I'd probably have to agree with Jestor. Not so much that TOR will take the remaining playerbase, even tho it might. The main problem I see for SWG is the IP and it's "fees". There were several rumor threads going here a year or so ago that LA is forgiving SOE's IP fees, even back then. If that was the case, with even a decreased playerbase, compared to then, it may be impossible for SOE to even make a "token" payment. 2nd, would be the ecomony. No company wants to get into a position where it is competing within itself, unless the market dictates such a measure. Case in point, GM, who is now getting rid of there competing products. I just can not see LA wanting SWG still up while TOR is out there. It does make some sence for SWG to remain while TOR is in development as they just might figure the Playerbase for SWG will be the base subs for TOR. (They figure they'll get every1 of those) The Star Wars Free Realms rumored game kinda iced the cake for me on this notion. LA awarding SOE a consolation prise for the losing of SWG at the launch of TOR. I doubt if a "tween browser based" game would be considered competion for TOR at all and this would give SOE something that might get a little larger, with the specific playerbase it's after, than SWG. The Free Realms type game might be considered a pre-cursor for TOR. (Start there as a "tween" and graduate to TOR as one would "come of age"). All of the negative publicity that came/comes with SWG. I'm sure LA, at this point in time, would like to just get beyond this. Smedly using the word "sunset" in connection with SWG. Leads me to believe that this decision was made months back. In hindsight, I would imagine that Lorin Jameson and his CHANGE everything mode again to SWG was an attempt to lure back the vets (as that was pretty much all he talked about while doing it). Might have been that LA gave them a sub number that they had to hit to save the game then. Of corse, SOE used thier "proven" tactics of "we will trade the existing playerbase to get one we do not have" and it all backfired on them, yet, again. Smed knowing that one of his games was coming to an end, with some1 else making that desision for him, tried and got something to replace it with. And even with all the SOE spin, in that interview, he got caught up in the moment and said a little too much. All of this does not bode too well for SWG.
Very interesting analysis. I'll have this post in the back of my mind as things "play out" over the next few months. Good post.
Originally posted by TUX426 Originally posted by Esquire1980 I'd probably have to agree with Jestor. Not so much that TOR will take the remaining playerbase, even tho it might. The main problem I see for SWG is the IP and it's "fees". There were several rumor threads going here a year or so ago that LA is forgiving SOE's IP fees, even back then. If that was the case, with even a decreased playerbase, compared to then, it may be impossible for SOE to even make a "token" payment. 2nd, would be the ecomony. No company wants to get into a position where it is competing within itself, unless the market dictates such a measure. Case in point, GM, who is now getting rid of there competing products. I just can not see LA wanting SWG still up while TOR is out there. It does make some sence for SWG to remain while TOR is in development as they just might figure the Playerbase for SWG will be the base subs for TOR. (They figure they'll get every1 of those) The Star Wars Free Realms rumored game kinda iced the cake for me on this notion. LA awarding SOE a consolation prise for the losing of SWG at the launch of TOR. I doubt if a "tween browser based" game would be considered competion for TOR at all and this would give SOE something that might get a little larger, with the specific playerbase it's after, than SWG. The Free Realms type game might be considered a pre-cursor for TOR. (Start there as a "tween" and graduate to TOR as one would "come of age"). All of the negative publicity that came/comes with SWG. I'm sure LA, at this point in time, would like to just get beyond this. Smedly using the word "sunset" in connection with SWG. Leads me to believe that this decision was made months back. In hindsight, I would imagine that Lorin Jameson and his CHANGE everything mode again to SWG was an attempt to lure back the vets (as that was pretty much all he talked about while doing it). Might have been that LA gave them a sub number that they had to hit to save the game then. Of corse, SOE used thier "proven" tactics of "we will trade the existing playerbase to get one we do not have" and it all backfired on them, yet, again. Smed knowing that one of his games was coming to an end, with some1 else making that desision for him, tried and got something to replace it with. And even with all the SOE spin, in that interview, he got caught up in the moment and said a little too much. All of this does not bode too well for SWG.
Very interesting analysis. I'll have this post in the back of my mind as things "play out" over the next few months. Good post.
Esquire and Tux seem to get it.... But for those who automatically jumped to the negative of the possibilities of my open end OP, well that is why for years now that the debate continues.
I'd probably have to agree with Jestor. Not so much that TOR will take the remaining playerbase, even tho it might.
The main problem I see for SWG is the IP and it's "fees". There were several rumor threads going here a year or so ago that LA is forgiving SOE's IP fees, even back then. If that was the case, with even a decreased playerbase, compared to then, it may be impossible for SOE to even make a "token" payment.
2nd, would be the ecomony. No company wants to get into a position where it is competing within itself, unless the market dictates such a measure. Case in point, GM, who is now getting rid of there competing products. I just can not see LA wanting SWG still up while TOR is out there. It does make some sence for SWG to remain while TOR is in development as they just might figure the Playerbase for SWG will be the base subs for TOR. (They figure they'll get every1 of those)
The Star Wars Free Realms rumored game kinda iced the cake for me on this notion. LA awarding SOE a consolation prise for the losing of SWG at the launch of TOR. I doubt if a "tween browser based" game would be considered competion for TOR at all and this would give SOE something that might get a little larger, with the specific playerbase it's after, than SWG. The Free Realms type game might be considered a pre-cursor for TOR. (Start there as a "tween" and graduate to TOR as one would "come of age").
All of the negative publicity that came/comes with SWG. I'm sure LA, at this point in time, would like to just get beyond this.
Smedly using the word "sunset" in connection with SWG. Leads me to believe that this decision was made months back. In hindsight, I would imagine that Lorin Jameson and his CHANGE everything mode again to SWG was an attempt to lure back the vets (as that was pretty much all he talked about while doing it). Might have been that LA gave them a sub number that they had to hit to save the game then. Of corse, SOE used thier "proven" tactics of "we will trade the existing playerbase to get one we do not have" and it all backfired on them, yet, again. Smed knowing that one of his games was coming to an end, with some1 else making that desision for him, tried and got something to replace it with. And even with all the SOE spin, in that interview, he got caught up in the moment and said a little too much.
All of this does not bode too well for SWG.
Very interesting analysis. I'll have this post in the back of my mind as things "play out" over the next few months. Good post.
Esquire and Tux seem to get it.... But for those who automatically jumped to the negative of the possibilities of my open end OP, well that is why for years now that the debate continues.
Hey Jestor, if the above analysis makes the "rodo-report" make sure to have my name in the credits. lol I think I'd take it as a compliment to have an SOE dev walk by me mubbleing.
It'll just be nice to see a StarWars MMO that isn't a broken mess that's been reinvented numerous times over. It'll also be nice if the new game doesn't have some insane RMT loot lottery.
