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Lord of the Rings Online: Free to Play Interview
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It might have to do with how many "free" points suscribers and vip's get, how much they are going to charge for LOTRO points and how much the points in lotro buy in comparison to DDO.
Sony is marketing their Station system but Turbine seems to be marketing each game as its own entity. Maybe it's an accounting thing. but it's clear that they want them separated.
One example is that DDO needs to be funded based on their players. If someone is a lifer in lotro and they get free points per month and then solely use them in DDO then that is not adding to ddo's bottom line.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
...Yes you do. If you pay a subscription fee for an MMO you do. I fail to see the problem here. You would rather be forced to pay a subscription than to have the option of not paying it if you don't feel like it? I mean, you already pay for it, yes? And if you pay for it now you get everything you've been getting and more. Your argument doesn't make any sense.
QFT, don't you want some more noobs to bash up or something?
This and a bit more.
LotRO going F2P isn't the end of the world, it may not even be a bad thing for the game long term and it most likely will be a profitable move for Turbine.
However, the way they chose to implement the change; the outright lies and deception involved in stonewalling anyone who asked what was going for 6 months while content stagnated and then engaging in a slash and burn campaign to eliminate all the old posts where they said they would NOT got F2P with LotRO is pathetic.
The second part of the announcement which basically says that there will be no significant content update for another 3-6 months plus basically nothing at all in 2011 is pathetic.
I really don't get the "battered wife syndrome" that seems to affect far too many MMO fans. Turbine just took a huge steaming dump on all their most loyal customers. That it may have made sound business sense is no reason for any of those customers to like it better or ever trust Turbine again.
They have seen the last of any payment for any game or service from me.; not because they were stupid or wrong or evil or whatever but because I do not do business with companies that treat their customers like this.
Before all you quitters start jumping to conclusions, read the complete information on the actual site, rather than just reading this article. This is only an interview from two employee's of Turbine, and doesn't have all the infromation. The FAQ, at www.lotro.com answers a pretty decent amount of questions, especially about the 3 player tiers; Free, Premium, and VIP, and what qualifies that. For all those Subscribers out there complaining, and saying " Oh well, looks like I am going to quit now, since LOTRO is going " Free to Play".". Look at it like this, if you already have everything up to Seige of Mirkwood, then you won't have to pay for it again, its already unlocked, you will already be a VIP member. You just have to pay the same monthly fee you always have done, not so sure about lifetimers, but all this stuff is subject to change, its only June and November is months away, just chill out and watch what happens. All the stuff can be earned through gameplay, so it takes you longer to do more things, and its a little bit harder to get there. Hell it maybe the same stuff your already doing in game right now. So just stop your complaining, it gets nowhere. Anyway Founders and Lifetimers get extra Turbine Points to spend every month, and from what I see those points accumulate. Mainly why Turbine is doing this is for the people not playing this MMORPG, to actually give them the chance to play and try it out. Rather than having a 14-day trial, it gives more of the casual player more time to play. Because unlike some of you, not everyone has time to play mmorpgs for hours on end.
I see: a zillion different options to catch money: "free, premium, vip, founders, lifetimers... and various degrees of item sales, expansions - bought or not - unlocked/locked content etc...
The end conclusion: if Lotro was really that good for "many" players, they wouldn't take all these in game measures, would they ?
They can't motivate enough players to pay their subs..."so let's make a system where they don't feel the money we grab"
Seriously: calling a game "free" and limit the Gold for those "free" players to 5 Gold ???
Lotro apparently was no longer popular enough to simply ask a fixed subscription fee. Period.
Its embarrassing when an NPC compliments you in an MMo, the only relevant, cool and epic things come from players whispering you Grtz, mate, we did it. copyright Pilnkplonk
That's not the main complaint. The main complaint is that now the community is going to change from a mature one to a f2p one, where most of the f2p games attract the worst gamers ever.
