Originally posted by SuperXero89 Despite what the fanboys will tell you, RPG video games have nothing to do with roleplaying your character in a sense one pretends to be a part of the gameworld but rather in the freedom of choice as to how to approach various situations and the ability to control your character's growth in terms of stats, armor, and appearance. Many of the forerunners to the modern day MMORPG were fairly condusive to roleplaying as UO has some great RP capabilities and a somewhat strong RP following if you know where to look. In its day, RPing was somewhat common in EQ, and even SWG gave the player plenty of options to feel as if he or she had a place in the game world. These days, with MMORPGs becoming nothing more than an e-peen swinging, level increase dog and pony show that they are today, most MMOs simply aren't condusive to roleplay as there's simply very little in the way of making the player feel as if he or she belongs to the world outside perhaps player housing.
. Completely false. . All you need to RP is two like minded people and a means to communicate. Matter of fact, the more RP stuff a game offers, lore etc, the harder it is to RP. . WoW has the best RP going today. On Moon Guard and Wyrmrest Accord servers. . People /walk around town. There are many conversations in /say to eavesdrop on. A player ran pub is always open. . What makes these true RP communities is that you will find yourself in a community of hundreds of RP'ers. RP will be the norm, not just a label on a server.
Despite what the fanboys will tell you, RPG video games have nothing to do with roleplaying your character in a sense one pretends to be a part of the gameworld but rather in the freedom of choice as to how to approach various situations and the ability to control your character's growth in terms of stats, armor, and appearance. Many of the forerunners to the modern day MMORPG were fairly condusive to roleplaying as UO has some great RP capabilities and a somewhat strong RP following if you know where to look. In its day, RPing was somewhat common in EQ, and even SWG gave the player plenty of options to feel as if he or she had a place in the game world. These days, with MMORPGs becoming nothing more than an e-peen swinging, level increase dog and pony show that they are today, most MMOs simply aren't condusive to roleplay as there's simply very little in the way of making the player feel as if he or she belongs to the world outside perhaps player housing.
These days, roleplaying is best left up to indy MMORPGs, MUDs, and my personal favorite, persistant worlds from either of the NWN games.
LOL
I paraphrase/interprelate/guess what you are droning about : "despite what the people who role play will tell you, I say it is all bunk." nice.
you are the prime example of what Mark Twain was talking about, removing all doubt.
I will confess, I hate RP, Rpers honestly creep me out, seriously. I skip through cinematics and HATE it when they try and force me to participate in the game story at all. I do not even enjoy PVE, I could care less about AI, it bores me to tears.
I do not care about storyline, and would rather play an MMO where the players create the story by their actions. I would rather have games that had NO NPC's No Story to participate in other than one created by the players. Where all items are created by the players, where the cities themselves are built by players. But I know that is not something that is going to come anytime soon.
* keeps dreaming* In the meantime, I play what I can get.
I will confess, I hate RP, Rpers honestly creep me out, seriously. I skip through cinematics and HATE it when they try and force me to participate in the game story at all.
I do not care about storyline, and would rather play an MMO where the players create the story by their actions. I would rather have games that had NO NPC's No Story to participate in other than one created by the players. Where all items are created by the players, where the cities themselves are built by players. But I know that is not something that is going to come anytime soon.
* keeps dreaming* In the meantime, I play what I can get.
Face of Mankind does exactly that, but then again, it also lacks a metric ton of incentives to *keep playing*.
I recommend you try it out so you can edit what it is you actually look for in a game, because when you actually get it, you may realise it was based on wishful thinking.
Anyone else saying they are tired of leveling progression should try it too, my point reaches out to them as well.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4 Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
I will confess, I hate RP, Rpers honestly creep me out, seriously. I skip through cinematics and HATE it when they try and force me to participate in the game story at all.
I do not care about storyline, and would rather play an MMO where the players create the story by their actions. I would rather have games that had NO NPC's No Story to participate in other than one created by the players. Where all items are created by the players, where the cities themselves are built by players. But I know that is not something that is going to come anytime soon.
* keeps dreaming* In the meantime, I play what I can get.
Face of Mankind does exactly that, but then again, it also lacks a metric ton of incentives to *keep playing*.
I recommend you try it out so you can edit what it is you actually look for in a game, because when you actually get it, you may realise it was based on wishful thinking.
Player incentives are important as well. I know what it is I enjoy, I would like a game where your actions are the story. When you go read books in the in game library, they are about the players. The statues in towns are of actual players based on their actions in game, the wanted posters on the walls are that of players who actually have bounties on their heads for their misdeeds, where the game has an in game court system where players are the jury and determine what happens to other players for discipline.
Where every item is craftable, tradable, socketable, dropable, and salvageable. High customization, and viscious PVP.
I prefer games where there is more emphasis placed on player skill, and not on just gear. Where you never know what someone else is capable of in battle until you fight them and where the crafting actually is based on creativity, not just mindless repetition.
All you need to RP is two like minded people and a means to communicate. Matter of fact, the more RP stuff a game offers, lore etc, the harder it is to RP.
.
WoW has the best RP going today. On Moon Guard and Wyrmrest Accord servers.
.
People /walk around town. There are many conversations in /say to eavesdrop on. A player ran pub is always open.
.
What makes these true RP communities is that you will find yourself in a community of hundreds of RP'ers. RP will be the norm, not just a label on a server.
Actually, RPing is down so he at least have a point. It does however exist in almost any MMO, but it is comparibly few RPers in a community.
UOs system did have many things that promoted RPing. The modern MMOs are more promoting greed for gear and grinding but that doesn't mean no one is RPing. But it do mean that modern MMOs could give the RPers more tools than the emotes.
I personally think that EQ2 and LOTRO have a higher percentage of RPers than Wow, stuff like EQ2s guildhouses and real player owned stores promotes RP somewhat. But it is almost impossible to tell, a lot of the RP is done in private session, in grouping or in a guild and most players see very little of that.
There are many things the devs could do to promote RP. One of the easy things would be to have an inn that have small minigames, like dice playing, drinking contests and other ways to spend time together without just killing stuff.
Gear is fairly static and it's an FPS-type game. Thing is that it gets really boring when the initial mystique of it all wears off, and you start questioning why you even play.
It's still one of the better PvP game's I've played in the last few years though, I spent 16 hours straight on New Years defending planets from the scumbag cop faction. Had a blast, but when war isn't going on you pretty much stand around and craft - which gets boring immediately. The game lacks a lot of things to do, and simply because it eschews NPC-based content, levels and other things people swear games can do without.
Well, they can, but it ain't pretty without a legit substitution. (try it)
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4 Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
Gear is fairly static and it's an FPS-type game. Thing is that it gets really boring when the initial mystique of it all wears off, and you start questioning why you even play.
It's still one of the better PvP game's I've played in the last few years though, I spent 16 hours straight on New Years defending planets from the scumbag cop faction. Had a blast, but when war isn't going on you pretty much stand around and craft - which gets boring immediately. The game lacks a lot of things to do, and simply because it eschews NPC-based content, levels and other things people swear games can do without.
Well, they can, but it ain't pretty without a legit substitution. (try it)
Just by looking at the VERY limited Face of mankind game, I can tell I would not be interested in it. 1. it is a crime fighting game- bleh. 2. I would rather have more creativity, less realism as far as creativity goes. I prefer fantasy because anything can happen in a fantasy game wheras in a real life simulator game, you are limited to real weapons/ armor/ ability. I can play reality FPS anywhere, and not be "commited to it", like a MMORPG.
Real life simulators are too restrictive in what can actually happen. I don;t play games to play in the " real world" I play them so I can do things that are not possible in the real world.
It appears to be more of a real life simulator.. and I really get bored with "reality simulators" fast. I can see why there is no incentive to play it. LOL
Gear is fairly static and it's an FPS-type game. Thing is that it gets really boring when the initial mystique of it all wears off, and you start questioning why you even play.
It's still one of the better PvP game's I've played in the last few years though, I spent 16 hours straight on New Years defending planets from the scumbag cop faction. Had a blast, but when war isn't going on you pretty much stand around and craft - which gets boring immediately. The game lacks a lot of things to do, and simply because it eschews NPC-based content, levels and other things people swear games can do without.
Well, they can, but it ain't pretty without a legit substitution. (try it)
Just by looking at the VERY limited Face of mankind game, I can tell I would not be interested in it. 1. it is a crime fighting game- bleh. 2. I would rather have more creativity, less realism as far as creativity goes. I prefer fantasy because anything can happen in a fantasy game wheras in a real life simulator game, you are limited to real weapons/ armor/ ability. I can play reality FPS anywhere, and not be "commited to it", like a MMORPG.
Real life simulators are too restrictive in what can actually happen. I don;t play games to play in the " real world" I play them so I can do things that are not possible in the real world.
It appears to be more of a real life simulator.. and I really get bored with "reality simulators" fast. I can see why there is no incentive to play it. LOL
It's deffo not a "crime-fighting game", there is just a police-based faction, and that is just one of the 8 therein.
there's also the military, drug czars, political mediators, mercenaries and 3 kinds of corporations.
Life simulator is going way too far with it too, its more like an FFA FPS game with politics. I recommend you do research on your own before reading into things the wrong way such as this.
Still though, yes, you would probably come to the same conclusions we both state here. I would just rather it happen through cause and effect, rather than guesstimation. It's assumptions that leads to the ideas that people would rather have no NPCs or leveling, and then it gets used to rationalize not taking a step into trying it.
It's worth a try in the very least, just so you *know* how you would feel about it.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4 Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
It is dangerous, difficult, and not efficient to play a role in many MMORPGs. Maybe in certain FPS it is possible, e.g. a tank commander, driver, gunner. But these roles are also functional.
The poll asked why I selected "gameplay" over story. I'm not quite sure why anybody would pick story to be perfectly honest. The stories in the vast majority of games might be slightly entertaining, but they are meaningless. You and thousands of others have all participated in various aspects of the story without it making an iota of difference to the world. If I wanted to be a passenger for a good story, I would pick up a good book or a not too bad movie. If I want to play a part in a player driven story, oddly enough - MMORPGs are not the place to do it - least not in a themepark. Sandbox games offer that over themeparks, your part in the story actually matters.
So it kind of defaults to gameplay over story...
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Gear is fairly static and it's an FPS-type game. Thing is that it gets really boring when the initial mystique of it all wears off, and you start questioning why you even play.
It's still one of the better PvP game's I've played in the last few years though, I spent 16 hours straight on New Years defending planets from the scumbag cop faction. Had a blast, but when war isn't going on you pretty much stand around and craft - which gets boring immediately. The game lacks a lot of things to do, and simply because it eschews NPC-based content, levels and other things people swear games can do without.
Well, they can, but it ain't pretty without a legit substitution. (try it)
Just by looking at the VERY limited Face of mankind game, I can tell I would not be interested in it. 1. it is a crime fighting game- bleh. 2. I would rather have more creativity, less realism as far as creativity goes. I prefer fantasy because anything can happen in a fantasy game wheras in a real life simulator game, you are limited to real weapons/ armor/ ability. I can play reality FPS anywhere, and not be "commited to it", like a MMORPG.
Real life simulators are too restrictive in what can actually happen. I don;t play games to play in the " real world" I play them so I can do things that are not possible in the real world.
It appears to be more of a real life simulator.. and I really get bored with "reality simulators" fast. I can see why there is no incentive to play it. LOL
It's deffo not a "crime-fighting game", there is just a police-based faction, and that is just one of the 8 therein.
there's also the military, drug czars, political mediators, mercenaries and 3 kinds of corporations.
Life simulator is going way too far with it too, its more like an FFA FPS game with politics. I recommend you do research on your own before reading into things the wrong way such as this.
Still though, yes, you would probably come to the same conclusions we both state here. I would just rather it happen through cause and effect, rather than guesstimation. It's assumptions that leads to the ideas that people would rather have no NPCs or leveling, and then it gets used to rationalize not taking a step into trying it.
It's worth a try in the very least, just so you *know* how you would feel about it.
I could play it for some kicks, but I can tell I am not going to like the setting already. It appears to me to be reality simulator, and if I wanted to do all that I could just move across the Border. ( Juarez has all that for real and MORE.)
1. Do you have to choose a faction from the start of the game?
2. Can you switch faction at will?
3.can I kill anyone from my own faction if they annoy me?
4. Are there penalties for killing people?
5. Are all items in game player craftable, tradable, dropable, and salvagable?
6. Do they actually incorporate players actions into the game itself?
Having a game that you just do not have to interact with NPC's isn;t much on gameplay unless you actually incorporate the player into the game world itself. Say - it keeps track of your actions and makes in game changes due to those actions.
You also need to have a " need" for crafting, merchanting, gathering, salvaging otheriwse it is pointless.
I could play it for some kicks, but I can tell I am not going to like the setting already. It appears to me to be reality simulator, and if I wanted to do all that I could just move across the Border. ( Juarez has all that for real and MORE.)
lol
1. Do you have to choose a faction from the start of the game?
yep
2. Can you switch faction at will?
Only if you are a paid subscriber, which gives you access to an apartment that allows this. Otherwise you need to kill off your character to the point where you lack the money to be cloned, which will kill off the char and let you reroll it. Same name can be used.
3.can I kill anyone from my own faction if they annoy me?
Yes, but if they bitch hard enough you might get kicked from the faction or just get stern talking to. If he really had it coming, there won't be any questioning it.
4. Are their penalties for killing people?
Yep, and you work them off by getting sent to DeMorgan's Castle, which is a jail. There are missions to help remove them, like "finding the soap", which has you walk around while crouched for X minutes. You could jsut afk for a while if they are low enough. I've done lots of killing in wars and got maybe 600 points at the max, which is like 10-15 minutes in jail. Some people have so many that jail is not an option, or they rolled over into the range of points that starts causing adverse effects like the inability to clone, or instant permadeath on the next kill.
5. Are all items in game player craftable, tradable, dropable, and salvagable?
All items are craftable, nothing but what is in the inventory (not equipped) is droppable, nothing can be salvaged. Things just wear down and require replacement.
6. Do they actually incorporate players actions into the game itself?
Zuh? Well, there are faction ranks and the higher you are, the more clearance you get for various duties like handing out missions and other stuff. I never got past rank one (a limit of being a free player), so I don't know how it works personally. There is also a lot of favoritism, so if the faction leader doesn't like you, you're gonna get nowhere.
Having a game that you just do not have to interact with NPC's isn;t much on gameplay unless you actually incorporate the player into the game world itself. Say - it keeps track of your actions and makes in game changes due to those actions.
You also need to have a " need" for crafting, merchanting, gathering, salvaging otheriwse it is pointless.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4 Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
I could play it for some kicks, but I can tell I am not going to like the setting already. It appears to me to be reality simulator, and if I wanted to do all that I could just move across the Border. ( Juarez has all that for real and MORE.)
lol
1. Do you have to choose a faction from the start of the game?
yep
I hate Faction. That is a downer. For it to be truly completly player run, you could do as you please, create your own faction and not have the game create the faction for you. I miss that.. players do that on their own, no need for the game to. I have my own friends I like to play with, and we kill everyone else regardless of faction.
3.can I kill anyone from my own faction if they annoy me?
Yes, but if they bitch hard enough you might get kicked from the faction or just get stern talking to. If he really had it coming, there won't be any questioning it.
I hate being pre grouped.. If someone doesn;t shut up when I tell them to I kill them. LOL
4. Are their penalties for killing people?
Yep, and you work them off by getting sent to DeMorgan's Castle, which is a jail. There are missions to help remove them, like "finding the soap", which has you walk around while crouched for X minutes. You could jsut afk for a while if they are low enough. I've done lots of killing in wars and got maybe 600 points at the max, which is like 10-15 minutes in jail. Some people have so many that jail is not an option, or they rolled over into the range of points that starts causing adverse effects like the inability to clone, or instant permadeath on the next kill.
What is the point in that? If all you do in game is kill everyone why would you be penalized for it? That right there would be a game breaker. So like the point of the game for me would be kill until permadeath? - THE END.
Whatever happened to losing your loot? LOL I don;t mind losing loot, but if I am going to be permadeathsed no point in starting. The point in playing a MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER game is to kill MASSIVELY.
I could play it for some kicks, but I can tell I am not going to like the setting already. It appears to me to be reality simulator, and if I wanted to do all that I could just move across the Border. ( Juarez has all that for real and MORE.)
lol
1. Do you have to choose a faction from the start of the game?
yep
I hate Faction. That is a downer. For it to be truly completly player run, you could do as you please, create your own faction and not have the game create the faction for you. I miss that.. players do that on their own, no need for the game to. I have my own friends I like to play with, and we kill everyone else regardless of faction.
You're kind of bringing up things that have never been done before here, so again, it's just wishful thinking. You're going to have to make that game yourself.
3.can I kill anyone from my own faction if they annoy me?
Yes, but if they bitch hard enough you might get kicked from the faction or just get stern talking to. If he really had it coming, there won't be any questioning it.
I hate being pre grouped.. If someone doesn;t shut up when I tell them to I kill them. LOL
4. Are their penalties for killing people?
Yep, and you work them off by getting sent to DeMorgan's Castle, which is a jail. There are missions to help remove them, like "finding the soap", which has you walk around while crouched for X minutes. You could jsut afk for a while if they are low enough. I've done lots of killing in wars and got maybe 600 points at the max, which is like 10-15 minutes in jail. Some people have so many that jail is not an option, or they rolled over into the range of points that starts causing adverse effects like the inability to clone, or instant permadeath on the next kill.
What is the point in that? If all you do in game is kill everyone why would you be penalized for it? That right there would be a game breaker. So like the point of the game for me would be kill until permadeath? - THE END.
Whatever happened to losing your loot? LOL I don;t mind losing loot, but if I am going to be permadeathsed no point in starting. The point in playing a MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER game is to kill MASSIVELY.
I think you fail to understand just how many kills it's going to take to get the major penalties I am talking about. Last I checked there was less than a dozen people on the bounty list that were eligible for any of it. They are proficient asshats, and professional come-uppers.
Like I said, I killed tons of people during a war declaration and got about 2% of the neccesary penalty points needed to get any of the negatives I mentioned. Again, assumptions like this are baaad. If anything about the game is actually game-breaking, it's not the jail aspect whatsoever. A lot of people turn themselves in just to clear their points early on, and jail can be quite fun if you get a knife smuggled in, or take part in a jailbreak. Plus, harrassing the guards is hillarious.
Really, you need to jsut try it before claiming you know all about how it works, and whether you'd hate it or not. Because as is, it does most of the things you are looking for in a game, but you're making rationalizations to not even give it a go. It's free to play and download, so there is nothing to lose. Remove it from the HD when you make up your mind to stop playing.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4 Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
I could play it for some kicks, but I can tell I am not going to like the setting already. It appears to me to be reality simulator, and if I wanted to do all that I could just move across the Border. ( Juarez has all that for real and MORE.)
lol
1. Do you have to choose a faction from the start of the game?
yep
I hate Faction. That is a downer. For it to be truly completly player run, you could do as you please, create your own faction and not have the game create the faction for you. I miss that.. players do that on their own, no need for the game to. I have my own friends I like to play with, and we kill everyone else regardless of faction.
You're kind of bringing up things that have never been done before here, so again, it's just wishful thinking. You're going to have to make that game yourself.
~Factionless games aren't new.. LOL! I prefer factionless games, the whole idea that the game has to tell you who to kill is newer than our old worlds of " do as you please". I find the linear style of new games terribly restrictive and a major turn off.
4. Are their penalties for killing people?
Yep, and you work them off by getting sent to DeMorgan's Castle, which is a jail. There are missions to help remove them, like "finding the soap", which has you walk around while crouched for X minutes. You could jsut afk for a while if they are low enough. I've done lots of killing in wars and got maybe 600 points at the max, which is like 10-15 minutes in jail. Some people have so many that jail is not an option, or they rolled over into the range of points that starts causing adverse effects like the inability to clone, or instant permadeath on the next kill.
What is the point in that? If all you do in game is kill everyone why would you be penalized for it? That right there would be a game breaker. So like the point of the game for me would be kill until permadeath? - THE END.
