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Update - plans till release (and beyond)
Kharum
Member Posts: 94
"Hello everyone!
I know everyone is anxious to start playing Xsyon. We're working around the clock to get players in this week, but at this point all I can promise is that this will happen as soon as possible. Our priority is getting the game as solid as possible.
I'd like to update all of you on the current state of development and how we plan to proceed over the next month.
Before we let players in we need to finish and fix a few things. Specifically we are:
- Finishing the latest Speed Tree implementation.
- Optimizing terrain to reduce the initial download.
- Testing and tweaking combat changes. We're reworking the combat system somewhat after taking into consideration some of the discussions on the forum. Instead of having to select a target, you will be attacking whatever is in range and your aim (center view point in 1st person, mouse cursor in 3rd person) will determine your specific intended target.
- Continuing testing and improving creature AI.
- Checking, organizing and finalizing data files.
- Fixing existing bugs and continuing testing all systems.
One we are ready, we need to pack up the latest files and upload them to our patch and main servers.
Over the next month our main goals are:
- To finish our weight and encumbrance system.
- To finish interfaces for the tribe and totem system.
- Additional improvements to the tribe system based on what has been discussed on the forums.
- Adding more data (creatures in particular).
- Continued testing, tweaking and improving the systems.
There's not too much to do given a month's time. Our biggest problem is that most of what remains to be finished should be done before we start letting players into the world.
A new programmer joined the team this weekend and we may add another programmer next week to ensure that we can do what is needed for this final push.
Some of you expressed concerns on how we will let players into the game before the April 15th launch date and what happens if we experience a huge influx of players.
Here is the plan:
As soon as we can, we will let players into the game in small groups of 20-50. If we encounter problems we fix them. If not, we let in another group right away, until all the pre-order players are in.
We will wipe the world as necessary and will wipe again one last time before the official launch date. We hope to do the final wipe one week before the Prelude begins, to give you pre-release players a chance to lay the foundations by building your tribes and towns. This will depend on how many more players join us and how you all react to the current game systems.
If we start to get too many pre-orders, we will take down the pre-order page until April 15th.
If we have a solid player base but feel the need for a final wipe on April 15th, we will likely not take orders for a week or two to allow the first tribes to settle in.
If at any point we are getting too many players rushing to order, we will stop taking orders and limit the number of new players per month. Our goal is not to have an influx of 10,000 players, but to let the community grow slowly over the summer. What are the numbers we are looking for? I'm guessing about 500 before April 15th, building slowly to around 5000 active players by the end of summer.
If the game feels empty at any point, we let in more players. We will see how it goes, but I want you all to understand that this will be a controlled launch designed to create a solid and fun community. We can and will adjust to make sure that the first players can build a solid foundation and not be overrun with players from the start. If we need to stop letting in players while we balance the game for the current players to enjoy, we will. In other words, our focus is the game and the community, not trying to get as many player as quickly as possible.
I'm now going to bury my head in some code. I plan not to follow the forums until we are letting players in. Then I will be back to answer all questions. I ask you all to be patient while we continue to do our best to bring you this unique game you've all been waiting for!
Thanks!
Jordi Grau Davis"
Source: http://www.xsyon.com/forums/5-announcements/5958-from-the-developers
Waiting on Xsyon & betaing stuff
Comments
I think that will be key for a lot of people.
-MrDDT
awesome!
I def hope preorders do get in this week, i want some videos!
Also the combat changes they said they are working on is awesome, glad they took that into consideration.
Also im not to sure about the limiting players thing.. thats like what darkfall did on release.
So they only want 500 at release and 5000 players by the end of summer? that seems very weird...
Dunno will see how it goes, IF the game has all the features then I suppose they will have the ability to be elitist lol.
Some of those changes sound like something they should have had done by now. And adding new programmers to help with the push? Anyone who has programmed should know that one of the hardest things you can do is learn someone else's program. A programmer just coming into the project won't be any help for a while. Especially when talking about something as complex as a MMO.
