That is a really good point actually. Lineage 2 for example. This game has become so corrupt when it comes to pvp now, that I just stopped playing. But, I do have one thing good to say about pvp. If someone is stealing all your kills, you can't do anything about it in games with no pvp. Hmm...I guess it all depends on the player. But all in all, I most definitely AM looking forward to this game, and I just want it to come out, so I can see what my friends think about it. Maybe do a little adventuring on their comps or something.
i dont know much about D&D online but as i know pepole who try to make money.
D&D online will be very very diffrent from the pnp virsion of it.
the besics will stay like classes spells and such but everything would be nerfed/tweeked and it will be like any other game out there (not thats its any bad) only with the name and appearence of D&D theres no other way to do it unless they make a pnp online game with scr's as game masters which i doubt grately
tbh I'm hoping that turbine stick to the no-pvp mode in D&D, it will ruin wot D&D is all about, teamwork, battling off mindless minotaurs with u're m8's. The aspect for this game should b a nice change from the likes of lineage 2 where there are loads of people raping each other jus coz they can.
I have played D&D and warhammer quest, with the good ol' pencil n paper, it's a real community game. A few laughs a few drinks and a good DM makes the game all worth while.
Can't wait till game's out, shame it's still over 6 months away.
Originally posted by glittermage Stop PvP in DnD Online like you do in paper and pencil.In civilized areas and cities there are witnesses and guards / police forces.In the wilds, you're screwed. That is why you travel in groups of friends.Just like paper and pencil. Anything less will make DnD Online just another MMORPG.
Exactly...
This game looked awesome but it wouldn't/won't be worth my time without pvp.
"Don't blame me, I voted for Badnarik." http://www.lp.org Still waiting for my next mmorpg... A definition of 'munchkin', origin forgotten: "A player who, when told that the game will involve political intrigue in 15th-century Italy, insists on playing a Ninja." -isomeme
WARNING: Spelling and grammatical errors intentionally left in document to test for Anal Retentive Trolls.
"The key to wasting time is distraction. Without distractions it's too obvious to your brain that you're not doing anything with it, and you start to feel uncomfortable." - Paul Graham http://paulgraham.com/hs.html
What gets me worked up the most with games in development such as Middle Earth Online and D&D Online is the fact that people talk about them like any other MMORPG. If they were just like any other, it would suck a great deal.
It's a shame companies like Turbine get projects like these since they have a rep for being incompetent fools.
Anyone who actually plays D&D knows that PvP is everything. Most of the NPCs you will encounter in an adventure have just the same edge and chances for power as the characters do. On top of this a human DM controls all monsters and NPCs. Now, unless they're planing on employing a host of DMs to make the game worth while, players will have to rely on other players for the same experience they find in table top D&D.
I've played Neverwinter Nights for a long time now, and have played on many servers. Some of them were decent, others were crap. Out of them all, the only ones that were worth my time were those with PvP. If a good character for example were to help out an evil character, they would recieve a minor alignment shift. I think that's enough to keep idiot players in check as such rules can be implemented with ease, now I only hope that those in charge actually know what D&D is.
Personally I look forward to a full PvP D&D Online. Forgery and scaming other character would be very neat, oh and PvP in D&D isn't just hacking eachother to bits, I hope you know.
Originally posted by Valarauk Originally posted by glittermage Stop PvP in DnD Online like you do in paper and pencil.In civilized areas and cities there are witnesses and guards / police forces.In the wilds, you're screwed. That is why you travel in groups of friends.Just like paper and pencil. Anything less will make DnD Online just another MMORPG.
Exactly...
This game looked awesome but it wouldn't/won't be worth my time without pvp.
"Don't blame me, I voted for Badnarik." http://www.lp.org Still waiting for my next mmorpg... A definition of 'munchkin', origin forgotten: "A player who, when told that the game will involve political intrigue in 15th-century Italy, insists on playing a Ninja." -isomeme
I agree. PVP in Table Top, Pen and Paper D & D is the good ol' self destruct button. Back in the old days, some flaky player would decide to steal/kill/etc. from a player and the game would self implode. Granted that was back when I was a kid and I gamed with kids...
...Which is what you do on a MMORPG game...along with adults too.
Keep PVP away. There are creative ways to solve the issue of kill stealing (EQ2 method of locking an encounter)...and they could do that for fallen loot (Like EQ2, etc.) If there absolutely has to be PVP, put in an Arena somewhere and link it to some quests or something. Or sell your character into gladiatorship. This means he can't adventure, only fight in the arena against appropriately matched foes. But seriously PVP is lame anyway.
And while we are at it, how about doing away with the /ooc , /auction and /shout function (reduce the range of /shout) in these games. That would encourage people's PCs to talk face to face. You could still have /tells. This would encourage role playing.
I personally feel pvp is always going to be unbalanced and rightly so. If you are stupid enough to be a rogue and try taking on a Wizard without some great magic bonuses, yer gonna lose. If pvp is to be accurate it shouldn't be balanced. Just because you are the same age as someone in RL does that mean you can automatically have an even chance to beat them in a fight? NOT! I'd say that if you are a Ranger ie NG, CG or LG, then why would you just attack some wizard walking down the road. A lot of what is missing is the RP in mmorpg playing as opposed to pnp. I personally hope they don't even look at class balancing and make the game as close as possible to the pnp version, and if you happen to like playing a gimp class, so be it! I am a Ranger at heart and play one in every fantasy game, because I like Nature, Bows and still fighting and having some magic. Thus I'm always a gimp to some degree, I deal with it and enjoy my time.
well I don't know......there's been times i've wanted to at least knock the suicidal member of the group unconcious with subdual damage.....maybe not the whole killing aspect, but I can see the occasional jigging of the member who is only out to get the group killed.
Obviously a lot of people do not know what D&D is all about. It is not about PVP it is about a group of people getting together usually consuming a great quantity of Mountain Dew or Coffee, staying up to the early mornings roleplaying with your friends Adventuring.
So it is a MMORPG now...Well thats when the DM gets to take a break hook up some computers to a router and roleplay online. I believe this is just my opinion but I know I will get the same feeling as if we were playing with PnP.
It is not about going around and killing other player characters just to get your rocks off. D&D is not a PVP based game and never will be.
Get over it...If you can't roleplay then D&D is not a game for you!
PvP shouldn't be the point of the game. You dont' PvP right away when you do a PnP game with your friends. Sure you might have fights but PvP isn't the thing on your mind when you start up a game.
Sure this is an MMORPG DnD now. But the good thing is it's 3rd edition not the other lesser versions. Certain classes will shine against others, but only in some ways. And it's never a sure thing that a mage will always beat a Warrior.
PvP is the most broken part of a game heh. Classes are going good, till someone PvP's then they scream for a change in the class that beat em. Then that class gets changed and it takes the fun outta it for other things besides PvP. Then they scream for a fix in that, and it just results in other oddities.
Exactly...It seems to me that all people want these days, but I am glad DDO is not going that way. "Roleplaying" is what D&D is all about. I do not how much I have to state that fact. Only thing I can say is people should not crucify the game before they give it a chance. This MMORPG is not even out yet and there is a lot of whinning and stomping of feet going on all because of certain things that are not going to be implimented into a game.
The developers of D&D Online have stated that there will be no PvP at launch, and they will look into the topic at some later date. I think they have made a wise move and hope they never change the core rules to allow for PvP. With so many PvP based games already out and others on the way, having a totally PvP free game will be a welcome difference.
Originally posted by Alkanphel Nightfyre Exactly...It seems to me that all people want these days, but I am glad DDO is not going that way. "Roleplaying" is what D&D is all about. I do not how much I have to state that fact. Only thing I can say is people should not crucify the game before they give it a chance. This MMORPG is not even out yet and there is a lot of whinning and stomping of feet going on all because of certain things that are not going to be implimented into a game.
For all your preaching about the game being about roleplaying, you seem to forget that PvP can be a part of roleplaying just as practically any facet of the game could be. Hell, restricting PvP in all actually lessens a player's Role Playing ability by restricting actions in a way they should not be. The less you're capable of, the less you're given to Role Play with. If all you can do is dungeon crawl and kill things, how much can you Role Play, really? You could go so far as to have a good guy say "I'm killing monsters to cleanse the land of evil" and a evil guy say "I'm killing monsters to gain power for myself" and you could call that roleplaying...to a point. But it wouldn't be the kind of Role Play fans of D&D expect. It'd be you choosing an archetype, nothing more.
The alignments are there for a reason, to define who you are based on your actions. What defines evil without being able to commit one of the prime acts of evil: Murder? Let's all fear Sehkta the Necromancer because he will summon the undead to...kick puppies and stay up past curfew. How evil. And let's not forget the atrocities of Boris the Rogue, he went and stole Old Lady Gertude's pocket money--the fiend!
If "Gill 'the Knife' Borthos" wants to group with some particularly mischevious co-horts and form a group of cutpurses that occasionally gank people for the money, they should be able to. It adds to what the character can do in roleplaying.
If "Sir Rowen Darkthorne" decides he will not withstand the base insults of such an obnoxious knave and wants to challenge him to a duel (or just draw his sword and try to run him through right there for his insolence), he should be able to.
Both of these instances are only possible in a PvP capable environment, and both consist of feasible character actions in such a world, aka, roleplaying.
To deny it completely is to limit what players can do immensly, and such a great limitation only adds a greater suspension of disbelief. The one who said "Limit PvP in game as you do in PnP" has a point. You attack someone in the open, you risk getting jumped by guards. It's that simple. And it doesn't hurt.
A very nice and logical speech Dream-Master, but the sad fact is the average MMO gamer sucks at RP'ing and would more likely use such a system to gank than to actually play out legitimate villain roles.
Even so, D&D is more about going out on adventures with a group, than living alternate lives. Let the RP come from dodging traps in the dungeon, running away from monsters and hiding, adapting to surprise situations.
For example, in one play test the dev group was walking through a gate, when a portcullis slammed down out of nowhere... separating the group into two. Then on one side, mass undead began coming out of the ground, leaving one half of the group fighting for their lives while the other half frantically searched for a way to meet up/rescue them.
These kinds of move-like scenarios, that add suspense and drama to missions is what will be helpful to roleplaying; not open pvp. Open pvp has been done already, and by its very nature draws the idiots that will ruin any chance of roleplaying.
Originally posted by Alkanphel DND IS NOT PVP END OF DISCUSSION!!!
I don't think PVP should be in the game either, but FOR GOD'S SAKE Alkanphel, quit acting like you're the only one who knows what the hell roleplaying is!
If anything, I think you're the one that's deluding yourself into thinking that this game is going to be some roleplayer's paradise just because it has D&D slapped on the name. In no way do I expect this game to suck, but you tend to play it up like it's going to be the next great evolution in this genre.
I know what D&D / roleplaying is all about just as much as you do. I've run and played in countless campaigns over the years..and not just D&D either--I've pretty much tried the entire spectrum, from the rules-heavy Hero system to the diceless Everway and Amber (my fav would still have to be Over the Edge, however--pure genius). In fact, I'd say that D&D rules don't do NEAR as good a job faciitating roleplay as some other systems out there
I agree with a lot of your stances regarding this game, Alkanphel--but what pisses me off is that every time you respond to someone, it's with "You guys don't get it! DDO is going to be about ROLEPLAYING!!!"
I'll believe it when I see it. It's the player base that determies that, not the development team.
Well Sir! It seems that this forum has totally got off topic do to a difference of opinion. It seems that I have offended you in some way I apologize. I myself have just been giving an opinion on certain things that rise in different forums. I have high aspectations for this game. If I have also offended anybody else on the forum again I apologize.
There seems to be a lot of confusion on the details of DDO that is why I am trying togive some assistance.
If you wish to discuss this over a hard line I will give you my number. But until then I believe we need to stick to the topic. If you live close enough maybe you can step in to one of our games.
on the new exciting adventures of D&D and PvP. Why it won't work...
Originally posted by Alkanphel Well Sir! It seems that this forum has totally got off topic do to a difference of opinion. It seems that I have offended you in some way I apologize. I myself have just been giving an opinion on certain things that rise in different forums. I have high aspectations for this game. If I have also offended anybody else on the forum again I apologize. There seems to be a lot of confusion on the details of DDO that is why I am trying togive some assistance. If you wish to discuss this over a hard line I will give you my number. But until then I believe we need to stick to the topic. If you live close enough maybe you can step in to one of our games. on the new exciting adventures of D&D and PvP. Why it won't work...
Well, I might have gotten a bit off topic there, I do admit
And no I didn't think you offended me, per se. I only kind of 'erupted' because the guy that posted all of the feasible D&D PvP scenarios didn't really get a fair shake from you...just 'D&D IS NOT PVP--END OF DISCUSSION'! Pray tell then, what is this thread for?
Do I think it should be in? Heck no. I agree with you that PvP has no real place in DDO at it's core. Heck, if games such as EQ2 can get away without it just fine (and that's a game where the overall setting and storyline would be PERFECT for PvP), then DDO will be just fine without it as well.
If anything, if they ever DO implement it in the future, it should be in the form of duels and no more. The poster that listed all of the cool PvP scenarios is right in many ways--but usually the role of the 'bad guy' is reserved for the DM's NPCs in a pnp game. While player characters in a normal PnP game could surely do those deeds, its really the exception to the rule (in my opinion, D&D doesn't really encourage the exploits of evil characters near as much as good or neutral).
Well, that's my view of it
And I apologize as well, Alkanphel. May we meet up in DDO
Most Definitly Darquen Blade I would like to roleplay with you on DDO. I guess the true role-players of the PnP world will have to set the example. I will notify you what server I am on and the name of my charater.
Again you are right on the one subject. I did not give the person a fair deal on the subject. In the future I will try and be more forgiving.
DDO is not including PvP for several reasons. The combat system was designed for PvE and the devs talk about how the server works with the client durring combat in several posts on the official site. Due to the way the combat system is coded it would be very difficult to include PvP at release since it is a huge project to figure out how to fit it into the game as far as code goes, not even how it works in the game like areans or whatever.
The devs are working to create a solid game and putting all their time into the core systems of the game for release. If they decided to make the PvP system work, they realized that it would take more time than they have before release. Since they stated they don't want to rush thru things, they want to take their time with each game system to make sure its the best it can be.
This game is going to be great! The devs are great and so far the community is great!
Comments
That is a really good point actually. Lineage 2 for example. This game has become so corrupt when it comes to pvp now, that I just stopped playing. But, I do have one thing good to say about pvp. If someone is stealing all your kills, you can't do anything about it in games with no pvp. Hmm...I guess it all depends on the player. But all in all, I most definitely AM looking forward to this game, and I just want it to come out, so I can see what my friends think about it. Maybe do a little adventuring on their comps or something.
Bark
Bark
i dont know much about D&D online but as i know pepole who try to make money.
D&D online will be very very diffrent from the pnp virsion of it.
the besics will stay like classes spells and such but everything would be nerfed/tweeked and it will be like any other game out there (not thats its any bad) only with the name and appearence of D&D theres no other way to do it unless they make a pnp online game with scr's as game masters which i doubt grately
.
Stop PvP in DnD Online like you do in paper and pencil.
In civilized areas and cities there are witnesses and guards / police forces.
In the wilds, you're screwed. That is why you travel in groups of friends.
