The CSM fucked up when they stopped CCP from just plain out sell skill points. If CCP could sell skill points for $ they really would not need any other revnue stream.
Just saying.
But oooooh, noooo. Buying skill point would be bad be course that would mean that the (imho equally unfair) advantage old chars have in the game over new ones, would be in jeopardy.
Idiots. CSM 5 that is...
Are you reallly that interested in the cashshop that you compare this to the fact that prices in the cashshop is expensive.
I can not understand the tears from people that can not afford a monocle and they are not the same as those tears that would be shed if we had skillpoints in the cashshop.
Oh no! CCP have to sell expensive monocles in the cashshop because they could not sell cheap skillpiints. Oh no! CCP blatently says the need to make a profit fron their games. At least they could humble about it, they hurt my feelings.
The CSM fucked up when they stopped CCP from just plain out sell skill points. If CCP could sell skill points for $ they really would not need any other revnue stream.
Just saying.
But oooooh, noooo. Buying skill point would be bad be course that would mean that the (imho equally unfair) advantage old chars have in the game over new ones, would be in jeopardy.
Idiots. CSM 5 that is...
Are you reallly that interested in the cashshop that you compare this to the fact that prices in the cashshop is expensive.
I can not understand the tears from people that can not afford a monocle and they are not the same as those tears that would be shed if we had skillpoints in the cashshop.
Oh no! CCP have to sell expensive monocles in the cashshop because they could not sell cheap skillpiints. Oh no! CCP blatently says the need to make a profit fron their games. At least they could humble about it, they hurt my feelings.
Oh well, what the hell......CSM 5 is not the one without a clue.
The problem with selling things that matter, like skill points, is that it gives a major advantage to the older vets that know how to play. For Example, need a few super cap pilots and you have people that know how to fly them in your alliance.....there you go!
Others, like you, get practically no benefit.
In fact, if players could really buy their way in, most of the ones without any experience would just lose the money, then realize how hard EVE really is, and quit. I would hurt the number of people that make it out of high sec. This would be really bad for the game.
It's not a question of what people want, it just wouldn't work in this game. However, it would give bitter old vets the ability to create clones all over eve.
It really is amazing to me how many players actually hold to the ideal that for a game to be noble its developers must work for free. Well, ok, maybe free takes it too far - maybe they should allow themselves to make about $30k per year - but that's it. The rest goes back into the game!
Imo, if someone makes a game that 300k+ people like to play on a daily basis, that someone and their company deserves to make a very nice living. And if that someone has half a brain, he or she milk it for all it's worth. Do you think EVE will last forever? What's the half-life do you suppose? 10 more years? 15? Will that get the developers to retirement age? And at the end of those 10 years they're supposed to have done - what? Sunk every penny back into their game that will have become a sinking ship and have nothing to show for themselves, hoping beyond hope that they can develop another hit game? If they can turn a million dollar profit now into 2 million they should do it. 10 mil possible through multi-colored monocles? Do that then. It will keep them happy, their high paid workers happy, and their players happy when a lot of the profit gets reinvested into the game.
Or maybe you'll someday find your idealistic game. The one where people don't always strive for bigger and better. The one where they are content to sit on their $30k salary and are never motivated to do more because they're perfectly satisfied with their very low population of players that is keeping them alive and their ideal of "everything for my players" will never allow them further personal achievement anyway, so why bother? Of course, your game won't get very many updates and won't have a marketing budget to draw more players, but I'm sure it will be an idillic enough online society that you'll never feel the need to leave.
I was pleasantly surprised when I went from Apprentice to full 5 star Elite in under 2 months. I was pleasantly surprised again when I went from Elite to just barely Hardcore in 2 weeks. Apprentice, here I come!
Well, if this is legit and they have done the same in the past. then CCP needs to sell out to a real game company soon because mocking your customers isn't exactly good public relations. Jeez, even EA isn't that stupid, and that is saying something. You might think your customers are idiots. You might even joke about them with coworkers, but putting it into writing is beyond stupid.
It really is amazing to me how many players actually hold to the ideal that for a game to be noble its developers must work for free. Well, ok, maybe free takes it too far - maybe they should allow themselves to make about $30k per year - but that's it. The rest goes back into the game!
