When I have the whole game world to look forward to.
I hate when I'm stuck in a handful of high level zones with only Raids to look forward to.
This is why I play Games with no endgame like Eve and Ryzom.
I hear ya. I got sucked into the "mad dash" to level cap in WoW. After a while I got sick of raiding constantly and started looking elsewhere. I learned to just slow down and enjoy the journey in LotRO, but even at my slow pace I still hit end-game there and got bored of raiding and the MoM grind.
Now I'm taking my time and enjoying Ryzom and am really looking forward to other sandbox MMOs like Earthrise and MO.
EQ for me! and DAOC ...but I dunno if its the NEW MMO's or the way there designed but in WAR I raced crazy mad to end game...I think alot of people did its the way they designed the quest but I felt like I was constantly just running to red circles on my map no time to talk to no one!!!! .....and I am not usually like that. Also I played Anarchy Online off and on since release and still only have a 213 character.
Originally posted by Draco91 There's no power gap between a retiree and someone who is working while pursuing other interests. There is a power gap between a level 30 and a level 60. The sooner you get to max, the sooner the power gap is nullified. This power gap, it seems, is where Abrahmm's discontent lies. It isn't a matter of reaching the end, so much as breaking the power barrier between players.
Why is it a problem that there is a power gap? Shouldn't there be some sort of reward for effort? The only time that even seems relevant is in the case of unrestricted PvP where higher level players can go gank lowbies.
It also completely segregates the community into subsections based on level. In WoW, you as a level 20 can't go help your level 80 friends fight a monster because you will be instantly killed. That is another reason why I felt the need to rush through the leveling, all my friends were already at max level playing the game, and I was unable to play with them because I still had to go through that whole pointless timesink. It also makes lower level content completely worthless and wasted once the player is passed that level of power.
The real question is, why have such massive power gaps?
Tried: LotR, CoH, AoC, WAR, Jumpgate Classic Played: SWG, Guild Wars, WoW Playing: Eve Online, Counter-strike Loved: Star Wars Galaxies Waiting for: Earthrise, Guild Wars 2, anything sandbox.
When I have the whole game world to look forward to.
I hate when I'm stuck in a handful of high level zones with only Raids to look forward to.
This is why I play Games with no endgame like Eve and Ryzom.
I hear ya. I got sucked into the "mad dash" to level cap in WoW. After a while I got sick of raiding constantly and started looking elsewhere. I learned to just slow down and enjoy the journey in LotRO, but even at my slow pace I still hit end-game there and got bored of raiding and the MoM grind.
Now I'm taking my time and enjoying Ryzom and am really looking forward to other sandbox MMOs like Earthrise and MO.
EQ for me! and DAOC ...but I dunno if its the NEW MMO's or the way there designed but in WAR I raced crazy mad to end game...I think alot of people did its the way they designed the quest but I felt like I was constantly just running to red circles on my map no time to talk to no one!!!! .....and I am not usually like that. Also I played Anarchy Online off and on since release and still only have a 213 character.
Maybe its due to me being a older mmo gamer but I enjoy games that let me play my own way.
If I see a clear cut path to a "End game" I quickly lose interest. As an example I reactivated my Account in WoW when WotLK release, I went into the first area, picked up a quest and instantly got bored and left my sub to rot for Ryzom.
I like Options, I think more MMOs should drop this clear path to endgame. Certain games are trying to remedy this by letting you level through pvp or pve and for my experience with WAR so far it isnt much different.
IN a game like Ryzom I just hang out, I don;t need to rush because what I'm doing at that moment feels 100% natural to me. Same goes for Eve even though I know alot of players don't like the games setting or combat I find the game a breath of fresh air even after near two years.
What I would really like is for a game with freedom like Ryzom to also give me the content quality of a Endgame MMO. Like optional dungeons and pvp minigames but not make them madatory for everything, make them feel natural. A complete blend of old school sandbox and new school themepark. Give people options, let the game play feel natural and flow.
My fondest memories are from DAoC. I remember fighting away solo at first and asking around if there are any groups that needed whatever I was playing at the time. Once I finally found one they were usually out in the thick wilderness or deep down some hole of a dungeon and now I had to carefully make my way down with danger all around. One screw up and it would set me back not only in experience loss but time as well. Once I finally get down to them I would then be able to relax because now I have a safe place to kill and gather loot and experience in a relaxed setting. I can kick back and BS with the rest of the group after a few pulls because healers/casters would run out of mana, hell even the combat was slow enough that I can toss in some dialogue while fighting. It was always about the people and having a good journey together especially since the journey took forever.
