Speaking as a pre-CU SWG vet, I can only hope & pray that Smugglers will /finally/ be able to smuggle. To the best of my knowledge, they /still/ can't over at that 3-legged mutant horror SOE still keeps on life support. Hell, I remember the in-depth information the devs posted on the forums, giving all kinds of info on "you'll be able to do this" and "it'll work like this"...only none of it was ever implemented, ever. (Not sure they ever intended to, honestly.)
I have ginormously high hopes for this game--but then again, Bioware has never let me down. If their Smugglers can smuggle, then SW:TOR will /automatically/, by that capacity alone, stand head-and-shoulders over SWG.
I played Galaxies, and I played a smuggler who smuggled things...
Now, that being said I was not very far into the smuggler "tree". I was mostly pistoleer and Tera Kasi (sp? it's been a while), with just enough smuggler tree for a couple of fun abilities.
My skills did not make my a smuggler, my actions did. I was a mover a goods from planet to planet. I was a supplier for doctors, cooks, etc. I smuggled the finest hides, meats, weapons, brandy and whatever else would make me money on the market.
Unfortunately with this iteration of Star Wars I have the feeling that the "smuggler" will just be a clearly defined class who fights a certain way and dosen't really smuggle much of anything except for very specific quest related items.
"The dialogue was a bit tedious, something we have found throughout the game. Though it is Bioware's style and has served them well in the past, I am just not sure how well it will do in an MMO when you are trying to get your work done quickly. Just remember speed gamers, the space bar is your friend."
I don't get it. i often see people on this site even complain about the lack of immersion or story in most mmos where you basically skip all the quest text and jump right to killing X rats. Finally a game has the depth, hell more depth, and decisions than most single player games and now people whine about it?
Give me more dialog bioware. Set yourself apart from all the other EQ/WoW clones and make my character more than just a fancy barbie doll i collect gear for.
The depth of an MMO is to be found in the communications and actions between players.
NPC's are mere fluff in any multi mass on line play.
NPC talkies and voice overs are even worse: they are vegetables spawning the same routine like coms in an extreme boring and irritating non intelligent way.
They are a nessecary evil in single player RPG and adventure games, because .... simply you are alone.
In an mmorpg they should only be used as window dressing. A stage for the avatars.
If you even remotely think they have a meaning in prolonged MMORPG pplay: you are in the same boat as Bioware.
The sinking one.
Harsh words, but you'll think of them in 2 years time.
Its embarrassing when an NPC compliments you in an MMo, the only relevant, cool and epic things come from players whispering you Grtz, mate, we did it. copyright Pilnkplonk
But... what would they smuggle? Why would they do it? And how would it be real?
You'd have to introduce trading as a part of gameplay, a bit like EVE, and have contraband. You'd then further have to give Smugglers special skills that other classes do not have.
You'd ALSO have to introduce a risk of being caught and implications of being caught, otherwise it would be completely silly.
So, it could be brilliant fun, but I can only see it happening in an artificial sense of being part of the storyline.
I agree with this poster. There needs to be consequences of being caught as a smuggler, otherwise there's no real point to them. Perhaps there will be a system where notorious smugglers get put on bounties that BHs can take out. Or get chased around by angry guards if you get caught with contraband on you like in SWG.
It was a bit random though in SWG since I never got stopped and scanned once within a big city. It only seemed to ever happen out in the middle of no where. I almost always had illegal stuff on me though and only ended up dying once due to being caught!
As far as what would we be smuggling? Anything illegal! That's the point. So, there would have to be a system where some things are legal and others aren't. Or perhaps we're breaking trade laws that are agreed between two planets, or whatever. Why? To make lots of credits, or perhaps there's a cause that the smuggler believes in.
I don't think smugglers would need to have special skills. I see smugglers as being jacks of all trades or having skills from other non-jedi/sith classes actually. Wasn't Han Solo originally a stormtrooper before he began his life as a smuggler?
Smugglers would work well if Bioware allows for player-made content. If it's entirely artificially structured through questlines it would be disappointing.
Please correct me if im wrong, but wasnt there talk about that you could change your faction, say if you chose the sith but felt that this wasnt your thing than you could do some missions to change you alignement.
If they scrapped the idea please tell me, cause i se alot of posts here and all over the net saying it is bad that smugglers and BH only can be one side and not the other.
P.S.: if my english is bad, i deeply apologize to all the internett, i am not that good at written english.
i just cant wait to check out a fully voiced game! I have enjoyed the quest fottage they have released and cant wait for beta!
LOL. Fully voiced over motion pictures have been introduced massively since 1929.
Video games are about gamplay not watching an NPC talk the same 5 sentences from start to finish.
"I don't know Sir" , "You're welcome Sir", "Make a choice Sir".
At the same time - in an MMO - a few hundred players stand around you (in vain) to get an anwser from you because you are so "involved" with the prerecorded NPC and its minute long preprogrammed vegetable talk.
Its embarrassing when an NPC compliments you in an MMo, the only relevant, cool and epic things come from players whispering you Grtz, mate, we did it. copyright Pilnkplonk
"The dialogue was a bit tedious, something we have found throughout the game. Though it is Bioware's style and has served them well in the past, I am just not sure how well it will do in an MMO when you are trying to get your work done quickly. Just remember speed gamers, the space bar is your friend."
I don't get it. i often see people on this site even complain about the lack of immersion or story in most mmos where you basically skip all the quest text and jump right to killing X rats. Finally a game has the depth, hell more depth, and decisions than most single player games and now people whine about it?
Give me more dialog bioware. Set yourself apart from all the other EQ/WoW clones and make my character more than just a fancy barbie doll i collect gear for.
This!
Thirded.
Forthed!
If you don't want story line and just want a quick Quest so you can kill kill kill. Then this may not be the MMO for you.
Corporation, n: An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility. - Ambrose Bierce
BW really should of made smuggler and a couple other classes apart of a neutral faction. Smugglers by nature don't usually choose sides and only using two factions is boring and cliche' to say the least.
You should watch the back story on the holonet before making coments like this one. The smuggelers joined up with the republic due to the on coming threat. I understand your point but they have already stated why they are on the republics side.
Please correct me if im wrong, but wasnt there talk about that you could change your faction, say if you chose the sith but felt that this wasnt your thing than you could do some missions to change you alignement.
If they scrapped the idea please tell me, cause i se alot of posts here and all over the net saying it is bad that smugglers and BH only can be one side and not the other.
P.S.: if my english is bad, i deeply apologize to all the internett, i am not that good at written english.
"The dialogue was a bit tedious, something we have found throughout the game. Though it is Bioware's style and has served them well in the past, I am just not sure how well it will do in an MMO when you are trying to get your work done quickly. Just remember speed gamers, the space bar is your friend."
I don't get it. i often see people on this site even complain about the lack of immersion or story in most mmos where you basically skip all the quest text and jump right to killing X rats. Finally a game has the depth, hell more depth, and decisions than most single player games and now people whine about it?
Give me more dialog bioware. Set yourself apart from all the other EQ/WoW clones and make my character more than just a fancy barbie doll i collect gear for.
The depth of an MMO is to be found in the communications and actions between players.
NPC's are mere fluff in any multi mass on line play.
NPC talkies and voice overs are even worse: they are vegetables spawning the same routine like coms in an extreme boring and irritating non intelligent way.
They are a nessecary evil in single player RPG and adventure games, because .... simply you are alone.
In an mmorpg they should only be used as window dressing. A stage for the avatars.
If you even remotely think they have a meaning in prolonged MMORPG pplay: you are in the same boat as Bioware.
The sinking one.
Harsh words, but you'll think of them in 2 years time.
I'll admit that the pull to MMO's for me is interaction with other people rather than story content or quest depth. If that's what I was after I would only play single player RPGs...
but, "necessary evil"? C'mon. Mass Effect II (for example) was a great game where the "necessary evil" made the game and immersed you in the story. If it wasn't for NPCs, talkies and cut-scenes, you may as well be playing space invaders or a text-based RPG.