Playing a StarWars MMO and not paying Smed a dime would also give me warm feelings ^_^.
Originally posted by TUX426 Originally posted by Ginaz Originally posted by Xondar123 People seem to be forgetting that SWG is not only going to be competing with SW:TOR, but also with Star Trek Online and possibly Jumpgate Evolution. There are more than two space MMOs on the block now and I can definitely see SWG taking a big hit simply because it is an old and much maligned game. I give SWG a year at most after the release on STO and SW:TOR. Their customer base will be cannibalized by these two games alone; not to mention the new EVE Online game, DUST 514, the EVE Online ambulation system, Jumpgate Evolution, and any other space or science fiction game that is due to be released. SWG is dead in the water at this point. Might as well wake up and smell the bantha fodder.
This is kind of how I feel. Right now, there isn't a lot of choices in mmo's for sci fi fans to choose from, and theres only 1 Star Wars themed mmo. Next year, however, theres going to be a lot more choices for both sci fi and Star Wars fans. The population of swg is already small as it is, and I don't have much confidence it will survive all of this. Many of the people left playing are only doing so because its the only Star Wars mmo available and theres not much to choose from for a sci fi game (EVE is a great game but its certainly not for everyone). I really don't think theres too many "swg Fans" left playing, who just enjoy the game for what it is.
Yup! The lack of a true competitor to SWG is SoE's only saving grace right now (they need to thank Tabula Rasa). Aside from Eve, there's really nothing in the "Sci-Fi" genera. This coming year should be a good one for Sci-Fi MMO fans though...will be interesting to watch the SWG forums
I'm sad about the loss of Tabula Rasa, that was actually a fun game (loved defending HQ's and mobs were actually challenging). SWG is still on its feet due to the lack of other sci-fi games out there as you said, when EVE gets their ground game added, that might change. And who knows how well STO will turn out, and there's SWTOR which I'm pretty sure will cause SWG to "sunset" a few years from now- they've already shut down MxO & PlanetSide, they still have Pirates of the Burning Sea & Vanguard on their list to shut down as well.
Why is it that when people see a new mmo coming out like TOR thay automaticly think SWG will suddenly die but yet we got tonnes of fantasy mmo's like wow and everquest and thay seems to be doing well, Another star wars mmo dousent mean it has to be the only star wars mmo out there.
As others in this thread have pointed out. There has not been much competition in the sci-fi area to compete with star wars galaxies. Something that has really gone unspoken is that this game only continues, because it has star wars in the title.
If this was a non-star wars game it would have closed down years ago, because it has been mismanaged from day 1 of release and the company running it has been working overtime to find ways to piss off the playerbase.
When a new star wars game hits the market it will most definately attract people who simply want to play a game that is based on star wars and that will include a large chunck of galaxies population. Will the old republic be enough to draw people away from the swg communities they have grown with for years, who knows.
At the same time soe has done a pretty good job of screwing up those communities with how they handled the free character transfer service. Shattering communities has not really helped swg, but maybe they rebuild in the months leading up to TOR.
my oh my, time to start dusting off that bottle of wine... can't wait for the new sw game to come out and finally land a crit to this one. The only thing that's been keeping this game alive is the station pass. Pathetic.
Ill be happy to drink a glass and remember the better days of this game and say good riddance the the abomination of the current game.
gg...lol.. gg
"Do not fret! Your captain is about to enter Valhalla!" - General Beatrix of Alexandria
"The acquisition of knowledge is of use to the intellect, for nothing can be loved or hated without first being known." - Leo da Vinci
my oh my, time to start dusting off that bottle of wine... can't wait for the new sw game to come out and finally land a crit to this one. The only thing that's been keeping this game alive is the station pass. Pathetic. Ill be happy to drink a glass and remember the better days of this game and say good riddance the the abomination of the current game. gg...lol.. gg
Originally posted by Daffid011 Will the old republic be enough to draw people away from the swg communities they have grown with for years, who knows.
I believe they will rebuild in TOR. It happened in other games just after the NGE. It's happened with my guild, and many others. People who've built relationships stick together (generally). That in itself will damage SWG when TOR launches. Many SWG players are packing their bags, many are mulling it over. Many who aren't considering leaving SWG will leave when their guilds tell them "C'mon over to TOR, we've got a spot for you here".
Community and belonging have an incredibly strong influence. (Something SOE even to this day doesn't seem to grasp)
Reading the Official TOR forums when they launched was like a reunion for many ex-SWGers. It was amazing how many familiar handles popped up that day.
Many people in my former SWG guild (including a few remaining SWG players) have all been able to get in on the TOR beta test. Though I don't wish for anyone's happy place (MMO of choice) to be taken away from them, it does pain me to see what SWG has become. It also pains me to see the StarWars name dragged through the mud. It's been a part of my life since I was 9, and is a story that's loved by our whole family (3 generartions now ^_^). So, I'll be relieved if TOR provides gamers and StarWars fans with an MMO that is functional, enjoyable and treats players with respect and dignity. Whatever SWG is remembered for, I don't think it will be that it had any of these qualities in abundance.
Originally posted by Bob_Blawblaw Originally posted by ArcheusCross my oh my, time to start dusting off that bottle of wine... can't wait for the new sw game to come out and finally land a crit to this one. The only thing that's been keeping this game alive is the station pass. Pathetic. Ill be happy to drink a glass and remember the better days of this game and say good riddance the the abomination of the current game. gg...lol.. gg
/raisesglass Archeus
/raiseglass as well. Here Here. To better days and a warning to those who may prevent them. The New Rodo Report is yours on my sig below. Happy Halloween and Love that Jestor!
Why is it that when people see a new mmo coming out like TOR thay automaticly think SWG will suddenly die but yet we got tonnes of fantasy mmo's like wow and everquest and thay seems to be doing well, Another star wars mmo dousent mean it has to be the only star wars mmo out there.
As others in this thread have pointed out. There has not been much competition in the sci-fi area to compete with star wars galaxies. Something that has really gone unspoken is that this game only continues, because it has star wars in the title.
If this was a non-star wars game it would have closed down years ago, because it has been mismanaged from day 1 of release and the company running it has been working overtime to find ways to piss off the playerbase.
When a new star wars game hits the market it will most definately attract people who simply want to play a game that is based on star wars and that will include a large chunck of galaxies population. Will the old republic be enough to draw people away from the swg communities they have grown with for years, who knows.
At the same time soe has done a pretty good job of screwing up those communities with how they handled the free character transfer service. Shattering communities has not really helped swg, but maybe they rebuild in the months leading up to TOR.
You guys really should stop kidding yourselfs, SWG has a population of about 50k people, they are such diehards that even god could not make them give up thier accounts. They will never leave the game, and 50k people can keep this game going for a long time with the 100k pluss accounts they are paying for each month.
