can u find a game where overwhelmingly the posts about it both here and in its own forums and almost all online reviews are negative and warn not to buy the product, yet the game was really good?
Hyperbole much?
Blatant exaggerations aside, if you're making the argument that forums are accurate indicators of quality or overall satisfaction of sets of players, there's probably no hope for you. Reviews are just as bad - I can show you games that got great initial reviews that didn't pan out so well, too, if you like.
The short answer is that the MMO community-at-large isn't what it used to be. It's much larger, and much more diverse than ever. Not every game fits the preferences of large subsets of MMO gamers. That fact, in and of itself, does not objectively define a game as good or bad. So many MMO players, unrealistically cocksure that their opinion equals unadulterated fact, are incapable of seeing that the terrain has changed, and that they aren't the arbiters of what is right and good.
Every game has large segments of people who don't like it. Every one. That says very little about the factual quality of the game - it speaks more to the preferences and tastes of a diverse group.
1- what part is an exaggeration?
2- what better indicator of the quality of a product is there than the people who bought it?(the people posting here have played the game and are saying its not good, in case you havent read any of it)
you still havent answered any of my questions rohn, or are you just going to keep deflecting like cryptic, rather than answer honest questions?
like i said earlier.. tic tac toe isnt for everyone, and you have every right to enjoy it.
IF THE ONLY DEFENCE FOR CRITICISM OF A GAME IS CALLING SOMEONE A TROLL OR HATER, THAT SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE QUALITY OF THE GAME
34 people from the gaming alias I am on tried STO in beta (including me) 12 ended up buying it at/before release (not including me) 0 people are playing now, as the free month ran out. Not one.
Maybe Cryptic should be targeting people that have never played MMOs before, because the veteran gamer crowd is seriously voting with their feet. And as a bonus, most said they "felt ripped off" and/or "would not be buying another Cryptic product" based on their STO experience.
The "veteran gaming crowd" (lol - no, seriously, actually laughing out loud) has been voting with their feet with just about every game.
There's one common denominator there. Here's a hint - it's not the games.
Good luck with ever finding a good game as defined by the ultra-thin-skinned veteran gaming crowd. People that should know better, but sadly don't. Even if you find a game you like, I guarantee it'll be torn apart by some MMO vets with egos that desparately need stroking.
To me, the opinions of hard-wired MMO vets are actually the least valuable, the least objective. Most of them live firmly in the past, which they over-glorify. It's sad, because games are meant to be enjoyed, but they've actually become incapable of doing that, literally incapable, because of preconceived notions they've come to worship.
In any event, I'm currently playing STO with several of the same people I started with, many of them 'MMO vets", and they seem to be enjoying it.
To each, his own (a phrase most MMO vets do not have the ability to understand anymore).
Some day in the not too distant future you'll one day look around and find yourself in a ghost town and wonder WTF?
Doubtful you'll come back here and admit it was a failed game when it happens. (See all the former CO fans who are no longer with us).
The game does not appeal to a large portion of the gaming community, which might not be the total story but its pretty easy to see that STO fell far short of what it could and should have been.
And that will make absolutely zero difference to me. I'm enjoying the game now, for what it is, and not obsessing over what it isn't. I'm definitely not concerned with what other people enjoy, or don't enjoy, as long as there are enough people in the game I play to keep it fun. Right now, there are more than enough.
That's what makes me laugh about people who are so obsessed with the success and failure of MMOs. It's as pathetic as sports fans: I'd have rather been a player on the worst NFL team, than a do-nothing critic of said team, or a do-nothing fan of the best team. The latter two are of no account, though they will often obsess over something they have no part in, or no control of.
Oddly enough, most MMOs not named WoW don't appeal to a large portion of the gaming community. It's all a matter of personal taste, which is no factual indicator of what people find fun.
But, if you need the approval of a "large portion" of the gaming community to validate whether or not you're having fun, well, I'm truly sorry.
Long story short: STO might last for years, or close tomorrow. I'm enjoying it now, without compulsively trying to determine if it's "good" to the standards of others, whatever that would actually mean.
He's allowed to like it, nothing wrong with that.
Trying to figure out what is the fight about.
He seems to care nothing about what we do or don't like. He is just saying it works for him.
As for me, I am in a hole with my co-workers and friends because I was the driving force to get everyone to buy and try CO and STO. So I have little credibility in the office and with friends now when it comes to suggesting MMOs.
your right fraxture, however rohn stated several untrue things, some of which i asked for answers on. no answer
and deflecting the same way (you just dont get it) the same was as cryptic is/has been doing is offensive when a large amount of people who bought this game feel ripped off.
and honestly im bored and listening to the radio so i found responding to the troll amusing.
oh and the longer negative forum posts stay at the top of the list, the less business cryptic will get in the future, which makes me happy as i feel the ripped me off for 50$
IF THE ONLY DEFENCE FOR CRITICISM OF A GAME IS CALLING SOMEONE A TROLL OR HATER, THAT SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE QUALITY OF THE GAME
34 people from the gaming alias I am on tried STO in beta (including me) 12 ended up buying it at/before release (not including me) 0 people are playing now, as the free month ran out. Not one.
Maybe Cryptic should be targeting people that have never played MMOs before, because the veteran gamer crowd is seriously voting with their feet. And as a bonus, most said they "felt ripped off" and/or "would not be buying another Cryptic product" based on their STO experience.
The "veteran gaming crowd" (lol - no, seriously, actually laughing out loud) has been voting with their feet with just about every game.
There's one common denominator there. Here's a hint - it's not the games.
Good luck with ever finding a good game as defined by the ultra-thin-skinned veteran gaming crowd. People that should know better, but sadly don't. Even if you find a game you like, I guarantee it'll be torn apart by some MMO vets with egos that desparately need stroking.
To me, the opinions of hard-wired MMO vets are actually the least valuable, the least objective. Most of them live firmly in the past, which they over-glorify. It's sad, because games are meant to be enjoyed, but they've actually become incapable of doing that, literally incapable, because of preconceived notions they've come to worship.
In any event, I'm currently playing STO with several of the same people I started with, many of them 'MMO vets", and they seem to be enjoying it.
To each, his own (a phrase most MMO vets do not have the ability to understand anymore).
Some day in the not too distant future you'll one day look around and find yourself in a ghost town and wonder WTF?
Doubtful you'll come back here and admit it was a failed game when it happens. (See all the former CO fans who are no longer with us).
The game does not appeal to a large portion of the gaming community, which might not be the total story but its pretty easy to see that STO fell far short of what it could and should have been.
And that will make absolutely zero difference to me. I'm enjoying the game now, for what it is, and not obsessing over what it isn't. I'm definitely not concerned with what other people enjoy, or don't enjoy, as long as there are enough people in the game I play to keep it fun. Right now, there are more than enough.
That's what makes me laugh about people who are so obsessed with the success and failure of MMOs. It's as pathetic as sports fans: I'd have rather been a player on the worst NFL team, than a do-nothing critic of said team, or a do-nothing fan of the best team. The latter two are of no account, though they will often obsess over something they have no part in, or no control of.
Oddly enough, most MMOs not named WoW don't appeal to a large portion of the gaming community. It's all a matter of personal taste, which is no factual indicator of what people find fun.
But, if you need the approval of a "large portion" of the gaming community to validate whether or not you're having fun, well, I'm truly sorry.
Long story short: STO might last for years, or close tomorrow. I'm enjoying it now, without compulsively trying to determine if it's "good" to the standards of others, whatever that would actually mean.
How often do you play? I'm guessing maybe 10 hours a week, because if you played any longer, you'd be at max level by now with nothing to do but Infected and 4 dailies.
I think their biggest mistake (besides making a MMO in just 3 short years) was to let a player handle a ship by himself. That works fine in a game like Eve but in Star trek the interaction between the crew-members is the most important thing.
Each guild should have a ship instead of the current system, highest guild officer online would be the commanding officer.
Now it is more like a sologame, and if they aired a mission on a star trek TV episode the trekkies would go berserk .
Together with limited content and missions that offer little challenge and we have the current state of the game.
Of course some players are having fun but the question if how long you can continue having fun because how little content there is. Cryptic never even tried here.
your right fraxture, however rohn stated several untrue things, some of which i asked for answers on. no answer and deflecting the same way (you just dont get it) the same was as cryptic is/has been doing is offensive when a large amount of people who bought this game feel ripped off. and honestly im bored and listening to the radio so i found responding to the troll amusing.
oh and the longer negative forum posts stay at the top of the list, the less business cryptic will get in the future, which makes me happy as i feel the ripped me off for 50$
I stated nothing untrue, just things that run counter to your opinion. Huge difference.
As I said before, people who use forums as a foundation for an argument, well, um, yeah.
As far as opinions go, they seem infinitely maleable for those who don't feel the need to be consistent, and appears predicated on nothing more than personal preference and taste. Let's look at you, for instance.
Posted by Raistalin69 on the Fallen Earth forum regarding criticism of that game:
"upon detailed research, the ony thing i can determine that a gravity engine may relate to is wether or not your tinfoil hat stays on your head while playing.
but in all seriousness, if op is still reading this thread, please check the looking for game section on the forums here, this game is not for you. i would suggest posting your system specifications when posting there so you dont get directed to a game your system will not run decently, and possibly some ideas of what other games you have enjoyed.
to me it sounds like the op was looking for a game that was a lot less effort with better graphics, id suggest that a console system might be a good idea, and avoiding mmo's alltogether.
would have to disagree with all of the op's complaints, this game just isnt like a lot of other mmo's and is definatly not for everyone. but its the first game ive played since eve that i think may have a long term future (besides wow of course), wasnt there in beta, and i cant honestly say that the game couldnt use more "tweeks", but having just come from playing sto, finding fe was like finding the light at the end of the tunnel.
its a free 10 day trial, and if your bored of wow clones, try it out."
After the initial honeymoon here, Fallen Earth has taken a great deal of criticism for all the issues it had for several months after its launch. Apparently, if one is predisposed to liking a game, that's the difference between earning the excuse "it's not for everyone", and a "bad game". MMO vet-speak ftl.
Also posted on the FE forum by Raistalin69, regarding significant price drops with FE (normally MMO vet fodder to indicate a "failed" game):
"im happy icarus is doing this, even though i recently paid 50$ for the game, cant wait to see the game get bigger!
having said that, i now feel the need to go flame cryptic some more on the sto forums, as i feel they completely ripped me off for a sto box.
if you didnt get a free key, try the 10 day free trial, this game wont be for everyone, but at least theres more than 6 issions, and theres crafting, and theres some social aspect to it. and your not bored in 6 days(allthough that doesnt neccasarly mean this games for you, but i reccomend trying it)"
So much for objectivity and/or credibility. One game is a ripoff, while the other just isn't for everyone, and the price reduction is a good thing because it'll help the game grow. All based on nothing more than the personal taste of a player.
How often do you play? I'm guessing maybe 10 hours a week, because if you played any longer, you'd be at max level by now with nothing to do but Infected and 4 dailies.
This is amusing, coming from a Darkfall player - the sandbox game that stutteringly, haltingly launched with almost no sand in the box, sych issues, a barren landscape with very few mobs, 8 hour queues, hacks galore, no economic model, afk macroing as the norm, the NA "publisher" fiasco, etc. It was also completely torn apart at launch by players and reviewers, and has a miniscule playerbase.
It must be a bad game.
EDIT: I've played STO for about 3 weeks, and have a CPT10. When I get him to RA5, I'm looking forward to leveling a science officer, and a Klingon Tac officer.
your right fraxture, however rohn stated several untrue things, some of which i asked for answers on. no answer and deflecting the same way (you just dont get it) the same was as cryptic is/has been doing is offensive when a large amount of people who bought this game feel ripped off. and honestly im bored and listening to the radio so i found responding to the troll amusing.
oh and the longer negative forum posts stay at the top of the list, the less business cryptic will get in the future, which makes me happy as i feel the ripped me off for 50$
I stated nothing untrue, just things that run counter to your opinion. Huge difference.
As I said before, people who use forums as a foundation for are argument, well, um, yeah.
As far as opinions go, they seem infinitely maleable for those who don't feel the need to be consistent, and appears predicated on nothing more than personal preference and taste. Let's look at you, for instance.
Posted by Raistalin69 on the Fallen Earth forum regarding criticism of that game:
"upon detailed research, the ony thing i can determine that a gravity engine may relate to is wether or not your tinfoil hat stays on your head while playing.
but in all seriousness, if op is still reading this thread, please check the looking for game section on the forums here, this game is not for you. i would suggest posting your system specifications when posting there so you dont get directed to a game your system will not run decently, and possibly some ideas of what other games you have enjoyed.
to me it sounds like the op was looking for a game that was a lot less effort with better graphics, id suggest that a console system might be a good idea, and avoiding mmo's alltogether.
would have to disagree with all of the op's complaints, this game just isnt like a lot of other mmo's and is definatly not for everyone. but its the first game ive played since eve that i think may have a long term future (besides wow of course), wasnt there in beta, and i cant honestly say that the game couldnt use more "tweeks", but having just come from playing sto, finding fe was like finding the light at the end of the tunnel.
its a free 10 day trial, and if your bored of wow clones, try it out."
After the initial honeymoon here, Fallen Earth has taken a great deal of criticism for all the issues it had for several months after its launch. Apparently, if one is predisposed to liking a game, that's the difference between earning the excuse "it's not for everyone", and a "bad game". MMO vet-speak ftl.
Also posted on the FE forum by Raistalin69, regarding significant price drops with FE (normally MMO vet fodder to indicate a "failed" game):
"im happy icarus is doing this, even though i recently paid 50$ for the game, cant wait to see the game get bigger!
having said that, i now feel the need to go flame cryptic some more on the sto forums, as i feel they completely ripped me off for a sto box.
if you didnt get a free key, try the 10 day free trial, this game wont be for everyone, but at least theres more than 6 issions, and theres crafting, and theres some social aspect to it. and your not bored in 6 days(allthough that doesnt neccasarly mean this games for you, but i reccomend trying it)"
So much for objectivity and/or credibility. One game is a ripoff, while the other just isn't for everyone, and the price reduction is a good thing because it'll help the game grow. All based on nothing more than the personal taste of a player.
Amazing how that works.
you still havent answered my questions, your still deflecting. and yes sto is a rip off, and if you look at the posts in the sto forum youll see that that is a pretty common theme in one form or another, and im happy that fe might grow, its a far better game than sto.
again, answer the questions i asked and stop trolling/deflecting.
IF THE ONLY DEFENCE FOR CRITICISM OF A GAME IS CALLING SOMEONE A TROLL OR HATER, THAT SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE QUALITY OF THE GAME
your right fraxture, however rohn stated several untrue things, some of which i asked for answers on. no answer and deflecting the same way (you just dont get it) the same was as cryptic is/has been doing is offensive when a large amount of people who bought this game feel ripped off. and honestly im bored and listening to the radio so i found responding to the troll amusing.
oh and the longer negative forum posts stay at the top of the list, the less business cryptic will get in the future, which makes me happy as i feel the ripped me off for 50$
I stated nothing untrue, just things that run counter to your opinion. Huge difference.
As I said before, people who use forums as a foundation for are argument, well, um, yeah.
As far as opinions go, they seem infinitely maleable for those who don't feel the need to be consistent, and appears predicated on nothing more than personal preference and taste. Let's look at you, for instance.
Posted by Raistalin69 on the Fallen Earth forum regarding criticism of that game:
"upon detailed research, the ony thing i can determine that a gravity engine may relate to is wether or not your tinfoil hat stays on your head while playing.
but in all seriousness, if op is still reading this thread, please check the looking for game section on the forums here, this game is not for you. i would suggest posting your system specifications when posting there so you dont get directed to a game your system will not run decently, and possibly some ideas of what other games you have enjoyed.
to me it sounds like the op was looking for a game that was a lot less effort with better graphics, id suggest that a console system might be a good idea, and avoiding mmo's alltogether.
would have to disagree with all of the op's complaints, this game just isnt like a lot of other mmo's and is definatly not for everyone. but its the first game ive played since eve that i think may have a long term future (besides wow of course), wasnt there in beta, and i cant honestly say that the game couldnt use more "tweeks", but having just come from playing sto, finding fe was like finding the light at the end of the tunnel.
its a free 10 day trial, and if your bored of wow clones, try it out."
After the initial honeymoon here, Fallen Earth has taken a great deal of criticism for all the issues it had for several months after its launch. Apparently, if one is predisposed to liking a game, that's the difference between earning the excuse "it's not for everyone", and a "bad game". MMO vet-speak ftl.
Also posted on the FE forum by Raistalin69, regarding significant price drops with FE (normally MMO vet fodder to indicate a "failed" game):
"im happy icarus is doing this, even though i recently paid 50$ for the game, cant wait to see the game get bigger!
having said that, i now feel the need to go flame cryptic some more on the sto forums, as i feel they completely ripped me off for a sto box.
if you didnt get a free key, try the 10 day free trial, this game wont be for everyone, but at least theres more than 6 issions, and theres crafting, and theres some social aspect to it. and your not bored in 6 days(allthough that doesnt neccasarly mean this games for you, but i reccomend trying it)"
So much for objectivity and/or credibility. One game is a ripoff, while the other just isn't for everyone, and the price reduction is a good thing because it'll help the game grow. All based on nothing more than the personal taste of a player.
Amazing how that works.
you still havent answered my questions, your still deflecting. and yes sto is a rip off, and if you look at the posts in the sto forum youll see that that is a pretty common theme in one form or another, and im happy that fe might grow, its a far better game than sto.
again, answer the questions i asked and stop trolling/deflecting.
Who's deflecting??? <see hypocrisy above>
What worthwhile question have you asked?
By the way, I can show you the same complaints about FE that you can about STO. Which ones are true? Or, is that something that changes depending on your personal likes or dislikes.
Lastly, I think that FE is also a good game, though like all of them, it has issues.
34 people from the gaming alias I am on tried STO in beta (including me) 12 ended up buying it at/before release (not including me) 0 people are playing now, as the free month ran out. Not one.
Maybe Cryptic should be targeting people that have never played MMOs before, because the veteran gamer crowd is seriously voting with their feet. And as a bonus, most said they "felt ripped off" and/or "would not be buying another Cryptic product" based on their STO experience.
Yup, same with my crew.
You can say that a product is great all day long til you are red in the face.
But the proof is in the pudding. Basically, the numbers speak for themselves.
The thing that is most telling to me, is that within this group, we have people all across the spectrum of players, some like more casual, others sandbox, a few FPS, a few browser/social, even a few MUD fans in there. So, it was not a bunch of people that all like the same things.
There seems to be no trouble finding something they all DON'T like, in the case of STO. Not an easy thing to do.
The most positive feedback I got from the informal poll, was "Maybe I'll go back in 6 months, and see if things are any better.", and that from a single person. Most were far more negative.
I activated the account 'CO' for my 10 year old son cause he thought it was novel when Ihad it running. He was bored in 3 days and doesn't touch it anymore.
Your kidding right, you do realize 10 year olds get bored of ANYTHING after about 3 days if it involves more effort than watching TV.
You might want to check back in a few months or a year. Cryptic in the past has a reputation for adding large stuff to their games over time, for free.
What content for free? CO has no added content and what they were planning to add they were going to charge for, only recently did they change that to free but it still doesnt exist. This isnt a compant that willingly adds anything for free and they willl charge you for as much as possible
I activated the account 'CO' for my 10 year old son cause he thought it was novel when Ihad it running. He was bored in 3 days and doesn't touch it anymore.
Your kidding right, you do realize 10 year olds get bored of ANYTHING after about 3 days if it involves more effort than watching TV.
You are obviously not around many 10 year olds. Either that, or my family is full of super-attentive kids that love to do things for extended periods of time.
"There is as yet insufficient data for a meaningful answer."
Well this wont be for everyone but i played this in the beta and subscription time and i was really looking foward to this game. Alas it really didnt quite live upto the hyper attentive game as it promised. I thought the trailers were brilliant as you would expect it to be as its a launch so i cant doubt the extra advertisement. What disappointed me was the lack of coersion and social play i thought we were promised but hey, we all cant be loved by one and all I here u say. It was basically the boredom of repeating myself on quests tech this and that and oh hang on I am sure I have been to this system before analysis. I wont play it ive been there and done that like many MMO's this is one not for the vault. Ty for ur time in reading this.
I hate to say I'm pretty much in agreement with the post title, the game has ground to the point that it is pretty unplayable without the desire to do something "else" meaning that It's been getting to the point that it takes more and more days for me to get up the desire to log in and the amount of time spent logged in has grown shorter and shorter. I'm still subbed and think I'll stay subbed until the next update is announced and if I don't see some features in there to turn this thing around I think at that point I'll have to cancel, and while resubbing like some half a year later is always an option I fear as I've stated before that the overall philosophy on design at Cryptic is the problem and that if they don't figure out how to get people excited by the second update the trend will only continue the way it has.
I don't begrudge anyone who is enjoying STO as it is built, more power to them and even Cryptic if it can survive under it's current direction but I can't support such dull and mostly uninspired gaming.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
your right fraxture, however rohn stated several untrue things, some of which i asked for answers on. no answer and deflecting the same way (you just dont get it) the same was as cryptic is/has been doing is offensive when a large amount of people who bought this game feel ripped off. and honestly im bored and listening to the radio so i found responding to the troll amusing.
oh and the longer negative forum posts stay at the top of the list, the less business cryptic will get in the future, which makes me happy as i feel the ripped me off for 50$
No one as far as I can see should really feel "ripped off" because the only promises Cryptic made and broke as I see it are standard for business, it's like trying to sue Burger King because every commercial says the Whopper is good but you hate it, Cryptic simply dropped there normal boring fare on the population, if you bought STO chances are you know or think you bought a bad game but anyone claiming they feel ripped off is a drama queen.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
You might want to check back in a few months or a year. Cryptic in the past has a reputation for adding large stuff to their games over time, for free.
if you're talking about coh, that was paragon not cryptic. Have they actually added that much to CO? Word I've been getting is no, that's why there was such an uprorar over charging for the new expansion zone.
You're wrong. Cryptic put out 10 expansions or issues in the two and a half years they were developing the game. They also developed the CoV paid expansion during their tenure.
Paragon (formerly NCSoft NorCal) took the game over in November of 2007, and continue to develop for the game.
Cryptic did indeed develop for CoX, which unfortunately doesn't fit the revisionist history you were hoping would give you a leg to stand on.
Actually, almost all the CoH developers stayed with the game when it was sold to NCSoft. Not revisionism, the truth. Something you aren't on a first name basis with.
You might want to check back in a few months or a year. Cryptic in the past has a reputation for adding large stuff to their games over time, for free.
Not sure where you got that 'reputation' from, must've confused it with another company. They won't do that here just like they didn't do it for Champions Online. Once the major fires are taken care of, most of the developers will move to the next 'quick-cash' MMO they're working on, Forgotten Realms Online, leaving a skeleton crew for STO just like they left a skeleton crew in Champions Online when most of the developers were transferred to the development of Star Trek Online.
Care to back up your claims with some reputable sources that detail such a history?
Case in point: Revelations is scheduled to come out shortly for Champions. I can back that up. I can also point to the STO calendar, some of which is backed up by what's on the PTS right now.
You appear to have a preconceived notion, and little more, but if you do have some hard information, please share it.
I don't know what they will do long term with STO, but they are actually talking to their playerbase, and they say they are working on a number of things that don't point to immediate maintenance mode as you claim.
EDIT: I've been playing for about 3 weeks, and it hasn't gotten dull to me yet. In fact, it's been one of the more addictive MMOs I've played in a while. Perfect? No. Fun? Yes.
I don't know much about the history of Cryptic, other than I found both CO and STO to be extremely lame, but all you're cases in points, and "facts" are events that are supposed to happen in the future. I don't think you can fairly point to things Cryptic claims they will do as backing up your case.
STO is an arcade game with no more content than a single player game, which is fine till you realize they are trying to charge you $15 a month on top of the box. Then to make it even more insulting they have a cash shop to boot. Do we really want to support companies that put out MMOs with less content and less depth than a single player game, charge for the box and per month? Do we really want to set that prescedent?
STO is an arcade game with no more content than a single player game, which is fine till you realize they are trying to charge you $15 a month on top of the box. Then to make it even more insulting they have a cash shop to boot. Do we really want to support companies that put out MMOs with less content and less depth than a single player game, charge for the box and per month? Do we really want to set that prescedent?
well all im gonna say is everyone has their own opinions about STO and thats fine with me, you do what ever you want, but for me i am enjoying playing it and its the only one i will be playing.
I think their biggest mistake (besides making a MMO in just 3 short years) was to let a player handle a ship by himself. That works fine in a game like Eve but in Star trek the interaction between the crew-members is the most important thing. Each guild should have a ship instead of the current system, highest guild officer online would be the commanding officer. Now it is more like a sologame, and if they aired a mission on a star trek TV episode the trekkies would go berserk . Together with limited content and missions that offer little challenge and we have the current state of the game. Of course some players are having fun but the question if how long you can continue having fun because how little content there is. Cryptic never even tried here.
now i do agree with Loke666 here, if there was "guildships" with the ranking of the guild like your saying. I think it would make the game lots better but then there would be that whole EGO thing with some people getting ahead in ranks before others just because they are best buds.
34 people from the gaming alias I am on tried STO in beta (including me) 12 ended up buying it at/before release (not including me) 0 people are playing now, as the free month ran out. Not one.
Maybe Cryptic should be targeting people that have never played MMOs before, because the veteran gamer crowd is seriously voting with their feet. And as a bonus, most said they "felt ripped off" and/or "would not be buying another Cryptic product" based on their STO experience.
The "veteran gaming crowd" (lol - no, seriously, actually laughing out loud) has been voting with their feet with just about every game.
There's one common denominator there. Here's a hint - it's not the games.
Good luck with ever finding a good game as defined by the ultra-thin-skinned veteran gaming crowd. People that should know better, but sadly don't. Even if you find a game you like, I guarantee it'll be torn apart by some MMO vets with egos that desparately need stroking.
To me, the opinions of hard-wired MMO vets are actually the least valuable, the least objective. Most of them live firmly in the past, which they over-glorify. It's sad, because games are meant to be enjoyed, but they've actually become incapable of doing that, literally incapable, because of preconceived notions they've come to worship.
In any event, I'm currently playing STO with several of the same people I started with, many of them 'MMO vets", and they seem to be enjoying it.
To each, his own (a phrase most MMO vets do not have the ability to understand anymore).
Some day in the not too distant future you'll one day look around and find yourself in a ghost town and wonder WTF?
Doubtful you'll come back here and admit it was a failed game when it happens. (See all the former CO fans who are no longer with us).
The game does not appeal to a large portion of the gaming community, which might not be the total story but its pretty easy to see that STO fell far short of what it could and should have been.
And that will make absolutely zero difference to me. I'm enjoying the game now, for what it is, and not obsessing over what it isn't. I'm definitely not concerned with what other people enjoy, or don't enjoy, as long as there are enough people in the game I play to keep it fun. Right now, there are more than enough.
That's what makes me laugh about people who are so obsessed with the success and failure of MMOs. It's as pathetic as sports fans: I'd have rather been a player on the worst NFL team, than a do-nothing critic of said team, or a do-nothing fan of the best team. The latter two are of no account, though they will often obsess over something they have no part in, or no control of.
Oddly enough, most MMOs not named WoW don't appeal to a large portion of the gaming community. It's all a matter of personal taste, which is no factual indicator of what people find fun.
But, if you need the approval of a "large portion" of the gaming community to validate whether or not you're having fun, well, I'm truly sorry.
Long story short: STO might last for years, or close tomorrow. I'm enjoying it now, without compulsively trying to determine if it's "good" to the standards of others, whatever that would actually mean.
So what exactly would constitute a "factual indicator of what people find fun." ?
Personaly I think a person expressing "I find this fun" or "I don't find this fun" would be about as close as one could get to that.... call me crazy that way
Furthermore what aspect of "fun" could be divorced from "personal taste"... does "fun" have some sort of specific gravity or something which can be objectively measured apart from the subjective taste of the person experiencing it?
Your post strikes me as an arguement for nihilism ... e.g. no persons/groups opinions have any meaning/bearing/weight as they are all subjective and therefore there is no point in posting/reading/discussing them.
Which begs the question as to why you are bothering to post yours here and discuss/refute others? That would strike me as a position which was not internaly consistant....and dare I say it...even "illogical" (arched eyebrow).
If on the contrary what you mean to say is that YOU shouldn't stop playing STO if YOU find it fun even though others may not.... I don't think anyone here would disagree with you. The same would probably apply to shaving your tongue.... if you enjoy it by all means do so..... but I daresay that wouldn't prevent a particular community from attempting to form/express some rough consensus of opinion about the matter....a consensus of opinion that would hold some value to other members of said community even if it didn't absolutely dictate thier actions.
Therefore logic dictates that one must conclude from the body of evidence presented that STO is kacka-poo-poo
At this point I don't know what the running argument is but I'd have to agree with the title, this game has lost just about all it's luster for me and that's without even getting to Admiral my highest now is a Captain but the hamster wheel that is STO is so devoid of variety/diversity that it has become a total grind and a bore.
And my biggest question is how does a company fix a problem they don't seem to know they have? Cryptic has a horrible design philosophy on gaming total 1980's arcade design for mmo's and I have yet to see this type of player as a big part of the market mmo or even console gaming.
The scariest thing for me is as a reliable designer (the games they create atleast work) I'm always willing to cut Cryptic some slack but everything I know for a fact they plan to add to the game does absolutely nothing for me, I haven't seen one feature that looks like it's going to change the direction of this game or even add much depth to it just a lot of fluff.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
At this point I don't know what the running argument is but I'd have to agree with the title, this game has lost just about all it's luster for me and that's without even getting to Admiral my highest now is a Captain but the hamster wheel that is STO is so devoid of variety/diversity that it has become a total grind and a bore. And my biggest question is how does a company fix a problem they don't seem to know they have? Cryptic has a horrible design philosophy on gaming total 1980's arcade design for mmo's and I have yet to see this type of player as a big part of the market mmo or even console gaming.
I don't know why they seem to think adding nothing but 5 man raids is going to improve their upper end long term viability. Sure people may go through them a couple times but how long can you do the same exact thing over and over. At least wow gives you a new coat of paint/story that makes it bearable.
At this point I don't know what the running argument is but I'd have to agree with the title, this game has lost just about all it's luster for me and that's without even getting to Admiral my highest now is a Captain but the hamster wheel that is STO is so devoid of variety/diversity that it has become a total grind and a bore. And my biggest question is how does a company fix a problem they don't seem to know they have? Cryptic has a horrible design philosophy on gaming total 1980's arcade design for mmo's and I have yet to see this type of player as a big part of the market mmo or even console gaming.
I don't know why they seem to think adding nothing but 5 man raids is going to improve their upper end long term viability. Sure people may go through them a couple times but how long can you do the same exact thing over and over. At least wow gives you a new coat of paint/story that makes it bearable.
My point exactly I feel like this game needs some actual "meat" to it but they keep adding a couple more veggies which is why one has to know that there are some issues upstairs there and a definite disconnect from the mmo market they are trying to reach.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Comments
can u find a game where overwhelmingly the posts about it both here and in its own forums and almost all online reviews are negative and warn not to buy the product, yet the game was really good?
Hyperbole much?
Blatant exaggerations aside, if you're making the argument that forums are accurate indicators of quality or overall satisfaction of sets of players, there's probably no hope for you. Reviews are just as bad - I can show you games that got great initial reviews that didn't pan out so well, too, if you like.
The short answer is that the MMO community-at-large isn't what it used to be. It's much larger, and much more diverse than ever. Not every game fits the preferences of large subsets of MMO gamers. That fact, in and of itself, does not objectively define a game as good or bad. So many MMO players, unrealistically cocksure that their opinion equals unadulterated fact, are incapable of seeing that the terrain has changed, and that they aren't the arbiters of what is right and good.
Every game has large segments of people who don't like it. Every one. That says very little about the factual quality of the game - it speaks more to the preferences and tastes of a diverse group.
1- what part is an exaggeration?
2- what better indicator of the quality of a product is there than the people who bought it?(the people posting here have played the game and are saying its not good, in case you havent read any of it)
you still havent answered any of my questions rohn, or are you just going to keep deflecting like cryptic, rather than answer honest questions?
like i said earlier.. tic tac toe isnt for everyone, and you have every right to enjoy it.
IF THE ONLY DEFENCE FOR CRITICISM OF A GAME IS CALLING SOMEONE A TROLL OR HATER, THAT SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE QUALITY OF THE GAME
The "veteran gaming crowd" (lol - no, seriously, actually laughing out loud) has been voting with their feet with just about every game.
There's one common denominator there. Here's a hint - it's not the games.
Good luck with ever finding a good game as defined by the ultra-thin-skinned veteran gaming crowd. People that should know better, but sadly don't. Even if you find a game you like, I guarantee it'll be torn apart by some MMO vets with egos that desparately need stroking.
To me, the opinions of hard-wired MMO vets are actually the least valuable, the least objective. Most of them live firmly in the past, which they over-glorify. It's sad, because games are meant to be enjoyed, but they've actually become incapable of doing that, literally incapable, because of preconceived notions they've come to worship.
In any event, I'm currently playing STO with several of the same people I started with, many of them 'MMO vets", and they seem to be enjoying it.
To each, his own (a phrase most MMO vets do not have the ability to understand anymore).
Some day in the not too distant future you'll one day look around and find yourself in a ghost town and wonder WTF?
Doubtful you'll come back here and admit it was a failed game when it happens. (See all the former CO fans who are no longer with us).
The game does not appeal to a large portion of the gaming community, which might not be the total story but its pretty easy to see that STO fell far short of what it could and should have been.
And that will make absolutely zero difference to me. I'm enjoying the game now, for what it is, and not obsessing over what it isn't. I'm definitely not concerned with what other people enjoy, or don't enjoy, as long as there are enough people in the game I play to keep it fun. Right now, there are more than enough.
That's what makes me laugh about people who are so obsessed with the success and failure of MMOs. It's as pathetic as sports fans: I'd have rather been a player on the worst NFL team, than a do-nothing critic of said team, or a do-nothing fan of the best team. The latter two are of no account, though they will often obsess over something they have no part in, or no control of.
Oddly enough, most MMOs not named WoW don't appeal to a large portion of the gaming community. It's all a matter of personal taste, which is no factual indicator of what people find fun.
But, if you need the approval of a "large portion" of the gaming community to validate whether or not you're having fun, well, I'm truly sorry.
Long story short: STO might last for years, or close tomorrow. I'm enjoying it now, without compulsively trying to determine if it's "good" to the standards of others, whatever that would actually mean.
He's allowed to like it, nothing wrong with that.
Trying to figure out what is the fight about.
He seems to care nothing about what we do or don't like. He is just saying it works for him.