Whatever happened to losing your loot? LOL I don;t mind losing loot, but if I am going to be permadeathsed no point in starting. The point in playing a MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER game is to kill MASSIVELY.
I think you fail to understand just how many kills it's going to take to get the major penalties I am talking about. Last I checked there was less than a dozen people on the bounty list that were eligible for any of it. They are proficient asshats, and professional come-uppers.
Like I said, I killed tons of people during a war declaration and got about 2% of the neccesary penalty points needed to get any of the negatives I mentioned. Again, assumptions like this are baaad. If anything about the game is actually game-breaking, it's not the jail aspect whatsoever. A lot of people turn themselves in just to clear their points early on, and jail can be quite fun if you get a knife smuggled in, or take part in a jailbreak. Plus, harrassing the guards is hillarious.
Really, you need to jsut try it before claiming you know all about how it works, and whether you'd hate it or not. Because as is, it does most of the things you are looking for in a game, but you're making rationalizations to not even give it a go. It's free to play and download, so there is nothing to lose. Remove it from the HD when you make up your mind to stop playing.
I think it has to do more with how I play. I have many friends that play games with me. When Someone finds a game to play .. we ALL go there. My guild was formed on campus at University of Texas in Austin, and is still actively growing with Alumni and new recruits. Perma death is an issue, because I play the game with real friends, and we DO kill ALL the time. You talk about killing in a war, but what if all you do is war with everyone else in game and nothing else? The guild consists of members who perform different functions within the guild. We have members that only gain supplies for the rest of us, we have members who do all the selling for the guild, and we have members that only kill . We share the in game money pool, and work more like a massive machine rather than the " average player".
We don;t want to have to wait on someone to get out of jail, or to create a new character just to continue to fight. We die- lose the best loot -have a friend re-gear us and are back on the battlefield in seconds. Being a war leader permadeath is a concern.
I will give it a shot, but I am seriously doubting it would be a game I would bring the guild into based on what I have read about it thus far.
Despite what the fanboys will tell you, RPG video games have nothing to do with roleplaying your character in a sense one pretends to be a part of the gameworld but rather in the freedom of choice as to how to approach various situations and the ability to control your character's growth in terms of stats, armor, and appearance. Many of the forerunners to the modern day MMORPG were fairly condusive to roleplaying as UO has some great RP capabilities and a somewhat strong RP following if you know where to look. In its day, RPing was somewhat common in EQ, and even SWG gave the player plenty of options to feel as if he or she had a place in the game world. These days, with MMORPGs becoming nothing more than an e-peen swinging, level increase dog and pony show that they are today, most MMOs simply aren't condusive to roleplay as there's simply very little in the way of making the player feel as if he or she belongs to the world outside perhaps player housing.
These days, roleplaying is best left up to indy MMORPGs, MUDs, and my personal favorite, persistant worlds from either of the NWN games.
LOL
I paraphrase/interprelate/guess what you are droning about : "despite what the people who role play will tell you, I say it is all bunk." nice.
you are the prime example of what Mark Twain was talking about, removing all doubt.
Um no...I'm actually saying that modern MMORPGs are no longer developed with any sort of roleplaying in mind and that you can find much better roleplay in older MMORPGs, indy games, and NWN persistant world servers. I'm not sure why you got so defensive there.
Secondly, because I don't know how to quote two different people:
-----------------
-----------------
Originally posted by uquipu
.
Completely false.
.
All you need to RP is two like minded people and a means to communicate. Matter of fact, the more RP stuff a game offers, lore etc, the harder it is to RP.
.
WoW has the best RP going today. On Moon Guard and Wyrmrest Accord servers.
.
People /walk around town. There are many conversations in /say to eavesdrop on. A player ran pub is always open.
.
What makes these true RP communities is that you will find yourself in a community of hundreds of RP'ers. RP will be the norm, not just a label on a server.
--------------------
--------------------
If 11 million people play World of Warcraft on 40 something different servers, yet only two of them have active roleplay populations, World of Warcraft is not condusive to roleplay. To understand what I'm saying, I think I need to educate you on the definition of "condusive." Condusive does not mean that World of Warcraft does not have roleplaers. Condusive does not mean that anyone can't roleplay any time they want. No, the dictionary defintion of condusive states, "tending to promote or assist." For you, that means that modern MMORPGs do nothing to actively promote roleplaying on their servers besides throwing up a "roleplaying prefered" tag on a server. This, of course, is compared to many indy MMORPs and whatnot that have specific mechanics that not only encourage role play but also make roleplaying more fun with features such as housing systems, town creation, and player create books just to name a few. Persistant worlds in NWN usually have small communities per server with admins who are very passionate about roleplaying, which means, in some cases, the entire server is designed around the purpose of roleplaying.
Sure, you can roleplay in World of Warcraft, LoTRO, WAR, EQ2, and the like, but those games simply do not give players any tools or encouragement to roleplay, and as such, roleplay is relegated to tavern sessions and random chats. If that's ok with you, it's ok with me, but there are other options out there that are much more "condusive" to roleplaying.
My friends role-play among ourselves. Each toon has a distinct individual personality and interacts with the others accordingly. We seldom break character except when grouped with outsiders (who wouldn't get our gameplay).
Its great fun, much like improvisation theater.
Ken Fisher - Semi retired old fart Network Administrator, now working in Network Security. I don't Forum PVP. If you feel I've attacked you, it was probably by accident. When I don't understand, I ask. Such is not intended as criticism.
I will give it a shot, but I am seriously doubting it would be a game I would bring the guild into based on what I have read about it thus far.
That's all I ask. I'm damn sure it won't occupy your time indefinitely, but the game itself is one hell of an experiment that many players need to see for themselves, just so they would know if such gameplay aesthetics such as a lack of NPCs or levels actually suits them or not.
I've been avoiding Vanguard because I *know* I won't stick with it, but even I feel like a bit of an ass for not trying it out. I may have to now that this makes me a bit of a hypocrite.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4 Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
Well, when I'm playing WoW... I role play within my mind.. not necessarily in speaking, but when I'm playing my character, I tend to kinda make up an "attitude" for each character I play depending on the look I finally decide on. This loosely translates to when I do speak in groups, it's always with proper grammer, and politeness, not necesarily role playing.
But I do believe that when I do play SW:TOR, because of how in depth the characters are going to be, npc's and pc's alike, I really think that's going to make me connect with my character even more, and even maybe lean toward being more in character while in groups. While playing through Mass Effect 1 and 2, I became VERY attached to my Shepard, so I can only imagine how connected I'll get with my character in this game.
But I do believe that when I do play SW:TOR, because of how in depth the characters are going to be, npc's and pc's alike, I really think that's going to make me connect with my character even more, and even maybe lean toward being more in character while in groups. While playing through Mass Effect 1 and 2, I became VERY attached to my Shepard, so I can only imagine how connected I'll get with my character in this game.
Player-Character voiceovers = acting.
Good acting can make you buy into anything, and it makes me wonder why the "silent protagonist" has been done so many times (besides being the easier route). The only thing is that it doesn't equate to RP, it in fact makes your character autonomous, and it's less about *your* decisions, and far more about *theirs*. All in all a good route to go though.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4 Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
The majority, the vast vast majority of WoW's player base does not roleplay. There are a great many of them that don't even know what the MMORPG industry is. You find the most RPers on older MMOs, or "hardcore" ones.
.
I saw a survey once that said only 5% of all MMO players roleplay.
It's becoming less and less frequent as the years go on, and the games stop appealing to the core RPG players and virtual world socializers, and appeal more and more to the casual 11 year old play for 10 minutes in an arcade game with elves type crowd.
Old Ultima Online was rife with Roleplay, as was EverQuest
What Everquest 1 game were you playing?
There was ONE....repeat ONE roleplay server. Items werent tagged "no-trade" on it either(dont remember if epics were), in an attempt to bolster popularity. Brad luved the roleplay server....the majority of his customers didnt.
The stereotypes are beyond old....it isnt just kids that cant stand RP. RP is more popular among those who used to play PnP games. Age has nothing to do with it.
I was on Mith Marr server and there were role play guilds on the server.
Just because there is a designated rp server does not mean that is the only place it happens.
But I do believe that when I do play SW:TOR, because of how in depth the characters are going to be, npc's and pc's alike, I really think that's going to make me connect with my character even more, and even maybe lean toward being more in character while in groups. While playing through Mass Effect 1 and 2, I became VERY attached to my Shepard, so I can only imagine how connected I'll get with my character in this game.
Player-Character voiceovers = acting.
Good acting can make you buy into anything, and it makes me wonder why the "silent protagonist" has been done so many times (besides being the easier route). The only thing is that it doesn't equate to RP, it in fact makes your character autonomous, and it's less about *your* decisions, and far more about *theirs*. All in all a good route to go though.
Either way. When the voices are done well enough it draws me into my character alot; it gets me more interested in the outcomes of the conversations and the choices I've made, and with that being said, it'll probably get me more into my role in a group and make it more enjoyable and I'll be in character more.
i wish it were roleplaying first, but one of my all time favorite games was final fantasy tactics(true not a mmo,but it is an rpg) it that game the game play was fantastic building your team in a certain way getting that new ability, but the story of your guys obsession for another guy is really lame they had some nice back stabbing but then thats all it became back stab delta back stab delta, but that game play made me go back and back for hours. just my 2 cents. hugs
Still feel that it comes down to do you want to be a "driver" or a "passenger"... while some single player RPG games offer the "driver" role, many are still just a case of being a "passenger". Themepark MMORPGs, you are a "passenger"... and that is simply too passive, I would rather buy a book, watch TV, see a movie, etc. PnP was interactive - yes, there might be a "story" - but stories normally do not survive contact long with players. You lose that in MMORPGs... simple mechanics prevent you from doing anything real...er...fake, but real, arggh - you know what I mean.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Comments
Completely false.
.
All you need to RP is two like minded people and a means to communicate. Matter of fact, the more RP stuff a game offers, lore etc, the harder it is to RP.
.
WoW has the best RP going today. On Moon Guard and Wyrmrest Accord servers.
.
People /walk around town. There are many conversations in /say to eavesdrop on. A player ran pub is always open.