Well the combat change the devs said was really quick and easy to do.. instead of pressing tab or whatever then using LMB to attack you just press LMB and you target/hit the closet thing to you.
basiccally only a melee combat change as range is fps ish
www.xsyon.com/forums/6-general-discussion/5959-from-the-developers-topic
On top of that the idea is not to be elitist or to create a huge hype but for a smooth release and steady/controlled population growth. Jooky does not want 1000000 players in all at once. This has nothing to do with the servers not being able to handle the load but does allow for easier management should any unexpected hiccups occur.
Some of those changes sound like something they should have had done by now. And adding new programmers to help with the push? Anyone who has programmed should know that one of the hardest things you can do is learn someone else's program. A programmer just coming into the project won't be any help for a while. Especially when talking about something as complex as a MMO.
One of the programmers is friends of one of the current programmers and he is showing him the ropes as he goes and getting him up to speed.
Looks like they are hoping people will blindly preorder the game with no proof of the games actual existence. Using the " We will limit how many people play " is just a tactic to drive up preorders as high as possible.
Dont like it. You either release or you dont. It honestly feels like the " limited players " is just another way of having an extended beta period after the release of the game.
In a way it is and I do not believe they are trying to hide that.
The other side of the coin is that early starters are being given an advantage that other players are perhaps never able to catch up with. So for certain players it will not be worth it to play the game when they do not belong to the select few. If so, that is not good either. It does not lure me in pre-ordering the game though, but it does make me wonder whether this is a smart move of them.
--
Delanor
Xsyon is designed in such a way that there is no true sense of "behind" and newer crafters actually have the upper hand.
Combat relies heavily on player skill since it is twitch based with manual blocking and is currently being changed (due to community request) to be more closely related to FPS then tab to target then attack.
Some weapons will be of better quality then others but this will only mean that they will last longer before breaking. As for armor, it depends what weapon you will be going up against. So, you could have amazing armor, but if it isn't built to go up against a pole arm your done for.
As for crafting, the newer crafters will actually be the ones with the upper hand. As the game evolves better technology and ways of making items will come to light, the older players that have come across this new technology but are well skilled in the old technology/method will pass the new technology onto the newer players. So, in essence the newer players will be the ones better off.
Hope that eases your mind a bit
all i read is: delayed until further notice :P
What is the thinking behind why any player/team wold do that in a PvP game? That's a serious question, btw. Basically, the design means that early starters can lock down tech and prevent or limit the rate at which others gain it. If the pre-order people are smart, they will form one massive guild and just maintain an unbeatable advantage over the newer players. An example of this would be Shadowbane's Treachery server. At release, the maps and resource locations were carried over from beta. This gave the beta players the advantage of knowing what to obtain and what to prevent others from getting in order to keep a permanent advantage. With most of the beta guilds under one umbrella (CoS), the server was quickly stomped into the ground, with the defeated players leaving the game or going to other servers and the victors left with no one to oppose them.
It seems like the dissemination of tech in Xsyon hinges on benevolence and magnanimous behaviour between rival guilds.
Never place faith in sportsmanship when gamesmanship offers greater rewards. As a developer, you have a vested interest in the longevity of the game. Your playerbase does not.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Well, that would just F over the the game play for everyone. But anyway new technology can be found and discovered as schematics so if that were to happen new people would be able to find new technology by hunting around.
I agree completely with your assessment. This is little more than pay-as-the-game -is-developed ploy targeted on desperate and disillusioned MMO players who want to be in on a new game that has little evidence of significant development outside a website (touting ambitious in-game features) and a handful of screen shots.
I agree completely with your assessment. This is little more than pay-as-the-game -is-developed ploy targeted on desperate and disillusioned MMO players who want to be in on a new game that has little evidence of significant development outside a website (touting ambitious in-game features) and a handful of screen shots.
Or like some other companies they learn from others mistakes, and instead of releasing it with 1000s of people release it with less to combat problems faster.
