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So Auction Houses are in...
Grafbenda
Member Posts: 51
Simple question to all the people defending not having AH's in the game. I saw a lot of comments against AH's and how having them would be easy mode and why do people insist on having everything handed to them and this is the game and vision SE intended. I even heard how this game isn't WoW so get over it.
Do you honestly think SE could code AH's so fast into the game? Thats a pretty big feature and I am sure it was something being worked but it just didn't make the cut. It makes me ask myself, what else didn't make the cut and what was rushed through. It looks like AH's have been planned for sometime, someone just forgot to tell us.
Before you flame me, I do want to see this game succeed and evolve because there are so many "meh" games out there now. I just can't stand blind fanaticism to your sacred franchise
Comments
They could of made an AH from the start like FFXI ... but they are TRYING to make market wards work in a fairer manner than an AH, which makes sorting so ridiculously easy that it gives the RMT such market domination.
Wards are getting categorized whicfh *should* help, but market wards with a simple search function for specific items (not the cheapest prices ect) would be much greater than an AH.
This is what they are aiming for, it needs work, but dont assume everyone who think an AH is an oudated flawed concept that should be changed is a rabid fanboy, at least they are trying, which is rare.
Auctions houses are in? Says who? *Checks FFXIV Core* *Checks The Lodestone* Nope, I got nothin'. Last I heard, they were making changes to the wards so people will be encouraged to place retainers by categories, but they weren't adding an auction house. If you've got a source link on how auction houses are in, I'd appreciate it.
They are adding something called a battle market system, it probably has something to do with the way retainers have levels, but I don't think that's the same as an auction house.
Im not attempting to flame either, but maybe I am misinformed.
I thought they weren't putting in an "AH" per say, but rather "sections" for retainers to be in that would be more speicifc to the items they are selling.
Personally I like the idea of retainers, it reminds me of the bazaar in EQ1. (Though I didn't like the bazaar at first, as I enjoyed the "player AH of "east commons" ((that was my servers auction area)) or and Gfay), but they put it in where you could "search" the bazaar vendors like an auction house, but you would then have to manually run to the individual auctioner and buy it from their pack.
I imagine FFXIV might do it that way, with the "Auction house" like features via search, but then you will have to run/find the retainer selling said item. Of course, they may give you directions to said retainer, as that would make sense, but I thought they weren't putting in a "building" per say, but rather a "search engine" for retainers possibly?
I am entitled to my opinions, misspellings, and grammatical errors.
yeah search for item it tell u the person and which ward they are in would help a lot, or which player is selling what and what area they are in at least. i hate going from person to person looking for items. but it is all i can do now to find stuff i need or want
IN THE FACE!
Does anyone remember some of the earlier posts from square saying how they wanted to make this game RMT proof. (Real money traders)
The one and only reason they have the economy set up the way it is, is to counteract the devastating hit gold selling can cause to an in game economy through auction houses.
Back when I used to play FFXI I bought lets say a haubergeon for 1 million. I quit, came back 6 months later and that same item was now worth 10x as much because everyone and their mother baught gil drove the prices up, leaving the regular people who did not buy gil stick paying ridiculous prices.
In a similar manner, FFXI's economy was constantly up and down up and down depending on how many RMT's SE banned that month.
With the market ward system people buy/sell by word of mouth and people actually make social contacts depending on specific things that they need. You need a new weapon? check if your blacksmith friend is online etc etc.
If RMT's become an issue it will not be as big an issue compared to FFXI.
And believe me, things are difficult now but in the long run the games much better off.
I dunno why, but an auction house at this point in the game would totally destroy most items value, especially Shards. They just need one of these 2 things:
1: Make it so your retainer can search for any item you want, and then shows you every retainer selling that item, and then when you select the one you want, he buys it for you and it goes into the retainers bag.
2: Catagorize the retainers, instead of "North Flippers Ward" they should rename the wards to "Goldsmith Ward" or "Gladiator Ward" - that way you can only sell items used by that class in that ward. It would be terribly hard to code tho.
The open market stall system has been in place for a while in Lineage 2, and I can tell you that it's done nothing to limit or even mildly prevent the acts or RMT by purchasers as well as sellers. I don't think the market stall system will affect FFXIV's RMTability in any way.
RMT proof.... sure. UO had plenty of gold sellers. There were plenty of auctions on Ebay. Yet, no auction house and very little of actual value to gameplay. Eq had gold selling and gold buying long before the bazaar got put into the game. I personally knew several people that made quit a bit of money in the early days off both games playing the markets.
