This is great news. It allows us to launch SWTOR, and not have to rush through. So that in 2-3 months when we've hit cap, and the themepark ride is over. We can move on happily to the 2012 releases, and have good memories not bitter resentment.
I'm pretty sure the combined content and replay value of SWTOR is going to last much longer than 2-3 months. Heck, that was the replay value of KOTOR 1+2 together or Dragon Age 1+2 and SWTOR is at least 8x bigger than those games. Not to mention future expansions including the space expansion and additional DLC that have quality, size, and playtime comparable to DA:Awakening or ME2 Lair of the Shadow Broker.
They're almost guaranteed to keep us hooked for way longer than 2-3 months. There's no way they would let their $80-million baby just sit and die from lack of expansions.
Combined content, and RE-PLAY, this is the key feature of it.
Sure Bioware spent alot of money, and time, and multiple voice actors to make the project, but how much will actually be used? I personally have no interest in the glowy-bat swinging side classes, so already their content is 1/2 for me.
Those who want Sith, are really going to re-role-re-play Jedi, just to re-ride the ride?
Rift offered their Rift raids, and how long did that keep players? And if your hoping the IP will keep it's players did Star Trek? Conan? War? or Star Wars galaxies?
Maybe your right, maybe we can re-do SWTOR for 6 months, heck I'm still re-playing Mass Effect.. OH wait I don't have to pay monthly for that re-ride.
Space expansion, is a shooter on rails, not worth $14.99 to many including me. Especially when Black Prophecy, or other experiences offer a better game play.
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not doom an gloom, I'm not a hater, I don't want SWTOR to fail. I am going to pick up a copy, and try it out as the ranged tank is interesting. Still it's kinda sad when this massive undertaking of Star Wars, by Bioware, MMO is comming, and I'm more interested in Ranged tank? that's new.
I think SWTOR will sell fine, be a solid polished release, and would have been an amazing success as a single player console type, but as a reaccuring subscription based MMo? no i think players will come, play and move when they see the ride has ended.
2-3 months, ok maybe a little short.. 3-6?
SWTOR. Face it, in the Scooby Doo Mystery Solving Van of coolness, this game is Velma. In this current MMO climate it has about as much chance for survival as a group of inquisitive teenagers in a 1980s slasher flick. -Tardcore May, 2011
Not really, personally I prefer a game rather than a moisture farming simulator
You can play Farmville and get a similar experience to Pre NGE SWG
So you like 'herioc' games where you have the same skills, wear the same gear, and carry the same weapons as every other thousand hero's of your 4-9 classes?
I'll take my Master Smuggler/ Weaponsmith over a farmville, or rinse and repeat the same content. anyday.
SWTOR. Face it, in the Scooby Doo Mystery Solving Van of coolness, this game is Velma. In this current MMO climate it has about as much chance for survival as a group of inquisitive teenagers in a 1980s slasher flick. -Tardcore May, 2011
I'm excited for this game, very much want it to be good.
However, that Warfront (is that what they are called?) video, showing pvp, looked so terrible.
People standing perfectly still shooting or hitting each other, no reaction from anyone unless they died. That could be because game mechanics aren't in place, animations aren't finished, etc.
But if that's indicative of the kind of combat we can expect, that's a little bit scary in how boring and unexciting it looks.
Or it could be because it is hotkey combat exactly as we see in WoW, WAR, and .
Why did i say that? Because in ANY hotkey MMO made today we stand still, press hotkeys every second until someone dies or others show up. Contrary to what they say thats what their combat is like. I want everyone reading this to go watch any cobat video, MUTE IT so you cannot hear the dev talking about how awesome it is, and then watch the combat unfold. Just watch it.
Just wanna go on record i agree with you Luro.
I don't entirely agree, the only one i have a lot of pvp experience with is wow, but in wow, you see druids shifting to get away, you see fears, sheeps, roots going off. You see rogues vanishing and mages blinking away, locks demonic circling up to a higher platform, you see people trying to los.
In that video, and i fully admit it might just be that video, you saw both sides, in an open field, standing perfectly still and shooting or swinging at each other, no movement, no variation. I was saying it's a really bad promo video because of that.
I would love something new in as far as combat in an mmo goes, i actually like themepark games, but they have pretty much said we can't expect anything really new as far as combat goes. But if it's literaly people lining up and hitting buttons, that i do have a problem with, because it's what i saw.
I also find it hard to beleive a AAA developer backed by one of the largest videogame companies in the world is making a game where there is no cc, no need to los, and no escape mechanizms for characters. I just wish they would show something in a hype video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjIid-hucnE - this video was also meant to hype people up. Video-guys do get better at doing such videos as many companies have shown. Trailer sucked, even at the time (for me at least), but I knew that when I will sit behind the keyboard, it will play much, much better.
And no matter the shitty gameplay shown, I still get the shivers down my spine. Awesome music as well as bringing back buckets of old memories.
Not really, personally I prefer a game rather than a moisture farming simulator
You can play Farmville and get a similar experience to Pre NGE SWG
So you like 'herioc' games where you have the same skills, wear the same gear, and carry the same weapons as every other thousand hero's of your 4-9 classes?