SWTOR looks like it will be a fun game, and its more RPG than MMO, its MMO light, and they even stated that. SWTOR will be a single person game you mostly play by yourself, but it does have pvp. PVP makes a MMO these days, I guess?
What is suprising is that Star Trek has taken over the #1 slot for atticipated. Guess alot of people are looking forward to a SciFi MMO. Its been in production for a long time, hope its good.
I doubt that the majority of SWG hardcore vets or even some of the current players will enjoy SW:TOR. It doesn't sound much like a game that would appeal to the sandbox/lvlless crowd. I would suggest fallen earth might be something a lot of SWG fans would enjoy.
tor is going to fail and fail hard i mean look around no one wants level based games they want sandbox based games like pre-cu swg what will be funny is to see the aftermath of tor as i know we will see tons of sandbox games after
This is possibly the silliest thing I have heard. Not everyone is interested in a sandbox game. Not even everyone who is interested in a sandbox game can agree what constitutes a true sandbox game.
There is a portion of the gaming population that likes sandboxes and a segment that likes themepark. The ones that like themeparks are going to make BioWare a very rich company. I doubt very much that SWTOR will be the mythical WoW slayer, but I do think it will be quite successful. To say that it will have a skynet-like crash which will spawn a sandbox renaissance when the huddled masses shake off their chains and rise up to dance in a cantina or moisture farm it up, is dellusional.
You guys really should stop kidding yourselfs, SWG has a population of about 50k people, they are such diehards that even god could not make them give up thier accounts. They will never leave the game, and 50k people can keep this game going for a long time with the 100k pluss accounts they are paying for each month. SWTOR looks like it will be a fun game, and its more RPG than MMO, its MMO light, and they even stated that. SWTOR will be a single person game you mostly play by yourself, but it does have pvp. PVP makes a MMO these days, I guess? What is suprising is that Star Trek has taken over the #1 slot for atticipated. Guess alot of people are looking forward to a SciFi MMO. Its been in production for a long time, hope its good.
So swg must be the only mmo on the market that has (according to you) over 100,000 paid subscriptions, but has not received a paid expansion in over 4 years and had its development team cut down to a skeleton crew and has been in a slow agonizing process of closing servers for the last few years.
Lets see what other games share similar characteristics in the soe station pass.
Vanguard
MxO
Planetside
Potbs
Something tells me that your opinion that swg has a 6 digit subscriber number is about as well thought out as your notion that people are not sticking around due to it being the only star wars mmo on the market. Again, something tells me they are more attracted to the star wars IP than they game play, especially considering the condition of the game the last several years.
You guys really should stop kidding yourselfs, SWG has a population of about 50k people, they are such diehards that even god could not make them give up thier accounts. They will never leave the game, and 50k people can keep this game going for a long time with the 100k pluss accounts they are paying for each month. SWTOR looks like it will be a fun game, and its more RPG than MMO, its MMO light, and they even stated that. SWTOR will be a single person game you mostly play by yourself, but it does have pvp. PVP makes a MMO these days, I guess? What is suprising is that Star Trek has taken over the #1 slot for atticipated. Guess alot of people are looking forward to a SciFi MMO. Its been in production for a long time, hope its good.
So swg must be the only mmo on the market that has (according to you) over 100,000 paid subscriptions, but has not received a paid expansion in over 4 years and had its development team cut down to a skeleton crew and has been in a slow agonizing process of closing servers for the last few years.
Lets see what other games share similar characteristics in the soe station pass.
Vanguard
MxO
Planetside
Potbs
Something tells me that your opinion that swg has a 6 digit subscriber number is about as well thought out as your notion that people are not sticking around due to it being the only star wars mmo on the market. Again, something tells me they are more attracted to the star wars IP than they game play, especially considering the condition of the game the last several years.
Na its more like a 15$ a month chat program these days. Accounts and players are two differnt things, Thier is anywhere from 25k-50k people still playing. SOE has come out with the 100k accounts. I believe this to be true, I even had two accounts, the nutty ones have up to 10 accounts. Anyone that has farmed solo keeps mulitple accounts, EVE I have two, people recommend more. I really dont like doing that but it is a way to get around I got no buddys on at 3 am.
Who knows what will happen, but my gut says the people still playing SWG are the most stubborn people in MMO's. And thier shutting down 12 servers to keep the others going much longer than they would if they had only a skeleton population. There are about 5 really active servers and about 5 so so servers left. Not bad considering the game is what 6 years old. Hell AOC only lasted 5 months before they merged. I really dont see SWG closing with SWTOR release. Besides I dont have much time to grind toons like I used to and I think thats where alot of them are.
Im sure they will all try SWTOR but you must be dreaming they are going to close the accounts down. What I do see happening is SWG surviving at least 5 more years. By that time they will either decide to make SWG2 or close it, and it looks like SOE and LA are on working terms again, all the junk from the NGE has cooled down. If thier is anything to learn about SOE is that they like to remake and resell titles.
You guys really should stop kidding yourselfs, SWG has a population of about 50k people, they are such diehards that even god could not make them give up thier accounts. They will never leave the game, and 50k people can keep this game going for a long time with the 100k pluss accounts they are paying for each month. SWTOR looks like it will be a fun game, and its more RPG than MMO, its MMO light, and they even stated that. SWTOR will be a single person game you mostly play by yourself, but it does have pvp. PVP makes a MMO these days, I guess? What is suprising is that Star Trek has taken over the #1 slot for atticipated. Guess alot of people are looking forward to a SciFi MMO. Its been in production for a long time, hope its good.
So swg must be the only mmo on the market that has (according to you) over 100,000 paid subscriptions, but has not received a paid expansion in over 4 years and had its development team cut down to a skeleton crew and has been in a slow agonizing process of closing servers for the last few years.
Lets see what other games share similar characteristics in the soe station pass.
Vanguard
MxO
Planetside
Potbs
Something tells me that your opinion that swg has a 6 digit subscriber number is about as well thought out as your notion that people are not sticking around due to it being the only star wars mmo on the market. Again, something tells me they are more attracted to the star wars IP than they game play, especially considering the condition of the game the last several years.
Na its more like a 15$ a month chat program these days. Accounts and players are two differnt things, Thier is anywhere from 25k-50k people still playing. SOE has come out with the 100k accounts. I believe this to be true, I even had two accounts, the nutty ones have up to 10 accounts. Anyone that has farmed solo keeps mulitple accounts, EVE I have two, people recommend more. I really dont like doing that but it is a way to get around I got no buddys on at 3 am.
Who knows what will happen, but my gut says the people still playing SWG are the most stubborn people in MMO's. And thier shutting down 12 servers to keep the others going much longer than they would if they had only a skeleton population. There are about 5 really active servers and about 5 so so servers left. Not bad considering the game is what 6 years old. Hell AOC only lasted 5 months before they merged. I really dont see SWG closing with SWTOR release. Besides I dont have much time to grind toons like I used to and I think thats where alot of them are.
