No thanks, I'd like to see some actual excitement in combat. The more flashy, the better. Keep realism out of a genre that clearly isn't built for realism in the first place. More Flash, More action, More fun.
well different types/genres just wouldnt work well in first person, but i agree, i wish they would make more first person, or at least tight in over the shoulder 3rd person (more like a 3rd person shooter style ala Ghost Recon) MMOs. Along with the first person, im really hoping that we eventually get the capabilities to really have more in depth control of our characters, rathe rthan pressing a hotkey or 2 to perform attacks made up of multiple movements, it would be cool to have more "realistic" control of your character, down to controlling your arm movements & hands almost as if you were actually doing it yourself (gripping/releasing weapons/objects, holding and handling different weapons differently for your own fighting style and effects, etc). I would think it would really be much more fun to be, lets say a ranger/archer going through the motions of retrieving the arrows, nocking them, aiming, pulling back, etc while stalking your prey and chasing them down rather than hotkey,hotkey,hotkey, or say playing as a mage and having to make specific hand/arm movements (think something like drawing symbols in the air or on the ground in front of you) while chanting in order to perform specific spells. Same goes with the crafting aspect to. would be interesting to actually manuever during the crafting and your success depending on your skill, accuracy, speed, etc rather than sitting there just watching a timer go by for a few seconds while your toon automatically does it all.
Would much rather see them get rid of all the crap useless flashy effects and spend the time/money/resources/hardware instead on developing a more detailed skill based way of playing that really immerses you in the world.
I tend to agree, especially when magical-type fire effects are going off for non-magical melee attacks; just doesn't fit.
However, I would not mind it if flashy swordplay scaled to skill level or character level. So the 1st level folks would have basic attack graphics while the high-level folks would have visuals of spins and catching swords in the air and such.
Plus MMOs should be first person. Sick of these shitty third person view games like WoW and AION. Think I wanna look at my character? No, I am the character, so I should have the same fucking viewpoint. Garbage ass lame companies
Many MMOs including WOW have the ability zoom your camera into first person view. I can't imagine you would be very effective as, the first person view makes for very difficult strategic playing which is what MMOs are. They aren't FPS for the most part.
You do have few exceptions Planet Side is the one I can thnk of.
Asheron's Call, Champions Online, Dark Age of Camelot, EVE Online, EverQuest, Lineage 2, Star Wars Galaxies and World of Warcraft.Waiting for SWTOR
Gotta disagree with you there. Long TTK doesn't really make for deeper combat. For the most part, long TTK has more to do with how long is spent on each mob (obviously), and it really has no effect whatsoever on how deep or shallow combat is. For Knights in Aion, the first few levels, combat is incredibly shallow and lasts for ten to twelve seconds apiece. For a mage, it's two casts of the same spell, spanning two, possibly three seconds. One has a short TTK, one long, and neither particularly complex. In that example, I'd take short over long any day. In another game I've been frequenting lately, Demon's Souls, combat is relatively simple and leadup and preparation is very important. Are you below half of your equip burden? If not, then you can't roll out of the way of heavy blows as effectively, but it's possible that the extra weight adds enough damage mitigation to make that worthwhile. Are you fighting a skeleton? Then swords won't be as good as maces. There's a lot of setup, and an easy way to carry around a few different 'outfits' as it were at any one time, swapping nigh-seamlessly between. This adds a lot of complexity to an otherwise simple (Light attack/heavy attack, block/parry) action RPG combat system. That, and the incredible amount of damage both you and enemies deal, means that there's a lot of time and thought spent preparing for any particular battle, then a bit of a standoff while both opponents test one another. A quick flurry of action, and a victor. Very simple at the core, but intensely in-depth when you're actually working your strategy out. It's an interesting, engaging combat system, which many modern MMORPGs lack, and its TTK is short, sweet, and brutal. There's no downward spiral, no 'oh god I pulled too much and now I'll slowly die to all the damage'. If you pull too much, you die. If you're conscientious and cautious, you live, often returning from combat without so much as a scratch. I'm all about that sort of thing. I'd like to see skill and preparation be a heftier player in combat than gear and how many hit points the players have to slew through before they're killed.
