With the new FF game I recommend allowing players to use time cards if you want to get everyone in the game. Some of us still prefer to not use them and some of us just plain can't get one and yes the really should try to beat Blizzard by getting this out before Cataclysm as they may gain some people. In fact players that are behind with WOW and feel they are not where they want to be in the game might jump ship to the new FF.
Most of us know WOW is the big giant out there in the MMO world, and many of us feel WOW is a bit too slow on the expansions, forcing players to repeat old content again and again and again. But WOW is coming out with a new expansion, "Cataclysm", that I predict will rock the charts just like all of their expansions. So, between now and when Cataclysm releases, is a window of opportunity for a new first rate MMO to step in and scoop up some bored WOW players. Is this not so? Therefore, I think FF XIV would be wise to release before Cataclysm comes out. Just my opinion. Thoughts?
IMO WoW players are "NOT" real MMO players, WoW players are the same as console players, people with the instant Glory mind set, I know It sounds harsh but Its true.
I also played WoW for 5 years, but also played AC,Eq1 and all of the old MMOS that made MMOS a World and not a video game, you see WoW came along and took MMOS and made them main steam bring with them main stream gamers and by doing so ruined the mmo market making game dev. jump on the banwagon to make a fast buck, the old school MMO games made MMO Worlds for roleplayers where everyhing was a time sink and earned (think fantasy life) and though not fun for alot people there where those that loved it, but we know money talks so MMO games took over MMO Worlds with the birth of WoW.
SO let WoW's Cat come, no matter what you do blizzard will be on top and its because they invented the MMO game and to many WoW is that quick fix for the low selfesteamed instant glory junkies, and in todays fast paced world thats what most players want and that is what sells, think about It, most if not 75% of all WoW players today where and are those people that where hooked to AoL chat rooms or facebook games, they want and got there fast fix of entertanment. (LOL omg I set my self up on that remark, O well It's true)
Although WoW invented the MMO game they sure as hell didn't invent the MMO World the real fans love and have been playing sence Mud.
FF14 is one of those MMO Worlds that has its core loyal group just like Eve,EQ, Linage,UO,AC,DaoC to name a few, to me those are the worlds that got us hooked in the first place so who cares if WoW number 1, they should be, after all they made a kick ass video game, but not a MMO World.
FFXI had on 500k population few years ago even if the game comes after wow's expansion I'm 90% sure those that enjoyed FFXI will give it a try plus there's those that want to try new mmos because are bored of the one they are playing.
FFXI had on 500k population few years ago even if the game comes after wow's expansion I'm 90% sure those that enjoyed FFXI will give it a try plus there's those that want to try new mmos because are bored of the one they are playing. So in other words nothing to worry about.
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
FFXI had on 500k population few years ago even if the game comes after wow's expansion I'm 90% sure those that enjoyed FFXI will give it a try plus there's those that want to try new mmos because are bored of the one they are playing. So in other words nothing to worry about.
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
From what I can tell the game will be "solo friendly" but also be group friendly. So you can do things whichever way you want them. Very different from a lot of other games where doing things in a group can be punished (like WoW, for instance).
FFXI had on 500k population few years ago even if the game comes after wow's expansion I'm 90% sure those that enjoyed FFXI will give it a try plus there's those that want to try new mmos because are bored of the one they are playing. So in other words nothing to worry about.
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
From what I can tell the game will be "solo friendly" but also be group friendly. So you can do things whichever way you want them. Very different from a lot of other games where doing things in a group can be punished (like WoW, for instance).
Lol the Problem is you can Group in Wow. But there is no point for most of the game, because its so easy to solo. Solo Friendly is Honestly the worst thing to happen to MMO's. Sure there should be a few easy games like WOW, But the Retarted numbers of them beeing made for solo people is Disgusting.
And NO. You cannot make a game Solo and Group friendly... Unless its Diffrent areas/Zones. Both cannot Exist next to each other because there would be no point for people in Groups, Or it would screw the Solo people because they would just Agrro all the good/ Quest/ High value Mobs and leave you nothing, or the crap thats Either to hard to kill so isent good Exp/hour, Or isent worth killing because its a gnat.
So while I guess in a Zone game you could make it Zone "A" is Solo, Zone "B" is Group, they can NEVER exist peacefully in the same area. Lots of MMO's to Prove this point.
If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude; greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen. Samuel Adams
I disagree, so far we have mainly seen games come out before a WoW expansion (I not sure whether to put Aion pre-Cat or Post-WotLK as it was released nearly a year ahead) and the box sales do decent but they can't hold onto a large playerbase (compared to the box sales).
So, I say release a couple of months after cat, people will be getting a bit bored of the content & there will be no hype building regarding another expansion (fan speculation on what it will be next doesn't count). I think 2010 may be the year where we finally see a dent in WoW's subs, not because Blizzard doesn't deserve it but I feel if a story based game becomes successful we may move away from the stasis condition this genra is in.
Not really, Wowtards don't like FF11 usually because you actually have to work for your stuff and you can't do most of the game alone. I just hope they don't wowafiy FF14 too much I like how FF11 requires some skill in combat (you can really tell an idiot fast in a exp party) I like the games community, its why I might be playing it again. Lets be honest here, I doubt any other mmorpg will get as many subs as Ezmode wow. For them to even try to compete sub wise is stupid, Mind you there are some free to play mmorpg's out there that are imo better than WoW gameplay wise. I just wish game devs would stop copying wow's gameplay and mechanics and make something orignal or at least try. Alganon, Runes of Magic, Allods all are YAWC (Yet Another Wow Clone). I think they just see wow's success and go "Well that works lets copy the papa monkey for our game!" <-- this is what I hope SE doesn't do with FF14, if they do I'll be very dissapointed. I already plan to pre-order ff14. I just hope they do a internation release insted of giving it to the rest of the world a year later. Which then pisses off the japanese players when we get caught up to them in 25% of the time it took them to get there. Stuff it took them a year to do in FF11 when the US ver came out we were at the same point after 2-3 months. On my server I was one of the first level 50 North American players on my server. When it first came out. Damn Limit break 1 took me near a week to do, bad drop rates -_-, its lot better now they upped the drop rates substantally for those items.
Also as someone said, FF11/14 cater more to the hardcore mmorpg player, insted of the ezmode wanting casuals, People who want more of a challenge out of their game should go with ff11/14 IMO.
FFXI had on 500k population few years ago even if the game comes after wow's expansion I'm 90% sure those that enjoyed FFXI will give it a try plus there's those that want to try new mmos because are bored of the one they are playing. So in other words nothing to worry about.
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
From what I can tell the game will be "solo friendly" but also be group friendly. So you can do things whichever way you want them. Very different from a lot of other games where doing things in a group can be punished (like WoW, for instance).
Lol the Problem is you can Group in Wow. But there is no point for most of the game, because its so easy to solo. Solo Friendly is Honestly the worst thing to happen to MMO's. Sure there should be a few easy games like WOW, But the Retarted numbers of them beeing made for solo people is Disgusting.
And NO. You cannot make a game Solo and Group friendly... Unless its Diffrent areas/Zones. Both cannot Exist next to each other because there would be no point for people in Groups, Or it would screw the Solo people because they would just Agrro all the good/ Quest/ High value Mobs and leave you nothing, or the crap thats Either to hard to kill so isent good Exp/hour, Or isent worth killing because its a gnat.
So while I guess in a Zone game you could make it Zone "A" is Solo, Zone "B" is Group, they can NEVER exist peacefully in the same area. Lots of MMO's to Prove this point.
All indications are that Guildleves are what they want you to use to "level" in FFXIV and that they'll scale with party size. So you certainly can do both (hmph, sometimes I think I'm the only one who reads what the Devs are saying about the game).
FFXI had on 500k population few years ago even if the game comes after wow's expansion I'm 90% sure those that enjoyed FFXI will give it a try plus there's those that want to try new mmos because are bored of the one they are playing. So in other words nothing to worry about.
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
From what I can tell the game will be "solo friendly" but also be group friendly. So you can do things whichever way you want them. Very different from a lot of other games where doing things in a group can be punished (like WoW, for instance).
Lol the Problem is you can Group in Wow. But there is no point for most of the game, because its so easy to solo. Solo Friendly is Honestly the worst thing to happen to MMO's. Sure there should be a few easy games like WOW, But the Retarted numbers of them beeing made for solo people is Disgusting.
And NO. You cannot make a game Solo and Group friendly... Unless its Diffrent areas/Zones. Both cannot Exist next to each other because there would be no point for people in Groups, Or it would screw the Solo people because they would just Agrro all the good/ Quest/ High value Mobs and leave you nothing, or the crap thats Either to hard to kill so isent good Exp/hour, Or isent worth killing because its a gnat.
So while I guess in a Zone game you could make it Zone "A" is Solo, Zone "B" is Group, they can NEVER exist peacefully in the same area. Lots of MMO's to Prove this point.
All indications are that Guildleves are what they want you to use to "level" in FFXIV and that they'll scale with party size. So you certainly can do both (hmph, sometimes I think I'm the only one who reads what the Devs are saying about the game).
And you missed the point of my post Entirely....
If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude; greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen. Samuel Adams
FFXI had on 500k population few years ago even if the game comes after wow's expansion I'm 90% sure those that enjoyed FFXI will give it a try plus there's those that want to try new mmos because are bored of the one they are playing. So in other words nothing to worry about.
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
From what I can tell the game will be "solo friendly" but also be group friendly. So you can do things whichever way you want them. Very different from a lot of other games where doing things in a group can be punished (like WoW, for instance).
Lol the Problem is you can Group in Wow. But there is no point for most of the game, because its so easy to solo. Solo Friendly is Honestly the worst thing to happen to MMO's. Sure there should be a few easy games like WOW, But the Retarted numbers of them beeing made for solo people is Disgusting.
And NO. You cannot make a game Solo and Group friendly... Unless its Diffrent areas/Zones. Both cannot Exist next to each other because there would be no point for people in Groups, Or it would screw the Solo people because they would just Agrro all the good/ Quest/ High value Mobs and leave you nothing, or the crap thats Either to hard to kill so isent good Exp/hour, Or isent worth killing because its a gnat.
So while I guess in a Zone game you could make it Zone "A" is Solo, Zone "B" is Group, they can NEVER exist peacefully in the same area. Lots of MMO's to Prove this point.
All indications are that Guildleves are what they want you to use to "level" in FFXIV and that they'll scale with party size. So you certainly can do both (hmph, sometimes I think I'm the only one who reads what the Devs are saying about the game).
And you missed the point of my post Entirely....
Did I miss the part where you mentioned how the Devs said Guildleves scale? Or the part where you mentioned the Guidleves are kinda like instanced content? Or the part where you realized that if enemies dynamically spawn for your party size then your concerns become moot?
I didn't realize I had to connect all the dots for you.
What your saying about how you cant have both is untrue. You cant have it perfectly balanced, wich is true, but this game will lean more one way then the other.
To have quests built for both and have soloing take longer, making you fight weaker mobs then a group would, and get generaly alot less per hour then a group. you need to make grouping not be a demand, but the most efficent and a hell of alot quicker way to level.
honestly i have faith that SE wont make this a solo EZ-fest, they said they wanted to appeal to the FFXI crowd first, wich would obvoiusly mean they want group play to be the main selling point.
FFXI had on 500k population few years ago even if the game comes after wow's expansion I'm 90% sure those that enjoyed FFXI will give it a try plus there's those that want to try new mmos because are bored of the one they are playing. So in other words nothing to worry about.
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
From what I can tell the game will be "solo friendly" but also be group friendly. So you can do things whichever way you want them. Very different from a lot of other games where doing things in a group can be punished (like WoW, for instance).
Lol the Problem is you can Group in Wow. But there is no point for most of the game, because its so easy to solo. Solo Friendly is Honestly the worst thing to happen to MMO's. Sure there should be a few easy games like WOW, But the Retarted numbers of them beeing made for solo people is Disgusting.
And NO. You cannot make a game Solo and Group friendly... Unless its Diffrent areas/Zones. Both cannot Exist next to each other because there would be no point for people in Groups, Or it would screw the Solo people because they would just Agrro all the good/ Quest/ High value Mobs and leave you nothing, or the crap thats Either to hard to kill so isent good Exp/hour, Or isent worth killing because its a gnat.
So while I guess in a Zone game you could make it Zone "A" is Solo, Zone "B" is Group, they can NEVER exist peacefully in the same area. Lots of MMO's to Prove this point.
All indications are that Guildleves are what they want you to use to "level" in FFXIV and that they'll scale with party size. So you certainly can do both (hmph, sometimes I think I'm the only one who reads what the Devs are saying about the game).
I think its hilarious that you think you can understand what SE is currently saying about the game.
Personally I do not know why they bother saying half the stuff they say. It is often contradictory or extremely vague... So yah Drachasor, maybe you are the only one listening because everyone else has the common sense to stop listening when the words are no longer comprehensible.
"All indications"- the amount of times you have posted on these boards with your complete faith that the simple and vague statements SE has made about their game somehow back up your beliefs and opnions is mad ...If I had a penny for each time I'd be able to buy SE and make sure FF14 the true succesor to the original FF11.
We know next to nothing from what SE has said. Economics is a much better tool, I think, to use to dicern what SE might do with FF14. And right now Blizzard is writing the Economics books... so it is far safer to say that SE is readind and rereading that book with the intent to use what they learn in FF14, then to try and decipher the words of SE's PR and make claims or opinions based on those translations... Might as well take up learning Ancient Greek and put all that effort to productive use.
I think its hilarious that you think you can understand what SE is currently saying about the game.
Personally I do not know why they bother saying half the stuff they say. It is often contradictory or extremely vague... So yah Drachasor, maybe you are the only one listening because everyone else has the common sense to stop listening when the words are no longer comprehensible.
"All indications"- the amount of times you have posted on these boards with your complete faith that the simple and vague statements SE has made about their game somehow back up your beliefs and opnions is mad ...If I had a penny for each time I'd be able to buy SE and make sure FF14 the true succesor to the original FF11.
We know next to nothing from what SE has said. Economics is a much better tool, I think, to use to dicern what SE might do with FF14. And right now Blizzard is writing the Economics books... so it is far safer to say that SE is readind and rereading that book with the intent to use what they learn in FF14, then to try and decipher the words of SE's PR and make claims or opinions based on those translations... Might as well take up learning Ancient Greek and put all that effort to productive use.
My condolences to you, but I've found what they've said to be completely coherent and not at all contradictory. As it happens, no one on these boards has ever shown my interpretation to be false. If things are so contradictory, then I am sure you can find a SE quote that disagrees with what I am saying. Heck, I'll make it easy for you, just find me some contradictory stuff they've said and post it here with links.