Im sure they will all try SWTOR but you must be dreaming they are going to close the accounts down. What I do see happening is SWG surviving at least 5 more years. By that time they will either decide to make SWG2 or close it, and it looks like SOE and LA are on working terms again, all the junk from the NGE has cooled down. If thier is anything to learn about SOE is that they like to remake and resell titles.
IMO a reasonable guess would be that TOR pulls about 1/2 of SWG's population away. You're right that there are some die hards that'll keep playing SWG but I'll bet that a great many of those people will drop at least one of their multiple SWG accounts to play TOR.
Many others I'm sure will simply follow friends and thier guilds to TOR.
Originally posted by BullseyeArc1 Na its more like a 15$ a month chat program these days. Accounts and players are two differnt things, Thier is anywhere from 25k-50k people still playing. SOE has come out with the 100k accounts. I believe this to be true, I even had two accounts, the nutty ones have up to 10 accounts. Anyone that has farmed solo keeps mulitple accounts, EVE I have two, people recommend more. I really dont like doing that but it is a way to get around I got no buddys on at 3 am. Who knows what will happen, but my gut says the people still playing SWG are the most stubborn people in MMO's. And thier shutting down 12 servers to keep the others going much longer than they would if they had only a skeleton population. There are about 5 really active servers and about 5 so so servers left. Not bad considering the game is what 6 years old. Hell AOC only lasted 5 months before they merged. I really dont see SWG closing with SWTOR release. Besides I dont have much time to grind toons like I used to and I think thats where alot of them are. Im sure they will all try SWTOR but you must be dreaming they are going to close the accounts down. What I do see happening is SWG surviving at least 5 more years. By that time they will either decide to make SWG2 or close it, and it looks like SOE and LA are on working terms again, all the junk from the NGE has cooled down. If thier is anything to learn about SOE is that they like to remake and resell titles.
Let me start off by asking you a question. What do you think it is that makes people so dedicated to star wars galaxies? Hint: star wars.
Do you really think people hang out in the game for its awesome gameplay? What do you think made them stick around through the horrible condition of the game post nge?
People are dedicated to this game, because it is the only star wars game on the market and they have built a community around that. You are kidding yourself if you think for one second the population of swg is so married to this game that they will not possibly leave.
Think about this. What is the old republic releases and it is an awesome game. It has plenty of things to do with your friends, runs smooth and bioware shows even the smallest bit of respect to the players. If TOR has even the smallest amount of content that would allow entire communities to relocate and interact with each other in TOR, what would possibly keep swg players away from the game?
Right now swg players are dedicated to swg, because where else would they go? That is the aspect you are overlooking.
Second, why did you revise your population estimate from 50,000 to 25,000? That is a rather large margin of error. +/- 50% of the entire population of the game?
Soe said swg has 100k accounts? Sure and I bet soe also has 100k station pass accounts which they can use to slant any figures they want since technically they are subscribers to all of their games. Lets not forget soe said 5 million players joined free realms (which is logistically impossiblity), but even after the server mergers swg will have more servers than free realms does. Sure, I believe soe when they make claims like this. Care to share where they said swg has 100k active paid accounts?
To be completely honest, SWG players are very dedicated players as you have already said. That being the case, I think you see the bulk of the players logged in every night.
Every real player that leaves swg hurts the bottom line and the community of the game much much more than any other mmo. Due to the averaging in of multiple accounts and addition revenue from loot card sales. I bet if soe lost the wrong 10% of the games population to TOR it would cripple the revenue swg generates and bring development to a screeching halt.
Lets be totally honest, soe does not care about small dedicated populations. They have shown more than once they are willing to effectively close down a game by abandoning development on it as seen with mxo, planetside, eq mac, eqoa, etc. Just because people are willing to pay for a dead game doesn't mean it hasn't died.
Originally posted by BullseyeArc1 Na its more like a 15$ a month chat program these days. Accounts and players are two differnt things, Thier is anywhere from 25k-50k people still playing. SOE has come out with the 100k accounts. I believe this to be true, I even had two accounts, the nutty ones have up to 10 accounts. Anyone that has farmed solo keeps mulitple accounts, EVE I have two, people recommend more. I really dont like doing that but it is a way to get around I got no buddys on at 3 am. Who knows what will happen, but my gut says the people still playing SWG are the most stubborn people in MMO's. And thier shutting down 12 servers to keep the others going much longer than they would if they had only a skeleton population. There are about 5 really active servers and about 5 so so servers left. Not bad considering the game is what 6 years old. Hell AOC only lasted 5 months before they merged. I really dont see SWG closing with SWTOR release. Besides I dont have much time to grind toons like I used to and I think thats where alot of them are. Im sure they will all try SWTOR but you must be dreaming they are going to close the accounts down. What I do see happening is SWG surviving at least 5 more years. By that time they will either decide to make SWG2 or close it, and it looks like SOE and LA are on working terms again, all the junk from the NGE has cooled down. If thier is anything to learn about SOE is that they like to remake and resell titles.
Let me start off by asking you a question. What do you think it is that makes people so dedicated to star wars galaxies? Hint: star wars.
Do you really think people hang out in the game for its awesome gameplay? What do you think made them stick around through the horrible condition of the game post nge?
People are dedicated to this game, because it is the only star wars game on the market and they have built a community around that. You are kidding yourself if you think for one second the population of swg is so married to this game that they will not possibly leave.
Think about this. What is the old republic releases and it is an awesome game. It has plenty of things to do with your friends, runs smooth and bioware shows even the smallest bit of respect to the players. If TOR has even the smallest amount of content that would allow entire communities to relocate and interact with each other in TOR, what would possibly keep swg players away from the game?
Right now swg players are dedicated to swg, because where else would they go? That is the aspect you are overlooking.
Second, why did you revise your population estimate from 50,000 to 25,000? That is a rather large margin of error. +/- 50% of the entire population of the game?
Soe said swg has 100k accounts? Sure and I bet soe also has 100k station pass accounts which they can use to slant any figures they want since technically they are subscribers to all of their games. Lets not forget soe said 5 million players joined free realms (which is logistically impossiblity), but even after the server mergers swg will have more servers than free realms does. Sure, I believe soe when they make claims like this. Care to share where they said swg has 100k active paid accounts?
To be completely honest, SWG players are very dedicated players as you have already said. That being the case, I think you see the bulk of the players logged in every night.
Every real player that leaves swg hurts the bottom line and the community of the game much much more than any other mmo. Due to the averaging in of multiple accounts and addition revenue from loot card sales. I bet if soe lost the wrong 10% of the games population to TOR it would cripple the revenue swg generates and bring development to a screeching halt.