What game are you referring to because that isn't TOR. Since I'll be crafting my own armour I can guarentee you I won't look like everyone else.
I'll take my Master Smuggler/ Weaponsmith over a farmville, or rinse and repeat the same content. anyday.
And I'll take my Sith Warrior with crafting companions who will have a fun time leveling over the rinse and repeat spin groups any day of the week. To each his own. Plus I hate to break it to you, but PRE- SWG was nothing but rinse and repeat.
Kotor was one of my favorite games (ME2 is way up there too). As long as SWToR is a good rpg in those same lines I will be happy, the MMO is icing on the cake.
Not really, personally I prefer a game rather than a moisture farming simulator
You can play Farmville and get a similar experience to Pre NGE SWG
So you like 'herioc' games where you have the same skills, wear the same gear, and carry the same weapons as every other thousand hero's of your 4-9 classes?
What game are you referring to because that isn't TOR. Since I'll be crafting my own armour I can guarentee you I won't look like everyone else.
I'll take my Master Smuggler/ Weaponsmith over a farmville, or rinse and repeat the same content. anyday.
And I'll take my Sith Warrior with crafting companions who will have a fun time leveling over the rinse and repeat spin groups any day of the week. To each his own. Plus I hate to break it to you, but PRE- SWG was nothing but rinse and repeat.
Do we know how basic the crafting in Swtor is? If it's like the majority of MMOs then you will be crafting the same gear as everyone else.
Not really, personally I prefer a game rather than a moisture farming simulator
You can play Farmville and get a similar experience to Pre NGE SWG
So you like 'herioc' games where you have the same skills, wear the same gear, and carry the same weapons as every other thousand hero's of your 4-9 classes?
What game are you referring to because that isn't TOR. Since I'll be crafting my own armour I can guarentee you I won't look like everyone else.
I'll take my Master Smuggler/ Weaponsmith over a farmville, or rinse and repeat the same content. anyday.
And I'll take my Sith Warrior with crafting companions who will have a fun time leveling over the rinse and repeat spin groups any day of the week. To each his own. Plus I hate to break it to you, but PRE- SWG was nothing but rinse and repeat.
Well Ktanner3, are you sure this is the arguement you wish to have?
Your Sith warrior will send the same Blue Twi'lek companion to gather that every other Sith Warrior has, her name is Vette by the way. She'll hang out in your Sith Fury same as every other Vette for Every other Sith Warrior, but wait it get's better... The SAME starship you have, your Sith Inquisitors have..
Your Sith warrior can choose to Juggernaut, or Marauder advance class, and you won't even have to tell us.. we'll just wait for you to pull out one or two glow sticks just like EVERY other Warrior of your same advance class...
I don't know how cookie cutter you can get? ALL Gunslinger Smugglers carry two pistols, and ALL Scoundrel smugglers have a 'scattergun'
You may craft your own armour, but it's ALL the same warable by Sith Warriors, and we've seen the armor progression vid's.
Lastly how many classes are in SWTOR again? right 8
As to Pre-NGE-SWG being a rinse an repeat? Really? on what server? Mine had entertainers leveling up from being in cantina's, and they were not always in the same spot, we had player cities. Rangers tracking different animal mobs for different stat hides,a nd meat for crafters, Creature handlers captureing mounts, and pets, space.. Sure you could continually run DWB, but it's not like taral V where the hounds drop a purple belt buckle..
OK ok i see Kyrat dragons getting farmed for lightsaber parts, just like 'Battlegrounds.. sorry they're warfronts in here.. get farmed for valor..
We had anchorhead - Bestine world pvp runs, then next time, used a different city.. same thing, right?
SWTOR. Face it, in the Scooby Doo Mystery Solving Van of coolness, this game is Velma. In this current MMO climate it has about as much chance for survival as a group of inquisitive teenagers in a 1980s slasher flick. -Tardcore May, 2011
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Not really, personally I prefer a game rather than a moisture farming simulator
You can play Farmville and get a similar experience to Pre NGE SWG
So you like 'herioc' games where you have the same skills, wear the same gear, and carry the same weapons as every other thousand hero's of your 4-9 classes?
What game are you referring to because that isn't TOR. Since I'll be crafting my own armour I can guarentee you I won't look like everyone else.
I'll take my Master Smuggler/ Weaponsmith over a farmville, or rinse and repeat the same content. anyday.
And I'll take my Sith Warrior with crafting companions who will have a fun time leveling over the rinse and repeat spin groups any day of the week. To each his own. Plus I hate to break it to you, but PRE- SWG was nothing but rinse and repeat.
Do we know how basic the crafting in Swtor is? If it's like the majority of MMOs then you will be crafting the same gear as everyone else.
We know quite a bit about crafting including you won't be crafting the same items as everyone else, there will be rare recipes and crit chances, and limited use recipes. This way certain items will be very sought after, and gathering is done a few different ways, one of which is rather costly but less time consuming.
Not really, personally I prefer a game rather than a moisture farming simulator
You can play Farmville and get a similar experience to Pre NGE SWG
So you like 'herioc' games where you have the same skills, wear the same gear, and carry the same weapons as every other thousand hero's of your 4-9 classes?
What game are you referring to because that isn't TOR. Since I'll be crafting my own armour I can guarentee you I won't look like everyone else.
I'll take my Master Smuggler/ Weaponsmith over a farmville, or rinse and repeat the same content. anyday.
And I'll take my Sith Warrior with crafting companions who will have a fun time leveling over the rinse and repeat spin groups any day of the week. To each his own. Plus I hate to break it to you, but PRE- SWG was nothing but rinse and repeat.
Well Ktanner3, are you sure this is the arguement you wish to have?
Your Sith warrior will send the same Blue Twi'lek companion to gather that every other Sith Warrior has, her name is Vette by the way. She'll hang out in your Sith Fury same as every other Vette for Every other Sith Warrior, but wait it get's better... The SAME starship you have, your Sith Inquisitors have..
Your Sith warrior can choose to Juggernaut, or Marauder advance class, and you won't even have to tell us.. we'll just wait for you to pull out one or two glow sticks just like EVERY other Warrior of your same advance class...
I don't know how cookie cutter you can get? ALL Gunslinger Smugglers carry two pistols, and ALL Scoundrel smugglers have a 'scattergun'
You may craft your own armour, but it's ALL the same warable by Sith Warriors, and we've seen the armor progression vid's.
Lastly how many classes are in SWTOR again? right 8
As to Pre-NGE-SWG being a rinse an repeat? Really? on what server? Mine had entertainers leveling up from being in cantina's, and they were not always in the same spot, we had player cities. Rangers tracking different animal mobs for different stat hides,a nd meat for crafters, Creature handlers captureing mounts, and pets, space.. Sure you could continually run DWB, but it's not like taral V where the hounds drop a purple belt buckle..
OK ok i see Kyrat dragons getting farmed for lightsaber parts, just like 'Battlegrounds.. sorry they're warfronts in here.. get farmed for valor..
We had anchorhead - Bestine world pvp runs, then next time, used a different city.. same thing, right?
And you still had cookie cutter builds. SWG was not about the proffessions as much as it was about community interdependency. As for the TOR's companions, Bioware has only showed a few not all and each one of those can be customized to your taste. Yes, TOR is more of a themepark MMORPG and that's what it always will be. Bioware though,has added some sandbox elements here and there, like exploration and crafted items being just as good as looted items, open world pvp, that guilds can run on any planet against other guilds, your ship being your house and some other stuff.
When you get down to it. TOR is a actual SW mmorpg and SWG was a world simulation with very little SW. SOE could have changed the name and removed everything that was SW related and the game still would have played the same and probably ended up in the same condition it still is in today.
TOR will be a very good game if first and foremost you are a fan of anything SW. Second, you actually care about diving deep into character choices and consequences and third, if you love a game that will be polished and full of content, with from the looks of it and from what people who actually played, an all around fun and engaging game.
By 'it' I mean something decent and new and different and not 'it' as in the regurgitation of the same shite dressed in star wars clothes. I know it seems like insanity to verge away from the proven, successful wow-iant format and 'it's a business and they want to make money so no one's going to take risks going off the path on a potential flop'. However, I'll bet the commentary of this period of gaming in a few years time will be 'how did no one put a decent effort into reading the forums thoroughly, taking notes and realising that a huge amount of the audience viewed this approach cynically, the fools could have cleaned up the market for years and made everyone very happy at the same time'. Diminishing returns gents, diminishing returns.
I have no invested interest in Rift whatsoever since I'm not playing it nor planning to, but I am curious about player activity and behaviour so I've been keeping track of a number of data.
So far it seems that Rift is slowly balancing out on a rough average of about 65% of 1st-month player population (XFire+Steam+Raptr), it has a higher retention rate than WAR had in its first months and there's absolutely nowhere near the uproar that was present around AoC. Anyone who thinks that AoC's and Rift's first post-launch months are the same when it comes to player (dis)satisfaction is I think clearly suffering from selective memory recall.
Will Rift hold on to 65% of its initial player population? Hmm, it'll probably lower more in the upcoming months, but the decrease rate has become less than it was, with recent player activity figures that aren't that different from 3 weeks or so ago.
Will they need to merge servers? Yeah, I think that in some moment in time this year they certainly will need to, imo they opened too many servers, 10-15 less would've been better, that last batch of server additions was just too much and not needed.
So far, Rift's launch and post-launch status comes far closer to how it was with LotrO than how it was with AoC or WAR, and definitely leagues better than DCUO's. We'll see how it develops over the months.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Not even sure what Niquity is trying to say there. I am not normally one for playing the English Teacher, but that was so garbled that I couldn't even peice it together after several attempts. Hopefully he/she does better on the next post.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
Well Ktanner3, are you sure this is the arguement you wish to have?
Why not? I played PRE-CU SWG and have been following TOR for quite awhile.
Your Sith warrior will send the same Blue Twi'lek companion to gather that every other Sith Warrior has, her name is Vette by the way. She'll hang out in your Sith Fury same as every other Vette for Every other Sith Warrior, but wait it get's better... The SAME starship you have, your Sith Inquisitors have..
