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General: Five Reasons to Be Concerned about LotRO F2P
Stradden
Managing EditorMember CommonPosts: 6,696
MMORPG.com's Bill Murphy writes the companion to his previous "Five Reasons to be Excited about LotRO F2P", examining the other side of the coin.
Okay, so by now the news has sunk in a bit. Lord of the Rings Online will be going Free-to-Play this fall in the grand tradition of Turbine's recent successful maneuver of switching DDO to F2P. Thing is, DDO was a failing game and the F2P conversion likely saved the title from extinction. What's the reasoning behind converting LotRO, by all means a still successful title? Players are busy debating whether it was Turbine or Warner Brothers' decision (the latter recently acquired the former), but the real question should be whether or not the conversion to F2P will mark the same or similar results as DDO experienced. There are no concrete numbers, but by many estimates LotRO enjoys over several hundred thousand subscriptions. When DDO went F2P the move re-sparked interest in the title and Turbine was later able to report that subscriptions (which were now optional) had tripled and the amount of players had increased exponentially overall.
It was a true turnaround success story. DDO, struggling to find its footing in a crowded market, managed to escape cancellation by innovating in its business model. Perhaps LotRO, while not nearly as troubled as its sister game, is hoping to enjoy similar levels of success. Maybe the increase in subscriptions won't be so high, but perhaps the amount of Turbine points spent will be substantial. LotRO is a theme-park adventure through Middle-earth, which previously was enjoyable for one low entry fee. This fall that will all change, and while unfounded as of yet, there may be reason to worry about what will happen to Middle-earth when the Free Peoples really become the "Free!" peoples. Here then is a brief list of five reasons you should be worried about a F2P LotRO.
Cheers,
Jon Wood
Managing Editor
MMORPG.com
Comments
the link point to http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/45/feature/4341/page/1
BestSigEver :P
now the link is working hehe
BestSigEver :P
Most of that is unfounded speculation. Turbine is not Gpotato. This is a AAA MMG that is 3ed in the west that is going free to play with an item shop. Turbine has been nothing but respectful to the IP and the DDO conversion shows they know how to do a cash shop with out cheapening a game.
This is TURBINE, one of the forefathers of this industry, in fact, they are responsible for most "standard" features of the mmos we play and enjoy today (Hows that GUI working for you?). They were the pioneers then, and are continuing to be so now.
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"Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"No, your wrong.." - Random user #123
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
How are you?" -Me
Still if you follow closer to DDO item shop you will see that is more and more going towards traditional item malls. You have to use if you want to enjoy the game. So i fear this speculation arent that unfounded as you try to claim them to be.
EvE doors
See the best doors on EvE-on!
If The conversion does go horribly wrong, maybe it will point out that F2P isnt necessarily the best thing since sliced bread, especially for the gamers, but it would be at the terrible cost of a game good enough to stand on its own as a P2P.
F2P/P2P excellent thread.
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/282517/F2P-An-Engineers-perspective.html
People also care WAY to dam much what others are doing in an entertainment product, especially when it has zero impact on them, or there game play.
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"Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"No, your wrong.." - Random user #123
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
How are you?" -Me
The death of monster play would be a crippling blow for me. I dont care about the other reasons.
If indeed Monster play is subscriber only, I doubt i'd ever play lotro again, shallow is me, I know. and I'd even probably protest by halting my semi-regular activities on DDO.
edit: Additionally, I'd go so far as to say i'd rather see lotro die completly, they just dont seem to realise what monster play could do for the game!... If they made nothing else but monster play F2P that would be enough.
Not sure I understand your reasoning on this one. If you are playing monster play now, you are paying 15$ a month. If you want to continue to do monster play, you will simply not change anything and maintain a subscription. Why would you cancel?
you've mis-read both the article and my comment.
read: Death of monster play.
Monster play, if you didnt know is pvp, no opponents, no pvp.
I am not saying there is no reason to be concerned about a game changing its model like this. I have my own concerns, in fact, and those are some of the reasons I want to get into the beta and see how things develop through customer feedback.
However.
There is a wide difference between expressing concerns and fear-mongering. Some of the items on this list may be a bit closer to the fear-monger side of the spectrum.
"I can't help but be worried that when LotRO changes to F2P in the fall it'll bring with it some incredibly obnoxious purchasable bonus items... like flying griffon mounts or your own personal Gollum non-combat pet."
I certainly agree this would be bad. But I see zero indication of it coming to the store or to the game at all. You want to say you are worried about new types of horses or ponies in the store, fine. But griffons?
"Free Ain't Free"
I'm with you on that one. I think free-to-play is an overused term that does not really describe the model.
"Many players were holding onto the vain hope that perhaps one day Turbine would further flesh out the Monster Play option to be a more fully-featured part of the game. And perhaps they will, thereby making people subscribe in order to play as Orcs and Wargs, and this whole worry will be unfounded. But until they do, I'll remain cautiously pessimistic about the future of Monster Play."
Reasons have already been given for the limitations on Monster Play at the relaunch. And it has been stated that they will be working on ways to let more people have access to the ststem without causing any of the problems they are trying to avoid. I do understand the caution here (especially in an "I'll believe it when I see it" kind of way), but I fall on the side of cauriously optimistic that they won't let this fall by the wayside.
"we'll all soon be wandering around a Middle-earth that is far too little like the game it was at launch and far too much like FreeRealms in Tolkien's universe"
I can truthfully say I'm not even sure what you mean by this. Please expand? (Without using griffons.)
"Bye-bye Community"
Another legitimate concern, but one that has been gone over and over and over again. The current community is, in fact, starting to pull together to do what we can to preserve a certain kind of atmosphere overall for the game. There are groups volunteering to be there to help new users from the start, there are tips on how to "shut down" disruptive chat, and there are many good ideas coming out of the discussions. So yes, a concern that should be on the list. Please join with the groups lookign to do what they can about it. Thanks.
This will be a change. Probably a fairly big one. And there are things we all have to watch for, things we have to let Turbine know will not work for the good of the game or the community. But there is enough fear and misinformation out there as it is. We have no more room for wild speculation and should be working to help people understand what is happening so they can properly voice their concerns in a way that Turbine will be able to absorb. (While the image of Gollum yelling "You RUINS IT! Stupid, fat corporation!" may be amusing, the message will not get through as effectively as a civil discussion based in the available facts.
)
I don't know, LOTRO is an amazing game, and a lot of the reason for that is developers that keep adding whole new ways to play (the skirmish system, etc.). I don't think they'll suddenly stop being good developers because it went free to play.
The community, I don't think we need to worry about too much. LOTRO is inherently about player cooperativeness and not player antagonism: PvE instead of PvP as it were. I've noticed that the crowd that is immature, offensive and mean-spirited tend to all be PvP players. They like dominating other players, and tend to get angry when they are forced to worth with them, ex. running instances (this is certainly not to say that all PvP players are this way, just that the mean ones often usually can't get along with people well enough to do much PvE). Even if they try the game, I imagine they'll end up leaving fairly quickly, due to the lack of much PvP content.
Power creep is something that is very common in free to play games. Eventually the optional offerings lose their shine and developers are forced to do something to get players spend money. Personally I think that in the microtransaction model it is unavoidable given enough time.
As for people wanting to much for nothing, perhaps that is a result of developers screaming FREE FREE FREE in an effort to get players to their games. Any backlash that they receive from players wanting something for nothing is their own fault. That is what happens when companies play fast and loose with their marketing and promises.
Major problem I see with F2P type games is the buying power of gamers. Often times lot of developers tend to forget they have jobs while a large percentage of gamers are now out of work due to the recession and therefore money is tight. So going F2P might be a option but do not expect to see much activity in the cash stores. Now for turbine, if they offer turbine points for x-number of hours or days a gamer plays and these points can be redeemed for items in the cash store then it might appeal to gamers as a whole especially those whom are out of work aka laid off due to the recession.