At no point in my post did I say "long TTKs = automatic game depth". There are many MMORPGs out there with long TTKs that are utterly shallow games.
However extremely fast TTKs do gaurantee that only pre-battle decisions mean anything. To date I haven't found a game whose pre-battle decisions were interesting enough to carry the game on their own.
In fact, shallow combat depth is one of the big reasons no game has come close to WOW at this point (and with my recent time spent in EVE, I attribute combat depth to being one of the main reasons this game has remained steadfast and growing; it might have the most dynamic combat in any MMORPG.) It's only one of many reasons, but it's a pretty significant one because often combat is the primary activity in these games -- if it's not fun, the game isn't fun.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Your tone seemed to imply it. I'd have to disagree again on short TTK = only pre-battle decisions matter, as well; one of the things I liked about my example is that there's a lot of feinting and dodging to be done before actual blows are struck. The thing about it that gets to me is the fact that blows are significant.
That's also the case in EVE, where pre-battle decisionmaking and preparation are a major part of victory, and in-battle clutch thinking is basically good as damage control and not-so-much else. If you're in the wrong gear and the bad guy is in the right gear, you're not going to be effective against him, and while swapping ammunition is available, TTKs can -still- be very short in EVE. I have a Thrasher that I can literally two-shot an Amarr cruiser in. It's expensive and slow, but the damn thing is just unbeatable when it comes to doing huge amounts of damage from a pretty long way off. My range is, of course, limited by my ship's class, but when it comes to brass tacks, the damn thing is a two-mil chassis with a hundred-mil or so of guns and rigs installed. It's an -excellent- ship, and my particular TTK is excruciatingly, brutally short whenever I have the time to set up.
Again, that's all pre-battle decisionmaking and preparation. The fights themselves are short, while the leadup that brought me to my current setup was extremely long and took a lot of thought and work. I'm within I think .6 mw and 1.2 mhz of my power and CPU requirements, and all my slots are packed full of the best stuff money can buy for the size.
My biggest decision, as a rule, is whether and when to attack, who to hit first, and whether to focus or split my fire. With my damage output, it can be a big mistake to waste long-firing artillery rounds on a ship that only two of my six guns could easily destroy.
So, again, preparation is of major importance to the fun factor here. Finding your niche (me, I one-shot little ships and remain more or less invisible thanks to my buddy the scrambler jockey) and filling it up right is very important, and often when you find yourself in a disadvantageous situation, the only real solution that you can make is to run away as fast as you can. EVE is all about that sort of thing, and although straight assault ships are more flexible, you're still looking at a lengthy period spent changing ammo types in order to go from killing Thing A well to killing Thing B well, or even just peeling shields with EM and then swapping to harder shot to penetrate armor and structure. The way you go into the fight makes a huge difference, and the capacities you'll have therein are decided early in all cases. Making that process interesting (theorycrafting spaders in WoW, strategists and quartermaster types in EVE, etcetera) is what makes gear progression so damned impossible to replace as a mechanic.
You can tell by my artillery-boat sort of background here that I like the time I'm spending on someone to be relatively short. Quick fights where I either live or die are my favorite sorts, and even if there are few decisions to be made (purely due to lack of time) between beginning and end, I prefer the short flurry of action to the long series of button-taps. It's likely all about personal preference, here, but I'd like to see less 'A hits B. B hits A. A hits B. B hits A' combat, and a lot more bobbing and weaving. Warriors stayed alive because they didn't take many hits, not because they toughed their way through a sword in the gut, and I think that could make for a number of interesting mechanics.
Overall, I agree with you. Fun combat in a combat-centric game is of great importance, but there's always a question of definition. I prefer Demon's Souls combat to World of Warcraft's just because watching two bars tick down, one faster than the other, isn't nearly as exciting to me as doing something that really feels like fighting, up to and including the panicking, bleeding-to-death backpedals and hiding behind shields while I try desperately to make a second's gap to patch myself up or flee.
Depends on the type of MMO really and the art direction. If an MMO has gone for a more gritty realism, you'll see something like AoC or Fallen Earth as someone mentioned. High Fantasy games like WoW, Aion require flashy animations because it fits their art direction.
