I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
Brieen - UO,DAOC,WOW,SB,EQ,EQII,EVE,LOTR,D&D,Rift,FFXI and some others I dont care to list......
I never thought about it, but there are some great points here.
What is a classic shard? How can you make a classic shard to appeal to the masses when everyone has their own particular time frame they loved?
For me, classic is anything before Trammel. Or, at the very least, before item properties and lower reagent suits. Back when all you needed was reagents, or a simple exceptionally crafted sword, and you went out and just did things.
But that's not everyone's cup of tea. What would start as a noble idea would turn into a shout fest and outcry from people who feel slighted because of certain things making it in and other things not returning.
You can't do a classic shard because it won't please everyone. There will still be complainers and there will still be people who, as said before, will remain on their MMO because it speaks directly to them.
Look, I'm the biggest UO supporter you'll find. My first article was basically condemned as propaganda for the game. I would shed a tear if I could step back about 10 years ago and relive my first MMO with fresh eyes. But those eyes have been seen so much now in so many different worlds that it could never be the same. I truly yearn for the way I felt about UO when I first started playing, back in a time before there were even death animations. I fished and sold fish steaks to the tavern for enough gold to buy a little kitty cat from a tamer in town.
But those days are gone. Nostalgia is not reality. UO, as it is now, is still a good game. Simplifying it, and that's what it is because most of the mechanics that made it great are still in game, won't change the minds of the player base that exists now.
We were a different breed back then. We're old men now. Our time is gone. We cling to memories and hope for the next best thing that constantly disappoints us, like Darkfall and Mortal.
I disagree with that being an issue (the issue I think for why this wouldn't work is above your post).
Which is the first of the three issues I listed.
You are forgetting the cheese exploit, leather female armor, blackholing, server boundary dupes, the 32k bank bug, alignment iexploits and well, hundreds of major issues that would need to be fixed or updated.
More importantly, what is YOUR definition of Classic server? To some, it's pre-T2A, to others it's pre-AoS. In each group there are people that disagree on what should be fixed and what was good to keep in place.
What's your stance on the harm wands? Teleport rings? Faction? Order vs Chaos? Aggression timers and the many different incarnations of the thieving rules? Stat loss PvP vs murder count vs perma red Dreads?
How about boat ownership? House keys? I ban thee?
A 'Classic Server' is good in theory, but that falls apart once people actually revisit it and the clamouring for changes begins.
Clamoring for Change or Clamoring for Fixes? The two are not synonimous. If players dont want to play the Classic server and want "Change" Then they are more than welcome to go back to the post AOS servers and get a big dose of reminder of what change and EA can do.
The Old UO didnt need change as you think of it. Yeah, a new land mass here or there, perhaps some new dungeons, that would have been fine. But the "changes" that were made completely ruined the game.
What you, and many who post your argument, seem to forget is, players have already experienced change to UO, and look at it now. Its a husk, a shell, a souless attempt to copy the EQ mainstream trend.
As for the old glitches you mentioned those can be, and were at one point, fixed. It The solutions were already found, they just need to be reapplied. It should be too hard for EA to just follow the word someone else did, I mean, they've built their whole company on being rip-off artists, this should be like breathing to them.
Addressing the issues of what a classic server is, thats easy. T2A. It was the best balanced era. It had its problems, but thats were simple patch fixes come in. All of those major glitches you mentioned can be quickly fixed because, like I said earlier, it was already done years ago. Copy, paste, complete. Someone already did the thinking for them, all the developers would have to do is follow some instructions.
The other "problems" you listed were trivial at best. The theiveing rules? As someone who played a theif in T2A, they worked pretty well. You get caught stealing, you fail at the attempt, the person you're stealing from gets alerted, you go grey, you got killed. You steal successfully, the victim remains unaware, you slink off and no one is the wiser. Get caught in town...... youre a pin coushion for the guards. It was a simple system, and it worked...what more could you ask for?
Chaos and Order guilds, those were always fun and they played in with the lore. Factions....no one really ever played them to begin with, so, why bother with them at all? If I recall correctly, they were nothing more than a ploy to get people to come back to Felucca after the split, and it failed. The PvP centric players knew that no one would be interested in it. It was more fun for people to stay in Trammel and be mouthy little jackasses then actually back up their trash talk with some brawn.