This global recession is hurting everyone, it is going to come to a point where only those whom are rich (have lot of money to throw around) or have jobs that are going to be abled to play any online games while the rest of us who are poor or out of work are going to be out of luck.
F2P is a idea but at a wrong time to do it. Game Companies who offer F2P tends to forget that it costs money to get internet access via a Internet Service Provider. If one cannot afford a Internet Service Provider then that person does NOT have internet access and therefore cannot play any type of online games be it either F2P or P2P.
3 of the points are essentially duplicates and not worth addressing. That leaves:
Death to Monster Play
Death to the community.
In a nutshell, good and ain't happening.
Why good to death to monster play? Simple. When was the last time you heard of a PvP game have tons of PvE players whining there's not enough PvE content? Never. Ok, GA is kind of a mild exception. But by and large PvP games are left to stand on their merits as PvP games. But every dang PvE under the sun always has legions of PvP players who want to shoehorn PvP play into a primarily PvE game.
Monster play is that that shoehorn for LotRO. The normal side of the game gets by perfectly well without Monster play. It doesn't need it to survive. So let the vestigal thing die already. Those people who engage in Monster play have tons of options. No, really, go look at MMORPG's list for hundreds of other MMOs with PvP. LotRO has always been the premiere PvE game (even more so than WoW in many regards); time for it to focus solely on that just as any half-way decent PvP game focuses on it's primary purpose. (As an aside, I ain't no care bear, I just don't believe in mixing PvE with PvP. When I PvP I do so in a game designed for PvP first & foremost. I don't whine to developers to cram PvP into every freakin' title out there just to have it.)
As for the community, it too will survive. Some of the worst communities I've experienced were in P2P games. Some of the best are on F2P games. As with any sufficiently large community the loud and brazzen idiots will make their presence known. The (lack of) pay status certainly doesn't endorse or muzzle them. So this is a chicken-little issue at best.
Not just another pretty color.
Personally I think it's a good move. I tried LotR a few times and got bored with it pretty quickly. To me, it's not worth $15 a month since I barely have time for mmo's as it is. This way I can play at my own pace and buy the content I need when I'm ready to use it. They're turning a non-customer into someone they can get money from.
"it some incredibly obnoxious purchasable bonus items... like flying griffon mounts or your own personal Gollum non-combat pet. I hope I'm wrong, but depending on who's pulling the strings you never know what could show up in the item-shop."
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I think you're forgetting the IP holders. Although they're a little looser now that Christopher Tolkien is getting old, Tolkien Enterprises and Saul Zaentz are real dragons on this sort of thing. IP holders like Blizzard would sell their own mother but the Tolkiens have never been that way. One of the reasons the IP is held in such high regard.
I'm hoping that if they must do this it is at least somewhat emmersive. Maybe a shop in Bree that yougo to to buy hunting/quest licences for 'The Lone Lands' or whatever. An item shop along with all the others that are there now. It doesn't have to be done tastelessly in a way that removes RP immersion. If subscibers and lifers want to just ignore the whole commercial thing they should be able to.
I have characters on Firefoot and Landroval. I'm really beginning to consider transfering everybody over to Landroval. Much as I like RP on Firefoot ( just as deserted aqs the books say it should be) I imagine that low population servers like Firefoot, Windfola, Nimrodel will be ground zero in this Fall's 'FREEP' adventures.
I rather agree with the various comments upon PVP in LOTRO. I don't do it myself but the Ettinmoors always seemed like a bit of a joke. How long since there's been an upgrade there? The least Turbine could do is 'discover' some cave leading to a cloned Moria or something. Maybe even a F2P PVP server or something. That would solve alot of these concerns.
It would be a financial success for Turbine/Warner but of course success means sacrificing some things such as the game community.
I'm a lifetime subscriber at LoTRO because of the quality of the community in Landroval and the general aesthetics of the game itself. Sadly, I can't exactly quit to register any displeasure should this F2P venture wreak all of that. Am I a snooty elitist? Or just a guy that appreciates no shirt, no shoes, no service sanctuaries from the blithering idiots out there? At least we'll still have the P2P zones to ourselves but losing the Shire or the Pony to folks not interested enough to pay for the pleasure of enjoying Tolkien's world is a sad thing.
