"Dune" By Frank Herbert

Athon · April 2005

All the MMO games that have even remotely interested me have been bespoke games with their own universe, storyline, etc. All the MMO games I've played based on other universes have spent all their time trying to live up to the universe they base themselves on - SWG is probably one of the best examples of a failure to live up to the universe you base your game on, all I see in their developer interviews and stuff are comments like "we're still trying to get that star wars feel the fans expect", and while actually playing, despite being set in the middle of an intergalactic war, I didn't feel like I was in the middle of a war.

Meanwhile, games like Neocron, despite its downfalls in other areas, continues to be one of the best MMOs on the market when it comes to storyline and role-playing. Why? Because the developers are part of the storyline - they're not just fans of it, they are it. They know the universe inside out and provide the players with the type of environment the expect in that universe.

While SWG's end game is power-levelling another profession, Neocron's end-game is its storyline and the wars between the factions and clans.

I say no to any MMO based on any existing universe - they inevitably fail to live up to that universe.

Athon Solo

Scorpes · April 2005

Well it cant literally ruin the book, but it can certainly leave a bad taste in peoples mouths. How many of us saw a movie and later found out it was a book and would never touch the book with a ten-foot pole. Thats why i refuse to see daredevil and elektra, i loved the original story and spinoffs "especially frank millers elektra" and from i heard of the movie and diehard fans it was totally craptastic. Why would a fan of something want to see something that butchers it?

As for dune being a mmo im all for it as long as im the kwisatz haderach

Volkmar · April 2005

Originally posted by Razorback

Originally posted by ianubisi

Originally posted by Misleading
why ruin a perfectly good book?

I absolutely agree with this. The series was especially poignant because of the deep psychological and pseudo-philosophical/theological overtones throughout. Those don't translate very well to a game.

I would be entirely behind the idea of a game in such a styled universe...just without the Herbert universe.

Which is certainly what Westwood acheived with Dune II. No deep delving into the Universe, just a really fun game using the basic premise of the conflict.

I think you would need to go a bit deeper to run an MMO off it but I agree largely with what your saying. I wish they would have left Star Wars alone when you look at it like that because the SWG universe adds nothing to the franchise, in fact it makes a mockery of most of it.

If you imagine for a moment though the possible options for a Dune MMO.

Races and Classes

Atraiedes - Loyalty based fighters with special abilities based on Pauls powers and teachings
Harkonan - Fighters based around warrior codes (like orcs) and heavy infantry systems
Fremen - Worm control, desert skills, extra warrior type skills, stealth etc
Benegeserits(sp) - phsycic ability based powers
Mentats - technologists, engineeers and assasains

The list could go on. Theoratically you could have at least 4 playable races and maybe more if you made some advanced ones like being able to become a Sardukaan Trooper or something after advancing through the ranks of say Harkonan or Atraides... Who knows... the point is the Universe is all set for it to be done.

i agree with Razor. The Dune universe is quite good for a MMorpg, BUT you run a terrible risk. the same risk that SWG runs. There is a fixed, unalterable story that runs in the background. no matter what you do, that part can't be changed.

So all the imperials in SWG fights even knowing they can't win and the time frame is kinda freezed in a gap between episode IV and V (there is effecticly a few years gap between these two movies... but how good is to play a story when you know how it will end?)

The solution is the Westwood solution. Dune II was a great game and didn't touched the history of the books as all that was supposed to happens a lot before the actual books.

So yai to a Dune MMorpg but get the timeframe straight.

Atomicus · April 2005

Ive only read the first and still have yet to read the rest of the books. I owned and played the first graphical Dune where you play as Paul. Dune II was a lot better but I would have liked it if they kept the original idea of an adventure game. Dune 2000 was a pretty good but they tried to stay away from adventure and instead added cut scenes. I think there is real potential for a MMO with more than enough content but the developer would have to be very careful with how they execute it.

ianubisi · April 2005

Originally posted by Atomicus
I think there is real potential for a MMO with more than enough content but the developer would have to be very careful with how they execute it.

And what's the point of staying with the brand other than brand recognition? The entire metaphor is available for anyone with 2 wits to rub together to mimic but not emulate. Thus, why engage the danger of Herbert fanaticists who will scrutinize every pixel and word for continuity to the series?

So many people talk about innovation in games, but when you tie yourself to an existing franchise you stymie innovation by hard-bound parameters. Such parameters must not only be adhered to but if they are deviated from there will be armies of critics decrying the change. Add to this the many preconceived notions of what living in the Herbert universe must entail and people naturally become disappointed with the result.

So what most of us who are saying "not Dune, but something like" are trying to say is: do the idea, but not with Herbert's franchise. You get all the glory, and none of the muck.

spo0ky · April 2005

1) it wouldn't be ruing the book... it'd give us a chance to be part of the book in our own little pathetic way. and of course... making a game of the book... won't change the books quality.

2) kick ass idea. booya grandma. booya.

thx

spooky

necbone · April 2005

dune mmo would be like mxo.....i luv the dune story

basically "the one" is out there, but you are "x" and blah blah....not feeling it, just like i'm not feeling mxo...i'd rather be involved in an original story made for the game...

i want that new car smell with my games.

