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Rushing to get to End Game. Why?
Spankthetoad
Member UncommonPosts: 83
I have played many online games and have seen this though the years. Game comes out and there is this mad rush to get to the end game. I don't get it. I mean we don't go to a fine restaurant and wolf down the food as fast as we can. I hope you do not make love like that either lol. I think to many players are missing the point of online gaming its not always the finish its the journey. There is so much to see and find in online gaming that i think you miss so much rushing that you really miss out on much of the game. I have come across area's in Guildwars that my Guild was not even aware of 1 year into the first game. So as they say take your time and smell the roses. You may fine that you enjoy the game much more that way. :}
Spankthetoad
Comments
If its a mmorpg, no one takes their time because they want to be the best. if its just a normal game like doom 3, Call of duty 4, gears of war 2. etc.
i do take my time i little, but i dont just sit there and look around in the same spot for 5 minutes like my dad does.
When someone rushes to Endgame its because the game it self is flawed.
The leveling content in those games are so inferior that people rush through terrible content for what is the "real game".
Back in the day we didn't need to rush to endgame because their wasn't one. The whole game was a joy to play.
I wish as MMOs evolved they didn't forget the fun.
OP, A sign of a bad MMO is when you see everyone maximizing their gameplay to hit cap faster. Noone will rush through quality content just bad lame repetitive shit.
PLaying: EvE, Ryzom
Waiting For: Earthrise, Perpetuum
I think 'Endgames' are a holdover from the old linear PC gaming world.
Theoretically an MMO wouldn't have one-just an environment that your character would wander around in doing whatever adventures that interest you.
Even the big Theme park MMOs are this way to a degree (in LOTRO you don't Have to do the Book Quests for example). A true MMO would never really have an 'End"
I think it's a holdover for newbe gamers who haven't figured out the MMO universe yet.
All of todays mmos have an endgame. only difference with the newer games is you have two and sometimes three endgames to choose from.
Its a step up but still not as good as the old sandbox games like UO and SWG.
PLaying: EvE, Ryzom
Waiting For: Earthrise, Perpetuum
mmos have turned gaming from adventuring, fun, and excitement in to collecting "things." You can only collect the best "things" at endgame. So why not rush there? How do you progress? By accumulating more/new "things." This is the mentality that is ruining the online genre...IMO.
What happens in the SP genre when you reach the end of the game? You quit and go play something else. If more mmo players would just do this I think the mmo genre would be better off. Developers would be much more inclined to add meaninful content instead of another mindless grind to get some BS faction/rep trinket. But players don't do this. They just keep subscribing, paying the developer, and chasing that pointless carrot. Why would a developer want this to change. It's easy for them to cash your checks while letting you grind on lame content for months on end.
Homie don't play that.
PLaying: EvE, Ryzom
Waiting For: Earthrise, Perpetuum
lmao, it is because people only care about rank, period. You really think people bot, buy gold, and powerlevel because the leveling is bad? lol people just want to be at the top or feel like they accomplished something. Don't be ignorant about the real end game.
Back in the day? So you never heard of the Konomi cheat codes? You never knew anyone that used the Contra code to get 30 lives, or the code to make Mario invulnerable? This is not a new trend.
There are lots of people that enjoy taking in the scenery when playing mmos, and many of them don't stand a chance as competitors.
I really don't know... I'm playing Atlantica Online now and I think I'm lagging behind.
Then again ever since I got over my addiction to Ragnarok Online, I sort of developed this phobia of gaming addiction. I don't want to spend too much time playing since I don't want to go back to my year-long mortal nightmare.
I am simply myself, no more and no less. And I only want to be free.
My guesses:
A) One key motivation of playing MMOs (or games in general) is the endorphine rush you gain through accomplishments ala "level-up". Since the effect is only short-lived you crave it again thus creating a continuously increasing 'forward motion' from level up to level up. It seems to me to be quite similar to caffeine or other drugs - addiction through pleasure; with a rapid breakdown of the effect (the basis for any addiction, btw).
