It worries me that you rate Aion as even less 'fun' than champions as I find Champions the least fun MMO I have ever encountered to date (not all its own fault I am just bored of more of the same with no sign of progress),,,, I do agree you can spend many happy hours in the CO character creator but once you step outside ...oh dear... Character creator aside what is the reletive fun factor associated with each game during the levelling process (which is, in truth, the thing that long term will consume most time) and is Aion as guilty as CO of doing nothing new? Edit; IMO CO structurally and thematically it forcebly treats/realises your character as a barbarian thug in a world full of dumb herding beasts... its more a fantasy game with a superficial comicy skin as there's no conviction in its theme.
CO does more things new than any MMO thats released in a long time. Combat, total character customization on every level, the nemesis system... just to name the big ones.
You have but to look over the shoulder of a person playing Aion and a person playing CO to see which one is obviously more entertaining at a base value. Aion may have more end-game options at this point, but thats really the only thing it touts over it.
Every questing MMO treats you as a thug for hire. Aion most assuredly does. It's the trapping of the world around you and the tools your given to perform that makes you "feel" like a super hero. When I drill a bad guy in the head with a semi-truck, or I save the city from an alien invasion, or I obliterate 10 thugs with a power and watch them all go sailing in differerent directions... I "feel" pretty super.
How much of a badass do you feel like when you scratch by taking on a single Pikachu and have to rest to tackle the next one in Aion? Oh noes, Pikachu called help!!... I'll need to pot for this battle! Yeah...Aion makes me feel like a real hero <sarcasm>
I have been in CO since alpha and really can't agree with the suggestion it does anything new at all...there are a few refinements (all in the avatar creation) but they are easily countered by the archaic/inapproprate approach to world design and questing (the nemesis system sounds cool till you actiually realise how rudimentary and simpistic it is).
By and large in a fantasy game it really doesn't matter that you are a thug because the theme is a chaotic and barbaric world...being a thug in a ' superhero' world is just completely inappropriate and its that kind of intrusion of arbitrary gameplay that destroys any conviction or immersion in CO.
I am hoping for an mmo that is immersive and involving, one where the game has some conviction in the theme imo CO fails miserably in these area's so the question is really, is Aion any better or worse?
Aion is immersive and involving. It is the first "somewhat" challenging game we've seen in a while. Throw some awesome Lore, a story that is interweaved in everything that you do in game, and an infinite amount of polish and stability, and you have a long lasting game.
Personally I play games like these to get immersed in a world. If I wanted to play a game that plays exactly like a console game ( CO ) I would just play a console game.
Haha wow I was not expecting this many replies and I thank everyone for there time in reading the long ass comparison I made. Just a couple of things.
1) Sorry about the overuse of Now. Never actually had a crutch word problem before and after reading it again I did realize the problem my self. Will go back later tonight and reedit and take out the nows and add something else or just let the sentence start out with the next word haha. I need to write my blogs like I write speeches and be concience on repetitive drivel.
2) I have gotten a lot people asking me about why I did not compare the PVP's in both games (mainly at the Champions Forum), and the answer is quite simply CO PVP is just convoluted crap. The balancing issues does not bother me (maybe taking 20 mins to kill someone is), its more the fact that it is not done well. Looks rushed, a lot of it is in a tiny arena where it is chaos and no cohesion.
3) And the people who said I did not touch on the fact Aion has a year more polish really did not read the blog. I said it 3 different times. I also said that the games still needed to be compared because they come out the same time and time of polish on release is what is going to matter.
I want to stress that Champions Online is very unpolished for an MMORPG about to go retail. After having been spoiled by polished releases like LotRO and WAR, this game really feels like it needs a lot of work. All that said, it's still a fun game. It has a steep learning curve, as you can gimp a character as you build the powers, stats, etc... However, I like that amount of depth, plus the ability to completely respec your character fairly inexpensively. If you get bored with a power set, no need to roll a new character, you can remake your existing character! (This includes appearance as well).
Aion
Aion is very polished. In some areas, I'm disappointed that a game that was released a year ago in Korea hasn't progressed further in some of the areas it is deficient in, but the head start before releasing in the West did produce a pretty solid foundation. On the down side, Aion DOES feel "grindy". It's been a while since I've played an MMORPG that requires so much effort to level. This is not always a bad thing, but many will find it off putting. Also, the forced PvP aspect will be a game ender for many.
It's a game you play more for achievement, than for fun, which will limit it's appeal.
Long term appeal
Which brings me to the one thing I'm not sure I agree with in the review. "Last-ability", or longevity? Long term appeal. Which game seems to most have the ability to retain subscribers first, beyond the first month and second, retain numbers longterm?
That's a tough question, because I see problems with both titles that effect this. Both games can be fun, but both have factors limiting their long term fun potential.
Advancing in Aion is a slog. The slog is made worse because combat is slow and repetitive and once you reach level 20 members of the other faction have a lot of capability to interfere with your ability to enjoy the game. As I stated above, Aion is a pure Achievers game and even then, some Achievers will become frustrated with the forced PvP element of the title.
