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Seeking A True MMORPG
My MMORPG background consists of EQ (1999 - 2004), SWG (2003 - 2004), and WoW (2004 - 2006). I have, of course, "tried" others on the market for a few weeks and given them a fair run. As for my personal dislikes when it comes to MMORPGs, I loathe immature players, bad naming, gold farmers, F2P, PvP, RvR, RMT and anything else that dilutes the integrity of a game and its community. It seems I've read just about every article/review of every so called MMORPG on the market today. Being uncertain of this has brought me to post and utilize the extensive knowledge of this community in hopes that I will either find something to play or at the very least, something to follow during development. As opposed to listing the things I do like, I'd like for those who make suggestions to view the dislikes I've listed. If the game has any of the things I've listed (minus gold farming, which I understand is an issue that cannot be completely removed), assume I won't be remotely interested.
Comments
Welcome to the eternal quest.
It's hard to say if any MMO is capable of satiating you. The F2P and RMT part, I can understand, but the other parts are pretty much a given no matter what game you go into. PvP is popular, and it isn't going anywhere.
If anything, the only thing I can take off the top of my head is LotRO.
TGWTETIPTNMAITC! -Gary Whitta
Well those two alone pretty much cancels every MMO in existence...might as well quit cause you will never find an MMO without immature players and bad naming. ...and if you insist on waiting for one to happen, get to the back of the line!
you sir are not looking for a true MMORPG, maybe an MMO that fits your styles but not a true one
you basically what you want does not exist nor it will, the non pvp games are mostly F2P and that type has to have RMT to survive.
so your best bet would be a single player game. such as oblivion or Diablo II (or III when it comes out) neverwinternights.
online gaming was made to go against other players, anything else dilutes the integrity of the game
you sir are not looking for a true MMORPG, maybe an MMO that fits your styles but not a true one
you basically what you want does not exist nor it will, the non pvp games are mostly F2P and that type has to have RMT to survive.
so your best bet would be a single player game. such as oblivion or Diablo II (or III when it comes out) neverwinternights.
online gaming was made to go against other players, anything else dilutes the integrity of the game
I expected a response like this much sooner. You are, of course, entitled to your opinion, but I must tell you that you are incorrect in your assertion as to why online gaming was "made". I wouldn't go as far as to say the things I dislike should not exist. I'm highly supportive of their existence overall. If anything, they serve as a filter for those of us who prefer a more pleasant gaming experience.
I know im a relatively new member of MMORPG.com but ive been kicking around the genre for quite a number of years. lets take a quick look at what you dont like: F2P PvP RvR RMT.. im willing to bet youre pretty keen on the whole questing and raid system? am i wrong? PvP/ RvR are pretty much a mainstay in any "non-true (according to you) " MMO out there. If you essentially take out all these aspects that you in fact do not like. you will have ,what? Questing? thats it? Kinda starting to sound. and i mean no offense by this in any means, that you 1) dont like confrontation (pvp/rvr) and 2) you dont like MMO's as a whole. the evolution of the genre has pretty much made it so that genesis of almost everygame that comes out has all if not most of these aspects you so deperately do not enjoy.
EQ - Did impolement most of those aspects at later times
SWG - Pre NGE was rife with war and struggle
and WoW - ? are you kidding? this game is or TRIED to be a manifestation of the MMO testosterone booster. This game wouldn't exist without it.
All the games youve played in the past have had aspects of evrything you do not like.
As far as i see it you need to actually look at yourself and do a couple of things.. Adapt and find a game you can put up with some aspects you dont like while enjoying parts you do.
Or... Stop going online, Buy a copy of some random hour-sinker RPG be it PC or whatever and continue onward.
Just seems to me you dont like the actual social aspect of gaming and you have yet to admit it to yourself.
Just my $0.02
And about the gold farming thing - Hate to admit this, but they are never going away. they prey upon peoples sloth and greed. part of human nature. and its hard to deny human nature. they will almost always be around in any game. And food for thought.. What if a company like say Blizzard, had a vested interest in a gold farming company, Acted outwardly to disposing them (they never do, you notice that they are always still in game) Blizzard in turn "allows them under the radar to work, while publicly chastising them.. ) The company is allowed to work in game, blizzard saves face to the community in turn looking good. all for a few dollars from a company as a pay off. Gold farming is a HUGE business, almost as big if not bigger than the games themselves. ..... I dunno.. just something i think about from time to time.
These guys aren't really answering your question but it's quite difficult as we don't know what other games you've tried. It seems you're mostly into PvE so from personal experience I would suggest LoTRO, EQ2, Vanguard and TCoS. Good luck!
you sir are not looking for a true MMORPG, maybe an MMO that fits your styles but not a true one
you basically what you want does not exist nor it will, the non pvp games are mostly F2P and that type has to have RMT to survive.
so your best bet would be a single player game. such as oblivion or Diablo II (or III when it comes out) neverwinternights.
online gaming was made to go against other players, anything else dilutes the integrity of the game
I expected a response like this much sooner. You are, of course, entitled to your opinion, but I must tell you that you are incorrect in your assertion as to why online gaming was "made". I wouldn't go as far as to say the things I dislike should not exist. I'm highly supportive of their existence overall. If anything, they serve as a filter for those of us who prefer a more pleasant gaming experience.