Just like paper and pencil. Anything less will make DnD Online just another MMORPG.
tbh I'm hoping that turbine stick to the no-pvp mode in D&D, it will ruin wot D&D is all about, teamwork, battling off mindless minotaurs with u're m8's. The aspect for this game should b a nice change from the likes of lineage 2 where there are loads of people raping each other jus coz they can.
I have played D&D and warhammer quest, with the good ol' pencil n paper, it's a real community game. A few laughs a few drinks and a good DM makes the game all worth while.
Can't wait till game's out, shame it's still over 6 months away.
Want to play the BETA!!!
Elfs kill dwarfs
Elfs kill dwarfs
Exactly...
This game looked awesome but it wouldn't/won't be worth my time without pvp.
"Don't blame me, I voted for Badnarik."
http://www.lp.org
Still waiting for my next mmorpg...
A definition of 'munchkin', origin forgotten: "A player who, when told that the game will involve political intrigue in 15th-century Italy, insists on playing a Ninja." -isomeme
WARNING: Spelling and grammatical errors intentionally left in document to test for Anal Retentive Trolls.
"The key to wasting time is distraction. Without distractions it's too obvious to your brain that you're not doing anything with it, and you start to feel uncomfortable." - Paul Graham http://paulgraham.com/hs.html
What gets me worked up the most with games in development such as Middle Earth Online and D&D Online is the fact that people talk about them like any other MMORPG. If they were just like any other, it would suck a great deal.
It's a shame companies like Turbine get projects like these since they have a rep for being incompetent fools.
Anyone who actually plays D&D knows that PvP is everything. Most of the NPCs you will encounter in an adventure have just the same edge and chances for power as the characters do. On top of this a human DM controls all monsters and NPCs. Now, unless they're planing on employing a host of DMs to make the game worth while, players will have to rely on other players for the same experience they find in table top D&D.
I've played Neverwinter Nights for a long time now, and have played on many servers. Some of them were decent, others were crap. Out of them all, the only ones that were worth my time were those with PvP. If a good character for example were to help out an evil character, they would recieve a minor alignment shift. I think that's enough to keep idiot players in check as such rules can be implemented with ease, now I only hope that those in charge actually know what D&D is.
Personally I look forward to a full PvP D&D Online. Forgery and scaming other character would be very neat, oh and PvP in D&D isn't just hacking eachother to bits, I hope you know.
Exactly...
This game looked awesome but it wouldn't/won't be worth my time without pvp.
"Don't blame me, I voted for Badnarik."
http://www.lp.org
Still waiting for my next mmorpg...
A definition of 'munchkin', origin forgotten: "A player who, when told that the game will involve political intrigue in 15th-century Italy, insists on playing a Ninja." -isomeme
I agree. PVP in Table Top, Pen and Paper D & D is the good ol' self destruct button. Back in the old days, some flaky player would decide to steal/kill/etc. from a player and the game would self implode. Granted that was back when I was a kid and I gamed with kids...
...Which is what you do on a MMORPG game...along with adults too.
Keep PVP away. There are creative ways to solve the issue of kill stealing (EQ2 method of locking an encounter)...and they could do that for fallen loot (Like EQ2, etc.) If there absolutely has to be PVP, put in an Arena somewhere and link it to some quests or something. Or sell your character into gladiatorship. This means he can't adventure, only fight in the arena against appropriately matched foes. But seriously PVP is lame anyway.
And while we are at it, how about doing away with the /ooc , /auction and /shout function (reduce the range of /shout) in these games. That would encourage people's PCs to talk face to face. You could still have /tells. This would encourage role playing.
Anthrorob
Tacklebury --}>>>
well I don't know......there's been times i've wanted to at least knock the suicidal member of the group unconcious with subdual damage.....maybe not the whole killing aspect, but I can see the occasional jigging of the member who is only out to get the group killed.
Hey, it's just a thought.
Obviously a lot of people do not know what D&D is all about. It is not about PVP it is about a group of people getting together usually consuming a great quantity of Mountain Dew or Coffee, staying up to the early mornings roleplaying with your friends Adventuring.