Champions Online feels more fun and fast paced. The mission environments are much, much more varied than in City of Heroes. Bored with relying on the same skill sequence in fight after fight? You can swap powers in and out, or even go with a completely new build. How's that for tackling the problem of monotony head on? The down side? The lack of polish is a major concern. Usually, if a game lacks polish at launch, the problems get more and more evident as you get into the higher level content. With CO, I'm worried how the game will hold up as you get further into the game.
Conclusion
Both games have a lot to offer to segments of the MMORPG fan base. Achievers will likely enjoy Aion. Players who have been yearning for a game that allows broad scope in customizing the appearance, skill selection and character advancement will love that aspect of CO. (There are no cookie-cutter characters in CO).
Neither game, in my opinion, offers broad AND lasting appeal.
In some ways, Champions Online has more potential to broaden it's audience down the line. Aion's core game experience is unlikely to change or broaden in the future. CO, on the other hand, suffers greatly from it's lack of polish. If it maintains enough subscribers to fund solid, continuing development, a polished CO could become a very successful title.
Lastly, neither game is "The One", the near perfect, expansive, content rich MMORPG title that offers equal appeal to PvEers/ PvPers, Casuals/Achievers, etc... Neither Aion nor Champions Online comes close to the ideal.
I have been in CO since alpha and really can't agree with the suggestion it does anything new at all...there are a few refinements (all in the avatar creation) but they are easily countered by the archaic/inapproprate approach to world design and questing (the nemesis system sounds cool till you actiually realise how rudimentary and simpistic it is). By and large in a fantasy game it really doesn't matter that you are a thug because the theme is a chaotic and barbaric world...being a thug in a ' superhero' world is just completely inappropriate and its that kind of intrusion of arbitrary gameplay that destroys any conviction or immersion in CO. I am hoping for an mmo that is immersive and involving, one where the game has some conviction in the theme imo CO fails miserably in these area's so the question is really, is Aion any better or worse?
I have played both CO and Aion in closed beta. I find my Ranger to be much more involved and interesting, combat-wise, than any of the sets I have tried in CO. For me, CO becomes "spam big skill", glance at TV while end builder on auto-fire, glance back at game and "spam big skill" if needed. The combat just is not interesting at all to me. In fact, I enjoy CoX's combat more. I only made it back up to L6 in open beta as I cannot stomach the desert or Canada again.
As for Aion, it has more of the old school world feel that CO and WAR are lacking. Plus, if you enjoy PvP at all, Aion will be a great choice. The quests are still more of the same, but at least you actually have to worry about aggro and your healthbar. Oh, and many of the quests actually require teaming. Mmmmm ... teaming.
For me, my choice is going to be Aion, as combat is very important to me, as that is what we do most in these games. I also enjoy the world and PvP of Aion. CO I will keep an eye on for several months to see if combat/teaming is improved at all. If not, I will pick console games to be my "break" from Aion.
Aion is immersive and involving. It is the first "somewhat" challenging game we've seen in a while. Throw some awesome Lore, a story that is interweaved in everything that you do in game, and an infinite amount of polish and stability, and you have a long lasting game. Personally I play games like these to get immersed in a world. If I wanted to play a game that plays exactly like a console game ( CO ) I would just play a console game.
I die more in Champions than I ever did in Aion. In Champions the illusion of being "super" is addicting enough that youu can easily overstep your bounds or be caught by surprise. Sometimes you can pull of some pretty amazing fights that you probably should of died from, and sometimes a baddy will catch you with a special attack you needed to block and put you in a hurt.
In Aion, I know whether or not I've won the fight before I even pull, and whether or not I need to disengage if I happen to grab an add. There is no challenge, its just a slow repetitive process of killing one mob at a time. Maybe you have to use a potion... thats about the extent of it.
I like Aion, but measuring challenge based on the number of enemies you can take on at one time is a poor measure. Just because one enemy in Aion is the equivalent of x enemies is CO doesn't make Aion harder. In CO pulls range from 3-10+ guys at a time, and that added element of randomness makes it more challenging and less boring.
My immersion factor in any game just so happens to directly correspond by how much fun I'm having. I feel like a Superhero in Champions.... do you feel like an immortal demi-god in Aion? I sure didn't... damned furbies kept taking a chunk out of my butt.
I have been in CO since alpha and really can't agree with the suggestion it does anything new at all...there are a few refinements (all in the avatar creation) but they are easily countered by the archaic/inapproprate approach to world design and questing (the nemesis system sounds cool till you actiually realise how rudimentary and simpistic it is). By and large in a fantasy game it really doesn't matter that you are a thug because the theme is a chaotic and barbaric world...being a thug in a ' superhero' world is just completely inappropriate and its that kind of intrusion of arbitrary gameplay that destroys any conviction or immersion in CO. I am hoping for an mmo that is immersive and involving, one where the game has some conviction in the theme imo CO fails miserably in these area's so the question is really, is Aion any better or worse?
I don't understand how being an immortal super being angel/demon somehow justifies you killing "x" of "y" enemy or being a delivery boy. If anything it makes more sense for a mortal superhero to be doing that sort of stuff as opposed to an immortal demi-god. A fantasy world is no more "chaotic or barbaric" than a world filled with evil super-villains each plotting their own schemes of mass destruction or power mongering... you are bending your perception and making excuses for one game and condemning another for no reason other that it suits your purpose.