Lets be totally honest, soe does not care about small dedicated populations. They have shown more than once they are willing to effectively close down a game by abandoning development on it as seen with mxo, planetside, eq mac, eqoa, etc. Just because people are willing to pay for a dead game doesn't mean it hasn't died.
Smedley did announce that SWG had 100K subs. At the Chapter 6 combat downgrade 2+ years ago. Then, Kauri had more people on it than Bria has today. RIP Kauri (10/15/09) Then there was 4-5 servers that could support gameplay, now, it's 1-2.
Last player made estimates I seen on the O-boards, it was mutually decided that SWG had somewhere between 10K to 30 K players. From what I seen, when I was in-game, I would agree with those figures. However, the wife still plays so I get to watch Bria, and a large portion of the Bria PVP playerbase has recently left for FE. Some more transfered to Starsider.
So, you might reconsider before you put Bria on the great server list. I transfered to Bria when the population was good (12/07) and seen it's fall since. Going the way of Kauri.
I've heard a lot of second hand accounts of Smed making 100k claims, but don't recall seeing it anywhere. It would be interesting to see exactly what was said.
Not to long ago Bria was the HEAVY server on the server selection list that players pointed to as proof of the games health. Not people are talking about it dying. This is exactly what I meant when I said SOE mismanaged the character transfers. They let the players panic and flood one server instead of keeping entire servers populations together with a proper server merger. These tight communities are shattering in some mad dash to get to the only healthy server in the game.
SOE just doesn't understand the concept of communities in their mmos. They killed shuttle waits, the player driven economy, player interdependancies in the game which just erodes the community more. Just like they did in the EQ series with instant travels, the bazaar and instanced player/guild housing. EQ2 is a ghost town as a result of it. They just don't understand that the people you play with are just as important as the quality of the game.
Other than the star wars IP and the everquest brand name, the only real asset they have is the strength of their communities who have mostly player with each other for many years.
I've heard a lot of second hand accounts of Smed making 100k claims, but don't recall seeing it anywhere. It would be interesting to see exactly what was said.
Not to long ago Bria was the HEAVY server on the server selection list that players pointed to as proof of the games health. Not people are talking about it dying. This is exactly what I meant when I said SOE mismanaged the character transfers. They let the players panic and flood one server instead of keeping entire servers populations together with a proper server merger. These tight communities are shattering in some mad dash to get to the only healthy server in the game.
SOE just doesn't understand the concept of communities in their mmos. They killed shuttle waits, the player driven economy, player interdependancies in the game which just erodes the community more. Just like they did in the EQ series with instant travels, the bazaar and instanced player/guild housing. EQ2 is a ghost town as a result of it. They just don't understand that the people you play with are just as important as the quality of the game. Other than the star wars IP and the everquest brand name, the only real asset they have is the strength of their communities who have mostly player with each other for many years.
Smedley made the claim in an interview if I remember right. And it would of been sometime right after May, 07, after C6CD. There were threads on it here at the time. The claim, even then that SWG held 100K subs, almost had to include Station Pass. I played SWG/NGE then, and it is no where near the population of what it was even then.
Bria probably was the largest server way back, when I transfered there (Dec. 07). C6CD killed what was left of an already small but fantastic playerbase that was left on Kauri. Then, those who were left used the paid transfer system to leave Kauri as I did leaving the server a "ghost server" until it's demise a few days from now. I believe that there are probably "Bria is dead" threads on the Bria O-boards as we speak. I know the tier 5 city I was mayor of, 2nd oldest city on Bria, (New Solah/Hideaway) which my wife's toon is now mayor of, is about to bite the dust and she has really tried to keep on top of it. There just isn't the people to keep everything going on Bria anylonger.
Personally I can't see NGE surviving the launch of TOR. Both shoes have dropped recently, the first being the closure of half the servers, the second being the impending TOR beta. The next thud will be the corpse of the NGE hitting the floor for the last time.
The only reason why NGE still has any subscribers at all is because it's the only Star Wars MMO. That will no longer be the case in the next few months. Next to TOR, NGE will look old, obsolete, and it's combat system likely STILL won't work.
I just can't see it competing unless a major investment in graphics upgrades and engine improvements are made. And that's just to modernize the NGE as is, which has already been rejected by 90% of those who played Pre-NGE.
Within days to weeks after TOR there simply won't be enough subscribers left to pay the expenses and upkeep. SOE may hang on and hope that people don't like TOR and come back, but I don't think that they will come back.
And it may not be up to SOE, LEC might mandate the shutdown of NGE with the TOR launch, not because NGE will compete with TOR (TOR will launch with hundreds of thousands of subscribers at least, many times what the NGE has) but to send the NGE and the bad blood and feelings down the memory hole. If you were LEC, would you want it around? Frankly, I think the only reason why NGE got a reprieve to hang around this long was because of TOR.
I'm looking forward to TOR, and am signed up for the beta. While I don't expect it to be Pre-CU (EVE satisfies my sandbox cravings anyway) I am a huge fan of Bioware.
Personally I can't see NGE surviving the launch of TOR. Both shoes have dropped recently, the first being the closure of half the servers, the second being the impending TOR beta. The next thud will be the corpse of the NGE hitting the floor for the last time. The only reason why NGE still has any subscribers at all is because it's the only Star Wars MMO. That will no longer be the case in the next few months. Next to TOR, NGE will look old, obsolete, and it's combat system likely STILL won't work. I just can't see it competing unless a major investment in graphics upgrades and engine improvements are made. And that's just to modernize the NGE as is, which has already been rejected by 90% of those who played Pre-NGE. Within days to weeks after TOR there simply won't be enough subscribers left to pay the expenses and upkeep. SOE may hang on and hope that people don't like TOR and come back, but I don't think that they will come back. And it may not be up to SOE, LEC might mandate the shutdown of NGE with the TOR launch, not because NGE will compete with TOR (TOR will launch with hundreds of thousands of subscribers at least, many times what the NGE has) but to send the NGE and the bad blood and feelings down the memory hole. If you were LEC, would you want it around? Frankly, I think the only reason why NGE got a reprieve to hang around this long was because of TOR. I'm looking forward to TOR, and am signed up for the beta. While I don't expect it to be Pre-CU (EVE satisfies my sandbox cravings anyway) I am a huge fan of Bioware. Bioware does not make bad games.
Hit the nail on the head perfectly.
Asheron's Call, Champions Online, Dark Age of Camelot, EVE Online, EverQuest, Lineage 2, Star Wars Galaxies and World of Warcraft.Waiting for SWTOR
The only reason why NGE still has any subscribers at all is because it's the only Star Wars MMO. That will no longer be the case in the next few months. Next to TOR, NGE will look old, obsolete, and it's combat system likely STILL won't work.