We p2p gamers like to play p2p games, not only for what we like about them in terms of content, lore, etc., but because they are p2p. When you change the type of game we initially bought, a p2p one, to a game we would have never put any time or effort into, a f2p one, you are literally pulling the rug from under our feet.
Don't give me that "Game experience may change during online play" crap, because honestly, this is not referring the method of payment, it is referring to the actual game content, ie., what once was a siege in moria is now a siege in mirkwood.
Give unto p2p what is p2p, and f2p that which is f2p; Do not mix the two.
If I had known this P2P game that I CHOSE to play from release unto now was going to change to F2P, I would have never picked it up.
There is a stark difference between p2p games and f2p games, and we will see that in the future patches to this game. The content itself will change, just like DDO has from when it went p2p to f2p.
I hate f2p games, I despise them, I think they are leeches to the mmo industry. And because of this change that LOTRO has undergone, I now see LOTRO in the same manner.
If money needed to be generated that bad, it would have been better off the game itself be shut down.
Quote me on this, this is what the developers did to swg with NCU. And if this game does not fall, it will have changed to be something completely different than intended.
Tolkien would be ashamed.
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"Your pride, good sir, far exceeds your worth." -x3r0h
Oldest mmorpg.com member with the least amount of post counts. That counts for something, right?
yea turbine also said it would not go f2p also
Originally Posted by Patience
Just to clear this up, LOTRO was originally intended to always be subscription only and it's absolutely true that we had no plans to go Free-to-Play. When the statements in question were made, they were true; but clearly, our plans did change.
right from the donkeys mouth from official forums.So lemme ask when there buisnessmodel changes againand they begin selling all the stuff they say they wont atm how many of you will roll over and accept it> Turbine has NO credibility left anyone who claims they do don't understand credibility very well.
Sorry to double post, but my first one took quite a bit of time to type up. So it sounds like this was only Turbines decision to make LOTRO "Free to Play", but did you forget the fact that Warner Bros. now has control over Turbine. Maybe it was true that LOTRO was not going to be "Free to Play", as said by Patience and Sapience. But now under Warner Bros., it was decided that, with the success of DDO's new "Free to Play" model, LOTRO should also be "Free to Play". Dont go around assuming that Turbine is hiding the fact that it wasn't going "Free to Play", by deleting the threads. Many things change when one business is owned by a much larger one. Don't just say that they are lying. Turbine has every right to delete those threads, because those statements are no longer true. That doesn't mean that those were lies, no one can foresee the future. As such don't go around saying such nonsense about a company if you don't think before you type. I do agree with the fact that yeah they should have given a warning about this change......oh wait they did, its not like it changed and is now "Free to Play". The change doesnt occur till the Fall so thats a few months away.
Well, I've played many f2p and many p2p since becoming an MMO addict. I have to say, one of the worst communities I have ever come across was from a p2p game...WoW.
Well if you are a P2P, I assume and I know assuming is bad, you played WoW. If not, then thats what happens when you assume. But if you have, then you must know the community of that MMORPG. That game has the worst, if not then one of the worst communities of all time. Last time I checked too, that game was P2P, not F2P. No matter which type you go with P2P or F2P your going to have people who are immature, or in your terms "F2P", one may have more than the other, but that all depends on the game. WoW is so easy and attracts much more people, has been out longer, ect. LOTRO attracts the poeple interested in Tolkien lore, mainly LOTR, not to say just that. But that makes up at least 80% of the community, maybe more, maybe less, just spitballing there. But as I see it, I'd rather try it and see how it goes rather than just saying right now, that I am going to quit, just because of that, I quit WoW, because I loved the community of LOTRO, and thats what kept me, I will be heading back to WoW when new expansion comes back, because though the community is very bad there, there are more +'s then -'s, of going back. I play because you find a very nice guild that enjoy playing with, there are quite a few decent people as well outside of guilds, that you socialize with. So there is going to be more immature people within LOTRO, all that could be is just your opinion and some others, but we wont know till the change occurs. We will see how many people from other mmorpgs come to play, or see how many that are new to the scene of mmorpgs. We just cant assume the fact that the community is going to go from one extreme to the other.