Aion is immersive and involving. It is the first "somewhat" challenging game we've seen in a while. Throw some awesome Lore, a story that is interweaved in everything that you do in game, and an infinite amount of polish and stability, and you have a long lasting game. Personally I play games like these to get immersed in a world. If I wanted to play a game that plays exactly like a console game ( CO ) I would just play a console game.
I die more in Champions than I ever did in Aion. In Champions the illusion of being "super" is addicting enough that youu can easily overstep your bounds or be caught by surprise. Sometimes you can pull of some pretty amazing fights that you probably should of died from, and sometimes a baddy will catch you with a special attack you needed to block and put you in a hurt.
In Aion, I know whether or not I've won the fight before I even pull, and whether or not I need to disengage if I happen to grab an add. There is no challenge, its just a slow repetitive process of killing one mob at a time. Maybe you have to use a potion... thats about the extent of it.
I like Aion, but measuring challenge based on the number of enemies you can take on at one time is a poor measure. Just because one enemy in Aion is the equivalent of x enemies is CO doesn't make Aion harder. In CO pulls range from 3-10+ guys at a time, and that added element of randomness makes it more challenging and less boring.
My immersion factor in any game just so happens to directly correspond by how much fun I'm having. I feel like a Superhero in Champions.... do you feel like an immortal demi-god in Aion? I sure didn't... damned furbies kept taking a chunk out of my butt.
That's the problem with CO to me. You start as a super-hero at level 1. You don't get a chance to build yourself up within the world. In Aion, you are trying to regain footing and even though you might not be "an immortal demi-god" from the start, by the end you sure will be.
CO is just not dynamic enough for me, the gameplay isn't constantly evolving like it is in Aion.
I understand why some people like CO, it's just not my bag of tea. Long story short, I come from Everquest as do a lot of my fellow gamers. We take pride in advancing in these virtual worlds, geeky as it may sound. I like my carrot on a stick because it tastes so much better when you finally get it, much better than someone just handing you a carrot and telling you to nibble on it so as to not run out before the end of the game.
I don't think its a good comparison. Aion has been out months in Korea, its polished, stunning graphics, and has been adding content and balance for some time. CO just isn't ready for launch yet, graphics are ok at best, still full of bugs and class imbalance. It's not really fair to compair the two, CO and Fallen Earth would have been a better.
I don't think its a good comparison. Aion has been out months in Korea, its polished, stunning graphics, and has been adding content and balance for some time. CO just isn't ready for launch yet, graphics are ok at best, still full of bugs and class imbalance. It's not really fair to compair the two, CO and Fallen Earth would have been a better.
Dude I made that statement 3 times in the Review. Reead it before you knock it. I said some people might think it unfair but it is valid because THEY COME OUT AT THE SAME TIME.
And the person who said CO is harder WTF are you talking about. I got to level 15 without dying once. In Aion by 15 I died 3 or 4 times. Aion is a lot more challenging.
If you find CO challenging then stop randomly pressing buttons
I agree with a good amount of the review. Champions Online I want to stress that Champions Online is very unpolished for an MMORPG about to go retail. After having been spoiled by polished releases like LotRO and WAR,...
Wait a minute...
I played WAR closed beta for year and 9+ months after launch. I have to disagree with you here. WAR was far from a polished launch. It took months to solve lag with using powers, lag in large scale ORVR, and fortress', etc... Lets also mention they have yet to solve the balance problem, oh yea and getting stuck in rocks, rabbits, etc... Yet in CO open beta the game runs very well with no large scale bugs, but I will give you the fact they are still balancing, but the game has yet to be released either.
Cheers!
MMO Vet since AOL Neverwinter Nights circa 1992. My MMO beat up your MMO. =S
I agree with a good amount of the review. Champions Online I want to stress that Champions Online is very unpolished for an MMORPG about to go retail. After having been spoiled by polished releases like LotRO and WAR,...
Wait a minute...
I played WAR closed beta for year and 9+ months after launch. I have to disagree with you here. WAR was far from a polished launch. It took months to solve lag with using powers, lag in large scale ORVR, and fortress', etc... Lets also mention they have yet to solve the balance problem, oh yea and getting stuck in rocks, rabbits, etc... Yet in CO open beta the game runs very well with no large scale bugs, but I will give you the fact they are still balancing, but the game has yet to be released either.
Cheers!
I agree with you about WARS Launch. For the first two weeks the game was stable minus a memory on a lot of peoples computer. But as the days wore on the lag got worse and worse and worse. And till this day the game is no where near polished as it should be.
But CO not having any large scale bugs. Are you serious. Champions Online Open Beta is ridiculously bugged. Graphical gliches Like every time I target a mob or NPC from about 10 feet away I see an either green or red grid over him. I had to completely change my graphical settings to see anything that was not black or neon white. Horrendous pathing issues with mobs or NPC's that have to follow you. The Bugs go on an on an on and on.
Under "Stability", I think it's only fair to mention GameGuard for Aion. It's extremely intrusive and it doesn't like a lot of common drivers (Sidewinder, Diamondback, G15, to name a few), and some common anti-virus software. You're right that it runs exceptionally well on systems that don't have conflicts. 50+ FPS on a medium system when in combat, with gorgeous graphics. They picked the right engine (unlike WAR). Unfortunately, when they couple that with GameGuard, it either runs very well or doesn't run at all.