And?
Your Sith warrior can choose to Juggernaut, or Marauder advance class, and you won't even have to tell us.. we'll just wait for you to pull out one or two glow sticks just like EVERY other Warrior of your same advance class...
And? In SWG everyone was slaughtering animals in spin groups. Just go to a populated spaceport, wait for a pickup group, group leader goes to mission terminal, picks bols and pickets because they are the best animals to kill and then go with your group to relive the great saga known as animal killing. What fun. I can live with others flying the same ship as me so long as I get to do more than slaughter animals to gain XP.
I don't know how cookie cutter you can get? ALL Gunslinger Smugglers carry two pistols, and ALL Scoundrel smugglers have a 'scattergun'
That's it? We use similiar weapons so that makes them cookie cutters? You will have NO idea what type of SI you are fighting since they have the option to Tank, DPS or Heal. He may be fighting you at close range or long range. None of those three fighters will fight the same.
You may craft your own armour, but it's ALL the same warable by Sith Warriors, and we've seen the armor progression vid's.
And you know this how? Where has that been stated? Oh that's right, it isn't true. This just shows that you have no idea what your are talking about. The progression video was just showing some of the options that you will have as you advance your character. It was NOT showing ALL that you will be wearing. There will be plenty of armour to choose from and those pics have been shown here countless times. .
Lastly how many classes are in SWTOR again? right 8
And I'm sure they'll all work, unlike SWG where so many of those 32 didn't actually work or were borked and useless.Smugglers will actually smuggle things (imagine that) and Troopers(commandoes) will actually be useful and not get their butts kicked by armourless characters without weapons.
As to Pre-NGE-SWG being a rinse an repeat? Really? on what server? Mine had entertainers leveling up from being in cantina's, and they were not always in the same spot, we had player cities.
Ooh. Player cities that all looked the same, which were not used by the majority of players and were a big eye sore. Most players used the cantinas in Theed and Mos Eisley. By the way I played on Corbantis, which was a very well populated server before the NGE.
Rangers tracking different animal mobs for different stat hides,a nd meat for crafters, Creature handlers captureing mounts, and pets, space..
Mounts and Space were not in SWG at launch. They will be in TOR's launch and won't require me paying for an expansion.
Sure you could continually run DWB, but it's not like taral V where the hounds drop a purple belt buckle..
You know what the drops are in Taral V? Do tell. Once again, please educate yourself because you are looking ridiculous. There are different stats in this game for crafting as well.
OK ok i see Kyrat dragons getting farmed for lightsaber parts, just like 'Battlegrounds.. sorry they're warfronts in here.. get farmed for valor..
We had anchorhead - Bestine world pvp runs, then next time, used a different city.. same thing, right?
You're leaving out the part where you had to "level" your character. Yes I know, there were no levels in SWG (yeah right). You still had to grind skill points in order to improve your character and that required a rinse and repeat process of grinding bols and pickets and then seeing a trainer. That is the process I was referring to. You know, the exercise that every player goes thru before they reach end game and can do any of the things you previously mentioned. That process that if it's boring will cause hundreds of thousands of players to leave like they did in SWG.I'm glad that you think that slaughtering animals over and over again is fun, but the rest of us think being part of a well written star wars saga with the option to go light or dark is a more interesting way to level your character. But if a mindless grind is your thing you can still do that in this game. Just go off to a spawn and grind until your heart's content or participate in repetitious PVP.
Anchorhead? Really? I visited it maybe twice and rarely ran into anyone there. The majority of players hung out in Theed and Mos Eisley. And if you want to bring planets into the argument you lose that one hands down since we have:
Tython, Korriban,Hutta, Ord Mantel, Coruscant, Balmera, Aldeeran, Dromund Kass, etc.etc.etc. and the majority of these 17 planets will be bigger than any planet SWG ever had.
Plus my game is being made by Bioware while yours was done by SOE, a company that could screw up a perfectly fine cup of coffee.
We have a game being made as a continuation of one the most succcessful games in history while yours was a poor Star Wars simulator that only made hunters, gatherers and crafters happy. You could have taken the Star Wars brand out of it and barely been able to tell the difference.
Originally posted by vesavius TBH, I am severly dissapointed with this so called 'great year for MMORPGs', and what I am seeing with this game isnt gonna save it (for me). It's no better then last year (for me) Still, fingers crossed for next year eh? lol
+1000000000000
All we heard about was how all these great AAA title were coming and the two best ones don't look like they'll be coming this year.
Currently Playing: Perpetuum MMOs Played (most time spent to least): World of Warcraft (BG/Open world PvP focused), Lord of the Rings Online (PvMP focused), Warhammer Online (BG PvP focused), Global Agenda, Age of Conan, DC Universe Online (PvP focused), Runes of Magic, Allods, Aion, Fallen Earth
I think GW2, The Secret World, and Arch Age are all games to keep an eye on, even if they don't necessarily release in 2011.
