The problem I have with this game is not the graphics or age but lack of subscribers.
This.
I'd gladly pay $20 a month if the population was what it used to be.
At what level would that be? What do you think made them go away?
I think hey went away the same reason I went away, lack of tactical depth, you do things the same way over and over and over and over and over again then you get bored of it. It happens in all different types of games, people get bored of WOW cause they do the same things over and over and over and over and over and over again and then get bored of it. So the solution is tactical depth so you're not doing the same things over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. Simulating logistics would solve that, instead of Capture The Flag Deluxe.
This isn't a Half-Life game with loading sequences every level. It would be impossible for the game to do what it does now with top of the line graphics. When in game you whip out your binoculars and look off into the distance and you can spot infantry and armor moving at over 2 virtual kms away! Draw distance trumps graphics in a war simulation game, I couldn't stress this fact enought. The only way games these days can achieve this kind of draw distance with top of the line graphics would be to put up invisible walls ... and everyone HATEs invisible walls(at least they should).
This game does away with irrelevant graphics to be able to provide hundreds of players a battleground with no boundaries and with as little lag as possible and I feel they have achieved this. The population is abit on the low side but that only means the 100 vs 100 battles for a town that happen right now happen only during peak times. Which is why a few of my CoD:BO friends see it as a bit boring, but I would rather do a 100 vs 100 1hr war(not to mention combined arms to boot) once a night with cheap graphics(however we have already covered this) then the monotonous(and unrealistic) 6 vs 6 catfight all night long.
Yes (to be honest and fair) I too believe that squads took a dive around 2005 - which is VERY sad because this environment is best geared for squads (included and incorporated into the HC).
But there are still squads out there who thrive, and you can always tell the difference between attacks just randomly being setup and those that are being setup by either a squad, more squads or HC along with squad(s).
My squad ALLFOR still field some 30-40 on squad nights, and we field in these days around 15-20 on a normal day peak, and 5-10 in low-pop.
My squad is also not what it once was, but that's not because of particular mechanics or game systems, it's just that players drifted away and perhaps CRS has allowed the squad game to drift unattended for a while.
It wouldn't take much in terms of squad development (battle comms) to bring squads back
Playing WWIIOL alongside squadmates is like no other game I've experienced.
And the more diciplined an outfit you are in - the more the game shine!
Im sorry but squads of todays ww2online do not match the squads that once held sway in this game. In ethier numbers tactics or combined ops. Today when someone shows a picture of there squad in action you might see 10 to 20 players. Back in the day a screen shot of say a squad like SG would feel the picture with tags for as far as the eye could see and that was just the land portion of the attacks not includeing air. The norm was 40 to 50 tanks about 100 inf and 20 to 30 air . Thats right 150 to 200 man attacks pulled off by one squad. 101st of which i was apart of could muster almost 100 guys our self on squad night and where most of the time used as lead assualt troops for alot of 3 corps operations.
Even the mention of todays squads in comparison to what this game has seen is a insult . Any one of the larger squads of old ww2online could wipe the floor with the instant action groups/squads we got in game today.
And the more diciplined an outfit you are in - the more the game shine!
Even the mention of todays squads in comparison to what this game has seen is a insult . Any one of the larger squads of old ww2online could wipe the floor with the instant action groups/squads we got in game today.
And the more diciplined an outfit you are in - the more the game shine!
Even the mention of todays squads in comparison to what this game has seen is a insult . Any one of the larger squads of old ww2online could wipe the floor with the instant action groups/squads we got in game today.
Prove it!
Wish I could but those days are gone.And even if I was to come back It would not effect the rats path of turning a once great game into a instant action gank fest or bring squads back as a driveing force in the game.