On the other hand, CO has lower framerate, although it looks like it should be less demanding than Aion. In some cases, it has less than half the framerate as Aion when run on the same system and appears to need optimization, at least on some video cards. This is with a launch date in less than a month.
I'd agree that Aion is more stable, with the GameGuard Caveat. But I wouldn't hold the patch problems on the first few days of OBT against CO, since they appear to have fixed them. If they used OBT to stress test the patching process, than that's fine if it's fixed for release.
A category that wasn't mentioned is dev involvement. CO has a lot of dev involvement on the beta forums. On the Aion beta forums, it seems like NCSoft West only has control over localization changes. Who knows whether feedback on bugs, interface, and gameplay from NA players is going to be noticed by the Aion devs (in Korea, not NCSoft West), in beta or ever? Whether you want to deal with that long term is as much a deciding factor as gameplay and stability, in my opinion.
I hate pvp games and will never play a game who's endgame is PvP centric. Aion looks great and has good PvE but it's just like guild wars - a leveling tool to get you to PvP. Champions endgame is PvE and I will never have to PvP if I don't want to. You're pretty much forced to PvP in Aion because that is the structure of the game.
The only problem with your comparison is this: Champions endgame: PvE Aion endgame: PvP I hate pvp games and will never play a game who's endgame is PvP centric. Aion looks great and has good PvE but it's just like guild wars - a leveling tool to get you to PvP. Champions endgame is PvE and I will never have to PvP if I don't want to. You're pretty much forced to PvP in Aion because that is the structure of the game.
Want to know the sad part about that statement? Aion's end game has more PVE than Champions (which is PVE based).
The only problem with your comparison is this: Champions endgame: PvE Aion endgame: PvP I hate pvp games and will never play a game who's endgame is PvP centric. Aion looks great and has good PvE but it's just like guild wars - a leveling tool to get you to PvP. Champions endgame is PvE and I will never have to PvP if I don't want to. You're pretty much forced to PvP in Aion because that is the structure of the game.
Want to know the sad part about that statement? Aion's end game has more PVE than Champions (which is PVE based).
It didn't until about a month ago, amazing what an extra year of development will do.
The only problem with your comparison is this: Champions endgame: PvE Aion endgame: PvP I hate pvp games and will never play a game who's endgame is PvP centric. Aion looks great and has good PvE but it's just like guild wars - a leveling tool to get you to PvP. Champions endgame is PvE and I will never have to PvP if I don't want to. You're pretty much forced to PvP in Aion because that is the structure of the game.
Want to know the sad part about that statement? Aion's end game has more PVE than Champions (which is PVE based).
It didn't until about a month ago, amazing what an extra year of development will do.
It is amazing what a year of development will do. And 2 years, etc. When CO has 1 year of development, Aion will have 2. CO will never catch up, NCsoft is very good about adding content and patches.
I came here and expected everyone to vouch for Champions Online. Except what I found was the majority would rather play Aion. These games can be compared but it's not a fair comparison when Aion has technically been out for a year. I expect good things from Champions but in the end it's just a superhero niche MMO. Aion is targetting a larger market while I suspect CO will get 100k subscribers, I also expect Aion to get 350k+. I believe both games will do very well however I'll be playing Aion.
The only problem with your comparison is this: Champions endgame: PvE Aion endgame: PvP I hate pvp games and will never play a game who's endgame is PvP centric. Aion looks great and has good PvE but it's just like guild wars - a leveling tool to get you to PvP. Champions endgame is PvE and I will never have to PvP if I don't want to. You're pretty much forced to PvP in Aion because that is the structure of the game.
Want to know the sad part about that statement? Aion's end game has more PVE than Champions (which is PVE based).
It didn't until about a month ago, amazing what an extra year of development will do.
It is amazing what a year of development will do. And 2 years, etc. When CO has 1 year of development, Aion will have 2. CO will never catch up, NCsoft is very good about adding content and patches.
Expansions make your point null and void. Consider how much wasted(in the sense nobody does it anymore) content WoW has because of expansions. Cryptic is no slouch themselves... and they won't have to go through a translation process everytime they want to port a patch/expansion to the english speaking servers.
I came here and expected everyone to vouch for Champions Online. Except what I found was the majority would rather play Aion. These games can be compared but it's not a fair comparison when Aion has technically been out for a year. I expect good things from Champions but in the end it's just a superhero niche MMO. Aion is targetting a larger market while I suspect CO will get 100k subscribers, I also expect Aion to get 350k+. I believe both games will do very well however I'll be playing Aion.
Most folks that come to MMORPG and post are either
1) Fairly Harcore Gamers... or
2) Trolls
Hard-core gamers tend to favor more traditional oriented time consuming games... ala Aion. They're also the ones that are more likely to pour over a forum board and critique everything. The folks who really enjoy CO are probably sitting in the character creator right now... or throwing tanks at villains.