To sit there and say SE is completely BSing us and that FF14 is gunna be another WoW type game is pointless. They said it from the beggining that they want to appeal to their already VERY steady 500k subs FF11 crowd FIRST (wich means they wouldnt make it like WoW or a giant solo fest, becuase FF11 is a completely diffrent game. Of course they are gunna add more solo stuff and make some stuff easyer, but hell i played FF11 for 4 years, and i can see why they are doing it, i actually dont mind that they are toning it down a little.
This is SE's second MMO and they relize if they keep the game close to what FF11 was then they are garunteed to have 7+years of very steady income....why would they want to mess that up? For now dont expect the game to turn out one way or the other, until beta we have almost NO idea how its going to be. Once beta rolls around, then sling the mud if you want, for now its all speculation.
This is SE's second MMO and they relize if they keep the game close to what FF11 was then they are garunteed to have 7+years of very steady income....why would they want to mess that up? For now dont expect the game to turn out one way or the other, until beta we have almost NO idea how its going to be. Once beta rolls around, then sling the mud if you want, for now its all speculation.
There are some indications, but nothing specific on the combat system. They've said they don't want a Tank-Healer-DPS system, and they want the combat to go slower and be more tactical. They want to make positioning important in the game. Beyond that we don't have a lot of detail.
There's more information on Guildleves, but still some significant gaps. We know you can do things with groups or solo using them. They are customized quests, essentially, you can make them more difficult if you want. Doing it with a group with people who don't have the exact same custom Guildleve is a goal of the design. They are kind of like instanced content (but we don't know if they are exactly instanced, or just sorta instanced in some kind of fashion). That's a decent amount of detail, but obviously there are significant gaps on the exact implementation.
Now I suppose we could assume half or more of this information won't be true, and that their stated goals aren't actual goals they are committed to, but that seems rather silly to me. From what I recollect, SE doesn't typically make wild statements about what it is doing like some MMOs, so I think they are more trustworthy than most.
Ah, how interesting indeed. Thought about this post for about an hour while doing laundry today.
Blizzard has been known to release their content in sync with other competition's releases. It absolutely is the battered girlfriend syndrome. Funnier still, is that they know this. If their game ran no risk of losing to competition, then their schedule would be dictated internally, not by the external market.
But Blizzard's game model is very much tired and has been struggling more and more as time progresses. The concept of obsoleting old content, old gear- giving a 'fresh reset' each and every patch has resulted in them burning out their own turnover rate. We know 3.3 is to be released very shortly due to current subscriber's reporting background dl's taking place. Typically this means a 2 week window until it's live. Give or take a couple weeks depending on how long they wish to stretch out their pacing, and we'd see at least by this holiday.
3.3 is the last biggest update in the game. Historically, the biggest subscriber drop-off rates happen between last patch updates and xpac releases. I recently read an article that a lot of die-hard WC universe fans might embrace and understand a bit better than fanbois or recent MMO goers:
Despite the obvious bias against Blizzard's WoW marketing engine that has taken over the franchise, it does examine a very, very valid issue at stake: once Arthas is downed, what else is truly left? Even Deathwing in Cata, despite being obviously a bigger baddie, does not hold nearly as much lore praise as Arthas.
The article also examines how Blizzard has been so keen at drawing out content and pacing its subscriber base. Couple this with 'everyone given everything' via the zone-wide compounding buff for the zone (and the historical Sunwell Isle buff in BC, free r14 gear in classic), and you're really looking at a content patch that Blizzard aims to drag on for a time.
But what counters this? Knowledge that the xpac is coming. Everyone knows that there will be a complete gear/level reset in a couple months. Even the most vain of WoW players will recognize the lack of necessity to 'earn' (a term used very lightly) any gear or accomplishments, because we historically know that it will all be more meaningless still than what current patch updates do to current gear itemization.
Oh, and there will be those content to play around with old concepts via 'new mechanics' such as cross-realm pve instancing and the like. But something tells me what brings people to the game is going to be what offers the most immersion, and that means accounting for things that hold interest: storyline, newness, advancement.
Oh, and Arthas. Once he's dead, we've reached an end of the road for many, many WC players.
What does this mean for FFXIV? It means they have all the time in the world. I hope I can subjectively state that the FF demographic has a strong enough following of its own in the western market that whatever else is going on will be placed to the side to scoop up the latest in this franchise's offerings. Offering an eastern demographic would compound this statement.
Blizzard will be forced to maintain interest. Achievements won't cut it, and this Blizzard is very much aware of. Drag out the 3.3/CATA releases too long, and you lose people to the drop-off sector between patch and xpac. Drop the titles too close to one another, and the 'newness' of CATA burns off that much quicker.
FF has a history of making complete games... for over 13 installments, depending on if we want to count spin-offs or not. There's nothing to suggest their 14th installment will bomb. To the contrary, we know they're examining a break from current cookie-cutter approaches to the MMO genre. It looks like a breath of fresh air to arrive in the fantasy MMO department has finally arrived.
My hope? They take their time with release. It's not theirs to worry about the timing of their product release. It's Blizzard's.
I hope they take their sweet time and make their game everything and more that it's hyped up to be. Stalling only furthers their hype, and makes the 'competition' sweat.
Edit: Vocab.
That is exactly right, and we're not saying NO to save WoW, because it is already a lost cause. We are saying NO to dissuade the next group of greedy suits who decide to emulate Blizzard and Cryptic, etc. We can prevent some of the future games from spewing this crap, but the sooner we start saying no, the better the results will be. So - Stand up, pull up your pants, and walk away. - MMO_Doubter
Ah, how interesting indeed. Thought about this post for about an hour while doing laundry today. Blizzard has been known to release their content in sync with other competition's releases. It absolutely is the battered girlfriend syndrome. Funnier still, is that they know this. If their game ran no risk of losing to competition, then their schedule would be dictated internally, not by the external market. But Blizzard's game model is very much tired and has been struggling more and more as time progresses. The concept of obsoleting old content, old gear- giving a 'fresh reset' each and every patch has resulted in them burning out their own turnover rate. We know 3.3 is to be released very shortly due to current subscriber's reporting background dl's taking place. Typically this means a 2 week window until it's live. Give or take a couple weeks depending on how long they wish to stretch out their pacing, and we'd see at least by this holiday. 3.3 is the last biggest update in the game. Historically, the biggest subscriber drop-off rates happen between last patch updates and xpac releases. I recently read an article that a lot of die-hard WC universe fans might embrace and understand a bit better than fanbois or recent MMO goers: http://wowriot.gameriot.com/blogs/Fives-the-Paladin-Hates-the-Blues/Six-Words-that-Terrify-Blizzard Despite the obvious bias against Blizzard's WoW marketing engine that has taken over the franchise, it does examine a very, very valid issue at stake: once Arthas is downed, what else is truly left? Even Deathwing in Cata, despite being obviously a bigger baddie, does not hold nearly as much lore praise as Arthas. The article also examines how Blizzard has been so keen at drawing out content and pacing its subscriber base. Couple this with 'everyone given everything' via the zone-wide compounding buff for the zone (and the historical Sunwell Isle buff in BC, free r14 gear in classic), and you're really looking at a content patch that Blizzard aims to drag on for a time.
But what counters this? Knowledge that the xpac is coming. Everyone knows that there will be a complete gear/level reset in a couple months. Even the most vain of WoW players will recognize the lack of necessity to 'earn' (a term used very lightly) any gear or accomplishments, because we historically know that it will all be more meaningless still than what current patch updates do to current gear itemization. Oh, and there will be those content to play around with old concepts via 'new mechanics' such as cross-realm pve instancing and the like. But something tells me what brings people to the game is going to be what offers the most immersion, and that means accounting for things that hold interest: storyline, newness, advancement. Oh, and Arthas. Once he's dead, we've reached an end of the road for many, many WC players.