But with that said you know its true stug noway the squads playing today could deal with a group of guys who planned out there attacks days in advance covering everything from Cap,Supply,Supply cuts,Transport of troops,Groups for assault,Defense be that depot or FB. It would be a slaughter not to mention these guys would not just drive down the road from the Fb to hit a town they might drive hours to attack with armor from a direction you didnt expect. Guys who cant be asked to even guard a flag building for more than 10 mins are not going to beat a crew that developed patience and deciplne to a art form while on attack or defense.Would give them a idea about what really being camped is about though lol.:)
Despite the negativity, the game still rewards cohesive squad play
The new(ish) capture mechanics allow for amazingly tense street battles around hot CPs, players inside and out exchanging fire and grenades. I'll accept that there's room for developing the group mechanic/UID but at its rawest, this game still delivers very tense, adrenalin-fuelled combat
Biggest change in squads I've seen (even way back squads came in all sizes) is the comms and patience. Used to be a lot more guarding, working together, sightings reported, tactics etc. On the free 'welcome backs' the squad stuff I saw wasn't that.
As a ATG lover, instead of getting support while pushing out or setting up, you get passed by the whole town inventory of tanks in their rush to meet the enemy head on. With the old squads, a few newbies might have done that, only to be given advice to setup and wait for them to come to you. Usually it was all ATGs spawning as tanks were held back for a counter or FB busting, took squad disipline. Now it's rush to get action while you can, logoff once tanks are used up. Not entirely squads fault as with the large AO requirements and smaller squads a good squad can't stop others from griefing.
Funniest was in Chimany, defending on the reverse slop of that S hill with ATG. Saw one guy take tank after tank (and yes driving past my ATG) over the crest only to die in under a minute, all the while being 'helpful' reporting to the squad what he saw seconds before dying. Then 10 min later it's the 'oh no, out of tanks, town is going to fall. In my old squad, that would get a WTF after the first tank and a lesson on reverse slope defense.
Squads are mostly just a group of players with the same tag who can share info on the magic radar. That doesn't mean there isn't one out there that still does, but I'm curious to know how with the one or two AOs running they can get equipment to actually use before it's all griefed away.
Despite the negativity, the game still rewards cohesive squad play
The new(ish) capture mechanics allow for amazingly tense street battles around hot CPs, players inside and out exchanging fire and grenades. I'll accept that there's room for developing the group mechanic/UID but at its rawest, this game still delivers very tense, adrenalin-fuelled combat
See thats the problem alot of the older guys dont want spawn die spawn die quake style of play. They dont want star gates opening in there rear areas cause 1 guy got by the line of defense.Etc etc...... the list goes on and on. If they wanted that style of play they could go out and play a hit point sandbox shooter with tons better graphics than what BE can put forth.
I really feel sad for the guys who never got to exp. large squad play and the tactics and organized play it provided. Sure things took longer to get going but you really felt like you where apart of something bigger. And the feeling you got when you did manage to cap a town was 100x better because of it.
I played the game years ago. It really was alot of fun for a while but you can only fight the same map so many times (at least for me). They were supposed to do other theatres- what happened to that? Anyway, I certainly wouldn't come back for the same game at $18 a month.
Squads have been using the same sophomoric useless tactics since day one, in 2001, that's why players stopped playing in squads, they got tired of dying all the time. High Command functions like another useless squad with useless tactics, it's why players don't listen to HC also.
And the more diciplined an outfit you are in - the more the game shine!
Im sorry but squads of todays ww2online do not match the squads that once held sway in this game. In ethier numbers tactics or combined ops. Today when someone shows a picture of there squad in action you might see 10 to 20 players. Back in the day a screen shot of say a squad like SG would feel the picture with tags for as far as the eye could see and that was just the land portion of the attacks not includeing air. The norm was 40 to 50 tanks about 100 inf and 20 to 30 air . Thats right 150 to 200 man attacks pulled off by one squad. 101st of which i was apart of could muster almost 100 guys our self on squad night and where most of the time used as lead assualt troops for alot of 3 corps operations.
Even the mention of todays squads in comparison to what this game has seen is a insult . Any one of the larger squads of old ww2online could wipe the floor with the instant action groups/squads we got in game today.
