Hero 2.0 system overview!

Falconoffury · March 2005

They are revamping the post level 50 game, and the changes look very impressive. Read about them here.

Falconoffury · March 2005

I thought the article had some really great ideas. They said there will be over 150 different perks that you can choose for your character. The chain skills for fellowships also sounded interesting. Is anyone else excited by this article?

Storm. · March 2005

no one talks here. I tried to mobilize discussion here a very long time ago and it fell flat on its face.

Falconoffury · March 2005

Well, then let's just talk to each other, Storm. What was your favorite part of the article?

Scaris · March 2005

Originally posted by Falconoffury
They are revamping the post level 50 game, and the changes look very impressive. Read about them here.

No offense, I mean I still hold a warm spot for AC 2 somewhere in me. HOWEVER, how many times can a game company revamp a game or portion of a game and not admit they don't know what they are doing? Seriously, not trying to slam but to me after your product has undergone so many revamps on this or that, doesn't that really say the company doesn't have a clue?

Palantir · March 2005

You'd have a point but name a game that hasn't had to revamp game systems.

Scaris · March 2005

Originally posted by Palantir
You'd have a point but name a game that hasn't had to revamp game systems.

Not what I said, I said had SO MANY revamps. Please don't try to slant what I said.

Falconoffury · March 2005

This is the second attempt at a hero system. There was a crafting revamp. There were some classes revamped. That is a lot, but every one of those changes have made the game better.

At least try the free trial. Fadeus, did the letter about the Hero 2.0 changes at least look interesting?

Scaris · March 2005

Originally posted by Falconoffury
This is the second attempt at a hero system. There was a crafting revamp. There were some classes revamped. That is a lot, but every one of those changes have made the game better.At least try the free trial. Fadeus, did the letter about the Hero 2.0 changes at least look interesting?

Free trial? Why would I want to do that, I own the game, I just refuse to try it anymore. I have no faith left in Turbine and I will not sit and play a graveyard of a game anymore. They have revamped the game so many times making it better yes because as it was on release was lowsy. They had no choice, so you telling me each has made it better is a redundant statement. You won't just accept what I was trying to say and admitting Turbine has flailed around with that game since conception and apparently still needs to correct design problems in it.

I have no interest what so ever to try that game a 5th time and waste another months money on it. Last time I checked revamp was a bad thing, and the only other game that I can think of that has truly used that word with any strength is SWG, and that game was obviously flawed seriously at released and suffered greatly for it.

I am not talking about patches, or updates to the game. I am talking about a problem where the original game was flawed and had to be REDONE because it didnt work well or do what it was intented to do, and just about every corner of AC 2 has gone through that since release. I bet I have atleast 4 skill resets on my charactes if I renewed right now, last I checked I had atleast 2 over a year ago and I had already used a few before that. I think we really don't have a discussion at this point if you won't admit AC 2 has its problems and Turbine apparently doesn't know what they are doing. After all, whats the active subscriptions on AC 2 now? under 10,000?

Falconoffury · March 2005

Fadeus, first you wonder why you should try the free trial. Later you say that you don't want to spend money on the game anymore. That doesn't make any sense.

Secondly, by revamping the systems that didn't work, Turbine is showing that they are admitting their mistakes and fixing them. If Turbine didn't fix the broken game systems, then you have a point, but since they are fixing their game, it is not a failed game.

As for subscription numbers, who cares? All that matters is the quality of the gameplay, which you won't even give a chance after 2 years of having quit the game. If you honestly need other people in order to enjoy a game, you have serious personal issues. There are still enough people to be able to get groups for the various high level quests, and that's enough in my opinion.

Fadeus, you are showing yourself to be close-minded and unforgiving. The world needs fewer people with a mindset like that. After 2 years off, you might be pleasantly surprised by this game. The graphics are still one of the best on the market.

Scaris · March 2005

I think there was some misunderstanding. I never asked why I should try the trial, if I did, it was not intentional or I wasn't speaking clearly.

As I said in my very first post, I don't have anything agasinst AC 2, my point simply was how many revamps can a game go through before Turbine admits they don't know what they are doing or needs help because what they are trying is not working.

That was the extent of it, I really don't wanna take it much farther then that because that would make me seem like I have some hatred for a game I don't. I just have no confidence in Turbine anymore at all.

Falconoffury · March 2005

I just have no confidence in Turbine anymore at all.

Even after reading that Hero 2.0 article? Yes, there were lots of revamps, but each revamp is making the game better and better. It sounds like they are moving in the right direction to me. It's almost like playing a new game now.

Scaris · March 2005

I didn't read the article, as I said I have no faith in them at this point. They had my money for several years with AC 1 and about half a year with AC2 and they squandered that. I do hope they are going inthe right direction now I just don't feel they are capable of handling a MMO. As I have said before, Turbine builds great engines, they just don't build good cars, they need to stick with making engines for other people's cars.

I do hope your right and I hope AC 2 turns around and becomes something big again. Game had alot of potential it just never left the runway.

Falconoffury · March 2005

I do hope your right and I hope AC 2 turns around and becomes something big again. Game had alot of potential it just never left the runway.

Personally, I like to read articles about games I don't play, or don't plan to play. I like to at least learn about what's going on out there. Turbine could have let this game die, or fix their past mistakes. I'm happy that they chose to keep it alive. Their engine optimizations in January made it less painful to play this game on a slower machine.

Storm. · March 2005

I'll post here but don't twist my words or expect to convert me with what I say.

I have played Ac2 since the very launch of the game and only for a few months here and there have I not been subscribed to it. I've played numerous MMOs as well....

First off, it's fair to say that this is the first "redo" of the hero system, because it was developed during the game. So it is fair to say they are correcting an initial implementation of a system with Hero 2.0.

From my experiences generally when numbers are used to represent skills... well... that is generally a clear mislead of representation.

"There are more than 150 perks to choose from, allowing for an unprecedented amount of character specialization. Many perks come in several levels for instance, there are six Deep Pockets perks, allowing up to 6 additional inventory slots. Some Perks, such as Jumping Mastery, are provided for flavor only, but almost all of them are useful to different types of characters."

World of Warcraft did this and well... on my warlock I use about 4 skills regularily... mabey up to 10 on occasion.... so always excercise caution around numbers.

Active skills.. we'll see how they turn out - pretty generally information there. Mabey they will be useful.. mabey they won't be.

Hero credits: Teressey... done to make loot more interesting most likely.

Hero skill changes.. focus changes..... nothing new.... we knew that was coming.. bonus dmg changes.. knew that was coming too... no big news there. Tier 3 skills.. supposed to be in a long time ago...

Combo changes.. a good rip from FFXI - hopefully they are interesting. It's obviously unknown how much it will actually effect combat.... so stay skeptical.

I guess so far I think Legions has done a poor job marketing themselves to the community. There are no videos at fileplanet..... there has been one interview that has been visible (the IGN rpg vault interview) .. but I guess they do have some ads flying around.

For coming out soon the expansion.. .basically a new release for the game... has done a bad job of getting its name out.

Basically the release is May 4th and they haven't released anything tangible on what the expansion pack will hold for players. They've only given abstract concepts.

Also, there is still no webpage for new players to get welcomed into to find out about the game. The little that there is is outdated or poorly organized. No screenshot of the day to entice new players.... I dunno - mabey I'm wrong but those seem critical to an mmo's success to me.

As for the other poster in this thread... I think you're undercrediting his time with the game.

Falconoffury · March 2005

For coming out soon the expansion.. .basically a new release for the game... has done a bad job of getting its name out.

One interview and some ads floating around is pretty standard for an expansion pack, they aren't going nuts about getting out the word, but the are doing an average job.

There are no videos at fileplanet.....