And lets be honest, there's not many examples of games out there with rubbish NPC interaction that are incredibly successful currently (WOW excluded). In my mind currently, pretty much all MMO's are in that sinking boat you're talking about...and it's not talkies or having options at quest time that's putting them there. Some type of innovation or change needs to be made in the industry.
Do I wish SWTOR had spent the voice-acting and conversation tree budget on development for a robust economy, professions and space combat? Yes. But I also think this is going to be the best MMO released next year, maybe for a couple of years...even if it does feel more like KOTOR online than a true MMO.
I space bar through text as much as anyone else, but do you know why? I don't care about the story in most MMO's. Most often they're the loosest of premise to get you to spend 100's of hours and $15 a month. I can promise you that the first character I play through SWTOR, I will listen to and read every single line of quest info. It's an IP I care about and a universe I want to become immersed in.
My only concern about the voice acting and questing in SWTOR is how the end game content will work. Will I feel like I have "finished the game" once I have exhausted all this content? Will there be any drive for me to continue? End game content, however, is an issue in every MMO..and at least I know there's 3 or 4 alts that I want to get to max level in SWTOR before I move on.
You failed to read or learn that SW:ToR is the first FULLY voiced MMO. That means every single peice of diolog that exists in the gme has already been voiced and its exactly like it is in the SW:KotOR. every dialog had already been [planned and set to follow certain responces or questions that you the play will ask while playing... its all in the way its been programed
"The dialogue was a bit tedious, something we have found throughout the game. Though it is Bioware's style and has served them well in the past, I am just not sure how well it will do in an MMO when you are trying to get your work done quickly. Just remember speed gamers, the space bar is your friend."
I don't get it. i often see people on this site even complain about the lack of immersion or story in most mmos where you basically skip all the quest text and jump right to killing X rats. Finally a game has the depth, hell more depth, and decisions than most single player games and now people whine about it?
Give me more dialog bioware. Set yourself apart from all the other EQ/WoW clones and make my character more than just a fancy barbie doll i collect gear for.
This!
Thirded.
Forthed!
If you don't want story line and just want a quick Quest so you can kill kill kill. Then this may not be the MMO for you.
fifthed?
tho to them, it might have just seemed tedious considering they had limited time to try the game and was more interested in skills/combat testing.
From the pic it looks like they have tweaked the player models a bit? The hands look less inflated, weapons a more realistic size and just better proportioned than the older ones.
You failed to read or learn that SW:ToR is the first FULLY voiced MMO. That means every single peice of diolog that exists in the gme has already been voiced and its exactly like it is in the SW:KotOR. every dialog had already been [planned and set to follow certain responces or questions that you the play will ask while playing... its all in the way its been programed
I didn't fail to read or learn *anything*, so no need to try to put me down.
That only partly answered my question. KotOR was single player only, so it's easier to code in who says what when, but my question was pertaining more to when you have a group of players doing a storyline quest, who says what and when?
I'm guessing that it's possible to change the outcome of the entire story by what people say to the NPCs and if so, it could open up to an interesting set of new dynamics in groups where players ask other players to answer a specific thing at points in the story when they are grouped up.
My question was not merely on the mechanics, it was also about a more generalised who says what and when?
Is it lack of my English comprehension skill or is the article a bit inconsistent? At the first paragraph it clearly states how "there are a few things that continue to stand out. The storylines that are created for characters are by far the most intricate seen in a game" only to be followed by a statement how "[t]he dialogue was a bit tedious, something we have found throughout the game." Does the story of the game stand out as being tedious or is it only the fashion with which this story is transmitted to player(s)?
All-in-all, the hands-on experience echoes rather similar sentiments as we have seen by virtually every gaming site since E3: There is nothing particularily revolutionary in the game-play mechanics and most seem to politely state that they need more information before they give their final judgement. In a sense it is a bit worrying when the demo that is supposed to hook you to the game fails to do so. After all, Bioware are showing the bits and pieces they decided were the best way to showcase their forthcoming title. If even these (currently) best sections can't captivate those testing the game, they surely have lots to work on before the title is released.
sounds great! I can't wait for this game to come out, probably take a large chunk of the player base of a well known mmo.