I don't mind both versions, probably gritty realism I'm fonder of, AoC was awesome as far combat animation went, finishing moves made you feel 'in' the game and gave an evil sense of satisfaction and power watching your helpless enemies head fly off. However the devs had an older playerbase in mind so it fit the bill.
Many AAA MMOs now are looking for the broadest possible audience, flashy animation is needed to keep the player excited, because a game with boring normal swings would look silly in a game with low violence.
If you want a game with normal swings, you need an adequate amount of gore to not make it look like you're hitting wooden dummies.
This thread is basically a 'I want an MMO to bend to what I want' when in reality you're simply going to have to find or wait for an MMO that fits your desired art direction.
Without getting to deep over something pretty trivial in my opinion. I don't mind flash in the games, it help's remind me more.. that I'm playing a game. Which i want... to escape the shit of real life for a couple hours.
I think if you suddenly turned of all effects, that you would be bored to hell. I remember seeing the first beta footages from AOC, where the combat was cleaned up for anything except abit cheesy bloodeffects -it actually didnt look more realistic at all, maybe even less. Sometimes effects can cover up less lifelike animations and reactions ( to beeing beaten with a sword). Effects might in many cases actually make the combat feel more real. Its abit like motion blur. Movement in games with motion blur added, looks more right, yet theres no motion blur in reality. Same if someone plants a fist in your face - it feels like a blitzlight, how do you illustrate that in a game with 10k polygon models?
Maybe the effects will be more lifelike, as polygones go up and particle systems becomes more sophisticated. Maybe heads and arms will fly and blood sting your screen. Maybe the engines will be powerfull enough to let the player customise how much of this and that, he wants on his screen. Atm though i dont mind abit fireworks to make a grind less boring. And i know alot of ppl enjoy those extra big flashy numbers after a critical strike.
If the MOB is coming at you with a sword...what is it you need to know? If they are approaching with a spear, what exactly do you need to know? If they are shooting a bow...can you not see that they are shooting a bow? Get the ideal?
I need to know if they have special moves by using a sword. Can they perform magic? Can they have fire on the sword? blah blah blah ...
A bit of flash is ok, but most games are over the top nowadays. Combat misses some 'punch (lol) when every stupid action requires my character to make a stupid little squeal and have graphics fly all over the screen. If those sort of graphics and sounds were reserved only for special moves I think I'd personally like them much more...
Yeah mmogs are way to flashy. Don't misunderstand, i like it flashy but it just got really ridiculous to the point where the targeted enemy's become a ball of rainbow lights...
Some flash is okay, if it is used sparingly and as a way to differentiate moves which would be hard to tell just from the normal animation. I think sound is much better overall. By tagging each movie with a unique pre-move sound effect, you can react just as well with less eyestrain or fatigue. The problem is that sound is often much easier to turn off, and That relying only on it makes gameplay impossible for hearing-impaired users.
It's better just to differentiate certain attack animations better. Give them unique charging animation stances. Like a couple seconds before fast blade, have your character lift his sword above his head. But for Seraph Blade, have your character quickly drop to a crouch. After, execute the move. If you need to use extensive flash effects, chances are you are trying to hide the fact your combat animations are bland or repetitive.
I don't mind flash or lack of it either way. As long as the flash is not a replacement for the gameplay, it is fine with me. It seems some games try to dazzle you with flash to cover up the poor combat.
As someone mentioned earlier, sounds are what get me. I like to play with the sound and music on, and if either are crappy and annoying, it ruins my immersion and I just don't want to bother playing any more.
At least with flashy graphics, I can usually turn them down so I still see something, but not so over the top. With sounds though, I can't change them to something less annoying. It is either on or off (with various volumes).
if you think telegraphing a move with an animation lasting barely a second is slow mode, well, give me slow mode. Especially if other players need to react to an animation to do a multi-player skillchain, or need to react defensively to a player skill, fast sucks.
I am not sure if I follow the OP correctly, but...