The difference between now and then is that transactions outside the game have mostly been taken over by rather successful businesses. The RMT people have become very organized because the amount of money at stake.
The only way to stop the majority of it is to make it so there is nothing to buy, trade, or loot. Then, the only thing left is to sell is accounts and playtime.
Forever looking for employment. Life is rather dull without it.
I can write a book as to why MMO's of old are far superior to anything post WOW... but its been done to death and I just dont feel like it.
Long story short, anything made after wow is easy mode and said mmo's gave birth to the crappy anger filled, no consequences for their actions communities we know today where everyone thinks that the person next to them fell out of their ass and has no obligation to speak to them as human beings.
Those who are new to this style of MMO, i suggest you give it a chance. Square will not be changing their game mechanics simply because a few people said they dont like it. If it bothers you that much then leave the genre to the people who built it up to what it was before it turned into a watered down RPG.
Remember, player made content > anything a developer can write into a linear quest.
The difference between now and then is that an auction house makes gold selling a problem for the entire server. It will effect every single person on the server. There is no doubt that everyone will be affected.
With the retainer system, damage to the economy can be done but only to the social circles of the people who buy money.
Combined with squares crafting/gathering minigames to fight against botters, it will be more difficult for said companies to establish themselves into the game. I am not saying it will be impossible but it will not be to the extent of FFXI. Just think how much those chinese gold farmers love their automation.
And yes UO had ebay auctions. Hell my brother baught an account for the ethereal mounts. But it did not affect my ability to play the game in any way. When i cant buy my next weapon off the auction house because some asshole drove the price up because he has no sense of value anymore after buying gold, then my game is hindered.
Just a quick thought.
How viable would a customer based market be for Final Fantasy XIV?
Instead of allowing the sellers to establish their prices via an Auction house etc allow the players to set their retainers to buy items of interest for set prices (its kind of there now) and allowing the sellers to then decide if that price is "fair".
Just wondering what some thoughts are on an economy that is consumer driven rather than based on the sellers.
Kind of something i've been wondering about might be worth theorycrafting abit.
I really like how they have things set up except the buying of items,you need to actualy have the item to buy more of them which sorta defeats the purpose,if im buying something its because i DON'T have it
This is one thing i wish they could change. here we are on week 2? or is it 3 now and i just found the hoards of retainers to shop from. This is my first FF game and I personaly am enjoying it. It's got a good learning curve for those that have never played any of the FF games. The wiki is your best friend.
I don't think you can totaly stop gold sellers there is just to much money involved for it to go away. But i can see how this is going to slow them down for a little while.
played M59,UO,lineage,EQ,Daoc,Entropia,SWG,Horizons,Lineage2.EQ2,Vangaurd,Irth online, DarkFall,Star Trek
and many others that did not make the cut or i just plain forgetting about.
Forever looking for employment. Life is rather dull without it.
The market ward system is just plain bad. The way they're band-aiding it is not going to stop the inherent problems. The tremendous lag will still be there, and you will still have to manually sort through 100s of bazaars all the while fighting the horrible database lag. Only now, the 100s of bazaars will be somewhat organized. I like that they're trying something new, and I'm willing to give it a little bit of time, but I honestly don't think it's going to work out how they hope.
The system is bad for the buyer and the seller. From the perspective of the seller, it's impossible to know what a reasonable price is without creating a shitton of Excel sheets, and honestly that just doesn't sound like fun. It's worse on the buyer. It's very easy to get ripped off, and you can spend HOURS sorting through bazaars for a single item. Maybe I'm one of these "new" MMO gamers spoiled by aucion houses, but honestly, most games use them for a reason. Mainly because they work. Auction houses don't promote RMT. People who are going to RMT are going to do it regardless of whether or not there's an AH. I just don't see a way around it. If they add a search feature, that seems a bit redundant. If they don't add a search function it's going to remain useless. Most people I play with refuse to bother with the wards, and I don't blame them.
SE is just so damn stubborn/slow that I doubt we'll see any major improvements until we get closer to the PS3 release. I'd really like for FFXIV to be an MMO I can enjoy for years, but in its current state, that just is not going to happen. It makes me sad because the game shows promise, but it's full of half-designed half thought out systems. Everything minus the graphics just feels incomplete and half-assed.
there was NO AH at jp release
I wonder how long it takes before someone creates a public available AH web application for FFXIV ...
If it's anything like FF XI the auction can't hold more then say 10-15 items of yours in it so stalls will still be used.
If they really wanted to put in an Auction House, they could've just spent 1/4 the time they spent on the retainer system and have put one in. I've never seen any indication from Devs that there ever will be one.
As with most things people complain about in this game, it's not that a feature didn't "make the cut", it's that the Devs decided to go a different direction and are sticking with it.
The one thing that didn't make the cut that's frustrating me more and more is the UI lag. It's still forgivable because it's a server issue, but if they can't ever fix it, I'll have to stop playing. It's just too annoying.
It's already been done.
http://www.ffxivpro.com/
There's another one too, but this one seems like the one most are going with.
Amazing the things you can find out when you read message boards that aren't just about flaming back and forth.
I would argue that is a failure of the developer to require you to purchase upgrades or only make them available from other players, and that it actually encourages RMT. Making game systems more tedious and time consuming from the development point of view in order to limit RMT is still hindering your gameplay imo.
Cheers!
MMO Vet since AOL Neverwinter Nights circa 1992. My MMO beat up your MMO. =S
Funny thing is that WoWs auction house never had inflated prices and was never made useless by RMTs and as you all know there's no game with as much RMT involved as WoW. Sure there are some low level items which sell at very high prices on old servers but that's because of supply and demand (pvp twinks need them and the world drops can't be farmed) . The Prices remained reasonable over the years and the system just worked because Bilzzard actually put some thought into it. The magic word here is "Bind on Pickup" or "Bind on Equip". FF XIV (as FF XI) doesn't have that and that's the reason an AH woulnd't even work in this game. It will be a mess like FF XI AH all over again, because they did learn nothing from their past experience. As was stated many times before: The games problems go way beyond missing tools.
Instead of thinking of a way to improve their AH, they just removed it, which is as stupid as ripping out your eyes instead of buying glasses, because "they don't work".
This is good and all but still requires u to play "Where's waldo" like an idiot looking thru everyones stalls. Only diff is insted of checking 3 towns u only need to check a specific section. They need some automated system, Maybe when your in that town u can search for an item and it'll tell you if anyone has it for sale, and then who, what they have it listed for, then you can go look for them. Maybe have it so each town has a search thing and that all towns aren't linked.
A private server in Ragnarok Online I used to play had something like this, would tell u price of the item, show shop name/who ran it, and what their location was worldwide. This is really the next best thing to an AH, it solves the issue of having to search like a moron. The one from the RO Private server, was a 3rd party website authorized by the hosts of said server. It bascally had a bot that'd go around check everyones shops then record and send what they were selling and the other info I listed to a automated webpage.
Also I don't see how an AH is easy mode etc. To be frank a market like FF14's currently as it is just doesn't really work in a mmo now a days. Eventually SE will see this and just do what they should have did from the start and put in an AH. or maybe do what I suggested here. Contrary to what people think, a stall system is actually a RMT farmers paradise, since they don't have to force themselves to use a average price like they would in an AH. DFO was a good example, 2 Stall had an item for 1 mil, next screen over same item for like 400k. Makes it real easy for a RMT farmer this way.
"An MMORPG could be completely diffirent from WoW. Just look at games like Dofus, Wizard101 or EVE. But as it is, most of the Western MMOs are trying to succeed by out-WoWing WoW. It's like an army of 10 sports games made about same sports, and barely none about other sports. WoW clone is an accurate description of those games, it manages to convey much information with only two words."
-Poster on mmorpg.com
Rift: World of Warcraft clone #9321 Nothing special to see here move along.
Sounds to me he wants to buy his gear from an NPC that sells it for a fixed price 24/7.
I mean, isn't that the point of peer-to-peer trading and auctions? Things being sold for varying prices, with you trying to get the best deal you can?
Almost all the best gear in WoW was quested or grinded out. That wouldn't work in an economy where all the gear comes from players. I remember having very little to spend my money on in WoW really. Inflation would've happened instantly if everything good could've been bought at the AH, obviously. I mean, if you take 2 seconds to think about it.
Clubmaster, are you ever going to find anything better to do than trolling this game you don't play? If you like WoW so much, go ahead an play it. Oh that's right it's old and stale and looks like crap. Well, there you go.
Sorry but while bind and pickup is a good system, but you cant base every mmo around it forever, its crap, a weapon binds to me coz i used it? seriously?.
ITs just the same tycpical narrow mindset, everything made simple should remain the same and not improved, even at risk.