Atomicus · April 2005

How about having the planets as different servers, meaning homeworlds, and arrakis being to big PVP grounds? that would be interesting. Of course the homeworlds would also have PvP areas. Just have the game go and not follow the story line like Dune II but have the concepts from the books like mind altering spice!

spo0ky · April 2005

there is a point in there tho... why not start a story from fresh? following the books may leave very little to the imagination... i mean, if they follow them too well... the readers of the books may know the end of the events before anyone else. sure, there can be an advantage to that... but at the same time... would you read a book if you already knew how it ended? kinda takes some of the fun outta it. but if ever there was a dune MMO... they couldn't leave out spice. must have spice. -twitch-

thx

spooky

Zaradis · April 2005

Dune, is so lush with information and history that it would be a perfect idea for a mmorpg as oppose to alot of other mmorpg. plus it would be nice to see a huge sandworm

Mentat · April 2005

D U N E !!!!!!!!!

This is the best series of books I've EVER read - basically I call this series my bible. Frank Herbert - Genius (and/or he swam in a bathtub of LSD daily while writing these).

Oh if they ever made this into an MMORPG I would just flip my shit....

There are some RTS games based on DUNE - the first one was a DOS based - totally awesome - DUNE 2000 was meh...

Mentat · April 2005

Originally posted by Misleading

of course i have one, otherwise i wouldn't be posting. All i'm saying is that Dune is a really good series, and i wouldn't want it shamed by making a crappy game. If you create a disscuion, you better be prepared to hear all kinda of opinions, not just ones that support your idea. What would be the point of posting if people just boosted your ego?

"Really good series" - this would lead me to believe you know of others that equal it - I cannot imagine sucha thing but, if so - name it!!

Atomicus · April 2005

To bad no developers are paying attention because from the looks of it so far Dune Online could be very successful.

Off-topic: Did EAgames buy out Westwood Studios?

Razorback · April 2005

Ummm *stretching memory*

I think they just shut the doors

Misleading · April 2005

Originally posted by Mentat

Originally posted by Misleading

of course i have one, otherwise i wouldn't be posting. All i'm saying is that Dune is a really good series, and i wouldn't want it shamed by making a crappy game. If you create a disscuion, you better be prepared to hear all kinda of opinions, not just ones that support your idea. What would be the point of posting if people just boosted your ego?

"Really good series" - this would lead me to believe you know of others that equal it - I cannot imagine sucha thing but, if so - name it!!

I do know of other series that can equate to or surpass the quaity of the Dune series, but they are more the genre of Fantasy than Sci-fi. But I will say that the Dune is the best Sci-fi series that i have read.

Vampir · April 2005

Originally posted by Misleading

Originally posted by Mentat

Originally posted by Misleading

of course i have one, otherwise i wouldn't be posting. All i'm saying is that Dune is a really good series, and i wouldn't want it shamed by making a crappy game. If you create a disscuion, you better be prepared to hear all kinda of opinions, not just ones that support your idea. What would be the point of posting if people just boosted your ego?

"Really good series" - this would lead me to believe you know of others that equal it - I cannot imagine sucha thing but, if so - name it!!

I do know of other series that can equate to or surpass the quaity of the Dune series, but they are more the genre of Fantasy than Sci-fi. But I will say that the Dune is the best Sci-fi series that i have read.

umm ya many people have series that are just as good. Amber series by roger zelazny. which would make a much much much better MMORPG.

foundation series by Asmimov is just as good.

Enders game series by orson scott card.

might i suggest u start reading multiple authors, frank herbert is good. but their are other authors that are just as good in their own way.

Misleading · April 2005

I do know of other series that can equate to or surpass the quaity of the Dune series, but they are more the genre of Fantasy than Sci-fi. But I will say that the Dune is the best Sci-fi series that i have read.

Let me add a note to what i said earlier. Dune is the best Sci-Fi series that i have read, mostly because it's the only sci-fi series that i have read.

but i do have a few friends who are in love with Enders Game. I think that i should read it over the summer to see what i think of it.

necbone · April 2005

i am the place you cannot go....

Atomicus · April 2005

from the sound of it you all are not ready to drink the water of life...

AngryHippie · April 2005

Originally posted by Atomicus
from the sound of it you all are not ready to drink the water of life...

or to ride as a leader of men!

Atomicus · April 2005

WHOW! post deleted...thats a first. Cant even remember what I said in the first place. Oh well....

Shai-Hulud

Kiamde · April 2005

Atomicus, perhaps you should learn to quit being so cynical and perhaps taking someone elses opinion to mind before blowing up.

Atomicus · April 2005

What? Oh, you mean Misleading...No its okay, shes my girlfriend in RL just trying to pick on me. She is not a gamer but I appreciate the fact she shows interest in my hobbies. When I started the post she wanted to post a comment then we ended up just joking around back and forth on the forums while talking on the phone.

Atomicus · April 2005

Thats such crap! Ugh, I like EA games but I also like Westwood Studios. It doesnt work when they are the same company. So did all the employees merge or some start up another company?

ianubisi · April 2005

Originally posted by Atomicus
What? Oh, you mean Misleading...No its okay, shes my girlfriend in RL just trying to pick on me. She is not a gamer but I appreciate the fact she shows interest in my hobbies. When I started the post she wanted to post a comment then we ended up just joking around back and forth on the forums while talking on the phone.

How nice of you to have a private conversation on a public board.

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