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AvA Dissaster... redesign needed quickly
ponerr
Member Posts: 24
Alliances are a bad system
No agency repect those in the alliance only use them as allows... At any second chance, they will dump the alliance after milking it, or rage quit cuz they think others are losers just because one day no numbers showed up...
After playing 7 days, i have been in 18 alliances and all agencies who entered, act like they are king shit and treat others poorly and demand, and ragequit as soon as they find out the others are not the zerg (meat shield) guild they were looking for to stop the internal bleeding of not being able to gain territory because they dont have 15 strike forces.
Alliance blocking thru time must be formed so this rage quitting ends.. Better yet, just ermove the alliances and put in factions, becuase everyone and their mother knows this is what is going to have to happen.
This game is just too demanding of time on its core base... Noone can achieve this level of play daily. This means you must have large large agencies which means you have bad bad players.. which further decreases morale.....
[Mod Edit]
-- Pon --
Comments
/agree with the fact that they need to overhaul AvA. It is broken it and it needs major fixing...i am open to how to fix it....but it needs fixing.
you're in BETA. Name a game that has a totally stable environment in BETA. when everything settles in, so will the players.
its going live in 2 days. and you can bet that what you see now is what you will get.
seriously, this circle has repeated a billions times before, havent people already learned that using the pathetic "BUT ITS BETA" excuse always come around and bite them in the ass?
NOTHING IS GOING TO CHANGE IN 2 DAYS. AvA sucks now, will suck in release, and will keep sucking 3 months after release....if this game manages to survive 3 months, something that i seriously doubt....
The actual gameplay in GA is great, but I do agree AvA needs a lot of work yet. I like no sub content so far, and have honestly already gotten my $44 out of the game. AvA leaves a lot to be desired however, I don't plan to sub unless some things are re-worked. Mostly it is very time oriented, the times conquest is "open" I am never able to login. I work mornings, and the afternoon I am busy. I usually log in a few hours before going to bed which is around 9-10pm cst, right after the zones have closed off. So basically I have not even gotten to try AvA yet, it's always closed when I want to play so end up just queing.
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-Currently playing FFXIV, and BDO.
So does that mean it's an MMO now?
So does that mean it's an MMO now?
The "Is GA an MMORPG?" debate thread is that way, no need to derail this topic which pertains to AvA for those who have played it.
AvA needs time to mature. Over time players are going to build strong alliances which can function 7 days a week.
Just give it time, HiRez can't patch in players who work as a team.
Yeah, any game mechanic that tries to force players to act mature will only end up seriously limiting or breaking any type of true PvP.
All of the complaints from the Original OP sounds like growing pains to me.
Wait until there are more players in the AvA system before complaining too much. Unless the features of the system are broken, which is a different story. Forcing players to retain an alliance for any period of time will only cause bickering and infighting and keep them from doing what they want or they sabotage the alliance in some way....
Another thing is the mature and truly good leaders may be waiting for the release... Do not want to give away their tactics now and possibly lose an advantage. Just take the time to note the Alliance leaders and Agency leaders who seem to be the most pathetic and avoid them come release time.
Say hello, To the things you've left behind. They are more a part of your life now that you can't touch them.
So the alliance system is "fail" because people don't get along?
I don't want factions. If I can't get along with the 13 year old interwebz champions, why the hell would I want them in my alliance anyhow?
I don't see this as fail at all.
Now, if there is something else that I am not aware of then please elaborate.
Uhgm, alliances mean nothing... obviously you have not been in any.. Every Agency thinks they are the shit... And try to get in alliances for meat shields.. You honestly think this will change as time goes bye? You are a fool. The second that one meat shield zerg agency that mass recruits starts losing its numbers, will lead to the other agency to defend the others hexes... This leads to fuck you attitude from the other agency covering their ass.. soon thereafter its bye bye alliance time..
This happens at a record pace of about 60 minutes time.. This is then done daily...Too much work, there is no fucking Agency that can keep its numbers high at these times, I had a record number of players telling me they were looking forward to Sundays huge battle.. out of 80 telling me they were going to be there and anxious to be there.. 5 people showed up... yet again another alliance member who also had a whopping 3 show up.. he decided to be a punk and try and use our 5 members to defend "HIS AGENCY" hexes. At this point, I did not give a fuck and gave up and let the players just play but yes that agency will be removed for exploiting my members for his goals.. He did not care about the alliance, he cared about hexes with his agencies name on them... Every fucking day is a new fucking asshole agency rage spewing bullshit and I ain't going to manage it.. I will walk away as you have seen in beta, everyone has already walked away.. Amongst every 5000 players maybe one leader.. and if the leaders wont lead.. have fun in your pvp pug fest.
If they make factions, the factions will unite the agencies and small guilds can manage their own... Together it wont matter who is backstabbing who;... As a faction will gain points and then can battle forever.. and groups will work together to fix and make their faction better.. they will spend time to train other members who are not that good or don't get the point.. Then even losing dont matter, as points will continue to be a basis of achievement and recognition.
This whole concept of backstabbing is the main problem and not a selling point and its already been fucking abused to the max... its beyond pathetic.I would bet that the winning agency at the end changed their agency name 500 times just bcause thye bullshitted so many agencies everyday to not get attacked or act like they are merging or caring.. its pathetic
I've seen alliances that own 3/4 of the map not last 24 hours.. its fucking halrious and its outright stupid.. I have 6 leaders in my agency and 80 member.s. All the leaders already have quit... They also see no point, they see no way possible to defend just a few hexes daily, and everyday of the week.. and whats the point of owning just a few hexes anyway.. not gonna win a game.
Lets say an alliance owned the 5/6th of the map for 28 days and broke up.... what happens then? Oh the one with the most land wins.. so yeah ugh, the alliance with the biggest agency. will do this... quit the alliance... have the most land.. win... Thanks other agencies.. its was fun.. we have ll the land now and game is over.. ha ha..
Its stupid.. factions will bring the entire population together... how many is depending on the numbers int he game but without them.. this game wont last 60 days online.. it will be more fail and a bigger laugh than Darkfall
-- Pon --
I understand the frustration on this... You could possibly even be right about the whole thing.
My thought tho ( based on not having played, to be honest ) is there are guilds out there or groups out there that are waiting to get all of their members in there and go at it.
Yes there will be infighting and back stabbing ( played a number of MMOFPS that were like that at the start ) but, through it all comes a group that will group together and own it. Resulting in lots of garbage spwewing on the BB and forumns and then the alliance breaks up and the groups rearrange themselves and you get new alliances starting out.
What I do not get and the one thing I think they should change from the current set up is a time limit on the AvA owning the map. Declare a winner or whatever just, do not reset the map. Where is the fun in taking it from someone if it is all of the work for a 2 day period at the end of the month> Or, you have kept it all month only to lose it at the 11th hour before a victor is decided upon.
Outside of that one feature, I think the AvA and map control has merrit.
Say hello, To the things you've left behind. They are more a part of your life now that you can't touch them.
Are people still using this tired old excuse? Are you delusional enough to believe you're convincing anyone else let alone yourself?
This is getting old hat but, the response does have some merrit.
Trying to base how a community will evolve and work when there is a finite number of players in a beta test envirenment of an Open Beta is a bit premature.
Still, I agree that the response is about as usefull as " STFU RTFM! ".
Say hello, To the things you've left behind. They are more a part of your life now that you can't touch them.
There is not one leading agency of any value in this game that thinks its alliance agency is of any value to care. If it did they would just merge under one name and all the small guilds in the world are not going to merge into one regular Global Agenda guild.. cuz that would just be lulz
There is not one small guild here that has 30-80 members of avg weekly playtime that can compete in global agenda.
This has been proven... you will need 30 players online everyday at game time to compete. and have alliances of the same
Not once a week, not 4 times a week.. 7 days a week... Everyday forever... not just your agency, all your allied agencies..
AS STATED, its too much, it kills the alliance on this fact alone... Imagine how your agency would feel getting 12 hexes and 2 shileds up and then your 3 strike forces can no longer be free because you must defend your hexes and your neighbors because they didnt show up... you start losing land at a record pace... what if they show up but just constantly lose? but you constantly win? You get upset at them.. what if they are backstabbing you???? Using you to build resources they are just selling on the side to another alliance they are soon to merge with??? You protcted and fed them.. who is now your enemy.. its just stupid
-- Pon --
Tabula Rasa had a fix for this. Makes people do a little research before the join a guild/clan/Alliance. They made you wait 7 days before you joined another guild. Alot of people hated that feature but it stopped people from guild jumping. Might be an idea GA might want to pick up
Tabula Rasa had a fix for this. Makes people do a little research before the join a guild/clan/Alliance. They made you wait 7 days before you joined another guild. Alot of people hated that feature but it stopped people from guild jumping. Might be an idea GA might want to pick up
Yeah, i already opinionated and told them to introduce an alliance join feature, if they left and alliance they'd have to wait 7,10, 30 days or something ridiculous. to stop the rage quits... but if you read my posts, it will not be enough..
The game doesn't function with "little agencies" forming an alliance.. has nothing to do with evolution.... Has to do with pride and tell me if your 50 man agency is going to defend 10 hexes that are owned by your alliance agency that gets all the resources because its in their name.... the answer is not just a no, because it means nothing to have nothing and if you cant capture a land.. you are nothing and that's why this game will NEVER EVER even come close to functioning... but tell me its beta, and it will change.. for 1 the population will only increase by about 20%.. its not a huge title.. and never going to be.. and after a month itll drop 50% cuz no one is going to pay, all these small clans playing with drop this game, and they may drop it before start now that BBC2 is out in 2 days...
Its not good outlook for GA, and I definitely cant see spending my 25 hours a week working for a lost cause... leading a bunch of bad players who you repeatably say SHOOT THE MEDIC but they don't even seem to be able to spot the medic..
[Mod Edit]
-- Pon --
Factions = population imbalance.
No thanks.
strict 10v10 setting
who cares?
you dont want a faction and 10 bucks says you wont be here in 21 days still playing
And ill bet you my game cd key on.. after 2 rounds of forced pvp in final day of beta, i seriously cant stand this game no more..
I been atlking to the alliance on my vent and the whole alliance is quitting, they said their members aint interested in the ava, and the leaders agree that its too much.. so tehre you have it folks... game is over before it started.. 100,000 copies sold
50,000 never will be activated.. haha
later. im done here, off to bbc2
-- Pon --
These problems will work out over time. You have people in the game right now who aren't paying for it and have no intention of ever subbing, and so they have a "who gives a shit" attitude. Chances are the people who will end up being the leaders of successful Alliances in the future haven't even started playing yet. It takes time for groups of people to really get organized and find good leadership. You're expecting this to be all set even before the game is released? Player-run Alliances is a great idea that should not be scrapped so hastily even before the game is released. Give it a chance.
Your deluded if you think putting in a couple of factions that people will need to join will mean people on your faction will now help you. Faction pride that existed in games like DAOC is non-existant nowadays in games like WAR or Aion. Heck i've wanted to kill my own faction more than the enemy sometimes.
HiRez have already talked about limiting AvA days from 7days a week. They have had a poll up about "Length of Zone Open Hours?" since the 15th of Jan and one about "AvA zone days" since the 23rd of Jan. The community asked for changes and Hirez have responded positively and quickly which is more than most developers. I remember playing AAA mmo's where the developers either had no communication or said they would fix it but 3 months later nothing had been done.
yeah a concept of total failure from every perspective is going to be carrassed by a population of people who will impulse buy the game, which is only on sale via Steam, or perhaps a few copies printed for Amazon.com.. This is a indie title has no publishing power, no connections, which means no game on best buy shelves.. where are these players coming out of the woodwork from?
The hardcore players already agree, there is no point.. For one.. what is winning? There isnt even a explanation of what the game rules are.. lulz... conquer the map with your allegience.. what if my agency was in an alliance and my agency defeated 90% of the map, and then we split... do they win? do we win.. and What is winning??? Oh i won a title.. and some credz.. who the heck cares, its pointless and i guess you nubs havent learned how stupid it really is.
It doesnt even have a point.. you think because there is a game of hexes that is going to be a reason for players to play 80 hours a week of the same repetiive zerg gayness..
Its a designed game where cant even have your team practice.. they have no clue how to get better, which means you control a bunch of pugs that dont listen.. yeah tell me how long that will last...
a community will evolve.. evolve around what? EPEEN? hahahah never.. you will see shortly i guess....some take longer to learn
-- Pon --
no thanks, dont need a game catered for a 6th grader, with overpowered weapons and weak skills and super fast moron cloaked recons that hack you down before you can even click your mouse.. actually you do click your mouse when you see em coming but the game is so gay there is no enuff time even if automated the faggot skillless preschooler woudl get the kill.. oh i can have a medic follow me around the whole game to trump that... problem being.. there are no medics.. cuz healing is fucking gay... and the medics are combat medics... like you... hahaha fucking sad... why would you pick combat medic? i mean you switch to combat medic if your team turns out to be under DPS, to get what Firepowe you can.. but to spec it intentionally? lol nub..
So if they offer a lifetime sub you think you'll grab one?
LMAO
While I agree ava needs work, the core gameplay itself is still a blast. It's easily worth the $44, but maybe not the sub yet.
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-Currently playing FFXIV, and BDO.
I agree with some of the things people have said in this thread. I am having fun playing the matches, but I think it's a mistake to have limited the AvA part to such restricted hours of play. I don't understand the logic in restricting the part you have to pay for. I think that is their biggest blunder.
There are many scenarios that can be counterproductive to making AvA work.
For instance, what if my agency/alliance is only focusing on one or two zones, and when I go to log on, that zone is locked (because it is outside my time of play). Well, the solution is to not play, or resort to looking for another agency in my time zone? This is already occurring in my agency because we have members in the US and EU.
Again, I think this is a major mistake on their part. It really is fun game play , but the map system needs ironing out.
I'll play the first "free" month of AvA, but if nothing changes after that, I find it really difficult to see myself continuing with a subscription.
HiRez have said they intend to have AvA open 24/7 so i imagine that means they will just open up more AvA zones. They need to have some sort of window or people will burn out trying to defend their territory is every hex is open 24/7. AvA isn't perfect yet but HiRez seem determined to improve it for the better.
Perhaps it'll be changed to not be open every day then!
"If all you can say is... "It's awful, it's not innovative, it's ugly, it's blah.." Then you're an unimaginative and unpolished excuse for human life" -eburn