Dunno thats just me. (and a lot of others).
-MrDDT
What is the thinking behind why any player/team wold do that in a PvP game? That's a serious question, btw. Basically, the design means that early starters can lock down tech and prevent or limit the rate at which others gain it. If the pre-order people are smart, they will form one massive guild and just maintain an unbeatable advantage over the newer players. An example of this would be Shadowbane's Treachery server. At release, the maps and resource locations were carried over from beta. This gave the beta players the advantage of knowing what to obtain and what to prevent others from getting in order to keep a permanent advantage. With most of the beta guilds under one umbrella (CoS), the server was quickly stomped into the ground, with the defeated players leaving the game or going to other servers and the victors left with no one to oppose them.
It seems like the dissemination of tech in Xsyon hinges on benevolence and magnanimous behaviour between rival guilds.
Never place faith in sportsmanship when gamesmanship offers greater rewards. As a developer, you have a vested interest in the longevity of the game. Your playerbase does not.
Then it sounds like the playerbase will have to adapt and evolve with this game, so far this is sounding more and more like a community co-op mmo. Depletable resources and crafting that can be learned from other players means the community will have to learn to cooperate rather than fiercly compete with one another like in most MMOs. So far the only sandboxes that have come to the market and all of the themeparks have hinged primarily on competition ( i.e. who can become the uberest player/guild).
Maybe it's time for an MMO to change the rules of the game and once the playerbase realizes what it takes to prosper (work together and form alliances between their tribes) the evolution will begin. Then we as a gaming community can stop focusing on who's better, and start getting to know the people we pass in our adventures...... maybe have a little fun while we're at it.
I agree with you on a small level, but I havn't been disillusioned enough by some aging-liberal-hippie sentiment to think thats possible in real life, let alone cyberspace. The largest demographic of gamers are young and immature. At this point, I think devs are still responsible to ensure that the mechanics create fair and balanced play.
Role-playing isn't what most people want to do, and thats exactly what you would be doing if players were responsible for real-world discretion and cooperation. They would be playing the role of a considerate, thoughtful gamer, because not many are.
As for taking out the competition aspects of it, or killing the "keeping up with the joneses" attitudes, I don't see it happening or necessarily want it too. MMO's breed greed- thats just the norm, as most are loot driven. If there wasn't loot, but i only got to make "friends" and share "adventures", i'd gouge my eye out. I have freinds in real life i can share adventures with. I want to be king shit when i play an MMO- the best gear, the best stats, the most money, the most resources. Thats half the reason I play (and most others i imagine). Each piece of loot is like a goal, and thats what keeps you grinding. I don't grind so I can get more story and plot, or meet more people on the server. I grind to get the gear I need to fight the biggest and the baddest enemies in the game. Fighting/battle is a major component of this game, and about 99% of every other mmo out there and If you agree that fighting, battle, war, ect... are indeed competitions, than you can see that competition IS a major component of this game. Its unavoidable in the lexicon that is online gaming.
It is after all a video GAME!
Chris Crawford
Computer game designer Chris Crawford attempted to define the term game[1] using a series of dichotomies:
1. Creative expression is art if made for its own beauty, and entertainment if made for money. (This is the least rigid of his definitions. Crawford acknowledges that he often chooses a creative path over conventional business wisdom, which is why only one of his 13 games is a sequel.)
2. A piece of entertainment is a plaything if it is interactive. Movies and books are cited as examples of non-interactive entertainment.
3. If no goals are associated with a plaything, it is a toy. (Crawford notes that by his definition, (a) a toy can become a game element if the player makes up rules, and (b) The Sims and SimCity are toys, not games.) If it has goals, a plaything is a challenge.
4. If a challenge has no “active agent against whom you compete,” it is a puzzle; if there is one, it is a conflict. (Crawford admits that this is a subjective test. Video games with noticeably algorithmic artificial intelligence can be played as puzzles; these include the patterns used to evade ghosts in Pac-Man.)