Stat loss... I believe that was taken out not long after it was put in, so.....probably a bad idea. Perma-reds? Hey, if you cant do the time, dont do the crime. But even then, any penalties inflicted on Reds is moot because players can just log on other characters and move about with impunity. So, they should just do it the way it was done in T2A. You kill one person, you go grey for a while, you kill two people, you go red. Keep killing people with reckless abandon, youre perma red. It worked. I played Catskills back then, at peak hours, solo, and I came across a red once in a while. I hit the dungeons, roamed the forests on my lumberjack, and had a good time. Sure, I got PK'd, especially when I started out, but then I learned, got better at the game, and before I knew it, I had 3 7x GM characters, and I was happy with them.
Boats, house keys and I ban thee...... T2A. It worked.
But, as anyone knows, this is all moot. EA wont make a classic server, and not because of trivial reasons like these. No, its more of a matter of arrogance and ignorance on their part. Practicality has nothing to do with it.
I never thought about it, but there are some great points here.
What is a classic shard? How can you make a classic shard to appeal to the masses when everyone has their own particular time frame they loved?
For me, classic is anything before Trammel. Or, at the very least, before item properties and lower reagent suits. Back when all you needed was reagents, or a simple exceptionally crafted sword, and you went out and just did things.
But that's not everyone's cup of tea. What would start as a noble idea would turn into a shout fest and outcry from people who feel slighted because of certain things making it in and other things not returning.
You can't do a classic shard because it won't please everyone. There will still be complainers and there will still be people who, as said before, will remain on their MMO because it speaks directly to them.
Look, I'm the biggest UO supporter you'll find. My first article was basically condemned as propaganda for the game. I would shed a tear if I could step back about 10 years ago and relive my first MMO with fresh eyes. But those eyes have been seen so much now in so many different worlds that it could never be the same. I truly yearn for the way I felt about UO when I first started playing, back in a time before there were even death animations. I fished and sold fish steaks to the tavern for enough gold to buy a little kitty cat from a tamer in town.
But those days are gone. Nostalgia is not reality. UO, as it is now, is still a good game. Simplifying it, and that's what it is because most of the mechanics that made it great are still in game, won't change the minds of the player base that exists now.
We were a different breed back then. We're old men now. Our time is gone. We cling to memories and hope for the next best thing that constantly disappoints us, like Darkfall and Mortal.
Substitutes, but never replacements.
Well, theres where you make youre mistake. Youre assuming that the goal here is to please everyone. A classic server's purpose wouldnt be to please everyone, it would be to try and recapture as many of those niche players UO once had. The new school players will more likely than not stay on their post AOS craptacular item fests and continue to suckle at the teat of item whoreage, trying to suck every last bitter drop of neon tokuno dyed pixleated crack they can.
However, there are a great many players out there, spanning the clone army of WoW, AoC, LoTRO, and all of the other rip-offs who would leave their "next-gen graphics", so called seiges, horribly malformed crafting systems, and come running back if EA had the basic logic to listen and make a classic server. Are these great many players "everyone?". Hell no. But are they a greater quality of player than what polutes the game now? Are they the old guild mates we lost touch with after they said "Blue Neon Elves!? They're adding in Blue Neon Elves!? WTF?!" or "You meant to tell me I cant wait for that mouthy little jerk off over there to leave town then kill him and humiliate him because theres no PvP on Trammel?" and quit? Are they the ones who with us took those first steps on our first dungeon crawls? Yes, they are.
They have seen what is out there, what the MMO market has to offer, and you know what? They would love NOTHING more than to come back to the game with the decade old graphics, simple 2d sprites, and play again. Because despite that, old UO still offered a better quality of game play than every fancy next gen MMO out there today.
Its not nostalgia that makes people want for a classic UO server, its fact that the players know what they want. EA has been told as much since Renaissance, but they pressed on with 3rd dawn, then LBR, then AOS and all the other ugh "expansions" that have brought us to today.
UO today: A freaking ghost town full of uber item buffed cheaters, hackers and gold farmers that all crowd into luna bank and spam all day. Woo hoo, oh yes, thats a great game indeed........ not. So, no, there is nothing good about UO anymore, unless youre one of those item buffed cheaters, hackers, or gold farmers.
Youre right that making classic servers wouldnt chance the mindset of the playerbase now. But the point is, the classic server wouldnt be made for them. To hell with what they think. They've had close to 8 years of getting their way, and look at what it did to the game. Nothing good I can tell you that.
But, whats the point in even talking about it. EA will NEVER do it. And not because its impossible, because if some moron from the ass end of nowhere working at foot locker can find the time and money to set up the servers on a practically nothing budget, it would be a breeze for EA to make it happen. They could have done it years ago when people first started calling for classic servers. So, unless someone manages to pry UO from EA's greedy talons of incompetance, hope for a good quality game is a fools endeavor.
There are some really decent points in these posts.
I agree with TuxedoSLY about the classic argument. What is classic? To me classic could be UO: Renaissance. To some classic UO could be just anything before AoS. And to others it could be UO: The Second Age. Hell, some might want UO: Beta with all the bugs, glitches, etc still intact.
It would be very hard for EA to decide where to exactly pin point classic UO. Of course you're still going to make some people upset because it is not the original game. I however think that *if* EA does this, I think they will recreate a UO where there is no Trammel, mainly due to the fact that current UO already has this feature. I think the most popular time line in UO history is probably with the Second Age (T2A), so I believe it would be the best choice to relaunch this UO classic shard at this point.
I started playing UO between The Second Age and Renaissance, probably a couple months before trammel was introduced etc... So it is kind of hard to really say what I would want, because I was introduced to the game right when changes were happening. I do know, however, that if this classic shard were to actually happen I personally would like it to be place before there was Malas, before the Age of Shadows. LBR was not my favorite expansion with all the steam punk, but I did enjoy the virtue system. The game still had the Vanquish, Runic...etc...item. So if EA were to launch from the LBR time line, I would have no problem. I do know others would have a fit.
I guess what we are trying to discuss here is what is a classic UO game to you? Is it Pre-Trammel or is it Renaissance? Is it UO Vanilla, or did you like The Second Age? As much as some of you doubt this to ever happen, I highly hope it does. I want to play an official UO that has been recreated from ten years ago. And no, free shards don't count because for all the right they do, they also do twice as much wrong.
/played-mmorpgs
Total time played:9125 Days, 21 Hours, 29 Minutes, 27 Seconds Time played this level: 39 Days, 1 Hour, 24 Minutes, 5 Seconds
Boats, house keys and I ban thee...... T2A. It worked.
I agree with vaultbrain. The Second Age would have to be my first choice. I loved the horses, houses, boats, chaos & order (hated factions, not even as fun as C & O), I ban thee, stealing. The Second Age, when I started playing, had to be Ultima Online in it's golden time.
/played-mmorpgs
Total time played:9125 Days, 21 Hours, 29 Minutes, 27 Seconds Time played this level: 39 Days, 1 Hour, 24 Minutes, 5 Seconds
Clamoring for Change or Clamoring for Fixes? The two are not synonimous. If players dont want to play the Classic server and want "Change" Then they are more than welcome to go back to the post AOS servers and get a big dose of reminder of what change and EA can do.
Again, you are missing the actual point which is that what needs to be fixed in classic differs from person to person. Of the small but vocal group that wants a classic server, there is too much fragmentation as to what needs to be left 'classic' and what needs to be 'fixed'.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Vaultbrain, do know that EA has been involved with UO since the release. Origin System has been a part of EA since 1992, when EA acquired them.
Also just so you know Richard was as much part of UO's decline as EA was. He was only a part of the whole Trammel thing, but I do agree that what messed up UO the most when AoS released.
You say you wish Richard would come back and save Ultima. I say I doubt he would even be able to save UO. He couldn't even create and save his game Tabula Rasa. Now he's out developing social games for Facebook and the likes. To me he sold out. I'm sure he is going to make a killing on some of those mindless games.
There used to be a day when I would doubt EA on anything. Hell, they ruined and had some of the worst games ever. But I can't say the same anymore. With the release of the Battlefield series (especially BF:BC2), Dead Space, and their support behind some of the greatest companies out there, ei Valve, I've learned to almost trust them again.
Sure They will never have my full trust and I'm not going to believe for a second that they would actually bring back a classic shard, but just the fact that they actually acknowledged it and stated that they are thinking about it gives me that slight reason to hope.
Ultima Online, next to WoW, is still one of the best MMO's out there. The only problem with it for me is that it has been so very long since I've played the game that I feel so left behind.
Lets just hope that EA is smart about UO again, and not just pulling our chains......again.
OMG. A moonstone. Remember when they started dropping before Tram/Fel was released, and the massive amounts of speculation regarding what they did/did not do?
Theres an entire generation of gamers out there that would look at that small drab screenshot and have no idea what took place in that wonderful, beautiful world.
Boats, house keys and I ban thee...... T2A. It worked.