I HATE Auto-Attack combat. Auto-Attack has always been one of the worst tributes of MMORPG. How I long for more fantasy action games.. It's much more fun to swing a sword and chop someones head of in satisfying real-time, than shooting them from a distance. Sword fighting and martial arts are close and personal and honorable, and more exciting.
Most online games are shooters.. its easier to make shooters as the latency of who hits who, in a FPS is always there to confuse things. once you start doing it with swords and melee it gets harder. We have already seen Fantasy online action games fail like Dark Messiah and Lord of the Rings Conquest. Both games with potential...
Fantasy in MMORPG is over saturated, but in normal online FPS games its not there at all. I think many devs won't touch the subject with a ten foot pole.
The only memorable good online sword fighting game I have ever tried was Jedi Knight II: Outcast and Jedi Academy(which is still popular online to this day). These games had fun swordfighting.. you really felt like a Jedi while swining your sword in real time.
I have high hopes for Mount and Blade Warband(check youtube)... hopefully it will be the medieval battlefield many have always been dreaming about.
Games like Age of Chivalry(AoC, A HL2 mod), Oblivion, Witcher, and a few others have had interesting real time sword fighting, but none of it has really hit it home I think...
As for flash and over-the-top animations... Well yeah, I am personally a fan of minimalism. I am old fashioned and would prefer if everyone would wear similiar looking dark minimalistic armor, instead of purple circus clowns. It really was one of the things that just went out of hand in WoW. The designers kept having to up their outragous designs, to the point were the weapons, shoulders and armors got so big and insane looking that it looked like a clown army... it just stopped being cool looking fantasy.
That's why I still love Guild Wars. its still very toned down, with dye for all armors that make sense.. nobody looks out of line, the weapons are uniqe but still within the realm of beloning in a regiment of any medieval army. the slight individualism in MMOs is good, but I never understood the need to be the main OMFG hero in a MMORPG. Was that not what single player games are for? story driven and all that...? i thought MMOs should be about community and just being one small piece of a big effort in a war.. I hate it when quests are designed like you are the main hero. it doesnt make sense.
Some of the online MMOs / online RPGs I am looking most forward to like Continent of the Ninth(c9), TERA, Blade and Soul and Mabinogi Heroes, all have real-time combat... perhaps except for blade and soul which looks like Aion... But the others look almost like dyansty warriors, ninja gaiden or devil may cry in their fast paced nature, and I love that.
its a big plus for me. because I am getting fed uop with auto-attack.
Comments
agree
People seem to love those arcade-like graphics.
1. Every blade swing has a dramatic whoosh, and acid trails.
2. Every hit has a grand explosive sound and a splash of color.
3. Every special ability has a custom animation with a huge whirl of color that screams out to the world... "I AM COOL".
... and of course with two hundred thousand people all having flashy graphics, nobody at all ends up looking special.
In the end, it's simply dazzle hiding lack-luster combat.
Ken
www.ActionMMORPG.com
One man, a small pile of money, and the screwball idea of a DIY Indie MMORPG? Yep, that's him. ~sigh~
well different types/genres just wouldnt work well in first person, but i agree, i wish they would make more first person, or at least tight in over the shoulder 3rd person (more like a 3rd person shooter style ala Ghost Recon) MMOs. Along with the first person, im really hoping that we eventually get the capabilities to really have more in depth control of our characters, rathe rthan pressing a hotkey or 2 to perform attacks made up of multiple movements, it would be cool to have more "realistic" control of your character, down to controlling your arm movements & hands almost as if you were actually doing it yourself (gripping/releasing weapons/objects, holding and handling different weapons differently for your own fighting style and effects, etc). I would think it would really be much more fun to be, lets say a ranger/archer going through the motions of retrieving the arrows, nocking them, aiming, pulling back, etc while stalking your prey and chasing them down rather than hotkey,hotkey,hotkey, or say playing as a mage and having to make specific hand/arm movements (think something like drawing symbols in the air or on the ground in front of you) while chanting in order to perform specific spells. Same goes with the crafting aspect to. would be interesting to actually manuever during the crafting and your success depending on your skill, accuracy, speed, etc rather than sitting there just watching a timer go by for a few seconds while your toon automatically does it all.
