Originally posted by Setekh Shae, To be fair, MMO's will not develope into their niches the way other games styles have. Not for some time anyways. In MMO's to make the best money, you have to deny some of the things that make MMO's great in its creation. To make it easy, so that the gamers who are used to other types of games can come be lower then average IQ idiots in our industry. If we keep MMO's challenging, then we will keep the kind of community that belongs to games like this...but since companies will be more concerned with money...that will not be the case. Once everything settles down, there will be one game made for the real MMORPG players, every couple of years... because that will be about the supply in demand we can expect for the percentage of players who are true MMORPG players. And in the end, MMORPG's will lose all the uniqueness that they were meant to have... to support a bunch of other genre idiots who wanted to come see why we loved MMORPG's...and then ended up ruining them because they don't understand.
Setekh,
You make an excelent point and although it may be more right then I care to believe, I just don't see the progression of MMO's going that way. IMO you can already see the divide that production companys are creating to accomodate the varying player styles and demands, I view WoW, EQ2, Lineage2, Eve and even Guild Wars as varying Genres of what was the original MMO configuration. All of these games are doing well and have found their niche, people that play those games and enjoy them will most likely continue to play similar games in the future and thus have games developed for them and marketed to them. Has is that unlike previous platforms ?
Either way, I think we basically agree, there will be and should be varying MMO types in the future and hopefully there will be a little something for everyone to enjoy.
Now if only we could learn to respect everyone's likes and dislikes, wouldn't that be nice ?
From my experience the lack of RP'ing steams from the fixed story lines of most games. I would like to be able play a game where you could actually play the character you wanted to play and not have to worry about how the build will effect your leveling. Sure that's a big part of these games but it shouldn't be the only factor that determines the game and it's development. I am a hardcore pen and paper gamer as well and that experience has made me realize some of the best gaming experiences come from the situations in games where no fighting/violence was even experienced but rather the verbal duels and situations you face. I know most people will think nothing of this but that's just me. After 20 years I can still remember a game session I had after school with my friends where a Paladian and a giant slayer argue the fate of a giant that surrendered to the party... good times
You seem to think that the term "roleplaying" only fits in your narrow little definition. By playing the game at all you are assuming a role, even if that is just "Person sitting in front of computer pressing buttons."
They tried realistic mmorpg's. See The Sims Online [/bomb].
Wow good post, you couldn't be farther from the truth. I've noticed in the last couple of years the majority of the idiot population, (you know the ones, the ones that need to be taken out of the human gene pool), have been bombarding the MMORPG games.
You are also right in that no one RP's anymore those days are gone which is sad. Now you have morons who use names like RoXoR, eLiTe, 133T, give me a break they are anything but that, lmao.
I've played all the online games out but you know what I'm finding myself playing more RPG single player games and FPS games just to get away from the sheer stupidity of the online community.
Here are some examples of complete ignorance you'll find in all the online games nowadays. Some of you that are normal left will be asking yourself, 'yeah why am I still playing with these idiots), after a while.
Examples:
1. Persistent beggars - They do not know what it means to learn and play the game on their own.
2. Game forum trolls - They barely play the game yet they have tons of whining to do. They cry so much that they get great game implementations removed or nerfed. Also known for over exaggaration of their experience with the game putting themselves on the same ranks of the devs, yet they really know nothing. These people I find quite amuzing, hard not to laugh at these imbeciles.
3. Cheaters - Players that have absolutely no skill in playing any game whatsoever. In fact they are so horrible at it that the only way they can do anything is with running scripts or using exploits in the game code. These people can overwhelmingly ruin a great online game, another example of human gene pool removal.
4. New Age Morons - These are the much newer part of the MMORPG community. They lack all knowledge of the days of old when RPGing was a very strong part in playing these games. Hell the games nowadays should not even be associated with the term RPG. These newer age players support such garbage like the Korean made games, examples: Saga of Ryzom, Final Fantasy and the such, I rest my case.
5. Greed - These players unfortunately are not into the game for the game. They are in it for a quick buck they can make on the auction websites. These people have ruined many online games.
6. Griefers - Another signed up for human gene pool removal. These people barely play the game they are far too busy with luring npc's and other nasty creatures to unsuspecting players minding their own business. They are also known for exploiting, they use bugs in the game code to cause grief to others however it may be.
7. Bank sitters - They think they are the greatest game players of all time yet how can they play the game when all they do is sit at the bank 24/7. Also known for causing great concentrated lag. Fire up the gas chambers they are being removed.
8. Scammers - Oh I think you all know this class of people. Always trying to trick people and stealing their precious items. The only way to counter them is when subscribing to a new game is go in trusting nobody. plain and simple no matter how they come off.
Well I'm gonna wrap it up there not gonna keep on going there simply just to many examples. So you see why even pay for a game and then pay a monthly fee to be angered, is it really worth it?
I agree that there are more idiots in recent games, but I think it's the nature of the games just as much as the growing MMOG community. Take CoH for instance.. it brought in many people that have never played an MMORPG before. And it shows -- many people in the game play it as a single player game, even when grouping, these people are all about themselves, screw everyone else (they play MMORPGs with a single player game mentality even in groups... we might as well all be NPCs). The same is true of WoW... it brought in many people from the RTS series that are all about "gg" and "pwnt".
I started to join RP servers because they are more mature, though I initially had no desire for roleplaying. (I do follow the rules of the RP server, though I generally gravitate toward more laid back guilds that allow some out of character discussion within the guild.) Still, there's no question that even RP servers have been infiltrated by some dewds, as I see "w00t" more often than I care to on RP servers. Greed, disregard for others' play, and the inability to communicate with others is on the rise in MMORPGs, even on RP servers. I agree that the community as a whole in most MMORPGs is going downhill, but there will always be people you can find within the game that are mature.
I don't need people to roleplay to make an MMORPG community mature, but I seem to have better chance of finding maturity in the roleplaying community these days. Again, it's not about lack of roleplaying that really upsets most people, it's the lack of maturity. (As someone said previously, find a bad game with a good community and it becomes a tolerable game (not a direct quote). ) I guess we need to remember that MMORPGs are really just an extension of the internet, so we shouldn't be shocked how the communities of MMORPGs are turning out. I'm not sure how the MMORPG companies will fix this, or if they even want to. Mainstream pays the bills, after all.
I just wanted to add, I too have started playing single player games more than MMOGs once again.. and the #1 reason is the community in most MMOGs. The only ones that I have hope for are the ones that most morons would overlook because all the other morons say they're crappy when they haven't even looked into them.
As long as morons continue to follow the mainstream, while there are games that stay out of the mainstream which are good (niche-type games I guess), there is hope for MMOGs.
But the sad fact is, computer gaming is basically mainstream now, and with this fact comes the mainstream mentality.
Sorry you feel that way i have been playing everquest 1 for 3 yrs now and when it comes to playing other mmo's it is what i base my gameplay on not only for the traditional gameplay it offers but by the leaps and bounds it has grown. I know you probally don't want to here this but alot of mmo's now probally use everquest 1 as a basis to grow off of when they sit down to plan a new mmo. Everquest is in my opinion still 1 of the best mmo's on the market today, now everquest 2 has little to be desired i was totally unimpressed with it thus i've stayed with everquest 1.
Comments
Setekh,
You make an excelent point and although it may be more right then I care to believe, I just don't see the progression of MMO's going that way. IMO you can already see the divide that production companys are creating to accomodate the varying player styles and demands, I view WoW, EQ2, Lineage2, Eve and even Guild Wars as varying Genres of what was the original MMO configuration. All of these games are doing well and have found their niche, people that play those games and enjoy them will most likely continue to play similar games in the future and thus have games developed for them and marketed to them. Has is that unlike previous platforms ?
Either way, I think we basically agree, there will be and should be varying MMO types in the future and hopefully there will be a little something for everyone to enjoy.
Now if only we could learn to respect everyone's likes and dislikes, wouldn't that be nice ?
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Alcanan
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"Faith Manages"
Why are some rp'ers so sanctimonius?
I play to have fun, and sure a little rp is included. I rp killing people.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
You seem to think that the term "roleplaying" only fits in your narrow little definition. By playing the game at all you are assuming a role, even if that is just "Person sitting in front of computer pressing buttons."
They tried realistic mmorpg's. See The Sims Online [/bomb].
Wow good post, you couldn't be farther from the truth. I've noticed in the last couple of years the majority of the idiot population, (you know the ones, the ones that need to be taken out of the human gene pool), have been bombarding the MMORPG games.
You are also right in that no one RP's anymore those days are gone which is sad. Now you have morons who use names like RoXoR, eLiTe, 133T, give me a break they are anything but that, lmao.
I've played all the online games out but you know what I'm finding myself playing more RPG single player games and FPS games just to get away from the sheer stupidity of the online community.
Here are some examples of complete ignorance you'll find in all the online games nowadays. Some of you that are normal left will be asking yourself, 'yeah why am I still playing with these idiots), after a while.
Examples:
1. Persistent beggars - They do not know what it means to learn and play the game on their own.
2. Game forum trolls - They barely play the game yet they have tons of whining to do. They cry so much that they get great game implementations removed or nerfed. Also known for over exaggaration of their experience with the game putting themselves on the same ranks of the devs, yet they really know nothing. These people I find quite amuzing, hard not to laugh at these imbeciles.
3. Cheaters - Players that have absolutely no skill in playing any game whatsoever. In fact they are so horrible at it that the only way they can do anything is with running scripts or using exploits in the game code. These people can overwhelmingly ruin a great online game, another example of human gene pool removal.
4. New Age Morons - These are the much newer part of the MMORPG community. They lack all knowledge of the days of old when RPGing was a very strong part in playing these games. Hell the games nowadays should not even be associated with the term RPG. These newer age players support such garbage like the Korean made games, examples: Saga of Ryzom, Final Fantasy and the such, I rest my case.
5. Greed - These players unfortunately are not into the game for the game. They are in it for a quick buck they can make on the auction websites. These people have ruined many online games.
6. Griefers - Another signed up for human gene pool removal. These people barely play the game they are far too busy with luring npc's and other nasty creatures to unsuspecting players minding their own business. They are also known for exploiting, they use bugs in the game code to cause grief to others however it may be.
7. Bank sitters - They think they are the greatest game players of all time yet how can they play the game when all they do is sit at the bank 24/7. Also known for causing great concentrated lag. Fire up the gas chambers they are being removed.
8. Scammers - Oh I think you all know this class of people. Always trying to trick people and stealing their precious items. The only way to counter them is when subscribing to a new game is go in trusting nobody. plain and simple no matter how they come off.
Well I'm gonna wrap it up there not gonna keep on going there simply just to many examples. So you see why even pay for a game and then pay a monthly fee to be angered, is it really worth it?
I just wanted to add, I too have started playing single player games more than MMOGs once again.. and the #1 reason is the community in most MMOGs. The only ones that I have hope for are the ones that most morons would overlook because all the other morons say they're crappy when they haven't even looked into them.
As long as morons continue to follow the mainstream, while there are games that stay out of the mainstream which are good (niche-type games I guess), there is hope for MMOGs.
But the sad fact is, computer gaming is basically mainstream now, and with this fact comes the mainstream mentality.
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Looking forward (cautiously) to: Age of Conan, Dark Solstice, Armada Online.
Will soon try: Guild Wars
Overall: Amazed and bewhildered at the current sad state of the artform of gaming.
coyotetoad2u