What does this mean for FFXIV? It means they have all the time in the world. I hope I can subjectively state that the FF demographic has a strong enough following of its own in the western market that whatever else is going on will be placed to the side to scoop up the latest in this franchise's offerings. Offering an eastern demographic would compound this statement. Blizzard will be forced to maintain interest. Achievements won't cut it, and this Blizzard is very much aware of. Drag out the 3.3/CATA releases too long, and you lose people to the drop-off sector between patch and xpac. Drop the titles too close to one another, and the 'newness' of CATA burns off that much quicker. FF has a history of making complete games... for over 13 installments, depending on if we want to count spin-offs or not. There's nothing to suggest their 14th installment will bomb. To the contrary, we know they're examining a break from current cookie-cutter approaches to the MMO genre. It looks like a breath of fresh air to arrive in the fantasy MMO department has finally arrived. My hope? They take their time with release. It's not theirs to worry about the timing of their product release. It's Blizzard's. I hope they take their sweet time and make their game everything and more that it's hyped up to be. Stalling only furthers their hype, and makes the 'competition' sweat. Edit: Vocab.
2 totally disjointed discussions.
WoW is bad b/c the end results are endless, gear this week will be obsolete months later. Blah Blah Blah. The goal I scored today in a football match with friends this afternoon will be forgotten next week when Pete shoots a better lop over the goalkeeper, so all football match is meaningless? Oh really? You play for some permanent end results that you can boast and maintain forever, or you just play for fun during the hours online?
Fuck it, who cares what gear will be available 6 months down the road? I play b/c I want to log on now, and forget it when I log out. I hardly need to write a long dissertation expression deep sorrow and remorse b/c the gear I won tonight with /roll becomes not the best gear next week. So what? Does it make the game today less enjoyable. Assuming suddenly I hear that Blizz is delaying its big patch for a month, will I be happier this month b/c my gear remains what? Best now?
I do not enjoy games that way. I play for the hour today and forget it after I log out. I think about WoW only after a days's work and have idle time to kill, not booked by RL BBQs or ball games elsewhere, or a visit to my sister's 4 year old. When I log out, all is forgotten, no worries about what new loot will be available next week. Worry about it next time I log on, there are enough things to worry today after WoW. Enough RL things to worry after the hour or two online.
As for how the dissing of WoW suddenly translated to FF having all time on earth, I failed to see. FF is a good game. If you can put in the time and effort to find groups, old FF does have a lot of its own gaming elements to deliver. It is not my game, though. I have difficulties putting up that much time consistently.
Not really, Wowtards don't like FF11 usually because you actually have to work for your stuff and you can't do most of the game alone. I just hope they don't wowafiy FF14 too much I like how FF11 requires some skill in combat (you can really tell an idiot fast in a exp party) I like the games community, its why I might be playing it again. Lets be honest here, I doubt any other mmorpg will get as many subs as Ezmode wow. For them to even try to compete sub wise is stupid, Mind you there are some free to play mmorpg's out there that are imo better than WoW gameplay wise. I just wish game devs would stop copying wow's gameplay and mechanics and make something orignal or at least try. Alganon, Runes of Magic, Allods all are YAWC (Yet Another Wow Clone). I think they just see wow's success and go "Well that works lets copy the papa monkey for our game!" <-- this is what I hope SE doesn't do with FF14, if they do I'll be very dissapointed. I already plan to pre-order ff14. I just hope they do a internation release insted of giving it to the rest of the world a year later. Which then pisses off the japanese players when we get caught up to them in 25% of the time it took them to get there. Stuff it took them a year to do in FF11 when the US ver came out we were at the same point after 2-3 months. On my server I was one of the first level 50 North American players on my server. When it first came out. Damn Limit break 1 took me near a week to do, bad drop rates -_-, its lot better now they upped the drop rates substantally for those items.
Also as someone said, FF11/14 cater more to the hardcore mmorpg player, insted of the ezmode wanting casuals, People who want more of a challenge out of their game should go with ff11/14 IMO.
Not really, self proclaimed elitist tards like you failed to realise that games are enjoyed by each person in his own way. Your view and your way of enjoying a game is your own private business, and that does not make you any superior than anyone else. Your disgusting attitude does make you a very disgusting element of any games, so much so that you will not be welcome by most mature people, who understand that differences can be discussed but must be respected.
Challenge in a game? When a programmer put in a lower % on drop rates, or design levelling paths that need to be done with groups, that is challenge? NO that is just digital illusion. Play a game that requires 20 years to level does not = challenge, it just means time sink. Play a game in which there are a lot of things to do, and enough of them fun to me, is gaming. I care not what level I am or what max path it is leading to. I worry about that when I hit max.
Reread the title of the thread. It's comparing the release of 2 major titles and their scheduling. The discussion is entirely related. If you missed this, I really don't know what else to say that might provide clarification.
WoW is bad b/c the end results are endless, gear this week will be obsolete months later. Blah Blah Blah. The goal I scored today in a football match with friends this afternoon will be forgotten next week when Pete shoots a better lop over the goalkeeper, so all football match is meaningless? Oh really? You play for some permanent end results that you can boast and maintain forever, or you just play for fun during the hours online?
I'm not examining anything that I personally do. I'm examining a game in its current state, and what they game does, needs to do, etc in order to maintain its cash flow- by the standards the devs themselves use. There are flaws to their system, like it or not, and this patch will be the end of the line for many, due to the culmination of WC lore. Others will continue to play, and that's great for them.
Fuck it, who cares what gear will be available 6 months down the road? I play b/c I want to log on now, and forget it when I log out. I hardly need to write a long dissertation expression deep sorrow and remorse b/c the gear I won tonight with /roll becomes not the best gear next week. So what? Does it make the game today less enjoyable. Assuming suddenly I hear that Blizz is delaying its big patch for a month, will I be happier this month b/c my gear remains what? Best now?
Your tone throughout your recent posts on these forums is one of increasing hostility I've noticed. No need for excessive language, eh? We're all adults here, not emotional teenagers right? How *you* choose to play is your deal. I examine the strong-arm approach that Blizzard uses when releasing new content, limiting its gaming base, of which undoubtedly many old school WC fans are tired of. It's not about the gear, if you failed to read between the lines- it's about the content and its limiting factor. Once we establish that basis we move onto the gear and how the vanity that has consumed the game is an uphill battle the devs will need to combat as well.
I do not enjoy games that way. I play for the hour today and forget it after I log out. I think about WoW only after a days's work and have idle time to kill, not booked by RL BBQs or ball games elsewhere, or a visit to my sister's 4 year old. When I log out, all is forgotten, no worries about what new loot will be available next week. Worry about it next time I log on, there are enough things to worry today after WoW. Enough RL things to worry after the hour or two online.
More people should embrace games your way apparently. Sadly, you aren't the masses who historically quit after they've gotten their fix for a patch's duration, then resub the week prior to an xpac's release. We've all seen the queue timers across all realms. There's no denying this one.
As for how the dissing of WoW suddenly translated to FF having all time on earth, I failed to see. FF is a good game. If you can put in the time and effort to find groups, old FF does have a lot of its own gaming elements to deliver. It is not my game, though. I have difficulties putting up that much time consistently.