Numbers doesn't equate to tactics or quality. The only thing SG could do successfully was exploit game mechanics like simul-cap, but when it comes to regular tactics they are still a bunch of zerg who got slaughtered with their sophomoric tactics.
Originally posted by LydarSynn I played the game years ago. It really was alot of fun for a while but you can only fight the same map so many times (at least for me). They were supposed to do other theatres- what happened to that? Anyway, I certainly wouldn't come back for the same game at $18 a month.
After 10 years of playing this game, I still from time to time fight battles in towns I have not been in before.
And the "same map" you talk about has over 400 towns, not quite the same as playing Karkhand over and over in BF2 ehh...
Tactical play is still out there in the game to say the least!
Yesterday in Liege I saw a group of Infanrty I was hunting with a Squaddie use a morterman to put rounds around a small tented area to destroy it. They then stormed it with an SMG and support.
I had been using those tents as cover, and had pulled back and was able to watch them work.
There is plenty of tactics to be had in the game, if your willing to find them and try them. I think because the game is 10 years old a lot of people have "been there" and "done that" and in doing so forget potential new players haven't.
I don't think people realise or know the potential for the game like we do in our own ways.
The big cities and the river cities were always the best. One just for sheer size of map (can't be zerged) and the other for chokepoints meaning you don't get surrounded by MSP. Had always wished they put a MSP range limit away from the FB in order to make somewhat of a combat line (whack-a-mole gets tiring). It was nuts that there was just as much chance of enemy coming from behind you as in front, or in the usual case the direction of the closest forrest.
BTW I didn't say the potential isn't there, as the others mentioned it's somewhat of an issue with the players creating it. Always been a bit of an issue even way back. When with all the option available you had the easist camping usually being used. From what I've seen with squads gone and the different playerbase it's even more so. You can be tactical as you want and spend 30 min pushing an ATG, finding the best postion with guarded flanks and good FOV. It's all meaningless when you see your whole tank spawn list drive past you to meet the enemy head on. Just wasn't worth the time (even free, I stopped doing ATGs on free weeks) having it get lost in the zergs.
I played the game years ago. It really was alot of fun for a while but you can only fight the same map so many times (at least for me). They were supposed to do other theatres- what happened to that? Anyway, I certainly wouldn't come back for the same game at $18 a month.
After 10 years of playing this game, I still from time to time fight battles in towns I have not been in before.
And the "same map" you talk about has over 400 towns, not quite the same as playing Karkhand over and over in BF2 ehh...
Yeah that's one good thing (but not the only) about it, although so often it's those same center cities. I always loved the crazy hilly South East side but so often the map would race past that (as one side looks about to win) and you'd miss all those cities while you're away. I do have some fond memories of being on a hill top basically shelling a city with bofor, good times
Which reminds me, being able to tow your own weapon would be a killer step in getting some to come back.
Comments
This.
I'd gladly pay $20 a month if the population was what it used to be.
At what level would that be? What do you think made them go away?
I think hey went away the same reason I went away, lack of tactical depth, you do things the same way over and over and over and over and over again then you get bored of it. It happens in all different types of games, people get bored of WOW cause they do the same things over and over and over and over and over and over again and then get bored of it. So the solution is tactical depth so you're not doing the same things over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. Simulating logistics would solve that, instead of Capture The Flag Deluxe.
Well I do not get boored, and IMO every day is different - which is also why I love the game, and that it has lived so long as it has.
I also play for the commeraderie etc..
There's only so many ways to capture the flag: up, down, left, right, and all diagnolly.
You don't play this game for the pretty graphics.
This isn't a Half-Life game with loading sequences every level. It would be impossible for the game to do what it does now with top of the line graphics. When in game you whip out your binoculars and look off into the distance and you can spot infantry and armor moving at over 2 virtual kms away! Draw distance trumps graphics in a war simulation game, I couldn't stress this fact enought. The only way games these days can achieve this kind of draw distance with top of the line graphics would be to put up invisible walls ... and everyone HATEs invisible walls(at least they should).