C) Competitiveness - gamers define their enjoyment not based on a rich and immersive story, but through competition with others (i.e. racing to reach level cap)
D) Many games (most, actually) have a heavily tiered game world, creating artificial borders between players of different levels - which only break down at cap level.
There is probably more tho...
To use your restaurant analogy, in MMO's leveling is the appetizer and the 'endgame' is the actual meal. The only thing is that the appetizer is boiled cabbage and you have to eat an entire room full of it first. All the effort is put into the endgame.
All the content being made is for the end game. Other players aren't even interested in you until you have something to offer them, which in most MMO's sadly doesn't occur until endgame. People want to solo leveling so all leveling content is soloable, no reason to group. The game designers don't want to put in XP bonuses for grouping because dividing XP has been done since Gary Gygax crawled out of his mother's basement sometime in the mid-60's and why would anyone even think of doing something, you know, DIFFERENT?
All interaction is at the end game. All new content is at the end game. You are useless to the rest of the players until you hit the end game. Maybe you enjoy reading the weak excuse stories behind the 500th "go here and kill 10 of this" quest you've done somewhere half-way to max level, but most people don't.
http://mmo-hell.blogspot.com/
http://www.mmorpg.com/blogs/rejad
I can't decipher what you are saying. You've merged points about people who enjoy solo play with people in a hurry to the "End" of a MMO.
Do you believe that the end game is the only reason to play, and that people who enjoy the journey are the suxxors?
Or are you stating that they should slow down and enjoy the ride?
Perhaps you could 'slow down' and make each point seperately?
It's just the attitude of people now a days. It's not about the journey, but about being at the end so you get rewarded, DUH! People only care about finishing that next quest, that next level, getting that new piece of gear. Why? ME ME ME ME ME. The game 1-? could be the best part of the game, and it would be the greatest game ever, but people would hate it, because only endgame matters.
The comparison of restaurant with a multiplayer computer game doesn't quite fit. In a multiplayer computer game, 99% of the people experience a slight feeling of competition. You stand around with a rough splintery shortbow. Then a guy next to you passes by, wielding a polished longbow of striking. Does that feel good? To most people it doesn't. They want to be better than the rest. They want to have the funky endgame armor and not run around in rags. They want to look down on those with a lower level, and when you have max level, there are more of those with a lower level than when you idle around midgame.
Sure, in theory you can take time. Read the quest descriptions. Follow the story line, which in a well made game is equal to a good book and worth the read. You can get to know the backgrounds of the characters and whatnot. But really, who does that nowadays? Especially since most PvE in most MMORPGs is about the same. You get a quest? 90% of the time it's "kill X of Y" "bring me X of that" "go to/talk with X" or when you are lucky an "escort X".
Let's play Fallen Earth (blind, 300 episodes)
Let's play Guild Wars 2 (blind, 45 episodes)
Man, I've written close to this as a reply before but I keep looking and trying to see if there's something else to it that could be done and yeah, I found a few "core" changes that could address the game play problems in a broader sense than what many look at -- including pretty much killing the reasons for "gold buying" and the like.
Unfortunately, the die is cast on the MMO industry as we know it. The only rewards that many will accept is the "carrot on a stick" approach of the gear chase. The only reason to "raid" is, as you put it, to "get stuff" and the only reason to do anything in the game is to get to end-game or chase the better stuff you can get at end-game.
As such, the genre is pretty much a dead-end until someone can change the foundations of why players play and, at this point, that's a "one step at a time" approach by moving away from the current model in degrees, which won't happen quickly when games cost 10's of millions of dollars and years of work to make a game. You won't get millions to make "something really different" but something "close to what works"... That you could get funding for *IF* you can show how the money gets back to the business that pays for the project.
It's a shame but we'll see what happens in the future. If tools standardize then worlds can be made faster and cheaper instead of "reinvent the wheel" each time and the like. It could change if it didn't cost as much to make them but not right now -- not at the current prices to make games.