It's unfortunate that someone like yourself fails to sift through remarks simply because they're 'biased'. The disses examined might sometimes be founded... ironic wouldn't that be? You like WoW- good for you. It's more your style than FF- good for you. This changes nothing to the fact that WoW's is a battle that struggles to maintain subs, whereas FF has the 'advantage' of not being released yet. Assuming, of course, both games are competing for the same demographic(s)- of which there is presumably only minor overlap- each has their own cult following. (There, I summed it up in 2 sentences for you.)
Again, the essence of both the OP and my post. Imagine that.
Edit: After reading the post you managed to make to another individual following mine, I figured it might be best to quote it back to you, *ironically*, immediately after you offered your 'two cents' about personal involvement with video games. It fits your bill almost to a T. Only fitting it comes from your own hand.
Not really, self proclaimed elitist tards like you failed to realise that games are enjoyed by each person in his own way. Your view and your way of enjoying a game is your own private business, and that does not make you any superior than anyone else. Your disgusting attitude does make you a very disgusting element of any games, so much so that you will not be welcome by most mature people, who understand that differences can be discussed but must be respected.
That is exactly right, and we're not saying NO to save WoW, because it is already a lost cause. We are saying NO to dissuade the next group of greedy suits who decide to emulate Blizzard and Cryptic, etc. We can prevent some of the future games from spewing this crap, but the sooner we start saying no, the better the results will be. So - Stand up, pull up your pants, and walk away. - MMO_Doubter
Honestly, FFXI vets are exactly who SE doesn't need to attract to their game. MMORPG sequels are so hard to pull off due to the pre-existing assumptions that vets of the original game will have for the new game. Just look at the utter contempt that many AC1 fans still have for AC2 (years after the game's shutdown).
MMORPG sequels are generally only sequels by name and perhaps some content. Historically, any sequel has been very dissimilar to the original game. If you think that FFXIV is going to be anything like FFXI, you're probably in for a letdown. XIV will most likely be an extremely different game than the original. The sooner you realize that, the better off everyone will be.
Just look at some of the posts in this very thread. There are a few that border on making demands about what the game "should" be or who the game should attract.
FFXIV will not have a minor impact on WoW. I dare say that a good majority of WoW players have not heard of FFXIV, nor do they even care. So many WoW players were mmorpg virgins when they started to play WoW, and they will continue to play WoW or leave the genre.
SE should release FFXIV when it's ready. Other mmorpgs be damned is what I'd say. Hell, look at the multitude of complete failures that the mmorpg genre has witnessed over the past few years. The only games with moderate success post WoW are LotRO and Aion. Everything else has been unfinished, bug ridden piles of filth. Honestly, the crap that has been released used to be industry standard, and the player's standards have risen. SE should take the time they need and make a quality AAA game.
Let FFXIV stand on it's own merits and judge it for the game that it is and not some preconceived notion of what you want it to be.
Square Enix (I still call them SquareSoft) has a long history of very good, polished working games. I believe they wouldn't care about other companies and their releases, not only WoW, but say a WAR Major update or Aion next major content patch, or Age of Conan expansion, Darkfall expansion, doesn't matter. They will release the game when they feel it has been fully tweaked, polished and has the high standard the company is known for.
Personally I favor the Kingdom Hearts series and can't wait for KH3. But looks like they have Final Fantasy more on their sight atm.
WoW must really be starting to get desperate, I mean Mr. T mo-hawk grenades? seriously? FFXIV should be just fine as long as SE does what they do best. It doesnt matter what mmo is releasing or what expansion is coming out.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore) Now Playing: N/A Worst MMO: FFXIV Favorite MMO: FFXI
Comments
With the new FF game I recommend allowing players to use time cards if you want to get everyone in the game. Some of us still prefer to not use them and some of us just plain can't get one and yes the really should try to beat Blizzard by getting this out before Cataclysm as they may gain some people. In fact players that are behind with WOW and feel they are not where they want to be in the game might jump ship to the new FF.
Money is the root of all evil.
IMO WoW players are "NOT" real MMO players, WoW players are the same as console players, people with the instant Glory mind set, I know It sounds harsh but Its true.
I also played WoW for 5 years, but also played AC,Eq1 and all of the old MMOS that made MMOS a World and not a video game, you see WoW came along and took MMOS and made them main steam bring with them main stream gamers and by doing so ruined the mmo market making game dev. jump on the banwagon to make a fast buck, the old school MMO games made MMO Worlds for roleplayers where everyhing was a time sink and earned (think fantasy life) and though not fun for alot people there where those that loved it, but we know money talks so MMO games took over MMO Worlds with the birth of WoW.
SO let WoW's Cat come, no matter what you do blizzard will be on top and its because they invented the MMO game and to many WoW is that quick fix for the low selfesteamed instant glory junkies, and in todays fast paced world thats what most players want and that is what sells, think about It, most if not 75% of all WoW players today where and are those people that where hooked to AoL chat rooms or facebook games, they want and got there fast fix of entertanment. (LOL omg I set my self up on that remark, O well It's true)
Although WoW invented the MMO game they sure as hell didn't invent the MMO World the real fans love and have been playing sence Mud.
FF14 is one of those MMO Worlds that has its core loyal group just like Eve,EQ, Linage,UO,AC,DaoC to name a few, to me those are the worlds that got us hooked in the first place so who cares if WoW number 1, they should be, after all they made a kick ass video game, but not a MMO World.
FFXI had on 500k population few years ago even if the game comes after wow's expansion I'm 90% sure those that enjoyed FFXI will give it a try plus there's those that want to try new mmos because are bored of the one they are playing.
So in other words nothing to worry about.
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
From what I can tell the game will be "solo friendly" but also be group friendly. So you can do things whichever way you want them. Very different from a lot of other games where doing things in a group can be punished (like WoW, for instance).
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
From what I can tell the game will be "solo friendly" but also be group friendly. So you can do things whichever way you want them. Very different from a lot of other games where doing things in a group can be punished (like WoW, for instance).
Lol the Problem is you can Group in Wow. But there is no point for most of the game, because its so easy to solo. Solo Friendly is Honestly the worst thing to happen to MMO's. Sure there should be a few easy games like WOW, But the Retarted numbers of them beeing made for solo people is Disgusting.
And NO. You cannot make a game Solo and Group friendly... Unless its Diffrent areas/Zones. Both cannot Exist next to each other because there would be no point for people in Groups, Or it would screw the Solo people because they would just Agrro all the good/ Quest/ High value Mobs and leave you nothing, or the crap thats Either to hard to kill so isent good Exp/hour, Or isent worth killing because its a gnat.
So while I guess in a Zone game you could make it Zone "A" is Solo, Zone "B" is Group, they can NEVER exist peacefully in the same area. Lots of MMO's to Prove this point.
If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude; greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.
Samuel Adams
I disagree, so far we have mainly seen games come out before a WoW expansion (I not sure whether to put Aion pre-Cat or Post-WotLK as it was released nearly a year ahead) and the box sales do decent but they can't hold onto a large playerbase (compared to the box sales).
So, I say release a couple of months after cat, people will be getting a bit bored of the content & there will be no hype building regarding another expansion (fan speculation on what it will be next doesn't count). I think 2010 may be the year where we finally see a dent in WoW's subs, not because Blizzard doesn't deserve it but I feel if a story based game becomes successful we may move away from the stasis condition this genra is in.