Online gaming was made for PvE only? A "pleasant gaming experience" cannot in any way include pvp? Everything you say is an opinion, get over yourself.
Pretty sure LoTRO is the best bet based on your past game experience and preferences, OP.
Perhaps COH/COV might fit the bill as well, if you don't mind wearing tights.
EVE if you're more hardcore, but I'm thinking the PVP focus will be a turn off in the long run.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
you sir are not looking for a true MMORPG, maybe an MMO that fits your styles but not a true one
you basically what you want does not exist nor it will, the non pvp games are mostly F2P and that type has to have RMT to survive.
so your best bet would be a single player game. such as oblivion or Diablo II (or III when it comes out) neverwinternights.
online gaming was made to go against other players, anything else dilutes the integrity of the game
I have to disagree with the statement "online gaming was made to go against other players". The 3 main forefathers of the MMO's of today were more about the PvE endgame and not as much about the PvP. UO was the heaviest of the PvP games back in the day where on certain servers anyone could come along and PK a character that had just logged in from character creation. AC had a server just for PVP and also the ability to get flagged for it and then have the whole world to hunt/hide in PvP mode (you could also do the quest to kill the PvP flag). EQ was pretty much the closest to pure PvE that there was at the time. PvP is a trend that has been introduced more and more as a selling point over the years and for me it has made the games worse. After playing WAR, WOW, and others I think that the new 'grind' is trying to get the best gear and all the points/stats/abilities to be more '133t' that the next guy/gal.
All that being said I must reinforce the point that everyone has a set of things that they expect from a game and just because they might differ doesn't mean that the other person is wrong. If you love PvP then you have the right to play the games that give a rich PvP environment. Myself, I have to agree with the OP. I don't mind paying a monthly fee (I ran a NWN server for over 2 years for free and it isn't fun when hardware breaks), have more fun playing PvE (the bigger the world the better since I like exploring), and love doing things with guildmates (playing and not chatting/making friends is something that single player games are for).
I know im a relatively new member of MMORPG.com but ive been kicking around the genre for quite a number of years. lets take a quick look at what you dont like: F2P PvP RvR RMT.. im willing to bet youre pretty keen on the whole questing and raid system? am i wrong? PvP/ RvR are pretty much a mainstay in any "non-true (according to you) " MMO out there. If you essentially take out all these aspects that you in fact do not like. you will have ,what? Questing? thats it? Kinda starting to sound. and i mean no offense by this in any means, that you 1) dont like confrontation (pvp/rvr) and 2) you dont like MMO's as a whole. the evolution of the genre has pretty much made it so that genesis of almost everygame that comes out has all if not most of these aspects you so deperately do not enjoy.
EQ - Did impolement most of those aspects at later times
SWG - Pre NGE was rife with war and struggle
and WoW - ? are you kidding? this game is or TRIED to be a manifestation of the MMO testosterone booster. This game wouldn't exist without it.
All the games youve played in the past have had aspects of evrything you do not like.
As far as i see it you need to actually look at yourself and do a couple of things.. Adapt and find a game you can put up with some aspects you dont like while enjoying parts you do.
Or... Stop going online, Buy a copy of some random hour-sinker RPG be it PC or whatever and continue onward.
Just seems to me you dont like the actual social aspect of gaming and you have yet to admit it to yourself.
Just my $0.02
And about the gold farming thing - Hate to admit this, but they are never going away. they prey upon peoples sloth and greed. part of human nature. and its hard to deny human nature. they will almost always be around in any game. And food for thought.. What if a company like say Blizzard, had a vested interest in a gold farming company, Acted outwardly to disposing them (they never do, you notice that they are always still in game) Blizzard in turn "allows them under the radar to work, while publicly chastising them.. ) The company is allowed to work in game, blizzard saves face to the community in turn looking good. all for a few dollars from a company as a pay off. Gold farming is a HUGE business, almost as big if not bigger than the games themselves. ..... I dunno.. just something i think about from time to time.
What I'm really "keen" on is the player having to actually work toward the progression of their character. Anything that allows a player to take shortcuts shouldn't be a part of the game. That covers F2P/RMT. As for PvP/RvR, conflict doesn't concern me in the slightest. I had a lot of fun initially in SWG and WoW participating in PvP. In both, however, the PvP system was unrewarding and those who participated, did so for the amusement and bragging rights. Once the honor system was implemented and PvP became rewarding (moreso than PvE), it lost its charm. You found more people PvPing for progression than fun and it was immensely less difficult to progress in PvP than PvE.
