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EverQuest II: EQ II Extended Fan Faire Panel
SBFord
Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,129
At last weekend's Sony Online Entertainment Fan Faire, MMORPG.com Managing Editor Jon Wood sat in on what was probably the most controversial panel during the convention: The panel dealing with the recently announced Everquest II Extended and its free-to-play option. Developers David Georgeson, Rich Waters, Greg Spence and Tony Royce spent time discussing what EQ II Extended is and isn't as well as giving fans time to ask their questions.
The Extended version of the game is instead to be seen as a F2P “attract mode”, meant to bring it to the attention of a generation of gamers that hadn’t necessarily had a chance to try EverQuest II. Being a game of six years old, EQ II isn’t attracting a lot of attention from either the gaming media or players, both of whom are naturally prone to look toward the newest and shiniest new thing that’s being talked about and not into the past.
Read Jon's full report on Everquest II Extended.
Comments
Only SOE could devise such an absurd design. Why would anyone move to the subscription game since they have to completely start over with a new character? Oh I suppose a few who find they like the game won't mind, but it seems to me to be a lot of time wasted. Players who don't have a lot of time to devote to a MMO are going to pass on that option.
Because SOE and John Smedly in particular don't want people to move to the Live Servers.
They want people to stick to EQ2:Extended, and want them to spend as much cash as possible in the much expanded Marketplace.
It's what John Smedly always wanted. And it's now going to happen.
And that he screws over all his loyal paying customers currently on the Live Servers. He couldn't care less. Never has. Never will.
Extended players will always remain one expansion behind the Live servers.
I think this is incorrect. Free players will have to wait one content release until new expansions are available to them. Players who purchase the expansion pack will have access to it immediately. This is actually better than the Live servers where players who don't buy the expansion pack never have access to it.
@Oz
Players DO NOT need to start over. They can pay a fee and transfer their toon over to the new server.
You cannot transfer from an EQ2:Extended server to a Live server! Only the other way around.
Coupled with that the trial for EQ2Live is going to be terminated.
And you won't need to be a rocket scientist to figure out what they are trying to do here.
@Jero
You're typing the same old stuff that other people are that makes no sense. How is SoE screwing over loyal customers? Maybe if they had put this stuff on the Live servers then people could complain that its changing their game. But they didn't. They put it on new servers.
If your argument is that current servers are going to lose population - well, they are losing population anyway. Server mergers are usually a good thing.
Plus, if a guild is losing players to the new server - they must not be a very good guild.
All new players will be funneled to the new Extended servers. And SOE will do everything in their power to mask the existence of the Live servers. (one example is that when you are on the EQ2Live forums you can see the Extended forums. But when you are on the extended forums, you have no option to go to the EQ2Live forums. You need to know the url. New players will never find out. Very sleeky and done on purpose.)
If they wanted people to move on to the Live Servers. Then they would allow transfers from Extended to Live. And they would also not kill the opportunity to trial on the Live servers either.
The Extended Servers have much more expanded Market Place aka Cash Shop with a ton more items and stuff for sale. It's much more RMT driven.
This has been John Smedly's wet dream all along. He wants all his games to end up with this Bussiness model.
He never made a real secret about it. But he always said he would do it with new future titles and leave the current running titles alone.
But the lying bastard as he has always been. He puts Pinochio it's his nose to shame.
Rest my case.
Declining population has nothing to do with quality of a guild and if guilds are already having problems recruiting replacements it will only become more difficult when free trails go away and the source of new blood to a server is diminished.
@Jero
I bet you love Conspiracy Theories.
Not ALL new players will be sent to the EQ2X servers. RAF program is still active. The splash screen on the main website will show both products. Players can choose where they want to play.
Your criticism of more RMT on the EQ2X servers is interesting because players would scream if those items were available on the Live servers. Are you suggesting that you want Mastercrafted gear for sale in the Marketplace on Live servers? Of course their is more variety of stuff on the Life servers. That is what they're there for.
Plus, you have to remember - its not a TRANSFER to EQ2X servers - its a COPY. Players can still log in and play those toons on the EQ2Live servers.
RAF was and always has been a failure. It's mostly (ab)used by multi-box accounts to powerlevel ALT's.
Most new players came via the regular Trial. Eventho the stream of new players was low. It was still there.
The much expanded market place on EQ2:Extended exactly shows you what they are trying to do and where they want to head with the future of this game.
It has nothing to do with conspiracy. Facts:
- EQ2Live forums invisible to EQ2:Extended players when on Extended forums. But Extended forums visible on EQ2Live forums.
- No character transfers from EQ2:Extended to EQ2:Live ! Only the other way around.
- No more trials for EQ2Live ! Only for EQ2:Extended.
It was not even a month ago that they said and reassured everyone that EverQuest 2 would NOT go Free 2 Play! That everything was fine and no such plans needed for this game.
And exactly 4 weeks later they announce Free 2 Play. Ready with Beta servers, forums and much expanded market place.
Right. This is not something you decide overnight. This takes months of careful planning and preperation.
So please. If you want to stick your head in the sand, pretend everything is peachy and John Smedly is a honest guy that never lies and always cares for his customers. Fine by me. Suit yourself.
@Jero
You know where your entire argument falls apart? The fact that this has all happened before and none of the doom and gloom happened.
Let me refresh your memory.
When SoE opened up the Exchange servers (Bazaar and Shadowhaven) this is what they allowed:
1. Transfer TO the server. (For free!)
2. No transfer FROM the server.
3. New players directed to those servers.
Look familar?
With regards to point 3. The reason why this is true is because during the character creation screen the least populated server is placed on top of the list and selected. The only thing that would tell a new player those were exchange servers was a (EXC) at the end of the server name.
Players transfered toons over. Players bought and sold plat and toons. And you know what?
AB is still the most populated server.
Even with allowing free transfers over to the Exchange servers the sky didn't fall on the non-Exchange servers. In fact, to this day, the Exchange servers are still the least populated.
So, you can have your arms like Alex Jones if you want, but the EQ2X model isn't going to kill the the Live model. History tells us this.
I canceled 2 accounts because of this. the people saying it wont change anything are deluding themselves. The guy above me is deluded and says that all those things didnt hurt or change eq2. I give you eq2x as proof it did change things. people are and continue to stay away from anything SoE related because of their lies and tricks and instead of turning that around, they continue to lie and trick you.
You just cant trust the company.
This is what's going to happen...SOE will do anything to make money. With that in mind, you can just about bet that any new content will be geared with the f2p servers in mind. Any money that goes into developement for EQ2 from now on will be used to cater to those f2p servers. Live servers will be getting the scraps from SOE's plate from this moment on. Count it! Sony will be putting all their efforts into coming up with new items, and new ways to get the f2p players to whip out the credit card. It's a shame, EQ2 is a great game with a crap-ton of content, but at the end, the Live servers will go the way of Vanguard and become the red-headed stepchild that SOE wants to forget exists.
@bhronn
You say people stay away from SoE. Yet you had two accounts?
And before you say that people stay away from SoE products you should consider that Free Realms is just about the hottest new thing in MMOs right now.
http://www.massively.com/2010/06/26/free-realms-celebrates-12-million-registered-players/
That's 12 million registered players. Doesn't seem like people are avoided SoE to me. But you go ahead and cancel those accounts.
Bringing up free realms is like bringing up the playerbase of farmville. How they actually figure the numbers is the sham. Does that website tell you that most of those accounts are for children under the age of 10? In fact, I cant name anyone that i know that plays or has played free realms.
I keep wanting to return to the game, but stuff like this puts me off. First the Station Cash, now this.
I would play the F2P version if it didn't had utterly moronic restrictions. I'd play on Live servers if I have to pay a monthly fee on a F2P just to be able to use Master skills, Fabled equipment and such, On top of that, you are behind on content. Its hilarious they have a yearly subscription too (on F2P version).
This is an abomination at best.
There are some important differences between then and now about EQ2 and what actually happened.
The first being, that most of the servers were healthy prior to station exchange (and the combat rebalance). That is not the case with the servers today.
Second being that the EQ2 did start closing down servers a little while after Station Exchange (and the combat rebalance).
I don't think Jeros argument falls apart at all and actually brings up some very valid concerns. Concerns that should not be ignorned and do suggest a change in direction for the game.
Oh please. Don't tell me you are THAT naive and actuall believe those numbers and that amount of people playing on just 10 servers? Are you new to the genre or something?
Here chew on this:
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/2/view/news/page/1/read/17339/EverQuest-II-Not-Going-Free-to-Play.html
Posted 28 June 2010.
and then this:
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/2/view/news/page/1/read/17630/EverQuest-II-Free-To-Play-Service-Coming-MidAugust.html
Posted on 27 July 2010.
That is $OE for you. You just keep thinking and believing they just decided overnight to go Free 2 Play, have servers all ready and prepped overnight. With all the features in place. Tons more items on Market Place. All overnight. Just like that.
Then I guess you will believe I am a wizard that can fly, spew laser beams out of my eyes, cast fire and electricity straight through my hands and insta port to any place on earth. Just like that.
Sweet dreams my friend.
Some people stay away from SOE, or claim they do. Most of them can be found here or at the Fringe. Its not like its a worldwide boycott going on.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
You and I know that free realms number is complete nonsense. Sure a lot of people checked out the game, but few play it. Next time come up with a fact that is a fact and not some nebulous number you want to throw around. SOE is grasping at straws, revenue is way down, hence all the layoffs.
I have no idea what they intend for the f2p servers, but my suspicions are that they are not something to look forward to. EQ II is a decent game still, but so many people have been burned by SOE in the past many are very reluctant to get involved again.
If they sell items that matters on one server and not the other that actually makes sense to me.
It sucks if someone just can transfer his char with bought gear and become one of the best geared tones of a server, that would be the final straw for many players.
I am not saying that I support this, I am not but I can understand it at least.
It's not that. You cannot compare it with Live Gamer on the Station Exchange servers.
There you can litterly buy everything on the Store. Including fully geared characters. Even sell them yourself.
That kind of stuff you indeed do not want to have ending up on the Live Servers.
Station Exchange is a true RMT abomination on itself. Cannot get any worse than that.
John Smedly would have commited corporate suicide if he had allowed transfers from Station Exchange to regular Live Servers.
It would have instantly been the end of Everquest 2 and probably SOE itself shortly after.
All I can say is almost every vet I know hates the idea. For instance taking out the 14 day trial, and locking it down to where nobody can transfer up. This means and a lot of folks believe it other than me, that the current servers are going to die a slow death.
Honestly I don't know but about 20 to 30 folks that even post in the eq2 forums that like it. Most of them hate it. I think its going to backfire. Gosh knows I actually seen folks who have canceled over this, just not idle threats.
I for one want nothing to do with it, not even the beta.
"Characters will be allowed to be copied from the Live servers onto the Extended servers, but the option does not exist in the reverse. Extended characters will not be able to move to the Live service."
What sense does this make. They claim that the idea is to attract "Extended" player to the "Live" version, but the "Extended" players will not be able to transfer characters to the "Live" version? That seems totally backwards. If you want them to join Live then let them transfer their character. I for one would not make the move if it meant starting over.
What would you do, if you ran SOE and EQ2?
Your sat watching your subscription numbers drop, due to the age of the game. You know 14 million MMO players are playing Warcraft. You know that F2P brings in alot of money, and keeps your game alive. You know that a few thousand loyal fans may quit, but a few thousand more would quit if you made the existing servers F2P. You know that possibly a few million will play if you go F2P. You are trying to develop multiple new games and need the money to do this.
If I were running it, I would be doing so to make money, pay my bills, pay my developers, pay my shareholders. I would not be doing it so a few thousand players can continue to play until I ran out of cash and the game closed!
The biggest argument from fans is that the live servers will slowly empty. They are empty anyway! I play EQ2 everyday, and theres about 10 people chatting in General, and I never see anyone running about. I spent all evening looking for a group. Do I mind starting again on a new server with a huge population? It would take me a week or two to get up to a high level, I know all the grinding tricks, I know how to make alot of plat quickly, I know how to do all the good quests to get the gear. And I could play with lots of people, and help them out. The fun would be back for me.
For everyone who quits, 100 new F2P people would join, and if you were running a business, that would look mighty attractive! This is how its going to be with MMO's from now on. Everyone is doing this. LOTRO, EQ2, Wow even has a disguised cash shop. And for those few thousands who dont play anymore there will be millions who will.
Personally I do not like cash shops, but I'm certainly not going to stop playing games in this genre due to it, or claim companies like SOE, Turbine, Blizzard etc are evil and ruining my life!
"When people don't know much about something, they tend to fill in the blanks the way they want them to be filled in. They are almost always disappointed." - Will Wright
There is a reason that the live servers are empty and it has nothing to do with the price tag.
If I were soe I would have started listening to my customers a long time ago. Stop putting out half finished expansions just to meet a revenue schedule. Take a serious long look at class balance, broken skills and all the other complaints being made.
EQ2 mechanics panel
Go look at the answers the developers give players when they bring up bugs and concerns. It is almost as if they don't understand the game and are just hearing what players are saying for the very first time. The answer to almost every question is "we will have to look at that when we get back".
The point is that simply changing the pricing of the game will not be a long term solution. Just like merging servers doesn't solve the core problem. Age isn't the reason that the game has declined so much. As long as soe keeps half assing the game the end result will be the same.