Not really, Wowtards don't like FF11 usually because you actually have to work for your stuff and you can't do most of the game alone. I just hope they don't wowafiy FF14 too much I like how FF11 requires some skill in combat (you can really tell an idiot fast in a exp party) I like the games community, its why I might be playing it again. Lets be honest here, I doubt any other mmorpg will get as many subs as Ezmode wow. For them to even try to compete sub wise is stupid, Mind you there are some free to play mmorpg's out there that are imo better than WoW gameplay wise. I just wish game devs would stop copying wow's gameplay and mechanics and make something orignal or at least try. Alganon, Runes of Magic, Allods all are YAWC (Yet Another Wow Clone). I think they just see wow's success and go "Well that works lets copy the papa monkey for our game!" <-- this is what I hope SE doesn't do with FF14, if they do I'll be very dissapointed. I already plan to pre-order ff14. I just hope they do a internation release insted of giving it to the rest of the world a year later. Which then pisses off the japanese players when we get caught up to them in 25% of the time it took them to get there. Stuff it took them a year to do in FF11 when the US ver came out we were at the same point after 2-3 months. On my server I was one of the first level 50 North American players on my server. When it first came out. Damn Limit break 1 took me near a week to do, bad drop rates -_-, its lot better now they upped the drop rates substantally for those items.
Also as someone said, FF11/14 cater more to the hardcore mmorpg player, insted of the ezmode wanting casuals, People who want more of a challenge out of their game should go with ff11/14 IMO.
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
From what I can tell the game will be "solo friendly" but also be group friendly. So you can do things whichever way you want them. Very different from a lot of other games where doing things in a group can be punished (like WoW, for instance).
Lol the Problem is you can Group in Wow. But there is no point for most of the game, because its so easy to solo. Solo Friendly is Honestly the worst thing to happen to MMO's. Sure there should be a few easy games like WOW, But the Retarted numbers of them beeing made for solo people is Disgusting.
And NO. You cannot make a game Solo and Group friendly... Unless its Diffrent areas/Zones. Both cannot Exist next to each other because there would be no point for people in Groups, Or it would screw the Solo people because they would just Agrro all the good/ Quest/ High value Mobs and leave you nothing, or the crap thats Either to hard to kill so isent good Exp/hour, Or isent worth killing because its a gnat.
So while I guess in a Zone game you could make it Zone "A" is Solo, Zone "B" is Group, they can NEVER exist peacefully in the same area. Lots of MMO's to Prove this point.
All indications are that Guildleves are what they want you to use to "level" in FFXIV and that they'll scale with party size. So you certainly can do both (hmph, sometimes I think I'm the only one who reads what the Devs are saying about the game).
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
From what I can tell the game will be "solo friendly" but also be group friendly. So you can do things whichever way you want them. Very different from a lot of other games where doing things in a group can be punished (like WoW, for instance).
Lol the Problem is you can Group in Wow. But there is no point for most of the game, because its so easy to solo. Solo Friendly is Honestly the worst thing to happen to MMO's. Sure there should be a few easy games like WOW, But the Retarted numbers of them beeing made for solo people is Disgusting.
And NO. You cannot make a game Solo and Group friendly... Unless its Diffrent areas/Zones. Both cannot Exist next to each other because there would be no point for people in Groups, Or it would screw the Solo people because they would just Agrro all the good/ Quest/ High value Mobs and leave you nothing, or the crap thats Either to hard to kill so isent good Exp/hour, Or isent worth killing because its a gnat.
So while I guess in a Zone game you could make it Zone "A" is Solo, Zone "B" is Group, they can NEVER exist peacefully in the same area. Lots of MMO's to Prove this point.
All indications are that Guildleves are what they want you to use to "level" in FFXIV and that they'll scale with party size. So you certainly can do both (hmph, sometimes I think I'm the only one who reads what the Devs are saying about the game).
And you missed the point of my post Entirely....
If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude; greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.
Samuel Adams
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
From what I can tell the game will be "solo friendly" but also be group friendly. So you can do things whichever way you want them. Very different from a lot of other games where doing things in a group can be punished (like WoW, for instance).
Lol the Problem is you can Group in Wow. But there is no point for most of the game, because its so easy to solo. Solo Friendly is Honestly the worst thing to happen to MMO's. Sure there should be a few easy games like WOW, But the Retarted numbers of them beeing made for solo people is Disgusting.
And NO. You cannot make a game Solo and Group friendly... Unless its Diffrent areas/Zones. Both cannot Exist next to each other because there would be no point for people in Groups, Or it would screw the Solo people because they would just Agrro all the good/ Quest/ High value Mobs and leave you nothing, or the crap thats Either to hard to kill so isent good Exp/hour, Or isent worth killing because its a gnat.
So while I guess in a Zone game you could make it Zone "A" is Solo, Zone "B" is Group, they can NEVER exist peacefully in the same area. Lots of MMO's to Prove this point.
All indications are that Guildleves are what they want you to use to "level" in FFXIV and that they'll scale with party size. So you certainly can do both (hmph, sometimes I think I'm the only one who reads what the Devs are saying about the game).
And you missed the point of my post Entirely....
Did I miss the part where you mentioned how the Devs said Guildleves scale? Or the part where you mentioned the Guidleves are kinda like instanced content? Or the part where you realized that if enemies dynamically spawn for your party size then your concerns become moot?
I didn't realize I had to connect all the dots for you.
What your saying about how you cant have both is untrue. You cant have it perfectly balanced, wich is true, but this game will lean more one way then the other.
To have quests built for both and have soloing take longer, making you fight weaker mobs then a group would, and get generaly alot less per hour then a group. you need to make grouping not be a demand, but the most efficent and a hell of alot quicker way to level.
honestly i have faith that SE wont make this a solo EZ-fest, they said they wanted to appeal to the FFXI crowd first, wich would obvoiusly mean they want group play to be the main selling point.
As a FFXI vet I will give this game a go but if it leans far to the casual play no dice I wont keep playing and will just give up MMO's since all games now lean solo play which is no fun at all.
I would love to see this game released before Cataclysm because well there really is nothing on the MMO market worth playing I will be playing APB as long as they don't go the RMT route which from what I seen game play wise should keep me entertained for awhile. Might have to get back into FFXI again shortly been on break for a few months.
From what I can tell the game will be "solo friendly" but also be group friendly. So you can do things whichever way you want them. Very different from a lot of other games where doing things in a group can be punished (like WoW, for instance).
Lol the Problem is you can Group in Wow. But there is no point for most of the game, because its so easy to solo. Solo Friendly is Honestly the worst thing to happen to MMO's. Sure there should be a few easy games like WOW, But the Retarted numbers of them beeing made for solo people is Disgusting.
And NO. You cannot make a game Solo and Group friendly... Unless its Diffrent areas/Zones. Both cannot Exist next to each other because there would be no point for people in Groups, Or it would screw the Solo people because they would just Agrro all the good/ Quest/ High value Mobs and leave you nothing, or the crap thats Either to hard to kill so isent good Exp/hour, Or isent worth killing because its a gnat.
So while I guess in a Zone game you could make it Zone "A" is Solo, Zone "B" is Group, they can NEVER exist peacefully in the same area. Lots of MMO's to Prove this point.
All indications are that Guildleves are what they want you to use to "level" in FFXIV and that they'll scale with party size. So you certainly can do both (hmph, sometimes I think I'm the only one who reads what the Devs are saying about the game).
I think its hilarious that you think you can understand what SE is currently saying about the game.
Personally I do not know why they bother saying half the stuff they say. It is often contradictory or extremely vague... So yah Drachasor, maybe you are the only one listening because everyone else has the common sense to stop listening when the words are no longer comprehensible.