This is the truth of the matter. Turbine caught again in another lie. For 6 months we got nothing, no updates. Anytime anybody asked the threads were locked and deleted.
What lies were told. (1) We doing great. (2) Our sub base is great nothing to worry abot the game is growing. (3) Were not going F2P, in fact any thread that even mentioned that was locked.
So if they were doing so great then why the buyout?
If there subs were so great and the game was growing then why this move?
We all know that they know they were doing this for months, thus the silince they were hoping to prolong this is much as possible, and keep getting folks to buy the lifetime. In fact just a few weeks back Patience was on a thread going no f2p, followed with a tin foil hat guy on a post that has been locked and pruned.
I am not worried to much about the f2p part of it any more, the out right lies over the past 6 months, I cant trust anything they say now.
[Quote]I think you should read what this is about again since its players like you who are the big winners in this.[/Quote]
A really, so loosing two character slots per server is a big win?!!!!!
I currently have 7, as a VIP I would only have 5. SO HOW ABOUT YOU ACTUALLY READING THE FAQ!!!
Also, do you really think that nothing will change for subscribers? This is total bull! Look at all the stuff that they offer for sale in the DDO store and tell me that you really want that? I cant stand the thought ot it!
The whole Turbine Store thing will totally ruin immersion for me.
Oh and for the guy who asked my why I did not become a lifetime subscriber: This offer has not always been available! When I wanted it, they did not have it. They just got it again in Europe and I was about to get it, when this announcement came out. I am sooo glad I did not. Oh and it is not about the money, you ijit! It is about the immersion and fairness and balance fo the game and the fact that you will always feel pressed to buy more and spend more money in the Turbine store to stay competitive. Players will run arround with nice stuff that they BOUGHT in the store. That feels like cheating to me, sorry. The thought allone makes me want to puke. Also, do you really think that things will stay that way? Turbine wants to make money and then more money. The lifetime subscribers dont do that, so they have to find ways to get more money out of them. They do that with that store. Whatever they promise, I dont believe a single word of what they are saying!
Money, money, money, must be funny.
I dont really see this as a bad move, it will bring more playerbase, more customers for Turbine, and alot more people to group up with.
Also, I dont get why the LT's are whining and bitching about this in every freaking post I see on this thread. Youve already played for years with that money, do some math and you will see that you have paid already less than those who pay monthly every month, just cus' they cant buy LT anymore. LT's will also get free points, so, why not? Its fine.
I could still buy my own LT as I am from Europe, but we'll see. Havent played LOTRO for ½ a year now..
I'm going to try this game.
I understand what might have happened, however unlike you I do not choose to give them a pass on it. Turbine doesn't get to magically drop everything they previously promised because they were bought out, that's part of the baggage anyone who buys an existing company gets along with the purchase. Think of it in legal terms if it helps: The new parent company is legally bound to honor old warranties, legally liable for any outstanding lawsuits, heck they are liable if Turbine was illegally dumping copy toner behind the dumpster outside the office...so I don't see why I shouldn't hold them to the promises they made to their players. Arguing otherwise is stupid to me as Sapience asserting that "steefel"'(sp?) publicly promising content updates wasn't relevent because he got shuffled to another project.
Yea the entire Stefell thing him and orion and the other devs being moved to another project was sure done on the quite.
We just found out Kate has been the exec for lotro for over a year, while steffel had been making his usuall comments on lotro as late as last month. I found it odd that Kate had been the exec suposdly durring the beta of SOM, and stefell promoting som when he was suposedly on another poject. It is all just a bit strage.
One thing for sure the devs were pulled to another poject and lotro had went stagnent. Were all going to have to see what happens now. I still dont trust what I am seing them saying and doing. But like it or not times are a changing.