Would much rather see them get rid of all the crap useless flashy effects and spend the time/money/resources/hardware instead on developing a more detailed skill based way of playing that really immerses you in the world.
I tend to agree, especially when magical-type fire effects are going off for non-magical melee attacks; just doesn't fit.
However, I would not mind it if flashy swordplay scaled to skill level or character level. So the 1st level folks would have basic attack graphics while the high-level folks would have visuals of spins and catching swords in the air and such.
Many MMOs including WOW have the ability zoom your camera into first person view. I can't imagine you would be very effective as, the first person view makes for very difficult strategic playing which is what MMOs are. They aren't FPS for the most part.
You do have few exceptions Planet Side is the one I can thnk of.
Asheron's Call, Champions Online, Dark Age of Camelot, EVE Online, EverQuest, Lineage 2, Star Wars Galaxies and World of Warcraft.Waiting for SWTOR
At no point in my post did I say "long TTKs = automatic game depth". There are many MMORPGs out there with long TTKs that are utterly shallow games.
However extremely fast TTKs do gaurantee that only pre-battle decisions mean anything. To date I haven't found a game whose pre-battle decisions were interesting enough to carry the game on their own.
In fact, shallow combat depth is one of the big reasons no game has come close to WOW at this point (and with my recent time spent in EVE, I attribute combat depth to being one of the main reasons this game has remained steadfast and growing; it might have the most dynamic combat in any MMORPG.) It's only one of many reasons, but it's a pretty significant one because often combat is the primary activity in these games -- if it's not fun, the game isn't fun.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Your tone seemed to imply it.
I'd have to disagree again on short TTK = only pre-battle decisions matter, as well; one of the things I liked about my example is that there's a lot of feinting and dodging to be done before actual blows are struck. The thing about it that gets to me is the fact that blows are significant.
That's also the case in EVE, where pre-battle decisionmaking and preparation are a major part of victory, and in-battle clutch thinking is basically good as damage control and not-so-much else. If you're in the wrong gear and the bad guy is in the right gear, you're not going to be effective against him, and while swapping ammunition is available, TTKs can -still- be very short in EVE. I have a Thrasher that I can literally two-shot an Amarr cruiser in. It's expensive and slow, but the damn thing is just unbeatable when it comes to doing huge amounts of damage from a pretty long way off. My range is, of course, limited by my ship's class, but when it comes to brass tacks, the damn thing is a two-mil chassis with a hundred-mil or so of guns and rigs installed. It's an -excellent- ship, and my particular TTK is excruciatingly, brutally short whenever I have the time to set up.
Again, that's all pre-battle decisionmaking and preparation. The fights themselves are short, while the leadup that brought me to my current setup was extremely long and took a lot of thought and work. I'm within I think .6 mw and 1.2 mhz of my power and CPU requirements, and all my slots are packed full of the best stuff money can buy for the size.
My biggest decision, as a rule, is whether and when to attack, who to hit first, and whether to focus or split my fire. With my damage output, it can be a big mistake to waste long-firing artillery rounds on a ship that only two of my six guns could easily destroy.
So, again, preparation is of major importance to the fun factor here. Finding your niche (me, I one-shot little ships and remain more or less invisible thanks to my buddy the scrambler jockey) and filling it up right is very important, and often when you find yourself in a disadvantageous situation, the only real solution that you can make is to run away as fast as you can. EVE is all about that sort of thing, and although straight assault ships are more flexible, you're still looking at a lengthy period spent changing ammo types in order to go from killing Thing A well to killing Thing B well, or even just peeling shields with EM and then swapping to harder shot to penetrate armor and structure. The way you go into the fight makes a huge difference, and the capacities you'll have therein are decided early in all cases. Making that process interesting (theorycrafting spaders in WoW, strategists and quartermaster types in EVE, etcetera) is what makes gear progression so damned impossible to replace as a mechanic.
You can tell by my artillery-boat sort of background here that I like the time I'm spending on someone to be relatively short. Quick fights where I either live or die are my favorite sorts, and even if there are few decisions to be made (purely due to lack of time) between beginning and end, I prefer the short flurry of action to the long series of button-taps. It's likely all about personal preference, here, but I'd like to see less 'A hits B. B hits A. A hits B. B hits A' combat, and a lot more bobbing and weaving. Warriors stayed alive because they didn't take many hits, not because they toughed their way through a sword in the gut, and I think that could make for a number of interesting mechanics.