To me it just seemed like at that time people took them selves less seriously. Everybody had a healthy sense of humor. Nobody would have a knee jerk reaction to things people would say. Nowadays people just seem like they want to shoot from the hip and I think that's what ruins the communities nowadays. All the people that are inclined to socialize get turned off by the lack of like minded individuals who take jokes and humor for what it is.
No required quests! And if I decide I want to be an assassin-cartographer-dancer-pastry chef who lives only to stalk and kill interior decorators, then that's who I want to be, even if it takes me four years to max all the skills and everyone else thinks I'm freaking nuts. -Madimorga-
The average age of the MMO player is dropping, this is why you think player attitudes to MMO’s have changed.
Teenagers take themselves very seriously, they have very little self referential humour. They shoot from the hip and find it hard to relate to a sense of community.
It is becoming easier for those younger and younger to join a MMO. You used to need a credit card, now you often don’t. You used to need a PC, now often a console will do. MMO’s were designed with PC RPG games in mind, now they are designed with console beat erm ups in mind.
The whole genre is going tweenie and so more and more of us are washed up here, wondering what happened to MMO’s? There are still some good MMO’s out there but each new release takes a step further to console button crunching, easy as possible game play, casual play style, solo only style games.
The whole problem is, most of the journey sucks ass. I don't enjoy doing the same quests, only with different text and different mobs. The only difference between most mobs are the skins. How much fun can a person have doing that? I had a lot of fun in FFXI, because it was my first. I had a lot of fun leveling in WoW for the first time. After that, leveling in any game became the most boring aspect of the game. If the journey was more interesting, and the quests were fun and challenging, then I wouldn't mind.
Too bad the journey isn't interesting, and the quests aren't fun or challenging. Go kill 20 boars. Go deliver this note to this guy. Save me, and bring me back to town. These type of quests are unavoidable, but devs haven't tried anything to improve them. The big problem is the AI of MMOs are horrible. If the AI was improved to be somewhat close to a single player game, I'm sure many people would love the journey.
As it is right now, most mobs in MMOs are dumb as hell. I can kill all regular mobs in MMOs with my eyes closed (literally). That's just not fun to me. This is why I need PvP in a MMO, or I wouldn't bother to play. Until PvE is on par, or close to a single player game, leveling up will be boring as hell.
Storylines matter to me. I figure the writers put some effort into writing the quests, so I'll put a little effort into reading them and following the stories they tell. Since PvP means "Kill anything with a life bar" nowadays, I stick with PvE. I take my own sweet time, currently in WoW once again. I try to hit up every faction I can, including going after racial mounts by starting from the very beginning of allied races if necessary. Once I've done it all and seen it all on my way to level cap, I call it a day. Raids to me mean playing the games at the whim of other people. I'll group up when necessary on my journey, but when I have to schedule days and times to do crap that lasts upwards of 5 hours and beyond, only to wind up getting ZIP at the end because the final boss didn't drop anything I could use, it stops being fun.
So, yeah, I prefer the levelling game. I don't even pay attention to the levelling itself, only so far as to allocate a new talent point, or hit up my trainers. Other than that, I just get quests, do the ones I can, hold the ones I can't in reserve until I can do them, and just play. To me, endgame is when I click "Exit to desktop" the last time and move on to something else.
"You'll never win an argument with an idiot because he is too stupid to recognize his own defeat." ~Anonymous
You know, back when you actually enjoyed the journey of leveling itself, even when it meant camping the same spot in a dungeon for hours on end, because it was enough of a rush just to get to see new areas of the game and get new abilities? Back when you slowly, over time, amassed wealth and possessions, and there were clear differences between the players who put in the effort and those who didn't? When dying had penalties, and you quickly learned to be protective of your character and not send him charging foolheartedly into battle? You know, when you actually felt like you had achieved something and felt an attachment to your avatar? There was no prize waiting for you at the end. There were no freebies or pats on the back to remind you that You're Special. Your prize was in fact the time that you had spent reaching the end and the friendships and memories you formed. Sigh. Get off my lawn.
hmm i don't have to remember, because is still don't give a s**t about the endgame ....
If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude; greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen. Samuel Adams
My first MMO's were Lineage 1 quickly followed by DAOC which were both level based and I was on the tread mill to end game right from day one.
In Lineage 1, the end game consisted of fighting for control of various castles and if a player wasn't in the level 45+ range they need not apply. Also, you could not talk on global chat (where all sales took place) until level 30, another big incentive to level quickly.
