Why is it that Blizzard can Copy Cat any MMORPG out there, and benefit greatly from it,
Yet when other MMORPG developers try to Copy Cat, it flops right in their face?
It seems to me as if Copying Ideas from other mmo has become an intolerable cruel behavior in this genre since 2004.
Whats going on?
What is Blizzard's copy cating agenda doing differently that gives them this major advantage?
They dont copy cat ANY game,they copy cat EQ and the reason is obvious,they played it extensively,so they know it very well.
Also copying Eq's quest for xp idea ,is my biggest peeve for RPG gaming,quests were NEVER abotu xp until EQ did it and Wow just outright copied it and now everyone else is as well.Square Enix was the only one that actually took the time to design a quest system without copying EQ,but unfortunately ,everyone wants that lazy free xp for doing simple quest design,so now even FXIV adopted it.
It is actually pretty much impossible for Blizzard to screw up that simpleteon design,Sqaure too kthe effort and time to design a rank/fame system for FFXI,so we can see how little effort Bl;izzrd took in their route to making Wow,just a simple copy and paste,nothing to screw up nothing to force them to think a little.So to say they do it right is a wrong analogy,they just outright copied,how could you possibly do it wrong?
Even the artwok in an outright copy from Warcraft,so again how could they do it worng,if Blizzard already had a following for this ?Instead i would have liked to see them be totally creative on their own and then see how it is liked.that would have been done from day 1,nothing to maintain a sub base now after you have al lthose gamers hooked at high levels afraid to leave their players.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
My take is that it was a pos game but if you think it was a jewel to behold then that is a fine opinion for you to have.
XD
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
Man, I am so sick of the WoW fanboy's and their constant chirping about how WoW is so much better then every other game, and Blizzard is the most awesomeness company ever. I'm not saying that WoW isn't a great game, or that Blizzard isn't a good company with excellent ideals. What I am saying is that much of the success of WoW, and therefore lack of success with other devs, is based off of addiction concepts instead of uber gameplay.
When a person starts out in a mmo they spend a bit of time deciding if they like it or not. After they choose to like it, they begin to spend alot of time creating the toon(s) that they want to have. Hours upon hours of time devoted to earning the rewards that they want their toon to have, They want cool armor, cool weapons, great acheivements, and whatever type of bragging rights that you can think of. Once a person has attained all of that, they don't want to walk away. They are stuck in the fact that they invested all of this time into something and have difficulty in letting go. Some people might say that they've quit playing all sorts of different games and I'm way off base, but how many of those people would delete their toons? If they're never going to play the game again, it shouldn't be much of an issue, but I don't think many would have the strength to do it.
So the result of this natural desire to retain the fruits of one's labors, is that people tend to be easily swayed into the purchase of expansion packs, upgrades and such, instead of trying out new and different games. And with the case of WoW, who is definately the big fish for the NA market, it is effectively easier to impliment new mechanics (irregardless of who originally came up with the idea) because the playerbase is already there and does not want to go anywhere because of the fear of losing their investment of time.
Blizzard really has it alot easier when it comes to copying someone's ideas, and with the weight of their playerbase and their foothold of over half a decade of player time invested, they're going to be a tough incumbent to beat. Copying WoW would be fruitless, and the dev's that want to make a good niche in the market, better start coming up with ideas that Blizzard can't put into WoW.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
Man, I am so sick of the WoW fanboy's and their constant chirping about how WoW is so much better then every other game, and Blizzard is the most awesomeness company ever. I'm not saying that WoW isn't a great game, or that Blizzard isn't a good company with excellent ideals. What I am saying is that much of the success of WoW, and therefore lack of success with other devs, is based off of addiction concepts instead of uber gameplay.
When a person starts out in a mmo they spend a bit of time deciding if they like it or not. After they choose to like it, they begin to spend alot of time creating the toon(s) that they want to have. Hours upon hours of time devoted to earning the rewards that they want their toon to have, They want cool armor, cool weapons, great acheivements, and whatever type of bragging rights that you can think of. Once a person has attained all of that, they don't want to walk away. They are stuck in the fact that they invested all of this time into something and have difficulty in letting go. Some people might say that they've quit playing all sorts of different games and I'm way off base, but how many of those people would delete their toons? If they're never going to play the game again, it shouldn't be much of an issue, but I don't think many would have the strength to do it.