Different cover options? Souds Epic. Stealth smuggler, awesome. Can't wait to see how this game plays out . Only thing is, if the dialogue is so tedious ... but you can easily hit the space bar key if it gets too out of hand right?
Comments
I played Galaxies, and I played a smuggler who smuggled things...
Now, that being said I was not very far into the smuggler "tree". I was mostly pistoleer and Tera Kasi (sp? it's been a while), with just enough smuggler tree for a couple of fun abilities.
My skills did not make my a smuggler, my actions did. I was a mover a goods from planet to planet. I was a supplier for doctors, cooks, etc. I smuggled the finest hides, meats, weapons, brandy and whatever else would make me money on the market.
Unfortunately with this iteration of Star Wars I have the feeling that the "smuggler" will just be a clearly defined class who fights a certain way and dosen't really smuggle much of anything except for very specific quest related items.
The depth of an MMO is to be found in the communications and actions between players.
NPC's are mere fluff in any multi mass on line play.
NPC talkies and voice overs are even worse: they are vegetables spawning the same routine like coms in an extreme boring and irritating non intelligent way.
They are a nessecary evil in single player RPG and adventure games, because .... simply you are alone.
In an mmorpg they should only be used as window dressing. A stage for the avatars.
If you even remotely think they have a meaning in prolonged MMORPG pplay: you are in the same boat as Bioware.
The sinking one.
Harsh words, but you'll think of them in 2 years time.
Its embarrassing when an NPC compliments you in an MMo, the only relevant, cool and epic things come from players whispering you Grtz, mate, we did it. copyright Pilnkplonk
I agree with this poster. There needs to be consequences of being caught as a smuggler, otherwise there's no real point to them. Perhaps there will be a system where notorious smugglers get put on bounties that BHs can take out. Or get chased around by angry guards if you get caught with contraband on you like in SWG.
It was a bit random though in SWG since I never got stopped and scanned once within a big city. It only seemed to ever happen out in the middle of no where. I almost always had illegal stuff on me though and only ended up dying once due to being caught!
As far as what would we be smuggling? Anything illegal! That's the point. So, there would have to be a system where some things are legal and others aren't. Or perhaps we're breaking trade laws that are agreed between two planets, or whatever. Why? To make lots of credits, or perhaps there's a cause that the smuggler believes in.
I don't think smugglers would need to have special skills. I see smugglers as being jacks of all trades or having skills from other non-jedi/sith classes actually. Wasn't Han Solo originally a stormtrooper before he began his life as a smuggler?
Smugglers would work well if Bioware allows for player-made content. If it's entirely artificially structured through questlines it would be disappointing.
Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.
i just cant wait to check out a fully voiced game! I have enjoyed the quest fottage they have released and cant wait for beta!
Please correct me if im wrong, but wasnt there talk about that you could change your faction, say if you chose the sith but felt that this wasnt your thing than you could do some missions to change you alignement.
If they scrapped the idea please tell me, cause i se alot of posts here and all over the net saying it is bad that smugglers and BH only can be one side and not the other.
P.S.: if my english is bad, i deeply apologize to all the internett, i am not that good at written english.
LOL. Fully voiced over motion pictures have been introduced massively since 1929.
Video games are about gamplay not watching an NPC talk the same 5 sentences from start to finish.
"I don't know Sir" , "You're welcome Sir", "Make a choice Sir".
At the same time - in an MMO - a few hundred players stand around you (in vain) to get an anwser from you because you are so "involved" with the prerecorded NPC and its minute long preprogrammed vegetable talk.
Its embarrassing when an NPC compliments you in an MMo, the only relevant, cool and epic things come from players whispering you Grtz, mate, we did it. copyright Pilnkplonk
Forthed!
If you don't want story line and just want a quick Quest so you can kill kill kill. Then this may not be the MMO for you.
Corporation, n: An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility. - Ambrose Bierce
You should watch the back story on the holonet before making coments like this one. The smuggelers joined up with the republic due to the on coming threat. I understand your point but they have already stated why they are on the republics side.
<a href="http://www.enjin.com/"; alt="swtor guild hosting"><img src="http://sigs.enjin.com/sig-swtor/078143aeee5205ec.png"></a>;
Any ideas how the smuggler will work in PvP when the enemy will be moving and trying to flank immediately?