DAOC was worse. Its core PVP did not start until level 50 so players fought their way to 50 as quickly as they could.
I recall being a low level (20 something) and speaking to a veteran who was leveling an alt. I told him it much be great to have a level 50 and she (he?) said, not really, once you get to 50 you just end up re-rolling an alt and doing it all over again.
Didn't realize how prophetic that person would be. I leveled up 6 characters to 50 (and bought 2) and in every game since then I've had 5 or more maximum level characters.
The good news is, I enjoy leveling alts (to a point) and find satisfaction in leveling each one to max more efficiently than the first time.
I recall in WOW my first Paladin took like 16 days played. My final Warlock, 6 days.
It wasn't until a few years ago when I started playing EVE that I discovered the freedom of an MMO w/o an endgame to speak of.
Sure, I wanted to fly the bigger better ships, but now that I'm a few years in , I can fly a wide range of ships (not everything of course) and am able to pursue any goal i choose w/o feeling a huge pressure to reroll, or level.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Sure, I wanted to fly the bigger better ships, but now that I'm a few years in , I can fly a wide range of ships (not everything of course) and am able to pursue any goal i choose w/o feeling a huge pressure to reroll, or level.
That sounds like an endgame. How's that any different than WoW.
____________________________________________ im to lazy too use grammar or punctuation good
I never cared all thart much for the end-game. Thats when it gets repetitive. The best part of a MMO is leveling up right from the get go when everyone is on the same playing field, learning together, being generally nicer to eachother.
For me, WOW did it best. Lots of choices, lots to do, lots to see, no linear boxed in path and no GRINDING or spawn camping.
Yes I remember those times. It was back during UO and EQs reign. You make an interesting point. I am so sick of the grind to get to a ''level'' so that you can participate in end game. I just liked working on my character and making them bad ass like in UO. It's just not worth playing a game just for a shot at an armor roll or some item. The wow method of games has made games so item-centric, hence the end game is so important. I believe those days are over though my friend, as everyone is releasing the same old crap these days.
Sure, I wanted to fly the bigger better ships, but now that I'm a few years in , I can fly a wide range of ships (not everything of course) and am able to pursue any goal i choose w/o feeling a huge pressure to reroll, or level.
That sounds like an endgame. How's that any different than WoW.
On the surface it might seem the same, but I'll try to differentiate.
If i was a max level Druid today in WOW, I'd either be raiding, working on some crafting skills (though I don't think this is something one pursues at length in WOW, and you are limited to a chosen set of trades to work on.) or rerolling another new character to aqcuire new skills and abilities and leveling up all over again.
In EVE, I don't need to reroll to aqcuire new skills, my character can pursue a new career and still remain profcient in his previous ones.
Were I to go into manufacturing, I could occupy myself for months if not years trying to acheive maximum glory in building the biggest and best ships. Or I could spend about a year or so becoming a mining expert .
But no need to really re-roll and level to get anywhere.
Its hard to explain if you've never experienced it before.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I remember those days fondly. They probably won't come again until developers move away from level based games. Slow progression worked great in a game like UO because you could work on several different skills at once but in a game like EQ where all you had was that one level it was a mind numbing grind.
What gets me is why people even bothering rushing to end-game and then trying to be the "most uber" toon around. I mean lets face it, theres a large amount of other people just like you with the exact same gear. I think if people actually took the time to enjoy the content and not rush to max level they'd have a much more enjoyable online gaming experience.
End-game for me is about time to pack it up and leave or roll another toon and give it a go with a different class. I've no interest in raiding for hours each night, or farming instances for the "best" gear. Its pixels not real life, so when anything ingame requires me to change my real life schedule its time to /quit or take a break.
In a way I guess this is why I enjoy pvp, because it offers more then just aiming for loot all the time. It offers strategy and fights which are different most of time, depending on the class your playing or fighting against. Not to mention I can log off whenever I want and not feel obligated to stay ingame to grind for loot. PVP FTW!! LOL
Okay, I absolutely love FFXI...actually, my favorite part was leveling and finding parties to level with...it's a long process, but, in that game, it was worth it... Thinking back, it makes me want to sub again.....*sighs* ...sometimes getting all nostalgic makes me depressed...nothing is the same anymore.....I can't get the connection with the games or with the other players aas I did with FFXI......hmph...
Yeah I know how you feel, Ive quit FFXI so many times to try to find something better and nothing has come close. I guess thats why I just subbed again lol. Well I guess ill see how Fallen Earth is if it dont satisfy my grouping addiction I'll just have to keep playing FFXI until FFXIV comes out.