I don't disagree with anything except this point, I highly doubt it's simply the Star Wars IP that keeps people playing. I'd look more at the variety in game-play styles, decent crafting (albeit not as important as it once was). Social avenues of advancement (non-combat). As well as flight and pseudo twitch or turned base combat. The sandbox elements are probabaly up there in reasons as well. Of course the IP would stack up too, you can't ignore the lack of variety in most games on the market.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Comments
Very interesting analysis. I'll have this post in the back of my mind as things "play out" over the next few months. Good post.
Very interesting analysis. I'll have this post in the back of my mind as things "play out" over the next few months. Good post.
Esquire and Tux seem to get it.... But for those who automatically jumped to the negative of the possibilities of my open end OP, well that is why for years now that the debate continues.
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Very interesting analysis. I'll have this post in the back of my mind as things "play out" over the next few months. Good post.
Esquire and Tux seem to get it.... But for those who automatically jumped to the negative of the possibilities of my open end OP, well that is why for years now that the debate continues.
Hey Jestor, if the above analysis makes the "rodo-report" make sure to have my name in the credits. lol I think I'd take it as a compliment to have an SOE dev walk by me mubbleing.
It'll just be nice to see a StarWars MMO that isn't a broken mess that's been reinvented numerous times over. It'll also be nice if the new game doesn't have some insane RMT loot lottery.
Playing a StarWars MMO and not paying Smed a dime would also give me warm feelings ^_^.
This is kind of how I feel. Right now, there isn't a lot of choices in mmo's for sci fi fans to choose from, and theres only 1 Star Wars themed mmo. Next year, however, theres going to be a lot more choices for both sci fi and Star Wars fans. The population of swg is already small as it is, and I don't have much confidence it will survive all of this. Many of the people left playing are only doing so because its the only Star Wars mmo available and theres not much to choose from for a sci fi game (EVE is a great game but its certainly not for everyone). I really don't think theres too many "swg Fans" left playing, who just enjoy the game for what it is.
Yup! The lack of a true competitor to SWG is SoE's only saving grace right now (they need to thank Tabula Rasa). Aside from Eve, there's really nothing in the "Sci-Fi" genera. This coming year should be a good one for Sci-Fi MMO fans though...will be interesting to watch the SWG forums
I'm sad about the loss of Tabula Rasa, that was actually a fun game (loved defending HQ's and mobs were actually challenging). SWG is still on its feet due to the lack of other sci-fi games out there as you said, when EVE gets their ground game added, that might change. And who knows how well STO will turn out, and there's SWTOR which I'm pretty sure will cause SWG to "sunset" a few years from now- they've already shut down MxO & PlanetSide, they still have Pirates of the Burning Sea & Vanguard on their list to shut down as well.
As others in this thread have pointed out. There has not been much competition in the sci-fi area to compete with star wars galaxies. Something that has really gone unspoken is that this game only continues, because it has star wars in the title.
If this was a non-star wars game it would have closed down years ago, because it has been mismanaged from day 1 of release and the company running it has been working overtime to find ways to piss off the playerbase.
When a new star wars game hits the market it will most definately attract people who simply want to play a game that is based on star wars and that will include a large chunck of galaxies population. Will the old republic be enough to draw people away from the swg communities they have grown with for years, who knows.
At the same time soe has done a pretty good job of screwing up those communities with how they handled the free character transfer service. Shattering communities has not really helped swg, but maybe they rebuild in the months leading up to TOR.
my oh my, time to start dusting off that bottle of wine... can't wait for the new sw game to come out and finally land a crit to this one. The only thing that's been keeping this game alive is the station pass. Pathetic.
Ill be happy to drink a glass and remember the better days of this game and say good riddance the the abomination of the current game.
gg...lol.. gg
"Do not fret! Your captain is about to enter Valhalla!" - General Beatrix of Alexandria
"The acquisition of knowledge is of use to the intellect, for nothing can be loved or hated without first being known." - Leo da Vinci
/raisesglass Archeus
I believe they will rebuild in TOR. It happened in other games just after the NGE. It's happened with my guild, and many others. People who've built relationships stick together (generally). That in itself will damage SWG when TOR launches. Many SWG players are packing their bags, many are mulling it over. Many who aren't considering leaving SWG will leave when their guilds tell them "C'mon over to TOR, we've got a spot for you here".
Community and belonging have an incredibly strong influence. (Something SOE even to this day doesn't seem to grasp)
Reading the Official TOR forums when they launched was like a reunion for many ex-SWGers. It was amazing how many familiar handles popped up that day.
Many people in my former SWG guild (including a few remaining SWG players) have all been able to get in on the TOR beta test. Though I don't wish for anyone's happy place (MMO of choice) to be taken away from them, it does pain me to see what SWG has become. It also pains me to see the StarWars name dragged through the mud. It's been a part of my life since I was 9, and is a story that's loved by our whole family (3 generartions now ^_^). So, I'll be relieved if TOR provides gamers and StarWars fans with an MMO that is functional, enjoyable and treats players with respect and dignity. Whatever SWG is remembered for, I don't think it will be that it had any of these qualities in abundance.
/raisesglass Archeus
/raiseglass as well. Here Here. To better days and a warning to those who may prevent them. The New Rodo Report is yours on my sig below. Happy Halloween and Love that Jestor!
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As others in this thread have pointed out. There has not been much competition in the sci-fi area to compete with star wars galaxies. Something that has really gone unspoken is that this game only continues, because it has star wars in the title.
If this was a non-star wars game it would have closed down years ago, because it has been mismanaged from day 1 of release and the company running it has been working overtime to find ways to piss off the playerbase.
When a new star wars game hits the market it will most definately attract people who simply want to play a game that is based on star wars and that will include a large chunck of galaxies population. Will the old republic be enough to draw people away from the swg communities they have grown with for years, who knows.
At the same time soe has done a pretty good job of screwing up those communities with how they handled the free character transfer service. Shattering communities has not really helped swg, but maybe they rebuild in the months leading up to TOR.
You guys really should stop kidding yourselfs, SWG has a population of about 50k people, they are such diehards that even god could not make them give up thier accounts. They will never leave the game, and 50k people can keep this game going for a long time with the 100k pluss accounts they are paying for each month.
SWTOR looks like it will be a fun game, and its more RPG than MMO, its MMO light, and they even stated that. SWTOR will be a single person game you mostly play by yourself, but it does have pvp. PVP makes a MMO these days, I guess?
What is suprising is that Star Trek has taken over the #1 slot for atticipated. Guess alot of people are looking forward to a SciFi MMO. Its been in production for a long time, hope its good.
