Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
Dont Believe the Player Haters.
pmaura
Member UncommonPosts: 530
I was on the fence for this game for awhile especually after the pretty brutal launch. But I figure at 23 euros why not give it a shot.
downloaded installed and created a character no problem character creation is decent not great I have said it before and I will say it again, eves is now the industry standard.
I very much like the ingame graphics also fyi.
You basicly start out in a city with no idea what to do and thats the game in a nut shell. It truly is a sandbox.
I spoke to all the tudors that give you some basic skills. and off you go to chop lumber or mine etc.
For the last couple days I have just done very simple routines get used the game killing pigs, selling lumber to vendors for silver etc.
From this I have made a few discoveries.
You can aonly specialize in a about one thing in this game. You cant a be a fighter amror crafter for example. and crafting with out a doubt is the most inricate I have seen a while. For exmaple with a bow you can eventually use different materials at different rations that effect its drawpull back time and damage etc. and here is the kicker much like real life theres no stats on these weapons to tell you this, you have to try them your self.
Much like almost everything in MO its trial and error and figuring out what works and what doesnt. Walking up to a buch of guys on in armor on horses in wilderness means you die for example.
Also a guild is fairly essential in otder to help you out with trading. Which I think is one of the games only fualts no in game auction houses to help sell things. People are basicly using vent or irc to do this. So you basicly are using an outside game resource to find an ingame resource which I think is uncessary. But there are some shops around towns that players have set up to sell there wares. Guild also are needed to help you get you into PVP and siegfes.
During this time I had 2 crashes that I just booted up again, the community answers my questions with no problems either. If there are bugs and exploits which I am sure they are they have not been ground breaking for me. Eve had always had them as well as every game. Currently there is not that a dagger bug that allows you to kill everyone istnatly for example.
So if you want a hardcore sandbox this is it. It had a HIGH LEARNING CURVE. especually since not all skills have discriptions. But the core gmae for me so far has been good.
My favorite moment so far was crossing a desert and seeing the ocean in distance and kind of marveling at the graphics when I realized crap I am at the edge of a cliff and didnt stop in time and down I went and splat. the game is deffianrlt fun, but wow it is not. no hand holding here.
Comments
(Edit: I should add that yes. . there are a few people that will trash the game no matter what SV does - if you mean those people then yes I agree. . the game is fun. . but it has also been broken for a long time.)
The game has a strong appeal for the first month or so as you explore and try all of the things that are different. In the past (and where the hate comes from) is that after that first month the game was just broken badly. There was not much to do etc etc.
Given the last few patches I would expect the positive experience would last a bit longer. If they can get some more interesting things to do in the game and keep the combat working they will certainly be on the right path.
You joined at a good time I think. Hopefully you don't see any of the problems others have but the hate was for a reason. . and typically from people that played in beta and preordered etc. They wanted to love the game but it was so rocky and full of duping and rapid changes (ie. book prices) that people just found it too frustrating.
I am hoping SV is on a smoother path now. To understand the hate. . play for a month and then imagine next time you log your horse is gone. . or you can't log in at all. . or the server is down 8 times a day for prolonged periods at a time. or you get stuck and there is no GM for several hours to fix it. Truly there were game breaking issues.
Telling people not to believe the hate isn't the best advice as all of those things were true and even long time supporters (Shinzon, Ledroc) etc would agree with that. It was old time fanbois that became the greatest haters. . people that posted initial messages like yourself. The only difference is that in your case it might be true.
It has only been in a good place for about 2 weeks though. . and the "next big patch" in the past has always messed something up pretty badly. People get tired of that.
I am glad you like the game. I have just resubbed myself and am enjoying it. . but the hate isn't out of nowhere.
Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!
well the way I see it, I knew way before hand how buggy it was and if I knew that I wouldnt complain, but SV has made efforts to fix issues.
But you are right I can see why people are annoyed, but even now I realize I am buying this game in a late beta stage. So I wont complain that much. as long as SV is trying to move forward
I do like that during night skeletons were roaming the country side.
I agree do not believe the hate but believe the truth. And the truth is pretty much what Aetheryn says. Alos there has not been one patch that did not go from totally breaking the game to making it frustrating to play. Or put in exploits and dupes.
I see you are new. I myself let my sub run out when the last patch hit. The last patch even the Devs were like WTF! There were days I would seriously lose 5-10 sets of gear in an hour due to crashes or bugs. Not due to pvp. Also I was unable to play my slag hauler for literally 3 months. I made a post about that long ago. Due to missing skils + slag hauling just being broken ( not being able to use certian devices to extract). How is someone not going to get frustrated at a game when you can not even play your character?? Fishing!! I was so happy when it came out. I was in IRC many times when Henrik said one day it will be like UO fishing. I left a slot open just for a fisher/butcher. So the patch comes out for fishing and henrik said we would get the other half of Fishing 2 weeks later. It is now 31/2 4 months later and no other half. There is nothing to do with the fish but vendor them. Also I went from 1-100 fishing in under 10 mins without catching a single fish (Thanx Kuroi for showing me how) Cast your rod, step forward, cast step back, repeat.
Like Aethryn says I can not count how many times I waited over an hour to get unstuck. There were times I got unstuck immediatly but seriously the game population is not at a place I should wait more than 5 mins to get unstuck, plus there is just too many places to get stuck in the game.
How many times when I could play my slag hauler did the game crash with stuff I am extracting and I get back and it is all gone 30 min down the tubes... I mean I can go on and on.
Op I know you got into the game and expected a beta game but it has been like that from release. And when you have the CEO telling you with every patch oh this will fix it, or the content will be here next week, or it will be MO2 then yes you get super frustrated and explode on some website.
Osumundo I hope no one really believes that stupid IRC log. I certianly did not. But the pm from Mats to another player was true and what he said was pretty telling as to why we keep getting broken patches.
Yeah the novelty wears off fairly quick.
I picked up the game a few months after launch. The more you play, the more broken features start to stand out. Mobs trying to ass-hump you was my favorite.
It had some good ideas but had to launch prematurely to avoid going under. Earthrise is about to do the same thing.
It seems to be a vicious cycle with indie games. Underfunded, rushed release, failed launch, struggle to recover. By the time the game is finally polished and playable everybody has moved on.
And this directly speaks to what I am talking about. All little problems and bugs that add up. A game this far into release and still having these problems. These are the same problems it has been having SINCE release.
31st January 2011, 23:08
#40 (permalink)
nine9six
Junior Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Gainesville, Florida
Age: 29
I came back last night. Fail!
Mount vanished after I got off, and can't use my other receipt b/c my mount is still in the game somewhere.
Logged off to get a shower and then I was going to try to abandon my pet...but my main guy turned into a naked chick on the character screen, and I get the spinning sword when I try to load that toon (my alts work fine, but are naked reds = no dice).
Looks like SV will get the last laugh....again. I have a support ticket in, but I'm not holding my breath.
Also, Meduli was a ghost town last night before all of this went down. I counted 5 people, other than myself.
I was hoping to play this while waiting for Rift to launch. Looks like it's more LotRO and the occasional RoM. =(
__________________
It's all about the U!
If the doors of perception were cleansed every thing would appear to man as it is, infinite.
Kain | Beeslebub
Osmunda, I think you've missed the point. Nobody said that paying money to SV causes bugs, the problem is that its the other way around: the game is plagued with issues and people pay money for it.
In doing so, SV's customers are setting the bar for what is acceptable in a commercial product, and we're concerned they're setting it too low.
Many of those who play MO claim they are driven to by the lack of innovation in mainstream titles. Why is the market flooded with generic clones? Because people pay good money for it.
What I and a few others are pointing out is that people who lap up buggy and broken software risk eroding the quality of the product, much as they have eroded the innovation. Its already becoming apparent, with various high-profile games being released with broken or dodgy features which people continue to lap up.
I didn't believe it at the time either. However, when it was posted here (thread deleted now) it was presented as incontrovertible fact.
A "player hater" started a rumor that has since been demonstrated to be untrue, and backed it up with what appears to be a falsified IRC log. It's hard to avoid the conclusion that sometimes you CAN'T believe the "player haters" because some of them just plain lie.
MO certainly has more than its share of problems, but there is a small group that is uniformly critical of MO, and will use a fine toothed comb to find something negative to post. This is so pervasive that people on the official forums (and others who pay attention) routinely dismiss this forum.