5. Finally, if the player can only outperform the opponent, but not attack them to interfere with their performance, the conflict is a competition. (Competitions include racing and figure skating.) However, if attacks are allowed, then the conflict qualifies as a game.
- this was pasted from the Wiki page "game"
What is the thinking behind why any player/team wold do that in a PvP game? That's a serious question, btw. Basically, the design means that early starters can lock down tech and prevent or limit the rate at which others gain it. If the pre-order people are smart, they will form one massive guild and just maintain an unbeatable advantage over the newer players. An example of this would be Shadowbane's Treachery server. At release, the maps and resource locations were carried over from beta. This gave the beta players the advantage of knowing what to obtain and what to prevent others from getting in order to keep a permanent advantage. With most of the beta guilds under one umbrella (CoS), the server was quickly stomped into the ground, with the defeated players leaving the game or going to other servers and the victors left with no one to oppose them.
It seems like the dissemination of tech in Xsyon hinges on benevolence and magnanimous behaviour between rival guilds.
Never place faith in sportsmanship when gamesmanship offers greater rewards. As a developer, you have a vested interest in the longevity of the game. Your playerbase does not.
Then it sounds like the playerbase will have to adapt and evolve with this game, so far this is sounding more and more like a community co-op mmo. Depletable resources and crafting that can be learned from other players means the community will have to learn to cooperate rather than fiercly compete with one another like in most MMOs. So far the only sandboxes that have come to the market and all of the themeparks have hinged primarily on competition ( i.e. who can become the uberest player/guild).
Maybe it's time for an MMO to change the rules of the game and once the playerbase realizes what it takes to prosper (work together and form alliances between their tribes) the evolution will begin. Then we as a gaming community can stop focusing on who's better, and start getting to know the people we pass in our adventures...... maybe have a little fun while we're at it.
It seems like you are basing your stance on how you would like people to function rather than how they actually do function. Utopia is called such for a reason.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
No offense but thats like saying most of the people in FL are old, so we shouldnt have anything made for younger people too.
The game has rules set so that those "young and immature" style of play wont work.
If they dont "role-play" like you say, where everyone else says work together, then they will be at a disadvantage. Thus why wouldnt they "role-play"
I dont see how "role-play" = working as a team.
I look at games like EVE that have a good working system on how it works, or Wurm Online.
-MrDDT
Its not Smart in my oponion to limit the number of peopel like that. those numbers you throw out Kharum, are nothing so small.
Thats hardly enough for much of anything. Seeing as how thiese people this low number of peopel will not be on 24/7.
And if you make people wait to long to be "allowed" to come into the game. They will of moved on to other games of interest by then.
Only wanting 5,000 players by the end of the summer is very shallow playerbase.
Are you Running this game on your home computer or something? unable to handlemore then that?
You say its not because of serverv issues but I think your not being completly truthful there. It makes no sicne form a business view point to set the golas and limits so low.
You are wrong wrong wrong. There will be a seince of behind when who have been there months, as the allowed number of players are limited.
That will give tribes/guilds allot to time to set up towns and citys and for the new comers when they are finally allowed in to feel really behind and those select few who have been there, will be so far ahead and will be able to destroy the new coming tribes.
I know I would not be intersted in playing if the player base is going to be limited like this over the summer.
The New FF will be out soon.
You are wrong wrong wrong. There will be a seince of behind when who have been there months, as the allowed number of players are limited.
That will give tribes/guilds allot to time to set up towns and citys and for the new comers when they are finally allowed in to feel really behind and those select few who have been there, will be so far ahead and will be able to destroy the new coming tribes.
I know I would not be intersted in playing if the player base is going to be limited like this over the summer.
The New FF will be out soon.
Huh?
Whats FF? (Are you talking about Final Fantasy game? You know that has nothing to do with this type of game right? This is a sandbox game, that will NOT be one. Good luck with that.)
Thanks for your opinion. Why do you think they will have "allot" of time to set up towns and cities "for" the new comers are allowed?