This game does away with irrelevant graphics to be able to provide hundreds of players a battleground with no boundaries and with as little lag as possible and I feel they have achieved this. The population is abit on the low side but that only means the 100 vs 100 battles for a town that happen right now happen only during peak times. Which is why a few of my CoD:BO friends see it as a bit boring, but I would rather do a 100 vs 100 1hr war(not to mention combined arms to boot) once a night with cheap graphics(however we have already covered this) then the monotonous(and unrealistic) 6 vs 6 catfight all night long.
2002-2004 levels?
TOEs?
Death of the Squads?
Yes (to be honest and fair) I too believe that squads took a dive around 2005 - which is VERY sad because this environment is best geared for squads (included and incorporated into the HC).
But there are still squads out there who thrive, and you can always tell the difference between attacks just randomly being setup and those that are being setup by either a squad, more squads or HC along with squad(s).
My squad ALLFOR still field some 30-40 on squad nights, and we field in these days around 15-20 on a normal day peak, and 5-10 in low-pop.
My squad is also not what it once was, but that's not because of particular mechanics or game systems, it's just that players drifted away and perhaps CRS has allowed the squad game to drift unattended for a while.
It wouldn't take much in terms of squad development (battle comms) to bring squads back
Playing WWIIOL alongside squadmates is like no other game I've experienced.
SWG > Aces High > WWIIOL
Still awesome, on axis side 91st squad is a very disciplined one.
And the more diciplined an outfit you are in - the more the game shine!
Im sorry but squads of todays ww2online do not match the squads that once held sway in this game. In ethier numbers tactics or combined ops. Today when someone shows a picture of there squad in action you might see 10 to 20 players. Back in the day a screen shot of say a squad like SG would feel the picture with tags for as far as the eye could see and that was just the land portion of the attacks not includeing air. The norm was 40 to 50 tanks about 100 inf and 20 to 30 air . Thats right 150 to 200 man attacks pulled off by one squad. 101st of which i was apart of could muster almost 100 guys our self on squad night and where most of the time used as lead assualt troops for alot of 3 corps operations.
Even the mention of todays squads in comparison to what this game has seen is a insult . Any one of the larger squads of old ww2online could wipe the floor with the instant action groups/squads we got in game today.
Prove it!
Wish I could but those days are gone.And even if I was to come back It would not effect the rats path of turning a once great game into a instant action gank fest or bring squads back as a driveing force in the game.
But with that said you know its true stug noway the squads playing today could deal with a group of guys who planned out there attacks days in advance covering everything from Cap,Supply,Supply cuts,Transport of troops,Groups for assault,Defense be that depot or FB. It would be a slaughter not to mention these guys would not just drive down the road from the Fb to hit a town they might drive hours to attack with armor from a direction you didnt expect. Guys who cant be asked to even guard a flag building for more than 10 mins are not going to beat a crew that developed patience and deciplne to a art form while on attack or defense.Would give them a idea about what really being camped is about though lol.:)
Despite the negativity, the game still rewards cohesive squad play
The new(ish) capture mechanics allow for amazingly tense street battles around hot CPs, players inside and out exchanging fire and grenades. I'll accept that there's room for developing the group mechanic/UID but at its rawest, this game still delivers very tense, adrenalin-fuelled combat
SWG > Aces High > WWIIOL
Biggest change in squads I've seen (even way back squads came in all sizes) is the comms and patience. Used to be a lot more guarding, working together, sightings reported, tactics etc. On the free 'welcome backs' the squad stuff I saw wasn't that.
As a ATG lover, instead of getting support while pushing out or setting up, you get passed by the whole town inventory of tanks in their rush to meet the enemy head on. With the old squads, a few newbies might have done that, only to be given advice to setup and wait for them to come to you. Usually it was all ATGs spawning as tanks were held back for a counter or FB busting, took squad disipline. Now it's rush to get action while you can, logoff once tanks are used up. Not entirely squads fault as with the large AO requirements and smaller squads a good squad can't stop others from griefing.
Funniest was in Chimany, defending on the reverse slop of that S hill with ATG. Saw one guy take tank after tank (and yes driving past my ATG) over the crest only to die in under a minute, all the while being 'helpful' reporting to the squad what he saw seconds before dying. Then 10 min later it's the 'oh no, out of tanks, town is going to fall. In my old squad, that would get a WTF after the first tank and a lesson on reverse slope defense.
Squads are mostly just a group of players with the same tag who can share info on the magic radar. That doesn't mean there isn't one out there that still does, but I'm curious to know how with the one or two AOs running they can get equipment to actually use before it's all griefed away.
See thats the problem alot of the older guys dont want spawn die spawn die quake style of play. They dont want star gates opening in there rear areas cause 1 guy got by the line of defense.Etc etc...... the list goes on and on. If they wanted that style of play they could go out and play a hit point sandbox shooter with tons better graphics than what BE can put forth.
I really feel sad for the guys who never got to exp. large squad play and the tactics and organized play it provided. Sure things took longer to get going but you really felt like you where apart of something bigger. And the feeling you got when you did manage to cap a town was 100x better because of it.
I played the game years ago. It really was alot of fun for a while but you can only fight the same map so many times (at least for me). They were supposed to do other theatres- what happened to that? Anyway, I certainly wouldn't come back for the same game at $18 a month.
Squads have been using the same sophomoric useless tactics since day one, in 2001, that's why players stopped playing in squads, they got tired of dying all the time. High Command functions like another useless squad with useless tactics, it's why players don't listen to HC also.
Numbers doesn't equate to tactics or quality. The only thing SG could do successfully was exploit game mechanics like simul-cap, but when it comes to regular tactics they are still a bunch of zerg who got slaughtered with their sophomoric tactics.
After 10 years of playing this game, I still from time to time fight battles in towns I have not been in before.
And the "same map" you talk about has over 400 towns, not quite the same as playing Karkhand over and over in BF2 ehh...
Tactical play is still out there in the game to say the least!
Yesterday in Liege I saw a group of Infanrty I was hunting with a Squaddie use a morterman to put rounds around a small tented area to destroy it. They then stormed it with an SMG and support.
I had been using those tents as cover, and had pulled back and was able to watch them work.
There is plenty of tactics to be had in the game, if your willing to find them and try them. I think because the game is 10 years old a lot of people have "been there" and "done that" and in doing so forget potential new players haven't.
I don't think people realise or know the potential for the game like we do in our own ways.
Whilst this game has come across my radar a few times in the past, the only thing that did put me off was the subscription rate.
The big cities and the river cities were always the best. One just for sheer size of map (can't be zerged) and the other for chokepoints meaning you don't get surrounded by MSP. Had always wished they put a MSP range limit away from the FB in order to make somewhat of a combat line (whack-a-mole gets tiring). It was nuts that there was just as much chance of enemy coming from behind you as in front, or in the usual case the direction of the closest forrest.
BTW I didn't say the potential isn't there, as the others mentioned it's somewhat of an issue with the players creating it. Always been a bit of an issue even way back. When with all the option available you had the easist camping usually being used. From what I've seen with squads gone and the different playerbase it's even more so. You can be tactical as you want and spend 30 min pushing an ATG, finding the best postion with guarded flanks and good FOV. It's all meaningless when you see your whole tank spawn list drive past you to meet the enemy head on. Just wasn't worth the time (even free, I stopped doing ATGs on free weeks) having it get lost in the zergs.
Yeah that's one good thing (but not the only) about it, although so often it's those same center cities. I always loved the crazy hilly South East side but so often the map would race past that (as one side looks about to win) and you'd miss all those cities while you're away. I do have some fond memories of being on a hill top basically shelling a city with bofor, good times
Which reminds me, being able to tow your own weapon would be a killer step in getting some to come back.