Overall, I agree with you. Fun combat in a combat-centric game is of great importance, but there's always a question of definition. I prefer Demon's Souls combat to World of Warcraft's just because watching two bars tick down, one faster than the other, isn't nearly as exciting to me as doing something that really feels like fighting, up to and including the panicking, bleeding-to-death backpedals and hiding behind shields while I try desperately to make a second's gap to patch myself up or flee.
I agree, give me a medieval life-simulation mmorpg without dumb flashy combat!
Depends on the type of MMO really and the art direction. If an MMO has gone for a more gritty realism, you'll see something like AoC or Fallen Earth as someone mentioned. High Fantasy games like WoW, Aion require flashy animations because it fits their art direction.
I don't mind both versions, probably gritty realism I'm fonder of, AoC was awesome as far combat animation went, finishing moves made you feel 'in' the game and gave an evil sense of satisfaction and power watching your helpless enemies head fly off. However the devs had an older playerbase in mind so it fit the bill.
Many AAA MMOs now are looking for the broadest possible audience, flashy animation is needed to keep the player excited, because a game with boring normal swings would look silly in a game with low violence.
If you want a game with normal swings, you need an adequate amount of gore to not make it look like you're hitting wooden dummies.
This thread is basically a 'I want an MMO to bend to what I want' when in reality you're simply going to have to find or wait for an MMO that fits your desired art direction.
O_o o_O
Without getting to deep over something pretty trivial in my opinion. I don't mind flash in the games, it help's remind me more.. that I'm playing a game. Which i want... to escape the shit of real life for a couple hours.
I think if you suddenly turned of all effects, that you would be bored to hell. I remember seeing the first beta footages from AOC, where the combat was cleaned up for anything except abit cheesy bloodeffects -it actually didnt look more realistic at all, maybe even less. Sometimes effects can cover up less lifelike animations and reactions ( to beeing beaten with a sword). Effects might in many cases actually make the combat feel more real. Its abit like motion blur. Movement in games with motion blur added, looks more right, yet theres no motion blur in reality. Same if someone plants a fist in your face - it feels like a blitzlight, how do you illustrate that in a game with 10k polygon models?
Maybe the effects will be more lifelike, as polygones go up and particle systems becomes more sophisticated. Maybe heads and arms will fly and blood sting your screen. Maybe the engines will be powerfull enough to let the player customise how much of this and that, he wants on his screen. Atm though i dont mind abit fireworks to make a grind less boring. And i know alot of ppl enjoy those extra big flashy numbers after a critical strike.
I need to know if they have special moves by using a sword. Can they perform magic? Can they have fire on the sword? blah blah blah ...
The flashier the better.
i agree aion's graphics and combat system are pretty bad
Aion in Asia is targetted at kids and teenagers, not at adults. You can see this from the commercials and forums.
In the West it was promoted universaly, while still remainging the same game.
I think that's part of the confusion.
I agree. Looks like an Xbox game or something.
If I shoot a fireball I'd like to see a fire ball.
If I swing a sword, I'd like to see a sword swing, not a bunch of flashing lights to make the add crowd happy.
REALISM ---- Vanguard --- Darkfall --- EQ
Semi-Realism --- WoW --- LotrO --- EQ2
Flash --- Aion
although not a big fan of flashy animation, i find the high pitched girly "YAAAAAA" screams (as in that Aion video u linked) infinitely more annoying
A bit of flash is ok, but most games are over the top nowadays. Combat misses some 'punch (lol) when every stupid action requires my character to make a stupid little squeal and have graphics fly all over the screen. If those sort of graphics and sounds were reserved only for special moves I think I'd personally like them much more...
Ningen wa ningen da.
----
http://twitter.com/Ciovala
pew pew lasers rule!
blood, sweat and muscles? So you mean hardcore GAY porn?