But, what people who don't play GW don't know is that GW is ALL end-game. Getting to level 20, especially if you start with Factions or Nightfall, is not particularly time-consuming. After that, everything else, by definition, is end-game. And, if you think your game world is large, try getting all the Cartographer titles in GW.
Hedonismbot: Your latest performance was as delectable as dipping my bottom over and over into a bath of the silkiest oils and creams.
Some games I loved the begining. I totally hate people who say don't worry the game is better at the end. Like Aion pvp. I dont want to phyically be fighting a battle with boardem to get to the fun part. Loved Warhammer, shadowbane and daoc after it put in battlegrounds.
People rush b/c they want to look as cool as the characters on the box do. They want to feel powerful and have cool weapons. I think if games started giving out cooler looking gear at the beginning it would slow it down some...not much but some. Lvl 1 leather gloves...wow exciting...Lvl 50 Death Mittens of Insanity...now those sound cool and probably have damn good stats which will make my character even better. Not everyone looks at things the same way you do so this is just one opinion from one random person who plays lots of games.
OP: I also do not understand why people rush to end/cap-lvl rushed but only when they start to bash a game because they are bored, But have no problems with those who rush to end/cap lvl and seem to enjoy themselfs, as that's is what we all want out of our games isn't it?
A lot of it has to do with the developers really. If they design a game to be fast to level through, then people will level fast through it.
I played EQ1 back in its glory days, where the mantra was SLOW leveling lol. To say the least. The speed at which exp was gained back then meant that a rush to the top was not very likely. Which made it so much more casual in a way...
Basically, in a fast to lvl game, like EQ2, WoW, and everything else, you always want to catch up with the other guy, or at least stay on the same level as those you started playing next to. Since leveling happens so fast, you gotta be quick about it. Conversely, old EQ1 which leveled slowly, you could literally take a week off and BARELY be 1 level behind the others if they got some good xp groups going while you were away.
EQ2... WoW... you take a week off, you will NEVER see your peers again lol. But then again, EQ2 and WoW and such, they aren't designed for the journey to end game, they are designed morre for the end game itself. Kinda like you cant really bash a bird for flying instead of swimming since it was created specifically to fly.
This sums it up nicely.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
However, it -is- easier to level whilst there are many other players your level. Its horrible to try to find a party when the whole server playerbase is max level.
That isn't really so common in most games. Older players usually makes new alts and new people join the game. I can imagine that it might be a problem in old games that attract few new players like EQ, or older Wow servers but I never had any problem and I am usually taking my time, at least with the first character.
The endgame can be fun but I like the story of many games and wants to explore as much as possible of it. I personally think it is a misstake by most games to slowly raise the levelcap and at the same time making leveling easier. It slowly turns the whole game until a tutorial for the endgame content.
Of course I understand that other people prefer playing the endgame and that is fine to me, but I think it sucks when they nerf the difficulty of all the early stuff so a 8 year old kid can do it without effort.
I wish that they made leveling taking it's time, not so you must grind but so you have to see a lot of the content. They could then make it easier to level up the second character instead. People are just missing so much of the older games today.
Levels are made to be important. Here is how-
Rushing through the leveling makes you stronger faster, gets you all over the map, lets you look epic, and you get to experience end game.
How about we replace leveling? But not with something that will just take it's spot with a different name. I'm not exactly sure if leveling could ever successfully be replaced and I don't think every game company should ditch leveling. I just think some games should murder leveling and make a business model to fit.
These two here pretty much sum it up. UO there was no rushing to endgame because the game was developing your character not collecting phat loot.
Players are going to rush no matter what. Players do speed runs of everything, regardless of whether it has progression, so making any design concessions to "prevent racing" is going to be a losing proposition.
Even so, there's ways to make racing less apparent, but limiting how much "skippable" content your game has, either by being a jerk and making quest text and cutscenes unskippable (thus making your playerbase hate you), or by not having as many cutscenes and as much (or any) quest text.
Which isn't to say games can't be made without levels, or with short/shallow progression systems. It's just that using those methods to "prevent rushing to endgame" is not going to work. Because players are going to rush through content regardless.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver