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World of Warcraft: Community Spirit I: World of Warcraft
SBFord
Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,129
MMORPG.com writer Phil James admits to being something of a lone wolf in his game life. So what's he doing writing about Community Spirit? Well, that's the thing: Phil is trying to break out of his solo mode and LFG. See how successful Phil has been in finding a community in World of Warcraft. Let us know what you think in the comments.
Recently, I’ve found myself between games, and by recently I mean for almost a year - I’ve just not been able to find one to stick with. Maybe part of the problem is that I don’t involve myself with the community of the games I play. It’s pretty well documented by countless players across many forums that playing with their friends was the only thing that kept them coming back to game X, Y or Z. Could be where I’m going wrong. I mean one game is pretty much like another these days. There are exceptions, but most play out in similar ways. So maybe my missing ingredient is socialisation. What I need is the right group of people to play with, and then I’ll find a reason to be that game for the long haul.
Read more of Phil James' Community Spirit I: World of Warcraft.
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Comments
I've been playing for a little over a year now. I can't recall a single random group. Which tells me none were significantly fun.
your best bet is to find a new active guild. With the new guild rewards I would think more guild groups go out together. Mine has, and those are fun. You know them, at least more than a random cross server bunch. Even wipes are better because chances are guildies are more reluctant to abandon group.
My advise, try getting into guild groups. Those are more fun, although harder to put together than the random cross server groups in most cases.
It's not easy to make new friends in a game just like in real life. You meet a lot of people, some of them you like, some you don't. The ones you like you keep in touch and you become acquiantances. It takes much more time to build up a friendship. It is not something that happens overnight.
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
This
Chiming in for the people that make friends easier in game than real life.
Seriously, I'm way more open on the internet.
Spec'ing properly is a gateway drug.
12 Million People have been meter spammed in heroics.
It's strange. I used to be very anti-social in RL, but very social in online games. Online games actually helped me become more social in my real life. So much so that I am pretty good at it now, whereas my online social life has gone to shit. I just don't trust anyone online anymore.
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
I'm sorry but you forgot 2 key components when trying to drum up social connections:
Timing
Situation
If either of these two are off then you'll find yourself hitting a brick wall more than not. Let me use an example:
TIMING~
Say you're in a group and someone like your wife/girlfriend starts talking to you and trying to hold a descent conversation with you during a pull/boss fight. More than likely you're not going to give her your full attention and your answers are going to be fragmented at best. This ,of course, is because your mind is else where even if you're an accomplished multi-tasker. And some people may not be able to do this without feeling irritated.
SITUATION~
Picking your situation for stimulating social experiences is just as important. Using dungeon finder to find players to build friendships is not the best situation. You and they know that beyond the 15-30 minute run needed to complete what you are doing is about how far the relationship will get. This is of course unless players have changed their behavior and are now giving out more personal information within 5 minutes of meeting new people.
Your best bet in finding a new friend would be to do so in your downtime when playing. During auction house searches, waiting for queues, while gathering resources, while crafting or during anytime not associated with combat. Because if they are anything like me (slow typer), all you'll get is at best a one worded response while I get back to the situation at hand that may or may not require a little bit of timing.
"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."
Most of my fiendships in wow were initiated by someone else, I guess I don't really think about it "a lot"?
I haven't had a ton in my years of playing, maybe about 5-6 good ones (in wow), but we usually loose touch after about 5 months, just becasue I decied not to play for a month or 2 without saying anything :P. I'm the rude one, sadly. I wish I could be more caring, and not leave people hanging, saying, "were the hell has she been?"; o well ...
But mmo friendships shouldn't be hard, or really much of a challenge to obtain; come on, you're a better version of yourself, leave the shyness in the real world. ^_^
I'm not usually posting anything on MMORPG.com but this topic forced me to come out of the dark. I personnaly think that social relations have changed in MMO over the years. When i started playing those kind of games with DAoC, I was amazed how easy it was to find people and start to talk with them. I made friends in a matter of days. Now, you say "Hi" and "Thanks" and that's pretty much it.
Why?
Because everyone, including me, is excpecting to rush everything and be on his way doing something else. We're not playing the game just to have fun, there's always something behind it. Better loot, better lvl and so on.
These games have become a permanent competition and that's what boring me. I used to love exploring, testing and discovering things. For a time I thought Cataclysm was going toward this, but no, it's still this boring circle of loot for better raids for better loots.
Sure you could find a nice roleplay guild with some casual people but in the end when everyone is looking somewhere else you start to feel frustrated.
That's why I've never managed to play an MMO for more than 3 to 6 months with the exception of the early days of WoW and DAoC.
Yeah, I didn't have much luck making friends in WoW. The game just doesn't lend itself to making friends easy until you start raiding. Before raiding, you're mostly spending your time alone soloing through quests, crafting, or gathering. In DAoC, leveling up efficiently required a group, and the game had downtime in order to regain health, endurance, and mana, so people chatted during those 2 minutes of recovery...or while roaming around looking for a good place to set up camp and grind. The same with SWG before the NGE. The solo quest orientation of WoW and post-WoW games have made socialization hard to do, and not really needed.
My recommendations on finding a social group to play with?
This is what I did:
My girlfriend wanted to start playing WoW with me as Cataclysm came out. Another couple we knew were part of a good sized guild already at the time. So my girlfriend and I joined their server and their guild and talked them into playing brand new Worgens together.
Each week now, we make 1-2 levels on our own and set a level cap each week to keep us the same levels.
Then, come Monday night we do a dungeon together.
It's had a big benefit as 4 of us in the same guild doing the lower level dungeons together has earned the guild achievements that had not been met yet. We have also made a name for ourselves in the guild as every Monday the guild chat is bombarded with 4 entries every time we beat a dungeon.
PersonA has defeated Deadmines!
PersonB has defeated Deadmines!
PersonC has defeated Deadmines!
PersonD has defeated Deadmines!
Guild has earned the Achievement Deadmines Guild Run!
As we progressed we have caught up in levels with other people in the guild. They started joining our progression with their characters and have started making new friends in the guild. All this while getting the chance to experience every dungeon I may have missed during level progression with my Main Character. We use Vent on Monday nights and sometimes when I reach the level cap for the week I will just log in and chat with people in the guild.
It has been working out great for us!
That being said, it sounds like socializing in an MMO is something you are forcing yourself to do. For the sake of writing an article as work I can understand that. But for those playing in their free time that feel they have to force themselves to socialize to get the most out of a game I don't think that is the right mindset. Gaming should be a relaxing experience, not something that you have to work at. There are far too many games out there to play one you don't enjoy.
All the best!
James
JamesMy recommendations on finding a social group to play with?
This is what I did:
My girlfriend wanted to start playing WoW with me as Cataclysm came out. Another couple we knew were part of a good sized guild already at the time. So my girlfriend and I joined their server and their guild and talked them into playing brand new Worgens together.
Each week now, we make 1-2 levels on our own and set a level cap each week to keep us the same levels.
Then, come Monday night we do a dungeon together.
It's had a big benefit as 4 of us in the same guild doing the lower level dungeons together has earned the guild achievements that had not been met yet. We have also made a name for ourselves in the guild as every Monday the guild chat is bombarded with 4 entries every time we beat a dungeon.
PersonA has defeated Deadmines!
PersonB has defeated Deadmines!
PersonC has defeated Deadmines!
PersonD has defeated Deadmines!
Guild has earned the Achievement Deadmines Guild Run!
As we progressed we have caught up in levels with other people in the guild. They started joining our progression with their characters and have started making new friends in the guild. All this while getting the chance to experience every dungeon I may have missed during level progression with my Main Character. We use Vent on Monday nights and sometimes when I reach the level cap for the week I will just log in and chat with people in the guild.
It has been working out great for us!
That being said, it sounds like socializing in an MMO is something you are forcing yourself to do. For the sake of writing an article as work I can understand that. But for those playing in their free time that feel they have to force themselves to socialize to get the most out of a game I don't think that is the right mindset. Gaming should be a relaxing experience, not something that you have to work at. There are far too many games out there to play one you don't enjoy.
All the best!
James
Well said Killy47. Id like to add that higher drop rates, less gear variation and smaller raid groups are a big part of the problem.
I was heavy into WoW when it launched, but didn't know anyone on my server. Levelled to 60 without a guild on 2 toons, random parties where needed (back in the day when you had to socialize to find a group). At 60, I tried to find a guild, but all the guilds on my server required applications, probationary periods, and in general treated people like crap. I finally got into a high-end guild where I was 4th tank, did 3 raids a week for a month where I was ineligible for loot (probationary), then the guild fell apart due to officer drama. Burned and tired, I was about to retire when a friend from another server invited me to join his guild...500 people in an alliance of 2400+, with no probation, nothing.
OK, hopped over to the PvP server and started over (no transfers back then, PvE->PvP), rolled to 60 quickly and started raiding. The problem with a 99% social guild is that EVERYone is in it, including people who really shouldn't be raiding. Oh, and if you get person A, who's a good raider, you also get person B who is their best friend and a horrible one, and person A won't run without person B. And then there's person A being awesome, and person B being awesome, but they hate each other and everytime they're together the raid chat becomes a bickerfest. I lived this for 2 years and it slowly wore me down until I reached a point where logging in gave me a headache, so I retired.
Earlier this year, bored out of my mind, I bought Cataclysm, transferred back to my original server and took 3 toons from 80-85. I found a guild to join easily enough, because there are 1,000's of guilds pimping for members, because there are rewards for having members....they don't want to actually *DO* anything with the members, I never got invited to raids, groups, or anything, but man were they excited that I joined and was levelling. And I did instances using the LFG tools, and my experiences were pretty much what the OP posted, except I was a tank and a healer, so if I was nice to people, it baffled them because most tanks and healers acted like gifts from God above, due to their value in the queues.
I love the social aspects of MMO's, but WoW is simply TOO big and has TOO many ways to be able to "use" other players without actually having to talk to them.
the reason i left WoW is due to the lack of community. i think their current model of the game has broken the game. instant travel to dungeons with people you don't know, combined with long dungeon wait times, combined with long dungeon times, to collect badges and rep for new factions with every expansion was a complete grind for me and made it impossible to see the world as it really was. riding to the dungeons was fun for me. being in a guild that actually didn't have cliques was fun for me, and the new dungeon model emphasized cliques. Lastly, every expansion had the same things to occomplish over and over in a grind, the most recent one Cataclysm added yet another long drawn out grinding of yet another set of five factions, armor sets bought with badges, and a new profession. (five years playing a game and all my toons professions were maxed out). just got boring really.
If this game somehow gained back a social aspect. It would so dominate even further. I really do hope that this game gains some sort of Social aspect back. Would be great!
ppl talking a lot in vent, not in chat cuz its not comfortable
As goes for me for sure community has absolutely nothing to do with game being able to keep me in. Is immersion, good questing, nice effects, fluid moving, .... etc etc ... not being (to much) buggy ... all this and more. But for sure not need to talk with somebody. If main reason would be community ... well ... stay in forums, why playing game for this. But for sure you need live people to be able to play endgame or doing hard quests.
Anymore SBFORD, that is how gaming works. I have always tended to be a loner in games. This goes back to the fall of 1992 when I first got into online gaming. I've basically been calling myself a "soloist" for the past near 20 years online. That said, I've always enjoyed social interaction and have been a part of Houses/Guilds/Factions, been an officer in various ones over the years.
Basically I've always managed to find a home somewhere, where I could help others, be a part of the time or needed and would gladly help. But still do my own soloist activities. Sadly though in recent years I've seen that I nolonger have been able to find a home with groups. The Guild/House/Faction hasn't really changed, it is the players who have changed. The mindset of the players is different these days.
I find that the immaturity, trolling, drama etc combined with a general lack of social etiquette have made becoming a member of these groups to be near impossible. Basically social interaction isn't wanted, but it is recognised as a necessary evil to most of these players. A selfish "ok I'll do this to get where or what I want, but I'm not going to be pleasant about it".
I was amused that you quoted "No Exit" by Jean-Paul Sartre btw. Currently my sig on my phone text messages is that very quote. "L'enfer, c'est les autres". Anyhow I don't see this aspect improving honestly nor do I see a way to fix it. I've been in dozens of guilds in recent years trying to find a home where I could interact, help others, get help, accomplish goals etc, with no real success.
Maybe as the online gaming population matures/ages this might change, I honestly can only speculate. The older gaming population from 10 to 20 years ago, was an older more mature crowd. Simply due to the fact that gaming used to cost us upwards of thousands of dollars a month "if " you allowed your hourly charges to go that high. I tried to keep my own online gaming to 500.00 to 1k a month at most during some events that would lead to more time online. This at the 6.00 or more an hour fees means it doesnt take long.
My point was that back then only working professionals by and large could afford the online gaming hobby.
Were there idiots? Those you didn't get along with? Drama? Yep, but wow to a much much smaller extent and you could ignore those idiots or that drama if you wanted to back then. The person(s) responsible would either wander away or change their ways since they "needed" the community. Now? This crap is the norm, not the exception. Which is why I can't even begin to honestly speculate if it will ever change/improve.
Hell is other people, indeed.
Too sweeping of a generalization for me. Since until recent years I'd never had a hard time socializing and making acquaintances/friends. This as a person who as I said in another post is a soloist by nature. I agree that it doesn't happen over night by any means but socializing has never been difficult for me until the past few years. Basically it wasn't hard to meet people and get "into" the group. It still isn't hard to get into a group, its just that the groups tend to be full of trolls, immature attention seeking twits, selfish snipes etc. Who wants to hang out with that for long? Same holds true with the guilds, I've been in dozens of guilds now in the past few years in WoW alone. I'll let someone who I've run some instances, bgs or saved their ass from getting ganked while doing dailies talk me into checking out the guild they are in and I find the same crap.
Wanna be gangsta talk, trolling, drama, massive immaturity and over the top neediness are common. I'll give it a two weeks or so usually before I'll reach my limit one night while reading the scroll of crap in the guild chat and do a guild quit. I think the longest I've lasted in any one guild has been 3 or 4 months.
I remember fondly sitting in Dreadlands in everquest grinding mobs in a group with some med time to get mana back on casters, back then there was natural pauses where people where chatting and was friendly, that made the grind a lot easier to take.
I am proud to report that community exists on Darkmoon Faire server of World of Warcraft. If
you define that as people having fun doing things together, then, yes, very much so. Our guild chat
is crammed with people blabbing about what is happening in real life, helping each other out with game,
giving real life advice, and general verbal foolishness. Our sucess as guild in higher level gameplay is spotty, to put it nicely.
This is despite the fact that we have a broad group of very talented people, and a real mix, arena, bg lovers, sucessful raiders
and rpers. Go figure. But we measure our sucess in friendliness anyway. In the end the game is only as good as
the person playing it. Remember, little kids can have fun playing with dirt and sticks. Sometimes it helps to put your
complaints about game's shortcomings, your friend's shortcomings ( these will always exsist) aside and have some fun and
a few laughs with your friends. I could tell stories, oh yes.
i have to agree,dungeon finderis all nice and good but cross server thing gets annoying in a hurry.and on some server like illidan ally side,there is no choice:when total 85 population is 49 player online.you have to use dungeon finder,and the fact that nobody use raid finder of things like raid or rated bg,makes even mather worst.what is surprising is if you look on the other side of the fence same server it is packed with horde .so let me tell you i am on the ally side and i stick to it we are a lvl 25 guild but we havent progressed near what the horde progressed to ,so it happen often that horde will meet a ilvl 352 player with a ilvl 342 weapon and all and will say wtf what are they doing on ally side sade truth is we re staring at each other cause we know on average we wont progress further then the dungeon finder or rated 2v2 (without the 2200 rating)not because of lack of talent but because there arent that many player pool period on illidan ally.