I agree with vaultbrain. The Second Age would have to be my first choice. I loved the horses, houses, boats, chaos & order (hated factions, not even as fun as C & O), I ban thee, stealing. The Second Age, when I started playing, had to be Ultima Online in it's golden time.
That's my personal favorite also. I'd miss the house creation, treasure hunting, deep sea fishing and a lot of the newer changes that were added but the gameplay of T2A and earlier worked well for me.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Vaultbrain, do know that EA has been involved with UO since the release. Origin System has been a part of EA since 1992, when EA acquired them.
Also just so you know Richard was as much part of UO's decline as EA was. He was only a part of the whole Trammel thing, but I do agree that what messed up UO the most when AoS released.
You say you wish Richard would come back and save Ultima. I say I doubt he would even be able to save UO. He couldn't even create and save his game Tabula Rasa. Now he's out developing social games for Facebook and the likes. To me he sold out. I'm sure he is going to make a killing on some of those mindless games.
There used to be a day when I would doubt EA on anything. Hell, they ruined and had some of the worst games ever. But I can't say the same anymore. With the release of the Battlefield series (especially BF:BC2), Dead Space, and their support behind some of the greatest companies out there, ei Valve, I've learned to almost trust them again.
Sure They will never have my full trust and I'm not going to believe for a second that they would actually bring back a classic shard, but just the fact that they actually acknowledged it and stated that they are thinking about it gives me that slight reason to hope.
Ultima Online, next to WoW, is still one of the best MMO's out there. The only problem with it for me is that it has been so very long since I've played the game that I feel so left behind.
Lets just hope that EA is smart about UO again, and not just pulling our chains......again.
OMG. A moonstone. Remember when they started dropping before Tram/Fel was released, and the massive amounts of speculation regarding what they did/did not do?
Theres an entire generation of gamers out there that would look at that small drab screenshot and have no idea what took place in that wonderful, beautiful world.
Thats the saddest part.
That's exactly why UO is so amazing. A stone, that eventually opened a portal to another world. You had no idea what could be on the other side.
It's sad because you used to be able to find them anywhere. To be honest, when I played in 2008, I don't remember really seeing any at all.
/played-mmorpgs
Total time played:9125 Days, 21 Hours, 29 Minutes, 27 Seconds Time played this level: 39 Days, 1 Hour, 24 Minutes, 5 Seconds
Treasure Maps were the best. I lost myself on adventures doing these with my brother. Man, it was such a blast finding the spot the dig site was located at and digging it up along with the wicked monsters.
If any of you have the time, read these articles I'm posting up. They are both very long but talk about how UO could do so much more with what the game offers.
They are both taken from the Ultima Online Travelogues, very interesting ideas that could bring many people back to UO.
The real problem is that classic UO server would really just end up a gank fest... I LOVE sandbox games, but back in 98/99 what made UO so special was that the world was populated by EVERY type of gamer out there. We had carebear players, crafters, murderers, home designers (lol) - You name it- we had it. This will never happen again due to 8 million games out there focusing on a particular playstyle... Sandbox game now means (or at least people think it means) PVP, full loot, anywhere....It does not. PVP, full loot is just one small part of a sandbox but a sandbox cannot work without those crafter players, merchant players, carebear players, role players, etc....These people will never gravitate to a game like this because there are a million "safe" games for them to ply their chosen trade in. I remember "hiring" escorts in UO and paying bounties against people who murdered me (I was one of those crafter/builder types) and god it was soooooooo fun... Its over. All a "sandbox" game will attract right now is PKers and that does not make a sandbox... Someone may cite Eve as an example but I dont really think so for a million reasons . Until a new "sandbox" style is created, we will never have what we once did and due to so much competition, folks will gravitate to the games with ez mode so they can feel "uber" with little effort....Thats where the money is going and the indistry is following the money. Even Darkfall made the mistake of no skill cap meaning dedicated crafters are useless and thus there is no "sandbox".
Its sad but its very true. Even the private shards I have played on are essentially just PVP gankfests. Our prefered game type is dead due to our hobby being invaded by the casual crowd. I would subscribe to a classic UO shard- I just dont think I would stay there.
Well said! It was the diversity of the original UO world that made it so amazing. Even if EA created a classic shard, they would still have the other 26 mindless shards for people to veg out in, so that's where the vegetables would go. Leaving the farmers playing by themselves on the classic shard, with no vegetables to pick.
Vaultbrain, you are a fucking legend. I couldn't have said any of what you said in this thread better myself, my only problem I have is that I hope your reasoning behind EA being too idiotic to actually make a good decision is wrong...for all our sakes.
Dude, we should sit down some day, grow beards, grab large tankards of ale, light a pipe and talk , laugh, sob and marvel (whilst stroking said beards) at what was The Legend of Ultima Online, and thus drown our sorrows! haha.
If they would implement a old setting server like Second Age they would get +50 players from our guild jumping right in.
Im still really surpriced they havent already made one?
It's like they dont appreciate our money?
Its not an issue of not appreciating money, its an issue of admittance of failure. You see, if EA were to release classic servers, they would have larger, more active populations than the post AOS servers, thus meaning EA wasted the past 8 years on post AOS content and drove away thousands of players for no reason, other than trying to suckle from the dried up teat of mainstream EQ cloning.
Clamoring for Change or Clamoring for Fixes? The two are not synonimous. If players dont want to play the Classic server and want "Change" Then they are more than welcome to go back to the post AOS servers and get a big dose of reminder of what change and EA can do.
Again, you are missing the actual point which is that what needs to be fixed in classic differs from person to person. Of the small but vocal group that wants a classic server, there is too much fragmentation as to what needs to be left 'classic' and what needs to be 'fixed'.
Actually, the majority of classic server supporters would perfer the server to take place in the T2A era, as it was the most popular amongst old school players. T2A offered more player freedoms and functioned the best. All that would need to be applied are appropriate fixes to the bugs of the era.
Fairly static, minor adjustments always made to try and replicate accuracy
Constant playerbase. Some come and go, but there are people who have been there for two years or more now
Typically over 300 unique clients connected, peak times 400-500
There are cons though as well:
PK/PvP dream. There are people who live/eat/breathe pk and pvp. However, the ones here are respectful, typically taking your gold/magic items and giving you the rest back and either rezzing you, or gating you out to a town themselves.
Macroing is allowed so player economy is not what it was on OSI back in T2A
Just naming a few things here, but it's the truest T2A experience since OSI T2A. The admin/coder is incredible, doing it almost entirely as a one man job with a few people decompiling the demo, checking patch notes, and being research addicts for the cause.
Like many have said, it's nostalgia and that's not reality. However, playing this experience for almost a year now, I can say that while I do take breaks, as with all my MMOs, this the one I can't wait to get back to the most when my schedule has free time.
Comments
http://www.uoorigins.com/
Pre t2a shard...still new but lots of nostalgia. !!
Please go to the link below and join the Bring back classic Ultima Online group Thank you everyone who has joined.
http://www.facebook.com/#!/group.php?gid=317849071900
I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
Brieen - UO,DAOC,WOW,SB,EQ,EQII,EVE,LOTR,D&D,Rift,FFXI and some others I dont care to list......
I never thought about it, but there are some great points here.
What is a classic shard? How can you make a classic shard to appeal to the masses when everyone has their own particular time frame they loved?
For me, classic is anything before Trammel. Or, at the very least, before item properties and lower reagent suits. Back when all you needed was reagents, or a simple exceptionally crafted sword, and you went out and just did things.
But that's not everyone's cup of tea. What would start as a noble idea would turn into a shout fest and outcry from people who feel slighted because of certain things making it in and other things not returning.
You can't do a classic shard because it won't please everyone. There will still be complainers and there will still be people who, as said before, will remain on their MMO because it speaks directly to them.
Look, I'm the biggest UO supporter you'll find. My first article was basically condemned as propaganda for the game. I would shed a tear if I could step back about 10 years ago and relive my first MMO with fresh eyes. But those eyes have been seen so much now in so many different worlds that it could never be the same. I truly yearn for the way I felt about UO when I first started playing, back in a time before there were even death animations. I fished and sold fish steaks to the tavern for enough gold to buy a little kitty cat from a tamer in town.
But those days are gone. Nostalgia is not reality. UO, as it is now, is still a good game. Simplifying it, and that's what it is because most of the mechanics that made it great are still in game, won't change the minds of the player base that exists now.
We were a different breed back then. We're old men now. Our time is gone. We cling to memories and hope for the next best thing that constantly disappoints us, like Darkfall and Mortal.
Substitutes, but never replacements.
Which is the first of the three issues I listed.
You are forgetting the cheese exploit, leather female armor, blackholing, server boundary dupes, the 32k bank bug, alignment iexploits and well, hundreds of major issues that would need to be fixed or updated.
More importantly, what is YOUR definition of Classic server? To some, it's pre-T2A, to others it's pre-AoS. In each group there are people that disagree on what should be fixed and what was good to keep in place.
What's your stance on the harm wands? Teleport rings? Faction? Order vs Chaos? Aggression timers and the many different incarnations of the thieving rules? Stat loss PvP vs murder count vs perma red Dreads?
How about boat ownership? House keys? I ban thee?
A 'Classic Server' is good in theory, but that falls apart once people actually revisit it and the clamouring for changes begins.
Clamoring for Change or Clamoring for Fixes? The two are not synonimous. If players dont want to play the Classic server and want "Change" Then they are more than welcome to go back to the post AOS servers and get a big dose of reminder of what change and EA can do.
The Old UO didnt need change as you think of it. Yeah, a new land mass here or there, perhaps some new dungeons, that would have been fine. But the "changes" that were made completely ruined the game.
What you, and many who post your argument, seem to forget is, players have already experienced change to UO, and look at it now. Its a husk, a shell, a souless attempt to copy the EQ mainstream trend.
As for the old glitches you mentioned those can be, and were at one point, fixed. It The solutions were already found, they just need to be reapplied. It should be too hard for EA to just follow the word someone else did, I mean, they've built their whole company on being rip-off artists, this should be like breathing to them.
Addressing the issues of what a classic server is, thats easy. T2A. It was the best balanced era. It had its problems, but thats were simple patch fixes come in. All of those major glitches you mentioned can be quickly fixed because, like I said earlier, it was already done years ago. Copy, paste, complete. Someone already did the thinking for them, all the developers would have to do is follow some instructions.
The other "problems" you listed were trivial at best. The theiveing rules? As someone who played a theif in T2A, they worked pretty well. You get caught stealing, you fail at the attempt, the person you're stealing from gets alerted, you go grey, you got killed. You steal successfully, the victim remains unaware, you slink off and no one is the wiser. Get caught in town...... youre a pin coushion for the guards. It was a simple system, and it worked...what more could you ask for?
Chaos and Order guilds, those were always fun and they played in with the lore. Factions....no one really ever played them to begin with, so, why bother with them at all? If I recall correctly, they were nothing more than a ploy to get people to come back to Felucca after the split, and it failed. The PvP centric players knew that no one would be interested in it. It was more fun for people to stay in Trammel and be mouthy little jackasses then actually back up their trash talk with some brawn.
Stat loss... I believe that was taken out not long after it was put in, so.....probably a bad idea. Perma-reds? Hey, if you cant do the time, dont do the crime. But even then, any penalties inflicted on Reds is moot because players can just log on other characters and move about with impunity. So, they should just do it the way it was done in T2A. You kill one person, you go grey for a while, you kill two people, you go red. Keep killing people with reckless abandon, youre perma red. It worked. I played Catskills back then, at peak hours, solo, and I came across a red once in a while. I hit the dungeons, roamed the forests on my lumberjack, and had a good time. Sure, I got PK'd, especially when I started out, but then I learned, got better at the game, and before I knew it, I had 3 7x GM characters, and I was happy with them.
Boats, house keys and I ban thee...... T2A. It worked.
But, as anyone knows, this is all moot. EA wont make a classic server, and not because of trivial reasons like these. No, its more of a matter of arrogance and ignorance on their part. Practicality has nothing to do with it.
Well, theres where you make youre mistake. Youre assuming that the goal here is to please everyone. A classic server's purpose wouldnt be to please everyone, it would be to try and recapture as many of those niche players UO once had. The new school players will more likely than not stay on their post AOS craptacular item fests and continue to suckle at the teat of item whoreage, trying to suck every last bitter drop of neon tokuno dyed pixleated crack they can.
However, there are a great many players out there, spanning the clone army of WoW, AoC, LoTRO, and all of the other rip-offs who would leave their "next-gen graphics", so called seiges, horribly malformed crafting systems, and come running back if EA had the basic logic to listen and make a classic server. Are these great many players "everyone?". Hell no. But are they a greater quality of player than what polutes the game now? Are they the old guild mates we lost touch with after they said "Blue Neon Elves!? They're adding in Blue Neon Elves!? WTF?!" or "You meant to tell me I cant wait for that mouthy little jerk off over there to leave town then kill him and humiliate him because theres no PvP on Trammel?" and quit? Are they the ones who with us took those first steps on our first dungeon crawls? Yes, they are.
They have seen what is out there, what the MMO market has to offer, and you know what? They would love NOTHING more than to come back to the game with the decade old graphics, simple 2d sprites, and play again. Because despite that, old UO still offered a better quality of game play than every fancy next gen MMO out there today.
Its not nostalgia that makes people want for a classic UO server, its fact that the players know what they want. EA has been told as much since Renaissance, but they pressed on with 3rd dawn, then LBR, then AOS and all the other ugh "expansions" that have brought us to today.
UO today: A freaking ghost town full of uber item buffed cheaters, hackers and gold farmers that all crowd into luna bank and spam all day. Woo hoo, oh yes, thats a great game indeed........ not. So, no, there is nothing good about UO anymore, unless youre one of those item buffed cheaters, hackers, or gold farmers.
Youre right that making classic servers wouldnt chance the mindset of the playerbase now. But the point is, the classic server wouldnt be made for them. To hell with what they think. They've had close to 8 years of getting their way, and look at what it did to the game. Nothing good I can tell you that.
But, whats the point in even talking about it. EA will NEVER do it. And not because its impossible, because if some moron from the ass end of nowhere working at foot locker can find the time and money to set up the servers on a practically nothing budget, it would be a breeze for EA to make it happen. They could have done it years ago when people first started calling for classic servers. So, unless someone manages to pry UO from EA's greedy talons of incompetance, hope for a good quality game is a fools endeavor.
RIP UO.
There are some really decent points in these posts.
I agree with TuxedoSLY about the classic argument. What is classic? To me classic could be UO: Renaissance. To some classic UO could be just anything before AoS. And to others it could be UO: The Second Age. Hell, some might want UO: Beta with all the bugs, glitches, etc still intact.
It would be very hard for EA to decide where to exactly pin point classic UO. Of course you're still going to make some people upset because it is not the original game. I however think that *if* EA does this, I think they will recreate a UO where there is no Trammel, mainly due to the fact that current UO already has this feature. I think the most popular time line in UO history is probably with the Second Age (T2A), so I believe it would be the best choice to relaunch this UO classic shard at this point.
I started playing UO between The Second Age and Renaissance, probably a couple months before trammel was introduced etc... So it is kind of hard to really say what I would want, because I was introduced to the game right when changes were happening. I do know, however, that if this classic shard were to actually happen I personally would like it to be place before there was Malas, before the Age of Shadows. LBR was not my favorite expansion with all the steam punk, but I did enjoy the virtue system. The game still had the Vanquish, Runic...etc...item. So if EA were to launch from the LBR time line, I would have no problem. I do know others would have a fit.
I guess what we are trying to discuss here is what is a classic UO game to you? Is it Pre-Trammel or is it Renaissance? Is it UO Vanilla, or did you like The Second Age? As much as some of you doubt this to ever happen, I highly hope it does. I want to play an official UO that has been recreated from ten years ago. And no, free shards don't count because for all the right they do, they also do twice as much wrong.
Total time played: 9125 Days, 21 Hours, 29 Minutes, 27 Seconds
Time played this level: 39 Days, 1 Hour, 24 Minutes, 5 Seconds
I agree with vaultbrain. The Second Age would have to be my first choice. I loved the horses, houses, boats, chaos & order (hated factions, not even as fun as C & O), I ban thee, stealing. The Second Age, when I started playing, had to be Ultima Online in it's golden time.
Total time played: 9125 Days, 21 Hours, 29 Minutes, 27 Seconds
Time played this level: 39 Days, 1 Hour, 24 Minutes, 5 Seconds
Again, you are missing the actual point which is that what needs to be fixed in classic differs from person to person. Of the small but vocal group that wants a classic server, there is too much fragmentation as to what needs to be left 'classic' and what needs to be 'fixed'.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
OMG. A moonstone. Remember when they started dropping before Tram/Fel was released, and the massive amounts of speculation regarding what they did/did not do?
Theres an entire generation of gamers out there that would look at that small drab screenshot and have no idea what took place in that wonderful, beautiful world.
Thats the saddest part.
PAST: UO-SWG-DAOC-WOW-DDO-VG-AOC-WAR-FE-DFO-LOTRO-RIFT-GW2
PRESENT: Nothing
FUTURE: ESO
I agree with vaultbrain. The Second Age would have to be my first choice. I loved the horses, houses, boats, chaos & order (hated factions, not even as fun as C & O), I ban thee, stealing. The Second Age, when I started playing, had to be Ultima Online in it's golden time.
That's my personal favorite also. I'd miss the house creation, treasure hunting, deep sea fishing and a lot of the newer changes that were added but the gameplay of T2A and earlier worked well for me.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Fishing >
SoS Bottles >
Treasure Maps >
Fun.
PAST: UO-SWG-DAOC-WOW-DDO-VG-AOC-WAR-FE-DFO-LOTRO-RIFT-GW2
PRESENT: Nothing
FUTURE: ESO
It's cool that so many UO vets gather here to discuss this, and sad that all we seem to do is depress ourselves with it
Ive found the MMO industry becoming more and more depressing as the years go on. Maybe its just me, and Im getting older and more cynical.
PAST: UO-SWG-DAOC-WOW-DDO-VG-AOC-WAR-FE-DFO-LOTRO-RIFT-GW2
PRESENT: Nothing
FUTURE: ESO
OMG. A moonstone. Remember when they started dropping before Tram/Fel was released, and the massive amounts of speculation regarding what they did/did not do?
Theres an entire generation of gamers out there that would look at that small drab screenshot and have no idea what took place in that wonderful, beautiful world.
Thats the saddest part.
That's exactly why UO is so amazing. A stone, that eventually opened a portal to another world. You had no idea what could be on the other side.
It's sad because you used to be able to find them anywhere. To be honest, when I played in 2008, I don't remember really seeing any at all.
Total time played: 9125 Days, 21 Hours, 29 Minutes, 27 Seconds
Time played this level: 39 Days, 1 Hour, 24 Minutes, 5 Seconds
Treasure Maps were the best. I lost myself on adventures doing these with my brother. Man, it was such a blast finding the spot the dig site was located at and digging it up along with the wicked monsters.
If any of you have the time, read these articles I'm posting up. They are both very long but talk about how UO could do so much more with what the game offers.
They are both taken from the Ultima Online Travelogues, very interesting ideas that could bring many people back to UO.
Pirate expansion: http://www.aschulze.net/ultima/blog/blog_20090220.htm
Revolutionizing UO: http://www.aschulze.net/ultima/blog/blog_20100217.htm
Total time played: 9125 Days, 21 Hours, 29 Minutes, 27 Seconds
Time played this level: 39 Days, 1 Hour, 24 Minutes, 5 Seconds
Well said! It was the diversity of the original UO world that made it so amazing. Even if EA created a classic shard, they would still have the other 26 mindless shards for people to veg out in, so that's where the vegetables would go. Leaving the farmers playing by themselves on the classic shard, with no vegetables to pick.
Vaultbrain, you are a fucking legend. I couldn't have said any of what you said in this thread better myself, my only problem I have is that I hope your reasoning behind EA being too idiotic to actually make a good decision is wrong...for all our sakes.
Dude, we should sit down some day, grow beards, grab large tankards of ale, light a pipe and talk , laugh, sob and marvel (whilst stroking said beards) at what was The Legend of Ultima Online, and thus drown our sorrows! haha.
If they would implement a old setting server like Second Age they would get +50 players from our guild jumping right in.
Im still really surpriced they havent already made one?
It's like they dont appreciate our money?
Its not an issue of not appreciating money, its an issue of admittance of failure. You see, if EA were to release classic servers, they would have larger, more active populations than the post AOS servers, thus meaning EA wasted the past 8 years on post AOS content and drove away thousands of players for no reason, other than trying to suckle from the dried up teat of mainstream EQ cloning.
Actually, the majority of classic server supporters would perfer the server to take place in the T2A era, as it was the most popular amongst old school players. T2A offered more player freedoms and functioned the best. All that would need to be applied are appropriate fixes to the bugs of the era.
Proof that a T2A shard can function: http://www.uosecondage.com
Fairly static, minor adjustments always made to try and replicate accuracy
Constant playerbase. Some come and go, but there are people who have been there for two years or more now
Typically over 300 unique clients connected, peak times 400-500
There are cons though as well:
PK/PvP dream. There are people who live/eat/breathe pk and pvp. However, the ones here are respectful, typically taking your gold/magic items and giving you the rest back and either rezzing you, or gating you out to a town themselves.
Macroing is allowed so player economy is not what it was on OSI back in T2A
Just naming a few things here, but it's the truest T2A experience since OSI T2A. The admin/coder is incredible, doing it almost entirely as a one man job with a few people decompiling the demo, checking patch notes, and being research addicts for the cause.
Like many have said, it's nostalgia and that's not reality. However, playing this experience for almost a year now, I can say that while I do take breaks, as with all my MMOs, this the one I can't wait to get back to the most when my schedule has free time.