NO the class system IS lost,because before you WERE that class to the end of the party,yes on rare occasion people would wait for someone to warp back to town to change,but only because their party was folding and needed a new tank or healer whatever.You can't deny that players for the most part were a BLM or a HEALER throughout to level 75,they only switched around out of boredom,when you talked about a particular player,you knew what you were getting a BLM or a PLD whatever. If you cannot see how badly this will dumb down the combat system you are blind.I guess i will have to spell out some scenarios,maybe i have played too much and have seen all the scenarios IDK,but this happens. You no longer have to worry about over healing ,you pull hate?no biggie,switch instantly to tank,problem with aggro?form two tanks 2 healers.Mob weak to nuking?simple form 1 tank 5 nukers.There is just SOooo many scenarios that can dumb down the combat by switching on the fly. Tank dies?no biggie you have 5 more possible tanks.Healer over healed causing hate ,takes hit dies,no biggie you got 4 other healers.Puller is crap pulls two mobs or whatever he has EVERY option avilable to him now,switch to thief use flee,heck you whole party can use flee.Even worse???imagine your whole party can switch to whm tele out of trouble or BLM and Escape out of trouble. Basically this whole design will take ANY risk out of combat and it WILL dumb down the combat system.One player survives?no biggie he is guaranteed to have raise because guess what,you can be anything and everything all MORPHLINGS.You are NOT a role player anymore,you are EVERY role,whatever is needed at that particuloar second.Imagine being able to setup multiple stuns?then switch over to DPS,then back for multiple stuns when the timer is up?keep switching around to utilize every single ability in the game.How about this....all 6 guys start off with a SNEAK ATTACK,mob dead.Took some damage?no biggie couple switch over to whm and heal rinse and repeat. I am sure others ca nthink of millions of ways to dumb down the combat system utilizing on the fly switching.This system will conquer one area,grouping needs,but totally ruin the entire game in doing so. I could go on and on how many different sceanrios you can muster up to ruin the combat system.The only way this can work,is they ar going to not have very many good skills in this game,so switching will have limited use,how does that make a better game?answer it does NOT.I hope others can actually see how this system is a big time fail.
Please, continue to assume you know how the system is going to work, it's really doing everyone a tremendous amount of good...lol you make me want to bang my head against a wall
NO the class system IS lost,because before you WERE that class to the end of the party,yes on rare occasion people would wait for someone to warp back to town to change,but only because their party was folding and needed a new tank or healer whatever.You can't deny that players for the most part were a BLM or a HEALER throughout to level 75,they only switched around out of boredom,when you talked about a particular player,you knew what you were getting a BLM or a PLD whatever. If you cannot see how badly this will dumb down the combat system you are blind.I guess i will have to spell out some scenarios,maybe i have played too much and have seen all the scenarios IDK,but this happens. You no longer have to worry about over healing ,you pull hate?no biggie,switch instantly to tank,problem with aggro?form two tanks 2 healers.Mob weak to nuking?simple form 1 tank 5 nukers.There is just SOooo many scenarios that can dumb down the combat by switching on the fly. Tank dies?no biggie you have 5 more possible tanks.Healer over healed causing hate ,takes hit dies,no biggie you got 4 other healers.Puller is crap pulls two mobs or whatever he has EVERY option avilable to him now,switch to thief use flee,heck you whole party can use flee.Even worse???imagine your whole party can switch to whm tele out of trouble or BLM and Escape out of trouble. Basically this whole design will take ANY risk out of combat and it WILL dumb down the combat system.One player survives?no biggie he is guaranteed to have raise because guess what,you can be anything and everything all MORPHLINGS.You are NOT a role player anymore,you are EVERY role,whatever is needed at that particuloar second.Imagine being able to setup multiple stuns?then switch over to DPS,then back for multiple stuns when the timer is up?keep switching around to utilize every single ability in the game.How about this....all 6 guys start off with a SNEAK ATTACK,mob dead.Took some damage?no biggie couple switch over to whm and heal rinse and repeat. I am sure others ca nthink of millions of ways to dumb down the combat system utilizing on the fly switching.This system will conquer one area,grouping needs,but totally ruin the entire game in doing so. I could go on and on how many different sceanrios you can muster up to ruin the combat system.The only way this can work,is they ar going to not have very many good skills in this game,so switching will have limited use,how does that make a better game?answer it does NOT.I hope others can actually see how this system is a big time fail.
I have to agree on certain points of this post. If there is no penalty for switching weapons (and thereby switching roles) inside FF XIV and you could do this during combat, it will dumb down the combat system and remove risks (even if one person is alive, he could switch to white mage staff and simply res someone).
With weapon and armor switching, I believe there has to penalties and you can't switch gear during certain times.
I believe for one that you should not be able to switch your weapon while in combat. Your team has to be in a safe area before you can switch a role. And equipment? You can't switch equipment when you're in a party outside town. This means that if you started out as a warrior then you tried switching to a staff for white magic that your magic would be weaker than it could be.
Also, did I mention that whenever you switch a weapon some sort of penalty occurs? I not quite sure what penalties to apply here, but even switching roles wouldn't always be the best idea (especially if you're in an extremely hostile territory).
I'm of the same mind here and if there isn't some sort of penalty for switching weapons/roles in combat then we could very well wind up with the mess that Wizardry fears. All it would really take is having you lose all of your mana and/or TP (or whatever we use to execute attacks) whenever you switch, then problem solved. Sure you could do it in combat, but you'd have mid-combat "downtime" as you wait for you bar(s) to regen. So you couldn't just switch to staff and start nuking or healing. In fact, doing so would cripple you more than help you.
Again you are trying to refer to a FFXI system. In FFXIV you level your weapon not your skills. It is not like for every one of your character's levels your dark magic skill level cap is increased by 5.
Maxing out healing and stunning? How would you do that if you're leveling your weapon? In every battle you are your class and you can't switch to use another class' skills.
This is an assumtion, it is possible that the "weaopn determines your job", but that you level your weapon skills not your weapon. Leveling a weapon.... all that time spent on a weapon? I want to increase MY power not the power of some inanimate that I may have to discard at some point.
Personally I don't see leveling a weapon(and armour) as being very logical in a game where accumulating,trading, creating and hunting different weapons and armour has typically been one of the main ways of excelling in an MMO. Where would the accumulation of skill rest in the character, if once they droped their weapon or armour to go to another one they lost all its levels.
I think it more likely that you level the specific weapons skills and armour skills etc., through use. That seems alright with me... and aftr readng some ideas about possible party scenarios I have more faith that SE will make a game where community dosn't become too WOWteen .
This is an assumtion, it is possible that the "weaopn determines your job", but that you level your weapon skills not your weapon. Leveling a weapon.... all that time spent on a weapon? I want to increase MY power not the power of some inanimate that I may have to discard at some point.
Personally I don't see leveling a weapon(and armour) as being very logical in a game where accumulating,trading, creating and hunting different weapons and armour has typically been one of the main ways of excelling in an MMO. Where would the accumulation of skill rest in the character, if once they droped their weapon or armour to go to another one they lost all its levels.
Your assumption that we'll replace such items is as big as his assumption that we'll level them.
DAoC did exactly what he's describing in the Trials of Atlantis expansion. You did this lengthy quest to acquire a special item and as you gained experience, so did the item. It not only made it more powerful (so you didn't need to replace it), but also unlocked special abilities. Of course that was the beginning of the end for DAoC because people who were at the level cap and enjoying end-game (which centered around PvP) suddenly had to go back to leveling (in PvE) again.
This is an assumtion, it is possible that the "weaopn determines your job", but that you level your weapon skills not your weapon. Leveling a weapon.... all that time spent on a weapon? I want to increase MY power not the power of some inanimate that I may have to discard at some point.
Personally I don't see leveling a weapon(and armour) as being very logical in a game where accumulating,trading, creating and hunting different weapons and armour has typically been one of the main ways of excelling in an MMO. Where would the accumulation of skill rest in the character, if once they droped their weapon or armour to go to another one they lost all its levels.
Your assumption that we'll replace such items is as big as his assumption that we'll level them.