The videos are on the Turbine website, naturally.

Also, there is still no webpage for new players to get welcomed into to find out about the game. The little that there is is outdated or poorly organized.

The webpage is here. The FAQ for Legions is here, and it's only a few weeks old. The information is quite accurate.

I also think you are dismissing a lot of the new active and passive skills as no big deal, but these look like they will be much greater in variety and also more creative than the previous hero skills. You're right that the lack of specifics makes it difficult to predict, but some of the examples of skills Turbine gave sound promising.

Storm. · March 2005

Ac2 has mabey 700 players online at max. Legions is like a launch of the new game because people do not play it, many do not know what it is.

With regards to videos, people do not visit Turbine.com looking for new game information.. they go to places like gamespot, ign, and fileplanet to find videos, screenshots.. pictures of games for the initial impression. Places like Turbinegames.com get the 3rd look at after the game pages and the actual game page. That's why it is flawed to host it there. I could make something at www.sdfojidsfajodfasojds.com avalible to the public, but if no one tells them about it they sure aren't going to find it.

The ac2 legions page isn't what im referring to.. I'm referring to a page that actually takes time to explain the game in an easy to read format. at http://ac2.turbinegames.com if you search enough you will find links to the "teaching stone" which contains outdated information about asherons call 2. If you dig deeper you can find a "learn more" area (very bottom of the page) which guides you to the screenshot gallery and might tell players about some of the classes in the game. It is a very blank space though for new players.

In contrast, I can go to www.blizzard.com/wow (which doesn't exist anymore because they made such a great community page) and see the classes avalible to play. (dont give me ac2hq runaround because that isn't the official ac2 site.. people don't usually learn about places like that before the actual game site (even though it is part of the ign network). I can learn about the classes, see their skills, and know their strengths and weaknesses. I can see screenshots of individual classes and see which ones are the most enticing to me.

Ramen and the live team have taken a couple of suggestions that I made for them... but they could still do so much better.

I have reservations on commenting on individual skills so please dont expect me to.

Falconoffury · March 2005

I could make something at www.sdfojidsfajodfasojds.com avalible to the public, but if no one tells them about it they sure aren't going to find it.

If Turbine.com is the equivalent of that gibberish site, then blizzard.com and sonyonline.com must also be equivalent. Turbine.com is the home page for the company, and it is where you find most of the information about their games. It's the same for any major gaming company.

The ac2 legions page isn't what im referring to.. I'm referring to a page that actually takes time to explain the game in an easy to read format.

You want to know about Legions, the FAQ is plenty easy to navigate. You want to know about the game in general, click the "New to AC2" link right on the main page. I don't understand this "digging" of which you are speaking.

(dont give me ac2hq runaround because that isn't the official ac2 site.. people don't usually learn about places like that before the actual game site (even though it is part of the ign network)

Gamespot and IGN aren't the official sites, yet you think they should have the most information. You said the official site was the equivalent of "www.sdfojidsfajodfasojds.com". You must be confusing even yourself.

Storm. · March 2005

I'm done discussing with you. You've warped my words and I don't appreciate it.

Unknown · March 2005

I still have the game and Q asked me to play again when Legions come out so probably I'll give another shot at the game with a Drudge

Still Hero 2.0 didn't look that appealing to me, yes they are fixing stuff and trying to put some sense into all that hero grinding, but from what I read, hero stuff (passive) give a small boost to certain aspects of the game, by putting hero credits into it....not very appealing to me, missing something to make me grind 5 levels for stuff that will only boost a little...not my taste, missing good stuff to make it feel rewarding.

I played this game for 1.5years, and I've been a year helping the devs on the testing team (that tests content and improvements every month) on that time I played.