Imo, if someone makes a game that 300k+ people like to play on a daily basis, that someone and their company deserves to make a very nice living. And if that someone has half a brain, he or she milk it for all it's worth. Do you think EVE will last forever? What's the half-life do you suppose? 10 more years? 15? Will that get the developers to retirement age? And at the end of those 10 years they're supposed to have done - what? Sunk every penny back into their game that will have become a sinking ship and have nothing to show for themselves, hoping beyond hope that they can develop another hit game? If they can turn a million dollar profit now into 2 million they should do it. 10 mil possible through multi-colored monocles? Do that then. It will keep them happy, their high paid workers happy, and their players happy when a lot of the profit gets reinvested into the game.
Or maybe you'll someday find your idealistic game. The one where people don't always strive for bigger and better. The one where they are content to sit on their $30k salary and are never motivated to do more because they're perfectly satisfied with their very low population of players that is keeping them alive and their ideal of "everything for my players" will never allow them further personal achievement anyway, so why bother? Of course, your game won't get very many updates and won't have a marketing budget to draw more players, but I'm sure it will be an idillic enough online society that you'll never feel the need to leave.
You see this argument in most games and on most forums concerning this issue, the argument that "hey maaan, it's a business maaan, they are there to make money maaaaaaan". I'm surprised so many consumers have swallowed this corporate BS so easily. A company does not exist to make a profit, a company exists to create a good product or service. Being profitable is supposed to be an indicator of providing a good service or product. Part of the problem is that not only have a lot of business people forgotten this simple fact, but so too have the consumers. Today the focus is on the profit and putting in the least amount of effort to create a passable product or service that will get them there. It's all backwards mate and wallowing in mediocrity.
The issue that has caused so much furor among the playerbase is that they feel betrayed by CCP. I'm sure most players would laugh and forgive them for the stupidity of making comsetic items in-game as or more expensive than their counterparts in real life, but the thing that sticks in their throats is the mention of pay-to-win items and of monetizing every aspect of the game.
For many players in EvE, taking the game in this direction is not indicative of a good product. Moreover, in a genre that is becoming saturated with cash grabbing games the players feel even more let down. Honestly, I'm starting to think that the fact that none of the big companies took the risk to increase their monthly sub price in line with inflation has hurt us all in the long term.
But let us not get ahead of ourselves, the validity of the document is still in question and so is the purpose of it.
You see this argument in most games and on most forums concerning this issue, the argument that "hey maaan, it's a business maaan, they are there to make money maaaaaaan". I'm surprised so many consumers have swallowed this corporate BS so easily. A company does not exist to make a profit, a company exists to create a good product or service. Being profitable is supposed to be an indicator of providing a good service or product. Part of the problem is that not only have a lot of business people forgotten this simple fact, but so too have the consumers. Today the focus is on the profit and putting in the least amount of effort to create a passable product or service that will get them there. It's all backwards mate and wallowing in mediocrity.
You see this argument in most games and on most forums concerning this issue, the argument that "hey maaan, it's a business maaan, they are there to make money maaaaaaan". I'm surprised so many consumers have swallowed this corporate BS so easily. A company does not exist to make a profit, a company exists to create a good product or service. Being profitable is supposed to be an indicator of providing a good service or product. Part of the problem is that not only have a lot of business people forgotten this simple fact, but so too have the consumers. Today the focus is on the profit and putting in the least amount of effort to create a passable product or service that will get them there. It's all backwards mate and wallowing in mediocrity.
What the hell planet are you from?
The planet where a company does not exist to make a profit but exists by making a profit.
You see this argument in most games and on most forums concerning this issue, the argument that "hey maaan, it's a business maaan, they are there to make money maaaaaaan". I'm surprised so many consumers have swallowed this corporate BS so easily. A company does not exist to make a profit, a company exists to create a good product or service. Being profitable is supposed to be an indicator of providing a good service or product. Part of the problem is that not only have a lot of business people forgotten this simple fact, but so too have the consumers. Today the focus is on the profit and putting in the least amount of effort to create a passable product or service that will get them there. It's all backwards mate and wallowing in mediocrity.
What the hell planet are you from?
The planet where a company does not exist to make a profit but exists by making a profit.
thats lala land, companies from the dawn of time have existed to make money so that the owner can make money and fee his family and provide a future for all off spring, they did not go will this is a damn good product but its to expensive for anyone to buy but I am going to keep making it go broke and starve becuase its for the betterment of mankind I die brining people this product and all my employees are going to agree with philosphy when I no longer pay them.
but on subject, CCP can offer a monocle for $1000 as far as I am concerened as long as thye dont allow pay to win, in the form of wepaons, blue prints, special ships etc.
