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Windows 7 or Vista 64 Premium or focus on the graphics card
Belgaraath
Member UncommonPosts: 3,205
Does anyone notice any large performance gains on their gaming PCs when upgrading from Vista to Windows 7? Is it really worth the $119 if you are strictly curious to see how it improves performance on your PC with regard to MMOs? I'm always torn where to begin. Ive had my PC for just over a year now. I have a Nvidia GTX 280. To upgrade performance, is it better to start with Windows 7, see how that goes, and if the gain isn't incremental enough add a second GTX 280? Sorry, I've never considered upgrading before since I always buy a new PC every 3 years.
Operating System: Windows Vista™ Home Premium (6.0, Build 6002) Service Pack 2 (6002.vistasp2_gdr.091208-0542)
Language: English (Regional Setting: English)
System Manufacturer: MICRO-STAR INTERNATIONAL CO.,LTD
System Model: MS-7380
BIOS: Default System BIOS
Processor: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q9550 @ 2.83GHz (4 CPUs), ~2.8GHz
Memory: 8190MB RAM
Page File: 1919MB used, 14512MB available
Windows Dir: C:Windows
DirectX Version: DirectX 11
DX Setup Parameters: Not found
DxDiag Version: 7.00.6002.18107 32bit Unicode
There Is Always Hope!
Comments
Man, your computer is pretty fast. Why do you need it to speed up? I wonder that your directx says 32bit while you claim you have 8GB. Are you using 64bit OS?
There is actually no increase of power or speed in gaming or whatsoever coming from vista to W7. It just boots faster and few other small things, but speed wise it is almost identical.
you could always download the software, burn it to disc install it and see what its like. Obviously thats illegal but hey who doesn't do it!? Then if you really wanna fork out $$$ for the software theres no stopping you
upgrading from vista to win7 is not going to give you added performance. if you check out some tech sites that compare the two, you'll see that on some benchmarks vista will be better, while others win7 will be better. but its all negligible. give or take a few fps or a few seconds for mem read/write or hd read/writes, etc.. i wouldnt even call it an 'upgrade'.
i enjoyed vista when i was using it, but then i put win7 on my rig. each have their own quirks to get used to. for instance, in win 7, it will not let u arrange your folders the way u want them. if you want folder A to come after folder X but before folder Z. you are out of luck. vista will let you do that, but win7 auto-arranges your directories and you cannot turn it off. but win7 will let you winkey+tab/alt+tab through you apps in a more intuitive manner than vista.
just my thoughts. a 2nd vid card will give u more performance in games than going from vista to win7 would. (make sure u got a good psu to support 2 vid cards) but if you just want to try win7 cause its new, that's not a bad reason either. i got a gtx280 as well but an x38 mobo so i cant go dual-gpu with an nvidia card
You actually have to choose to run the 64-bit version of dxdiag or it'll run the 32-bit version of the app, that's the thing you're seeing in his log.
But yea, going Vista to 7 isn't really a performance boost, it just runs nicer and smarter. If you have a .edu address you could pick up Win7 Pro 64 bit for $68 btw. But yea video card would help a lot more.
mm gear wise i wouldnt touch it ,nothing out there right now can rise speed
one 2 techno can help you
direct cache access (if you have an intel )
the other i ll link the site instead
http://kadaitcha.cx/vista/index.html window 7 tweak were added not long ago
http://www.speedguide.net/
those are 2 great site to get goo tip that will speed up you system
MAKE SURE TO READ ALL CAUTION BEFORE APPLYING TWEAK!
once you applied speedguide.net you ll notice that you hit your internet provider limit and you dont want that to happen since everytime your provider system has to do it they lower your speed from 20 to 30% slower yes i know they hhare arsh
i eard on the net there is a way to limit your system you self just shy of the cap .025 if i recall but so far havent found info
since its a very old trick nobody remember the registery key for it
and yes it is avail in w7 but it has to be manually setting and figgle with till you dont hit the bump but are at the fastest still
videotron speed test. is a nice tool for that since there is a needle so you see it when it does that speed bump drop
http://testvitesse.videotron.ca/index-fr.html test it first test each tweak here one at a time and retest test them together separate
why?some brand have tweak that are new feature not many know.these retest arent to check if you ll speed up by the way these are to emsure you dont slow down!since the speed is locked by your provider there shouldnt be big variation of speed
last do not apply any registery tweak from speedguide.net espacially if you have w7
w7 have lot of internal tweak that people dont know about and some speedguide tweak will affect those in a bad way
the rest on the w7 tweak page of speedguide are all good (netsh tweak)
direct cache access (intel)is one such feature ,the short of it is
it link the network to you processor cache directly(ram is very slow compared to cache)
If you are thinking of upgrading,then just overclock everything.There is some software on the net to help you,or just take it to a tech guy and ask him or get him to max o/c it.You can o/c without spending any money ,but to get the max o/c you will need more cooling.You have nothing to lose if you plan on upgrading anyhow.If you want maximum O/C then ask your tech guy about adding more cooling that can also be kept to use on upgrade or new PC,that way you can use it to o/c your new PC when you get it ,so it is not a waste of money.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Why would you EVER spend money on an operating system when you can get it for free off the internet?
TORRENTS ARE YOUR FRIEND
That is, if you happen to be a cheap thief.
That is, if you happen to be a cheap thief.
Hope he doesn't do the same thing with PC games, PC market is kinda dying
That is, if you happen to be a cheap thief.
Hope he doesn't do the same thing with PC games, PC market is kinda dying
I see this as partly good. Hopefully in the future the primary media for releasing games will be digital distribution, and the prices for a new game will be much lower.
drazzah you are right linux is free!and its avail on torrent!
That is, if you happen to be a cheap thief.
Hope he doesn't do the same thing with PC games, PC market is kinda dying
Its not being a cheap thief, its being a smart thief.
-And i dont do it for pc games because i dont play single player games.
-To DrBaltazar
Linux is free, but why would i use linux. Windows 7 is so much better, without the headaches.
after that you wonder why microsoft will bring out drm
i know a lot who pirate those ,doesnt mather why.i heard microsoft is working on a toy for their update website
once they find out that your copy isnt legal they deactivate all computer component including bios!then they shut down computer
then send a lock to bios provider .so once you are detected the bios mprovider its self lock the thing for bios so after that you computer is worth less got to buy a new motherboard
once you ve been locked out all you computer info is on a list if one on the list match ,process is repeated again automaticly
without warning .another mobo .grin
so all you pirate out there count your blessing because once microsoft stability phaze is finish
i wouldnt like to be a pirate
Well, a thief with a little hassle. People without a second computer have gotten burned by this with the WinXP keygen/crack back in the day. Remember the one that after a certain autoupdate, it ended up locking people out of WinXP until they entered a legit code and re-activated it? That is if they didn't pooch a corporate copy.
Personally, I buy my core applications and that includes the OS and antivirus software. Not because I need support, I don't. It's because after years of cracking software it's so much easier just to throw the disk in and type a code than download it, unrar it, realize it was some jerk that password protected it with some Spam site, redownload it again, unrar it, find the crack, realize the crack doesn't work, find a crack that works, install the OS and then set everything back up. Meh, I'll just pay the money. Most of my core apps are cheap or are GNU anyway. The expensive ones are owned by the company I work for and are justified as I take a lot of my work home with me.
As for games, I used to pirate everything under the sun. What I noticed is that a lot of hard core pirates and myself included (at the time), download stuff ... just to download stuff. Half the programs and games I downloaded from the Newsgroups, I didn't ever install. The ones that I did install, half the time I never used. My god, if I started using all the apps I had back in the day, I would be some kind of Maya, Soft Image, Lightwave, 3DStudio Max expert with almost every studio plugin available. But, yeah ... I'm not. The reason I mention this : The people who are downloading the PC games illegally more than likely wouldn't play them if they couldn't pirate them. They are usually not a lost customer.
That being said back to the OP. The only performance gain you will get from Windows 7 vs. Vista is memory management and that could also be negligable on how well tuned your current system is. At 8 gigs of RAM, I am assuming that your pagefile has been disabled. There is no need for it in a 64-bit OS and that much memory. Also, Windows 7 seems to have some of it's services turned off by default vs. nearly everything turned on in Vista out of the box. However, if you are like me, the first thing I do after a fresh install and update is to disable every service that I don't need (Readyboost, Superfetch, Windows Search, etc.) Most of those services slow down the OS by forcing it to hard drive frequently. Also, I would recommend turning off System Protection in either Vista or Windows 7. If you don't the OS takes some of it's resources and dedicates them to backing up DLLs and registry entries in the background.
What you will notice is that Windows 7 seems a little more polished than Vista. Yes, you can fine tune Vista to be pretty lean. However, the apps that Windows 7 installs are much more solid and seem to have a little more time to bake.
For MMOs, you won't notice too much of a performance increase with SLI or Crossfire. You will get some performance increase, but you will also get headaches as some MMO have had problems that crop up out of nowhere when running in SLI mode. This means there could be patches that force you to switch to single GPU mode, restart your system and reload the game. Also, MMOs tend to be more CPU heavy than normal standalone FPS games. This means that you won't see as much improvement switching to SLI with something like AoC when comparing the performance gains from Crysis. Also, once again, some older standalone FPS may have problems with SLI. Which becomes compounded when some games only work with a few versions back of an nVidia driver and other games may only work with the latest version of nVidia driver. Usually these problems crop up only when trying to use the computer in SLI mode.
Thanks everyone. After reading all of these very helpful posts, I've decided just to stay put. The effect on my MMO experience seems like it would be negligible not matter what path I choose and may only cause headaches if I try SLI. I'm not really having any issues, I always just like to feel ahead of the curve :-). At the moment, I'm only playing Allods and Dragon Age Origins. I do notice some issues with Vista when I upgraded my McAfee Total Protection (now just use Windows Defender and Avira Free) and some installations sometimes freeze over the last year or so that I wasnt experiencing with XP, but I work around those as frustrating as it can be sometimes. I always like to play everything at max, so if Star Wars Online is a good game in 2011 and it doesnt let me do that, Ill just buy a new PC lol.
Thanks also for the sites for tweaking and the info I didnt realize about dxdiag. I am using Vista 64bit.
There Is Always Hope!
a smart pirate never makes a show of it or brags about it, this is done by noobs who actually think they're effin' the system and think they're the smart ones.
do you have any idea why software costs so much money, do you even know how to use photoshop besides adding "can i haz a noobz burgr" to a crappy picture and yes, most of the free world knows about torrents and what they are and make the morally comfortable choice for themselves on whether to support further development, artists or advancements to the industry.
____________________________
TheCore
PUFF PUFF PASS
This will never happen, that would be illegal on MS part and they don't need
any more bad press then they already get.
Assassin's like to do it in the dark and from behind.
Photoshop is overly expensive. If it was $100 or possibly even $200, I would definitely buy it. I wouldn't have a problem buying it. I would be happy to give them the money for it!
But sadly, the problem is I can't afford it. I can't pay $600 for photoshop, no matter how much I want to and how much I would like to help them by giving them money for a spectacular product.
(take note, I never said anything about pirating it)
There are some products, that cost too much just for the sake of costing too much. Microsoft could lower the price of their OS's and they did a good job with the price model for 7. But companies like Adobe, still charge way too much for many of their products. There is no reason for it, they would more than likely make more money by charging less.
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You can still run a second nvidia video card in these boards you can not do SLI but running it as a physx processor helps with performance in games. I have a DP45SG i run a GTX275 as my main GPU and a 9800GTX as a physx processor. Overall i have found that running a second video card as a physx processor nets me a larger performance increase than SLI.