I noticed the overuse of 'now' right away too. It's a strange habit, especially because it's completely unnecessary. I don't think I've ever seen it before. Anyways... I agree with some of your points, but there is a major factor you should consider. The fact that Aion has been out for so long in Asia provides a lot of benefits. Many of the reasons why you picked Aion is primarily due to the fact that it's a more mature game. Give CO some time to mature and you might change your mind. For example, you mentioned stability. I'm sure that stability is something that Cryptic is working hard to fix. Stability is a common problem for new MMO's. Why do you hate CO PvP? I think it's a lot of fun. Do you hate it because of the imbalances? Cryptic is working hard to fix the overpowered skills. How about the endgame? For CO, there is a lot we don't know yet.
sounds to me like you are just making excuses....
People want to play a mature, polished MMO now, not in 6 months. For that, Aion is definitely the way to go, hands down.
CO is just not going to be a very popular MMO. the game plays just like COH/COV, and will attract the same type of people. It has already been shown that superhero MMOs tend to do just "decent"... not even "well". the community will never be that large.
Aion on the other hand, is drawing directly from the WoW pool, which we can all agree is immense. I can easily see Aion capturing all wow players that enjoy the PVE aspects of WOW, but are looking for a little more hardcore, PVP-centric experience. this is exactly what Aion provides, a similar experience to WOW, but with superior PVP endgame.
I don't understand how being an immortal super being angel/demon somehow justifies you killing "x" of "y" enemy or being a delivery boy. If anything it makes more sense for a mortal superhero to be doing that sort of stuff as opposed to an immortal demi-god. A fantasy world is no more "chaotic or barbaric" than a world filled with evil super-villains each plotting their own schemes of mass destruction or power mongering... you are bending your perception and making excuses for one game and condemning another for no reason other that it suits your purpose.
For the record I wasn't making that comment specifically about Aion as I haven't played it and really know nothing of it's lore... as a general rule the chaotic and 'primitve' world of a typical fantasy game means charging around as a thug is still a valid (maybe even unavoidable) way of life..... However in a contemporary Superhero world - the super agent thug that CO forces you to be is, thankfully a rare and for the most part entirely inappropriate creature. Cryptics second bite of the cherry has lost more than it has gained in the area of theme conviction, involvement and immersion, which is sad.
From the responses it seems Aion is the better game in those areas that matter to me, although i do need to be grabbed by the theme - no one just plays and mmo because its there do they??
Ultimately neither game comes accross as overly progressive, lets hope some mmo's with real imagination and respect for their IP's are on the horizon. (DCUO, SWToR, APB are at least talking/prioritising the right things at the mo imo)
i realy thought i was only going to read this thread but i have to point out one thing about the NA version of the game (which i will be playing) . the thing is you are judgeing everything on the 1.0 version of the game instead of the 1.5 version of the NA release which will remove the graphics problems and a lot of the grind by adding in tons of quests and such in the end makeing aion the winner im not gonna stay and fight out any problems anyone has with my post as i have had my fill of getting sucked into trollers posts in threads like this and am fairly sick of it have a good thread everyone
Comments
CO does more things new than any MMO thats released in a long time. Combat, total character customization on every level, the nemesis system... just to name the big ones.
You have but to look over the shoulder of a person playing Aion and a person playing CO to see which one is obviously more entertaining at a base value. Aion may have more end-game options at this point, but thats really the only thing it touts over it.
Every questing MMO treats you as a thug for hire. Aion most assuredly does. It's the trapping of the world around you and the tools your given to perform that makes you "feel" like a super hero. When I drill a bad guy in the head with a semi-truck, or I save the city from an alien invasion, or I obliterate 10 thugs with a power and watch them all go sailing in differerent directions... I "feel" pretty super.
How much of a badass do you feel like when you scratch by taking on a single Pikachu and have to rest to tackle the next one in Aion? Oh noes, Pikachu called help!!... I'll need to pot for this battle! Yeah...Aion makes me feel like a real hero <sarcasm>
I have been in CO since alpha and really can't agree with the suggestion it does anything new at all...there are a few refinements (all in the avatar creation) but they are easily countered by the archaic/inapproprate approach to world design and questing (the nemesis system sounds cool till you actiually realise how rudimentary and simpistic it is).
By and large in a fantasy game it really doesn't matter that you are a thug because the theme is a chaotic and barbaric world...being a thug in a ' superhero' world is just completely inappropriate and its that kind of intrusion of arbitrary gameplay that destroys any conviction or immersion in CO.
I am hoping for an mmo that is immersive and involving, one where the game has some conviction in the theme imo CO fails miserably in these area's so the question is really, is Aion any better or worse?
Aion is immersive and involving. It is the first "somewhat" challenging game we've seen in a while. Throw some awesome Lore, a story that is interweaved in everything that you do in game, and an infinite amount of polish and stability, and you have a long lasting game.
Personally I play games like these to get immersed in a world. If I wanted to play a game that plays exactly like a console game ( CO ) I would just play a console game.
Haha wow I was not expecting this many replies and I thank everyone for there time in reading the long ass comparison I made. Just a couple of things.
1) Sorry about the overuse of Now. Never actually had a crutch word problem before and after reading it again I did realize the problem my self. Will go back later tonight and reedit and take out the nows and add something else or just let the sentence start out with the next word haha. I need to write my blogs like I write speeches and be concience on repetitive drivel.
2) I have gotten a lot people asking me about why I did not compare the PVP's in both games (mainly at the Champions Forum), and the answer is quite simply CO PVP is just convoluted crap. The balancing issues does not bother me (maybe taking 20 mins to kill someone is), its more the fact that it is not done well. Looks rushed, a lot of it is in a tiny arena where it is chaos and no cohesion.
3) And the people who said I did not touch on the fact Aion has a year more polish really did not read the blog. I said it 3 different times. I also said that the games still needed to be compared because they come out the same time and time of polish on release is what is going to matter.
But thx for all the feedback, keep it coming.
I agree with a good amount of the review.
Champions Online
I want to stress that Champions Online is very unpolished for an MMORPG about to go retail. After having been spoiled by polished releases like LotRO and WAR, this game really feels like it needs a lot of work. All that said, it's still a fun game. It has a steep learning curve, as you can gimp a character as you build the powers, stats, etc... However, I like that amount of depth, plus the ability to completely respec your character fairly inexpensively. If you get bored with a power set, no need to roll a new character, you can remake your existing character! (This includes appearance as well).
Aion
Aion is very polished. In some areas, I'm disappointed that a game that was released a year ago in Korea hasn't progressed further in some of the areas it is deficient in, but the head start before releasing in the West did produce a pretty solid foundation. On the down side, Aion DOES feel "grindy". It's been a while since I've played an MMORPG that requires so much effort to level. This is not always a bad thing, but many will find it off putting. Also, the forced PvP aspect will be a game ender for many.
It's a game you play more for achievement, than for fun, which will limit it's appeal.
Long term appeal
Which brings me to the one thing I'm not sure I agree with in the review. "Last-ability", or longevity? Long term appeal. Which game seems to most have the ability to retain subscribers first, beyond the first month and second, retain numbers longterm?
That's a tough question, because I see problems with both titles that effect this. Both games can be fun, but both have factors limiting their long term fun potential.
Advancing in Aion is a slog. The slog is made worse because combat is slow and repetitive and once you reach level 20 members of the other faction have a lot of capability to interfere with your ability to enjoy the game. As I stated above, Aion is a pure Achievers game and even then, some Achievers will become frustrated with the forced PvP element of the title.
Champions Online feels more fun and fast paced. The mission environments are much, much more varied than in City of Heroes. Bored with relying on the same skill sequence in fight after fight? You can swap powers in and out, or even go with a completely new build. How's that for tackling the problem of monotony head on? The down side? The lack of polish is a major concern. Usually, if a game lacks polish at launch, the problems get more and more evident as you get into the higher level content. With CO, I'm worried how the game will hold up as you get further into the game.
Conclusion
Both games have a lot to offer to segments of the MMORPG fan base. Achievers will likely enjoy Aion. Players who have been yearning for a game that allows broad scope in customizing the appearance, skill selection and character advancement will love that aspect of CO. (There are no cookie-cutter characters in CO).
Neither game, in my opinion, offers broad AND lasting appeal.
In some ways, Champions Online has more potential to broaden it's audience down the line. Aion's core game experience is unlikely to change or broaden in the future. CO, on the other hand, suffers greatly from it's lack of polish. If it maintains enough subscribers to fund solid, continuing development, a polished CO could become a very successful title.
Lastly, neither game is "The One", the near perfect, expansive, content rich MMORPG title that offers equal appeal to PvEers/ PvPers, Casuals/Achievers, etc... Neither Aion nor Champions Online comes close to the ideal.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
I have played both CO and Aion in closed beta. I find my Ranger to be much more involved and interesting, combat-wise, than any of the sets I have tried in CO. For me, CO becomes "spam big skill", glance at TV while end builder on auto-fire, glance back at game and "spam big skill" if needed. The combat just is not interesting at all to me. In fact, I enjoy CoX's combat more. I only made it back up to L6 in open beta as I cannot stomach the desert or Canada again.
As for Aion, it has more of the old school world feel that CO and WAR are lacking. Plus, if you enjoy PvP at all, Aion will be a great choice. The quests are still more of the same, but at least you actually have to worry about aggro and your healthbar. Oh, and many of the quests actually require teaming. Mmmmm ... teaming.
For me, my choice is going to be Aion, as combat is very important to me, as that is what we do most in these games. I also enjoy the world and PvP of Aion. CO I will keep an eye on for several months to see if combat/teaming is improved at all. If not, I will pick console games to be my "break" from Aion.
Neither. Guild Wars 2!
Actually, if I had to choose Champions would get the nod because it was more fun to play compared to Aion.
I die more in Champions than I ever did in Aion. In Champions the illusion of being "super" is addicting enough that youu can easily overstep your bounds or be caught by surprise. Sometimes you can pull of some pretty amazing fights that you probably should of died from, and sometimes a baddy will catch you with a special attack you needed to block and put you in a hurt.
In Aion, I know whether or not I've won the fight before I even pull, and whether or not I need to disengage if I happen to grab an add. There is no challenge, its just a slow repetitive process of killing one mob at a time. Maybe you have to use a potion... thats about the extent of it.
I like Aion, but measuring challenge based on the number of enemies you can take on at one time is a poor measure. Just because one enemy in Aion is the equivalent of x enemies is CO doesn't make Aion harder. In CO pulls range from 3-10+ guys at a time, and that added element of randomness makes it more challenging and less boring.