I doubt that the majority of SWG hardcore vets or even some of the current players will enjoy SW:TOR. It doesn't sound much like a game that would appeal to the sandbox/lvlless crowd. I would suggest fallen earth might be something a lot of SWG fans would enjoy.
tor is going to fail and fail hard i mean look around no one wants level based games they want sandbox based games like pre-cu swg
what will be funny is to see the aftermath of tor as i know we will see tons of sandbox games after
This is possibly the silliest thing I have heard. Not everyone is interested in a sandbox game. Not even everyone who is interested in a sandbox game can agree what constitutes a true sandbox game.
There is a portion of the gaming population that likes sandboxes and a segment that likes themepark. The ones that like themeparks are going to make BioWare a very rich company. I doubt very much that SWTOR will be the mythical WoW slayer, but I do think it will be quite successful. To say that it will have a skynet-like crash which will spawn a sandbox renaissance when the huddled masses shake off their chains and rise up to dance in a cantina or moisture farm it up, is dellusional.
So swg must be the only mmo on the market that has (according to you) over 100,000 paid subscriptions, but has not received a paid expansion in over 4 years and had its development team cut down to a skeleton crew and has been in a slow agonizing process of closing servers for the last few years.
Lets see what other games share similar characteristics in the soe station pass.
Vanguard
MxO
Planetside
Potbs
Something tells me that your opinion that swg has a 6 digit subscriber number is about as well thought out as your notion that people are not sticking around due to it being the only star wars mmo on the market. Again, something tells me they are more attracted to the star wars IP than they game play, especially considering the condition of the game the last several years.
So swg must be the only mmo on the market that has (according to you) over 100,000 paid subscriptions, but has not received a paid expansion in over 4 years and had its development team cut down to a skeleton crew and has been in a slow agonizing process of closing servers for the last few years.
Lets see what other games share similar characteristics in the soe station pass.
Vanguard
MxO
Planetside
Potbs
Something tells me that your opinion that swg has a 6 digit subscriber number is about as well thought out as your notion that people are not sticking around due to it being the only star wars mmo on the market. Again, something tells me they are more attracted to the star wars IP than they game play, especially considering the condition of the game the last several years.
Na its more like a 15$ a month chat program these days. Accounts and players are two differnt things, Thier is anywhere from 25k-50k people still playing. SOE has come out with the 100k accounts. I believe this to be true, I even had two accounts, the nutty ones have up to 10 accounts. Anyone that has farmed solo keeps mulitple accounts, EVE I have two, people recommend more. I really dont like doing that but it is a way to get around I got no buddys on at 3 am.
Who knows what will happen, but my gut says the people still playing SWG are the most stubborn people in MMO's. And thier shutting down 12 servers to keep the others going much longer than they would if they had only a skeleton population. There are about 5 really active servers and about 5 so so servers left. Not bad considering the game is what 6 years old. Hell AOC only lasted 5 months before they merged. I really dont see SWG closing with SWTOR release. Besides I dont have much time to grind toons like I used to and I think thats where alot of them are.
Im sure they will all try SWTOR but you must be dreaming they are going to close the accounts down. What I do see happening is SWG surviving at least 5 more years. By that time they will either decide to make SWG2 or close it, and it looks like SOE and LA are on working terms again, all the junk from the NGE has cooled down. If thier is anything to learn about SOE is that they like to remake and resell titles.
So swg must be the only mmo on the market that has (according to you) over 100,000 paid subscriptions, but has not received a paid expansion in over 4 years and had its development team cut down to a skeleton crew and has been in a slow agonizing process of closing servers for the last few years.
Lets see what other games share similar characteristics in the soe station pass.
Vanguard
MxO
Planetside
Potbs
Something tells me that your opinion that swg has a 6 digit subscriber number is about as well thought out as your notion that people are not sticking around due to it being the only star wars mmo on the market. Again, something tells me they are more attracted to the star wars IP than they game play, especially considering the condition of the game the last several years.
Na its more like a 15$ a month chat program these days. Accounts and players are two differnt things, Thier is anywhere from 25k-50k people still playing. SOE has come out with the 100k accounts. I believe this to be true, I even had two accounts, the nutty ones have up to 10 accounts. Anyone that has farmed solo keeps mulitple accounts, EVE I have two, people recommend more. I really dont like doing that but it is a way to get around I got no buddys on at 3 am.
Who knows what will happen, but my gut says the people still playing SWG are the most stubborn people in MMO's. And thier shutting down 12 servers to keep the others going much longer than they would if they had only a skeleton population. There are about 5 really active servers and about 5 so so servers left. Not bad considering the game is what 6 years old. Hell AOC only lasted 5 months before they merged. I really dont see SWG closing with SWTOR release. Besides I dont have much time to grind toons like I used to and I think thats where alot of them are.
Im sure they will all try SWTOR but you must be dreaming they are going to close the accounts down. What I do see happening is SWG surviving at least 5 more years. By that time they will either decide to make SWG2 or close it, and it looks like SOE and LA are on working terms again, all the junk from the NGE has cooled down. If thier is anything to learn about SOE is that they like to remake and resell titles.
IMO a reasonable guess would be that TOR pulls about 1/2 of SWG's population away. You're right that there are some die hards that'll keep playing SWG but I'll bet that a great many of those people will drop at least one of their multiple SWG accounts to play TOR.
Many others I'm sure will simply follow friends and thier guilds to TOR.
Let me start off by asking you a question. What do you think it is that makes people so dedicated to star wars galaxies? Hint: star wars.
Do you really think people hang out in the game for its awesome gameplay? What do you think made them stick around through the horrible condition of the game post nge?
People are dedicated to this game, because it is the only star wars game on the market and they have built a community around that. You are kidding yourself if you think for one second the population of swg is so married to this game that they will not possibly leave.
Think about this. What is the old republic releases and it is an awesome game. It has plenty of things to do with your friends, runs smooth and bioware shows even the smallest bit of respect to the players. If TOR has even the smallest amount of content that would allow entire communities to relocate and interact with each other in TOR, what would possibly keep swg players away from the game?
Right now swg players are dedicated to swg, because where else would they go? That is the aspect you are overlooking.
Second, why did you revise your population estimate from 50,000 to 25,000? That is a rather large margin of error. +/- 50% of the entire population of the game?
Soe said swg has 100k accounts? Sure and I bet soe also has 100k station pass accounts which they can use to slant any figures they want since technically they are subscribers to all of their games. Lets not forget soe said 5 million players joined free realms (which is logistically impossiblity), but even after the server mergers swg will have more servers than free realms does. Sure, I believe soe when they make claims like this. Care to share where they said swg has 100k active paid accounts?
To be completely honest, SWG players are very dedicated players as you have already said. That being the case, I think you see the bulk of the players logged in every night.
Every real player that leaves swg hurts the bottom line and the community of the game much much more than any other mmo. Due to the averaging in of multiple accounts and addition revenue from loot card sales. I bet if soe lost the wrong 10% of the games population to TOR it would cripple the revenue swg generates and bring development to a screeching halt.