{Mod Edit}
I didn't say that giving people were arguing that Starvault getting money causes bugs, just that they argue that paying the developer somehow makes the player "responsible" for the flaws of the game. (i.e. Are MO fans partially to blame? )
To rephrase that position: Paying developers (SV in this case, "generic clone" in other cases) for a product causes an environment which makes it more likely that flawed patches and flawed games will be released. --To me that sounds like an argument that the customer is "responsible" for the flaws in the game (and future games) just not directly responsible.
SO because some guy who if I recall had 1 post.. when he started... posted something that was wrong.. it somehow negates all the TRUE info that has been posted on these forums for over a year? Like the info on how the game was going to be delayed repeatedly when SV was denying it. Like the way they were going to try and ninja-bill all the pre-orders? Like the TRUE emails from the Community Manager or the TRUE PM from Mats explaining his frustration with the development and with his boss?
Of COURSE some people will post untrue stuff. This is the internet. Like everything else though, you watch and when someone posts untrue stuff you ignore that person from then on and call them on it when they make their next claim. Same thing I do when people come here and post obvious falsities like "This patch fixed the game!" or "Look no more crashes!". Or when someone says "The game is much better now but you don;t know because you aren't subbed !!" when they themselves aren;t subbed to the game... Those people have lost all credibility at this point. When someone like Aeraethyn or Shogunone posts similar info I will read it with much greater weight.
So in summary.. it doesn't matter if someone is PRO or CON to a game. What matters is that person's individual credibility.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Not really, it's saying paying for an inferior product enables companies to release inferior products in the future. I gave examples in another thread, Evony and the Lapland Experience. People can make good money selling terrible products if they advertise it right.
Why should a company invest in proper testing etc if they can make a living putting out any old rubbish and people pay for it? Sadly for SV, they can't even break even with their output though. Wonder what that says about the quality of SV's product when some truely terrible games are more profitable.
Must just be because it's so hardcore *raawwrrrrr!!*
PS The outright lies from some of the pro-SV posters on this board far, far outweigh anything from the other side. Miracle patches, people saying they play when on MO forums they say they are not, trumpeting server stability when it crashes multiple times daily still, saying patches are great when even the CEO says the patch broke the game, and on and on.
There are still duping exploits that have been around since beta and have yet to be patched.
SV is not moving forward, far from it.
My other post disappeared, so I'll say it again. The vitriol is about the same on both sides.
I remember back in 2003 when EVE got launched and those haters back then were trully on a epic crusade, EVE did survive after a really rocky launch CCP even worked for free for months just to get the game stable enough to be able to play.
EVE was CCP first game they made it with trial and error thrue the first 2 years.
Looks like SV doing the same with MO beacuse MO is also SV's first game.
So i dont hate them or think badly for them I cheer for them trying to break the mold and try to make something different, yes there have been alot of issues and yes alot of them but they do as CCP did back then they doing it by trial and error and hoping to stay afloat long enought to make the game what it should be.
So I really don't understand where all these hate comes from It's a game and you forked out like 40 bucks for it, imo that dont justify to fuel a year long hate train.
If it's not broken, you are not innovating.
I don't think it is fair to compare a game from 2003 to 2010, considering the later cost more then a finished and polished AAA product at launch. Technology advance, you know. I expect developers making some sort of advancement, instead of releasing games in same state as they did 8 years ago..
I understand what you mean but SV is a indy studio and for a indy studio i give em credit.
Bigger studios like Funcom and Mythic to name a few has years of experience and still they failed.
If it's not broken, you are not innovating.
Well, being indie is not really an excuse for shipping a poor product, is it? Indie merely states that they got no publisher, which still does not prohibid them from having investors.
As for Mythic and Funcom.. Funcom may have failed with AoC at first, but it is recovering now, but WAR.. yeah, it's in quite a sad state, however for other reasons then game breaking bugs, I believe. They failed at good game design to make the game appeal to the players, and then went for to much of "wow" feeling without bothering to actually polish the game, nor to balance it in the endgame or add enough endgame.
So well, in short.. I think MO faces different kind of troubles that affect its population then AoC and WAR.
We (you and I specifically) have discussed these and many other issues at length in other thread. Ultimately, many of those issues can't be clearly settled one way or the other, since they ultimately hinge things we don't and sometimes can't know ( i.e. motivation, precise numbers i.e. subscriptions, finances etc) Trying to reargue those issues go well beyond the scope of this thread, so I cited one instance where someone who was trying to assert something that is demonstrably false. I.E. Mortal Online did not shut down in December despite "inside info" that it would.
If you need another example of indefensible behavior/statements by a "player hater" here's a link to the wiki account created specifically to turn wikipedia into someone's personal review of MO and the discussion of the changes they made. The account had to be blocked as spam/advertising. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/StarVault http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Mortal_Online
As for credibility, the casual reader really has no good way of assessing that. (and most not so casual readers have a pretty well established opinion of their own). In the absence of a well informed assessment of credibility, perhaps the best recommendation is that any poster who is uniformly negative or uniformly positive is probably not making any effort to maintain objectivity.
Simply put, the OP is saying that despite all the negative feedback (and two crashes and HIGH LEARNING CURVE)on the forums, he is enjoying the game
And your "casual reader" would have no more way to judge that then to judge the person's credibility.
For every instance you can give about some anonymous "hater" that gave wrong info I can give 10 "pro" posts that were blatantly untrue and on at least 2 occassions were proven to be given by people that weren't even subscribed to the game. Heck if we simply want to get into the ultimate example of someone pro-MO who says things are going to happen in the future that don;t pan out we need look no further than Henrick himself. The CEO has been making promises and/or statements of what they plan "soon" for over a year and yet countless numbers of those plans never materialize. Remember when Tindrem was "done" but just waiting for some AI tweaks? Well his last statement is that it was all ripped out except for the arena.
So again... liking or disliking the game or company doesn't make your info any better or worse. What matters is the content of the post.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Even SV's CEO's positivity is not as uniform as, (to use OP's wording) player-haters' negativity. Henrik has acknowledged faults in the game, the haters on this forum have never acknowledged that the game can be fun to play, or has it's charms, etc. Every 'positive' is written in an obviously-negative way, like the person can't bear to type something positive without a whine thrown in there to make clear their feelings.
Osmunda is right: uniform negativity AND positivity is suspect... Not to take sides here, but I doubt there's a single MO fanboy on these forums who hasn't said MO is buggy (for instance).
Osmunda is also right in that there has been ALOT of random doomsaying about MO's future. You yourself said it wouldn't last 3 months after launch (if memory serves, before that you said it wouldn't even launch AT ALL). We all remember the December shut-down hoax, and the haters jumped on that train like it was the last one to ever leave the station... I don't mean this personally Slapshot, but I have a hunch you'll be here saying that MO is dying "any day now" a year from now. You can't deny that Osmunda has a point here.
I respectfully disagree, but to say that one side "outweighs" the other would require combing through the entire forum assessing the truth of every post and tallying up the numbers. Even then it would not be an accurate reflection since some of the most heated rhetoric on both sides ends up violating forum rules and getting deleted. I will concede that sometimes people portray things as roses and sunshine without justification, but feel the balance is the opposite of what you say.
As to one specific issue, "miracle patch" is a phrase used by critics, not fans. It is used to set up unrealistic standards. If you do a google search for 'mortal online mmorpg.com "miracle patch" you get threads critical of MO not people praising the "miracle patch" http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/3415370#3415370 http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/270348/page/1 http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/271616/page/1
These are forums.. they are MEANT for discussion about opinions. When someone tries to talk another person into playing the game when they themselves have quit (or on a "break) that is just blatantly dishonest and is (IMHO) just as bad as someone creating a fake chat log and posting it.
Speaking of chat logs... here is a link to a chat (on the official forums) from Henrick from July 2010. Feel free to read through his many claims and then crosscheck them to reality in Feb 2011.
http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/50858-irc-q-henrik-29-07-10-a.html#post981768
I mean.. 13 schools of magic? And that's just a random chat. Feel free to pick any of them and watch the pattern of making claims about what will happen "soon".. putting them on the Upcoming Features list... then letting them drop off to be replaced by new promises.
Or while we are on the subject... how about shipping the DVDs that were promised "at release"? Yeah... some guy on the internet said MO wouldn't last 6 months so we can't believe anything he says since it's lasted 8 months but the company promised to ship DVDs to their customers 8 months ago (at release), hasn't done so, yet no complaining by these same fans?!? Sounds pretty inconsistent to me...
So again... liking or disliking the game or company doesn't make your info any better or worse. What matters is the content of the post.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018