"All indications"- the amount of times you have posted on these boards with your complete faith that the simple and vague statements SE has made about their game somehow back up your beliefs and opnions is mad ...If I had a penny for each time I'd be able to buy SE and make sure FF14 the true succesor to the original FF11.
We know next to nothing from what SE has said. Economics is a much better tool, I think, to use to dicern what SE might do with FF14. And right now Blizzard is writing the Economics books... so it is far safer to say that SE is readind and rereading that book with the intent to use what they learn in FF14, then to try and decipher the words of SE's PR and make claims or opinions based on those translations... Might as well take up learning Ancient Greek and put all that effort to productive use.
WOOT
www.eorzeapedia.com
(Great FF14 source)
My condolences to you, but I've found what they've said to be completely coherent and not at all contradictory. As it happens, no one on these boards has ever shown my interpretation to be false. If things are so contradictory, then I am sure you can find a SE quote that disagrees with what I am saying. Heck, I'll make it easy for you, just find me some contradictory stuff they've said and post it here with links.
To sit there and say SE is completely BSing us and that FF14 is gunna be another WoW type game is pointless. They said it from the beggining that they want to appeal to their already VERY steady 500k subs FF11 crowd FIRST (wich means they wouldnt make it like WoW or a giant solo fest, becuase FF11 is a completely diffrent game. Of course they are gunna add more solo stuff and make some stuff easyer, but hell i played FF11 for 4 years, and i can see why they are doing it, i actually dont mind that they are toning it down a little.
This is SE's second MMO and they relize if they keep the game close to what FF11 was then they are garunteed to have 7+years of very steady income....why would they want to mess that up? For now dont expect the game to turn out one way or the other, until beta we have almost NO idea how its going to be. Once beta rolls around, then sling the mud if you want, for now its all speculation.
There are some indications, but nothing specific on the combat system. They've said they don't want a Tank-Healer-DPS system, and they want the combat to go slower and be more tactical. They want to make positioning important in the game. Beyond that we don't have a lot of detail.
There's more information on Guildleves, but still some significant gaps. We know you can do things with groups or solo using them. They are customized quests, essentially, you can make them more difficult if you want. Doing it with a group with people who don't have the exact same custom Guildleve is a goal of the design. They are kind of like instanced content (but we don't know if they are exactly instanced, or just sorta instanced in some kind of fashion). That's a decent amount of detail, but obviously there are significant gaps on the exact implementation.
Now I suppose we could assume half or more of this information won't be true, and that their stated goals aren't actual goals they are committed to, but that seems rather silly to me. From what I recollect, SE doesn't typically make wild statements about what it is doing like some MMOs, so I think they are more trustworthy than most.
Ah, how interesting indeed. Thought about this post for about an hour while doing laundry today.
Blizzard has been known to release their content in sync with other competition's releases. It absolutely is the battered girlfriend syndrome. Funnier still, is that they know this. If their game ran no risk of losing to competition, then their schedule would be dictated internally, not by the external market.
But Blizzard's game model is very much tired and has been struggling more and more as time progresses. The concept of obsoleting old content, old gear- giving a 'fresh reset' each and every patch has resulted in them burning out their own turnover rate. We know 3.3 is to be released very shortly due to current subscriber's reporting background dl's taking place. Typically this means a 2 week window until it's live. Give or take a couple weeks depending on how long they wish to stretch out their pacing, and we'd see at least by this holiday.
3.3 is the last biggest update in the game. Historically, the biggest subscriber drop-off rates happen between last patch updates and xpac releases. I recently read an article that a lot of die-hard WC universe fans might embrace and understand a bit better than fanbois or recent MMO goers:
http://wowriot.gameriot.com/blogs/Fives-the-Paladin-Hates-the-Blues/Six-Words-that-Terrify-Blizzard
Despite the obvious bias against Blizzard's WoW marketing engine that has taken over the franchise, it does examine a very, very valid issue at stake: once Arthas is downed, what else is truly left? Even Deathwing in Cata, despite being obviously a bigger baddie, does not hold nearly as much lore praise as Arthas.
The article also examines how Blizzard has been so keen at drawing out content and pacing its subscriber base. Couple this with 'everyone given everything' via the zone-wide compounding buff for the zone (and the historical Sunwell Isle buff in BC, free r14 gear in classic), and you're really looking at a content patch that Blizzard aims to drag on for a time.
But what counters this? Knowledge that the xpac is coming. Everyone knows that there will be a complete gear/level reset in a couple months. Even the most vain of WoW players will recognize the lack of necessity to 'earn' (a term used very lightly) any gear or accomplishments, because we historically know that it will all be more meaningless still than what current patch updates do to current gear itemization.
Oh, and there will be those content to play around with old concepts via 'new mechanics' such as cross-realm pve instancing and the like. But something tells me what brings people to the game is going to be what offers the most immersion, and that means accounting for things that hold interest: storyline, newness, advancement.
Oh, and Arthas. Once he's dead, we've reached an end of the road for many, many WC players.
What does this mean for FFXIV? It means they have all the time in the world. I hope I can subjectively state that the FF demographic has a strong enough following of its own in the western market that whatever else is going on will be placed to the side to scoop up the latest in this franchise's offerings. Offering an eastern demographic would compound this statement.
Blizzard will be forced to maintain interest. Achievements won't cut it, and this Blizzard is very much aware of. Drag out the 3.3/CATA releases too long, and you lose people to the drop-off sector between patch and xpac. Drop the titles too close to one another, and the 'newness' of CATA burns off that much quicker.
FF has a history of making complete games... for over 13 installments, depending on if we want to count spin-offs or not. There's nothing to suggest their 14th installment will bomb. To the contrary, we know they're examining a break from current cookie-cutter approaches to the MMO genre. It looks like a breath of fresh air to arrive in the fantasy MMO department has finally arrived.
My hope? They take their time with release. It's not theirs to worry about the timing of their product release. It's Blizzard's.
I hope they take their sweet time and make their game everything and more that it's hyped up to be. Stalling only furthers their hype, and makes the 'competition' sweat.
Edit: Vocab.
That is exactly right, and we're not saying NO to save WoW, because it is already a lost cause. We are saying NO to dissuade the next group of greedy suits who decide to emulate Blizzard and Cryptic, etc.
We can prevent some of the future games from spewing this crap, but the sooner we start saying no, the better the results will be.
So - Stand up, pull up your pants, and walk away.
- MMO_Doubter
2 totally disjointed discussions.
WoW is bad b/c the end results are endless, gear this week will be obsolete months later. Blah Blah Blah. The goal I scored today in a football match with friends this afternoon will be forgotten next week when Pete shoots a better lop over the goalkeeper, so all football match is meaningless? Oh really? You play for some permanent end results that you can boast and maintain forever, or you just play for fun during the hours online?
Fuck it, who cares what gear will be available 6 months down the road? I play b/c I want to log on now, and forget it when I log out. I hardly need to write a long dissertation expression deep sorrow and remorse b/c the gear I won tonight with /roll becomes not the best gear next week. So what? Does it make the game today less enjoyable. Assuming suddenly I hear that Blizz is delaying its big patch for a month, will I be happier this month b/c my gear remains what? Best now?
I do not enjoy games that way. I play for the hour today and forget it after I log out. I think about WoW only after a days's work and have idle time to kill, not booked by RL BBQs or ball games elsewhere, or a visit to my sister's 4 year old. When I log out, all is forgotten, no worries about what new loot will be available next week. Worry about it next time I log on, there are enough things to worry today after WoW. Enough RL things to worry after the hour or two online.
