PvP is accessed in two ways. There are global queues in the UI where you simply pick the scenarios you want to wait in line for and a pop-up window beams you in as soon as one kicks off. The second way is through the map itself. Players can fly to the neutral zone and go to sectors on the map that throw them in line for the queue in question. This is reason enough to delay the game, this is the most god awful excuse for player versus player I have ever read, especially in terms of a space MMO and Star Trek to boot.
Really? It sounds like a "battlegrounds" or "capture the flag" type pvp setup where you can sign up into a queue to join. The only difference is roleplayers have an option now to travel to the neutral zone instead of opening a menu. Sounds nice to me.
And last I checked, battlegrounds/capture-the-flag/scenario type pvp areas are very popular. So what's the "god awful excuse"?
Well from my point of view this is the most un-Star Trek way to go about things. For one, PvP means little, there is no War here, it’s just mindless pit battles, the opposite of any sort of continuity that you'd have in a real war. Where is the surprise attacks? Where is the feigns, and outflanking that could happen if they simply made the Neutral Zone open for PvP, with objectives to take with real rewards? It just makes the whole thing cartoon like; it won’t feel like a real war, it will feel like a glorified gladiator arena. How is this even remotely like how war would be in Star Trek?? I don’t know I haven’t played the game yet, but by the sounds of it PvP will be a meaningless diversion, like Monster Play in LOTRO. I don’t know about you, but I was really looking forward to sneak attacks on enemy outposts, and even being outflanked and outmaneuvered by skilled opposition. It takes the grand strategy element away in favor of "ease of use".
I want to fly into Federation Space (or Klingon if I'm a Fed) and be terrified, but exited. I want to run to the defense of one of my outposts only to find out it was a ruse, and that the true target was another sector. I want the players to be able to make the PvP experience their own, instead of these lame pre constructed scenarios that totally destroy any sense of continuity and emersion to the world. I don’t mind scenarios, I think they should be in there, but I was really hoping for an open PvP area with objectives. I was planning on playing this game mostly PvP, but now I'm thinking that it’s going to be so lame that I have become skeptical of the whole thing.
I would really like it if Cryptic gave us a lot more specifics of how all this works. I really do want to play a Star Trek MMO.
Obviously, people can use Vent, but I for one want my game to give me all the tools right in it. In the last few years, integrated voice chat has become standard in MMOs. It's a huge hole in the game's social systems.
Good review, except I never got the memo about built in voice chat for MMOs being a standard. The only one I can think of is EVE and you had to pay extra for that. So no, built in voice chat is not an MMO standard.
Obviously, people can use Vent, but I for one want my game to give me all the tools right in it. In the last few years, integrated voice chat has become standard in MMOs. It's a huge hole in the game's social systems. Good review, except I never got the memo about built in voice chat for MMOs being a standard. The only one I can think of is EVE and you had to pay extra for that. So no, built in voice chat is not an MMO standard.
Your right that EVE has it but.... WOW has it too. As far as i know it is included in the monthly sub.
Obviously, people can use Vent, but I for one want my game to give me all the tools right in it. In the last few years, integrated voice chat has become standard in MMOs. It's a huge hole in the game's social systems. Good review, except I never got the memo about built in voice chat for MMOs being a standard. The only one I can think of is EVE and you had to pay extra for that. So no, built in voice chat is not an MMO standard.
Your right that EVE has it but.... WOW has it too. As far as i know it is included in the monthly sub.
It's funny that you didn't mention LotRO, since you've listed it as a game you're currently playing. It has built-in voice chat as well. Same with DDO.
Interesting read. I hope they fix the UI I never cared for the UI in CO very much, so I am hoping that is one thing they go about changing. Voice doesn't bug me, but I am old school where we had 200+ people raids on Elemental Gods with no voice and had to type it all out.
As for PvP, I am sure it'll change to an extent, but it's NOT Monster Play, there are several reviews that tell us flat out there while there is less PvE content for the Klingons, they can get to max level without ever touching PvP if they so chose.
Admittedly I am hoping they do update the PvP some, but I am REAL sick and tired of all the PvP'ers -still- complaining about it, when we've known what it was going to be like for weeks now. If you don't like it, don't play the game, there's no point at all in continuing to nerdrage about PvP in STO. It's not a 'hardcore' PvP game.
No amount of complaining is going to change that at this point.
PvP is accessed in two ways. There are global queues in the UI where you simply pick the scenarios you want to wait in line for and a pop-up window beams you in as soon as one kicks off. The second way is through the map itself. Players can fly to the neutral zone and go to sectors on the map that throw them in line for the queue in question. This is reason enough to delay the game, this is the most god awful excuse for player versus player I have ever read, especially in terms of a space MMO and Star Trek to boot.
Really? It sounds like a "battlegrounds" or "capture the flag" type pvp setup where you can sign up into a queue to join. The only difference is roleplayers have an option now to travel to the neutral zone instead of opening a menu. Sounds nice to me.
And last I checked, battlegrounds/capture-the-flag/scenario type pvp areas are very popular. So what's the "god awful excuse"?
Well from my point of view this is the most un-Star Trek way to go about things. For one, PvP means little, there is no War here, it’s just mindless pit battles, the opposite of any sort of continuity that you'd have in a real war. Where is the surprise attacks? Where is the feigns, and outflanking that could happen if they simply made the Neutral Zone open for PvP, with objectives to take with real rewards? It just makes the whole thing cartoon like; it won’t feel like a real war, it will feel like a glorified gladiator arena. How is this even remotely like how war would be in Star Trek?? I don’t know I haven’t played the game yet, but by the sounds of it PvP will be a meaningless diversion, like Monster Play in LOTRO. I don’t know about you, but I was really looking forward to sneak attacks on enemy outposts, and even being outflanked and outmaneuvered by skilled opposition. It takes the grand strategy element away in favor of "ease of use".
I want to fly into Federation Space (or Klingon if I'm a Fed) and be terrified, but exited. I want to run to the defense of one of my outposts only to find out it was a ruse, and that the true target was another sector. I want the players to be able to make the PvP experience their own, instead of these lame pre constructed scenarios that totally destroy any sense of continuity and emersion to the world. I don’t mind scenarios, I think they should be in there, but I was really hoping for an open PvP area with objectives. I was planning on playing this game mostly PvP, but now I'm thinking that it’s going to be so lame that I have become skeptical of the whole thing.
I would really like it if Cryptic gave us a lot more specifics of how all this works. I really do want to play a Star Trek MMO.
I wouldn't mind seeing specific areas within zones setup with bases designed to attack. Take for example, Anarchy Online. There are suppression areas within each zone. 100% suppression is no attacking at all. 75% is PvE only, though pvp is allowed if you are flagged. 25% is PvP allowed if you are in the area with alignment restriction. 5% is non-restrictive PvP.
To take advantage of this, there are pvp-attackable tower fields in which organizations (player guilds) place towers that buff the respective owners. Also, the more towers a particular alignment owns, the more "bonus side xp" is given to that alignment. It should be noted that the suppression zones aren't just for tower fields....all zones have suppression but not necessarily tower fields.
Now, if you are talking about something like that in a star trek mesh, then cool. I have no problems with that idea. But if you are suggesting being able to just fly around in PvE areas and PvP with any noob at will, then forget about it.
I have a strong feeling that this game is going to be PvE first and PvP last. Reasoning is that all the trekkies are going to be wanting to RP and while PvP is nice, Scenario PvP provides the roleplayer with the right type of PvP. Random 1vs1 epeen PvP and the like isn't something that would fly with a roleplayer (in my mind).
Lastly, at launch, they are probably going to provide for the roleplayer first, pvp'er second, thanks to the IP we are dealing with. I wouldn't be suprised to see starbases or the like that are player owned and that can be attacked later down the road.
PvP is accessed in two ways. There are global queues in the UI where you simply pick the scenarios you want to wait in line for and a pop-up window beams you in as soon as one kicks off. The second way is through the map itself. Players can fly to the neutral zone and go to sectors on the map that throw them in line for the queue in question. This is reason enough to delay the game, this is the most god awful excuse for player versus player I have ever read, especially in terms of a space MMO and Star Trek to boot.