Photoshop is overly expensive. If it was $100 or possibly even $200, I would definitely buy it. I wouldn't have a problem buying it. I would be happy to give them the money for it!
But sadly, the problem is I can't afford it. I can't pay $600 for photoshop, no matter how much I want to and how much I would like to help them by giving them money for a spectacular product.
(take note, I never said anything about pirating it)
There are some products, that cost too much just for the sake of costing too much. Microsoft could lower the price of their OS's and they did a good job with the price model for 7. But companies like Adobe, still charge way too much for many of their products. There is no reason for it, they would more than likely make more money by charging less.
the student edition of photoshop CS4 is $199, just in case anyone is curious on purchasing a copy that has a valid student ID
"If you want a picture of the future, imagine a robot foot stomping on a human face -- forever."
w7 as gaming goes vs vista 64 bit!im sorry to say unless ms have hidden feature your money will be better spent on a dx11
ready card and even the graphic card today (dx11 model )isnt worth buying !why woul i say something like this!i just upgraded
my system the whole nine yard took the simple approach for proccessor(x2 instead of x4,because i hope asus,amd and the network card i got will support direct cache access in the futur
wich isnt right now so on that front find out if the system you have support direct cache access(netbios 2.0 feature basicly)
as for your system your better of going to a the cinema etc.
or check out speedguide.net
kadaitcha.cx both exelent site to speed oup or optimize speed
the problem is there are no game design for the way multiple core or graphic multiple tread works
i have a ati 5770,its not faster but it can push a lot of tread simultanously
but since all game or most of them are made for the single tread graphic card(ati just got this on the 5xxx serie)
it will take 10 years for the techno to be used
its like eq2 when they checked proc speed it hasnt when up in a freaking long time so what they did!
you can process lot of smaller tread simultanously ,so many in fact the game maker dont know what to do or how to apply it to gaming.so thats where we re stuch
,even when we do see dx11 title i doubt it will be designed for newer machine like yours it will be designed for p4 yera computer
win7 was supposed to improve my performance? lol
I've kind of seen the opposite when switching from XP. Basically all I got was an oversimplified windows XP with some flashy add-on's to slow me down (I do like the CPU speedometre tho xD). Since I switched most of my games can't be played smoothly on max settings anymore
If you want better performance you should consider an SSD for your OS and games. I'ts a huge performance upgrade. I would recomend the Intel X25-M. Now SSDs are expensive if you count dollar per gb, but don't think of them as storage, think of them as a performance upgrade. Load times will be minimal, and in a game like wow, all NPC will actually load before you fly past them on your flying mount
nha ssd is good only if you got a big game if you play aika still game(500 mb footprint)it wont help you at all
best second solution is deactivate paging file,i wont show this here but its helps ,the two link i posted earlier speak a lot about those
MAKE SURE TO READ THE WARNING!IF YOU DONT UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU ARE READING ,DONT APPLY THE TWEAK
or you might hate me with good reason lol!but if you read the op warning and understand what hes saying
and you arent concerned by what he say then apply those tweak
last warning some suggest 4 gb of ram if you applied kadaitcha.cx and your a mmo gamer then i recommend 6 gig or ram!
ps:i just recalled there is a trick avail .i think kingston make those for eve server
its called ramdisk or ramdrive.try to find a review about those since theres a lot of badder one
it basicly make a hardrive out of your spare memory .i stopped using that in w7 64 ,(any 64 bit os probably dont need this
but a 32 bit system might like this tweak as it will boost performance by a lot .but make sure that the memory is more the your system
my recommendation on this is leave 4 gig to your computer and add another 4 gig for your ramdrive if you plan to go that route
that way everything will be (a bit )safe.since it isnt made by windows .i dont really love this piece of techno often they tend to slow system down in the long term.your better off going 64 bit in my view.
Also, Gimp is free, and almost as good as Photoshop.. interface takes a little getting used to, but for what most people use Photoshop for Gimp is great. Between that, my $30 student copy of Win7, and OpenOffice.org, I have all legit software for very cheap for once.