So the result of this natural desire to retain the fruits of one's labors, is that people tend to be easily swayed into the purchase of expansion packs, upgrades and such, instead of trying out new and different games. And with the case of WoW, who is definately the big fish for the NA market, it is effectively easier to impliment new mechanics (irregardless of who originally came up with the idea) because the playerbase is already there and does not want to go anywhere because of the fear of losing their investment of time.
Blizzard really has it alot easier when it comes to copying someone's ideas, and with the weight of their playerbase and their foothold of over half a decade of player time invested, they're going to be a tough incumbent to beat. Copying WoW would be fruitless, and the dev's that want to make a good niche in the market, better start coming up with ideas that Blizzard can't put into WoW.
I have to ask. What are you doing at a site called mmorpg.com? You seem to have a problem with the most basic element of all mmo games. I am not saying you are wrong, but your comment suggests that you dont like the genre that is mmos.
I have to ask. What are you doing at a site called mmorpg.com? You seem to have a problem with the most basic element of all mmo games. I am not saying you are wrong, but your comment suggests that you dont like the genre that is mmos.
Umm, what comment that I made implies I don't like MMORPGs? The comment that I can't stand WoW fanboy's or the comment that people have a desire to hold on to the fruits of their labors, so they find it preferable to stay with one game instead of trying others?
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
It's not that they copy then other people, they just had the timing.
If WoW didn't exist and other MMOs still existed, one of them still would of come out at the right time with the right features to get millions of players. If WoW was to come out now instead it wouldn't have even a fraction of the players it does. Timing is everything. They came out with a copy cat MMO that stole all of the features from other games (and copied AC2 almost completely) and then released at a time when people were starting to hear about this MMO thing. So those people tried the new MMO and they found MMOs to be amazing, they then told their friends who also weren't big into gaming or MMOs. Those friends tried it and alos found MMOs to be fun and the cycle continued.
It got its nubers by releasing at the right time and getting all the non MMO gamers who decided to try this MMO phenomenon. Any major MMO who released in place of WoW and copied MMOs that already existed also would of had that level of success. It is that simple.
You can't recreate that time so copy cats no longer work. They aren't hitting a market of people who haven't played MMOs anymore, they are now hitting a market of players who have been playing MMOs. Those who already plaeyd MMOs won't be impressed by a copy cat the way people who have never played an MMO are.
The big criticism I keep seeing about WoW is that it copied everything that came before and during. Yet, if that's true, why is everything else being called a WoW clone? If this is true, WoW is just a link in the chain of their conspiracy theory. They should be hating all the games that came before WoW.
I honestly think that most of the WoW haters confuse boredom with rage. They play it constantly for years, finally burn out and get tired of playing, so now the game suddenly sucks.
Maybe cause blizz just copies small elements of other games and even for them it takes some time till they add them ingame, while other companies try to copy an entire game in 1 year and spend a lot of money on marketing so noobs can go buy the game and then ragequit.
Why is it that Blizzard can Copy Cat any MMORPG out there, and benefit greatly from it,
Yet when other MMORPG developers try to Copy Cat, it flops right in their face?
It seems to me as if Copying Ideas from other mmo has become an intolerable cruel behavior in this genre since 2004.
Whats going on?
What is Blizzard's copy cating agenda doing differently that gives them this major advantage?
Nothing is ever truly "Original" and this goes in every aspect of life, work, gaming etc. Even artists see a painting and get ideas from it, same with authors, and so on. I have been playing MMO's for the last 10-12 years beginning with UO and I frequently play WOW (among many others) and have to comment that I never found WOW glaringly copying in my opinion.
I suppose if you look at the bigger picture all games are really just a copy cat of Everquest 1 (The daddy of MMOs, not to be confused with the best). WOW has its charm, as does game "X" or whatever your playing. I'll say it again and again, when a MMO company starts listening to players more often as Blizzard does, you will create a game the general consensus likes. Blizzard has done an amazing job at communication and changing things for the greater good of retaining the number 1 spot in MMOland for over 4 years.
To that I say EQ2 released 2 weeks before wow did, so why isn't it dominating the market? EQ2 is built on all the same basic building blocks and copies mmos that came before it.
Wow is just made up of elements copied from other mmos.
True, but what has been keeping so many other companies from achieving the same levels of success that blizzard did? If all of these awesome gameplay mechanics already existed why hasn't someone else put out a game that can compete?
In the haste to trivialize what wow brought to the genre I think a lot is getting overlooked. Blizzard didn't just regurgitate the same exact things other games did and somehow blindly find the success it has. What blizzard did NOT do is just as important as wha they did do.
They looked at mmos not just to see what works, but also what wasn't working. Keep in mind this was 6-10 years ago in the development process. They spent just as much time addressing things that people were complaining about back then as they did working on things that people enjoyed.
Wow isn't just a flat clone of previous games, it is an evolution of games that came before it. Wow did change a lot. It may not be huge innovation, but it was pretty big change for its time.
What was really key to the success is the approach blizzard took to creating wow. They looked at every element to see if it was fun and if it wasn't they fixed it or removed it. On top of that they did not rush the game out unfinished. The "it will release when it is ready" really paid off.
Those last two concepts might seem like common sense, but if you really look closely at all the mmos that have really tanked in the last 10 years I bet you will find those are the to key problems in most mmos that have done poorly.
As to the question posted by the original poster I say. Are other companies emulating or evolving more with their game designs? For all intents and purposes, wow is an eq clone, but the two games play and feel drastically different. Are these other games that also clone producing something the feels distinct or something that feels like a shallow broken version of a game you have already played to death for 5 years?
They didn't have a publisher breathing down their neck forcing them to release at a specific deadline. That's why BLizzard has been able to push back the release of so many of their games in the past and polish them up better.
Most developers don't have that luxory.
Of course, things have been changing since they merged with Activision.
To that I say EQ2 released 2 weeks before wow did, so why isn't it dominating the market? EQ2 is built on all the same basic building blocks and copies mmos that came before it.
Are you kidding? Who do you think a lot of the people swarming at the WoW launch were? People that were severely disappointed with EQ2 and didn't have a juggernaut pc to run that game.
Myself included.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
New companies can either ignore or use that knowledge. Blizzard uses it -- and look at their success.
Would you criticize an artist for using shading or perspective?
Would you criticize someone who didn't invent the car or airplane for using those tools to achieve their goals?
Over the years it's amused me more and more how crucial it is that new things build upon existing knowledge -- and yet in gaming there's so much obsession over innovation.
I beg to differ. Comparing a painting or whatever the hell you're trying to compare in your second example doesn't make a lot of sense to me because they are completely different venues with different expectations.
If this was really true then Turbine's LotR would be right up there with WoW. Which it isn't and in fact one of the biggest complaints you hear from those that don't care for the game is that it is too much of a WoW clone.
Which I personally don't agree with but you know that's one of their biggest snipes at the game. Utilising gameplay techniques or some basic concepts is all fine and dandy but the moment a game tries to be too much like its predecessor is the moment you'll lose the bulk of players out there because they'll simply look at the game and ask themselves, "Why in the hell would I want to play this game when I can play 'Game X' that trumps it in content, gameplay, etc."
You have to have something that will draw in players and keep them coming back for more.
Well even among artists who use shading and perspective, there are good and bad artists. It's about knowing the techniques and executing that knowledge. That's the basis of all skill really (be it game design, game playing, or being a good artist.)
Putting too much value in someone calling a game "WOW clone", when it's such a copout blanket critique, seems like a poor basis for conversation. There's a lot of little things said with that simple phrase, and they're not always the same (although many times they simply speak of copying many of WOW's techniques, but doing so inadequately to make the game more fun than WOW (which they may or may not think is a fun game itself.))
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
New companies can either ignore or use that knowledge. Blizzard uses it -- and look at their success.
Would you criticize an artist for using shading or perspective?
Would you criticize someone who didn't invent the car or airplane for using those tools to achieve their goals?
Over the years it's amused me more and more how crucial it is that new things build upon existing knowledge -- and yet in gaming there's so much obsession over innovation.
I beg to differ. Comparing a painting or whatever the hell you're trying to compare in your second example doesn't make a lot of sense to me because they are completely different venues with different expectations.
If this was really true then Turbine's LotR would be right up there with WoW. Which it isn't and in fact one of the biggest complaints you hear from those that don't care for the game is that it is too much of a WoW clone.
Which I personally don't agree with but you know that's one of their biggest snipes at the game. Utilising gameplay techniques or some basic concepts is all fine and dandy but the moment a game tries to be too much like its predecessor is the moment you'll lose the bulk of players out there because they'll simply look at the game and ask themselves, "Why in the hell would I want to play this game when I can play 'Game X' that trumps it in content, gameplay, etc."
You have to have something that will draw in players and keep them coming back for more.
Well even among artists who use shading and perspective, there are good and bad artists. Knowing the techniques and executing on that knowledge is the basis of all skill (be it game design, game playing, or being a good artist.)
Putting too much value in someone calling a game "WOW clone", when it's such a copout blanket critique, seems like a poor basis for conversation. There's a lot of little things said with that simple phrase, and they're not always the same (although many times they simply speak of copying many of WOW's techniques, but doing so inadequately to make the game more fun than WOW (which they may or may not think is a fun game itself.))
so what you are saying, is the phrase "WoW Clone" can be both positive and negative. But most of the time its used negative manner, to avoid criticism to bad features alone?
so what you are saying, is the phrase "WoW Clone" can be both positive and negative. But most of the time its used negative manner, to avoid criticism to bad features alone?
No, it's nearly always negative. But it's about as useful and specific as "That game sucks." (which is to say: it's neither useful nor specific criticism.)
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Blizzard have good judgement when it comes to: what to copy, why to copy it, how to make it better, and how to integrate it with what they already have.
Most developers have no insight or understanding beyond "WoW is successful; therefore, copy WoW."
They don't understand why it's successful. So they copy some (superficial) elements without even seeing the underlying structure, let alone copying it. Needless to say they certainly do NOT make any improvements in the process of copying. So they end up with a half-finished mishmash which is in every way inferior to the original.
No, it's nearly always negative. But it's about as useful and specific as "That game sucks." (which is to say: it's neither useful nor specific criticism.)
I would say always myself. I can't stand the phrase but it is the fad of the day.
I think you and I are agreement for the most part. Probably one of the only areas we differ on is what developers need to try and focus on to be successful in the mmo market.
...and the use of analogies but I digress.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
I don't think they actually copy. They take stuff that they think makes sense, improve on it, implement it, and voila.
I mean, seriously, most of the stuff they put in there just.......makes sense?
Na, even Blizzard devs say they "copy". They play lots of games and take what they like from those games. However, honestly, every single developer does this. There are very, very few ideas that seem to come out of nowhere.
The magic, for people that like Blizzard style games, is that Blizzard is very good at integrating all the ideas they pull in from other games and polishing those ideas.
Most developers can't even get the art in their game to mesh well.
Forever looking for employment. Life is rather dull without it.
Comments
They dont copy cat ANY game,they copy cat EQ and the reason is obvious,they played it extensively,so they know it very well.
Also copying Eq's quest for xp idea ,is my biggest peeve for RPG gaming,quests were NEVER abotu xp until EQ did it and Wow just outright copied it and now everyone else is as well.Square Enix was the only one that actually took the time to design a quest system without copying EQ,but unfortunately ,everyone wants that lazy free xp for doing simple quest design,so now even FXIV adopted it.
It is actually pretty much impossible for Blizzard to screw up that simpleteon design,Sqaure too kthe effort and time to design a rank/fame system for FFXI,so we can see how little effort Bl;izzrd took in their route to making Wow,just a simple copy and paste,nothing to screw up nothing to force them to think a little.So to say they do it right is a wrong analogy,they just outright copied,how could you possibly do it wrong?
Even the artwok in an outright copy from Warcraft,so again how could they do it worng,if Blizzard already had a following for this ?Instead i would have liked to see them be totally creative on their own and then see how it is liked.that would have been done from day 1,nothing to maintain a sub base now after you have al lthose gamers hooked at high levels afraid to leave their players.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
XD
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
Man, I am so sick of the WoW fanboy's and their constant chirping about how WoW is so much better then every other game, and Blizzard is the most awesomeness company ever. I'm not saying that WoW isn't a great game, or that Blizzard isn't a good company with excellent ideals. What I am saying is that much of the success of WoW, and therefore lack of success with other devs, is based off of addiction concepts instead of uber gameplay.
When a person starts out in a mmo they spend a bit of time deciding if they like it or not. After they choose to like it, they begin to spend alot of time creating the toon(s) that they want to have. Hours upon hours of time devoted to earning the rewards that they want their toon to have, They want cool armor, cool weapons, great acheivements, and whatever type of bragging rights that you can think of. Once a person has attained all of that, they don't want to walk away. They are stuck in the fact that they invested all of this time into something and have difficulty in letting go. Some people might say that they've quit playing all sorts of different games and I'm way off base, but how many of those people would delete their toons? If they're never going to play the game again, it shouldn't be much of an issue, but I don't think many would have the strength to do it.
So the result of this natural desire to retain the fruits of one's labors, is that people tend to be easily swayed into the purchase of expansion packs, upgrades and such, instead of trying out new and different games. And with the case of WoW, who is definately the big fish for the NA market, it is effectively easier to impliment new mechanics (irregardless of who originally came up with the idea) because the playerbase is already there and does not want to go anywhere because of the fear of losing their investment of time.