Really? It sounds like a "battlegrounds" or "capture the flag" type pvp setup where you can sign up into a queue to join. The only difference is roleplayers have an option now to travel to the neutral zone instead of opening a menu. Sounds nice to me.
And last I checked, battlegrounds/capture-the-flag/scenario type pvp areas are very popular. So what's the "god awful excuse"?
Well from my point of view this is the most un-Star Trek way to go about things. For one, PvP means little, there is no War here, it’s just mindless pit battles, the opposite of any sort of continuity that you'd have in a real war. Where is the surprise attacks? Where is the feigns, and outflanking that could happen if they simply made the Neutral Zone open for PvP, with objectives to take with real rewards? It just makes the whole thing cartoon like; it won’t feel like a real war, it will feel like a glorified gladiator arena. How is this even remotely like how war would be in Star Trek?? I don’t know I haven’t played the game yet, but by the sounds of it PvP will be a meaningless diversion, like Monster Play in LOTRO. I don’t know about you, but I was really looking forward to sneak attacks on enemy outposts, and even being outflanked and outmaneuvered by skilled opposition. It takes the grand strategy element away in favor of "ease of use".
I want to fly into Federation Space (or Klingon if I'm a Fed) and be terrified, but exited. I want to run to the defense of one of my outposts only to find out it was a ruse, and that the true target was another sector. I want the players to be able to make the PvP experience their own, instead of these lame pre constructed scenarios that totally destroy any sense of continuity and emersion to the world. I don’t mind scenarios, I think they should be in there, but I was really hoping for an open PvP area with objectives. I was planning on playing this game mostly PvP, but now I'm thinking that it’s going to be so lame that I have become skeptical of the whole thing.
I would really like it if Cryptic gave us a lot more specifics of how all this works. I really do want to play a Star Trek MMO.
I wouldn't mind seeing specific areas within zones setup with bases designed to attack. Take for example, Anarchy Online. There are suppression areas within each zone. 100% suppression is no attacking at all. 75% is PvE only, though pvp is allowed if you are flagged. 25% is PvP allowed if you are in the area with alignment restriction. 5% is non-restrictive PvP.
To take advantage of this, there are pvp-attackable tower fields in which organizations (player guilds) place towers that buff the respective owners. Also, the more towers a particular alignment owns, the more "bonus side xp" is given to that alignment. It should be noted that the suppression zones aren't just for tower fields....all zones have suppression but not necessarily tower fields.
Now, if you are talking about something like that in a star trek mesh, then cool. I have no problems with that idea. But if you are suggesting being able to just fly around in PvE areas and PvP with any noob at will, then forget about it.
I have a strong feeling that this game is going to be PvE first and PvP last. Reasoning is that all the trekkies are going to be wanting to RP and while PvP is nice, Scenario PvP provides the roleplayer with the right type of PvP. Random 1vs1 epeen PvP and the like isn't something that would fly with a roleplayer (in my mind).
Lastly, at launch, they are probably going to provide for the roleplayer first, pvp'er second, thanks to the IP we are dealing with. I wouldn't be suprised to see starbases or the like that are player owned and that can be attacked later down the road.
Then what is the whole point of the back story being that there is war between the Klingons and the Federation? It's like they just shot themselves in the foot.
PvP is accessed in two ways. There are global queues in the UI where you simply pick the scenarios you want to wait in line for and a pop-up window beams you in as soon as one kicks off. The second way is through the map itself. Players can fly to the neutral zone and go to sectors on the map that throw them in line for the queue in question. This is reason enough to delay the game, this is the most god awful excuse for player versus player I have ever read, especially in terms of a space MMO and Star Trek to boot.
Really? It sounds like a "battlegrounds" or "capture the flag" type pvp setup where you can sign up into a queue to join. The only difference is roleplayers have an option now to travel to the neutral zone instead of opening a menu. Sounds nice to me.
And last I checked, battlegrounds/capture-the-flag/scenario type pvp areas are very popular. So what's the "god awful excuse"?
Well from my point of view this is the most un-Star Trek way to go about things. For one, PvP means little, there is no War here, it’s just mindless pit battles, the opposite of any sort of continuity that you'd have in a real war. Where is the surprise attacks? Where is the feigns, and outflanking that could happen if they simply made the Neutral Zone open for PvP, with objectives to take with real rewards? It just makes the whole thing cartoon like; it won’t feel like a real war, it will feel like a glorified gladiator arena. How is this even remotely like how war would be in Star Trek?? I don’t know I haven’t played the game yet, but by the sounds of it PvP will be a meaningless diversion, like Monster Play in LOTRO. I don’t know about you, but I was really looking forward to sneak attacks on enemy outposts, and even being outflanked and outmaneuvered by skilled opposition. It takes the grand strategy element away in favor of "ease of use".
I want to fly into Federation Space (or Klingon if I'm a Fed) and be terrified, but exited. I want to run to the defense of one of my outposts only to find out it was a ruse, and that the true target was another sector. I want the players to be able to make the PvP experience their own, instead of these lame pre constructed scenarios that totally destroy any sense of continuity and emersion to the world. I don’t mind scenarios, I think they should be in there, but I was really hoping for an open PvP area with objectives. I was planning on playing this game mostly PvP, but now I'm thinking that it’s going to be so lame that I have become skeptical of the whole thing.
I would really like it if Cryptic gave us a lot more specifics of how all this works. I really do want to play a Star Trek MMO.
I wouldn't mind seeing specific areas within zones setup with bases designed to attack. Take for example, Anarchy Online. There are suppression areas within each zone. 100% suppression is no attacking at all. 75% is PvE only, though pvp is allowed if you are flagged. 25% is PvP allowed if you are in the area with alignment restriction. 5% is non-restrictive PvP.
To take advantage of this, there are pvp-attackable tower fields in which organizations (player guilds) place towers that buff the respective owners. Also, the more towers a particular alignment owns, the more "bonus side xp" is given to that alignment. It should be noted that the suppression zones aren't just for tower fields....all zones have suppression but not necessarily tower fields.
Now, if you are talking about something like that in a star trek mesh, then cool. I have no problems with that idea. But if you are suggesting being able to just fly around in PvE areas and PvP with any noob at will, then forget about it.
I have a strong feeling that this game is going to be PvE first and PvP last. Reasoning is that all the trekkies are going to be wanting to RP and while PvP is nice, Scenario PvP provides the roleplayer with the right type of PvP. Random 1vs1 epeen PvP and the like isn't something that would fly with a roleplayer (in my mind).
Lastly, at launch, they are probably going to provide for the roleplayer first, pvp'er second, thanks to the IP we are dealing with. I wouldn't be suprised to see starbases or the like that are player owned and that can be attacked later down the road.
Something like this would be fine with me. I am not a hardcore “must have PvP in all areas" of the open world guy. I hate ganking just as much as the next guy. All I am asking for is some sort of larger scale strategic PvP area, where both sides can tip their toes in and have some meaningful battles without all these pre arranged conditions on everything. Like one big PvP lake like in WAR??
You could get around pop imbalance if you simply introduced some sort of modest attrition rules. These factions would only have so many resources at their disposal; you could set a ship limit for spawning in depending on the particular systems strategic value. A big Starbase can spawn ten ships a minute and the little system closer to the battle might be only able to support one or two ships a minute. You can choose where you spawn, but if you want in closer to where the potential battle is your going to have to wait longer. In the mean time you can PvE or whatever you like. Just an idea I am thinking up right now, but the point is something like this: an isolated PvP area with no pre set conditions that has some sort of battle lines and objectives is all I am looking for. It wouldn’t be that hard to implement, and everyone that wants to just PvE can do so to their hearts content.
I imagine this has been mentioned already, but UI changes quite a bit through beta. And imagine it will change before launch, especially after that article. The kit and equipment thing intrigues me, and would like to play for myself to see how I like it.