They have a good crew but the player base was slaughtered many times during all that time, too many nerfing and balancing, it eventually burned me out as some things make no sense, some classes will always be better than others at a certain time, for example, I was Feral since start, I was a damage dealer, then changed to a "druid" where I had to opt for one of 3 paths, "DD", "Tank", "Fast Hunter", and some time later into a Tank only, losing a pet in the way, and being nerfed several times after that because the Feral has a triple attack and a hero skill that adds to damage, and we can't have that.

Ac2 was my first MMORPG, I still have a family there, it's a good game (better than WoW IMO) but the devs should stick to put content into the game, items and special skills, letting the players be a little godly at hero levels, instead of toning everyone down ever 3months to keep you hunting like you did 2 years ago.

Unknown · March 2005

Falconoffurry, I'm sure you know that Ac2 always lacked publicity, storm is right when he says it's missing something to make Ac2 player base go up, I know this, you know this and the devs know this, that's why turbine joint efforts with Sony for Legion distribution and advertising, something that Microcrap never did while they owned Ac2.

IMO the only way Legions will get Ac2 back on it's feet, is putting the games on the shelves, where you can buy it cuz you looked at it at a shop.

Yes the game is missing a good article explaining how much better the game is, taking in consideration the Hero upgrade and Legions, but also all those content that was brought into the game by the montly patches, and obviously this article had to be linked from the Game Review sites, cuz that's where me and so many more browse when they are considering playing a new game

Ease down falco, you're pushing away everyone from this board you're looking like an Ac2 guard dog, like I was so many time when I played, and I must say that's not very healthy.

Falconoffury · March 2005

I'm a guard dog of logic, and that storm guy was contradicting his own arguments. That letter about Hero 2.0 does leave a lot to the imagination, but it shows that the new Hero system will be much more complex, and players will have more options to customize their heros.

It's good that sony will handle the marketing and distribution of the game. Microsoft did a terrible job at marketing. Microsoft had no lasting advertisements. They did some advertisements a month before the game, and a few months after, but then it just stopped. They just stopped distributing game boxes to stores. If you want to succeed at an mmorpg, you have to be always advertising and always distributing the game. Now with Turbine, at the reigns, we'll see. I don't think the advertising campaign has reached climax yet because the game is still over a month away, but it just sounds promising.

Scaris · March 2005

Turbine usually has a problem with news and PR in the sense of not getting news out on the game. The most advertising I have ever seen them do is the adds here. I have revisited their site a few times wanting to read up on what new has been put into the game. I usually find VERY little and I hate having to find out by digging through forum thread after forum thread in the ac2 community site.

They really need to hire a few good people who's sole job is game promotion.

Falconoffury · March 2005

They have some print ads in gaming magazines, but I expect to start seeing more banners ads closer to the release date.

Storm. · March 2005

"Places like Turbinegames.com get the 3rd look at after the game pages and the actual game page."

Don't know how I'm contradicting myself. The only place I could have made myself any clearer was that it doesn't make sense for Turbine to host their videos [only there and not anywhere else besides there]. Like the others all agree with me.. Turbine is bad at getting their games out to the public.

Ign/Gamespot/magazine... http://ac2.turbinegames.com.... turbinegames.com....fansite

Ign/Gamespot/magazine www.worldofwarcraft.com... www.blizzard.com.... fansite

ign/gamespot/magazine www.gamename.com www.asdfasdfasdfasdfasdfieeieie.com .... fansite

great to see banner ads... BUY AC2 FOR LOW PRICE OF 9.99 - nothing sounds more desperate than that.

I'm really done responding to you now.. I just dont like being told I'm contradicting myself when I am not.

Temid · March 2005

Turbine hired Jonathan Hanna (aka, Calandryll) as Director of Community Relations. I dont know anything about him, but response from some oldtime gamers to this news was good. If i understood correctly he played his part at UO and also was there at UXO project.

9.99 price doesnt seem desperate to me, it seems like a logical step to make when u know u will put x-pack box on shelves in 2 months and want to sell that last batch of original game boxes. If im not mistaken expected price for x-pack is around 30 bugs.

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Hero 2.0 system overview!

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