The only problem I have with TERA is that I have little reason to believe it won't devolve into yet another Korean grind but with pretty graphics. I mean, we heard the localization talk from NCSoft years ago with AION, but it has been three years, and I still don't believe AION has been westernized enough for mass appeal within the American market.
Let me...wrap my mind about this...
You say we shoud trust FunCom...who brought us Age of Conan...without question...
...But TERA gives you little reason to believe it won't be a grind, simply on the merits that it is made by a Korean developer?
We probably need Ben Kenobi now more than ever if we're going to have a decent mmo for 2011. NcSoft made it official that the GW2 mmo will go in closed beta by the end of the year. That all but eliminates the majority of possibilities we will see GW2 in 2011 unless a small miracle happens. Are there any other hopes for 2011 ? Honestly, it looks like online rts and rpg games will reign supreme yet again. Lets pray that The Old Republic has a good launch.
If you want a "decent MMO for 2011", you have one. It's called Rift. It's certainly far from amazing, but if "decent" is your standard, that's what you have. SWTOR will be next year's Rift. Except it'll have all the boring parts (i.e. solo questing) and none of the good parts (i.e. dynamic content). So if you want a "decent MMO for 2012", you'll have SWTOR. Hopefully.
The saddest thing is that "decent" is really the best we can hope for these days. I'm eagerly awaiting TSW, but even that doesn't look like it'll be much more than "decent". The hopes for "Good" or "Great" mmo now lie mostly with WoD and only because little to nothing is known about it - it's easy to expect greatness when there is no evidence to the contrary.
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall Currently Playing: ESO
Well Ktanner3, are you sure this is the arguement you wish to have?
Why not? I played PRE-CU SWG and have been following TOR for quite awhile.
Your Sith warrior will send the same Blue Twi'lek companion to gather that every other Sith Warrior has, her name is Vette by the way. She'll hang out in your Sith Fury same as every other Vette for Every other Sith Warrior, but wait it get's better... The SAME starship you have, your Sith Inquisitors have..
And?
Your Sith warrior can choose to Juggernaut, or Marauder advance class, and you won't even have to tell us.. we'll just wait for you to pull out one or two glow sticks just like EVERY other Warrior of your same advance class...
And? In SWG everyone was slaughtering animals in spin groups. Just go to a populated spaceport, wait for a pickup group, group leader goes to mission terminal, picks bols and pickets because they are the best animals to kill and then go with your group to relive the great saga known as animal killing. What fun. I can live with others flying the same ship as me so long as I get to do more than slaughter animals to gain XP.
I don't know how cookie cutter you can get? ALL Gunslinger Smugglers carry two pistols, and ALL Scoundrel smugglers have a 'scattergun'
That's it? We use similiar weapons so that makes them cookie cutters? You will have NO idea what type of SI you are fighting since they have the option to Tank, DPS or Heal. He may be fighting you at close range or long range. None of those three fighters will fight the same.
You may craft your own armour, but it's ALL the same warable by Sith Warriors, and we've seen the armor progression vid's.
And you know this how? Where has that been stated? Oh that's right, it isn't true. This just shows that you have no idea what your are talking about. The progression video was just showing some of the options that you will have as you advance your character. It was NOT showing ALL that you will be wearing. There will be plenty of armour to choose from and those pics have been shown here countless times. .
Lastly how many classes are in SWTOR again? right 8
And I'm sure they'll all work, unlike SWG where so many of those 32 didn't actually work or were borked and useless.Smugglers will actually smuggle things (imagine that) and Troopers(commandoes) will actually be useful and not get their butts kicked by armourless characters without weapons.
As to Pre-NGE-SWG being a rinse an repeat? Really? on what server? Mine had entertainers leveling up from being in cantina's, and they were not always in the same spot, we had player cities.
Ooh. Player cities that all looked the same, which were not used by the majority of players and were a big eye sore. Most players used the cantinas in Theed and Mos Eisley. By the way I played on Corbantis, which was a very well populated server before the NGE.
Rangers tracking different animal mobs for different stat hides,a nd meat for crafters, Creature handlers captureing mounts, and pets, space..
Mounts and Space were not in SWG at launch. They will be in TOR's launch and won't require me paying for an expansion.
Sure you could continually run DWB, but it's not like taral V where the hounds drop a purple belt buckle..
You know what the drops are in Taral V? Do tell. Once again, please educate yourself because you are looking ridiculous. There are different stats in this game for crafting as well.
OK ok i see Kyrat dragons getting farmed for lightsaber parts, just like 'Battlegrounds.. sorry they're warfronts in here.. get farmed for valor..
We had anchorhead - Bestine world pvp runs, then next time, used a different city.. same thing, right?
You're leaving out the part where you had to "level" your character. Yes I know, there were no levels in SWG (yeah right). You still had to grind skill points in order to improve your character and that required a rinse and repeat process of grinding bols and pickets and then seeing a trainer. That is the process I was referring to. You know, the exercise that every player goes thru before they reach end game and can do any of the things you previously mentioned. That process that if it's boring will cause hundreds of thousands of players to leave like they did in SWG.I'm glad that you think that slaughtering animals over and over again is fun, but the rest of us think being part of a well written star wars saga with the option to go light or dark is a more interesting way to level your character. But if a mindless grind is your thing you can still do that in this game. Just go off to a spawn and grind until your heart's content or participate in repetitious PVP.
Anchorhead? Really? I visited it maybe twice and rarely ran into anyone there. The majority of players hung out in Theed and Mos Eisley. And if you want to bring planets into the argument you lose that one hands down since we have:
Tython, Korriban,Hutta, Ord Mantel, Coruscant, Balmera, Aldeeran, Dromund Kass, etc.etc.etc. and the majority of these 17 planets will be bigger than any planet SWG ever had.
Plus my game is being made by Bioware while yours was done by SOE, a company that could screw up a perfectly fine cup of coffee.
We have a game being made as a continuation of one the most succcessful games in history while yours was a poor Star Wars simulator that only made hunters, gatherers and crafters happy. You could have taken the Star Wars brand out of it and barely been able to tell the difference.
I don't think you'll find many (any) people out there that won't agree that SOE borked the whole SWG thing.. from the CU onwards... but.. i'd wait until the game is released before making too many assumptions about SW:TOR... unless of course you want these posts to be quoted later on.. with 'i told you so' remarks... the thing about the SWG references .. were not referring to the current game.. but to when the period before the 'fall' when open world PVP was actually.. fairly common.. im sure there must be players who remember the 'TEF's... as for the size and number of planets in SW:TOR vs SWG.. one of the biggest.. or at least most common complaints.. was that the planets in SWG were.. underutilised.. i really hope that Biowares take on their planets is not 'a la' Kashyyk.. which was just plain horrible.. linear.. invisible walls and zoning... no zones or phasing please!! immersion breaking.. hell yes.. but i suppose having a 'break' so you can go put the kettle on while the zone loads.. (dragon age:origins) .. .. .. is more than just a little annoying.. ..
.. btw.. what have you got against crafters etc.. or entertainers for that matter.. social gaming is actually very popular.. but that only matters if you want more people to play the game right
You say we shoud trust FunCom...who brought us Age of Conan...without question...
so uhm.. what you're saying here is that "because i didn't like AoC, it's a reasonable assumption that i won't like Funcom's next game"... right?
...But TERA gives you little reason to believe it won't be a grind, simply on the merits that it is made by a Korean developer?
but what you're saying here is that "even though most korean-made MMOs released have been grinders, it's a mistake to assume that the next one will be as well" .. right?
LOL?
LOL indeed.
i like the way your thinking goes...lol.
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall Currently Playing: ESO
I still don't think that it makes much sense about people comparing a completely Sandbox game (well used to be) to a completely Theme Park game. ToR will not be SWG the only thing similar is the lore of Star Wars.
i really hope that Biowares take on their planets is not 'a la' Kashyyk.. which was just plain horrible.. linear.. invisible walls and zoning... no zones or phasing please!! immersion breaking.. hell yes.. but i suppose having a 'break' so you can go put the kettle on while the zone loads.. (dragon age:origins) .. .. .. is more than just a little annoying.. ..
From what I've seen so far there's no zoning at all, not even when you hit the phased instances which makes it feel like one contiguous world indeed, also no or hardly any invisible walls from what I gathered so far.
There is room phasing, where you step into a phased/instanced area when you enter a room (or set of rooms) or a cave.
The entertainer was an amazing concept, certainly something that is useable in an MMORPG and great for boosting social activity. The SWG designers should have gone for adding themepark/quest styled content, but not replace 1 type of content and gameplay features with another, then SWG could still have been great with a lot of objections and thresholds that non-sandbox MMO gamers had against the game removed. I think that without WoW and its success the NGE would never have happened. But that's a topic for another thread.
I'm speculating on a release of TERA, SWTOR, TSW and GW2 within 2011 or Q1 of 2012 in this order:
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
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Combined content, and RE-PLAY, this is the key feature of it.
Sure Bioware spent alot of money, and time, and multiple voice actors to make the project, but how much will actually be used? I personally have no interest in the glowy-bat swinging side classes, so already their content is 1/2 for me.
Those who want Sith, are really going to re-role-re-play Jedi, just to re-ride the ride?
Rift offered their Rift raids, and how long did that keep players? And if your hoping the IP will keep it's players did Star Trek? Conan? War? or Star Wars galaxies?
Maybe your right, maybe we can re-do SWTOR for 6 months, heck I'm still re-playing Mass Effect.. OH wait I don't have to pay monthly for that re-ride.
Space expansion, is a shooter on rails, not worth $14.99 to many including me. Especially when Black Prophecy, or other experiences offer a better game play.
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not doom an gloom, I'm not a hater, I don't want SWTOR to fail. I am going to pick up a copy, and try it out as the ranged tank is interesting. Still it's kinda sad when this massive undertaking of Star Wars, by Bioware, MMO is comming, and I'm more interested in Ranged tank? that's new.
I think SWTOR will sell fine, be a solid polished release, and would have been an amazing success as a single player console type, but as a reaccuring subscription based MMo? no i think players will come, play and move when they see the ride has ended.
2-3 months, ok maybe a little short.. 3-6?
SWTOR. Face it, in the Scooby Doo Mystery Solving Van of coolness, this game is Velma. In this current MMO climate it has about as much chance for survival as a group of inquisitive teenagers in a 1980s slasher flick. -Tardcore May, 2011
So you like 'herioc' games where you have the same skills, wear the same gear, and carry the same weapons as every other thousand hero's of your 4-9 classes?
I'll take my Master Smuggler/ Weaponsmith over a farmville, or rinse and repeat the same content. anyday.
SWTOR. Face it, in the Scooby Doo Mystery Solving Van of coolness, this game is Velma. In this current MMO climate it has about as much chance for survival as a group of inquisitive teenagers in a 1980s slasher flick. -Tardcore May, 2011
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjIid-hucnE - this video was also meant to hype people up. Video-guys do get better at doing such videos as many companies have shown. Trailer sucked, even at the time (for me at least), but I knew that when I will sit behind the keyboard, it will play much, much better.
And no matter the shitty gameplay shown, I still get the shivers down my spine. Awesome music as well as bringing back buckets of old memories.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
Okay that deserves a ROFLMFAO, I'm still laughing 10 mins later.
-----
The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.
Kotor was one of my favorite games (ME2 is way up there too). As long as SWToR is a good rpg in those same lines I will be happy, the MMO is icing on the cake.
Do we know how basic the crafting in Swtor is? If it's like the majority of MMOs then you will be crafting the same gear as everyone else.
Well Ktanner3, are you sure this is the arguement you wish to have?
Your Sith warrior will send the same Blue Twi'lek companion to gather that every other Sith Warrior has, her name is Vette by the way. She'll hang out in your Sith Fury same as every other Vette for Every other Sith Warrior, but wait it get's better... The SAME starship you have, your Sith Inquisitors have..
Your Sith warrior can choose to Juggernaut, or Marauder advance class, and you won't even have to tell us.. we'll just wait for you to pull out one or two glow sticks just like EVERY other Warrior of your same advance class...
I don't know how cookie cutter you can get? ALL Gunslinger Smugglers carry two pistols, and ALL Scoundrel smugglers have a 'scattergun'
You may craft your own armour, but it's ALL the same warable by Sith Warriors, and we've seen the armor progression vid's.
Lastly how many classes are in SWTOR again? right 8
As to Pre-NGE-SWG being a rinse an repeat? Really? on what server? Mine had entertainers leveling up from being in cantina's, and they were not always in the same spot, we had player cities. Rangers tracking different animal mobs for different stat hides,a nd meat for crafters, Creature handlers captureing mounts, and pets, space.. Sure you could continually run DWB, but it's not like taral V where the hounds drop a purple belt buckle..
OK ok i see Kyrat dragons getting farmed for lightsaber parts, just like 'Battlegrounds.. sorry they're warfronts in here.. get farmed for valor..
We had anchorhead - Bestine world pvp runs, then next time, used a different city.. same thing, right?
SWTOR. Face it, in the Scooby Doo Mystery Solving Van of coolness, this game is Velma. In this current MMO climate it has about as much chance for survival as a group of inquisitive teenagers in a 1980s slasher flick. -Tardcore May, 2011
Everything is rinse and repeat or a grind if you're not having fun with it.
Fun is subjective, what does it for one person doesn't do it for another.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
We know quite a bit about crafting including you won't be crafting the same items as everyone else, there will be rare recipes and crit chances, and limited use recipes. This way certain items will be very sought after, and gathering is done a few different ways, one of which is rather costly but less time consuming.
And you still had cookie cutter builds. SWG was not about the proffessions as much as it was about community interdependency. As for the TOR's companions, Bioware has only showed a few not all and each one of those can be customized to your taste. Yes, TOR is more of a themepark MMORPG and that's what it always will be. Bioware though,has added some sandbox elements here and there, like exploration and crafted items being just as good as looted items, open world pvp, that guilds can run on any planet against other guilds, your ship being your house and some other stuff.
When you get down to it. TOR is a actual SW mmorpg and SWG was a world simulation with very little SW. SOE could have changed the name and removed everything that was SW related and the game still would have played the same and probably ended up in the same condition it still is in today.
TOR will be a very good game if first and foremost you are a fan of anything SW. Second, you actually care about diving deep into character choices and consequences and third, if you love a game that will be polished and full of content, with from the looks of it and from what people who actually played, an all around fun and engaging game.
'If you build it they will come'
By 'it' I mean something decent and new and different and not 'it' as in the regurgitation of the same shite dressed in star wars clothes. I know it seems like insanity to verge away from the proven, successful wow-iant format and 'it's a business and they want to make money so no one's going to take risks going off the path on a potential flop'. However, I'll bet the commentary of this period of gaming in a few years time will be 'how did no one put a decent effort into reading the forums thoroughly, taking notes and realising that a huge amount of the audience viewed this approach cynically, the fools could have cleaned up the market for years and made everyone very happy at the same time'. Diminishing returns gents, diminishing returns.
I have no invested interest in Rift whatsoever since I'm not playing it nor planning to, but I am curious about player activity and behaviour so I've been keeping track of a number of data.
So far it seems that Rift is slowly balancing out on a rough average of about 65% of 1st-month player population (XFire+Steam+Raptr), it has a higher retention rate than WAR had in its first months and there's absolutely nowhere near the uproar that was present around AoC. Anyone who thinks that AoC's and Rift's first post-launch months are the same when it comes to player (dis)satisfaction is I think clearly suffering from selective memory recall.
Will Rift hold on to 65% of its initial player population? Hmm, it'll probably lower more in the upcoming months, but the decrease rate has become less than it was, with recent player activity figures that aren't that different from 3 weeks or so ago.
Will they need to merge servers? Yeah, I think that in some moment in time this year they certainly will need to, imo they opened too many servers, 10-15 less would've been better, that last batch of server additions was just too much and not needed.
So far, Rift's launch and post-launch status comes far closer to how it was with LotrO than how it was with AoC or WAR, and definitely leagues better than DCUO's. We'll see how it develops over the months.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
To all disgruntled SWG vets: You will play TOR, and you will like it.
Not even sure what Niquity is trying to say there. I am not normally one for playing the English Teacher, but that was so garbled that I couldn't even peice it together after several attempts. Hopefully he/she does better on the next post.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
Corellian Courgette, man that's funny
-----
The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
+1000000000000
All we heard about was how all these great AAA title were coming and the two best ones don't look like they'll be coming this year.
Currently Playing: Perpetuum
MMOs Played (most time spent to least): World of Warcraft (BG/Open world PvP focused), Lord of the Rings Online (PvMP focused), Warhammer Online (BG PvP focused), Global Agenda, Age of Conan, DC Universe Online (PvP focused), Runes of Magic, Allods, Aion, Fallen Earth
Let me...wrap my mind about this...
You say we shoud trust FunCom...who brought us Age of Conan...without question...
...But TERA gives you little reason to believe it won't be a grind, simply on the merits that it is made by a Korean developer?
LOL?
If you want a "decent MMO for 2011", you have one. It's called Rift. It's certainly far from amazing, but if "decent" is your standard, that's what you have. SWTOR will be next year's Rift. Except it'll have all the boring parts (i.e. solo questing) and none of the good parts (i.e. dynamic content). So if you want a "decent MMO for 2012", you'll have SWTOR. Hopefully.
The saddest thing is that "decent" is really the best we can hope for these days. I'm eagerly awaiting TSW, but even that doesn't look like it'll be much more than "decent". The hopes for "Good" or "Great" mmo now lie mostly with WoD and only because little to nothing is known about it - it's easy to expect greatness when there is no evidence to the contrary.
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO
Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall
Currently Playing: ESO
I don't think you'll find many (any) people out there that won't agree that SOE borked the whole SWG thing.. from the CU onwards... but.. i'd wait until the game is released before making too many assumptions about SW:TOR... unless of course you want these posts to be quoted later on.. with 'i told you so' remarks... the thing about the SWG references .. were not referring to the current game.. but to when the period before the 'fall' when open world PVP was actually.. fairly common.. im sure there must be players who remember the 'TEF's... as for the size and number of planets in SW:TOR vs SWG.. one of the biggest.. or at least most common complaints.. was that the planets in SWG were.. underutilised.. i really hope that Biowares take on their planets is not 'a la' Kashyyk.. which was just plain horrible.. linear.. invisible walls and zoning... no zones or phasing please!! immersion breaking.. hell yes.. but i suppose having a 'break' so you can go put the kettle on while the zone loads.. (dragon age:origins
) .. .. .. is more than just a little annoying.. ..
.. btw.. what have you got against crafters etc.. or entertainers for that matter.. social gaming is actually very popular.. but that only matters if you want more people to play the game right
i like the way your thinking goes...lol.
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO
Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall
Currently Playing: ESO
I still don't think that it makes much sense about people comparing a completely Sandbox game (well used to be) to a completely Theme Park game. ToR will not be SWG the only thing similar is the lore of Star Wars.
From what I've seen so far there's no zoning at all, not even when you hit the phased instances which makes it feel like one contiguous world indeed, also no or hardly any invisible walls from what I gathered so far.
There is room phasing, where you step into a phased/instanced area when you enter a room (or set of rooms) or a cave.
The entertainer was an amazing concept, certainly something that is useable in an MMORPG and great for boosting social activity. The SWG designers should have gone for adding themepark/quest styled content, but not replace 1 type of content and gameplay features with another, then SWG could still have been great with a lot of objections and thresholds that non-sandbox MMO gamers had against the game removed. I think that without WoW and its success the NGE would never have happened. But that's a topic for another thread.
I'm speculating on a release of TERA, SWTOR, TSW and GW2 within 2011 or Q1 of 2012 in this order:
September/October 2011: SWTOR
late 2011 - January 2012: TSW, TERA
Late Q1 2012 (maybe overflow into Q2): GW2
Q1/Q2 2012: Firefall
Q2/3 2012: ArcheAge
Pure speculation of course
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."