Does the cover you took with someone targeted stay as cover if they move?
Can't wait to get my hands on a beta test or the actual game itself. Go BioWare!
No Faction change at Launch.
I'll admit that the pull to MMO's for me is interaction with other people rather than story content or quest depth. If that's what I was after I would only play single player RPGs...
but, "necessary evil"? C'mon. Mass Effect II (for example) was a great game where the "necessary evil" made the game and immersed you in the story. If it wasn't for NPCs, talkies and cut-scenes, you may as well be playing space invaders or a text-based RPG.
And lets be honest, there's not many examples of games out there with rubbish NPC interaction that are incredibly successful currently (WOW excluded). In my mind currently, pretty much all MMO's are in that sinking boat you're talking about...and it's not talkies or having options at quest time that's putting them there. Some type of innovation or change needs to be made in the industry.
Do I wish SWTOR had spent the voice-acting and conversation tree budget on development for a robust economy, professions and space combat? Yes. But I also think this is going to be the best MMO released next year, maybe for a couple of years...even if it does feel more like KOTOR online than a true MMO.
I space bar through text as much as anyone else, but do you know why? I don't care about the story in most MMO's. Most often they're the loosest of premise to get you to spend 100's of hours and $15 a month. I can promise you that the first character I play through SWTOR, I will listen to and read every single line of quest info. It's an IP I care about and a universe I want to become immersed in.
My only concern about the voice acting and questing in SWTOR is how the end game content will work. Will I feel like I have "finished the game" once I have exhausted all this content? Will there be any drive for me to continue? End game content, however, is an issue in every MMO..and at least I know there's 3 or 4 alts that I want to get to max level in SWTOR before I move on.
I noticed in some of the videos of SW:ToR I've seen that both PCs talk in the cut scenes. How is it determined who says what and when?
Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.
You failed to read or learn that SW:ToR is the first FULLY voiced MMO. That means every single peice of diolog that exists in the gme has already been voiced and its exactly like it is in the SW:KotOR. every dialog had already been [planned and set to follow certain responces or questions that you the play will ask while playing... its all in the way its been programed
fifthed?
tho to them, it might have just seemed tedious considering they had limited time to try the game and was more interested in skills/combat testing.
From the pic it looks like they have tweaked the player models a bit? The hands look less inflated, weapons a more realistic size and just better proportioned than the older ones.
I didn't fail to read or learn *anything*, so no need to try to put me down.
That only partly answered my question. KotOR was single player only, so it's easier to code in who says what when, but my question was pertaining more to when you have a group of players doing a storyline quest, who says what and when?
I'm guessing that it's possible to change the outcome of the entire story by what people say to the NPCs and if so, it could open up to an interesting set of new dynamics in groups where players ask other players to answer a specific thing at points in the story when they are grouped up.
My question was not merely on the mechanics, it was also about a more generalised who says what and when?
Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.
Is it lack of my English comprehension skill or is the article a bit inconsistent? At the first paragraph it clearly states how "there are a few things that continue to stand out. The storylines that are created for characters are by far the most intricate seen in a game" only to be followed by a statement how "[t]he dialogue was a bit tedious, something we have found throughout the game." Does the story of the game stand out as being tedious or is it only the fashion with which this story is transmitted to player(s)?
All-in-all, the hands-on experience echoes rather similar sentiments as we have seen by virtually every gaming site since E3: There is nothing particularily revolutionary in the game-play mechanics and most seem to politely state that they need more information before they give their final judgement. In a sense it is a bit worrying when the demo that is supposed to hook you to the game fails to do so. After all, Bioware are showing the bits and pieces they decided were the best way to showcase their forthcoming title. If even these (currently) best sections can't captivate those testing the game, they surely have lots to work on before the title is released.
sounds great! I can't wait for this game to come out, probably take a large chunk of the player base of a well known mmo.
Different cover options? Souds Epic. Stealth smuggler, awesome. Can't wait to see how this game plays out . Only thing is, if the dialogue is so tedious ... but you can easily hit the space bar key if it gets too out of hand right?