.
What makes these true RP communities is that you will find yourself in a community of hundreds of RP'ers. RP will be the norm, not just a label on a server.
Well shave my back and call me an elf! -- Oghren
LOL
I paraphrase/interprelate/guess what you are droning about : "despite what the people who role play will tell you, I say it is all bunk." nice.
you are the prime example of what Mark Twain was talking about, removing all doubt.
I will confess, I hate RP, Rpers honestly creep me out, seriously. I skip through cinematics and HATE it when they try and force me to participate in the game story at all. I do not even enjoy PVE, I could care less about AI, it bores me to tears.
I do not care about storyline, and would rather play an MMO where the players create the story by their actions. I would rather have games that had NO NPC's No Story to participate in other than one created by the players. Where all items are created by the players, where the cities themselves are built by players. But I know that is not something that is going to come anytime soon.
* keeps dreaming* In the meantime, I play what I can get.
Face of Mankind does exactly that, but then again, it also lacks a metric ton of incentives to *keep playing*.
I recommend you try it out so you can edit what it is you actually look for in a game, because when you actually get it, you may realise it was based on wishful thinking.
Anyone else saying they are tired of leveling progression should try it too, my point reaches out to them as well.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
Player incentives are important as well. I know what it is I enjoy, I would like a game where your actions are the story. When you go read books in the in game library, they are about the players. The statues in towns are of actual players based on their actions in game, the wanted posters on the walls are that of players who actually have bounties on their heads for their misdeeds, where the game has an in game court system where players are the jury and determine what happens to other players for discipline.
Where every item is craftable, tradable, socketable, dropable, and salvageable. High customization, and viscious PVP.
I prefer games where there is more emphasis placed on player skill, and not on just gear. Where you never know what someone else is capable of in battle until you fight them and where the crafting actually is based on creativity, not just mindless repetition.
Actually, RPing is down so he at least have a point. It does however exist in almost any MMO, but it is comparibly few RPers in a community.
UOs system did have many things that promoted RPing. The modern MMOs are more promoting greed for gear and grinding but that doesn't mean no one is RPing. But it do mean that modern MMOs could give the RPers more tools than the emotes.
I personally think that EQ2 and LOTRO have a higher percentage of RPers than Wow, stuff like EQ2s guildhouses and real player owned stores promotes RP somewhat. But it is almost impossible to tell, a lot of the RP is done in private session, in grouping or in a guild and most players see very little of that.
There are many things the devs could do to promote RP. One of the easy things would be to have an inn that have small minigames, like dice playing, drinking contests and other ways to spend time together without just killing stuff.
Again, FoM does all that.
Gear is fairly static and it's an FPS-type game. Thing is that it gets really boring when the initial mystique of it all wears off, and you start questioning why you even play.
It's still one of the better PvP game's I've played in the last few years though, I spent 16 hours straight on New Years defending planets from the scumbag cop faction. Had a blast, but when war isn't going on you pretty much stand around and craft - which gets boring immediately. The game lacks a lot of things to do, and simply because it eschews NPC-based content, levels and other things people swear games can do without.
Well, they can, but it ain't pretty without a legit substitution. (try it)
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
Just by looking at the VERY limited Face of mankind game, I can tell I would not be interested in it. 1. it is a crime fighting game- bleh. 2. I would rather have more creativity, less realism as far as creativity goes. I prefer fantasy because anything can happen in a fantasy game wheras in a real life simulator game, you are limited to real weapons/ armor/ ability. I can play reality FPS anywhere, and not be "commited to it", like a MMORPG.
Real life simulators are too restrictive in what can actually happen. I don;t play games to play in the " real world" I play them so I can do things that are not possible in the real world.
It appears to be more of a real life simulator.. and I really get bored with "reality simulators" fast. I can see why there is no incentive to play it. LOL
It's deffo not a "crime-fighting game", there is just a police-based faction, and that is just one of the 8 therein.
there's also the military, drug czars, political mediators, mercenaries and 3 kinds of corporations.
Life simulator is going way too far with it too, its more like an FFA FPS game with politics. I recommend you do research on your own before reading into things the wrong way such as this.
Still though, yes, you would probably come to the same conclusions we both state here. I would just rather it happen through cause and effect, rather than guesstimation. It's assumptions that leads to the ideas that people would rather have no NPCs or leveling, and then it gets used to rationalize not taking a step into trying it.
It's worth a try in the very least, just so you *know* how you would feel about it.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
It is dangerous, difficult, and not efficient to play a role in many MMORPGs. Maybe in certain FPS it is possible, e.g. a tank commander, driver, gunner. But these roles are also functional.
The poll asked why I selected "gameplay" over story. I'm not quite sure why anybody would pick story to be perfectly honest. The stories in the vast majority of games might be slightly entertaining, but they are meaningless. You and thousands of others have all participated in various aspects of the story without it making an iota of difference to the world. If I wanted to be a passenger for a good story, I would pick up a good book or a not too bad movie. If I want to play a part in a player driven story, oddly enough - MMORPGs are not the place to do it - least not in a themepark. Sandbox games offer that over themeparks, your part in the story actually matters.