The worst part is it will probably succeed. And this model will keep gaining in popularity.
Or maybe it's a good thing after all. Once we roleplayers are run off the internet maybe we'll discover tabletop games again? They tend to be more creative and better designed than MMOs anyhow.
Always notice what you notice.
Now ya see here, this is what I would like to call "speculation" hehehe.
To say that a community would be ruined by F2P player is like saying World of Warcraft is full of college professors and brain surgeons.
The monster thing is probably the only legit concern I found on their. Other then that you have consider how LoTRO is made; which I'm assuming is a open world game unlike DDO which is 90% instanced. Can't really take a open world game and turn it into a instanced game over night with out wasting a ton of cash that would have just been better used to improve the subscription model. Instead of taking a risk on switching to F2P model. Either way I don't see why your complaining. Your subscribed now and most likely you'll be subscribed then along with all the other people subscribed right now and will most likely introduce even more subscribers which will then rule out your fear of monster role play.
As for your little "mature role play" server even if they game became popular by subs it would still get the WoW doomsayers. It's impossible to out run them no matter how hard you RP yourself into the woods of what ever its called lol.
Community? Really? F2P game companies don't care about community, they only care about the unwashed masses that aren't currently playing their game. I understand the mentality - why cater to the people already paying you when you could grab all of those facebook morons that'll buy virtual peas and carrots. What they don't seem to realize is that there's a big difference between state government workers that wants to waste a few hours at work with a flash game and people willing and able to download and install a 2-3GB client in order to buy virtual crap.
Money, money, money.
This is their way of making a permanent very restricted trial of the game, while giving over 2500 ways of making someone spend more than the usual $15 for a subscription, not to mention you still pay for expansions.
You might also be able to buy everything that a VIP has (in terms of overcoming the mystical gates of "pay so that I can give you quests" NPC dialogues), but without the subscription, and that will probably add up in a cost comparable to a lifetime subscription cost.
I use to love to log onto LOTRO simply because that everything was there because I paid for it. I may not have it right away but at least I could get it at some point. Now, even though I paid for the game, there are going to be some things that I won't have access to because they are items on some mt shop. That changes the equation for me. Is there reason for concern? Probably not dire concern. But, long term, probably. Once all the people start to realise that they are paying piece-meal for a game that they should have full access to then I think people playing will fall off. Free is not free.
Let's party like it is 1863!
Turbine doesn't put anything in the item shop that can't be obtained in th game thru patience and normal play. Everything there is for those who can't wait to get to the big payoff. It's one of the things that I like about DDO. You earn the points and the prizes in-game, or you can buy them early if you like.
I have no doubts that Turbine will treat LotRO with the respect that it deserves when they convert it to a F2P game.
Sorry to crush all of the fanboy love for Turbine, but LoTRo is just another failing title. They have under 100k actual subs, not several hundred thousand as they'd have you believe via their own rumor mill and board infiltrators. Everything they do fails, and unlike DDO, LOTRO required considerable server resources to maintain.
And DDO is still horrible, note the silence the last month from Turbine regarding the 'turnaround story'. People tried it out because it was free, a few people bought stuff, most are now gone again, myself included.
If F2P really was a better option than monthly subs for a 'successful' mmo, then every successful mmo would be doing it, but they are not, because it's only for failures.
I think #5 is just wrong to think might happen.
Blizzard owns the warcraft IP, they created it and can do with it as they wish.
Turbine licenses the Lord of the Rings IP, as such there is certainly lore limitations on what they can and can not add to the world. I would expect they won't be able to add any silly things like flying mounts made of stars, everything they add would have to fit into the existing world Tolkien created.
DDO says it's subscriptions doubled when it went F2P, so I don't think you have to worry about monster play dying off, if the trend holds true then it would in fact see more action.
My concern, which isn't on this list, is that too many other games will follow this model and I plan to only stick to subscriber models only.