Lets be totally honest, soe does not care about small dedicated populations. They have shown more than once they are willing to effectively close down a game by abandoning development on it as seen with mxo, planetside, eq mac, eqoa, etc. Just because people are willing to pay for a dead game doesn't mean it hasn't died.
Let me start off by asking you a question. What do you think it is that makes people so dedicated to star wars galaxies? Hint: star wars.
Do you really think people hang out in the game for its awesome gameplay? What do you think made them stick around through the horrible condition of the game post nge?
People are dedicated to this game, because it is the only star wars game on the market and they have built a community around that. You are kidding yourself if you think for one second the population of swg is so married to this game that they will not possibly leave.
Think about this. What is the old republic releases and it is an awesome game. It has plenty of things to do with your friends, runs smooth and bioware shows even the smallest bit of respect to the players. If TOR has even the smallest amount of content that would allow entire communities to relocate and interact with each other in TOR, what would possibly keep swg players away from the game?
Right now swg players are dedicated to swg, because where else would they go? That is the aspect you are overlooking.
Second, why did you revise your population estimate from 50,000 to 25,000? That is a rather large margin of error. +/- 50% of the entire population of the game?
Soe said swg has 100k accounts? Sure and I bet soe also has 100k station pass accounts which they can use to slant any figures they want since technically they are subscribers to all of their games. Lets not forget soe said 5 million players joined free realms (which is logistically impossiblity), but even after the server mergers swg will have more servers than free realms does. Sure, I believe soe when they make claims like this. Care to share where they said swg has 100k active paid accounts?
To be completely honest, SWG players are very dedicated players as you have already said. That being the case, I think you see the bulk of the players logged in every night.
Every real player that leaves swg hurts the bottom line and the community of the game much much more than any other mmo. Due to the averaging in of multiple accounts and addition revenue from loot card sales. I bet if soe lost the wrong 10% of the games population to TOR it would cripple the revenue swg generates and bring development to a screeching halt.
Lets be totally honest, soe does not care about small dedicated populations. They have shown more than once they are willing to effectively close down a game by abandoning development on it as seen with mxo, planetside, eq mac, eqoa, etc. Just because people are willing to pay for a dead game doesn't mean it hasn't died.
Smedley did announce that SWG had 100K subs. At the Chapter 6 combat downgrade 2+ years ago. Then, Kauri had more people on it than Bria has today. RIP Kauri (10/15/09) Then there was 4-5 servers that could support gameplay, now, it's 1-2.
Last player made estimates I seen on the O-boards, it was mutually decided that SWG had somewhere between 10K to 30 K players. From what I seen, when I was in-game, I would agree with those figures. However, the wife still plays so I get to watch Bria, and a large portion of the Bria PVP playerbase has recently left for FE. Some more transfered to Starsider.
So, you might reconsider before you put Bria on the great server list. I transfered to Bria when the population was good (12/07) and seen it's fall since. Going the way of Kauri.
I've heard a lot of second hand accounts of Smed making 100k claims, but don't recall seeing it anywhere. It would be interesting to see exactly what was said.
Not to long ago Bria was the HEAVY server on the server selection list that players pointed to as proof of the games health. Not people are talking about it dying. This is exactly what I meant when I said SOE mismanaged the character transfers. They let the players panic and flood one server instead of keeping entire servers populations together with a proper server merger. These tight communities are shattering in some mad dash to get to the only healthy server in the game.
SOE just doesn't understand the concept of communities in their mmos. They killed shuttle waits, the player driven economy, player interdependancies in the game which just erodes the community more. Just like they did in the EQ series with instant travels, the bazaar and instanced player/guild housing. EQ2 is a ghost town as a result of it. They just don't understand that the people you play with are just as important as the quality of the game.
Other than the star wars IP and the everquest brand name, the only real asset they have is the strength of their communities who have mostly player with each other for many years.
Smedley made the claim in an interview if I remember right. And it would of been sometime right after May, 07, after C6CD. There were threads on it here at the time. The claim, even then that SWG held 100K subs, almost had to include Station Pass. I played SWG/NGE then, and it is no where near the population of what it was even then.
Bria probably was the largest server way back, when I transfered there (Dec. 07). C6CD killed what was left of an already small but fantastic playerbase that was left on Kauri. Then, those who were left used the paid transfer system to leave Kauri as I did leaving the server a "ghost server" until it's demise a few days from now. I believe that there are probably "Bria is dead" threads on the Bria O-boards as we speak. I know the tier 5 city I was mayor of, 2nd oldest city on Bria, (New Solah/Hideaway) which my wife's toon is now mayor of, is about to bite the dust and she has really tried to keep on top of it. There just isn't the people to keep everything going on Bria anylonger.
Personally I can't see NGE surviving the launch of TOR. Both shoes have dropped recently, the first being the closure of half the servers, the second being the impending TOR beta. The next thud will be the corpse of the NGE hitting the floor for the last time.
The only reason why NGE still has any subscribers at all is because it's the only Star Wars MMO. That will no longer be the case in the next few months. Next to TOR, NGE will look old, obsolete, and it's combat system likely STILL won't work.
I just can't see it competing unless a major investment in graphics upgrades and engine improvements are made. And that's just to modernize the NGE as is, which has already been rejected by 90% of those who played Pre-NGE.
Within days to weeks after TOR there simply won't be enough subscribers left to pay the expenses and upkeep. SOE may hang on and hope that people don't like TOR and come back, but I don't think that they will come back.
And it may not be up to SOE, LEC might mandate the shutdown of NGE with the TOR launch, not because NGE will compete with TOR (TOR will launch with hundreds of thousands of subscribers at least, many times what the NGE has) but to send the NGE and the bad blood and feelings down the memory hole. If you were LEC, would you want it around? Frankly, I think the only reason why NGE got a reprieve to hang around this long was because of TOR.
I'm looking forward to TOR, and am signed up for the beta. While I don't expect it to be Pre-CU (EVE satisfies my sandbox cravings anyway) I am a huge fan of Bioware.
Bioware does not make bad games.
Hit the nail on the head perfectly.
Asheron's Call, Champions Online, Dark Age of Camelot, EVE Online, EverQuest, Lineage 2, Star Wars Galaxies and World of Warcraft.Waiting for SWTOR
I don't disagree with anything except this point, I highly doubt it's simply the Star Wars IP that keeps people playing. I'd look more at the variety in game-play styles, decent crafting (albeit not as important as it once was). Social avenues of advancement (non-combat). As well as flight and pseudo twitch or turned base combat. The sandbox elements are probabaly up there in reasons as well. Of course the IP would stack up too, you can't ignore the lack of variety in most games on the market.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson