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PvP needs another direction..
Lord.Bachus
Member RarePosts: 9,686
Why do all these developers create PvP engame based on 2 sides (WoW like) my best PvP memories come from DAoC where the 3rd realm in PVP gave that extra .
My favourite endgame PvP would be a world with 5 factions and several endgame PvP zones where those factions could fight it out defending castles and little villages... fighting over mines and woods and fishing grounds...
People would end up in one of these 5 factions based on their ingame actions and decisons...
Rewards for PvP should be in minor abbilites and stat an AA system of some kind... and not only in Armor...
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Comments
Well, I don't like RvR setting at all. I much more prefer GuildVGuild (FFA) PvP when you and your buddies are creating faction. Played L2, EVE and now DF (none have RvR). Please avoid phrase "all games".
Fair enough as some players don't want to be niched into a certain race, nation, faction, but aren't you basically creating the concept of a RvR game when you go GuildvGuild? Maybe RvR isn't the right all incompressing term.
Ether way having only 2 sides limits what you can do.
SWG (pre-cu) - AoC (pre-f2p) - PotBS (pre-boarder) - DDO - LotRO (pre-f2p) - STO (pre-f2p) - GnH (beta tester) - SWTOR - Neverwinter
Play Darkfall you can fight whole world with your clan no restrictions.
Games played:AC1-Darktide'99-2000-AC2-Darktide/dawnsong2003-2005,Lineage2-2005-2006 and now Darkfall-2009.....
In between WoW few months AoC few months and some f2p also all very short few weeks.
2 side RvR is pretty bad solution.
It doesn't allow to form any alliances.
RvRvR is a little bit better, but the game has to automatically offer an über race.
This isn't a good solution either.
Beside all the rvr, isn't it about time that games offer full house since first login, not after getting highest lvl ?
Sandbox is t3h shit
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/thread
Remember, your advantage lies in your opponent's weakness (J)
DF misses the boat on many fronts. Yes, creating yoru own faction is cool.
However, what is not cool is FFA PvP. Not fun, IMO. Grinding skills by a "use it to improve it" system. Not very immersive, IMO. Macros used to raise "use it to improve it" skill system.
FPS combat. Doesn't work for an RPG, IMO. No content to do meaningful PvE.
I agree that two sides is not enough, you need at least 3. Best case is players make sides, but I'd like to see this in an RvR environment, not FFA.
I think the issue that needs the most attention in PvP is that:
Majority of players do not necessarily find bloody battles FFA gankfest the most interesting way to have PvP.
RvR is actually the first step to a solution, but no matter how many factions you have, you need interaction between allies and enemies and not just a bloodbath. I mean bloodbath is alot of fun, but doing it all the time can become rather boring after a while.
The intricate art of war is what is addictive in PvP and no so much the slaughter itself. Killing and being killed lose its meaning when everyone can simply respawn without any tactical value added to it. I think this goes back to PvP's core design and seems to be something that can be remedied without too much trouble.
We'll see, since PvP itself gave the only direction necessary. Pitting Player vs. Players, but I suppose it is more of the HOW the PvP is conducted will become more important in the future. Direction wise, it is pretty straight forward.
I like the way Pirates of the burning sea does it.
4 factions all fighting over all the ports.
It makes for a fun game and some good battles. You form Alliance with a faction one day and the next are in a full blow war with them, its great fun.
Sooner or Later
In terms of RvR, DAOC had a pretty good formula that worked for the most part. Why some other developers haven't looked into replicating it I don't know. Why Mythic chose Warhammer over DAOC 2...I don't know. I'm dying for another DAOC, the anytime RvR, the all nighter sieges & relic raids.. ahh good times.
EQ1-AC1-DAOC-FFXI-L2-EQ2-WoW-DDO-GW-LoTR-VG-WAR-GW2-ESO
DAOC's RVR model was about the best I've seen to date. I remember times when I was in the middle of battle with the humans, and you didn't know how the Hibernians were going to side, and then you saw one of them wave at you, indicating that the temporary alliance was on, and next thing you knew, the Albions were being turned back and fought back to their home keep (or wherever). It was even stranger because you couldn't communicate, so you had to take hand signals as a sign of an alliance.
My blog:
http://www.littlesarbonn.com
linren hinted at the root issue. Most players want close fights where their decisions matter. FFA PVP involves one-sided fights where decisions don't matter much. Things are so one-sided that the fight's victor is predetermined, which undermines player decisions (and player decisions -- interactivity -- is basically the reason to play videogames over other forms of entertainment.)
But that's only if you're talking about FFA World PVP.
If we're just talking about a 3-faction system (or any number of factions really) then you can design gameplay where the above shortcomings aren't true. Planetside is an excellent example.
It's only when you talk about features like world PVP, world factions, and FFA PVP that a game's design works itself into a corner where player decisions matter less and one-sided battles dominate gameplay.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver