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EVE Online: Eve Online Survivor Guy Week Six

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Comments

  • EnerlaEnerla Member Posts: 97

    I know how to use intel tools to avoid gatecamps, and I know that our corp has aPVP sister corp, and if I go in after their roaming pvp gang I won't see a gatecamp, for me avoiding gatecamps is trival. But for a lot of people it isn't. But the point is: You try to move in 10 times, in all 10 times, you avoid the gatecamp and you go back to high sec, many players will leave. The problem with gatecamp is even if these newbies are well trained and will never run into one these camps can stop their ideas to move into low sec. Because from ten attempts they will bounce off the wall before they would run into the gatecamp.

    The "I see there are neutrals in the systems and a few was around the gate, so I don't move to low sec today, maybe in a week" outcomes is the problem, not the "gatecamp would destroy my ship".

  • LovesurgeonLovesurgeon Member Posts: 40

    Originally posted by Enerla

    I know how to use intel tools to avoid gatecamps, and I know that our corp has aPVP sister corp, and if I go in after their roaming pvp gang I won't see a gatecamp, for me avoiding gatecamps is trival. But for a lot of people it isn't. But the point is: You try to move in 10 times, in all 10 times, you avoid the gatecamp and you go back to high sec, many players will leave. The problem with gatecamp is even if these newbies are well trained and will never run into one these camps can stop their ideas to move into low sec. Because from ten attempts they will bounce off the wall before they would run into the gatecamp.

    The "I see there are neutrals in the systems and a few was around the gate, so I don't move to low sec today, maybe in a week" outcomes is the problem, not the "gatecamp would destroy my ship".

    At the risk of making myself look like a bigger fool than I already am by keeping this pointlessness going I am going to make one last post in this thread.

    I never said you didn't know how to use these tools, I said you are choosing to not use them or teach your new players how to use them.

    Your Concord Gate proposal does absolutely nothing to help new players who want to move into low sec and does everything to nerf a legitimate player career in game along with making low sec travel way to risk free. All your proposal would do is make new players a little less scared to enter low sec but they will still not move there because pirates will now gank and destroy them in their missions, mining ops and plexs. Atleast with the current system, they get the warning they are entering low sec space this is all the buffer a new player should need. All you are providing is a false security blanket that does nothing to teach a new player how to survive in low sec.

    If you truly are interested in a real discussion about this I again extend my offer to move this to in game rather than look like morons together here. I have sent you a private message as well with my offer which is pretty straight forward. You tell me which character to talk to (i don't care if it's an alt or your main, it really doesn't matter to me) I will message you on my main. You set the details and I will discuss this with you in a calm and rational manner. I am really interested in hearing your ideas. Like I said before, your ideas for improving the industrial side of the game are very good and well thought out, but I do believe your ideas on PvP are misguided and mistaken. Perhaps a clear person to person discussion can clear things up a bit for the both of us.

  • ThalariusThalarius Member Posts: 125

    I once tried EVE ONLINE back in 2008 and after one month left due to disgust and skill points that took too long. Had one person showed me that it would take 5 to 10 years just to get from tier 1 to tier 2.  It might be worth while for someone who are in there teens to early 30's. But for someone like me who is age 40 bracket, 5 to 10 years of paying month just to get up to tier 2 or even tier 3 is not worth it. 

    Also the scammers was massive and CCP did nothing about it.  <-- major turn off

    PVP GANKERS (so this was a pvp game but allowing high level tier pvp players ganking new players is not a good way to run a MMO)

    PVE skillsets do not work, was warned about it and read horror stories of players who had pve ships lose them via pvp gankers and they cancel thier accounts. PVE players ARE NOT WELCOME IN EVE ONLINE.

  • mklinicmklinic Member RarePosts: 2,014

    Originally posted by Thalarius

    I once tried EVE ONLINE back in 2008 and after one month left due to disgust and skill points that took too long. Had one person showed me that it would take 5 to 10 years just to get from tier 1 to tier 2.  It might be worth while for someone who are in there teens to early 30's. But for someone like me who is age 40 bracket, 5 to 10 years of paying month just to get up to tier 2 or even tier 3 is not worth it. 

    Also the scammers was massive and CCP did nothing about it.  <-- major turn off

    PVP GANKERS (so this was a pvp game but allowing high level tier pvp players ganking new players is not a good way to run a MMO)

    PVE skillsets do not work, was warned about it and read horror stories of players who had pve ships lose them via pvp gankers and they cancel thier accounts. PVE players ARE NOT WELCOME IN EVE ONLINE.

    5 to 10 years from t1 to t2? Does that really make any sense? I mean, the game just had it's 7th birthday right? So, that being the case, there should only be a handful of t2 pilots right? Or, my two year old character should not be flying t2 ships? Maybe my character I created this year should not be 40 days off of being a competent t3 pilot?

    I can understand your other complaints, and you are certainly welcome to your opinion, but the one about 5-10 years for t2 just makes no sense....

    -mklinic

    "Do something right, no one remembers.
    Do something wrong, no one forgets"
    -from No One Remembers by In Strict Confidence

  • LovesurgeonLovesurgeon Member Posts: 40

    Originally posted by Thalarius

    I once tried EVE ONLINE back in 2008 and after one month left due to disgust and skill points that took too long. Had one person showed me that it would take 5 to 10 years just to get from tier 1 to tier 2.  It might be worth while for someone who are in there teens to early 30's. But for someone like me who is age 40 bracket, 5 to 10 years of paying month just to get up to tier 2 or even tier 3 is not worth it. 

    Also the scammers was massive and CCP did nothing about it.  <-- major turn off

    PVP GANKERS (so this was a pvp game but allowing high level tier pvp players ganking new players is not a good way to run a MMO)

    PVE skillsets do not work, was warned about it and read horror stories of players who had pve ships lose them via pvp gankers and they cancel thier accounts. PVE players ARE NOT WELCOME IN EVE ONLINE.

    I really should learn better than to make dumb statements like this is my last post in this thread, but anyways.

    Your first paragraph, could you please explain in more detail because this talk of 5 - 10 years and tier 1 and 2 I have no clue what you a talking about but it sounds, no scratch it is extremely wrong. You do realize there are many people who play Eve that are much older than you are right ?

    The only logical thing I can think of that you are talking about is going from tech 1 to tech 2 ships and that only takes about waht 2 months to get into a tech 2 frigate ? I am sure someone can give an exact train time using EveMon but I am too lazy to do it myself. 5 - 10 years of train time would have you flying and doing almost everything you wanted in game.

    Sorry you got turned off of the game by some extremely bad info.

    As for the rest of your post. Well you just don't like a game where it's open PvP, luckily for you there a about a gajilliion options out there for you, good luck in your endevours.

    What exactly constitutes a PvE skillset anyways ?

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,342


    Originally posted by mklinic
    5 to 10 years from t1 to t2? Does that really make any sense? I mean, the game just had it's 7th birthday right? So, that being the case, there should only be a handful of t2 pilots right? Or, my two year old character should not be flying t2 ships? Maybe my character I created this year should not be 40 days off of being a competent t3 pilot?
    I can understand your other complaints, and you are certainly welcome to your opinion, but the one about 5-10 years for t2 just makes no sense....

    It is not T2, just a ship tier. T2 is +20 years.

  • EnerlaEnerla Member Posts: 97

    Originally posted by Thalarius

    I once tried EVE ONLINE back in 2008 and after one month left due to disgust and skill points that took too long. Had one person showed me that it would take 5 to 10 years just to get from tier 1 to tier 2.  It might be worth while for someone who are in there teens to early 30's. But for someone like me who is age 40 bracket, 5 to 10 years of paying month just to get up to tier 2 or even tier 3 is not worth it. 

    Also the scammers was massive and CCP did nothing about it.  <-- major turn off

    PVP GANKERS (so this was a pvp game but allowing high level tier pvp players ganking new players is not a good way to run a MMO)

    PVE skillsets do not work, was warned about it and read horror stories of players who had pve ships lose them via pvp gankers and they cancel thier accounts. PVE players ARE NOT WELCOME IN EVE ONLINE.

    At that time Tech 2 was maximum.

    You was able to learn to use Tech 2 fits after a few weeks / months.

    You was able to learn to use Tech 2 ships a few weeks / months.

    Use of all tech 2 eqeipment in game for all races was a "bit" worse.

    Getting to level 2 missions would take a few days at most, getting to level 3 missions isn't much longer... So if you wanted PVE mission progress it is simple. And most people who do PVE (ratting, missioning, mining, some complexes) and keep a few things in mind never get ganked.

    And in 2008 it was easier to move to low sec. :)

  • LovesurgeonLovesurgeon Member Posts: 40

    Just to be clear there is tech levels and tier levels and they both refer to different measures.

    There are tier 1, 2, and 3 battleships and they all have pretty much the same same skill requirements. Examples of Minmatar battleships would be Typhoon (tier 1), Tempest (tier 2) and Maelstrom (tier 3). Battleship skill 1 is needed for the tier 1 and battleship 3 is needed for the tier 3.

    Tech 2 is another thing and is suposed to be the next progression for a lack of a better word because that has little meaning in Eve. A tech 2 battleship would be the Marauder class such as the Vargur and this does require some fairly extensive skill train but not 5 - 10 years worth, maybe 5 - 10 months to be in a full tech 2 fit Marauder if you focused your training specifically for one.

  • EnerlaEnerla Member Posts: 97

    Thanks for the correction, fixed my post.

    Was in two topics at once. A WoW "discussion" about Gearscore where I had to repeat an argument from one of my blog posts, about how gearscore replaced tier and attunemet requirements, because people do hate links. It is funny when a "fuck gearscore" line becomes "fuck blizzard, we should lynch ghostcrawler" line, but they don't consider other games (eve for example), they don't consider adapting to the problems (leading raids, taing tank role, etc). I think the problem they have with moving to other games (such as eve) is simple: They cannot bring their 1337 3P1XXX to other games.

  • mklinicmklinic Member RarePosts: 2,014

    Originally posted by Lovesurgeon

    Just to be clear there is tech levels and tier levels and they both refer to different measures.

    good point. I tend to use tech and tier interchangeably...damn me and my WoW playing experience...

    So based on that, the original complaint was that he couldn't learn all skills (which Gdemami provided a more realistic time frame) in a short period. Sounds like the same thread that pops up every few weeks i guess.

    -mklinic

    "Do something right, no one remembers.
    Do something wrong, no one forgets"
    -from No One Remembers by In Strict Confidence

  • AnerynAneryn Member Posts: 2

    I've been playing Eve for about 6 months now.  I am running level 4 missions and have like 500m in ISK.  For me what I've experienced so far is about played out.  

    I've ventured into lowsec four times.  All four times I was blown to bits.  Three of those four times it was at a gate.  As far as I can tell from my experience if I don't have a gang of people with me and a serious plan then I'd better stay in highsec.

    I am part of a corp...my like third one.  The first wanted to run 0.0 exclusively.  I didn't run with them at the time because I was very new.  They were repeatedly beaten down and most of them quit...one still plays that I know of.

    The second kinda faded away and the third were hellbent on faction PvP...which they never got to do because two folks got in and stole a buncha stuff.  Sigh.

    Now my most current corp are nice folks but they don't seem to have any inclination to venture into lowsec.  They were exploring wormholes the other day and some gang came along and kicked them out.  I was running missions.

    I have come to the conclusion that I (and all new Eve players) need to set realistic goals and go about researching and preparing to achieve them.

    My goal is to train and acquire wealth until I have what is necessary to PvP effectively.  What that is going to take is not entirely clear to me still but I've been given a hint by a corpmate to train until I can use T3 cruisers and afford to lose them...then I'm not sure.

    Go into a lowsec place somewhere and pick a fight?  I still don't know the answer to this but...at six months I don't feel like I'm anywhere near prepared even though I know people who've started after me who're in corps doing PvP all the time...or so they say.

    What is confusing me is; what is the reward for PvP?  If I band together with an alliance who are holding a constellation or a system or whatever and repell invaders....I am going to enjoy the combat but what are the tangible rewards?  I still don't have the answer to this.  Do I get to loot enemy ships?  Bounties?  Is there a PvP point system like in WoW?

    In WoW I queued up for battlegrounds and went about my business.  I enjoyed all my different characters in the BG's...they all had their roles and powers.  In Eve I have no idea how I'm going to end up...and everyone I've said this to has given me different responses.

    I sorta feel like Eve is a game you make fun for yourself...that you purposefully and methodically squeeze whatever fun there is out of the game.  Blood sweat and tears and all that.  I'm still trying to figure out how to do so.

    What I WISH is that I could go somewhere and just fight.  No Concord, no gate campers stopping me from even getting there, no overwhelming forces on my side or the other side, no 3+ year veterans blowing me out of the sky like I'm nothing, no waiting around cause nothing is happening....

    But unfortunately so far those things are all I've seen.  

     

    But....I'm still looking....for what it's worth.

  • GdemamiGdemami Member EpicPosts: 12,342


    Originally posted by Aneryn
    My goal is to train and acquire wealth until I have what is necessary to PvP effectively.  

    Your wealth won't make you win any battle nor your skill points.

    All you need to be effective in PVP is your experience, something you won't gain by running L4 in high sec...