Yea, I have decided to re-sub to FFXI....I just can't go long without playing an MMO, and since I really don't like anything else out there (or I've grown bored with them), I think I need to go back to the MMO that took my MMO virginity....
....that is, until FFXIV comes to take the sloppy seconds...
PLAYING: NOTHING!!! PLAYED:FFXI, LotRO, AoC, WAR, DDO, Megaten, Wurm, Rohan, Mabinogi, RoM
Comments
I hear ya. I got sucked into the "mad dash" to level cap in WoW. After a while I got sick of raiding constantly and started looking elsewhere. I learned to just slow down and enjoy the journey in LotRO, but even at my slow pace I still hit end-game there and got bored of raiding and the MoM grind.
Now I'm taking my time and enjoying Ryzom and am really looking forward to other sandbox MMOs like Earthrise and MO.
EQ for me! and DAOC ...but I dunno if its the NEW MMO's or the way there designed but in WAR I raced crazy mad to end game...I think alot of people did its the way they designed the quest but I felt like I was constantly just running to red circles on my map no time to talk to no one!!!! .....and I am not usually like that. Also I played Anarchy Online off and on since release and still only have a 213 character.
Why is it a problem that there is a power gap? Shouldn't there be some sort of reward for effort? The only time that even seems relevant is in the case of unrestricted PvP where higher level players can go gank lowbies.
It also completely segregates the community into subsections based on level. In WoW, you as a level 20 can't go help your level 80 friends fight a monster because you will be instantly killed. That is another reason why I felt the need to rush through the leveling, all my friends were already at max level playing the game, and I was unable to play with them because I still had to go through that whole pointless timesink. It also makes lower level content completely worthless and wasted once the player is passed that level of power.
The real question is, why have such massive power gaps?
Tried: LotR, CoH, AoC, WAR, Jumpgate Classic
Played: SWG, Guild Wars, WoW
Playing: Eve Online, Counter-strike
Loved: Star Wars Galaxies
Waiting for: Earthrise, Guild Wars 2, anything sandbox.
I hear ya. I got sucked into the "mad dash" to level cap in WoW. After a while I got sick of raiding constantly and started looking elsewhere. I learned to just slow down and enjoy the journey in LotRO, but even at my slow pace I still hit end-game there and got bored of raiding and the MoM grind.
Now I'm taking my time and enjoying Ryzom and am really looking forward to other sandbox MMOs like Earthrise and MO.
EQ for me! and DAOC ...but I dunno if its the NEW MMO's or the way there designed but in WAR I raced crazy mad to end game...I think alot of people did its the way they designed the quest but I felt like I was constantly just running to red circles on my map no time to talk to no one!!!! .....and I am not usually like that. Also I played Anarchy Online off and on since release and still only have a 213 character.
Maybe its due to me being a older mmo gamer but I enjoy games that let me play my own way.
If I see a clear cut path to a "End game" I quickly lose interest. As an example I reactivated my Account in WoW when WotLK release, I went into the first area, picked up a quest and instantly got bored and left my sub to rot for Ryzom.
I like Options, I think more MMOs should drop this clear path to endgame. Certain games are trying to remedy this by letting you level through pvp or pve and for my experience with WAR so far it isnt much different.
IN a game like Ryzom I just hang out, I don;t need to rush because what I'm doing at that moment feels 100% natural to me. Same goes for Eve even though I know alot of players don't like the games setting or combat I find the game a breath of fresh air even after near two years.
What I would really like is for a game with freedom like Ryzom to also give me the content quality of a Endgame MMO. Like optional dungeons and pvp minigames but not make them madatory for everything, make them feel natural. A complete blend of old school sandbox and new school themepark. Give people options, let the game play feel natural and flow.
Maybe one day.
Playing: EvE, Ryzom
My fondest memories are from DAoC. I remember fighting away solo at first and asking around if there are any groups that needed whatever I was playing at the time. Once I finally found one they were usually out in the thick wilderness or deep down some hole of a dungeon and now I had to carefully make my way down with danger all around. One screw up and it would set me back not only in experience loss but time as well. Once I finally get down to them I would then be able to relax because now I have a safe place to kill and gather loot and experience in a relaxed setting. I can kick back and BS with the rest of the group after a few pulls because healers/casters would run out of mana, hell even the combat was slow enough that I can toss in some dialogue while fighting. It was always about the people and having a good journey together especially since the journey took forever.
To me it just seemed like at that time people took them selves less seriously. Everybody had a healthy sense of humor. Nobody would have a knee jerk reaction to things people would say. Nowadays people just seem like they want to shoot from the hip and I think that's what ruins the communities nowadays. All the people that are inclined to socialize get turned off by the lack of like minded individuals who take jokes and humor for what it is.
No required quests! And if I decide I want to be an assassin-cartographer-dancer-pastry chef who lives only to stalk and kill interior decorators, then that's who I want to be, even if it takes me four years to max all the skills and everyone else thinks I'm freaking nuts. -Madimorga-
The average age of the MMO player is dropping, this is why you think player attitudes to MMO’s have changed.
Teenagers take themselves very seriously, they have very little self referential humour. They shoot from the hip and find it hard to relate to a sense of community.
It is becoming easier for those younger and younger to join a MMO. You used to need a credit card, now you often don’t. You used to need a PC, now often a console will do. MMO’s were designed with PC RPG games in mind, now they are designed with console beat erm ups in mind.
The whole genre is going tweenie and so more and more of us are washed up here, wondering what happened to MMO’s? There are still some good MMO’s out there but each new release takes a step further to console button crunching, easy as possible game play, casual play style, solo only style games.
The whole problem is, most of the journey sucks ass. I don't enjoy doing the same quests, only with different text and different mobs. The only difference between most mobs are the skins. How much fun can a person have doing that? I had a lot of fun in FFXI, because it was my first. I had a lot of fun leveling in WoW for the first time. After that, leveling in any game became the most boring aspect of the game. If the journey was more interesting, and the quests were fun and challenging, then I wouldn't mind.
Too bad the journey isn't interesting, and the quests aren't fun or challenging. Go kill 20 boars. Go deliver this note to this guy. Save me, and bring me back to town. These type of quests are unavoidable, but devs haven't tried anything to improve them. The big problem is the AI of MMOs are horrible. If the AI was improved to be somewhat close to a single player game, I'm sure many people would love the journey.
As it is right now, most mobs in MMOs are dumb as hell. I can kill all regular mobs in MMOs with my eyes closed (literally). That's just not fun to me. This is why I need PvP in a MMO, or I wouldn't bother to play. Until PvE is on par, or close to a single player game, leveling up will be boring as hell.
I still don't care about the end game.
Maybe that's why I haven't been a subscriber to any MMO longer than few months since 2004. Excluding LOTRO.
"There is as yet insufficient data for a meaningful answer."
Storylines matter to me. I figure the writers put some effort into writing the quests, so I'll put a little effort into reading them and following the stories they tell. Since PvP means "Kill anything with a life bar" nowadays, I stick with PvE. I take my own sweet time, currently in WoW once again. I try to hit up every faction I can, including going after racial mounts by starting from the very beginning of allied races if necessary. Once I've done it all and seen it all on my way to level cap, I call it a day. Raids to me mean playing the games at the whim of other people. I'll group up when necessary on my journey, but when I have to schedule days and times to do crap that lasts upwards of 5 hours and beyond, only to wind up getting ZIP at the end because the final boss didn't drop anything I could use, it stops being fun.
So, yeah, I prefer the levelling game. I don't even pay attention to the levelling itself, only so far as to allocate a new talent point, or hit up my trainers. Other than that, I just get quests, do the ones I can, hold the ones I can't in reserve until I can do them, and just play. To me, endgame is when I click "Exit to desktop" the last time and move on to something else.
"You'll never win an argument with an idiot because he is too stupid to recognize his own defeat." ~Anonymous
Still doesn't. I despise the MMORPG traditional end game.
hmm i don't have to remember, because is still don't give a s**t about the endgame ....
I just wish it was possible to do all the content in a game like WoW without doing some of the content a billion times.
I'd love to do all the "endgame" stuff once or twice and then quit, but you pretty much can't do that.
____________________________________________
im to lazy too use grammar or punctuation good
We need more MMO's W/O endgames.
If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude; greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.
Samuel Adams
I assume you were being sarcastic, but if not, how's that possible?
____________________________________________
im to lazy too use grammar or punctuation good
Actually, no.
My first MMO's were Lineage 1 quickly followed by DAOC which were both level based and I was on the tread mill to end game right from day one.
In Lineage 1, the end game consisted of fighting for control of various castles and if a player wasn't in the level 45+ range they need not apply. Also, you could not talk on global chat (where all sales took place) until level 30, another big incentive to level quickly.
DAOC was worse. Its core PVP did not start until level 50 so players fought their way to 50 as quickly as they could.