On "Normal" servers, this poses a problem. For those uninterested in PvP, they are put in situations where they can no longer progress, as most take the easy road with PvP. I've organized countless runs where at least a few of our group/raid would be queued for a BG, move through the instance with us and as soon as they had enough people to PvP, they jumped ship. As you can probably imagine, issues did arise where this occurred at the most inopportune times. If said players had a replacement ready, it would be a different story, but no one bothers to do this anymore. In no small part, I'd imagine, due to a combination of lacking ethics and available players.
To expand on this a bit, if a game were to implement PvP and kept it on PvP servers, this would never occur. Those who are interested in PvP and want to go that route would be separated from the PvE crowd and we'd have two very satisfied groups of players. These are just two naturally opposing aspects of gameplay and it has been proven to death. So to summarize and to specify, rewarding PvP on its own server is fine, while rewarding PvP on a PvE server is not. I say rewarding now because without PvP being rewarding, not so many would vehemently defend it. Oh, just to address it, socialization is why I haven't purchased a console since before 1999. It seems I'm incapable of playing a single player game these days.
You pointed out the games I listed and state that each has or has had aspects of the things I do not like. In truth, if you'll talk to players of those games from the initial launch to the approximate time I left them, you'll be made aware that major changes were made around those times. Would you like to guess which changes exactly? I also mean no offense, but it seems you're lacking in the area of MMORPG knowledge pre-dating World of Warcraft. I don't have an issue with this and I'm certainly not going to chastise you for it, but understand things haven't always been as they are now and what we are presented with now is hardly what I would consider an evolution of the genre.
fast post i would say ffxi although you don't like rmt i would say (just my opinion) that it is by far the best pve game out and has been for hardcore players.
as some poeple posting about pvp, alot of mmo's was not big on pvp during the early stages of mmo's; well i can say to the very least that the game was either a pvp game or a pve game. Now it is common to have both while the game has a main focus the other part of it is still supported. FFxi has pvp but it is not a big part of the game, as for what your looking for i would say most of the past games are better suited then todays standards.
I to have been looking for a game that meets my standards but todays games have been gangbanged by stupids so games make things easy which gets boring and the big thing now is to take care of casual players since mmo's is becoming a bigger cash cow.
On a side note if you do change your mind about pvp games as i am waiting for aion, i believe it will be a good game but i am also not to happy since alot of hyped games can turn out crap and i am also looking at the new star wars game as i had played swg pre cu and it was one of the best games i everplayed for pvp and community. i played quite a big of mmo's myself and i am not sure if its cause i got to "elite" but the stupidity in games has risen to an insane amount making the communitys crap which is why i think i might be playing the new star wars over aion since many want to play aion and might ruin it from stupids.
almost positive i have bad grammer in this post kinda late and don't wanna look back :P
you sir are not looking for a true MMORPG, maybe an MMO that fits your styles but not a true one
you basically what you want does not exist nor it will, the non pvp games are mostly F2P and that type has to have RMT to survive.
so your best bet would be a single player game. such as oblivion or Diablo II (or III when it comes out) neverwinternights.
online gaming was made to go against other players, anything else dilutes the integrity of the game
I have to disagree with the statement "online gaming was made to go against other players". The 3 main forefathers of the MMO's of today were more about the PvE endgame and not as much about the PvP. UO was the heaviest of the PvP games back in the day where on certain servers anyone could come along and PK a character that had just logged in from character creation. AC had a server just for PVP and also the ability to get flagged for it and then have the whole world to hunt/hide in PvP mode (you could also do the quest to kill the PvP flag). EQ was pretty much the closest to pure PvE that there was at the time. PvP is a trend that has been introduced more and more as a selling point over the years and for me it has made the games worse. After playing WAR, WOW, and others I think that the new 'grind' is trying to get the best gear and all the points/stats/abilities to be more '133t' that the next guy/gal.
All that being said I must reinforce the point that everyone has a set of things that they expect from a game and just because they might differ doesn't mean that the other person is wrong. If you love PvP then you have the right to play the games that give a rich PvP environment. Myself, I have to agree with the OP. I don't mind paying a monthly fee (I ran a NWN server for over 2 years for free and it isn't fun when hardware breaks), have more fun playing PvE (the bigger the world the better since I like exploring), and love doing things with guildmates (playing and not chatting/making friends is something that single player games are for).
just to clarify, i was careful in choosing the words online gaming and not MMO
online gaming with doom lan parties or wolfenstein 3d and then with unreal tournament, those games where made to go against eachother. MMOs on the other hand the main focus is the cooperative aspect of it
and to the OP LOTRO is the game for you barely any PvP and the bit of it is insignificant, no RvR, low% of immature players
but looking at your post i still think your best bet is to get a copy of oblivion. its all you are looking for, lots of quests and storyline no pvp no rvr no community and best of all its not free, but will cost you less than a subscription