My immersion factor in any game just so happens to directly correspond by how much fun I'm having. I feel like a Superhero in Champions.... do you feel like an immortal demi-god in Aion? I sure didn't... damned furbies kept taking a chunk out of my butt.
I don't understand how being an immortal super being angel/demon somehow justifies you killing "x" of "y" enemy or being a delivery boy. If anything it makes more sense for a mortal superhero to be doing that sort of stuff as opposed to an immortal demi-god. A fantasy world is no more "chaotic or barbaric" than a world filled with evil super-villains each plotting their own schemes of mass destruction or power mongering... you are bending your perception and making excuses for one game and condemning another for no reason other that it suits your purpose.
I die more in Champions than I ever did in Aion. In Champions the illusion of being "super" is addicting enough that youu can easily overstep your bounds or be caught by surprise. Sometimes you can pull of some pretty amazing fights that you probably should of died from, and sometimes a baddy will catch you with a special attack you needed to block and put you in a hurt.
In Aion, I know whether or not I've won the fight before I even pull, and whether or not I need to disengage if I happen to grab an add. There is no challenge, its just a slow repetitive process of killing one mob at a time. Maybe you have to use a potion... thats about the extent of it.
I like Aion, but measuring challenge based on the number of enemies you can take on at one time is a poor measure. Just because one enemy in Aion is the equivalent of x enemies is CO doesn't make Aion harder. In CO pulls range from 3-10+ guys at a time, and that added element of randomness makes it more challenging and less boring.
My immersion factor in any game just so happens to directly correspond by how much fun I'm having. I feel like a Superhero in Champions.... do you feel like an immortal demi-god in Aion? I sure didn't... damned furbies kept taking a chunk out of my butt.
That's the problem with CO to me. You start as a super-hero at level 1. You don't get a chance to build yourself up within the world. In Aion, you are trying to regain footing and even though you might not be "an immortal demi-god" from the start, by the end you sure will be.
CO is just not dynamic enough for me, the gameplay isn't constantly evolving like it is in Aion.
I understand why some people like CO, it's just not my bag of tea. Long story short, I come from Everquest as do a lot of my fellow gamers. We take pride in advancing in these virtual worlds, geeky as it may sound. I like my carrot on a stick because it tastes so much better when you finally get it, much better than someone just handing you a carrot and telling you to nibble on it so as to not run out before the end of the game.
I don't think its a good comparison. Aion has been out months in Korea, its polished, stunning graphics, and has been adding content and balance for some time. CO just isn't ready for launch yet, graphics are ok at best, still full of bugs and class imbalance. It's not really fair to compair the two, CO and Fallen Earth would have been a better.
Dude I made that statement 3 times in the Review. Reead it before you knock it. I said some people might think it unfair but it is valid because THEY COME OUT AT THE SAME TIME.
And the person who said CO is harder WTF are you talking about. I got to level 15 without dying once. In Aion by 15 I died 3 or 4 times. Aion is a lot more challenging.
If you find CO challenging then stop randomly pressing buttons
Wait a minute...
I played WAR closed beta for year and 9+ months after launch. I have to disagree with you here. WAR was far from a polished launch. It took months to solve lag with using powers, lag in large scale ORVR, and fortress', etc... Lets also mention they have yet to solve the balance problem, oh yea and getting stuck in rocks, rabbits, etc... Yet in CO open beta the game runs very well with no large scale bugs, but I will give you the fact they are still balancing, but the game has yet to be released either.
Cheers!
MMO Vet since AOL Neverwinter Nights circa 1992. My MMO beat up your MMO. =S
Wait a minute...
I played WAR closed beta for year and 9+ months after launch. I have to disagree with you here. WAR was far from a polished launch. It took months to solve lag with using powers, lag in large scale ORVR, and fortress', etc... Lets also mention they have yet to solve the balance problem, oh yea and getting stuck in rocks, rabbits, etc... Yet in CO open beta the game runs very well with no large scale bugs, but I will give you the fact they are still balancing, but the game has yet to be released either.
Cheers!
I agree with you about WARS Launch. For the first two weeks the game was stable minus a memory on a lot of peoples computer. But as the days wore on the lag got worse and worse and worse. And till this day the game is no where near polished as it should be.
But CO not having any large scale bugs. Are you serious. Champions Online Open Beta is ridiculously bugged. Graphical gliches Like every time I target a mob or NPC from about 10 feet away I see an either green or red grid over him. I had to completely change my graphical settings to see anything that was not black or neon white. Horrendous pathing issues with mobs or NPC's that have to follow you. The Bugs go on an on an on and on.
Under "Stability", I think it's only fair to mention GameGuard for Aion. It's extremely intrusive and it doesn't like a lot of common drivers (Sidewinder, Diamondback, G15, to name a few), and some common anti-virus software. You're right that it runs exceptionally well on systems that don't have conflicts. 50+ FPS on a medium system when in combat, with gorgeous graphics. They picked the right engine (unlike WAR). Unfortunately, when they couple that with GameGuard, it either runs very well or doesn't run at all.