DAoC did exactly what he's describing in the Trials of Atlantis expansion. You did this lengthy quest to acquire a special item and as you gained experience, so did the item. It not only made it more powerful (so you didn't need to replace it), but also unlocked special abilities. Of course that was the beginning of the end for DAoC because people who were at the level cap and enjoying end-game (which centered around PvP) suddenly had to go back to leveling (in PvE) again.
I knew I was saying what I thought.
What i was replying to was his reply to someone else where he stated why someone else was wrong, based on the fact we will be leveling weapons which is not fact. Anymore then what i said was fact but I am not telling anyone they are wrong because I know how the game is going to turn out. It is exactly because we do not know how the game has turned out that he was wrong.
No where in my message do I make the assumption that I KNOW how the game will turn out. Reread it if you need to.
Comments
Please, continue to assume you know how the system is going to work, it's really doing everyone a tremendous amount of good...lol you make me want to bang my head against a wall
I have to agree on certain points of this post. If there is no penalty for switching weapons (and thereby switching roles) inside FF XIV and you could do this during combat, it will dumb down the combat system and remove risks (even if one person is alive, he could switch to white mage staff and simply res someone).
With weapon and armor switching, I believe there has to penalties and you can't switch gear during certain times.
I believe for one that you should not be able to switch your weapon while in combat. Your team has to be in a safe area before you can switch a role. And equipment? You can't switch equipment when you're in a party outside town. This means that if you started out as a warrior then you tried switching to a staff for white magic that your magic would be weaker than it could be.
Also, did I mention that whenever you switch a weapon some sort of penalty occurs? I not quite sure what penalties to apply here, but even switching roles wouldn't always be the best idea (especially if you're in an extremely hostile territory).
I'm of the same mind here and if there isn't some sort of penalty for switching weapons/roles in combat then we could very well wind up with the mess that Wizardry fears. All it would really take is having you lose all of your mana and/or TP (or whatever we use to execute attacks) whenever you switch, then problem solved. Sure you could do it in combat, but you'd have mid-combat "downtime" as you wait for you bar(s) to regen. So you couldn't just switch to staff and start nuking or healing. In fact, doing so would cripple you more than help you.
This is an assumtion, it is possible that the "weaopn determines your job", but that you level your weapon skills not your weapon. Leveling a weapon.... all that time spent on a weapon? I want to increase MY power not the power of some inanimate that I may have to discard at some point.
Personally I don't see leveling a weapon(and armour) as being very logical in a game where accumulating,trading, creating and hunting different weapons and armour has typically been one of the main ways of excelling in an MMO. Where would the accumulation of skill rest in the character, if once they droped their weapon or armour to go to another one they lost all its levels.
I think it more likely that you level the specific weapons skills and armour skills etc., through use. That seems alright with me... and aftr readng some ideas about possible party scenarios I have more faith that SE will make a game where community dosn't become too WOWteen .
WOOT
www.eorzeapedia.com
(Great FF14 source)
Your assumption that we'll replace such items is as big as his assumption that we'll level them.
DAoC did exactly what he's describing in the Trials of Atlantis expansion. You did this lengthy quest to acquire a special item and as you gained experience, so did the item. It not only made it more powerful (so you didn't need to replace it), but also unlocked special abilities. Of course that was the beginning of the end for DAoC because people who were at the level cap and enjoying end-game (which centered around PvP) suddenly had to go back to leveling (in PvE) again.
Your assumption that we'll replace such items is as big as his assumption that we'll level them.
DAoC did exactly what he's describing in the Trials of Atlantis expansion. You did this lengthy quest to acquire a special item and as you gained experience, so did the item. It not only made it more powerful (so you didn't need to replace it), but also unlocked special abilities. Of course that was the beginning of the end for DAoC because people who were at the level cap and enjoying end-game (which centered around PvP) suddenly had to go back to leveling (in PvE) again.
I knew I was saying what I thought.
What i was replying to was his reply to someone else where he stated why someone else was wrong, based on the fact we will be leveling weapons which is not fact. Anymore then what i said was fact but I am not telling anyone they are wrong because I know how the game is going to turn out. It is exactly because we do not know how the game has turned out that he was wrong.
No where in my message do I make the assumption that I KNOW how the game will turn out. Reread it if you need to.
WOOT
www.eorzeapedia.com
(Great FF14 source)