Blizzard really has it alot easier when it comes to copying someone's ideas, and with the weight of their playerbase and their foothold of over half a decade of player time invested, they're going to be a tough incumbent to beat. Copying WoW would be fruitless, and the dev's that want to make a good niche in the market, better start coming up with ideas that Blizzard can't put into WoW.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
I have to ask. What are you doing at a site called mmorpg.com? You seem to have a problem with the most basic element of all mmo games. I am not saying you are wrong, but your comment suggests that you dont like the genre that is mmos.
Umm, what comment that I made implies I don't like MMORPGs? The comment that I can't stand WoW fanboy's or the comment that people have a desire to hold on to the fruits of their labors, so they find it preferable to stay with one game instead of trying others?
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
It's not that they copy then other people, they just had the timing.
If WoW didn't exist and other MMOs still existed, one of them still would of come out at the right time with the right features to get millions of players. If WoW was to come out now instead it wouldn't have even a fraction of the players it does. Timing is everything. They came out with a copy cat MMO that stole all of the features from other games (and copied AC2 almost completely) and then released at a time when people were starting to hear about this MMO thing. So those people tried the new MMO and they found MMOs to be amazing, they then told their friends who also weren't big into gaming or MMOs. Those friends tried it and alos found MMOs to be fun and the cycle continued.
It got its nubers by releasing at the right time and getting all the non MMO gamers who decided to try this MMO phenomenon. Any major MMO who released in place of WoW and copied MMOs that already existed also would of had that level of success. It is that simple.
You can't recreate that time so copy cats no longer work. They aren't hitting a market of people who haven't played MMOs anymore, they are now hitting a market of players who have been playing MMOs. Those who already plaeyd MMOs won't be impressed by a copy cat the way people who have never played an MMO are.
The big criticism I keep seeing about WoW is that it copied everything that came before and during. Yet, if that's true, why is everything else being called a WoW clone? If this is true, WoW is just a link in the chain of their conspiracy theory. They should be hating all the games that came before WoW.
I honestly think that most of the WoW haters confuse boredom with rage. They play it constantly for years, finally burn out and get tired of playing, so now the game suddenly sucks.
Maybe cause blizz just copies small elements of other games and even for them it takes some time till they add them ingame, while other companies try to copy an entire game in 1 year and spend a lot of money on marketing so noobs can go buy the game and then ragequit.
Stupidity and greediness, thats why
Nothing is ever truly "Original" and this goes in every aspect of life, work, gaming etc. Even artists see a painting and get ideas from it, same with authors, and so on. I have been playing MMO's for the last 10-12 years beginning with UO and I frequently play WOW (among many others) and have to comment that I never found WOW glaringly copying in my opinion.
I suppose if you look at the bigger picture all games are really just a copy cat of Everquest 1 (The daddy of MMOs, not to be confused with the best). WOW has its charm, as does game "X" or whatever your playing. I'll say it again and again, when a MMO company starts listening to players more often as Blizzard does, you will create a game the general consensus likes. Blizzard has done an amazing job at communication and changing things for the greater good of retaining the number 1 spot in MMOland for over 4 years.
A) Wow released at the right time.
To that I say EQ2 released 2 weeks before wow did, so why isn't it dominating the market? EQ2 is built on all the same basic building blocks and copies mmos that came before it.
True, but what has been keeping so many other companies from achieving the same levels of success that blizzard did? If all of these awesome gameplay mechanics already existed why hasn't someone else put out a game that can compete?
In the haste to trivialize what wow brought to the genre I think a lot is getting overlooked. Blizzard didn't just regurgitate the same exact things other games did and somehow blindly find the success it has. What blizzard did NOT do is just as important as wha they did do.
They looked at mmos not just to see what works, but also what wasn't working. Keep in mind this was 6-10 years ago in the development process. They spent just as much time addressing things that people were complaining about back then as they did working on things that people enjoyed.
Wow isn't just a flat clone of previous games, it is an evolution of games that came before it. Wow did change a lot. It may not be huge innovation, but it was pretty big change for its time.
What was really key to the success is the approach blizzard took to creating wow. They looked at every element to see if it was fun and if it wasn't they fixed it or removed it. On top of that they did not rush the game out unfinished. The "it will release when it is ready" really paid off.
Those last two concepts might seem like common sense, but if you really look closely at all the mmos that have really tanked in the last 10 years I bet you will find those are the to key problems in most mmos that have done poorly.
As to the question posted by the original poster I say. Are other companies emulating or evolving more with their game designs? For all intents and purposes, wow is an eq clone, but the two games play and feel drastically different. Are these other games that also clone producing something the feels distinct or something that feels like a shallow broken version of a game you have already played to death for 5 years?
Agree but I'd add their game engine too. It runs so smoothly on low PC requirements and that makes it so consumer friendly.
It's budget and their abiliy to self-publish.
They didn't have a publisher breathing down their neck forcing them to release at a specific deadline. That's why BLizzard has been able to push back the release of so many of their games in the past and polish them up better.
Most developers don't have that luxory.
Of course, things have been changing since they merged with Activision.
Are you kidding? Who do you think a lot of the people swarming at the WoW launch were? People that were severely disappointed with EQ2 and didn't have a juggernaut pc to run that game.
Myself included.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
Its called marketing !!!
Simple as that , godsake its not that hard .
Example Day 1 AQ 25 you see a rogue standing in stormwind with full AQ 25 set gear !!!
No guild can be that fast
but people like wow woot envy rush to AQ , post ticket haxor bla bla .
You see people with a flying mount in Dalaran , you want it too !!
You see people with tons of achievement points . you want it too ...
You got no life no voice if you aint got arena points !!
You are nobody if you aint raided before !!
LoL it ain´t orginal what they do , its the way they implement it .
That seperates them from the rest , the rest designs system , they perfect it with marketing .
They perfected there PR/market /CM machine to perfection , thats a huge difference from other MMO´s
And leave the rest to the humanity , envy jealousy greed . thats the keywords .
WoW is driven by those 3 pillars , take away those 3 pillars , there aint much difference from any other MMO .
It's because Blizzard are masters of copying...
warcarft == 70% warhammer (fantasy) rip-off
starcraft == 90% warhammer 40k rip-off
Their whole empire is build on stealing other peoples intellectual property.
Don't mind me. I'm just jealous. ...of their rip-off skills that is.
They got millions of paying customers. They did something right it seems.
Or maybe people rather go for well known brands (like Blizzard) instead of noname asia rip-offs (aw, teh grind...).
I hate WoW and what it has done to the MMO genre.
Well even among artists who use shading and perspective, there are good and bad artists. It's about knowing the techniques and executing that knowledge. That's the basis of all skill really (be it game design, game playing, or being a good artist.)
Putting too much value in someone calling a game "WOW clone", when it's such a copout blanket critique, seems like a poor basis for conversation. There's a lot of little things said with that simple phrase, and they're not always the same (although many times they simply speak of copying many of WOW's techniques, but doing so inadequately to make the game more fun than WOW (which they may or may not think is a fun game itself.))
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
so what you are saying, is the phrase "WoW Clone" can be both positive and negative. But most of the time its used negative manner, to avoid criticism to bad features alone?
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
No, it's nearly always negative. But it's about as useful and specific as "That game sucks." (which is to say: it's neither useful nor specific criticism.)
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Blizzard have good judgement when it comes to: what to copy, why to copy it, how to make it better, and how to integrate it with what they already have.
Most developers have no insight or understanding beyond "WoW is successful; therefore, copy WoW."
They don't understand why it's successful. So they copy some (superficial) elements without even seeing the underlying structure, let alone copying it. Needless to say they certainly do NOT make any improvements in the process of copying. So they end up with a half-finished mishmash which is in every way inferior to the original.
I would say always myself. I can't stand the phrase but it is the fad of the day.
I think you and I are agreement for the most part. Probably one of the only areas we differ on is what developers need to try and focus on to be successful in the mmo market.
...and the use of analogies but I digress.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
I don't think they actually copy. They take stuff that they think makes sense, improve on it, implement it, and voila.
I mean, seriously, most of the stuff they put in there just.......makes sense?
Na, even Blizzard devs say they "copy". They play lots of games and take what they like from those games. However, honestly, every single developer does this. There are very, very few ideas that seem to come out of nowhere.
The magic, for people that like Blizzard style games, is that Blizzard is very good at integrating all the ideas they pull in from other games and polishing those ideas.
Most developers can't even get the art in their game to mesh well.
Forever looking for employment. Life is rather dull without it.
2008 called and wants this thread back.....
Sorry I forgot about Warhammer and AoC. but they still could copy some interesting ideas as well
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Why would I want to play a copy cat? When the original has more content, more players, a lot less bugs and other technical problems.
The choice is obvious...
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