The only fix for crafting or any specific skill in mmo's is endless amounts of abilitlies that require ever increasing levels of grinding.
Example: so you've reached L999 Crafting Ships GJ!! Now you can begin working on the following specializations:
(Increased Ship Base Armor Level (0-999)) * (Special BOE Item) * (proc chance(based on specialization level)) = Congratz you've increased "X" ship with +2% Base Speed Bonus
Increased Ship Base Speed (0-999) "" "" "" "" = Congratz you've built "X" ship with 5% base speed bonus.
And have ex: 10 of these specializations - A Master Crafter will spend the time required to max them all. An adventurer doesn't care about leveling these things, they want the basics and to get back to killing mobs and finding loot, and will seek the services of the crafter for these services..
Make a % of Endgame items from raids etc... BOE and able to be re-manufactured only be the best of the best crafters.
Make things break and require professional repair.
Allow adventurers to sell patterns or original BOE items so they can be "learned".
I don't raid, but I do expect my quests and and explorations to drop upgrades to my current equipment. I like the instant gratification of being able to immediately put on that upgraded equipment. I'm not interested in an economic simulation either. If people want to trade, that's fine, but don't force me to. I want to get my get my rewards from adventuring, not other people. When crafting becomes a requirement in the loot reward system, I move on to a different game.
And that's where we diverge. I actually don't expect to get upgrades to equipment from drops or quests.
I mean, we are just coming from two different game backgrounds. I came from Lineage 2. You could go 10 levels and never see a drop. And these are lineage 2 levels, not "bang out 10 levels in a weekend" levels.
What was interesting was that we had dedicated and trusted crafters. They could even sell you mats if you needed. And they could be trusted so you could give them your mats and they would craft for you. They spent time building their reputation. They would then screen shot the result if it failed and send to you so you had a record of it failing.
The quests were more about character development for the most part so you weren't getting rewards. My "reward" came when I went to an area to hunt because I knew the recipe for a demon staff dropped with something like .000000000000283%
And I got it on the 3rd try. Still have to laugh about that.
This is not to say that I say "no" to quest rewards in games that are designed for them. But more often than not I buy from players and their wares are better than most of the quest drops.
I understand that, but what I don't understand is why people come to specific game's boards and complain about certain aspects of content when they never intended to implement those types of things in the first place. It's like some country music fan going to a rock concert and whining about why they don't play country music. If you want an economic simulation / crafting centric loot system, then haunt the games that currently include or intend to include that type of content.
Well, in part, that's where we agree.
I can understand a player getting caught up in a settign/art design and then putting forth their argument why there should be x and y.
However, if after a while the developers are clearly going for Z the I don't see the point of whining about it.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
I guess that in the end we all want a crafting/economics system like EVE, but the truth is that it won't happen. Games like WoW and SWTOR are made for the masses, they don't want complicated skill or craft systems.
SWTOR crafting system is complex, it isn't EVE but i isn't WoW either.
Can you please show me proof that TOR's crafting system is complex?
The last time I asked to be shown TOR's crafting system I was given a link to to the crew skills video and all it told me was "your companions can do it for you" which I don't consider a crafting system.
In SWTOR, you are forced into 1 crafting profession per character, with 2 sub professions, either gathering or crafting (or mission skills). This stimulates the need for other crafters, and other players in general, hence starting an economy.
i just want to clarify this. you aren't forced to have a crafting skill. you can choose to not take a craft and just take gathering or missions, and you can have any mix of them (i.e. 3 missions, or 2 gathering and 1 mission, ect.). however you are correct in that if you do want crafting skills you can only have 1 at a time.
You can have three gathering skills, or three mission skills, or one of each. Or two gathering and a craft. The only limit (right now) is you can only have one crafting skill, and you can only have three as a whole.
and just to add more thoughts on crafting in tor by damion:
Responding to MegaBubble on the fact that people can't be jack of all trade crafters, Damion Schubert explains why that is in greater detail:
To be more precise, players can have up to three crew skills but only one of those can be a crafting skill. The fictional reason is that you only can have room for one crafting table on your ship, but the real reason is that we don't want all players to be self-sufficient.
We call the system Crew Skills because they are skills possessed by your amorphous crew as a whole. If your crew can go treasure hunting, you can order any of your crew members to run treasure hunting missions. Vette may have a bonus to treasure hunting (being a native treasure hunter and all), but to be honest we currently have these bonuses set to be relatively mild - we don't want people to choose NOT to take their favorite companion out on the field with them because the economic bonus to keeping them on the ship is that much greater.
In a later response, Damion Schubert answers MorgonKara's question on whether Crew Skills are a permanent choice:
Are the three crew skills a permanent choice or can you experiment with different combinations and change them?
You can unlearn skills. If you relearn it later, you must progress it up again. (You will not lose your schematics for crafting skills, but they are inaccessible until you reach the proper skill level).
Damion Schubert explains a few more points BioWare's philosophy on Crew Skills:
So just to throw a couple more stray thoughts about our philosophy.
No, you the player cannot craft currently - which is to say you cannot choose to watch the progress bar fill up yourself. That being said, to us, watching a progress bar has always been the least interesting part of crafting in other MMOs. The part of being a crafter that is interesting to us is things like finding rare schematics, finding hard-to-find components, and the social game of finding customers and suppliers. We really wanted devoted crafters to be able to focus on these aspects of crafting, and not so much on the 'watch a progress bar go forward' part of things. Crafting should be a social thing - staring at a progress bar is not.
No, you don't see companions running missions out 'in the real world'. While I laugh at the idea of a stream of companion characters filing into the palace on Alderaan, it's unfeasible for a lot of reasons.
The real test of the value of crafting is less about whether companions or players are swinging the hammer and tongs, and more about how the itemization of crafting is balanced in a way that the gear is useful. Crafting is important to the systems team, and we're devoted to ensuring that crafted gear has a place in the economy, especially at the endgame, and doubly especially for the devoted crafters.
It's worth noting that we really want the system to support the casual crafter (the guy who is taking crafting largely to outfit himself while leveling up) and the devoted crafter (the guy who wants to be known as the best Armormech in the galaxy). Supporting the former means making the system accessible and easy. Supporting the latter means ensuring that hard work can allow you to provide goods and services that almost no one in the galaxy can. The systems design team is striving to satisfy both groups of people.
My own personal goal is that some crafters can get so good that players all over the server seek them out. My problem being a crafter in most other MMOs is that you tend to become a guild's pet at some point, and you're expected to do all of the work for free. We want those devoted crafters to be exceptional enough that they can actually demand a price, and that people will actually break out of the guild in order to pursue those goods and services. The system isn't there yet, but we have plans...
I guess that in the end we all want a crafting/economics system like EVE, but the truth is that it won't happen. Games like WoW and SWTOR are made for the masses, they don't want complicated skill or craft systems.
SWTOR crafting system is complex, it isn't EVE but i isn't WoW either.
Can you please show me proof that TOR's crafting system is complex?
The last time I asked to be shown TOR's crafting system I was given a link to to the crew skills video and all it told me was "your companions can do it for you" which I don't consider a crafting system.
Same.. where is all the information coming from that the crafting is so complex and in depth??
Crew Skills are BioWare’s implementation for harvesting and crafting in Star Wars™: The Old Republic™, but they’re really much more than that. From off-line crafting to diplomacy missions – not to mention companions who can do most of the work for you – this system is unlike any that you’ve seen in other MMORPGs.
Recently, Damion Schubert, Lead Systems Designer for Star Wars™: The Old Republic™ was nice enough to take some time for a little Crew Skills Q&A with Ask A Jedi to help expand our understanding of the system!
Ask A Jedi: How and when is the player first introduced to Crew Skills? Is it via narrative, or visiting a trainer at a certain level?
Damion Schubert: The Crew Skills trainers all like to hang out on the capital worlds, where the player can encounter them. Each trainer will give the player a description of the Crew Skill they teach, along with the benefits they provide, so the player knows which Crew Skills may be most beneficial to their play style.
Ask A Jedi: How are the various Crew Skills Missions obtained? For example, are they auto-populated? Found in the wild? NPC Trainer? All of the above?
Damion Schubert: Most Crew Skills missions are drawn from a random pool for the player to choose from, and that pool refreshes from time to time. However, some missions are unlocked by rare objects you might find in the world. These missions are one-off, but tend to offer more substantial rewards.
Time to get busy.
Ask A Jedi: Artifice is one of the revealed Crafting skills, and is mentioned as the production of Jedi and Sith artifacts. Is this Crafting skill available only to Force users? Are any other Crew Skills limited to certain classes?
Damion Schubert: Nope! There are no limits in that regard. It is the player’s call as to whether they want to choose a skill that might not be directly beneficial to their character.
Ask A Jedi: Will companion Crew Skill bonuses be unique per companion?
Damion Schubert: Each Companion has Crew Skills that are unique to that companion, designed to help create a little flavor for what that companion is all about. However, these benefits are fairly minor – we don’t want you to leave a companion on the ship that you’d really like to take out, just because they have a crafting bonus.
Ask A Jedi: Is there a risk to your companions while on Missions? Can they die? In other words, what are the downsides of sending a companion on a mission?
Damion Schubert: They don’t die but they can fail, which means that the player will lose his initial capital investment (i.e. his credits and time spent). It is up to the player to decide if he wants to play it safe with his companion missions, or go for higher risk, higher reward missions. We have some ideas on how to expand this in the future.
Diplomatic Missions
Ask A Jedi: Are there mechanics in place that allow for crafting an item of better “quality” from the same recipe? For example, with additional or more rare materials?
Damion Schubert: Yes and at the same time, no – but we’re not ready to spill the beans yet on what that means, sorry! Trust me when I say we still have a few surprises to spring on the crafting community, once we prove the features are fun in the Game Testing Program.
Editor’s Note: We would like to help you prove those things in the Game Testing Program
Ask A Jedi: When gathering with your player character or with your active companion, do you physically need to take the resources back to your ship in order to use them in crafting? Does the ship have a “stock room” to hold these items for crafting?
Damion Schubert: Currently, items craft from and drop to your inventory. This may change based on feedback from Game Testing and as we iterate on the system, though.
Ask A Jedi: Another concern regarding missions that might award dark or light side points is that it trivializes the morality system, essentially allowing you to “grind morality.” How is this system intended to work?
Damion Schubert: The system is less designed to allow you to ‘grind’ morality than it is to allow you to correct some bad decisions – which is fairly vital in an MMORPG, where you have no reload button. It would take a pretty hefty time and cash investment to use this system to ‘grind’ morality.
Ah, the spoils.
Ask A Jedi: When sending companions out on missions, can you send them to locations you haven?t been yet? Or bring back materials you?ve never found yourself before?
Damion Schubert: Yes and yes. In fact, one of the key benefits of the missions system is to find rare crafting materials that aren’t ‘drops’ elsewhere in the world, usually used for making very high quality items.
Ask A Jedi: In the context of master crafters, “dedication” is cited as the avenue to achieve this status. Is it “time” that will allow you to become this elite crafter, or will there be rare resources, quests, raids (pve or pvp) or other activities that you need to do in order to achieve this status?
Damion Schubert: We want our top crafters to progress and get to be the best in their field by doing things that crafters like to do: research, gather very rare materials, and interact with other players as customers or resource suppliers. We’re not a big fan of ‘you can be the best there is by staring at progress bars’, if for no other reason than then there is no way for great craftsmen to differentiate themselves from a casual craftsman with a lot of free time.
As for the other activities, we have some things we’ll be talking about eventually, but the general gist is that we want there to be a symbiotic relationship. We want top-end raiders and PvPers to need crafters, but we want the crafters to need them in return. And we’re trying to keep away from making anyone play a game they don’t want to play. We want crafters to be primarily playing a social game, not spending hours doing stuff they don’t want to do.
Ask A Jedi: It?s been stated (by you in fact, on the forums,) that Crew Skills will not be the method players use for creating light sabers. Will there be an equivalent non-crafting “weapon” system for non-Force users?
Damion Schubert: Guns and vibroblades are made via a Crew Skill. However, they are also ripe for… well, let’s just call it tinkering for now, and promise to tell you more at some point.
You guys keep working while I'm at dinner.
Ask A Jedi: With so much of this activity centralized on your ship, what is being done to assure that player hubs/cities are still filled with players, making them feel vibrant and alive?
Damion Schubert: Just because the activity is happening on your ship doesn’t mean that the player has to be there – he can direct his companion characters on his ship to craft while he is out adventuring, exploring, or socializing in the cities. We anticipate most of our hardcore crafters will actually spend most of their time in the cities, where they can reach their customer base, engage in person to person transactions, or put their items up for sale – but then that’s another feature discussion for another day.
We just wanted to say thanks again to Damion for taking the time to answer these questions for our readers, and we cannot wait to hear more about the Crew Skills system in Star Wars™: The Old Republic™.
That shows nothing of how crafting is complex. Basically all it told me was that crafted gear would be viable (which it better be seeing as TOR is just another gear>skill game) and some companions would be better at crafting some things than other.
That shows nothing of how crafting is complex. Basically all it told me was that crafted gear would be viable (which it better be seeing as TOR is just another gear>skill game) and some companions would be better at crafting some things than other.
i was in no way providing it to say its complex. i honestly cant say how easy or complex it will be. i'm just trying to provide information on what has been said regarding the crew skills system because many people seem uniformed about it.
I guess that in the end we all want a crafting/economics system like EVE, but the truth is that it won't happen. Games like WoW and SWTOR are made for the masses, they don't want complicated skill or craft systems.
SWTOR crafting system is complex, it isn't EVE but i isn't WoW either.
Can you please show me proof that TOR's crafting system is complex?
The last time I asked to be shown TOR's crafting system I was given a link to to the crew skills video and all it told me was "your companions can do it for you" which I don't consider a crafting system.
Same.. where is all the information coming from that the crafting is so complex and in depth??
If you want to take crafting seriously it will be much more complex than simply getting your companions to do it all for you.
I guess that in the end we all want a crafting/economics system like EVE, but the truth is that it won't happen. Games like WoW and SWTOR are made for the masses, they don't want complicated skill or craft systems.
SWTOR crafting system is complex, it isn't EVE but i isn't WoW either.
Can you please show me proof that TOR's crafting system is complex?
The last time I asked to be shown TOR's crafting system I was given a link to to the crew skills video and all it told me was "your companions can do it for you" which I don't consider a crafting system.
Same.. where is all the information coming from that the crafting is so complex and in depth??
If you want to take crafting seriously it will be much more complex than simply getting your companions to do it all for you.
I am looking forward to this game but I would like to see a deep crafting system. I am not sure if the planned one will be that deep but I am willing to give it the benefit of the doubt. IMO, a good game economy can only be created where crafting trumps all. The best items should be made by someone and be difficult to make. They will also be expensive. Why bother with crafting at all if animals are dropping swords or in this case light sabers that are better than can be made by players?. I really hope Bioware at least eliminates that piece of stupidity in MMOs.
That shows nothing of how crafting is complex. Basically all it told me was that crafted gear would be viable (which it better be seeing as TOR is just another gear>skill game) and some companions would be better at crafting some things than other.
They haven't showed enough of crafting to say whether it's complex or not. People claiming it is is just wishful thinking at this point, but then again what you might consider complex might not be the same as what others might percieve as complex.
This is everything we know crafting so far.
Apologise if the post is too long just thought everyone should know the facts.
The perception of many that social aspects like crafting and banking are limited only to your ship is wrong. There are a very small number of things that are ship based only activities. -Bioware
Quote: A crafting bench isn't just on your ship, but also in various areas on Tython - Darth Hater
Currently any crafted items/resources just get placed in your standard inventory - AskAJedi
Only Jedi/Sith craft Ligtsabers, not the companions - Bioware
Quote Daniel: The general approach is that once you learn a recipe, you know it. There may be exceptions - Darth Hater
Some resources may be only available on certain planets - Darth Hater
Quote Daniel: The part that is not terribly exciting is standing in one spot and watching a progress bar over and over and over again. And that's literally all that we removed - Massively
If you are either a Solo'er or in a large guild you can become a top Master Crafter, but of course the person in the large guild has a lot of help - Massively
Crafting is based on time invested more than XP level. Do not expect to decide to become a Master Crafter over a weekend, it will not happen - Torocast
Master Crafters will be able to craft some of the best items in game - Torocast
Some recipes will be limited per server to make them rare - Torocast
You will be able to brand your crafted items so people know who made it. - Torocast
Quote: "No, you the player cannot craft currently - which is to say you cannot choose to watch the progress bar fill up yourself". You tell your companions to do it and they will - Dev Comment
Quote from Damion: "It's worth noting that we really want the system to support the casual crafter (the guy who is taking crafting largely to outfit himself while levelling up) and the devoted crafter (the guy who wants to be known as the best Armormech in the galaxy)" - Dev Comment
You, via your crew skills, can have a maximum of three skills only one of which can be crafting. So you could have a mission skill, gathering and crafting or two gathering and one crafting etc - Dev Comment
If you wish to do the harvesting/gathering yourself you can. Its not limited to your companions - Crafting Video
The skills your companions will have will be split into three groups: Gathering, Crafting, and Missions. - Darth Hater
Crafting missons can take between 5mins to 24hrs long there is a cost to do each misson. - ChronicReload
Quote: I will just say there are some mechanics to it that will allow players who are more involved in crafting to really get deeply involved in crafting and be appropriately rewarded for it." - Darth Hater
Quote Blaine: It doesn't make sense for Darth Vader to skin womp rats for a new pair of boots in between conquering worlds "You are the hero," says Christine. "You make your crew work for you." - Gamespot
Crafting in TOR will use a Crew, Companion, Skill crafting system. Using their ship as a base of operations, players will be able to send their companions on crafting tasks - Darth Hater
All crew skill trainers are available at the Capital worlds. - AskAJedi
The majority of crew skill missions are accessed from a pool of random missions but some are unlocked when you find rare items which give better rewards. - AskAJedi
There are no limitations on what class does what type of crafting - AskAJedi
Each companion has a minor crafting skill bonus based on their background, but its not enough to warrant you leaving them only to do crafting - AskAJedi
Companions can not die while on Crafting missions but they can fail. If it fails the lost incured is the credits it cost you to send your companion on the mission - AskAJedi
For a companion to go on a resource collection mission you the player do not have to visit the area first. - AskAJedi
Quote: We want crafters to be primarily playing a social game, not spending hours doing stuff they don’t want to do - AskAJedi
If you found two gathering nodes near each other you could harvest one and your companion could do the other at the same time - Darth Hater
Your crew does not have skills themselves. The crew skills they can use are based on the crafting skills your main character has. - Darth Hater
The maximum number of crew that can perform any crafting skill, at one time, is 5. Any others spare could be doing missons, gathering or travelling with the main character - Darth Hater
Certain companions will be better at some crafting group than others, for example Vette, a pirate and companion to the Sith Warrior, will excel at Treasure Hunting. - Darth Hater
Your companions can also be given missions on the fly, and even while players are away from their ship. They can also operate while your offline - Darth Hater
Only companions you have left on board your ship can perform any crafting actions. The ones you group with to fight etc can only perform gathering tasks - Darth Hater
While out adventuring if you see a crafting node instead of player character going to mine it you can send your companion to do it for you - Darth Hater
Quote: Currently, you can recall your companion at any time from a mission. You lose any progress he has made, as well as any upfront costs, but he returns immediately - Bioware
Quote: You can also have a companion stop crafting an item at any time. In that case, you lose no materials (but all progress will be lost). - Bioware
Quote: Players who choose Armstech as their crafting skill will be able to create a wide range of blaster pistols, blaster rifles, sniper rifles, and assault cannons. - Bioware
Quote: Players can issue crafting orders to up to five companions at a time, and each companion can add up to five crafting tasks to their queue. - Bioware
Quote: Companions with high affection will have their ability to perform crafting tasks greatly improved. For example, a companion with high affection can craft items faster - Bioware
Quote: "Though companions are vital to The Old Republic and the Crew Skills system, we do know that some players want to be the primary crafter for all their crafted items", "It is worth noting players will definitely need to be directly involved in the process when learning rare schematics - Bioware
The following crafting types are the ones revealed so far:
Gathering Skills include:
Bioanalysis – The practice of collecting genetic material from creatures and plants
Scavenging – The art of recovering useful materials and parts from old or damaged technology
Slicing – A skill in accessing secured computer systems and lockboxes to acquire valuable data and rare schematics
Crafting Skills include:
Armormech – the ability to work with hard metals and electronic shielding to construct all types of personal armor
Armstech - Armstech is the ability to work with hard metals, alloys, and synthetic materials to craft blasters.
There are three quality levels for crafted blasters:
Quality - Crafting Requirements Premium Gathered resources and common items sold on vendors
Prototype - Rare gathered resources and other valuable items
Artifact - Rare resources (gathered or otherwise) and other valuable items – possibly acquired from other players.
Artifice is not limited to just Force users - AskAJedi
Artifice – the delicate work of constructing Jedi and Sith artifacts
Biochem – The engineering of performance-enhancing chemical serums and biological implants
Mission Skills include:
Diplomacy – The art of conducting and managing negotiations
Treasure Hunting – The ability to track down and recover valuable items by investigating a series of clues.
Quote Richard Vogel: It will not be to the extent of some of the games out there, like [Star Wars] Galaxies. It will be very similar to what WoW has. - Massively
Quote: We are going to have crafting, because that's a big part of MMOs. We're going to implement crafting in a way that 'feels' right for Star Wars. - Massively
Quote: We’ve spent quite a bit of time discussing how to ensure that crafters – true dedicated crafters – can make a name for themselves and be important in their community. - Developer Blog
Quote James Ohlen:... And plus the fact that you can get “critical hits” on crafting items so you can actually craft an item that is as good as you can get in a raid. http://www.askajedi.com/2011/03/14/p...h-james-ohlen/
If the above is true then.. I the Op take backWhat I said.. I have been hard pressed to find that type of information you posted.. So I am a little more comfortable in seeing what they are putting together.. fingers crossed..
I wonder if they will bring back the Creature Handler.. That would be Awesome.. no?
Sorry if I missed it, didnt read the whole thread. Does anyone know the name of the person or persons who designed SWTOR's crafting system?
as lead systems designer, i believe damion schubert is in charge of it but he and other des have said that they kick these ideas around and get input from the whole team, not just his people.
Originally posted by Solestran I don't care for crafting, but I have to wonder why you crafting types keep crying about adventure games that don't focus more on crafting? Why not play games like Ryzom, A Tale in the Desert, Istaria, Eve, FFXIV and so forth that are essentially crafting simulators with adventuring on the side. You do realize that crafting and adventuring are competing game styles? In order to make crafting meaningful, you have to reduce or even eliminate adventuring rewards and incentives to favor those of crafting products and components. Not exactly fun for the adventurer, don't you think.
Stop haunting adventure games to push your crafting agenda and just play a damn crafting game already.
Its sad that people dont even know what a good mmorpg is supposed to be like. Crafting,combat,adventure,and roleplay all need to compliment each other and have equal weight and depth in an mmo. That is a sign of a well made game. All types of gamers coming together and participating in a unique world in their own way.
Unfortunately mmos arent made like that very often. We get crafting systems for players who prefer combat. This is the sad state of games like wow, rift, and even the exalted gw2. Tor's approach is interesting, but it is still not enough. Id like to see more games like precu where the crafting classes outnumbered the combat classes. Youd be suprised what it can do to your mmo. it plays a huge role in creating a living, breathing world.
unless of course you just want beat em ups online and make everything else an afterthought. in which case id say to you quit haunting my mmorpgs. Go back to halo or gow or whatever arcade style genre you came from.
theres one simple truth that we all should "embrace"...
crafting is boring for most of people
if the only way to get "endgame" gear is to spend hours running around some forsaken by gods planets, or pay a month of "daily quests" to a guy who will do it for us... game will go "nishe" and never after initial lounch will reach even 1mln subs...
thats not something EA will want
we already heard that crafted items will go "in pair" with gear from raiding and PVP, i can asure U SWG vets crying for crafting, that if PVP and raiding will give people gear at same ilvl than "dedicated" crafting, than 99% of players will go for PVP/raiding, and U will be the only ones doing "endgame crafting", so U willbe "special"... in a way
for now, crafting system is "ready"... only people in beta can change something in it now, by giving feedback,
crying on other than official forums is just a rant
Be Who You Are and Say What You Feel Because Those Who Mind Don't Matter and Those Who Matter Don't Mind. Dr.Seuss
theres one simple truth that we all should "embrace"...
crafting is boring for most of people
if the only way to get "endgame" gear is to spend hours running around some forsaken by gods planets, or pay a month of "daily quests" to a guy who will do it for us... game will go "nishe" and never after initial lounch will reach even 1mln subs...
thats not something EA will want
we already heard that crafted items will go "in pair" with gear from raiding and PVP, i can asure U SWG vets crying for crafting, that if PVP and raiding will give people gear at same ilvl than "dedicated" crafting, than 99% of players will go for PVP/raiding, and U will be the only ones doing "endgame crafting", so U willbe "special"... in a way
for now, crafting system is "ready"... only people in beta can change something in it now, by giving feedback,
crying on other than official forums is just a rant
I think TOR's crafting system sounds great. It was way beyond my expectations. Hope it plays out as well as it sounds.
However,
Are you saying if the exact same item could be gained through raiding pvp or crafting, 99% of people would raid or pvp grind for it? I don't think so. 99% would buy it of the auction house, but i assume you meant craft it themselves. Still thats rediculous. Or were you just exagerating?
Anyway, I like SWTOR's crafting the way it is, from what i read. It should be interesting to see how they balance the tears from each group claiming their gear should be better or "on par" with the others. Maybe it wont matter the way they've done it. That would be cool if they managed that.
i wonder how much of a difference gear stats will make anyway. Some games you cant even notice a difference. Others it dictates your worth.
See you in the dream.. The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
If the above is true then.. I the Op take backWhat I said.. I have been hard pressed to find that type of information you posted.. So I am a little more comfortable in seeing what they are putting together.. fingers crossed..
I wonder if they will bring back the Creature Handler.. That would be Awesome.. no?
It would be cool if they had something like that but I'm not sure they will. I myself never had the patience for that profession but it was cool watching players running and training their pets in SWG.
Like the majority, I voted for the way TOR is doing it now. I understand that some folks like the old ways, but I'm glad that we're getting something different. It seems to me the devs get it on what does and doesn't work when it comes to crafting and economies. I look forward to doing what I did in SWG; gather important resources and sell them to dedicated crafters.
On a side note,I'm curious how important those jedi/sith artifacts will be on the market.
Im honestly intrigued by the crafting system of this game. As a major resource broker/crafter though I have to ask the question of whether or not the economy is going to mainly player or AI driven? I haven't really seen too much discussion as to this and I was wondering if I'd simply missed a scrap of information or if it's just not something that has really been discussed yet.
Im honestly intrigued by the crafting system of this game. As a major resource broker/crafter though I have to ask the question of whether or not the economy is going to mainly player or AI driven? I haven't really seen too much discussion as to this and I was wondering if I'd simply missed a scrap of information or if it's just not something that has really been discussed yet.
Well...that entirely depends on what you mean by AI driven. If i'm mistaken feel free to let me know and i'll try and help out.
Ok with that aside here is how crafting goes (based on the information we have)
When you start out in your adventures you are alone (meaning no companions)
If you want to start crafting your going to have to find a craftting trainer (this is the guy, girl or alien that gives you your crafting skill aka armortech, slicing, Diplomacy that sort of thing)
You'll most likely have to get off the starter planet to do that. In which case you'll have a companion then.
Now that you have your crafting skills (known in swtor as crew skills) you can go out and start gathering mats from resources nodes (you remember this from EQ2 if you've played that). You also need schematifcs or plans or whatever it is they call them in this game, it's the item that tells you what your making.
Now the thing that is different from other games is that you have to click on the resource node and watch this fill
<0%---------50%----------100%>
Everytime you get a node.
This time around though you can have your companion do it while you fight off a mob OR you can do the above and have your companion watch for hostiles.
Also if your feeling particularly lazy you can send your companion out to get supplies for you, though this is likely to be more expensive then if you did this manually, but if your missing one candle (for example not literally) and thats half way across the planet, then you can send your companion to go and grab it for a fee. Not sure if theres a chance you can fail at gathering resources.
Now that you have the mats and the plans to do the job you assign crew members to make the item (depending on loyalty and how many are on it plus their expertise at it will depend on quality). Remember those you assign to a job can not be taken with you in the world.
Once they are assigned to it, it will take a certain amount of time (i would gather the better the item the longer it takes, as that seems to be the trend) to make the item, as it's both skill based (as in you need a certain amount of crafting skill to start it) and timed based (like Fallen earth did, you will make this item in X amount of hours and mins)
However you don't need to be present during the crafting part so you can be out hunting or talking to friends, pvping or even sleeping/working.
Once the item is done, the companions will give you the item they made (again quality of the item is based on several factors) then you place that up on the auction house. Wait for it to be bought by another player and you get your money in return. You could also just vendor trash it if you want, but who does that to good items? or do it the old fashion way and meet up with the other character and trade the item if you wish to do it that way. Think they stated there wouldn't be vendor stalls though as that would clutter the areas.
If you've played fallen earth and done crafting there you get the general idea, it's the same type of thing except a few tweaks, like your not really doing the crafting but your skills do affect what types of items you can have your crew make. Plus instead of it just being based on your crafting skills you have to figure out which of your companions have the best skill make up to make the item the best it can be. You don't have to go out and find every bit of materials (though in fallen earth you did the crafting on your character so it was okay there.) Obviously the more lazy you are about gathering stuff the more expensive it will be. So a decent crafter will gather stuff as they see it, take it all back to the ship, purchase from auction house or have their crew run for stuff they don't have and make the items they want when they have the spare time.
Good crafters, will figure out where the good resource nodes are, get some of the really good plans, figure out which crew members work good with each plan and craft that way.
While some of the best crafters (and this is by no means a walkthrough to elite crafting) Will figure out where the best nodes for what they want to make are. Get the companions to like them the most for the type of items they will be making, work the auction house so they can buy items cheap, get people to gather mats for them at a reduced cost to them. Then send those companions do to the job and get the best quality items possible. Then throw those up on the auction house for lots of money. So they can do it all over again.
To finally answer your question if i understand it right. While the actual crafting process itself is AI driven, the gather (unless you send a companion to get mats), the selling, and other such things are completely player driven. Its set up so you don't HAVE to interact with other players directly (ie you can go to the auction house), but it doesn't limit you from doing it if you wish. That doesn't mean you can make every item on your own, no you will need to buy stuff from others such as you may need one from scavenging but because you took up slicing you don't have it. Or vice versa they may have something from slicing that a artifce might need and they can trade with them to get more money to fuel their armortech.
Some random things here: they stated you can get some interesting stuff being casual, but some of the rarest stuff requires you to be working almost solely on that.
They also stated that there are three ways to get end-game gear
One is through raiding (if you've played a lot of MMOs you know precisely how this one works)
Second one is through PvP (most likely tokens recieved for a job well done can be turned in to the vendor for goodies)
and finally the third one is through crafting. Yes thats right you can get end game gear simply by crafting
They also stated that crafters and raiders would need each other. I'd imagine this breaks down to (though i could be wrong) that crafters will need the raiders to get the rare blueprints from raids and the raiders will need the crafters for making that hard to make stuff.
Again if i'm mistakening what you mean by AI controlled let me know, but from what i've seen of the crafting that is what it looks like to me.
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Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
That shows nothing of how crafting is complex. Basically all it told me was that crafted gear would be viable (which it better be seeing as TOR is just another gear>skill game) and some companions would be better at crafting some things than other.
They haven't showed enough of crafting to say whether it's complex or not. People claiming it is is just wishful thinking at this point, but then again what you might consider complex might not be the same as what others might percieve as complex.
This is everything we know crafting so far.
Apologise if the post is too long just thought everyone should know the facts.
The perception of many that social aspects like crafting and banking are limited only to your ship is wrong. There are a very small number of things that are ship based only activities. -Bioware
Quote: A crafting bench isn't just on your ship, but also in various areas on Tython - Darth Hater
Currently any crafted items/resources just get placed in your standard inventory - AskAJedi
Only Jedi/Sith craft Ligtsabers, not the companions - Bioware
Quote Daniel: The general approach is that once you learn a recipe, you know it. There may be exceptions - Darth Hater
Some resources may be only available on certain planets - Darth Hater
Quote Daniel: The part that is not terribly exciting is standing in one spot and watching a progress bar over and over and over again. And that's literally all that we removed - Massively
If you are either a Solo'er or in a large guild you can become a top Master Crafter, but of course the person in the large guild has a lot of help - Massively
Crafting is based on time invested more than XP level. Do not expect to decide to become a Master Crafter over a weekend, it will not happen - Torocast
Master Crafters will be able to craft some of the best items in game - Torocast
Some recipes will be limited per server to make them rare - Torocast
You will be able to brand your crafted items so people know who made it. - Torocast
Quote: "No, you the player cannot craft currently - which is to say you cannot choose to watch the progress bar fill up yourself". You tell your companions to do it and they will - Dev Comment
Quote from Damion: "It's worth noting that we really want the system to support the casual crafter (the guy who is taking crafting largely to outfit himself while levelling up) and the devoted crafter (the guy who wants to be known as the best Armormech in the galaxy)" - Dev Comment
You, via your crew skills, can have a maximum of three skills only one of which can be crafting. So you could have a mission skill, gathering and crafting or two gathering and one crafting etc - Dev Comment
If you wish to do the harvesting/gathering yourself you can. Its not limited to your companions - Crafting Video
The skills your companions will have will be split into three groups: Gathering, Crafting, and Missions. - Darth Hater
Crafting missons can take between 5mins to 24hrs long there is a cost to do each misson. - ChronicReload
Quote: I will just say there are some mechanics to it that will allow players who are more involved in crafting to really get deeply involved in crafting and be appropriately rewarded for it." - Darth Hater
Quote Blaine: It doesn't make sense for Darth Vader to skin womp rats for a new pair of boots in between conquering worlds "You are the hero," says Christine. "You make your crew work for you." - Gamespot
Crafting in TOR will use a Crew, Companion, Skill crafting system. Using their ship as a base of operations, players will be able to send their companions on crafting tasks - Darth Hater
All crew skill trainers are available at the Capital worlds. - AskAJedi
The majority of crew skill missions are accessed from a pool of random missions but some are unlocked when you find rare items which give better rewards. - AskAJedi
There are no limitations on what class does what type of crafting - AskAJedi
Each companion has a minor crafting skill bonus based on their background, but its not enough to warrant you leaving them only to do crafting - AskAJedi
Companions can not die while on Crafting missions but they can fail. If it fails the lost incured is the credits it cost you to send your companion on the mission - AskAJedi
For a companion to go on a resource collection mission you the player do not have to visit the area first. - AskAJedi
Quote: We want crafters to be primarily playing a social game, not spending hours doing stuff they don’t want to do - AskAJedi
If you found two gathering nodes near each other you could harvest one and your companion could do the other at the same time - Darth Hater
Your crew does not have skills themselves. The crew skills they can use are based on the crafting skills your main character has. - Darth Hater
The maximum number of crew that can perform any crafting skill, at one time, is 5. Any others spare could be doing missons, gathering or travelling with the main character - Darth Hater
Certain companions will be better at some crafting group than others, for example Vette, a pirate and companion to the Sith Warrior, will excel at Treasure Hunting. - Darth Hater
Your companions can also be given missions on the fly, and even while players are away from their ship. They can also operate while your offline - Darth Hater
Only companions you have left on board your ship can perform any crafting actions. The ones you group with to fight etc can only perform gathering tasks - Darth Hater
While out adventuring if you see a crafting node instead of player character going to mine it you can send your companion to do it for you - Darth Hater
Quote: Currently, you can recall your companion at any time from a mission. You lose any progress he has made, as well as any upfront costs, but he returns immediately - Bioware
Quote: You can also have a companion stop crafting an item at any time. In that case, you lose no materials (but all progress will be lost). - Bioware
Quote: Players who choose Armstech as their crafting skill will be able to create a wide range of blaster pistols, blaster rifles, sniper rifles, and assault cannons. - Bioware
Quote: Players can issue crafting orders to up to five companions at a time, and each companion can add up to five crafting tasks to their queue. - Bioware
Quote: Companions with high affection will have their ability to perform crafting tasks greatly improved. For example, a companion with high affection can craft items faster - Bioware
Quote: "Though companions are vital to The Old Republic and the Crew Skills system, we do know that some players want to be the primary crafter for all their crafted items", "It is worth noting players will definitely need to be directly involved in the process when learning rare schematics - Bioware
The following crafting types are the ones revealed so far:
Gathering Skills include:
Bioanalysis – The practice of collecting genetic material from creatures and plants
Scavenging – The art of recovering useful materials and parts from old or damaged technology
Slicing – A skill in accessing secured computer systems and lockboxes to acquire valuable data and rare schematics
Crafting Skills include:
Armormech – the ability to work with hard metals and electronic shielding to construct all types of personal armor
Armstech - Armstech is the ability to work with hard metals, alloys, and synthetic materials to craft blasters.
There are three quality levels for crafted blasters:
Quality - Crafting Requirements Premium Gathered resources and common items sold on vendors
Prototype - Rare gathered resources and other valuable items
Artifact - Rare resources (gathered or otherwise) and other valuable items – possibly acquired from other players.
Artifice is not limited to just Force users - AskAJedi
Artifice – the delicate work of constructing Jedi and Sith artifacts
Biochem – The engineering of performance-enhancing chemical serums and biological implants
Mission Skills include:
Diplomacy – The art of conducting and managing negotiations
Treasure Hunting – The ability to track down and recover valuable items by investigating a series of clues.
Quote Richard Vogel: It will not be to the extent of some of the games out there, like [Star Wars] Galaxies. It will be very similar to what WoW has. - Massively
Quote: We are going to have crafting, because that's a big part of MMOs. We're going to implement crafting in a way that 'feels' right for Star Wars. - Massively
Quote: We’ve spent quite a bit of time discussing how to ensure that crafters – true dedicated crafters – can make a name for themselves and be important in their community. - Developer Blog
Quote James Ohlen:... And plus the fact that you can get “critical hits” on crafting items so you can actually craft an item that is as good as you can get in a raid. http://www.askajedi.com/2011/03/14/p...h-james-ohlen/
Hendo, Very nice post is this stickyed anywhere it's the best crafting summary I have seen.
________________________________________________________ Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
Comments
The only fix for crafting or any specific skill in mmo's is endless amounts of abilitlies that require ever increasing levels of grinding.
Example: so you've reached L999 Crafting Ships GJ!! Now you can begin working on the following specializations:
(Increased Ship Base Armor Level (0-999)) * (Special BOE Item) * (proc chance(based on specialization level)) = Congratz you've increased "X" ship with +2% Base Speed Bonus
Increased Ship Base Speed (0-999) "" "" "" "" = Congratz you've built "X" ship with 5% base speed bonus.
And have ex: 10 of these specializations - A Master Crafter will spend the time required to max them all. An adventurer doesn't care about leveling these things, they want the basics and to get back to killing mobs and finding loot, and will seek the services of the crafter for these services..
Make a % of Endgame items from raids etc... BOE and able to be re-manufactured only be the best of the best crafters.
Make things break and require professional repair.
Allow adventurers to sell patterns or original BOE items so they can be "learned".
Thats all.
You Scratch my back, And I'll scratch yours.
Shouldn't the thread be titles Lazy Gathering.
Who is to say that the crafting will not be fun.
________________________________________________________
Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
Well, in part, that's where we agree.
I can understand a player getting caught up in a settign/art design and then putting forth their argument why there should be x and y.
However, if after a while the developers are clearly going for Z the I don't see the point of whining about it.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Can you please show me proof that TOR's crafting system is complex?
The last time I asked to be shown TOR's crafting system I was given a link to to the crew skills video and all it told me was "your companions can do it for you" which I don't consider a crafting system.
i just want to clarify this. you aren't forced to have a crafting skill. you can choose to not take a craft and just take gathering or missions, and you can have any mix of them (i.e. 3 missions, or 2 gathering and 1 mission, ect.). however you are correct in that if you do want crafting skills you can only have 1 at a time.
edit: for my source
Damion Schubert expounds further in the thread:
Damion Schubert said:
You can have three gathering skills, or three mission skills, or one of each. Or two gathering and a craft. The only limit (right now) is you can only have one crafting skill, and you can only have three as a whole.
and just to add more thoughts on crafting in tor by damion:
Responding to MegaBubble on the fact that people can't be jack of all trade crafters, Damion Schubert explains why that is in greater detail:Damion Schubert said:
To be more precise, players can have up to three crew skills but only one of those can be a crafting skill. The fictional reason is that you only can have room for one crafting table on your ship, but the real reason is that we don't want all players to be self-sufficient.
We call the system Crew Skills because they are skills possessed by your amorphous crew as a whole. If your crew can go treasure hunting, you can order any of your crew members to run treasure hunting missions. Vette may have a bonus to treasure hunting (being a native treasure hunter and all), but to be honest we currently have these bonuses set to be relatively mild - we don't want people to choose NOT to take their favorite companion out on the field with them because the economic bonus to keeping them on the ship is that much greater.
In a later response, Damion Schubert answers MorgonKara's question on whether Crew Skills are a permanent choice:Damion Schubert said:
Originally Posted by MorgonKara
Are the three crew skills a permanent choice or can you experiment with different combinations and change them?
You can unlearn skills. If you relearn it later, you must progress it up again. (You will not lose your schematics for crafting skills, but they are inaccessible until you reach the proper skill level).
Damion Schubert explains a few more points BioWare's philosophy on Crew Skills:
Damion Schubert said:
So just to throw a couple more stray thoughts about our philosophy.
No, you the player cannot craft currently - which is to say you cannot choose to watch the progress bar fill up yourself. That being said, to us, watching a progress bar has always been the least interesting part of crafting in other MMOs. The part of being a crafter that is interesting to us is things like finding rare schematics, finding hard-to-find components, and the social game of finding customers and suppliers. We really wanted devoted crafters to be able to focus on these aspects of crafting, and not so much on the 'watch a progress bar go forward' part of things. Crafting should be a social thing - staring at a progress bar is not.
No, you don't see companions running missions out 'in the real world'. While I laugh at the idea of a stream of companion characters filing into the palace on Alderaan, it's unfeasible for a lot of reasons.
The real test of the value of crafting is less about whether companions or players are swinging the hammer and tongs, and more about how the itemization of crafting is balanced in a way that the gear is useful. Crafting is important to the systems team, and we're devoted to ensuring that crafted gear has a place in the economy, especially at the endgame, and doubly especially for the devoted crafters.
It's worth noting that we really want the system to support the casual crafter (the guy who is taking crafting largely to outfit himself while leveling up) and the devoted crafter (the guy who wants to be known as the best Armormech in the galaxy). Supporting the former means making the system accessible and easy. Supporting the latter means ensuring that hard work can allow you to provide goods and services that almost no one in the galaxy can. The systems design team is striving to satisfy both groups of people.
My own personal goal is that some crafters can get so good that players all over the server seek them out. My problem being a crafter in most other MMOs is that you tend to become a guild's pet at some point, and you're expected to do all of the work for free. We want those devoted crafters to be exceptional enough that they can actually demand a price, and that people will actually break out of the guild in order to pursue those goods and services. The system isn't there yet, but we have plans...
from one of darth haters devtracker highlight posts http://darthhater.com/2010/11/15/devtracker-highlights-for-the-week-of-november-15-2010/
Same.. where is all the information coming from that the crafting is so complex and in depth??
and here is a interview with damion schubert about crew skills from askajedi:
Crew Skills Q&A With Damion Schubert
Crew Skills are BioWare’s implementation for harvesting and crafting in Star Wars™: The Old Republic™, but they’re really much more than that. From off-line crafting to diplomacy missions – not to mention companions who can do most of the work for you – this system is unlike any that you’ve seen in other MMORPGs.
Recently, Damion Schubert, Lead Systems Designer for Star Wars™: The Old Republic™ was nice enough to take some time for a little Crew Skills Q&A with Ask A Jedi to help expand our understanding of the system!
Ask A Jedi: How and when is the player first introduced to Crew Skills? Is it via narrative, or visiting a trainer at a certain level?
Ask A Jedi: How are the various Crew Skills Missions obtained? For example, are they auto-populated? Found in the wild? NPC Trainer? All of the above?
Time to get busy.
Ask A Jedi: Artifice is one of the revealed Crafting skills, and is mentioned as the production of Jedi and Sith artifacts. Is this Crafting skill available only to Force users? Are any other Crew Skills limited to certain classes?
Ask A Jedi: Will companion Crew Skill bonuses be unique per companion?
Ask A Jedi: Is there a risk to your companions while on Missions? Can they die? In other words, what are the downsides of sending a companion on a mission?
Diplomatic Missions
Ask A Jedi: Are there mechanics in place that allow for crafting an item of better “quality” from the same recipe? For example, with additional or more rare materials?
Editor’s Note: We would like to help you prove those things in the Game Testing Program
Ask A Jedi: When gathering with your player character or with your active companion, do you physically need to take the resources back to your ship in order to use them in crafting? Does the ship have a “stock room” to hold these items for crafting?
Ask A Jedi: Another concern regarding missions that might award dark or light side points is that it trivializes the morality system, essentially allowing you to “grind morality.” How is this system intended to work?
Ah, the spoils.
Ask A Jedi: When sending companions out on missions, can you send them to locations you haven?t been yet? Or bring back materials you?ve never found yourself before?
Ask A Jedi: In the context of master crafters, “dedication” is cited as the avenue to achieve this status. Is it “time” that will allow you to become this elite crafter, or will there be rare resources, quests, raids (pve or pvp) or other activities that you need to do in order to achieve this status?
Ask A Jedi: It?s been stated (by you in fact, on the forums,) that Crew Skills will not be the method players use for creating light sabers. Will there be an equivalent non-crafting “weapon” system for non-Force users?
You guys keep working while I'm at dinner.
Ask A Jedi: With so much of this activity centralized on your ship, what is being done to assure that player hubs/cities are still filled with players, making them feel vibrant and alive?
We just wanted to say thanks again to Damion for taking the time to answer these questions for our readers, and we cannot wait to hear more about the Crew Skills system in Star Wars™: The Old Republic™.
That shows nothing of how crafting is complex. Basically all it told me was that crafted gear would be viable (which it better be seeing as TOR is just another gear>skill game) and some companions would be better at crafting some things than other.
i was in no way providing it to say its complex. i honestly cant say how easy or complex it will be. i'm just trying to provide information on what has been said regarding the crew skills system because many people seem uniformed about it.
If you want to take crafting seriously it will be much more complex than simply getting your companions to do it all for you.
SWTOR crafting system is complex, it isn't EVE but i isn't WoW either.
Can you please show me proof that TOR's crafting system is complex?
The last time I asked to be shown TOR's crafting system I was given a link to to the crew skills video and all it told me was "your companions can do it for you" which I don't consider a crafting system.
Same.. where is all the information coming from that the crafting is so complex and in depth??
If you want to take crafting seriously it will be much more complex than simply getting your companions to do it all for you.
I am looking forward to this game but I would like to see a deep crafting system. I am not sure if the planned one will be that deep but I am willing to give it the benefit of the doubt. IMO, a good game economy can only be created where crafting trumps all. The best items should be made by someone and be difficult to make. They will also be expensive. Why bother with crafting at all if animals are dropping swords or in this case light sabers that are better than can be made by players?. I really hope Bioware at least eliminates that piece of stupidity in MMOs.
They haven't showed enough of crafting to say whether it's complex or not. People claiming it is is just wishful thinking at this point, but then again what you might consider complex might not be the same as what others might percieve as complex.
This is everything we know crafting so far.
Apologise if the post is too long just thought everyone should know the facts.
The perception of many that social aspects like crafting and banking are limited only to your ship is wrong. There are a very small number of things that are ship based only activities. -Bioware
Quote: A crafting bench isn't just on your ship, but also in various areas on Tython - Darth Hater
Currently any crafted items/resources just get placed in your standard inventory - AskAJedi
Only Jedi/Sith craft Ligtsabers, not the companions - Bioware
Quote Daniel: The general approach is that once you learn a recipe, you know it. There may be exceptions - Darth Hater
Some resources may be only available on certain planets - Darth Hater
Quote Daniel: The part that is not terribly exciting is standing in one spot and watching a progress bar over and over and over again. And that's literally all that we removed - Massively
If you are either a Solo'er or in a large guild you can become a top Master Crafter, but of course the person in the large guild has a lot of help - Massively
Crafting is based on time invested more than XP level. Do not expect to decide to become a Master Crafter over a weekend, it will not happen - Torocast
Master Crafters will be able to craft some of the best items in game - Torocast
Some recipes will be limited per server to make them rare - Torocast
You will be able to brand your crafted items so people know who made it. - Torocast
Quote: "No, you the player cannot craft currently - which is to say you cannot choose to watch the progress bar fill up yourself". You tell your companions to do it and they will - Dev Comment
Quote from Damion: "It's worth noting that we really want the system to support the casual crafter (the guy who is taking crafting largely to outfit himself while levelling up) and the devoted crafter (the guy who wants to be known as the best Armormech in the galaxy)" - Dev Comment
You, via your crew skills, can have a maximum of three skills only one of which can be crafting. So you could have a mission skill, gathering and crafting or two gathering and one crafting etc - Dev Comment
If you wish to do the harvesting/gathering yourself you can. Its not limited to your companions - Crafting Video
The skills your companions will have will be split into three groups: Gathering, Crafting, and Missions. - Darth Hater
Crafting missons can take between 5mins to 24hrs long there is a cost to do each misson. - ChronicReload
Quote: I will just say there are some mechanics to it that will allow players who are more involved in crafting to really get deeply involved in crafting and be appropriately rewarded for it." - Darth Hater
Quote Blaine: It doesn't make sense for Darth Vader to skin womp rats for a new pair of boots in between conquering worlds "You are the hero," says Christine. "You make your crew work for you." - Gamespot
Crafting Crew Abilities/Function - Crew Skills Overview Page
Crafting in TOR will use a Crew, Companion, Skill crafting system. Using their ship as a base of operations, players will be able to send their companions on crafting tasks - Darth Hater
All crew skill trainers are available at the Capital worlds. - AskAJedi
The majority of crew skill missions are accessed from a pool of random missions but some are unlocked when you find rare items which give better rewards. - AskAJedi
There are no limitations on what class does what type of crafting - AskAJedi
Each companion has a minor crafting skill bonus based on their background, but its not enough to warrant you leaving them only to do crafting - AskAJedi
Companions can not die while on Crafting missions but they can fail. If it fails the lost incured is the credits it cost you to send your companion on the mission - AskAJedi
For a companion to go on a resource collection mission you the player do not have to visit the area first. - AskAJedi
Quote: We want crafters to be primarily playing a social game, not spending hours doing stuff they don’t want to do - AskAJedi
If you found two gathering nodes near each other you could harvest one and your companion could do the other at the same time - Darth Hater
Your crew does not have skills themselves. The crew skills they can use are based on the crafting skills your main character has. - Darth Hater
The maximum number of crew that can perform any crafting skill, at one time, is 5. Any others spare could be doing missons, gathering or travelling with the main character - Darth Hater
Certain companions will be better at some crafting group than others, for example Vette, a pirate and companion to the Sith Warrior, will excel at Treasure Hunting. - Darth Hater
Your companions can also be given missions on the fly, and even while players are away from their ship. They can also operate while your offline - Darth Hater
Only companions you have left on board your ship can perform any crafting actions. The ones you group with to fight etc can only perform gathering tasks - Darth Hater
While out adventuring if you see a crafting node instead of player character going to mine it you can send your companion to do it for you - Darth Hater
Quote: Currently, you can recall your companion at any time from a mission. You lose any progress he has made, as well as any upfront costs, but he returns immediately - Bioware
Quote: You can also have a companion stop crafting an item at any time. In that case, you lose no materials (but all progress will be lost). - Bioware
Quote: Players who choose Armstech as their crafting skill will be able to create a wide range of blaster pistols, blaster rifles, sniper rifles, and assault cannons. - Bioware
Quote: Players can issue crafting orders to up to five companions at a time, and each companion can add up to five crafting tasks to their queue. - Bioware
Quote: Companions with high affection will have their ability to perform crafting tasks greatly improved. For example, a companion with high affection can craft items faster - Bioware
Quote: "Though companions are vital to The Old Republic and the Crew Skills system, we do know that some players want to be the primary crafter for all their crafted items", "It is worth noting players will definitely need to be directly involved in the process when learning rare schematics - Bioware
The following crafting types are the ones revealed so far:
Gathering Skills include:
Crafting Skills include:
Artifice – the delicate work of constructing Jedi and Sith artifacts
Biochem – The engineering of performance-enhancing chemical serums and biological implants
Mission Skills include:
Quote Richard Vogel: It will not be to the extent of some of the games out there, like [Star Wars] Galaxies. It will be very similar to what WoW has. - Massively
Quote: We are going to have crafting, because that's a big part of MMOs. We're going to implement crafting in a way that 'feels' right for Star Wars. - Massively
Quote: We’ve spent quite a bit of time discussing how to ensure that crafters – true dedicated crafters – can make a name for themselves and be important in their community. - Developer Blog
Quote James Ohlen:... And plus the fact that you can get “critical hits” on crafting items so you can actually craft an item that is as good as you can get in a raid. http://www.askajedi.com/2011/03/14/p...h-james-ohlen/
i voted for swg. i would go for eve but eve doesnt have the complexity of swg and swg doesnt have all items player made like eve..
cant we have a mix of both these twp ??? that would be epic.
Sorry if I missed it, didnt read the whole thread. Does anyone know the name of the person or persons who designed SWTOR's crafting system?
See you in the dream..
The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
If the above is true then.. I the Op take backWhat I said.. I have been hard pressed to find that type of information you posted.. So I am a little more comfortable in seeing what they are putting together.. fingers crossed..
I wonder if they will bring back the Creature Handler.. That would be Awesome.. no?
as lead systems designer, i believe damion schubert is in charge of it but he and other des have said that they kick these ideas around and get input from the whole team, not just his people.
Its sad that people dont even know what a good mmorpg is supposed to be like. Crafting,combat,adventure,and roleplay all need to compliment each other and have equal weight and depth in an mmo. That is a sign of a well made game. All types of gamers coming together and participating in a unique world in their own way.
Unfortunately mmos arent made like that very often. We get crafting systems for players who prefer combat. This is the sad state of games like wow, rift, and even the exalted gw2. Tor's approach is interesting, but it is still not enough. Id like to see more games like precu where the crafting classes outnumbered the combat classes. Youd be suprised what it can do to your mmo. it plays a huge role in creating a living, breathing world.
unless of course you just want beat em ups online and make everything else an afterthought. in which case id say to you quit haunting my mmorpgs. Go back to halo or gow or whatever arcade style genre you came from.
theres one simple truth that we all should "embrace"...
crafting is boring for most of people
if the only way to get "endgame" gear is to spend hours running around some forsaken by gods planets, or pay a month of "daily quests" to a guy who will do it for us... game will go "nishe" and never after initial lounch will reach even 1mln subs...
thats not something EA will want
we already heard that crafted items will go "in pair" with gear from raiding and PVP, i can asure U SWG vets crying for crafting, that if PVP and raiding will give people gear at same ilvl than "dedicated" crafting, than 99% of players will go for PVP/raiding, and U will be the only ones doing "endgame crafting", so U willbe "special"... in a way
for now, crafting system is "ready"... only people in beta can change something in it now, by giving feedback,
crying on other than official forums is just a rant
Be Who You Are and Say What You Feel Because Those Who Mind Don't Matter and Those Who Matter Don't Mind. Dr.Seuss
I think TOR's crafting system sounds great. It was way beyond my expectations. Hope it plays out as well as it sounds.
However,
Are you saying if the exact same item could be gained through raiding pvp or crafting, 99% of people would raid or pvp grind for it? I don't think so. 99% would buy it of the auction house, but i assume you meant craft it themselves. Still thats rediculous. Or were you just exagerating?
Anyway, I like SWTOR's crafting the way it is, from what i read. It should be interesting to see how they balance the tears from each group claiming their gear should be better or "on par" with the others. Maybe it wont matter the way they've done it. That would be cool if they managed that.
i wonder how much of a difference gear stats will make anyway. Some games you cant even notice a difference. Others it dictates your worth.
See you in the dream..
The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
It would be cool if they had something like that but I'm not sure they will. I myself never had the patience for that profession but it was cool watching players running and training their pets in SWG.
Like the majority, I voted for the way TOR is doing it now. I understand that some folks like the old ways, but I'm glad that we're getting something different. It seems to me the devs get it on what does and doesn't work when it comes to crafting and economies. I look forward to doing what I did in SWG; gather important resources and sell them to dedicated crafters.
On a side note,I'm curious how important those jedi/sith artifacts will be on the market.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
Im honestly intrigued by the crafting system of this game. As a major resource broker/crafter though I have to ask the question of whether or not the economy is going to mainly player or AI driven? I haven't really seen too much discussion as to this and I was wondering if I'd simply missed a scrap of information or if it's just not something that has really been discussed yet.
Retired: EVE, SWG, STO, EQ2, Ryzom, AO, LotRO, FFXI
Currently Awaiting: SWTOR, TSW, ArcheAge
Well...that entirely depends on what you mean by AI driven. If i'm mistaken feel free to let me know and i'll try and help out.
Ok with that aside here is how crafting goes (based on the information we have)
When you start out in your adventures you are alone (meaning no companions)
If you want to start crafting your going to have to find a craftting trainer (this is the guy, girl or alien that gives you your crafting skill aka armortech, slicing, Diplomacy that sort of thing)
You'll most likely have to get off the starter planet to do that. In which case you'll have a companion then.
Now that you have your crafting skills (known in swtor as crew skills) you can go out and start gathering mats from resources nodes (you remember this from EQ2 if you've played that). You also need schematifcs or plans or whatever it is they call them in this game, it's the item that tells you what your making.
Now the thing that is different from other games is that you have to click on the resource node and watch this fill
<0%---------50%----------100%>
Everytime you get a node.
This time around though you can have your companion do it while you fight off a mob OR you can do the above and have your companion watch for hostiles.
Also if your feeling particularly lazy you can send your companion out to get supplies for you, though this is likely to be more expensive then if you did this manually, but if your missing one candle (for example not literally) and thats half way across the planet, then you can send your companion to go and grab it for a fee. Not sure if theres a chance you can fail at gathering resources.
Now that you have the mats and the plans to do the job you assign crew members to make the item (depending on loyalty and how many are on it plus their expertise at it will depend on quality). Remember those you assign to a job can not be taken with you in the world.
Once they are assigned to it, it will take a certain amount of time (i would gather the better the item the longer it takes, as that seems to be the trend) to make the item, as it's both skill based (as in you need a certain amount of crafting skill to start it) and timed based (like Fallen earth did, you will make this item in X amount of hours and mins)
However you don't need to be present during the crafting part so you can be out hunting or talking to friends, pvping or even sleeping/working.
Once the item is done, the companions will give you the item they made (again quality of the item is based on several factors) then you place that up on the auction house. Wait for it to be bought by another player and you get your money in return. You could also just vendor trash it if you want, but who does that to good items? or do it the old fashion way and meet up with the other character and trade the item if you wish to do it that way. Think they stated there wouldn't be vendor stalls though as that would clutter the areas.
If you've played fallen earth and done crafting there you get the general idea, it's the same type of thing except a few tweaks, like your not really doing the crafting but your skills do affect what types of items you can have your crew make. Plus instead of it just being based on your crafting skills you have to figure out which of your companions have the best skill make up to make the item the best it can be. You don't have to go out and find every bit of materials (though in fallen earth you did the crafting on your character so it was okay there.) Obviously the more lazy you are about gathering stuff the more expensive it will be. So a decent crafter will gather stuff as they see it, take it all back to the ship, purchase from auction house or have their crew run for stuff they don't have and make the items they want when they have the spare time.
Good crafters, will figure out where the good resource nodes are, get some of the really good plans, figure out which crew members work good with each plan and craft that way.
While some of the best crafters (and this is by no means a walkthrough to elite crafting) Will figure out where the best nodes for what they want to make are. Get the companions to like them the most for the type of items they will be making, work the auction house so they can buy items cheap, get people to gather mats for them at a reduced cost to them. Then send those companions do to the job and get the best quality items possible. Then throw those up on the auction house for lots of money. So they can do it all over again.
To finally answer your question if i understand it right. While the actual crafting process itself is AI driven, the gather (unless you send a companion to get mats), the selling, and other such things are completely player driven. Its set up so you don't HAVE to interact with other players directly (ie you can go to the auction house), but it doesn't limit you from doing it if you wish. That doesn't mean you can make every item on your own, no you will need to buy stuff from others such as you may need one from scavenging but because you took up slicing you don't have it. Or vice versa they may have something from slicing that a artifce might need and they can trade with them to get more money to fuel their armortech.
Some random things here: they stated you can get some interesting stuff being casual, but some of the rarest stuff requires you to be working almost solely on that.
They also stated that there are three ways to get end-game gear
One is through raiding (if you've played a lot of MMOs you know precisely how this one works)
Second one is through PvP (most likely tokens recieved for a job well done can be turned in to the vendor for goodies)
and finally the third one is through crafting. Yes thats right you can get end game gear simply by crafting
They also stated that crafters and raiders would need each other. I'd imagine this breaks down to (though i could be wrong) that crafters will need the raiders to get the rare blueprints from raids and the raiders will need the crafters for making that hard to make stuff.
Again if i'm mistakening what you mean by AI controlled let me know, but from what i've seen of the crafting that is what it looks like to me.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
Hendo, Very nice post is this stickyed anywhere it's the best crafting summary I have seen.
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Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
The information was (is) originally posted on the SWTOR forum here...
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=188836
Hope that helps.