As for me, I am in a hole with my co-workers and friends because I was the driving force to get everyone to buy and try CO and STO. So I have little credibility in the office and with friends now when it comes to suggesting MMOs.
your right fraxture, however rohn stated several untrue things, some of which i asked for answers on. no answer
and deflecting the same way (you just dont get it) the same was as cryptic is/has been doing is offensive when a large amount of people who bought this game feel ripped off.
and honestly im bored and listening to the radio so i found responding to the troll amusing.
oh and the longer negative forum posts stay at the top of the list, the less business cryptic will get in the future, which makes me happy as i feel the ripped me off for 50$
IF THE ONLY DEFENCE FOR CRITICISM OF A GAME IS CALLING SOMEONE A TROLL OR HATER, THAT SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE QUALITY OF THE GAME
The "veteran gaming crowd" (lol - no, seriously, actually laughing out loud) has been voting with their feet with just about every game.
There's one common denominator there. Here's a hint - it's not the games.
Good luck with ever finding a good game as defined by the ultra-thin-skinned veteran gaming crowd. People that should know better, but sadly don't. Even if you find a game you like, I guarantee it'll be torn apart by some MMO vets with egos that desparately need stroking.
To me, the opinions of hard-wired MMO vets are actually the least valuable, the least objective. Most of them live firmly in the past, which they over-glorify. It's sad, because games are meant to be enjoyed, but they've actually become incapable of doing that, literally incapable, because of preconceived notions they've come to worship.
In any event, I'm currently playing STO with several of the same people I started with, many of them 'MMO vets", and they seem to be enjoying it.
To each, his own (a phrase most MMO vets do not have the ability to understand anymore).
Some day in the not too distant future you'll one day look around and find yourself in a ghost town and wonder WTF?
Doubtful you'll come back here and admit it was a failed game when it happens. (See all the former CO fans who are no longer with us).
The game does not appeal to a large portion of the gaming community, which might not be the total story but its pretty easy to see that STO fell far short of what it could and should have been.
And that will make absolutely zero difference to me. I'm enjoying the game now, for what it is, and not obsessing over what it isn't. I'm definitely not concerned with what other people enjoy, or don't enjoy, as long as there are enough people in the game I play to keep it fun. Right now, there are more than enough.
That's what makes me laugh about people who are so obsessed with the success and failure of MMOs. It's as pathetic as sports fans: I'd have rather been a player on the worst NFL team, than a do-nothing critic of said team, or a do-nothing fan of the best team. The latter two are of no account, though they will often obsess over something they have no part in, or no control of.
Oddly enough, most MMOs not named WoW don't appeal to a large portion of the gaming community. It's all a matter of personal taste, which is no factual indicator of what people find fun.
But, if you need the approval of a "large portion" of the gaming community to validate whether or not you're having fun, well, I'm truly sorry.
Long story short: STO might last for years, or close tomorrow. I'm enjoying it now, without compulsively trying to determine if it's "good" to the standards of others, whatever that would actually mean.
How often do you play? I'm guessing maybe 10 hours a week, because if you played any longer, you'd be at max level by now with nothing to do but Infected and 4 dailies.
I think their biggest mistake (besides making a MMO in just 3 short years) was to let a player handle a ship by himself. That works fine in a game like Eve but in Star trek the interaction between the crew-members is the most important thing.
Each guild should have a ship instead of the current system, highest guild officer online would be the commanding officer.
Now it is more like a sologame, and if they aired a mission on a star trek TV episode the trekkies would go berserk .
Together with limited content and missions that offer little challenge and we have the current state of the game.
Of course some players are having fun but the question if how long you can continue having fun because how little content there is. Cryptic never even tried here.
I stated nothing untrue, just things that run counter to your opinion. Huge difference.
As I said before, people who use forums as a foundation for an argument, well, um, yeah.
As far as opinions go, they seem infinitely maleable for those who don't feel the need to be consistent, and appears predicated on nothing more than personal preference and taste. Let's look at you, for instance.
Posted by Raistalin69 on the Fallen Earth forum regarding criticism of that game:
"upon detailed research, the ony thing i can determine that a gravity engine may relate to is wether or not your tinfoil hat stays on your head while playing.
but in all seriousness, if op is still reading this thread, please check the looking for game section on the forums here, this game is not for you. i would suggest posting your system specifications when posting there so you dont get directed to a game your system will not run decently, and possibly some ideas of what other games you have enjoyed.
to me it sounds like the op was looking for a game that was a lot less effort with better graphics, id suggest that a console system might be a good idea, and avoiding mmo's alltogether.
would have to disagree with all of the op's complaints, this game just isnt like a lot of other mmo's and is definatly not for everyone. but its the first game ive played since eve that i think may have a long term future (besides wow of course), wasnt there in beta, and i cant honestly say that the game couldnt use more "tweeks", but having just come from playing sto, finding fe was like finding the light at the end of the tunnel.
its a free 10 day trial, and if your bored of wow clones, try it out."
After the initial honeymoon here, Fallen Earth has taken a great deal of criticism for all the issues it had for several months after its launch. Apparently, if one is predisposed to liking a game, that's the difference between earning the excuse "it's not for everyone", and a "bad game". MMO vet-speak ftl.
Also posted on the FE forum by Raistalin69, regarding significant price drops with FE (normally MMO vet fodder to indicate a "failed" game):
"im happy icarus is doing this, even though i recently paid 50$ for the game, cant wait to see the game get bigger!
having said that, i now feel the need to go flame cryptic some more on the sto forums, as i feel they completely ripped me off for a sto box.
if you didnt get a free key, try the 10 day free trial, this game wont be for everyone, but at least theres more than 6 issions, and theres crafting, and theres some social aspect to it. and your not bored in 6 days(allthough that doesnt neccasarly mean this games for you, but i reccomend trying it)"
So much for objectivity and/or credibility. One game is a ripoff, while the other just isn't for everyone, and the price reduction is a good thing because it'll help the game grow. All based on nothing more than the personal taste of a player.
Amazing how that works.
Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.
This is amusing, coming from a Darkfall player - the sandbox game that stutteringly, haltingly launched with almost no sand in the box, sych issues, a barren landscape with very few mobs, 8 hour queues, hacks galore, no economic model, afk macroing as the norm, the NA "publisher" fiasco, etc. It was also completely torn apart at launch by players and reviewers, and has a miniscule playerbase.
It must be a bad game.
EDIT: I've played STO for about 3 weeks, and have a CPT10. When I get him to RA5, I'm looking forward to leveling a science officer, and a Klingon Tac officer.
Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.
I stated nothing untrue, just things that run counter to your opinion. Huge difference.
As I said before, people who use forums as a foundation for are argument, well, um, yeah.
As far as opinions go, they seem infinitely maleable for those who don't feel the need to be consistent, and appears predicated on nothing more than personal preference and taste. Let's look at you, for instance.
Posted by Raistalin69 on the Fallen Earth forum regarding criticism of that game:
"upon detailed research, the ony thing i can determine that a gravity engine may relate to is wether or not your tinfoil hat stays on your head while playing.
but in all seriousness, if op is still reading this thread, please check the looking for game section on the forums here, this game is not for you. i would suggest posting your system specifications when posting there so you dont get directed to a game your system will not run decently, and possibly some ideas of what other games you have enjoyed.
to me it sounds like the op was looking for a game that was a lot less effort with better graphics, id suggest that a console system might be a good idea, and avoiding mmo's alltogether.
would have to disagree with all of the op's complaints, this game just isnt like a lot of other mmo's and is definatly not for everyone. but its the first game ive played since eve that i think may have a long term future (besides wow of course), wasnt there in beta, and i cant honestly say that the game couldnt use more "tweeks", but having just come from playing sto, finding fe was like finding the light at the end of the tunnel.
its a free 10 day trial, and if your bored of wow clones, try it out."
