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Personal space .. housing crisis..
patron07
Member Posts: 2
Hows it going,
Let me begin by stating the fact that all people like personal space right? its good to see more mmos like AOC incorporated this concept by creating a guild controlled village sort to speak. To me personally these kinds of things attract me to a game .. its like wow i can make this and o wow its all mine. its always nice to have a place to come back to when you finish a long quest and dont want to get bothered by noobs asking you for silver when you get in town . .For example in darkfall you have the capabiity of creating your own pirate ships . I get more excited every time i see new things like that in newer games ,to me its bringing RP back to mmoRPg. And this brings a big question to mind ...I wonder if FFIX incorporated or even improved on the housing situation they had in the first FF mmo.. What do you guys think ?
Comments
Housing for my MMO characters ranks about 5,283rd on my "Most desired thing in a game".
It ranks even lower for me. Since most player housing is still ridiculously generic, you can't make any serious changes, you can just move setpieces around, what's the point? Everyone gets the same house, or one of a small number of alternatives, everyone gets the same pieces of furniture to pick from, you throw it in your house and... so what?
Player housing has absolutely zero in-game value. It's good for RPing purposes, I suppose, if you're only doing generic RPing, but otherwise... why bother?
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
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For me housing is extremely important, and i think its very important to all the RPG players, with the exception of the PvP/Loot Whores that play just with this 2 objectives.
Unfortunatele the current generation of games, leaded by Warcraft left housing completely out of the loot, but i gladly see that the new game releases are going back to the roots and bringing this feature back, like AoC, Aion already confirmed that player and guild housing are on the way and i also believe Bioware will invest in this in SW:ToR like they did in neverwinter nights 2.
There is no greater satisfaction that possessing our place in a game, where we can meet with friends, display achievements and just look to a wall and say: "theres the head of that bastard... it was hard but i did it"
Why does it matter if "everyone gets the same piece of furniture?" arn't you the guy always saying "it doesn't matter what the other players have/don't have, it doesn't effect your gameplay" ? or "it doesn't matter if they level faster and get that armor, it doesn't effect you"
Eather way, stuff like this and other frills in a game add flavor and depth to it. for me its probably in the top 10 of "must haves" for a mmo.
And i'm assuming you never play'd FFXI? it that game furniture in your house changed your stats, depending on what you had and what quality, it would change your crafting stats/fighting stats. And your house is where you stored/grew your plants which had a HUGE effect on the game, and I won't even go into right now.
not only that but making furniture added 2 more crafting classes into the game (wood cutting and carpentry) So yeah I think that ingame housing is a very cool thing to have...
Housing is another form of character customization. Eyebrow thickness and nostril width don't affect gameplay at all, but people go batshit for Aion's facial customization. Ditto for housing. Even when it's only cosmetic, players like to create something that is uniquely their own.
I love player housing, and I am not an RPer by any stretch of the imagination. Housing significantly increases immersion and really helps a game feel like an online world. You are able to leave a permanent mark on the game world. Of course I am talking about non-instanced housing, instanced housing means little to me and I would rather the developers not waste their time with it.
It was really cool in SWG for you to have a house or houses of your own, for your guild to have a complete town that they built and maintained. The immersion felt from just playing the game was absolutely spectacular. Housing can also be a great place to have player store their stuff. People in SWG did some amazing things when decorating their houses since they could place almost any item in the game in their house to be displayed.
It's a shame that the current generation of MMOs is missing out on such an important and immersive feature. More proof they are making (crappy) games instead of immersive worlds.
Tried: LotR, CoH, AoC, WAR, Jumpgate Classic
Played: SWG, Guild Wars, WoW
Playing: Eve Online, Counter-strike
Loved: Star Wars Galaxies
Waiting for: Earthrise, Guild Wars 2, anything sandbox.
I agree OP I LOVE player housing. I miss having my houses in SWG. I hope SW:TOR will have it but I doubt it will.
I loved player towns in UO.
We'd have reds come in and "raid" them, and needed to gather a force to kick them back out, made for some really good times. Have the occasional player run event in them as well..
"Zero in game value".... pfft.
Everquest 2 has a robust housing system, where you start out with a single room in an inn, and can work your way up to large spaces - there are also a huge variety of furniture, decorations, and other housing items so that no two houses are alike. I'm not sure of the numbers but I think there are probably thousands of choices. People have houses for taverns, theaters and other roleplay spaces, and if you don't want to roleplay you can always just decorate the place with trophies of your kills.
