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If You're a Solo Player, Life Will be Difficult, Especially at First
Madimorga
Member UncommonPosts: 1,920
Below is my original post, from before I got clarification on the fencing issue. A tribe won't be able to completely fence a homesteader in or out, denying access to the homestead.
On a happy side note, to my surprise, none of the community, even the ones who seemed to think the idea of fencing in homestead was pretty funny, is asking to be able to do this. Which makes Xsyon's community, trolls, griefers, and all, about 100x better than the vast majority.
Still, solo players and small groups are going to struggle big time, especially at first. So if this is the route you're going, be warned and be ready.
Edit: See my posts below for an update! I got some info on this issue after I made this thread.
While solo players were told they would have a place in Xsyon, the latest changes make it impossible for a solo player to defend their land.
Worse, at least for right now, the changes even make it possible for tribes to fence a solo player into or out of their land.
Resources will be extremely scarce, fenced in, and fought over from day one. Solo players will have no access. The fact is, even the preorder players will have a difficult time finding a good place to settle, and anyone who has to wait to start until the official launch will have nowhere to go at all. You will only be able to choose to join a tribe or not really be able to play the game.
Sadly, yet another population and developer has decided that solo players, despite making up a large percentage of just about every game's player base (and this includes Xsyon, thanks to misleading promises), are not worth catering to. So if you are a solo player (or planning to play with one or two friends or family members), go elsewhere. The masses, and the devs, have spoken. Xsyon is not for you, and they don't want you there.
Edit: See my posts below for an update! I got some info on this issue after I made this thread.
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~Albert Einstein
Comments
As a solo player myself, I don't see a problem with this. There is a serious lack of games that demand teammwork on all levels of gameplay.
I'm just letting solo players and groups of small players know now. If you preordered, you should go read up on these changes. If you don't have an issue with it, well and good, but if you do, don't buy, or if you already ordered, demand your money back. As I have.
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~Albert Einstein
As a solo player I say stay off the beaten trail and make your niche in the middle of nowhere.
--------
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The most awesomest after school special T-shirt:
Front: UNO Chemistry Club
Back: /\OH --> Bad Decisions
I bought it just for the sake of indie developers trying to do something different. Tho I only played for 10mins. I'll will stick to Wurm a bit longer.
______________________________
The Sceptics, yes they're special but we've need them to.. I guess.
And if they're put more effort MMORPG.com can create a 'Team Sceptic'
and send them to the Special Olympus.
I plan on starting solo then maybe joining a tribe. I don't see the issues either. It's a survival game. Plenty of examples in history and movies where the lone wolf gets pushed out by the big guy. The government forcing a person from there home for the new interstate..the big landowner buying all the land around the lone hold-out to secure water rights or other resources...oil magnates putting on pressure to the small farmer so his land can be purchased for a pipeline. ..or just the big bullying street/motorcylce gang being dicks...etc..etc...etc.
Or tell them your concerns as a solo player?
You give up so fast man.
What's stopping you from joining a tribe and build some small town for you alone in their radius? you will still be soloing this way or you can't be arsed to speak to people?
I read your OP and didn't find anything so drastic as your trying to imply.
As a solo player in Xsyon, I fail to see the problem..
Ook... but being some1 whos been interested and tempted to take part in the xsyon expedition, break it down for me a bit... briefly and specifically... what are these 'changes' that would make it 'impossible' for a solo player like myself to have a good experience in xsyon?
edit: i see you say resources i guess that would be a problem but i still say there must be ways of making it, im sure being a solo player and joining a tribe are two different things group hunting and solo hunting defines a solo player i dont see why people wouldnt eventually want to join a tribe lone wolf or not. you gonna stay in your house reclusive from the whole world your entire game life? dont even think thats possible you gotta be part of some kinda village/tribe.... if not find a nice place away from everything once your strong and established enough to. it makes sense to me.
MoS resurecci
Something I don't understand is.. Why play MMOs when you're a solo player? There's games for that. Single-player games.
I'm not saying there's anything wrong with being a solo player, it's absolutely fine, and just great, but if they start to whine over stuff like updates that make them unable to do solo play - An MMO is not their place to be. I respect solo players, I can be one myself, but.. Don't whine, when MMOs ain't made for solo play. It's just stupid. MMOs are for large groups of players, hence why it's called Massively Multiplayer Online.
"To reduce crowding, we will implement the following:
- Slightly reduced homestead areas.
- Add ‘clans’. Clans will be 5+ member tribes with a smaller maximum radius.
- Tribes will require 10 members (as originally planned).
- Tribes and clans will not be allowed to overlap, based on their maximum radius.
- Homesteads will not be able to be placed within a tribe’s maximum radius.
- Tribes will check placement using a middle radius distance from homesteads. This will allow tribes to expand, potentially enclosing homesteads in the way. Homesteads will have priority over their zones. Tribes will have to negotiate with the homestead if they want it removed.
- Tribes losing members will revert down a level (from tribe to clan to homestead). Homesteads gaining members will require a disband and reforming to claim more land as a new clan or homestead."
Homesteads are basically one man tribes if you didn't know.
Sorry, but solo players should have a tougher time doing what a tribe of 10+ can do. Even with these changes, homesteads are still going to be viable. I bolded some of the update. I don't see where these changes hinder your ability to play solo in a MMO.
Sadly, yet another solo player decides to complain that an online game encourages teamwork and cooperation, despite solo games making up a 99.99% percentage of the MMOG market. For people that do not like social activity, solo gamers sure do love to venture out in online society and seek out and interfere with every game possible, saying to every developer, "hey you! we see you trying to make a game outside of the box! we're not that interested in the concepts that make the foundation of this game's ideas, but you better scratch those concepts right now and fall back into line with World of Warcraft!"
I don't know a lot about Xsyon and I don't intend to try it until there is a free trial. I don't know if whatever changes they made were good or bad or whether or not they are unfair to so-called "solo players." And by unfair, I am not mixing up the term with "logical" - solo players should naturally be at a large disadvantage, but they should be able to find their place in the world if they are willing to abide by the laws of the larger community's society. However, I do know that that statement was utterly ridiculous. I have known about and been trying MMOGs for a decade now, and I have only come across ONE, which was a business simulator (not an RPG) out of all that time that gave a true home for players that enjoy teamwork and cooperation. And even that did not last a long time for me, because the game was semi-low budget ($2million development) and severely lacked any type of end-game content. All the other MMOGs have either been far too underdeveloped, completely boring/like a job (EVE Online - though I do respect the game), or (surprise, surprise) have little to no persistant-world teamwork/cooperation features due to catering to solo players.
Not true, this game can be played and enjoyed solo if you know how to play it.
No fate but what we make, so make me a ham sandwich please.
I am also curious as to where you got your data, that most people play MMO's solo. Just because someone plays a game casually, does not mean they are playing it solo. Most people that I PERSONALLY know play online games to interact and have fun with other gamers. If they want to play a game solo, they play a single player RPG or something along those lines.
Solo players will still have a place in Xsyon. I agree that is a perfectly valid style of gameplay. I would not go so far as to say that MOST people were going to play Xsyon solo. That is simply not the case.
Where in Massively Multiplayer Online does it say cooperation. The game is massive, it has more then one player and is online. I really never understood why people seems to think MMO = Cooperation. I mean most games are created that way true, but the name MMO does in no way indicate this to the sligtest.
Beside that if your solo it does not mean you do not work with others. People might be interested in being a hunter and run around alone and go to tribes to sell there meat, skin or even refined stuff. They might even be mercenaries that take contracts that could include working with others. Solo simply means your your own boss and no tribe or leader decides where you go or stand. This does not mean your will not work together, but normally only if it suits you and helps your advance.
Also the person is complaining because the game is catering to solo player by giving them homesteads. So clearly the developers intent (A feature that was not planned as I remember asking for this feature a years ago and back then there where no plans to have things like homestreads) to caters to these type of players as well.
Now I do not understand why the person is complaining about this and what he means with impossible. Tribes can not steal land from your. They can surround your land, but never take any land from you. Also playing solo is supposed to be harder! If it was just as easy or even easier then everyone would do that. I myself am not sure what I am going to do, I would love to become a hunter and work together with some tribes to trade with.
The way the changes were described, a solo player out gathering could have been literally fenced out of their homestead area, or fenced into it, by a large enough tribe. However, I did express my concerns while asking for a refund, and the answer I got was that this would not be allowed. The griefer tribes want to do it, obviously, some have even stated it would be quite funny, but it seems the solo player isn't out just yet. We shall see.
However, if you are on the fence about buying, and you are a solo player, you better understand what you're getting into. For at least awhile, until more land and resources are available, your late start as a solo player will make it very, very difficult to get anywhere with any activity in the game, from building a home to crafting a weapon or armor that will make you viable in PvP. If you're fine with that, buy the game. Everything else about it is worth the money.
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~Albert Einstein
Meh, I suspect this is the player (sorry forgot name) that made the fuzz about fencing a homestead player on the OF forums. and got lauched hard at by Solo and tribe players due to the paranoid view on things.
In short, this player was scared that he/she could not claim a spot as a tribe would try to remove her by force/pestering/camping her zone and building walls around -his/her- spot.
In short this player was told this would be very hard to do if it was at all possible ( nobody knows atm) and basicly if a 30 man tribe wants a solo player gone out of the area they could away by just making sure that whenever the soloplayer leaves the save zone he/she would be killed giving no chance to progress.
Solo play is harder and more dangerus, you have to keep in mind that a group of people can always stop a single person form progressing if they realy wanted. solo play is a choice of a more dangerus game live.
Im a soloplayer in xsyon and will see how that fairs. i might join a tribe if I think that would be better for me in the long run but atm just having a blast .
Also anyone intrested in the game and then for the solo path.. solo play does not mean hermit play. you will need to interact whit people in order to have the best game experience. you can be a hermit..but things will be much much harder and only grow harder as the game grows.
As stated at least three times in this thread.... "Its gonna be harder for a solo player"!! obviously... It's supposed to be, thats why some choose it. That or their just casual players doing their thing here and there, not too concerned with the outcome. Bascially I think a solo player, or solo-er is supposed to be a bit more opportunistic in the sense that he takes what he can and if worst comes to worst, moves on and gets on with things. So what if you get fenced out or even if your house gets destroyed (I really hope they put this option in) the point is you still can get back on your feet with determination which is my key to solo-gaming.
BTW coman you said people can't invade your land or tribes land. I heard there will be a server where there are NO safezones; the one I intend to choose if I do purchase the game, where people can kill and steal from your land.
MoS resurecci
I just don't see why a solo player should be able to defend their land.
If it's a sandbox game isn't it what the players make of it? So if someone wants to be "solo" then shouldn't they find someplace away from others?
I'm all for being solo in any game as I mostly solo but in no way would I, as a solo player, expect to be able to compete equally with a group.
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They have decided on having only one server Devusin, just so you know.
"Hello everyone!
After sleeping (just a bit) on the two server decision and discussing this with the other programmers, I’ve decided that there will not be a server split."
http://www.xsyon.com/forum/showthread.php/1440-Xsyon-Updates
Things currenly change by the day haha, atm one server again..
Best bet / advice atm is to wait till confirmed release. things change so fast that even the hardcore fans aint knowing whats to come or not haha.
Still a heck of a game tho, just a very hard launch to be in.
I also don't see how this would negatively impact a solo player. In fact I find the bit about distinguishing between 5-9 player clans and 10+ player tribes promising.
For me being a solo player in an MMO doesn't mean you have to do everything by yourself. For me it means doing what you want to do without letting a clan/tribe dictate your activities. If you want more wood even though the rest of the tribe is mining iron then you go chop wood alone. If you want fish and the rest of the tribe also happens to be fishing then you fish together.
Since they're distinguishing between 10+ man groups and 5-9 man groups I'd say that's promising as 5-9 man groups are, I think, more likely to adopt a playstyle as described above where players do whatever they want and if they want the same thing then they go together, if not then alone.
I'd consider myself a solo player in that sense and I feel quite at home in 5-9 man groups. It's the 25+ groups that I hate to be in. And seeing as they're distinguishing between those types of groups then apperantly they're expecting a decent number of those groups to exist ( would be quite silly to make a change that only 2-3 tribes out there will notice. )
We are the bunny.
Resistance is futile.
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The second server isn't going to happen now, which is why resources are going to be so scarce for awhile. And land, too. I've been all over the map, and I have a lot of coordinates. A few days ago, I went back and checked on the most unlikely and undesirable locations, and every one of them was taken. Keep in mind, this is with another wipe incoming. Things really are getting pretty crowded.
Building fortifications (or the pointlessness of doing so as either a solo player or sub-tribe sized group) is something to think about for the future, since not all areas will likely be safe for homesteaders or tribes in some magic bubble of protection. And what is the point of walls if someone can terraform right up the sides of them?
But anyway, despite what some of the tribes seem to want in the way of griefing solo players and smaller groups of players, they're probably not going to be able to do it. I just wish someone had bothered to clarify that little point before I made this thread. It seemed important to me, since I didn't relish the idea of coming back from a day out hunting or gathering to discover I could not return to my homestead past the new fencing, nor did I relish the idea of logging in one day at my totem to discover some tribe had built a great big fence all around me.
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~Albert Einstein
Ok, well it wasn't too much of a big deal to me as I knew they might do it because of the starting off of things and trying to populate the xsyon land as much as possible. But I know this may, and probably will change in the near future, either when they expand the size of the map and probably add another server. Theres always time. Only issue I had was it getting too full of houses and tribal villages. But I doubt that would be a problem since it probably would be hard to start either of them up in the first place, or people not too interested in that part of the game as I might think.
Either way it isn't really a problem for the game since PVP and wars will still make the game fun and competitive.
Edit: Furthermore, the part about the forcing of war is a good point for fairness aswell as a bad point for competition. But like I said either way it will still be good since wars are nice but not always nice when you don't have a choice really. Making it more fun than competitive.
MoS resurecci
Now i'm getting a better understanding of your unsatisfaction, firstly although I know the game had a HUGE fan base, didn't think housing over crowding would be that much that even the far off, "middle-of-nowhere" regions would be largely populated although this isn't too much of a surprise.
The part about fortifications I gave a little thought but now can only assume will be advantageous when it comes to war and sieges, maybe.
And I didn't really understand what you mean't about fencing in until you made the statement in your final sentence. Maybe they will make a way to teleport or hate to say it but bind to another spawning area and you'll have to commit suicide
!
Other than that I think it would be a dumb idea of being trapped in your own homestead just because you were logged off. But still i'm sure there would be ways of terraforming/burrowing/breaking climbing out or over of walls of some sort. If not then that would be really lame.
MoS resurecci
Word I had is, this isn't going to be allowed, despite how amusing some of the big tribes would find it. While a large percentage of the game's population is beneath contempt (go figure, it's the internet!), the game is solid, and as long as the morons aren't allowed to grief everyone they perceive as being vulnerable with crazy game mechanics, we'll be fine. Mostly. But for those who didn't preorder, life really is going to be tough as a solo player, at least until more land is available.
I suppose it would be possible to join a tribe at first, skill up, gear up, then move out to solo after the new areas open up, for those who want to solo but have a little patience. Me, I'm really glad I preordered. Because I don't have that kind of patience.
I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.
~Albert Einstein