As for how the dissing of WoW suddenly translated to FF having all time on earth, I failed to see. FF is a good game. If you can put in the time and effort to find groups, old FF does have a lot of its own gaming elements to deliver. It is not my game, though. I have difficulties putting up that much time consistently.
Not really, self proclaimed elitist tards like you failed to realise that games are enjoyed by each person in his own way. Your view and your way of enjoying a game is your own private business, and that does not make you any superior than anyone else. Your disgusting attitude does make you a very disgusting element of any games, so much so that you will not be welcome by most mature people, who understand that differences can be discussed but must be respected.
Challenge in a game? When a programmer put in a lower % on drop rates, or design levelling paths that need to be done with groups, that is challenge? NO that is just digital illusion. Play a game that requires 20 years to level does not = challenge, it just means time sink. Play a game in which there are a lot of things to do, and enough of them fun to me, is gaming. I care not what level I am or what max path it is leading to. I worry about that when I hit max.
/sigh. I'm feeding a troll.
2 totally disjointed discussions.
Reread the title of the thread. It's comparing the release of 2 major titles and their scheduling. The discussion is entirely related. If you missed this, I really don't know what else to say that might provide clarification.
WoW is bad b/c the end results are endless, gear this week will be obsolete months later. Blah Blah Blah. The goal I scored today in a football match with friends this afternoon will be forgotten next week when Pete shoots a better lop over the goalkeeper, so all football match is meaningless? Oh really? You play for some permanent end results that you can boast and maintain forever, or you just play for fun during the hours online?
I'm not examining anything that I personally do. I'm examining a game in its current state, and what they game does, needs to do, etc in order to maintain its cash flow- by the standards the devs themselves use. There are flaws to their system, like it or not, and this patch will be the end of the line for many, due to the culmination of WC lore. Others will continue to play, and that's great for them.
Fuck it, who cares what gear will be available 6 months down the road? I play b/c I want to log on now, and forget it when I log out. I hardly need to write a long dissertation expression deep sorrow and remorse b/c the gear I won tonight with /roll becomes not the best gear next week. So what? Does it make the game today less enjoyable. Assuming suddenly I hear that Blizz is delaying its big patch for a month, will I be happier this month b/c my gear remains what? Best now?
Your tone throughout your recent posts on these forums is one of increasing hostility I've noticed. No need for excessive language, eh? We're all adults here, not emotional teenagers right? How *you* choose to play is your deal. I examine the strong-arm approach that Blizzard uses when releasing new content, limiting its gaming base, of which undoubtedly many old school WC fans are tired of. It's not about the gear, if you failed to read between the lines- it's about the content and its limiting factor. Once we establish that basis we move onto the gear and how the vanity that has consumed the game is an uphill battle the devs will need to combat as well.
I do not enjoy games that way. I play for the hour today and forget it after I log out. I think about WoW only after a days's work and have idle time to kill, not booked by RL BBQs or ball games elsewhere, or a visit to my sister's 4 year old. When I log out, all is forgotten, no worries about what new loot will be available next week. Worry about it next time I log on, there are enough things to worry today after WoW. Enough RL things to worry after the hour or two online.
More people should embrace games your way apparently. Sadly, you aren't the masses who historically quit after they've gotten their fix for a patch's duration, then resub the week prior to an xpac's release. We've all seen the queue timers across all realms. There's no denying this one.
As for how the dissing of WoW suddenly translated to FF having all time on earth, I failed to see. FF is a good game. If you can put in the time and effort to find groups, old FF does have a lot of its own gaming elements to deliver. It is not my game, though. I have difficulties putting up that much time consistently.
It's unfortunate that someone like yourself fails to sift through remarks simply because they're 'biased'. The disses examined might sometimes be founded... ironic wouldn't that be? You like WoW- good for you. It's more your style than FF- good for you. This changes nothing to the fact that WoW's is a battle that struggles to maintain subs, whereas FF has the 'advantage' of not being released yet. Assuming, of course, both games are competing for the same demographic(s)- of which there is presumably only minor overlap- each has their own cult following. (There, I summed it up in 2 sentences for you.)
Again, the essence of both the OP and my post. Imagine that.
Edit: After reading the post you managed to make to another individual following mine, I figured it might be best to quote it back to you, *ironically*, immediately after you offered your 'two cents' about personal involvement with video games. It fits your bill almost to a T. Only fitting it comes from your own hand.
Not really, self proclaimed elitist tards like you failed to realise that games are enjoyed by each person in his own way. Your view and your way of enjoying a game is your own private business, and that does not make you any superior than anyone else. Your disgusting attitude does make you a very disgusting element of any games, so much so that you will not be welcome by most mature people, who understand that differences can be discussed but must be respected.
That is exactly right, and we're not saying NO to save WoW, because it is already a lost cause. We are saying NO to dissuade the next group of greedy suits who decide to emulate Blizzard and Cryptic, etc.
We can prevent some of the future games from spewing this crap, but the sooner we start saying no, the better the results will be.
So - Stand up, pull up your pants, and walk away.
- MMO_Doubter
Honestly, FFXI vets are exactly who SE doesn't need to attract to their game. MMORPG sequels are so hard to pull off due to the pre-existing assumptions that vets of the original game will have for the new game. Just look at the utter contempt that many AC1 fans still have for AC2 (years after the game's shutdown).
MMORPG sequels are generally only sequels by name and perhaps some content. Historically, any sequel has been very dissimilar to the original game. If you think that FFXIV is going to be anything like FFXI, you're probably in for a letdown. XIV will most likely be an extremely different game than the original. The sooner you realize that, the better off everyone will be.
Just look at some of the posts in this very thread. There are a few that border on making demands about what the game "should" be or who the game should attract.
FFXIV will not have a minor impact on WoW. I dare say that a good majority of WoW players have not heard of FFXIV, nor do they even care. So many WoW players were mmorpg virgins when they started to play WoW, and they will continue to play WoW or leave the genre.
SE should release FFXIV when it's ready. Other mmorpgs be damned is what I'd say. Hell, look at the multitude of complete failures that the mmorpg genre has witnessed over the past few years. The only games with moderate success post WoW are LotRO and Aion. Everything else has been unfinished, bug ridden piles of filth. Honestly, the crap that has been released used to be industry standard, and the player's standards have risen. SE should take the time they need and make a quality AAA game.
Let FFXIV stand on it's own merits and judge it for the game that it is and not some preconceived notion of what you want it to be.
Square Enix (I still call them SquareSoft) has a long history of very good, polished working games. I believe they wouldn't care about other companies and their releases, not only WoW, but say a WAR Major update or Aion next major content patch, or Age of Conan expansion, Darkfall expansion, doesn't matter. They will release the game when they feel it has been fully tweaked, polished and has the high standard the company is known for.
Personally I favor the Kingdom Hearts series and can't wait for KH3. But looks like they have Final Fantasy more on their sight atm.
FF is a trite, uncreative, boring, tired, TIRED old videogame franchise. Let it die for God's sake.
WoW must really be starting to get desperate, I mean Mr. T mo-hawk grenades? seriously? FFXIV should be just fine as long as SE does what they do best. It doesnt matter what mmo is releasing or what expansion is coming out.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
Fixed.
Anyway, no reason for SE to be out before Cataclysm. In most cases, those looking forward to FFXIV don't play WoW in the first place.