One thing to remember Cryptic focuses on Fun not Challenge. Their strong suite is customization not necessarily the game play. However if they can over come that it could be a great game. I imagine this game actually being a peak competitor after about 2 or 3 years, not right out of the gate.
No in-game voice chat for STO? Really Cryptic? Um...it's Star Trek. Please tell me there will be crafting at least. I am still very excited about my pre-order of the collectors edition, however I can do without the KAAAN! emote and the pet tribble for now in exchange for a true Star Trek expirience. I am looking forward to reading more about PVP as well. I hope STO will be a true faction based game as it has been saying. Nothing was worse to me when LOTRO did there Mickey Mouse version of PVP.
Ill be waiting a few months after release before I pick up STO. It seems like they have a lot of work to do still, but that's nothing new as with the release of many mmo's lately.
OK, this is a little ridiculous. While I appreciate the long review and the time taken, the author really apparently does not know anything about MMOs. Voice chat standard in all mmos now? Have to move close to loot? Too busy to read what skills actually do? Some of the points he brings up are valid and useful but nearly all the things that he talks about as deal breakers are pretty stupid things to complain about. His review made me frustrated reading it, and I bet if he actually talked to some people in game, he would find solutions to most of his problems.
No in-game voice chat for STO? Really Cryptic? Um...it's Star Trek. Please tell me there will be crafting at least. I am still very excited about my pre-order of the collectors edition, however I can do without the KAAAN! emote and the pet tribble for now in exchange for a true Star Trek expirience. I am looking forward to reading more about PVP as well. I hope STO will be a true faction based game as it has been saying. Nothing was worse to me when LOTRO did there Mickey Mouse version of PVP.
Hmmm when I think of Star Trek I don't think about "in-game voice chat". Oh I remember quite well that all they had to do was touch those fancy little badges and talk but, really? This is something to complain about? O.K..
I mostly agree most of the pre order items are kind of ridiculous and it just taps too much into the nerdom over there at Cryptic for my taste (though I am getting the Amazon pre order for the Borg officer).
And my last point would be crafting, while I know Star Trek is a show about ground breaking technology how often did they actually "craft" things as you seem to be suggesting? And that's to say that a crafting system as robust as say a LOTRO or SWG or WOW would not be as representative of the Star Trek Universe as you suggest.
Again I've seen upwards of only ten or more episodes from each series (give or take a few episodes) but again these things you mention don't seem to be very well represented in the world of ST as I see it maybe I'm wrong any Trekkies out there have an opinion?
I guess my biggest problem with this post again is far too often people try to validate there own personal desires by trying to interject there own view points on what a IP is about, and I for one get sick of hearing it since it is much more logical to trust the company actually able to pay for the rights to that IP as the original IP holder is in essence giving them the right to take the IP in either the same or another direction and as fans we don't have that right.
There is nothing wrong with wanting more crafting or even a simple feature like voice chat (which as I see it has only been a standard mmo feature in what the last three games released?). But what is the point of trying to hide those desires behind a crazy argument like "Star Trek isn't about this", well yes maybe to you but it means different things to lot's of different people evident by your post.
I also love how people are so quick to complain about the "weakness" of the pvp build because again when I think of Star Trek (as a little more than a casual fan) I don't think of war as quickly as I think of exploration and science. I can see people making these types of complaints about a Star Wars title devoid of war but really Star Trek was it really about war and factional pvp. During the longest running ST series I'm fairly certain therer wasn't even a war between the Fed and Klingons.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
OK, this is a little ridiculous. While I appreciate the long review and the time taken, the author really apparently does not know anything about MMOs. Voice chat standard in all mmos now? Have to move close to loot? Too busy to read what skills actually do? Some of the points he brings up are valid and useful but nearly all the things that he talks about as deal breakers are pretty stupid things to complain about. His review made me frustrated reading it, and I bet if he actually talked to some people in game, he would find solutions to most of his problems.
Maybe you should think before you post because the first thing that comes to mind is that you are the one that does not understand the MMO industry.
STO is being released in alpha form at best, they have not even fleshed out the 2nd race, the Klingons. There are a lot more serious issues he has neglected to point out in the review, I feel sorry for those that pay to take this game through the beta stage.
OK, this is a little ridiculous. While I appreciate the long review and the time taken, the author really apparently does not know anything about MMOs. Voice chat standard in all mmos now? Have to move close to loot? Too busy to read what skills actually do? Some of the points he brings up are valid and useful but nearly all the things that he talks about as deal breakers are pretty stupid things to complain about. His review made me frustrated reading it, and I bet if he actually talked to some people in game, he would find solutions to most of his problems.
Maybe you should think before you post because the first thing that comes to mind is that you are the one that does not understand the MMO industry.
STO is being released in alpha form at best, they have not even fleshed out the 2nd race, the Klingons. There are a lot more serious issues he has neglected to point out in the review, I feel sorry for those that pay to take this game through the beta stage.
The bottom line is that STO is being released with less development time than CO had. They say that it's because they already had the engine developed, thanks to CO, but if you think about it that means that there will be about the same amount of content that CO had at launch. And what was one of the biggest complaints about CO? Lack of content!
What's more, the beta for STO has yet to run on a 24/7 schedule even though it's only 10 days from open beta. Just how much balancing, bug finding and polishing can happen with so little up time?
It seems to me that Cryptic is trying to change the MMO development paradigm They're calling the alpha stage, "closed beta". What they'll call "open beta" is really what has previously been the closed beta stage. And when the game goes live it's at a point that previous companies would have used for open beta. They then count on a percentage of loyal fans staying on to fund continued development in the hope that eventually the game will turn into something. It will take a long time, though. What was the first content expansion for CO? A few repeatable missions. Now THAT'S excitement! Not!
I made the mistake of buying a lifetime sub to CO. I compounded that mistake by giving Cryptic a chance to make the game better, even though I'd stopped logging in a couple weeks after launch. Three months in, I finally realized that the game would never be worth the lifetime fee and tried to get a refund on that subscription and pointed to the fact that I hadn't logged into the game once after the initial 30 days. They refused. I may check it out again once in a while, but so far they have given no indication that the game will ever flourish. I can only imagine what will happen to their subs after DC Universe and Going Rogue are released this year.
You see, the problem with Cryptic's approach is that you only get one chance to make a first impression. When you release a game in beta state, you are almost guaranteeing that you'll be relegated to niche status. (One would think they'd have learned from Vanguard, AoC, WAR and yes... even CO.) When you start open beta in what should be a closed beta state you're practically begging a large percentage of your preorder customers to cancel. Lack of things like integrated voice chat or auto looting are simply another example of how this studio doesn't believe in learning from other MMO's. When I look back at CoX's history, I have to say that Jack Emmert held the game back. It has seen far more innovation in the time since he left than it ever saw while he was on board. Even while he was with the company, there was always the distinct impression that he was going to give players the game HE wanted them to have because his vision was superior to their expectations. Now that he's running the show at Cryptic that same hubris is obvious with both CO and the direction that STO is obviously going in.
It's ironic, but Allods Online is in the best shape at beta of any MMO that I've seen since LotRO... and it's going to be free to play!
What it all boils down to is that this is one CO lifetimer who really wanted to love both games, yet will not even be preordering STO. I also know for a fact that I'm not alone in that.
No in-game voice chat for STO? Really Cryptic? Um...it's Star Trek. Please tell me there will be crafting at least. I am still very excited about my pre-order of the collectors edition, however I can do without the KAAAN! emote and the pet tribble for now in exchange for a true Star Trek expirience. I am looking forward to reading more about PVP as well. I hope STO will be a true faction based game as it has been saying. Nothing was worse to me when LOTRO did there Mickey Mouse version of PVP.
Hmmm when I think of Star Trek I don't think about "in-game voice chat". Oh I remember quite well that all they had to do was touch those fancy little badges and talk but, really? This is something to complain about? O.K..
I mostly agree most of the pre order items are kind of ridiculous and it just taps too much into the nerdom over there at Cryptic for my taste (though I am getting the Amazon pre order for the Borg officer).