I recall being a low level (20 something) and speaking to a veteran who was leveling an alt. I told him it much be great to have a level 50 and she (he?) said, not really, once you get to 50 you just end up re-rolling an alt and doing it all over again.
Didn't realize how prophetic that person would be. I leveled up 6 characters to 50 (and bought 2) and in every game since then I've had 5 or more maximum level characters.
The good news is, I enjoy leveling alts (to a point) and find satisfaction in leveling each one to max more efficiently than the first time.
I recall in WOW my first Paladin took like 16 days played. My final Warlock, 6 days.
It wasn't until a few years ago when I started playing EVE that I discovered the freedom of an MMO w/o an endgame to speak of.
Sure, I wanted to fly the bigger better ships, but now that I'm a few years in , I can fly a wide range of ships (not everything of course) and am able to pursue any goal i choose w/o feeling a huge pressure to reroll, or level.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
That sounds like an endgame. How's that any different than WoW.
____________________________________________
im to lazy too use grammar or punctuation good
I never cared all thart much for the end-game. Thats when it gets repetitive. The best part of a MMO is leveling up right from the get go when everyone is on the same playing field, learning together, being generally nicer to eachother.
For me, WOW did it best. Lots of choices, lots to do, lots to see, no linear boxed in path and no GRINDING or spawn camping.
Yes I remember those times. It was back during UO and EQs reign. You make an interesting point. I am so sick of the grind to get to a ''level'' so that you can participate in end game. I just liked working on my character and making them bad ass like in UO. It's just not worth playing a game just for a shot at an armor roll or some item. The wow method of games has made games so item-centric, hence the end game is so important. I believe those days are over though my friend, as everyone is releasing the same old crap these days.
I don't believe in an endgame principle. I don't raid, but have leveled quickly before just to access new skills/spells/content.
For me it has always been about the journey.
That sounds like an endgame. How's that any different than WoW.
On the surface it might seem the same, but I'll try to differentiate.
If i was a max level Druid today in WOW, I'd either be raiding, working on some crafting skills (though I don't think this is something one pursues at length in WOW, and you are limited to a chosen set of trades to work on.) or rerolling another new character to aqcuire new skills and abilities and leveling up all over again.
In EVE, I don't need to reroll to aqcuire new skills, my character can pursue a new career and still remain profcient in his previous ones.
Were I to go into manufacturing, I could occupy myself for months if not years trying to acheive maximum glory in building the biggest and best ships. Or I could spend about a year or so becoming a mining expert .
But no need to really re-roll and level to get anywhere.
Its hard to explain if you've never experienced it before.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I remember those days fondly. They probably won't come again until developers move away from level based games. Slow progression worked great in a game like UO because you could work on several different skills at once but in a game like EQ where all you had was that one level it was a mind numbing grind.
What gets me is why people even bothering rushing to end-game and then trying to be the "most uber" toon around. I mean lets face it, theres a large amount of other people just like you with the exact same gear. I think if people actually took the time to enjoy the content and not rush to max level they'd have a much more enjoyable online gaming experience.
End-game for me is about time to pack it up and leave or roll another toon and give it a go with a different class. I've no interest in raiding for hours each night, or farming instances for the "best" gear. Its pixels not real life, so when anything ingame requires me to change my real life schedule its time to /quit or take a break.
In a way I guess this is why I enjoy pvp, because it offers more then just aiming for loot all the time. It offers strategy and fights which are different most of time, depending on the class your playing or fighting against. Not to mention I can log off whenever I want and not feel obligated to stay ingame to grind for loot. PVP FTW!! LOL
"I play Tera for the gameplay"
Yeah I know how you feel, Ive quit FFXI so many times to try to find something better and nothing has come close. I guess thats why I just subbed again lol. Well I guess ill see how Fallen Earth is if it dont satisfy my grouping addiction I'll just have to keep playing FFXI until FFXIV comes out.
Yea, I have decided to re-sub to FFXI....I just can't go long without playing an MMO, and since I really don't like anything else out there (or I've grown bored with them), I think I need to go back to the MMO that took my MMO virginity....
....that is, until FFXIV comes to take the sloppy seconds...
PLAYING: NOTHING!!!
PLAYED:FFXI, LotRO, AoC, WAR, DDO, Megaten, Wurm, Rohan, Mabinogi, RoM
WAITING FOR: Dust 514
That's all I remember, I don't play MMOs for endgame. I play to level only. Which is why I stayed with CoX for 5 years.