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General: Player Perspectives Measuring Diversity
Stradden
Managing EditorMember CommonPosts: 6,696
MMORPG.com Columnist Jaime Skelton sets her sights on diversity in online games and whether or not it really makes a difference in the end.
I read an interesting blog post the other day from Emily Taylor, a game designer for EverQuest II, about population ratios. More pointedly, the post talked about the ratio of male to female NPCs in Champions Online, and how female characters seemed highly underrepresented for no discernible purpose. She asks at the end, “I wonder how many other games suffer a similar bias, and nobody's even noticed?”
Curious, I flipped out a pen and paper, and took a run around Dalaran in World of Warcraft. Surely a city of erudite mages in one of the world's most popular MMO would have a fair balance of men and women, correct? After a count of every NPC in both Horde and Alliance areas, as well as the sewers – although I'm sure I missed one or two of the roaming flavor NPCs – the count wasn't entirely disappointing. The NPC population of Dalaran is over 250, and of that, 60% are male, 40% are female. While vendors and service men and women (NPCs like trainers, innkeepers, bankers) were pretty even for the small single city sample, there were more male guards than female (40 to 24). The real number discrepancy came with “flavor” NPCs, the NPCs that are there for quests, to lend story, or simply to add a little life by wandering around the city. For those NPCs, the count was a ridiculous 41 male to 14 female.
Cheers,
Jon Wood
Managing Editor
MMORPG.com
Comments
The splits should really be determined by the world and lore.
If you're a game mimicking medieval days of earth, then there shouldn't be many female guards at all. If you're a game creating a world that is new then you get to say what the political views are of that world.
Also I'd like to point out Asheron's Call for the shades of skin color. Being a game that sports only humans as the playable race (although they mentioned adding some new playable races in the near future). They offer a wide variety of heritages and color. In fact the 3 original races (the 4th one added years ago is blue) are based off of the medieval world and are based on regions that were influencial at the time. So there is the race based on Europe, the one based on Arab, and the one based on Asian cultures. The shade color choices for each race are a wide range as well. And this was one of the original big 3 games.
If I remember correctly UO made it easy to choose any skin color as well.
The really strange thing is that all i see now days in post are the young boys 12 -15 range posting wow that toon is hot this toon is hot, and that was the atempted lure the aoc had was the topless factor.
You would think that mmo's would want more female toons as apposed to male in order to play up to that demegraphic.
Actully I am glad that in some of the MMO's that I play we don't have a lot of that omg look at that toon factor.
While I fully support diversity in real life, I don't necessarily find the need for it in my fantasy life.
I do object to games that force you to play a specific gender for a class though unless of course there is some need based on the storyline for it. An amazon should be female be definition for example.
I certainly don't look at others choices of skin color, but I do find it odd when males select a female avatar when they have a choice. But then again it is a fantasy world and you should be able to live whatever fantasies you want as long as your choices don't insult others.
I find it really odd that you cite males as the majority in wow especially using the blood elves as an example. Even though the night elves are almost wholey female. Not only the npcs but also the players are female. So that alone makes females teh more dominant group in the game.
I've not really played any mmos that have males being the wholey dominant gender as far as npcs goes. Sure some do have men being guards most of the time if it's some traditional fantasy game. But one of the ones that struck me the most was Perfect World. It had ONLY three male npc models. There were three count 'em three males out of the entire home city area. and also out and questing there was maybe 9-10 total. Out of the entire world 9-10 males the rest were female. So i don't know what game you've been playing(obviously wow only) which i'm guessing is why you said how many males there were in it. But most of the games i play have the female npcs as the majority. If there is one. I always find a game and i'm like oh cool they have a class that seems to be pretty fun. So i get into the game and all i see is females, females everywhere. And i'm the only guy of my race. During my play i see like 1-2 other guys the rest are female of my race.
So i highly doubt it's more female npcs than males. Most of the time look at the npc they're trying to portray. Which would be better for the players to see and interact with as far as an npc goes. We're going to make this one a blacksmith who swings a big hammer all the time. A female or male? Well almost everyone could see a man doing that more than a woman. And that's simply b/c of the stereotypes we all are acustomed to.
Look at evil female characters who are bosses. Are they all muscular and swing giant swords? No they use magic most of the time to attack. So having most guards be male doesn't surprise me at all. Also blizzard using most males as guards for blood elves was just them being lazy using the old night elf models. I guess they figured they had to get some use out of them.
All in all, i think the ratios will never be 50/50 as that's now how it is here and it's definately not going to be how designers make it whether they just don't try to or they try and fail.
Maybe on your server the female night elf population far outweighs the male, but I'd venture a guess that your experience is unique or your assertion a bit short-sighted. Certainly it isn't the case on my server, where the night elf population looks to be about 60:40 male:female.
If you want a game with no diversity, go play Modern Warfare 2. >_> The biggest virtual sossagefest I've ever seen. Now some would argue, "realism, military, physical fitness etc." but they would only reinforce my point.
There are a lot of factors that are not mentioned here. As ideal as it might be to have a fantasy world where every group is represented equally, it's not really that sensible. Most fantasy worlds are set in a location resembling Europe, with a very specific climate and weather. The European climate produced white people. It stands to reason that anyone who lived in that sort of place would look like that. A fantasy area based on a grassy savanna, where the temperature is 90+ degrees every day would produce darker people. Skin color and racial distinctions (between humans, that is) are a function of location. In a medieval based world, people can't travel very far, so there really shouldn't be that many non white people in a European castle.
Important facts:
1. Free to Play games are poorly made.
2. Casuals are not all idiots, but idiots call themselves casuals.
3. Great solo and group content are not mutually exclusive, but they suffer when one is shoved into the mold of the other. The same is true of PvP and PvE.
4. Community is more important than you think.
Good points, and you mention two great games that for some reason have been swept under the rug and never looked at as inspiration for newer games for the most part. The occasional indie developer may say they look at UO, but most times the only thing they are really talking about is pre-trammel pvp. They are taking the game in as a whole. Same with AC.
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
Chavez y Chavez
I think once you start going down this road it can only be divisive to the community. We should never lose sight of the fact that we are playing a game, and trying to interject our own political, racial or ethnic biases into a game will only alienate some other group. There is already of bit of social engineering going on in America, which incidentally has ended badly in the past. Do we have to mirror that in our games as well? Perhaps so, but only if it is relevant to the lore of the game.
MMO developers already have enough on their plates. We don't need to saddle them with more when every mmo offering of late seems to offer less.
I think that many people of color are, and should be, put off by the lack of representation of avatars that reflect their heritage and ethnicity. Just because in the west most people who play MMOs are white doesn't mean that concessions shouldn't be made to represent more diversity and support for bringing more people in from outside the dominant group. It is because it is a fantasy world, that the same paradigms that exist in the real world, should be the exception and not the rule. Inclusion never hurts anyone but the bigots who feel threatened by "others".
I don't even believe in Jeebus.
Maybe on your server the female night elf population far outweighs the male, but I'd venture a guess that your experience is unique or your assertion a bit short-sighted. Certainly it isn't the case on my server, where the night elf population looks to be about 60:40 male:female.
not players. We're talking npcs. Actual players can never be nor should ever be counted. You cannot actually expect it to be completely equal. It's mostly female night elf npcs, and also most of the night elves i ever saw as in players were female. The point being that night elves are a more female dominant race. The high elves however, are a more male dominant race which then explains why the blood elves are the way they are. It's just a basic men got fed up and left their little area etc. etc.
In reality every mmo has certain factions/races having more of one gender than the other. It's just how it was/is.
The problem with this article is everyone is perceiving "diversity" in different ways. I could care less about male vs females issues or racial issues (i.e. white skin, dark skin, etc) because in virtual worlds, your visual representation often differs from what you really look like offline. Therefore when people talk about diversity in-game, I'd love for them to talk more about a person's passions and interests, along the lines of Richard Bartle's gamer psychology test (i.e. achiever, explorer, socializer, killer). Even more so, I'd love to see an MMO that truly takes advantage of these different diverse groups to create some really amazing interaction between the people within it.
Games like EVE Online are almost doing this to a degree in that you can specialize your career in exploration, combat, crafting, economics, or even diplomacy. Not only that but you can choose to do it from a PvP or PvE perspective. And best of all, the strongest communities (i.e. corporations in EVE) are those which ensure they include all career aspects as subgroups (or subcultures) within their main community. It's basically similar to how the best RTS games work. No single unit can effectively win the game for you. You need a diverse group of units, working effectively as a team, to overcome your obstacles.
PS. Even with regards to people's behaviors, this has nothing to do with male vs female. I've seen 16 year old males who were extremely mature and 35 year old females who were extremely immature. If you're creating a community, you need to clearly define and communicate the culture of it, so as to attract people of a similar nature. If you don't and just leave it open, people will define it themselves or get frustrated and leave. Most guild conflicts usually occur because of this. People go in expecting or assuming one thing and find out the reality of it is something completely different.
It is indeed interesting that there are any female soldiers at all in SW, if SW is the equivalent of medieval England, where women were not warriors at all. OTOH, there are no male guards at all in Darnassus. IF? Any female guards? I can't think of any. Women as vendors and merchants, bankers and auctioneers, historians, trainers. There ARE female mountaineers in Loch Modan.
"Diversity" is inherent in WoW as far as racial types, and with gender. Lots of female orc grunts in Org and the Barrens.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
I have a very good ( straight) male friend who plays female toons because that is what he wants to look at. He doesn't see his character as an extension of himself, but as a puppet he controls. Maybe it wont seem so odd looking at it that way.
Maybe on your server the female night elf population far outweighs the male, but I'd venture a guess that your experience is unique or your assertion a bit short-sighted. Certainly it isn't the case on my server, where the night elf population looks to be about 60:40 male:female.
I was going to point out the Night Elf has more female NPC's than male. Although on the server I play on there are probably more male players than female or it seems the mix is that way. But if your count was done in pretty much any of the Night Elf cities or towns the female far outweigh the male with NPC's.
However, in playing Atlantica most of the NPC's are male.
{mod edit - go easy on the return key}
Gikku
Why would 'a game with 95% male guards, for instance, [have] questions to answer'? Take a trip to London and visit Buckingham Palace. The Guards are 100% male. That's because evolution has made men to be better - faster and stronger - fighters than women. Almost all the mmorpgs out there are about fighting so, of course, guards tend to be male. Did you wake up and suddenly realise it was two hours to deadline and you still needed to find eight hundred words from somewhere?
tru dat.
Di more you measure, di verse it gets.
Completely disagree here. Some of the best works produced throughout history deal with difficult moral issues or feature difficult moral issues in them. For example, blood feuds between rival families in Romeo and Juliet, works of satire such as the treatment of the Irish by the English that inspired the essay "A Modest Proposal," racial issues in Huckleberry Finn, To Kill a Mockingbird, and others, all the way to films such as American History X, Guess Who's Coming to Dinner, as well as numerous TV shows.
This, I feel, is one huge thing that most (if not all) MMOs are missing nowadays: satire, and the examination and confrontation of moral issues. They are the perfect instruments to convey these messages because they do encompass simulated realities. Examining these issues can be interesting, thought-provoking, and even entertaining. But I guess the modern MMO market is set up for mindless repeated mouse clicks. It's sad that the interactive medium of MMOs can be far less complex and engaging than a static medium like television.
Completely disagree here. Some of the best works produced throughout history deal with difficult moral issues or feature difficult moral issues in them. For example, blood feuds between rival families in Romeo and Juliet, works of satire such as the treatment of the Irish by the English that inspired the essay "A Modest Proposal," racial issues in Huckleberry Finn, To Kill a Mockingbird, and others, all the way to films such as American History X, Guess Who's Coming to Dinner, as well as numerous TV shows.
This, I feel, is one huge thing that most (if not all) MMOs are missing nowadays: satire, and the examination and confrontation of moral issues. They are the perfect instruments to convey these messages because they do encompass simulated realities. Examining these issues can be interesting, thought-provoking, and even entertaining. But I guess the modern MMO market is set up for mindless repeated mouse clicks. It's sad that the interactive medium of MMOs can be far less complex and engaging than a static medium like television.
Meh, just trying to play a game here. RL time is for RL issues, game time is for no issues. And MMOs tend to eliminate the big burning issues by providing anonymity anyways, which is a good thing, as we can all relax and game together without any of the nonsense.
I really don't care about NPC diversity...more naked female NPC's would be nice though.
Also, the current male/female population ratio is not 50:50, it's more like 47:53. Most interestingly, that means there are more boobs than humans on the planet earth.
Sigh we have to put up with all the diversity crap in RL and now someone wants to bring it into the game world? Please please just go away. If you want some form of diversity just make your own MMO and try not to ruin the rest of the gameworld for us. The fact is right now no one knows who is behind any given avatar and that is about as diverse as I want it. In MMO's I dont have to worry about what the other person looks like or what background they come from...I only have to worry about whether or not I get along with them and if they are a good person or not. Lets leave it at that.
Generally, I am used that "my kind" is nonexistend in fiction, by and large. (Meaning gay people, if you really did not follow what I say. ^^). The oh so diverse Star Trek hasn't yet to this day displayed a single gay character. Not that I mind, but it does summon feelings of strangeness now and then. I mean, I am used to the fact some people still feel uneasy having us around and a MMO is a money making entertainment, not an ideal world charity thing. So I guess I can understand how women or maybe black people may feel, since in all too many MMOs and fantasy worlds women or blacks are not really displayed in a good share.
Tolkien has all coloured people as evil southerners and women are all behind the oven as in the "good olde days". I guess that comes with the brand, but one migh wonder if 2009 games should not remedy the prejudices of the past at least a bit.
I vividly recall the large debate about SWTOR, when some Dev said "there is no such thing as gay in Star Wars", or somesuch. I mean, yes, look at Star Wars, or most Sci Fi: the vast majority of the heroes are white, straight males. One alibi woman, one alibi black person, but we are not yet so far to have an alibi gay person, because as everyone knows gay characters in TV die as a rule within the first five minutes anyway.
A fantasy game which went to great length to at least show a gender fairness in the German "The Dark Eye" pen and paper RPG, where even in the class description book the exact ration of genderization is 50/50. But I guess with a fantasy world there still comes some medieval standard of thinking, sometimes.
In a MMO I don't mind so much, since by and large it is what we the players make of it, IF the game allowes that we make it.
I vividly recall the DS9 episode, where all the DS9 crew members where in the 1950ies of Earth, and they all were Sci Fi authors. Sisco had this dream of wanting to write about a black space station captain, and his boss went nuts how ridiculous that was that a black man commanded white men in the future in space! I felt a lot with him, and often I come to the point that people seem to think "oh, yes a gay person can't be captain of a starship, thats ridiculous"; I mean many dont SAY it, but they would still withdraw their kids from a school if they knew the teacher was gay. As I assume many men may play "women have equal rights", but my assumption is a large number does not really feel that way about women. Call me suspicious, but thats what I think, and looking at games is a small window to show there is some truth in that. All too often women in games are attractive "objects" rather that real persons. On the other hand I rather not want to force a census; that has something artificial.
I do not want to over dramatize it. I enjoy Star Wars or Lord of the Rings despite the lack of gay characters as much as any bloke. But in sum, if you are white, just imagine EVERY single character in EVERY single movie that was published in the last decades was back; no single white character in any of it. Sure, you might enjoy the good story telling still, but as a whole, would it NOT put you into an odd sort of position?
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Aion, Fallen Earth and LOTRO have the ability to create a range of races. This is not only through color but even in the structure of the skull and facial features. Vanguard, WOW and many oihers aren't just human, but orcs, trolls, elves, etc.
Which are the games that have a lack of representation of avatars that reflect their heritage and ethnicity?
- RPG Quiz - can you get all 25 right?
- FPS Quiz - how well do you know your shooters?
I applaud any game that tries to have as much diversity as possible.. and in that spirit I would like to see more people who have physical and mental disabilities represented as well. As an Advocate for people with disabilities and a person with a disability myself, I wouldn't mind seeing more of my Brothers and Sisters who have disabilities. Breaking stereotypes and stigmas is important to the disability rights movement and I think people with disabilities would love to see more of their community involved, active and doing great things just like other characters. The way it should be. I certainly hope to see more games give some spotlights to my Brothers and Sisters with disabilities.
SO Mote it Be!