So it kind of defaults to gameplay over story...
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%
I could play it for some kicks, but I can tell I am not going to like the setting already. It appears to me to be reality simulator, and if I wanted to do all that I could just move across the Border.
( Juarez has all that for real and MORE.)
1. Do you have to choose a faction from the start of the game?
2. Can you switch faction at will?
3.can I kill anyone from my own faction if they annoy me?
4. Are there penalties for killing people?
5. Are all items in game player craftable, tradable, dropable, and salvagable?
6. Do they actually incorporate players actions into the game itself?
Having a game that you just do not have to interact with NPC's isn;t much on gameplay unless you actually incorporate the player into the game world itself. Say - it keeps track of your actions and makes in game changes due to those actions.
You also need to have a " need" for crafting, merchanting, gathering, salvaging otheriwse it is pointless.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
Um no...I'm actually saying that modern MMORPGs are no longer developed with any sort of roleplaying in mind and that you can find much better roleplay in older MMORPGs, indy games, and NWN persistant world servers. I'm not sure why you got so defensive there.
Secondly, because I don't know how to quote two different people:
-----------------
-----------------
Originally posted by uquipu
.
Completely false.
.
All you need to RP is two like minded people and a means to communicate. Matter of fact, the more RP stuff a game offers, lore etc, the harder it is to RP.
.
WoW has the best RP going today. On Moon Guard and Wyrmrest Accord servers.
.
People /walk around town. There are many conversations in /say to eavesdrop on. A player ran pub is always open.
.
What makes these true RP communities is that you will find yourself in a community of hundreds of RP'ers. RP will be the norm, not just a label on a server.
--------------------
--------------------
If 11 million people play World of Warcraft on 40 something different servers, yet only two of them have active roleplay populations, World of Warcraft is not condusive to roleplay. To understand what I'm saying, I think I need to educate you on the definition of "condusive." Condusive does not mean that World of Warcraft does not have roleplaers. Condusive does not mean that anyone can't roleplay any time they want. No, the dictionary defintion of condusive states, "tending to promote or assist." For you, that means that modern MMORPGs do nothing to actively promote roleplaying on their servers besides throwing up a "roleplaying prefered" tag on a server. This, of course, is compared to many indy MMORPs and whatnot that have specific mechanics that not only encourage role play but also make roleplaying more fun with features such as housing systems, town creation, and player create books just to name a few. Persistant worlds in NWN usually have small communities per server with admins who are very passionate about roleplaying, which means, in some cases, the entire server is designed around the purpose of roleplaying.
Sure, you can roleplay in World of Warcraft, LoTRO, WAR, EQ2, and the like, but those games simply do not give players any tools or encouragement to roleplay, and as such, roleplay is relegated to tavern sessions and random chats. If that's ok with you, it's ok with me, but there are other options out there that are much more "condusive" to roleplaying.
My friends role-play among ourselves. Each toon has a distinct individual personality and interacts with the others accordingly. We seldom break character except when grouped with outsiders (who wouldn't get our gameplay).
Its great fun, much like improvisation theater.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
Well, when I'm playing WoW... I role play within my mind.. not necessarily in speaking, but when I'm playing my character, I tend to kinda make up an "attitude" for each character I play depending on the look I finally decide on. This loosely translates to when I do speak in groups, it's always with proper grammer, and politeness, not necesarily role playing.
But I do believe that when I do play SW:TOR, because of how in depth the characters are going to be, npc's and pc's alike, I really think that's going to make me connect with my character even more, and even maybe lean toward being more in character while in groups. While playing through Mass Effect 1 and 2, I became VERY attached to my Shepard, so I can only imagine how connected I'll get with my character in this game.
Player-Character voiceovers = acting.
Good acting can make you buy into anything, and it makes me wonder why the "silent protagonist" has been done so many times (besides being the easier route). The only thing is that it doesn't equate to RP, it in fact makes your character autonomous, and it's less about *your* decisions, and far more about *theirs*. All in all a good route to go though.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
I was on Mith Marr server and there were role play guilds on the server.
Just because there is a designated rp server does not mean that is the only place it happens.
Either way. When the voices are done well enough it draws me into my character alot; it gets me more interested in the outcomes of the conversations and the choices I've made, and with that being said, it'll probably get me more into my role in a group and make it more enjoyable and I'll be in character more.
i wish it were roleplaying first, but one of my all time favorite games was final fantasy tactics(true not a mmo,but it is an rpg) it that game the game play was fantastic building your team in a certain way getting that new ability, but the story of your guys obsession for another guy is really lame they had some nice back stabbing but then thats all it became back stab delta back stab delta, but that game play made me go back and back for hours. just my 2 cents. hugs
kevin ripka
Still feel that it comes down to do you want to be a "driver" or a "passenger"... while some single player RPG games offer the "driver" role, many are still just a case of being a "passenger". Themepark MMORPGs, you are a "passenger"... and that is simply too passive, I would rather buy a book, watch TV, see a movie, etc. PnP was interactive - yes, there might be a "story" - but stories normally do not survive contact long with players. You lose that in MMORPGs... simple mechanics prevent you from doing anything real...er...fake, but real, arggh - you know what I mean.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%