After the initial honeymoon here, Fallen Earth has taken a great deal of criticism for all the issues it had for several months after its launch. Apparently, if one is predisposed to liking a game, that's the difference between earning the excuse "it's not for everyone", and a "bad game". MMO vet-speak ftl.
Also posted on the FE forum by Raistalin69, regarding significant price drops with FE (normally MMO vet fodder to indicate a "failed" game):
"im happy icarus is doing this, even though i recently paid 50$ for the game, cant wait to see the game get bigger!
having said that, i now feel the need to go flame cryptic some more on the sto forums, as i feel they completely ripped me off for a sto box.
if you didnt get a free key, try the 10 day free trial, this game wont be for everyone, but at least theres more than 6 issions, and theres crafting, and theres some social aspect to it. and your not bored in 6 days(allthough that doesnt neccasarly mean this games for you, but i reccomend trying it)"
So much for objectivity and/or credibility. One game is a ripoff, while the other just isn't for everyone, and the price reduction is a good thing because it'll help the game grow. All based on nothing more than the personal taste of a player.
Amazing how that works.
you still havent answered my questions, your still deflecting. and yes sto is a rip off, and if you look at the posts in the sto forum youll see that that is a pretty common theme in one form or another, and im happy that fe might grow, its a far better game than sto.
again, answer the questions i asked and stop trolling/deflecting.
IF THE ONLY DEFENCE FOR CRITICISM OF A GAME IS CALLING SOMEONE A TROLL OR HATER, THAT SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE QUALITY OF THE GAME
I stated nothing untrue, just things that run counter to your opinion. Huge difference.
As I said before, people who use forums as a foundation for are argument, well, um, yeah.
As far as opinions go, they seem infinitely maleable for those who don't feel the need to be consistent, and appears predicated on nothing more than personal preference and taste. Let's look at you, for instance.
Posted by Raistalin69 on the Fallen Earth forum regarding criticism of that game:
"upon detailed research, the ony thing i can determine that a gravity engine may relate to is wether or not your tinfoil hat stays on your head while playing.
but in all seriousness, if op is still reading this thread, please check the looking for game section on the forums here, this game is not for you. i would suggest posting your system specifications when posting there so you dont get directed to a game your system will not run decently, and possibly some ideas of what other games you have enjoyed.
to me it sounds like the op was looking for a game that was a lot less effort with better graphics, id suggest that a console system might be a good idea, and avoiding mmo's alltogether.
would have to disagree with all of the op's complaints, this game just isnt like a lot of other mmo's and is definatly not for everyone. but its the first game ive played since eve that i think may have a long term future (besides wow of course), wasnt there in beta, and i cant honestly say that the game couldnt use more "tweeks", but having just come from playing sto, finding fe was like finding the light at the end of the tunnel.
its a free 10 day trial, and if your bored of wow clones, try it out."
After the initial honeymoon here, Fallen Earth has taken a great deal of criticism for all the issues it had for several months after its launch. Apparently, if one is predisposed to liking a game, that's the difference between earning the excuse "it's not for everyone", and a "bad game". MMO vet-speak ftl.
Also posted on the FE forum by Raistalin69, regarding significant price drops with FE (normally MMO vet fodder to indicate a "failed" game):
"im happy icarus is doing this, even though i recently paid 50$ for the game, cant wait to see the game get bigger!
having said that, i now feel the need to go flame cryptic some more on the sto forums, as i feel they completely ripped me off for a sto box.
if you didnt get a free key, try the 10 day free trial, this game wont be for everyone, but at least theres more than 6 issions, and theres crafting, and theres some social aspect to it. and your not bored in 6 days(allthough that doesnt neccasarly mean this games for you, but i reccomend trying it)"
So much for objectivity and/or credibility. One game is a ripoff, while the other just isn't for everyone, and the price reduction is a good thing because it'll help the game grow. All based on nothing more than the personal taste of a player.
Amazing how that works.
you still havent answered my questions, your still deflecting. and yes sto is a rip off, and if you look at the posts in the sto forum youll see that that is a pretty common theme in one form or another, and im happy that fe might grow, its a far better game than sto.
again, answer the questions i asked and stop trolling/deflecting.
Who's deflecting??? <see hypocrisy above>
What worthwhile question have you asked?
By the way, I can show you the same complaints about FE that you can about STO. Which ones are true? Or, is that something that changes depending on your personal likes or dislikes.
Lastly, I think that FE is also a good game, though like all of them, it has issues.
Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.
Yup, same with my crew.
You can say that a product is great all day long til you are red in the face.
But the proof is in the pudding. Basically, the numbers speak for themselves.
The thing that is most telling to me, is that within this group, we have people all across the spectrum of players, some like more casual, others sandbox, a few FPS, a few browser/social, even a few MUD fans in there. So, it was not a bunch of people that all like the same things.
There seems to be no trouble finding something they all DON'T like, in the case of STO. Not an easy thing to do.
The most positive feedback I got from the informal poll, was "Maybe I'll go back in 6 months, and see if things are any better.", and that from a single person. Most were far more negative.
Your kidding right, you do realize 10 year olds get bored of ANYTHING after about 3 days if it involves more effort than watching TV.
=============================
I have a soap box and I am not afraid to use it.
What content for free? CO has no added content and what they were planning to add they were going to charge for, only recently did they change that to free but it still doesnt exist. This isnt a compant that willingly adds anything for free and they willl charge you for as much as possible
Your kidding right, you do realize 10 year olds get bored of ANYTHING after about 3 days if it involves more effort than watching TV.
You are obviously not around many 10 year olds. Either that, or my family is full of super-attentive kids that love to do things for extended periods of time.
"There is as yet insufficient data for a meaningful answer."
I hate to say I'm pretty much in agreement with the post title, the game has ground to the point that it is pretty unplayable without the desire to do something "else" meaning that It's been getting to the point that it takes more and more days for me to get up the desire to log in and the amount of time spent logged in has grown shorter and shorter. I'm still subbed and think I'll stay subbed until the next update is announced and if I don't see some features in there to turn this thing around I think at that point I'll have to cancel, and while resubbing like some half a year later is always an option I fear as I've stated before that the overall philosophy on design at Cryptic is the problem and that if they don't figure out how to get people excited by the second update the trend will only continue the way it has.
I don't begrudge anyone who is enjoying STO as it is built, more power to them and even Cryptic if it can survive under it's current direction but I can't support such dull and mostly uninspired gaming.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
No one as far as I can see should really feel "ripped off" because the only promises Cryptic made and broke as I see it are standard for business, it's like trying to sue Burger King because every commercial says the Whopper is good but you hate it, Cryptic simply dropped there normal boring fare on the population, if you bought STO chances are you know or think you bought a bad game but anyone claiming they feel ripped off is a drama queen.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
if you're talking about coh, that was paragon not cryptic. Have they actually added that much to CO? Word I've been getting is no, that's why there was such an uprorar over charging for the new expansion zone.
You're wrong. Cryptic put out 10 expansions or issues in the two and a half years they were developing the game. They also developed the CoV paid expansion during their tenure.
Paragon (formerly NCSoft NorCal) took the game over in November of 2007, and continue to develop for the game.
Cryptic did indeed develop for CoX, which unfortunately doesn't fit the revisionist history you were hoping would give you a leg to stand on.
Actually, almost all the CoH developers stayed with the game when it was sold to NCSoft. Not revisionism, the truth. Something you aren't on a first name basis with.
Not sure where you got that 'reputation' from, must've confused it with another company. They won't do that here just like they didn't do it for Champions Online. Once the major fires are taken care of, most of the developers will move to the next 'quick-cash' MMO they're working on, Forgotten Realms Online, leaving a skeleton crew for STO just like they left a skeleton crew in Champions Online when most of the developers were transferred to the development of Star Trek Online.
Care to back up your claims with some reputable sources that detail such a history?
Case in point: Revelations is scheduled to come out shortly for Champions. I can back that up. I can also point to the STO calendar, some of which is backed up by what's on the PTS right now.
You appear to have a preconceived notion, and little more, but if you do have some hard information, please share it.
I don't know what they will do long term with STO, but they are actually talking to their playerbase, and they say they are working on a number of things that don't point to immediate maintenance mode as you claim.
EDIT: I've been playing for about 3 weeks, and it hasn't gotten dull to me yet. In fact, it's been one of the more addictive MMOs I've played in a while. Perfect? No. Fun? Yes.
I don't know much about the history of Cryptic, other than I found both CO and STO to be extremely lame, but all you're cases in points, and "facts" are events that are supposed to happen in the future. I don't think you can fairly point to things Cryptic claims they will do as backing up your case.
LOL so your saying the game is boring and dull now, ok maybe check out the game now with the future updates coming up....
STO is an arcade game with no more content than a single player game, which is fine till you realize they are trying to charge you $15 a month on top of the box. Then to make it even more insulting they have a cash shop to boot. Do we really want to support companies that put out MMOs with less content and less depth than a single player game, charge for the box and per month? Do we really want to set that prescedent?
well all im gonna say is everyone has their own opinions about STO and thats fine with me, you do what ever you want, but for me i am enjoying playing it and its the only one i will be playing.
now i do agree with Loke666 here, if there was "guildships" with the ranking of the guild like your saying. I think it would make the game lots better but then there would be that whole EGO thing with some people getting ahead in ranks before others just because they are best buds.
The "veteran gaming crowd" (lol - no, seriously, actually laughing out loud) has been voting with their feet with just about every game.
There's one common denominator there. Here's a hint - it's not the games.
Good luck with ever finding a good game as defined by the ultra-thin-skinned veteran gaming crowd. People that should know better, but sadly don't. Even if you find a game you like, I guarantee it'll be torn apart by some MMO vets with egos that desparately need stroking.
To me, the opinions of hard-wired MMO vets are actually the least valuable, the least objective. Most of them live firmly in the past, which they over-glorify. It's sad, because games are meant to be enjoyed, but they've actually become incapable of doing that, literally incapable, because of preconceived notions they've come to worship.
In any event, I'm currently playing STO with several of the same people I started with, many of them 'MMO vets", and they seem to be enjoying it.
To each, his own (a phrase most MMO vets do not have the ability to understand anymore).
Some day in the not too distant future you'll one day look around and find yourself in a ghost town and wonder WTF?
Doubtful you'll come back here and admit it was a failed game when it happens. (See all the former CO fans who are no longer with us).
The game does not appeal to a large portion of the gaming community, which might not be the total story but its pretty easy to see that STO fell far short of what it could and should have been.
And that will make absolutely zero difference to me. I'm enjoying the game now, for what it is, and not obsessing over what it isn't. I'm definitely not concerned with what other people enjoy, or don't enjoy, as long as there are enough people in the game I play to keep it fun. Right now, there are more than enough.
That's what makes me laugh about people who are so obsessed with the success and failure of MMOs. It's as pathetic as sports fans: I'd have rather been a player on the worst NFL team, than a do-nothing critic of said team, or a do-nothing fan of the best team. The latter two are of no account, though they will often obsess over something they have no part in, or no control of.
Oddly enough, most MMOs not named WoW don't appeal to a large portion of the gaming community. It's all a matter of personal taste, which is no factual indicator of what people find fun.
But, if you need the approval of a "large portion" of the gaming community to validate whether or not you're having fun, well, I'm truly sorry.
Long story short: STO might last for years, or close tomorrow. I'm enjoying it now, without compulsively trying to determine if it's "good" to the standards of others, whatever that would actually mean.
So what exactly would constitute a "factual indicator of what people find fun." ?
Personaly I think a person expressing "I find this fun" or "I don't find this fun" would be about as close as one could get to that.... call me crazy that way
Furthermore what aspect of "fun" could be divorced from "personal taste"... does "fun" have some sort of specific gravity or something which can be objectively measured apart from the subjective taste of the person experiencing it?
Your post strikes me as an arguement for nihilism ... e.g. no persons/groups opinions have any meaning/bearing/weight as they are all subjective and therefore there is no point in posting/reading/discussing them.
Which begs the question as to why you are bothering to post yours here and discuss/refute others? That would strike me as a position which was not internaly consistant....and dare I say it...even "illogical" (arched eyebrow).
If on the contrary what you mean to say is that YOU shouldn't stop playing STO if YOU find it fun even though others may not.... I don't think anyone here would disagree with you. The same would probably apply to shaving your tongue.... if you enjoy it by all means do so..... but I daresay that wouldn't prevent a particular community from attempting to form/express some rough consensus of opinion about the matter....a consensus of opinion that would hold some value to other members of said community even if it didn't absolutely dictate thier actions.
Therefore logic dictates that one must conclude from the body of evidence presented that STO is kacka-poo-poo
(The above said in fun)
At this point I don't know what the running argument is but I'd have to agree with the title, this game has lost just about all it's luster for me and that's without even getting to Admiral my highest now is a Captain but the hamster wheel that is STO is so devoid of variety/diversity that it has become a total grind and a bore.
And my biggest question is how does a company fix a problem they don't seem to know they have? Cryptic has a horrible design philosophy on gaming total 1980's arcade design for mmo's and I have yet to see this type of player as a big part of the market mmo or even console gaming.
The scariest thing for me is as a reliable designer (the games they create atleast work) I'm always willing to cut Cryptic some slack but everything I know for a fact they plan to add to the game does absolutely nothing for me, I haven't seen one feature that looks like it's going to change the direction of this game or even add much depth to it just a lot of fluff.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
I don't know why they seem to think adding nothing but 5 man raids is going to improve their upper end long term viability. Sure people may go through them a couple times but how long can you do the same exact thing over and over. At least wow gives you a new coat of paint/story that makes it bearable.
I don't know why they seem to think adding nothing but 5 man raids is going to improve their upper end long term viability. Sure people may go through them a couple times but how long can you do the same exact thing over and over. At least wow gives you a new coat of paint/story that makes it bearable.
My point exactly I feel like this game needs some actual "meat" to it but they keep adding a couple more veggies which is why one has to know that there are some issues upstairs there and a definite disconnect from the mmo market they are trying to reach.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....