R.I.P Chikaca Whachuchu
Yeah mmogs are way to flashy. Don't misunderstand, i like it flashy but it just got really ridiculous to the point where the targeted enemy's become a ball of rainbow lights...
Some flash is okay, if it is used sparingly and as a way to differentiate moves which would be hard to tell just from the normal animation. I think sound is much better overall. By tagging each movie with a unique pre-move sound effect, you can react just as well with less eyestrain or fatigue. The problem is that sound is often much easier to turn off, and That relying only on it makes gameplay impossible for hearing-impaired users.
It's better just to differentiate certain attack animations better. Give them unique charging animation stances. Like a couple seconds before fast blade, have your character lift his sword above his head. But for Seraph Blade, have your character quickly drop to a crouch. After, execute the move. If you need to use extensive flash effects, chances are you are trying to hide the fact your combat animations are bland or repetitive.
No thanks, I'd prefer not to have my combat go in slow mode every couple seconds, that seems truly lame.
I don't mind flash or lack of it either way. As long as the flash is not a replacement for the gameplay, it is fine with me. It seems some games try to dazzle you with flash to cover up the poor combat.
As someone mentioned earlier, sounds are what get me. I like to play with the sound and music on, and if either are crappy and annoying, it ruins my immersion and I just don't want to bother playing any more.
At least with flashy graphics, I can usually turn them down so I still see something, but not so over the top. With sounds though, I can't change them to something less annoying. It is either on or off (with various volumes).
if you think telegraphing a move with an animation lasting barely a second is slow mode, well, give me slow mode. Especially if other players need to react to an animation to do a multi-player skillchain, or need to react defensively to a player skill, fast sucks.
I am not sure if I follow the OP correctly, but...
I HATE Auto-Attack combat. Auto-Attack has always been one of the worst tributes of MMORPG. How I long for more fantasy action games.. It's much more fun to swing a sword and chop someones head of in satisfying real-time, than shooting them from a distance. Sword fighting and martial arts are close and personal and honorable, and more exciting.
Most online games are shooters.. its easier to make shooters as the latency of who hits who, in a FPS is always there to confuse things. once you start doing it with swords and melee it gets harder. We have already seen Fantasy online action games fail like Dark Messiah and Lord of the Rings Conquest. Both games with potential...
Fantasy in MMORPG is over saturated, but in normal online FPS games its not there at all. I think many devs won't touch the subject with a ten foot pole.
The only memorable good online sword fighting game I have ever tried was Jedi Knight II: Outcast and Jedi Academy(which is still popular online to this day). These games had fun swordfighting.. you really felt like a Jedi while swining your sword in real time.
I have high hopes for Mount and Blade Warband(check youtube)... hopefully it will be the medieval battlefield many have always been dreaming about.
Games like Age of Chivalry(AoC, A HL2 mod), Oblivion, Witcher, and a few others have had interesting real time sword fighting, but none of it has really hit it home I think...
As for flash and over-the-top animations... Well yeah, I am personally a fan of minimalism. I am old fashioned and would prefer if everyone would wear similiar looking dark minimalistic armor, instead of purple circus clowns. It really was one of the things that just went out of hand in WoW. The designers kept having to up their outragous designs, to the point were the weapons, shoulders and armors got so big and insane looking that it looked like a clown army... it just stopped being cool looking fantasy.
That's why I still love Guild Wars. its still very toned down, with dye for all armors that make sense.. nobody looks out of line, the weapons are uniqe but still within the realm of beloning in a regiment of any medieval army. the slight individualism in MMOs is good, but I never understood the need to be the main OMFG hero in a MMORPG. Was that not what single player games are for? story driven and all that...? i thought MMOs should be about community and just being one small piece of a big effort in a war.. I hate it when quests are designed like you are the main hero. it doesnt make sense.
Some of the online MMOs / online RPGs I am looking most forward to like Continent of the Ninth(c9), TERA, Blade and Soul and Mabinogi Heroes, all have real-time combat... perhaps except for blade and soul which looks like Aion... But the others look almost like dyansty warriors, ninja gaiden or devil may cry in their fast paced nature, and I love that.
its a big plus for me. because I am getting fed uop with auto-attack.