Next, I think you are misunderstanding the game. If you play games like Wurm Online you will notice how the game runs. Just because you move towns or build another one doesnt mean you are starting over. Plus in Xsyon there are going to be times when you want to move out of your old town to get another resource and area locked down and use new tech.
Say the first 6 months you didnt have the tech to make stone walls, but now with the new tech you can say build your town up better and use better techs to make it, plus it will be much faster.
This game isnt for everyone, and if you wont be playing because the devs dont follow your ideas or beliefs then sounds like you wont be playing.
-MrDDT
Had to change the font size in the quote to stop my eyes from bleeding, sorry.
5000 players isn't that limited. Just to use a comparison most can relate to, vanilla wow allowed about 2.5k players online on each server at the same time. Azeroth is about 200 square kilometers, while Xsyon's gameworld during the prelude will be 120 square kilometers. So, to have the same population density as Vanilla WoW, there would have to be 1500 players online. During peak hours, that number doesn't sound unlikely with 5000 subscribers, at least during the first couple of months when the interest is high. Add to that, that none of the players online will be hidden away in instanced dungeons or instanced battlegrounds, and I don't think you'll have to worry about the game feeling empty if it does hit the subscription cap.
Besides, I doubt the gameplay during the prelude would work well if the world was crowded. The first phase is for players to build settlements and get the game world ready for the next phase. This would just get frustrating if they had to fight for every little piece of land right from the start. The prelude will probably also involve a fair bit of bug testing and trial and error, so if you want to scream "Paid beta!", knock yourself out.
As for the bad business sense, that's your opinion. They have claimed this is a soft launch, and that they will market the game once it is ready for the next chapter. If recent MMO launches have showed anything, it's that marketing/hyping a game before it's ready for the masses is a terrible idea. The 5000 player cap will only be a problem if the game is good right from the start and word of mouth gets out. If so, they can either up the cap, or open another server.
Anyway, I doubt I'll preorder, but I'm optimistic about the game. Their plans for the launch is a major part of my reason for being optimistic. Those who do join now, are likely to stick with it through a rocky launch, and since they are not trying to lure in the masses right away, they have some damage control for the game's reputation when things go wrong.
You are forgetting one important fact.. The 5000 " players " will not be on all at once.. If they plan to only sell 5000 copies then you can expect to have less than 1000 players on at a given time ( probably not even that ).. Thats about the size of a closed beta test phase ( which fits my opinion of this " limited launch " ).
Your WoW example doesnt fly either considering there were probably 15000 unqiue players on a server with 2500 - 3000 on at the same time.
I didn't forget that. The average Sandbox player plays much more than the average WoW player, and populations are more active right after a launch. I don't think my estimate of 1500 players at peak hours was too high. We'll see, though. You can't compare the gameplay of the two games. It was just to give an idea of the size of the world compared to the number of players. Even with 500-1000 players online, I doubt it will seem empty.
Anyway, 5000 accounts means that theoretically there can be 1500 towns. (3 characters per account, 10 characters in a tribe to build a town). I think they'll need the space even if they split up into just 100-200 tribes.
I didn't forget that. The average Sandbox player plays much more than the average WoW player, and populations are more active right after a launch. I don't think my estimate of 1500 players at peak hours was too high. We'll see, though. You can't compare the gameplay of the two games. It was just to give an idea of the size of the world compared to the number of players. Even with 500-1000 players online, I doubt it will seem empty.
Anyway, 5000 accounts means that theoretically there can be 1500 towns. (3 characters per account, 10 characters in a tribe to build a town). I think they'll need the space even if they split up into just 100-200 tribes.
You have zero proof of what you just spewed.. ZERO.
At the start I am sure 500-1000 players will make the game seem full because everyone will be in the same areas.. Spread that over a few months ( like the suggested ) and the game would be a ghost town.
Either way you look at it they are covering for something and it aint hype or making sure they arent flooded with players.