On the other hand, CO has lower framerate, although it looks like it should be less demanding than Aion. In some cases, it has less than half the framerate as Aion when run on the same system and appears to need optimization, at least on some video cards. This is with a launch date in less than a month.
I'd agree that Aion is more stable, with the GameGuard Caveat. But I wouldn't hold the patch problems on the first few days of OBT against CO, since they appear to have fixed them. If they used OBT to stress test the patching process, than that's fine if it's fixed for release.
A category that wasn't mentioned is dev involvement. CO has a lot of dev involvement on the beta forums. On the Aion beta forums, it seems like NCSoft West only has control over localization changes. Who knows whether feedback on bugs, interface, and gameplay from NA players is going to be noticed by the Aion devs (in Korea, not NCSoft West), in beta or ever? Whether you want to deal with that long term is as much a deciding factor as gameplay and stability, in my opinion.
The only problem with your comparison is this:
Champions endgame: PvE
Aion endgame: PvP
I hate pvp games and will never play a game who's endgame is PvP centric. Aion looks great and has good PvE but it's just like guild wars - a leveling tool to get you to PvP. Champions endgame is PvE and I will never have to PvP if I don't want to. You're pretty much forced to PvP in Aion because that is the structure of the game.
Want to know the sad part about that statement? Aion's end game has more PVE than Champions (which is PVE based).
i think the comparison to the two games was great. good review of both games i'm going to have to agree and go with aion
Want to know the sad part about that statement? Aion's end game has more PVE than Champions (which is PVE based).
It didn't until about a month ago, amazing what an extra year of development will do.
Want to know the sad part about that statement? Aion's end game has more PVE than Champions (which is PVE based).
It didn't until about a month ago, amazing what an extra year of development will do.
It is amazing what a year of development will do. And 2 years, etc. When CO has 1 year of development, Aion will have 2. CO will never catch up, NCsoft is very good about adding content and patches.
I came here and expected everyone to vouch for Champions Online. Except what I found was the majority would rather play Aion. These games can be compared but it's not a fair comparison when Aion has technically been out for a year. I expect good things from Champions but in the end it's just a superhero niche MMO. Aion is targetting a larger market while I suspect CO will get 100k subscribers, I also expect Aion to get 350k+. I believe both games will do very well however I'll be playing Aion.
Want to know the sad part about that statement? Aion's end game has more PVE than Champions (which is PVE based).
It didn't until about a month ago, amazing what an extra year of development will do.
It is amazing what a year of development will do. And 2 years, etc. When CO has 1 year of development, Aion will have 2. CO will never catch up, NCsoft is very good about adding content and patches.
Expansions make your point null and void. Consider how much wasted(in the sense nobody does it anymore) content WoW has because of expansions. Cryptic is no slouch themselves... and they won't have to go through a translation process everytime they want to port a patch/expansion to the english speaking servers.
Very linear way of thinking.
Most folks that come to MMORPG and post are either
1) Fairly Harcore Gamers... or
2) Trolls
Hard-core gamers tend to favor more traditional oriented time consuming games... ala Aion. They're also the ones that are more likely to pour over a forum board and critique everything. The folks who really enjoy CO are probably sitting in the character creator right now... or throwing tanks at villains.
i cant even get the installer for champions online to work lol..
i have however played in aions CB, and enjoy it very much... So my choice is obvious.. Aion
sounds to me like you are just making excuses....
People want to play a mature, polished MMO now, not in 6 months. For that, Aion is definitely the way to go, hands down.
CO is just not going to be a very popular MMO. the game plays just like COH/COV, and will attract the same type of people. It has already been shown that superhero MMOs tend to do just "decent"... not even "well". the community will never be that large.
Aion on the other hand, is drawing directly from the WoW pool, which we can all agree is immense. I can easily see Aion capturing all wow players that enjoy the PVE aspects of WOW, but are looking for a little more hardcore, PVP-centric experience. this is exactly what Aion provides, a similar experience to WOW, but with superior PVP endgame.
For the record I wasn't making that comment specifically about Aion as I haven't played it and really know nothing of it's lore... as a general rule the chaotic and 'primitve' world of a typical fantasy game means charging around as a thug is still a valid (maybe even unavoidable) way of life..... However in a contemporary Superhero world - the super agent thug that CO forces you to be is, thankfully a rare and for the most part entirely inappropriate creature. Cryptics second bite of the cherry has lost more than it has gained in the area of theme conviction, involvement and immersion, which is sad.
From the responses it seems Aion is the better game in those areas that matter to me, although i do need to be grabbed by the theme - no one just plays and mmo because its there do they??
Ultimately neither game comes accross as overly progressive, lets hope some mmo's with real imagination and respect for their IP's are on the horizon. (DCUO, SWToR, APB are at least talking/prioritising the right things at the mo imo)
i realy thought i was only going to read this thread but i have to point out one thing about the NA version of the game (which i will be playing) . the thing is you are judgeing everything on the 1.0 version of the game instead of the 1.5 version of the NA release which will remove the graphics problems and a lot of the grind by adding in tons of quests and such in the end makeing aion the winner im not gonna stay and fight out any problems anyone has with my post as i have had my fill of getting sucked into trollers posts in threads like this and am fairly sick of it have a good thread everyone