I think the hybrid model works well in games that offer mostly pve . There isn't anything to win so the pay to win arguement is redunant and quite frankly a little stupid . The turbine store wont ruin any sort of immersion for me in fact it will be quite useful at times and I think with the boost in the numbers of players this will bring in and in the increased revenue it should mean a lot more new content will be available . I do however think it was completly wrong to offer a lifetime subscription at half price only a few weeks before changing the buisness model . While not actually fraud it certainly feels like it to those that brought it . I think for those with vip access any future expansions should be free now and it would be seen as pure greed to charge for them . The thing is with this model is its really not completly free is more an extended free trial , subscriptions still exist and to get to the end game content you ll either have to pay a one of payment or become a vip . With increased numbers playing it will be easier to group for lower level quests . The only downside initially is you ll proberbly get loads of trolls coming in to have their say but as in DDO this will only last a couple of months before things settle down . LOTRO wont ever appeal to younger players in the way Warcraft does so I think the community will remain mature and maybe somewhat larger . I'm already at work trying to get friends I know that play mmos to at least try it and you know what I think a fair few will .
To each their own. But corporations are no different than individuals in many regards. They will always act in their self interest. Obviously some corporate bean counters ran the numbers, and decided that more money could be made this way, than with their current business model.
How that works out for them in the future remains to be seen.
As for their revision of history, that too should be expected. Its pretty much human nature, yet again. Why do you think politicians and governments hate the Internet as much as they do? It makes it more difficult for them to keep their various lies from coming back to haunt them.
But keep this in mind in regards to Turbine. Perhaps at the time, they really did not have any intention of taking LOTRO F2P. Perhaps it was the idea of the corporate types from WB?
As for content, given all of the work thats going into the switch over, perhaps they have limited staff/talent resources that they can throw at the problems? If it really was an edict from on high within WB, then they are doing what they can, with what they have. Again, only time will tell how this works out.
I've been in WoW since late beta. I have four 80's on Silvermoon(one of the most populated realms to this day), and while it isn't the best community, its FAR from the worst I've seen on some other games(F2P/P2P). Might I remind you that Shadowbane was originally P2P?...
Its not quite time for torches and pitchforks. Lets see how this works out, before we see if thats warranted.
I've been a huge fan of this game and the franchise in general for about three years now.
I know it won't make any difference, but I've just cancelled my account.
Why? - Free to play opens the floodgates to any non-dedicated gamer who chooses to play for 'a little bit'. I don't want 'little bit' players in my games, plain and simple.
M
While there is some truth in that it will be mostly at the lower levels . Kinships will only keep active players so its highly unlikly you'll see many casual players beyond level 40 . While at the lower levels it will be easier to get groupings .I can't count the number of times I've tried to get groups together for instances and group quests at lower levels without success . Its quite simple stay in your kinship and it will make no difference to you at all apart from the fact when you level an alt it will be far more interesting because middle earth will be a lot buisier . I have a life time sub and I'm looking forward to this . My kinship does have a few players that think it willbe a bad thing but they are by no means a majority . If anything like DDO it will be a greater success . One thing I would have liked to see is being able to use you credits in both the DDO and LOTRO stores allowing access to both games but I guess thats unlikly to happen at least in the near future .
Lets hope the likes of Warhammer , Everquest ,Vanguard and Age of Conan are taking note . This is a good thing from mmos a break with the tired old 15 dollar subsrciption model which is failing miserably to attact players to most MMOs out there today .
Its another step in the right direction .
hmm...not bad...maybe i will try this one...
I don't think it's a bad change but I do think it is a 'change'. It changes the dynamic of who populates the gameworld. It changes the perception of how you view the other players in the game.
I understand why they made the change, trying to ride DDO's coattails but there is one huge difference as to why I don't think it'll be as successfull for this as it was for DDO. In DDO, from what I've heard, it is perfectly viable to play that game without spending a dime. With their current model, that doesn't seem to be the case in LoTRO. It's one thing to want to buy items from the shop because you enjoy the game, it's something else when you feel you 'need' to buy those items to enjoy the game.