So it is a MMORPG now...Well thats when the DM gets to take a break hook up some computers to a router and roleplay online. I believe this is just my opinion but I know I will get the same feeling as if we were playing with PnP.
It is not about going around and killing other player characters just to get your rocks off. D&D is not a PVP based game and never will be.
Get over it...If you can't roleplay then D&D is not a game for you!
I've heard all the excuses.. and by far the lamest is this "balancing" issue..
there is no need to balance.. the ruleset defines your abilities and you will get spanked by a better class at certain things.
If you are a low level cleric getting shreaded by a rogue.. find a fighter to group with you to help out..
damn, you guys are going to be forced to group anyway... THAT WAS THE POINT OF D&D ANYWAY .. to GROUP...(but you could solo if you so choose to)
this game hasn't even gone beta and whining and crying has already started.. jeeezbus.
PvP shouldn't be the point of the game. You dont' PvP right away when you do a PnP game with your friends. Sure you might have fights but PvP isn't the thing on your mind when you start up a game.
Sure this is an MMORPG DnD now. But the good thing is it's 3rd edition not the other lesser versions. Certain classes will shine against others, but only in some ways. And it's never a sure thing that a mage will always beat a Warrior.
PvP is the most broken part of a game heh. Classes are going good, till someone PvP's then they scream for a change in the class that beat em. Then that class gets changed and it takes the fun outta it for other things besides PvP. Then they scream for a fix in that, and it just results in other oddities.
Exactly...It seems to me that all people want these days, but I am glad DDO is not going that way. "Roleplaying" is what D&D is all about. I do not how much I have to state that fact. Only thing I can say is people should not crucify the game before they give it a chance. This MMORPG is not even out yet and there is a lot of whinning and stomping of feet going on all because of certain things that are not going to be implimented into a game.
For all your preaching about the game being about roleplaying, you seem to forget that PvP can be a part of roleplaying just as practically any facet of the game could be. Hell, restricting PvP in all actually lessens a player's Role Playing ability by restricting actions in a way they should not be. The less you're capable of, the less you're given to Role Play with. If all you can do is dungeon crawl and kill things, how much can you Role Play, really? You could go so far as to have a good guy say "I'm killing monsters to cleanse the land of evil" and a evil guy say "I'm killing monsters to gain power for myself" and you could call that roleplaying...to a point. But it wouldn't be the kind of Role Play fans of D&D expect. It'd be you choosing an archetype, nothing more.
The alignments are there for a reason, to define who you are based on your actions. What defines evil without being able to commit one of the prime acts of evil: Murder? Let's all fear Sehkta the Necromancer because he will summon the undead to...kick puppies and stay up past curfew. How evil. And let's not forget the atrocities of Boris the Rogue, he went and stole Old Lady Gertude's pocket money--the fiend!
If "Gill 'the Knife' Borthos" wants to group with some particularly mischevious co-horts and form a group of cutpurses that occasionally gank people for the money, they should be able to. It adds to what the character can do in roleplaying.
If "Sir Rowen Darkthorne" decides he will not withstand the base insults of such an obnoxious knave and wants to challenge him to a duel (or just draw his sword and try to run him through right there for his insolence), he should be able to.
Both of these instances are only possible in a PvP capable environment, and both consist of feasible character actions in such a world, aka, roleplaying.
To deny it completely is to limit what players can do immensly, and such a great limitation only adds a greater suspension of disbelief. The one who said "Limit PvP in game as you do in PnP" has a point. You attack someone in the open, you risk getting jumped by guards. It's that simple. And it doesn't hurt.
A very nice and logical speech Dream-Master, but the sad fact is the average MMO gamer sucks at RP'ing and would more likely use such a system to gank than to actually play out legitimate villain roles.
Even so, D&D is more about going out on adventures with a group, than living alternate lives. Let the RP come from dodging traps in the dungeon, running away from monsters and hiding, adapting to surprise situations.
For example, in one play test the dev group was walking through a gate, when a portcullis slammed down out of nowhere... separating the group into two. Then on one side, mass undead began coming out of the ground, leaving one half of the group fighting for their lives while the other half frantically searched for a way to meet up/rescue them.
These kinds of move-like scenarios, that add suspense and drama to missions is what will be helpful to roleplaying; not open pvp. Open pvp has been done already, and by its very nature draws the idiots that will ruin any chance of roleplaying.
I don't think PVP should be in the game either, but FOR GOD'S SAKE Alkanphel, quit acting like you're the only one who knows what the hell roleplaying is!
If anything, I think you're the one that's deluding yourself into thinking that this game is going to be some roleplayer's paradise just because it has D&D slapped on the name. In no way do I expect this game to suck, but you tend to play it up like it's going to be the next great evolution in this genre.
I know what D&D / roleplaying is all about just as much as you do. I've run and played in countless campaigns over the years..and not just D&D either--I've pretty much tried the entire spectrum, from the rules-heavy Hero system to the diceless Everway and Amber (my fav would still have to be Over the Edge, however--pure genius). In fact, I'd say that D&D rules don't do NEAR as good a job faciitating roleplay as some other systems out there
I agree with a lot of your stances regarding this game, Alkanphel--but what pisses me off is that every time you respond to someone, it's with "You guys don't get it! DDO is going to be about ROLEPLAYING!!!"
I'll believe it when I see it. It's the player base that determies that, not the development team.
Well Sir! It seems that this forum has totally got off topic do to a difference of opinion. It seems that I have offended you in some way I apologize. I myself have just been giving an opinion on certain things that rise in different forums. I have high aspectations for this game. If I have also offended anybody else on the forum again I apologize.
There seems to be a lot of confusion on the details of DDO that is why I am trying togive some assistance.
If you wish to discuss this over a hard line I will give you my number. But until then I believe we need to stick to the topic. If you live close enough maybe you can step in to one of our games.
Well, I might have gotten a bit off topic there, I do admit
And no I didn't think you offended me, per se. I only kind of 'erupted' because the guy that posted all of the feasible D&D PvP scenarios didn't really get a fair shake from you...just 'D&D IS NOT PVP--END OF DISCUSSION'! Pray tell then, what is this thread for?
Do I think it should be in? Heck no. I agree with you that PvP has no real place in DDO at it's core. Heck, if games such as EQ2 can get away without it just fine (and that's a game where the overall setting and storyline would be PERFECT for PvP), then DDO will be just fine without it as well.
If anything, if they ever DO implement it in the future, it should be in the form of duels and no more. The poster that listed all of the cool PvP scenarios is right in many ways--but usually the role of the 'bad guy' is reserved for the DM's NPCs in a pnp game. While player characters in a normal PnP game could surely do those deeds, its really the exception to the rule (in my opinion, D&D doesn't really encourage the exploits of evil characters near as much as good or neutral).
Well, that's my view of it
And I apologize as well, Alkanphel. May we meet up in DDO
Most Definitly Darquen Blade I would like to roleplay with you on DDO. I guess the true role-players of the PnP world will have to set the example. I will notify you what server I am on and the name of my charater.
Again you are right on the one subject. I did not give the person a fair deal on the subject. In the future I will try and be more forgiving.
Alkanphel
DDO is not including PvP for several reasons. The combat system was designed for PvE and the devs talk about how the server works with the client durring combat in several posts on the official site. Due to the way the combat system is coded it would be very difficult to include PvP at release since it is a huge project to figure out how to fit it into the game as far as code goes, not even how it works in the game like areans or whatever.
The devs are working to create a solid game and putting all their time into the core systems of the game for release. If they decided to make the PvP system work, they realized that it would take more time than they have before release. Since they stated they don't want to rush thru things, they want to take their time with each game system to make sure its the best it can be.
This game is going to be great! The devs are great and so far the community is great!