    If you want to PVP, look-up how to use directional scanner, read some low sec guides, jump to fresh clone, pick up a frig, fit it with what suits your wallet and head to low sec.

    It is no more complicated than that.


    PS:
    Also, I do not know about your corp but telling you to wait until you can PVP in T3 cruiser is damn silly advice...

  • mklinicmklinic Member RarePosts: 2,014

    Originally posted by Aneryn

    What I WISH is that I could go somewhere and just fight.  No Concord, no gate campers stopping me from even getting there, no overwhelming forces on my side or the other side, no 3+ year veterans blowing me out of the sky like I'm nothing, no waiting around cause nothing is happening....

    But unfortunately so far those things are all I've seen.  

     

    But....I'm still looking....for what it's worth.

     

    Have you looked into Red vs Blue? It sounds like you are in a similar position as the OP from the following thread:

    http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/14/view/forums/post/3140803#3140803

    -mklinic

    "Do something right, no one remembers.
    Do something wrong, no one forgets"
    -from No One Remembers by In Strict Confidence

  • LovesurgeonLovesurgeon Member Posts: 40

    Originally posted by mklinic

    Originally posted by Aneryn

    What I WISH is that I could go somewhere and just fight.  No Concord, no gate campers stopping me from even getting there, no overwhelming forces on my side or the other side, no 3+ year veterans blowing me out of the sky like I'm nothing, no waiting around cause nothing is happening....

    But unfortunately so far those things are all I've seen.  

     

    But....I'm still looking....for what it's worth.

     

    Have you looked into Red vs Blue? It sounds like you are in a similar position as the OP from the following thread:

    http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/14/view/forums/post/3140803#3140803

    Also let me add, if you are just looking to have some risk free practice pvp head to the test server with some people and practice blowing each other up there. You are not allowed to just random gank people there at all.

  • AnerynAneryn Member Posts: 2

    Surely I don't have to join Red vs Blue or a particular corp just to get into battles.

     

    I mean it can't be that you have to join certain corps to get PvP...can it?  Can't everyone go?  I like the people I'm in corp with, personally.

     

    I find it hard to believe the game is setup to include people a corp at a time rather than individually at all.  I just figured I don't understand yet.

  • mklinicmklinic Member RarePosts: 2,014

    Originally posted by Aneryn

    Surely I don't have to join Red vs Blue or a particular corp just to get into battles.

     I mean it can't be that you have to join certain corps to get PvP...can it?  Can't everyone go?  I like the people I'm in corp with, personally.

     I find it hard to believe the game is setup to include people a corp at a time rather than individually at all.  I just figured I don't understand yet.

     

    you presented an issue with your experience thus far and Red vs Blue is just one potential fix. Since these two are permanently at war, you don't have to venture into low/null sec to get your pvp fix. As I said, your situation seemed to parallel the OP of the other thread I linked so that's why I mentioned it.

    Generally, conflict is thought of between corps and alliances, but faction warfare would probably be your route for individual (to the extent of your faction i suppose) conflict

    -mklinic

    "Do something right, no one remembers.
    Do something wrong, no one forgets"
    -from No One Remembers by In Strict Confidence

  • Blacknight1Blacknight1 Member Posts: 11

    To the Author---- Thank you for making this.  It really made smile.

     

    everyone telling him what to do---- chill, its a sandbox, he's not looking for universe domination after 8 weeks.  I kinda want to find his corp though.  He makes it sound so perfect.

    SWTOR, EVE (Atrum Muris), Allods(Ferrum), APB (Blacknight)

  • drbaltazardrbaltazar Member UncommonPosts: 7,856

    i experienced his feeling!eve online can be an impressive game when you go in first time.me i wasnt luck got pulled out of newby area got killed left the game right then and there lol.but just reading his story was a nice perspective,hope he doesnt meet bad luck next week!

  • KravisKravis Member UncommonPosts: 186

    Good read.  If EVE Uni accepts your app. will you go or stay in your new corp.?  Looking forward to your next article.

  • FreeBooteRFreeBooteR Member Posts: 333

    He'll hit a brick wall when it comes to:

    Eidetic memory 4,500,000.00 isk

    Logic 4,500,000.00 isk

    Clarity 4,500,000.00 isk

    unless he can find them for cheap somewhere

    most likely he'll do learning, instant recall, analytical mind, iron will, and spatial awareness...then some useful money getting skills and return to those big hitters.  Well to the veterans with billions it's nothing, but a newb it's huge.

    Archlinux ftw

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