And my last point would be crafting, while I know Star Trek is a show about ground breaking technology how often did they actually "craft" things as you seem to be suggesting? And that's to say that a crafting system as robust as say a LOTRO or SWG or WOW would not be as representative of the Star Trek Universe as you suggest.
Again I've seen upwards of only ten or more episodes from each series (give or take a few episodes) but again these things you mention don't seem to be very well represented in the world of ST as I see it maybe I'm wrong any Trekkies out there have an opinion?
I guess my biggest problem with this post again is far too often people try to validate there own personal desires by trying to interject there own view points on what a IP is about, and I for one get sick of hearing it since it is much more logical to trust the company actually able to pay for the rights to that IP as the original IP holder is in essence giving them the right to take the IP in either the same or another direction and as fans we don't have that right.
There is nothing wrong with wanting more crafting or even a simple feature like voice chat (which as I see it has only been a standard mmo feature in what the last three games released?). But what is the point of trying to hide those desires behind a crazy argument like "Star Trek isn't about this", well yes maybe to you but it means different things to lot's of different people evident by your post.
I also love how people are so quick to complain about the "weakness" of the pvp build because again when I think of Star Trek (as a little more than a casual fan) I don't think of war as quickly as I think of exploration and science. I can see people making these types of complaints about a Star Wars title devoid of war but really Star Trek was it really about war and factional pvp. During the longest running ST series I'm fairly certain therer wasn't even a war between the Fed and Klingons.
1. In-game voice chat is becoming an industry standard for MMO's. STO without it will be sub-standard. Not too big of a deal since many will use ventrillo anyway.
2. How often did they craft in ST? Seriously? Many many episodes revolved around improvising, retrofiting, and improving upon out of neccesity. There is great potential for a full robust crafting system in STO.
3. We have the right to state our opinion and view points on any STO topics we want on MMORPG forums (Keeping within the guidlines). Thats acctually kind of the point in having them. The intention here is not to "smack talk" the game, it is to help improve it as it is being developed.
4. Of corse people are quick to complain about a games weakness. Why would someone complain about a games strong points?
5. As far as war between Klingons and the Federation, have you ever read the new time line for STO and what has been transpiring for when the game launches?
OK, this is a little ridiculous. While I appreciate the long review and the time taken, the author really apparently does not know anything about MMOs. Voice chat standard in all mmos now? Have to move close to loot? Too busy to read what skills actually do? Some of the points he brings up are valid and useful but nearly all the things that he talks about as deal breakers are pretty stupid things to complain about. His review made me frustrated reading it, and I bet if he actually talked to some people in game, he would find solutions to most of his problems.
Maybe you should think before you post because the first thing that comes to mind is that you are the one that does not understand the MMO industry.
STO is being released in alpha form at best, they have not even fleshed out the 2nd race, the Klingons. There are a lot more serious issues he has neglected to point out in the review, I feel sorry for those that pay to take this game through the beta stage.
I agree that it seems like STO is releasing too early, and could probably use an extra month or two to really fit more stuff in. My point, though, was that if you read the articles about STO at other sites (Ten Ton Hammer has pretty good ones), they don't complain about standard stuff like moving to loot or how they were too lazy to read about skills.
OK, this is a little ridiculous. While I appreciate the long review and the time taken, the author really apparently does not know anything about MMOs. Voice chat standard in all mmos now? Have to move close to loot? Too busy to read what skills actually do? Some of the points he brings up are valid and useful but nearly all the things that he talks about as deal breakers are pretty stupid things to complain about. His review made me frustrated reading it, and I bet if he actually talked to some people in game, he would find solutions to most of his problems.
Maybe you should think before you post because the first thing that comes to mind is that you are the one that does not understand the MMO industry.
STO is being released in alpha form at best, they have not even fleshed out the 2nd race, the Klingons. There are a lot more serious issues he has neglected to point out in the review, I feel sorry for those that pay to take this game through the beta stage.
I agree that it seems like STO is releasing too early, and could probably use an extra month or two to really fit more stuff in. My point, though, was that if you read the articles about STO at other sites (Ten Ton Hammer has pretty good ones), they don't complain about standard stuff like moving to loot or how they were too lazy to read about skills.
I don't recall him saying that he was too lazy to read about skills. I recall him saying that in many cases the skill descriptions are vague, confusing or even misleading. The names don't help much, and the tooltips do little to improve that.
It's an important difference.
I actually have to wonder why Champions Online introduced the Power House so that you can test out and see the results of your choices before committing to them, yet STO has no Holodeck to accomplish the same purpose?
I actually have to wonder why Champions Online introduced the Power House so that you can test out and see the results of your choices before committing to them, yet STO has no Holodeck to accomplish the same purpose?
Not enough demand for paid respecs in CO?
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Here is a preview about STO by a group who is in beta. Some of the things they cover follows:
- How space works, flying around
- Pause Button
- Combat Missions
- Ground Combat/Away teams
- Non-combat missions/Star Trek Lore
- Episodes (Quests) how they work
- Ship gear and equipping
- Pvp/pvp maps
- Star Trek Knowledge advantage
- Grouping (sidekick feature: if you group with your friends that are say... higher level/rank you will be pushed up to their level/rank while within a certain range for that mission/quest)
- Sounds effects and Music
- Fleet Actions/grouping
- Skilling learning via other players, other players can teach you skills their officers know and vice versa.
By a group called STOked, they come out with a podcast every tuesday I believe.
No in-game voice chat for STO? Really Cryptic? Um...it's Star Trek. Please tell me there will be crafting at least. I am still very excited about my pre-order of the collectors edition, however I can do without the KAAAN! emote and the pet tribble for now in exchange for a true Star Trek expirience. I am looking forward to reading more about PVP as well. I hope STO will be a true faction based game as it has been saying. Nothing was worse to me when LOTRO did there Mickey Mouse version of PVP.
Don't hold your breath, you'd be dead very shortly. This is not the game your looking for. (pun intended) This is as shallow as they get. It's Champions/Warhammer/AoC all over again. They will sell a bunch of boxes (only because Star Trek is on the Box) and well over 1/2 won't go beyond the first 30 days. 2/3 after 60 will cancel. When Atari bought Cryptic, in their contract was certain goals that cryptic had to make in order to get paid. They HAVE TOO meet certain sales goals and release dates. If they do not Atari just bought one cheap company. This IMHO this was the worst possible deal cryptic could have made. I'd fire the lawyers for this one. They obviously were desperate for cash NOW. They sold their soul to do it.
This is the link to the buy out (see below). In the last paragraph it says that an additional 20 million dollars will be paid out for hitting the aforementioned goals. This is why I believe STO is being pushed out of the door much too early, and why they slapped the old City of Heroes engine on this project. Projects like this will become more and more common, because you buy it. Companies like Bioware and Lucasarts are spending massive amounts of money on The Old Republic. This will be the LAST big budget MMO for many many years to come. The rest will be just good enough. It's all about ROI. The art form is long gone. The suits have finally won and will demographic the MMOs to death. This nearly killed Disney with Michael Eisner running the company before pixar took it over (thank god the creatives are in charge of Disney again,yea John Lassiter). Now the suits will ruin MMO development for years as companies are more concerned with short term (slap it out get your first days sales, shut it down after a year. Rinse repeat) gain and not long term success.
No in-game voice chat for STO? Really Cryptic? Um...it's Star Trek. Please tell me there will be crafting at least. I am still very excited about my pre-order of the collectors edition, however I can do without the KAAAN! emote and the pet tribble for now in exchange for a true Star Trek expirience. I am looking forward to reading more about PVP as well. I hope STO will be a true faction based game as it has been saying. Nothing was worse to me when LOTRO did there Mickey Mouse version of PVP.
Hmmm when I think of Star Trek I don't think about "in-game voice chat". Oh I remember quite well that all they had to do was touch those fancy little badges and talk but, really? This is something to complain about? O.K..
I mostly agree most of the pre order items are kind of ridiculous and it just taps too much into the nerdom over there at Cryptic for my taste (though I am getting the Amazon pre order for the Borg officer).
And my last point would be crafting, while I know Star Trek is a show about ground breaking technology how often did they actually "craft" things as you seem to be suggesting? And that's to say that a crafting system as robust as say a LOTRO or SWG or WOW would not be as representative of the Star Trek Universe as you suggest.
Again I've seen upwards of only ten or more episodes from each series (give or take a few episodes) but again these things you mention don't seem to be very well represented in the world of ST as I see it maybe I'm wrong any Trekkies out there have an opinion?
I guess my biggest problem with this post again is far too often people try to validate there own personal desires by trying to interject there own view points on what a IP is about, and I for one get sick of hearing it since it is much more logical to trust the company actually able to pay for the rights to that IP as the original IP holder is in essence giving them the right to take the IP in either the same or another direction and as fans we don't have that right.
There is nothing wrong with wanting more crafting or even a simple feature like voice chat (which as I see it has only been a standard mmo feature in what the last three games released?). But what is the point of trying to hide those desires behind a crazy argument like "Star Trek isn't about this", well yes maybe to you but it means different things to lot's of different people evident by your post.
I also love how people are so quick to complain about the "weakness" of the pvp build because again when I think of Star Trek (as a little more than a casual fan) I don't think of war as quickly as I think of exploration and science. I can see people making these types of complaints about a Star Wars title devoid of war but really Star Trek was it really about war and factional pvp. During the longest running ST series I'm fairly certain therer wasn't even a war between the Fed and Klingons.
1. In-game voice chat is becoming an industry standard for MMO's. STO without it will be sub-standard. Not too big of a deal since many will use ventrillo anyway.
Ventrillo is much better anyways then the ingame crap they call "voice chat" e.g. Right after the ingame voice chat for WOW launched, it sucked and still does.
2. How often did they craft in ST? Seriously? Many many episodes revolved around improvising, retrofiting, and improving upon out of neccesity. There is great potential for a full robust crafting system in STO.
I read an article somewhere that they might introduce starship design as a crafting system. Again rumor.
3. We have the right to state our opinion and view points on any STO topics we want on MMORPG forums (Keeping within the guidlines). Thats acctually kind of the point in having them. The intention here is not to "smack talk" the game, it is to help improve it as it is being developed.
Agreed.
4. Of corse people are quick to complain about a games weakness. Why would someone complain about a games strong points?
As for pointing out the weakness of a game, especialy if its still in beta or on the PTRs, it helps the devs create new stuff or fix the problems. But it is human nature to find faults regardless of the context.
5. As far as war between Klingons and the Federation, have you ever read the new time line for STO and what has been transpiring for when the game launches?
This will forever change the face of the Star Trek franchise... like Worf isnt part of the enterprise crew at all or the dominion war could have gone the other way for the federation...meaning the klingons would be at war with the federation. To many varibles in this situation to explain.
Comments
Really? It sounds like a "battlegrounds" or "capture the flag" type pvp setup where you can sign up into a queue to join. The only difference is roleplayers have an option now to travel to the neutral zone instead of opening a menu. Sounds nice to me.
And last I checked, battlegrounds/capture-the-flag/scenario type pvp areas are very popular. So what's the "god awful excuse"?
Well from my point of view this is the most un-Star Trek way to go about things. For one, PvP means little, there is no War here, it’s just mindless pit battles, the opposite of any sort of continuity that you'd have in a real war. Where is the surprise attacks? Where is the feigns, and outflanking that could happen if they simply made the Neutral Zone open for PvP, with objectives to take with real rewards? It just makes the whole thing cartoon like; it won’t feel like a real war, it will feel like a glorified gladiator arena. How is this even remotely like how war would be in Star Trek?? I don’t know I haven’t played the game yet, but by the sounds of it PvP will be a meaningless diversion, like Monster Play in LOTRO. I don’t know about you, but I was really looking forward to sneak attacks on enemy outposts, and even being outflanked and outmaneuvered by skilled opposition. It takes the grand strategy element away in favor of "ease of use".
I want to fly into Federation Space (or Klingon if I'm a Fed) and be terrified, but exited. I want to run to the defense of one of my outposts only to find out it was a ruse, and that the true target was another sector. I want the players to be able to make the PvP experience their own, instead of these lame pre constructed scenarios that totally destroy any sense of continuity and emersion to the world. I don’t mind scenarios, I think they should be in there, but I was really hoping for an open PvP area with objectives. I was planning on playing this game mostly PvP, but now I'm thinking that it’s going to be so lame that I have become skeptical of the whole thing.
I would really like it if Cryptic gave us a lot more specifics of how all this works. I really do want to play a Star Trek MMO.
Obviously, people can use Vent, but I for one want my game to give me all the tools right in it. In the last few years, integrated voice chat has become standard in MMOs. It's a huge hole in the game's social systems.
Good review, except I never got the memo about built in voice chat for MMOs being a standard. The only one I can think of is EVE and you had to pay extra for that. So no, built in voice chat is not an MMO standard.
Your right that EVE has it but.... WOW has it too. As far as i know it is included in the monthly sub.
Your right that EVE has it but.... WOW has it too. As far as i know it is included in the monthly sub.
It's funny that you didn't mention LotRO, since you've listed it as a game you're currently playing.
It has built-in voice chat as well. Same with DDO.
Interesting read. I hope they fix the UI I never cared for the UI in CO very much, so I am hoping that is one thing they go about changing. Voice doesn't bug me, but I am old school where we had 200+ people raids on Elemental Gods with no voice and had to type it all out.
As for PvP, I am sure it'll change to an extent, but it's NOT Monster Play, there are several reviews that tell us flat out there while there is less PvE content for the Klingons, they can get to max level without ever touching PvP if they so chose.
Admittedly I am hoping they do update the PvP some, but I am REAL sick and tired of all the PvP'ers -still- complaining about it, when we've known what it was going to be like for weeks now. If you don't like it, don't play the game, there's no point at all in continuing to nerdrage about PvP in STO. It's not a 'hardcore' PvP game.
No amount of complaining is going to change that at this point.
Period.
Really? It sounds like a "battlegrounds" or "capture the flag" type pvp setup where you can sign up into a queue to join. The only difference is roleplayers have an option now to travel to the neutral zone instead of opening a menu. Sounds nice to me.
And last I checked, battlegrounds/capture-the-flag/scenario type pvp areas are very popular. So what's the "god awful excuse"?
Well from my point of view this is the most un-Star Trek way to go about things. For one, PvP means little, there is no War here, it’s just mindless pit battles, the opposite of any sort of continuity that you'd have in a real war. Where is the surprise attacks? Where is the feigns, and outflanking that could happen if they simply made the Neutral Zone open for PvP, with objectives to take with real rewards? It just makes the whole thing cartoon like; it won’t feel like a real war, it will feel like a glorified gladiator arena. How is this even remotely like how war would be in Star Trek?? I don’t know I haven’t played the game yet, but by the sounds of it PvP will be a meaningless diversion, like Monster Play in LOTRO. I don’t know about you, but I was really looking forward to sneak attacks on enemy outposts, and even being outflanked and outmaneuvered by skilled opposition. It takes the grand strategy element away in favor of "ease of use".
I want to fly into Federation Space (or Klingon if I'm a Fed) and be terrified, but exited. I want to run to the defense of one of my outposts only to find out it was a ruse, and that the true target was another sector. I want the players to be able to make the PvP experience their own, instead of these lame pre constructed scenarios that totally destroy any sense of continuity and emersion to the world. I don’t mind scenarios, I think they should be in there, but I was really hoping for an open PvP area with objectives. I was planning on playing this game mostly PvP, but now I'm thinking that it’s going to be so lame that I have become skeptical of the whole thing.
I would really like it if Cryptic gave us a lot more specifics of how all this works. I really do want to play a Star Trek MMO.
I wouldn't mind seeing specific areas within zones setup with bases designed to attack. Take for example, Anarchy Online. There are suppression areas within each zone. 100% suppression is no attacking at all. 75% is PvE only, though pvp is allowed if you are flagged. 25% is PvP allowed if you are in the area with alignment restriction. 5% is non-restrictive PvP.
To take advantage of this, there are pvp-attackable tower fields in which organizations (player guilds) place towers that buff the respective owners. Also, the more towers a particular alignment owns, the more "bonus side xp" is given to that alignment. It should be noted that the suppression zones aren't just for tower fields....all zones have suppression but not necessarily tower fields.
Now, if you are talking about something like that in a star trek mesh, then cool. I have no problems with that idea. But if you are suggesting being able to just fly around in PvE areas and PvP with any noob at will, then forget about it.
I have a strong feeling that this game is going to be PvE first and PvP last. Reasoning is that all the trekkies are going to be wanting to RP and while PvP is nice, Scenario PvP provides the roleplayer with the right type of PvP. Random 1vs1 epeen PvP and the like isn't something that would fly with a roleplayer (in my mind).
Lastly, at launch, they are probably going to provide for the roleplayer first, pvp'er second, thanks to the IP we are dealing with. I wouldn't be suprised to see starbases or the like that are player owned and that can be attacked later down the road.
Really? It sounds like a "battlegrounds" or "capture the flag" type pvp setup where you can sign up into a queue to join. The only difference is roleplayers have an option now to travel to the neutral zone instead of opening a menu. Sounds nice to me.
And last I checked, battlegrounds/capture-the-flag/scenario type pvp areas are very popular. So what's the "god awful excuse"?
Well from my point of view this is the most un-Star Trek way to go about things. For one, PvP means little, there is no War here, it’s just mindless pit battles, the opposite of any sort of continuity that you'd have in a real war. Where is the surprise attacks? Where is the feigns, and outflanking that could happen if they simply made the Neutral Zone open for PvP, with objectives to take with real rewards? It just makes the whole thing cartoon like; it won’t feel like a real war, it will feel like a glorified gladiator arena. How is this even remotely like how war would be in Star Trek?? I don’t know I haven’t played the game yet, but by the sounds of it PvP will be a meaningless diversion, like Monster Play in LOTRO. I don’t know about you, but I was really looking forward to sneak attacks on enemy outposts, and even being outflanked and outmaneuvered by skilled opposition. It takes the grand strategy element away in favor of "ease of use".
I want to fly into Federation Space (or Klingon if I'm a Fed) and be terrified, but exited. I want to run to the defense of one of my outposts only to find out it was a ruse, and that the true target was another sector. I want the players to be able to make the PvP experience their own, instead of these lame pre constructed scenarios that totally destroy any sense of continuity and emersion to the world. I don’t mind scenarios, I think they should be in there, but I was really hoping for an open PvP area with objectives. I was planning on playing this game mostly PvP, but now I'm thinking that it’s going to be so lame that I have become skeptical of the whole thing.
I would really like it if Cryptic gave us a lot more specifics of how all this works. I really do want to play a Star Trek MMO.
I wouldn't mind seeing specific areas within zones setup with bases designed to attack. Take for example, Anarchy Online. There are suppression areas within each zone. 100% suppression is no attacking at all. 75% is PvE only, though pvp is allowed if you are flagged. 25% is PvP allowed if you are in the area with alignment restriction. 5% is non-restrictive PvP.
To take advantage of this, there are pvp-attackable tower fields in which organizations (player guilds) place towers that buff the respective owners. Also, the more towers a particular alignment owns, the more "bonus side xp" is given to that alignment. It should be noted that the suppression zones aren't just for tower fields....all zones have suppression but not necessarily tower fields.
Now, if you are talking about something like that in a star trek mesh, then cool. I have no problems with that idea. But if you are suggesting being able to just fly around in PvE areas and PvP with any noob at will, then forget about it.
I have a strong feeling that this game is going to be PvE first and PvP last. Reasoning is that all the trekkies are going to be wanting to RP and while PvP is nice, Scenario PvP provides the roleplayer with the right type of PvP. Random 1vs1 epeen PvP and the like isn't something that would fly with a roleplayer (in my mind).
Lastly, at launch, they are probably going to provide for the roleplayer first, pvp'er second, thanks to the IP we are dealing with. I wouldn't be suprised to see starbases or the like that are player owned and that can be attacked later down the road.
Then what is the whole point of the back story being that there is war between the Klingons and the Federation? It's like they just shot themselves in the foot.
Really? It sounds like a "battlegrounds" or "capture the flag" type pvp setup where you can sign up into a queue to join. The only difference is roleplayers have an option now to travel to the neutral zone instead of opening a menu. Sounds nice to me.
And last I checked, battlegrounds/capture-the-flag/scenario type pvp areas are very popular. So what's the "god awful excuse"?
Well from my point of view this is the most un-Star Trek way to go about things. For one, PvP means little, there is no War here, it’s just mindless pit battles, the opposite of any sort of continuity that you'd have in a real war. Where is the surprise attacks? Where is the feigns, and outflanking that could happen if they simply made the Neutral Zone open for PvP, with objectives to take with real rewards? It just makes the whole thing cartoon like; it won’t feel like a real war, it will feel like a glorified gladiator arena. How is this even remotely like how war would be in Star Trek?? I don’t know I haven’t played the game yet, but by the sounds of it PvP will be a meaningless diversion, like Monster Play in LOTRO. I don’t know about you, but I was really looking forward to sneak attacks on enemy outposts, and even being outflanked and outmaneuvered by skilled opposition. It takes the grand strategy element away in favor of "ease of use".
I want to fly into Federation Space (or Klingon if I'm a Fed) and be terrified, but exited. I want to run to the defense of one of my outposts only to find out it was a ruse, and that the true target was another sector. I want the players to be able to make the PvP experience their own, instead of these lame pre constructed scenarios that totally destroy any sense of continuity and emersion to the world. I don’t mind scenarios, I think they should be in there, but I was really hoping for an open PvP area with objectives. I was planning on playing this game mostly PvP, but now I'm thinking that it’s going to be so lame that I have become skeptical of the whole thing.
I would really like it if Cryptic gave us a lot more specifics of how all this works. I really do want to play a Star Trek MMO.
I wouldn't mind seeing specific areas within zones setup with bases designed to attack. Take for example, Anarchy Online. There are suppression areas within each zone. 100% suppression is no attacking at all. 75% is PvE only, though pvp is allowed if you are flagged. 25% is PvP allowed if you are in the area with alignment restriction. 5% is non-restrictive PvP.
To take advantage of this, there are pvp-attackable tower fields in which organizations (player guilds) place towers that buff the respective owners. Also, the more towers a particular alignment owns, the more "bonus side xp" is given to that alignment. It should be noted that the suppression zones aren't just for tower fields....all zones have suppression but not necessarily tower fields.
Now, if you are talking about something like that in a star trek mesh, then cool. I have no problems with that idea. But if you are suggesting being able to just fly around in PvE areas and PvP with any noob at will, then forget about it.
I have a strong feeling that this game is going to be PvE first and PvP last. Reasoning is that all the trekkies are going to be wanting to RP and while PvP is nice, Scenario PvP provides the roleplayer with the right type of PvP. Random 1vs1 epeen PvP and the like isn't something that would fly with a roleplayer (in my mind).
Lastly, at launch, they are probably going to provide for the roleplayer first, pvp'er second, thanks to the IP we are dealing with. I wouldn't be suprised to see starbases or the like that are player owned and that can be attacked later down the road.
Something like this would be fine with me. I am not a hardcore “must have PvP in all areas" of the open world guy. I hate ganking just as much as the next guy. All I am asking for is some sort of larger scale strategic PvP area, where both sides can tip their toes in and have some meaningful battles without all these pre arranged conditions on everything. Like one big PvP lake like in WAR??
You could get around pop imbalance if you simply introduced some sort of modest attrition rules. These factions would only have so many resources at their disposal; you could set a ship limit for spawning in depending on the particular systems strategic value. A big Starbase can spawn ten ships a minute and the little system closer to the battle might be only able to support one or two ships a minute. You can choose where you spawn, but if you want in closer to where the potential battle is your going to have to wait longer. In the mean time you can PvE or whatever you like. Just an idea I am thinking up right now, but the point is something like this: an isolated PvP area with no pre set conditions that has some sort of battle lines and objectives is all I am looking for. It wouldn’t be that hard to implement, and everyone that wants to just PvE can do so to their hearts content.
I imagine this has been mentioned already, but UI changes quite a bit through beta. And imagine it will change before launch, especially after that article. The kit and equipment thing intrigues me, and would like to play for myself to see how I like it.
One thing to remember Cryptic focuses on Fun not Challenge. Their strong suite is customization not necessarily the game play. However if they can over come that it could be a great game. I imagine this game actually being a peak competitor after about 2 or 3 years, not right out of the gate.
No in-game voice chat for STO? Really Cryptic? Um...it's Star Trek. Please tell me there will be crafting at least. I am still very excited about my pre-order of the collectors edition, however I can do without the KAAAN! emote and the pet tribble for now in exchange for a true Star Trek expirience. I am looking forward to reading more about PVP as well. I hope STO will be a true faction based game as it has been saying. Nothing was worse to me when LOTRO did there Mickey Mouse version of PVP.
Ill be waiting a few months after release before I pick up STO. It seems like they have a lot of work to do still, but that's nothing new as with the release of many mmo's lately.
OK, this is a little ridiculous. While I appreciate the long review and the time taken, the author really apparently does not know anything about MMOs. Voice chat standard in all mmos now? Have to move close to loot? Too busy to read what skills actually do? Some of the points he brings up are valid and useful but nearly all the things that he talks about as deal breakers are pretty stupid things to complain about. His review made me frustrated reading it, and I bet if he actually talked to some people in game, he would find solutions to most of his problems.
Hmmm when I think of Star Trek I don't think about "in-game voice chat". Oh I remember quite well that all they had to do was touch those fancy little badges and talk but, really? This is something to complain about? O.K..
I mostly agree most of the pre order items are kind of ridiculous and it just taps too much into the nerdom over there at Cryptic for my taste (though I am getting the Amazon pre order for the Borg officer).
And my last point would be crafting, while I know Star Trek is a show about ground breaking technology how often did they actually "craft" things as you seem to be suggesting? And that's to say that a crafting system as robust as say a LOTRO or SWG or WOW would not be as representative of the Star Trek Universe as you suggest.
Again I've seen upwards of only ten or more episodes from each series (give or take a few episodes) but again these things you mention don't seem to be very well represented in the world of ST as I see it maybe I'm wrong any Trekkies out there have an opinion?
I guess my biggest problem with this post again is far too often people try to validate there own personal desires by trying to interject there own view points on what a IP is about, and I for one get sick of hearing it since it is much more logical to trust the company actually able to pay for the rights to that IP as the original IP holder is in essence giving them the right to take the IP in either the same or another direction and as fans we don't have that right.
There is nothing wrong with wanting more crafting or even a simple feature like voice chat (which as I see it has only been a standard mmo feature in what the last three games released?). But what is the point of trying to hide those desires behind a crazy argument like "Star Trek isn't about this", well yes maybe to you but it means different things to lot's of different people evident by your post.
I also love how people are so quick to complain about the "weakness" of the pvp build because again when I think of Star Trek (as a little more than a casual fan) I don't think of war as quickly as I think of exploration and science. I can see people making these types of complaints about a Star Wars title devoid of war but really Star Trek was it really about war and factional pvp. During the longest running ST series I'm fairly certain therer wasn't even a war between the Fed and Klingons.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Maybe you should think before you post because the first thing that comes to mind is that you are the one that does not understand the MMO industry.
STO is being released in alpha form at best, they have not even fleshed out the 2nd race, the Klingons. There are a lot more serious issues he has neglected to point out in the review, I feel sorry for those that pay to take this game through the beta stage.
Maybe you should think before you post because the first thing that comes to mind is that you are the one that does not understand the MMO industry.
STO is being released in alpha form at best, they have not even fleshed out the 2nd race, the Klingons. There are a lot more serious issues he has neglected to point out in the review, I feel sorry for those that pay to take this game through the beta stage.
The bottom line is that STO is being released with less development time than CO had. They say that it's because they already had the engine developed, thanks to CO, but if you think about it that means that there will be about the same amount of content that CO had at launch. And what was one of the biggest complaints about CO? Lack of content!
What's more, the beta for STO has yet to run on a 24/7 schedule even though it's only 10 days from open beta. Just how much balancing, bug finding and polishing can happen with so little up time?
It seems to me that Cryptic is trying to change the MMO development paradigm They're calling the alpha stage, "closed beta". What they'll call "open beta" is really what has previously been the closed beta stage. And when the game goes live it's at a point that previous companies would have used for open beta. They then count on a percentage of loyal fans staying on to fund continued development in the hope that eventually the game will turn into something. It will take a long time, though. What was the first content expansion for CO? A few repeatable missions. Now THAT'S excitement! Not!
I made the mistake of buying a lifetime sub to CO. I compounded that mistake by giving Cryptic a chance to make the game better, even though I'd stopped logging in a couple weeks after launch. Three months in, I finally realized that the game would never be worth the lifetime fee and tried to get a refund on that subscription and pointed to the fact that I hadn't logged into the game once after the initial 30 days. They refused. I may check it out again once in a while, but so far they have given no indication that the game will ever flourish. I can only imagine what will happen to their subs after DC Universe and Going Rogue are released this year.
You see, the problem with Cryptic's approach is that you only get one chance to make a first impression. When you release a game in beta state, you are almost guaranteeing that you'll be relegated to niche status. (One would think they'd have learned from Vanguard, AoC, WAR and yes... even CO.) When you start open beta in what should be a closed beta state you're practically begging a large percentage of your preorder customers to cancel. Lack of things like integrated voice chat or auto looting are simply another example of how this studio doesn't believe in learning from other MMO's. When I look back at CoX's history, I have to say that Jack Emmert held the game back. It has seen far more innovation in the time since he left than it ever saw while he was on board. Even while he was with the company, there was always the distinct impression that he was going to give players the game HE wanted them to have because his vision was superior to their expectations. Now that he's running the show at Cryptic that same hubris is obvious with both CO and the direction that STO is obviously going in.
It's ironic, but Allods Online is in the best shape at beta of any MMO that I've seen since LotRO... and it's going to be free to play!
What it all boils down to is that this is one CO lifetimer who really wanted to love both games, yet will not even be preordering STO. I also know for a fact that I'm not alone in that.
Hmmm when I think of Star Trek I don't think about "in-game voice chat". Oh I remember quite well that all they had to do was touch those fancy little badges and talk but, really? This is something to complain about? O.K..
I mostly agree most of the pre order items are kind of ridiculous and it just taps too much into the nerdom over there at Cryptic for my taste (though I am getting the Amazon pre order for the Borg officer).
And my last point would be crafting, while I know Star Trek is a show about ground breaking technology how often did they actually "craft" things as you seem to be suggesting? And that's to say that a crafting system as robust as say a LOTRO or SWG or WOW would not be as representative of the Star Trek Universe as you suggest.
Again I've seen upwards of only ten or more episodes from each series (give or take a few episodes) but again these things you mention don't seem to be very well represented in the world of ST as I see it maybe I'm wrong any Trekkies out there have an opinion?
I guess my biggest problem with this post again is far too often people try to validate there own personal desires by trying to interject there own view points on what a IP is about, and I for one get sick of hearing it since it is much more logical to trust the company actually able to pay for the rights to that IP as the original IP holder is in essence giving them the right to take the IP in either the same or another direction and as fans we don't have that right.
There is nothing wrong with wanting more crafting or even a simple feature like voice chat (which as I see it has only been a standard mmo feature in what the last three games released?). But what is the point of trying to hide those desires behind a crazy argument like "Star Trek isn't about this", well yes maybe to you but it means different things to lot's of different people evident by your post.
I also love how people are so quick to complain about the "weakness" of the pvp build because again when I think of Star Trek (as a little more than a casual fan) I don't think of war as quickly as I think of exploration and science. I can see people making these types of complaints about a Star Wars title devoid of war but really Star Trek was it really about war and factional pvp. During the longest running ST series I'm fairly certain therer wasn't even a war between the Fed and Klingons.
1. In-game voice chat is becoming an industry standard for MMO's. STO without it will be sub-standard. Not too big of a deal since many will use ventrillo anyway.
2. How often did they craft in ST? Seriously? Many many episodes revolved around improvising, retrofiting, and improving upon out of neccesity. There is great potential for a full robust crafting system in STO.
3. We have the right to state our opinion and view points on any STO topics we want on MMORPG forums (Keeping within the guidlines). Thats acctually kind of the point in having them. The intention here is not to "smack talk" the game, it is to help improve it as it is being developed.
4. Of corse people are quick to complain about a games weakness. Why would someone complain about a games strong points?
5. As far as war between Klingons and the Federation, have you ever read the new time line for STO and what has been transpiring for when the game launches?
I'm sorry Dana, but to me it's a sad day when a published journalist actually uses the term "WoW killer" in any fashion in an article.
Maybe you should think before you post because the first thing that comes to mind is that you are the one that does not understand the MMO industry.
STO is being released in alpha form at best, they have not even fleshed out the 2nd race, the Klingons. There are a lot more serious issues he has neglected to point out in the review, I feel sorry for those that pay to take this game through the beta stage.
I agree that it seems like STO is releasing too early, and could probably use an extra month or two to really fit more stuff in. My point, though, was that if you read the articles about STO at other sites (Ten Ton Hammer has pretty good ones), they don't complain about standard stuff like moving to loot or how they were too lazy to read about skills.
Maybe you should think before you post because the first thing that comes to mind is that you are the one that does not understand the MMO industry.
STO is being released in alpha form at best, they have not even fleshed out the 2nd race, the Klingons. There are a lot more serious issues he has neglected to point out in the review, I feel sorry for those that pay to take this game through the beta stage.
I agree that it seems like STO is releasing too early, and could probably use an extra month or two to really fit more stuff in. My point, though, was that if you read the articles about STO at other sites (Ten Ton Hammer has pretty good ones), they don't complain about standard stuff like moving to loot or how they were too lazy to read about skills.
I don't recall him saying that he was too lazy to read about skills. I recall him saying that in many cases the skill descriptions are vague, confusing or even misleading. The names don't help much, and the tooltips do little to improve that.
It's an important difference.
I actually have to wonder why Champions Online introduced the Power House so that you can test out and see the results of your choices before committing to them, yet STO has no Holodeck to accomplish the same purpose?
Not enough demand for paid respecs in CO?
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Here is a preview about STO by a group who is in beta. Some of the things they cover follows:
- How space works, flying around
- Pause Button
- Combat Missions
- Ground Combat/Away teams
- Non-combat missions/Star Trek Lore
- Episodes (Quests) how they work
- Ship gear and equipping
- Pvp/pvp maps
- Star Trek Knowledge advantage
- Grouping (sidekick feature: if you group with your friends that are say... higher level/rank you will be pushed up to their level/rank while within a certain range for that mission/quest)
- Sounds effects and Music
- Fleet Actions/grouping
- Skilling learning via other players, other players can teach you skills their officers know and vice versa.
By a group called STOked, they come out with a podcast every tuesday I believe.
http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/3554473
There is no Dana only Zool!
The two most common elements in the universe are Hydrogen and stupidity. - Harlan Ellison
Don't hold your breath, you'd be dead very shortly. This is not the game your looking for. (pun intended) This is as shallow as they get. It's Champions/Warhammer/AoC all over again. They will sell a bunch of boxes (only because Star Trek is on the Box) and well over 1/2 won't go beyond the first 30 days. 2/3 after 60 will cancel. When Atari bought Cryptic, in their contract was certain goals that cryptic had to make in order to get paid. They HAVE TOO meet certain sales goals and release dates. If they do not Atari just bought one cheap company. This IMHO this was the worst possible deal cryptic could have made. I'd fire the lawyers for this one. They obviously were desperate for cash NOW. They sold their soul to do it.
This is the link to the buy out (see below). In the last paragraph it says that an additional 20 million dollars will be paid out for hitting the aforementioned goals. This is why I believe STO is being pushed out of the door much too early, and why they slapped the old City of Heroes engine on this project. Projects like this will become more and more common, because you buy it. Companies like Bioware and Lucasarts are spending massive amounts of money on The Old Republic. This will be the LAST big budget MMO for many many years to come. The rest will be just good enough. It's all about ROI. The art form is long gone. The suits have finally won and will demographic the MMOs to death. This nearly killed Disney with Michael Eisner running the company before pixar took it over (thank god the creatives are in charge of Disney again,yea John Lassiter). Now the suits will ruin MMO development for years as companies are more concerned with short term (slap it out get your first days sales, shut it down after a year. Rinse repeat) gain and not long term success.
www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/atari-acquires-cryptic-studios
The two most common elements in the universe are Hydrogen and stupidity. - Harlan Ellison
Hmmm when I think of Star Trek I don't think about "in-game voice chat". Oh I remember quite well that all they had to do was touch those fancy little badges and talk but, really? This is something to complain about? O.K..
I mostly agree most of the pre order items are kind of ridiculous and it just taps too much into the nerdom over there at Cryptic for my taste (though I am getting the Amazon pre order for the Borg officer).
And my last point would be crafting, while I know Star Trek is a show about ground breaking technology how often did they actually "craft" things as you seem to be suggesting? And that's to say that a crafting system as robust as say a LOTRO or SWG or WOW would not be as representative of the Star Trek Universe as you suggest.
Again I've seen upwards of only ten or more episodes from each series (give or take a few episodes) but again these things you mention don't seem to be very well represented in the world of ST as I see it maybe I'm wrong any Trekkies out there have an opinion?
I guess my biggest problem with this post again is far too often people try to validate there own personal desires by trying to interject there own view points on what a IP is about, and I for one get sick of hearing it since it is much more logical to trust the company actually able to pay for the rights to that IP as the original IP holder is in essence giving them the right to take the IP in either the same or another direction and as fans we don't have that right.
There is nothing wrong with wanting more crafting or even a simple feature like voice chat (which as I see it has only been a standard mmo feature in what the last three games released?). But what is the point of trying to hide those desires behind a crazy argument like "Star Trek isn't about this", well yes maybe to you but it means different things to lot's of different people evident by your post.
I also love how people are so quick to complain about the "weakness" of the pvp build because again when I think of Star Trek (as a little more than a casual fan) I don't think of war as quickly as I think of exploration and science. I can see people making these types of complaints about a Star Wars title devoid of war but really Star Trek was it really about war and factional pvp. During the longest running ST series I'm fairly certain therer wasn't even a war between the Fed and Klingons.
1. In-game voice chat is becoming an industry standard for MMO's. STO without it will be sub-standard. Not too big of a deal since many will use ventrillo anyway.
Ventrillo is much better anyways then the ingame crap they call "voice chat" e.g. Right after the ingame voice chat for WOW launched, it sucked and still does.
2. How often did they craft in ST? Seriously? Many many episodes revolved around improvising, retrofiting, and improving upon out of neccesity. There is great potential for a full robust crafting system in STO.
I read an article somewhere that they might introduce starship design as a crafting system. Again rumor.
3. We have the right to state our opinion and view points on any STO topics we want on MMORPG forums (Keeping within the guidlines). Thats acctually kind of the point in having them. The intention here is not to "smack talk" the game, it is to help improve it as it is being developed.
Agreed.
4. Of corse people are quick to complain about a games weakness. Why would someone complain about a games strong points?
As for pointing out the weakness of a game, especialy if its still in beta or on the PTRs, it helps the devs create new stuff or fix the problems. But it is human nature to find faults regardless of the context.
5. As far as war between Klingons and the Federation, have you ever read the new time line for STO and what has been transpiring for when the game launches?
This will forever change the face of the Star Trek franchise... like Worf isnt part of the enterprise crew at all or the dominion war could have gone the other way for the federation...meaning the klingons would be at war with the federation. To many varibles in this situation to explain.
Um, I missed the ui, any pictures? or was I not paying attention?