If you're interested in housing I'd definitely give it a shot because it's probably the most detailed housing system there is right now, with the possible exception of Vanguard.
Implementing player housing to a game is wasted man-hours. That is what I think. Devs should put that time into something more important like the game engine, AI coding, graphics etc... unless the title is Sims Online.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
WoW actually planed on having housing and had devs talk some of it in the beginning of the pre forums, it wasnt implemenented but needless to say they saw value in the concept or they wouldnt have brought it up.
As for player housing I think its great to have something you can point at and say thats mine, to show people your interior and work to add new details and furnitures to your virtual home. It makes a perfect secondary objective in a game, something to do when your bored of the conventional gameplay.
Unfortuantly WoW never implemented player/guild housing and instead focused all their energy on items and gear and to me... that doesnt cut it. I mean lets say a bow, it might be the best frickin bow in game but.. its still just a bow.
Perhaps you and the OP needed to do your homework on current mmorpg that have player housing. AOC is having PLAYER housing,well bully for them because VG has had non instanced player housing from the first day it was released. It also has guild forts that are non instanced and guild villages that can be set up around the guild forts.
VG also has 1000s of items that can be put in your house ,you name it and VG has got it,from wall paper to what clour curtains you want. It also has many styles of housing from three different islands. VG also has ships and galleons that are small to immense.
SWTOR has not said anything about hosuing so i would not hold your breath on that one. I bet none of the new games will even come close to VG housing system or it's crafting and ship building.
www.youtube.com/watch
www.youtube.com/watch
I for one enjoy player based housing; I enjoy having a place to call home. However, I do agree that for the most part housing is very lack luster. I would like to see it more meaningful with players able to create vibrant communities within these housing communities with tradesmen, inns, taverns, shops, etc. I think that is is something that has been lacking of late.
Im also for player housing, it just adds more depth to any game. I personaly dont get into it much but I know for alot of people it gives even more enjoyment to every game.
Both UO and SWG had an excellent player housing system, no surprise they are the two games I consider when hoping to start a new MMO. Also no wonder then that there are no MMOs worth playing.
And VGs form of instanced housing was shit. As was its bug ridden crafting system.
Another plus for housing is increased storage, fwiw.
PAST: UO-SWG-DAOC-WOW-DDO-VG-AOC-WAR-FE-DFO-LOTRO-RIFT-GW2
PRESENT: Nothing
FUTURE: ESO
VG never had or has instanced housing so wtf are you talking about?
It's open world housing just like SWG is open world....
VG crafting system is second only to SWG and in some ways it's better. It had bugs over two years ago,now it has no bugs at all. Perhaps you have never played VG or are you one of these people who played 2 years ago and doent realise that things change over time.
You saying VG has instanced housing shows me that you have never played VG or at best have not seen housing in VG..
Instanced housing...LMAO for a dumb comment.
The use of housing to create communities has been done, and was widely accepted and appreciated by gamers in UO and SWG, but the big thing along with housing was the ability for players to run and operate vendors.
With the advent of Auction Houses, lazy fucking developers no longer have to worry about coding vendors.
PAST: UO-SWG-DAOC-WOW-DDO-VG-AOC-WAR-FE-DFO-LOTRO-RIFT-GW2
PRESENT: Nothing
FUTURE: ESO
VG never had or has instanced housing so wtf are you talking about?
It's open world housing just like SWG is open world....
Not when I played, housing was restricted to certain areas, one of them I remember being an island. It was nothing like SWG, where you could place a house anywhere the landscape enabled it.
PAST: UO-SWG-DAOC-WOW-DDO-VG-AOC-WAR-FE-DFO-LOTRO-RIFT-GW2
PRESENT: Nothing
FUTURE: ESO
VG never had or has instanced housing so wtf are you talking about?
It's open world housing just like SWG is open world....
Not when I played, housing was restricted to certain areas, one of them I remember being an island. It was nothing like SWG, where you could place a house anywhere the landscape enabled it.
You are talking rubbish,You could always place a house on the main islands. You could not place a house anywhere you liked in SWG,it was the same set up as VG.
You can place a house anywhere the landscape enables you in VG just like SWG.
You said housing was instanced in VG,well you are talking rubbish and obviously don't no what instanced means.
The use of housing to create communities has been done, and was widely accepted and appreciated by gamers in UO and SWG, but the big thing along with housing was the ability for players to run and operate vendors.
With the advent of Auction Houses, lazy fucking developers no longer have to worry about coding vendors.
Yes that is where SWG has VG beat but their are many things that VG has SWG beat when it comes to crafting and housing.
The use of housing to create communities has been done, and was widely accepted and appreciated by gamers in UO and SWG, but the big thing along with housing was the ability for players to run and operate vendors.
With the advent of Auction Houses, lazy fucking developers no longer have to worry about coding vendors.
Yes that is where SWG has VG beat but their are many things that VG has SWG beat when it comes to crafting and housing.
I'll disagree, but this time a little more respectfully.
SWGs setting (sci-fi, instead of fantasy) allowed for so many different ways to craft, that it is still unmatched. From personal harvestors that collected resources so long as you maintained them, to factories that would produce a certain number of identical items from a blueprint, I think for such an old game, it trumped VGs system. Added to that was a resource code that changed continually which prompted crafters to remain alert (otherwise they might miss the next best resource).
Having watched the crafting vid you linked of VG crafting reminded me just how fucked up complications were. I was level 36 crafter...I think, when I quit but this was right at launch and the whole system was flawed beyond repair.
Woah, this has derailed the thread pretty badly, apologies to the OP.
PAST: UO-SWG-DAOC-WOW-DDO-VG-AOC-WAR-FE-DFO-LOTRO-RIFT-GW2
PRESENT: Nothing
FUTURE: ESO
The use of housing to create communities has been done, and was widely accepted and appreciated by gamers in UO and SWG, but the big thing along with housing was the ability for players to run and operate vendors.
With the advent of Auction Houses, lazy fucking developers no longer have to worry about coding vendors.
Yes that is where SWG has VG beat but their are many things that VG has SWG beat when it comes to crafting and housing.
I'll disagree, but this time a little more respectfully.
SWGs setting (sci-fi, instead of fantasy) allowed for so many different ways to craft, that it is still unmatched. From personal harvestors that collected resources so long as you maintained them, to factories that would produce a certain number of identical items from a blueprint, I think for such an old game, it trumped VGs system. Added to that was a resource code that changed continually which prompted crafters to remain alert (otherwise they might miss the next best resource).
Having watched the crafting vid you linked of VG crafting reminded me just how fucked up complications were. I was level 36 crafter...I think, when I quit but this was right at launch and the whole system was flawed beyond repair.
Woah, this has derailed the thread pretty badly, apologies to the OP.
Beyond repair? exaggeration much..
I know how swg worked because i played it for two years. I also know how VG works because i have played that for the last two years.
As for the housing,well VG is just as good as SWG with just as many items to put in your house. Can you explain to me what makes VG housing instanced?
I find player housing very enjoyable. I loved how UO had a wide variety in housing and absolutely loved when they offered customizable housing. I like AoC original design concept of player controlled cities with either pvp or npc threats. Where AoC fell short was not giving individual control to houses. Sure it is great that my guild owns a town but owning a individual piece of the town would be much more enjoyable.
Over all player housing won't make or break a game if I like the game concept. Player housing could make me try a game that I may not of and would probably make me stick around a lot longer then I would of ie. played UO off and on for over 7 years now next closest is WoW at probably 1.5.
I think if the developers took the time to really think about player housing and involve it in the grand story of the game it would be a great asset. It could and would keep people playing a lot longer, but that is only if they were to make housing more then just storage.
The real problem is the lack of open world MMOs -Instanced housing is just not as fun as finding a plot and building your house on it (in my opinion anyway)
I really loved my house/shop in SWG.
Vanguard looks pretty good too, but I didn't play long enough to get a place.
When the ultimate sandbox MMO comes along
it will definitelyhave player housing.
I like housing but I don't like what many people want to do with it.
Meaning I don't want player ran cities. For one, player made cities look bad, because players lack the tools and creativity to create a city anywhere close to what a developer could. Everyone I have seen has been bland and uninteresting. Plus players put cities in rediculous places and screw up the landscape.
Two letting players have the power to govern others is a bad Idea I think, because they could abuse it but it generally isn't fun to be taxed or be governed.
I also don't want any architect skill in the game, everyone should be able to design their own house and there shouldn't be a lengthy process to build it, cause it is just pointless in my opinion and completely misses the fun having housing.
I would rather focus on the ability to create the house you want, of course limiting the styles and colors to make it fit in the region. Houses and guild halls could be built on plots in the suburbs of already established cities, giving enough creative control to the developer so that the city will still look good.
At that rate I don't have a problem with instanced housing, every player could have an apartment from the beginning and could buy a physical house if they wanted and had enough money.
Don't you worry little buddy. You're dealing with a man of honor. However, honor requires a higher percentage of profit