As long as its vanity items charge what ever they want
You see this argument in most games and on most forums concerning this issue, the argument that "hey maaan, it's a business maaan, they are there to make money maaaaaaan". I'm surprised so many consumers have swallowed this corporate BS so easily. A company does not exist to make a profit, a company exists to create a good product or service. Being profitable is supposed to be an indicator of providing a good service or product. Part of the problem is that not only have a lot of business people forgotten this simple fact, but so too have the consumers. Today the focus is on the profit and putting in the least amount of effort to create a passable product or service that will get them there. It's all backwards mate and wallowing in mediocrity.
What the hell planet are you from?
The planet where a company does not exist to make a profit but exists by making a profit.
thats lala land, companies from the dawn of time have existed to make money so that the owner can make money and fee his family and provide a future for all off spring, they did not go will this is a damn good product but its to expensive for anyone to buy but I am going to keep making it go broke and starve becuase its for the betterment of mankind I die brining people this product and all my employees are going to agree with philosphy when I no longer pay them.
but on subject, CCP can offer a monocle for $1000 as far as I am concerened as long as thye dont allow pay to win, in the form of wepaons, blue prints, special ships etc.
As long as its vanity items charge what ever they want
I'm not saying companies shouldn't make a profit. What I am saying is that the profit shouldn't be their single primary concern. Acting in self-interest is not a bad thing, pursuing it ruthlessly is.
It really is amazing to me how many players actually hold to the ideal that for a game to be noble its developers must work for free. Well, ok, maybe free takes it too far - maybe they should allow themselves to make about $30k per year - but that's it. The rest goes back into the game!
Imo, if someone makes a game that 300k+ people like to play on a daily basis, that someone and their company deserves to make a very nice living. And if that someone has half a brain, he or she milk it for all it's worth. Do you think EVE will last forever? What's the half-life do you suppose? 10 more years? 15? Will that get the developers to retirement age? And at the end of those 10 years they're supposed to have done - what? Sunk every penny back into their game that will have become a sinking ship and have nothing to show for themselves, hoping beyond hope that they can develop another hit game? If they can turn a million dollar profit now into 2 million they should do it. 10 mil possible through multi-colored monocles? Do that then. It will keep them happy, their high paid workers happy, and their players happy when a lot of the profit gets reinvested into the game.
Or maybe you'll someday find your idealistic game. The one where people don't always strive for bigger and better. The one where they are content to sit on their $30k salary and are never motivated to do more because they're perfectly satisfied with their very low population of players that is keeping them alive and their ideal of "everything for my players" will never allow them further personal achievement anyway, so why bother? Of course, your game won't get very many updates and won't have a marketing budget to draw more players, but I'm sure it will be an idillic enough online society that you'll never feel the need to leave.
" A company does not exist to make a profit, a company exists to create a good product or service" This had me lmao!
Who cares? CCP is a company. Companys find ways to make money. There is nothing wrong about turning a profit. Get a job...
The problem is that ccp is very likely adding pay for advantage to eve and that the money isn't going back into eve but instead going into other games for development.
Dust, Incarna, World of darkness, all are getting more of ccp's money then the parts of eve players actually participate in. It took 3 years for them to create a single box you can walk around with your avatar in when since the begining players have been saying they don't want it.
Every expansion is still incomplete when the next one rolls out.
We're waiting on engine trails, cyno effects, a gallente cosmos arc, two unfinished pirate epic arcs, Faction warfare to be updated so it isn't based on grinding lp with a dram+ bomber, a response to the caldari FW side winning and having 100% of the territory(beyond the hotfix to just reset control), two classes of T3's that were planned for expansion release about two years ago. CCP rolled back a chunk of the changes in dominion because they were poorly implemented, PI has 0 interaction with other players on planet, no conflict or scarcity assosiated with it despite that being planned for release. Incursion was a decent expansion, just straight copy paste sleepers to known space and change their skin to a skin that's old. Oh yeah and incarna is a single player box.
Who cares? CCP is a company. Companys find ways to make money. There is nothing wrong about turning a profit. Get a job...
The problem is that ccp is very likely adding pay for advantage to eve and that the money isn't going back into eve but instead going into other games for development.
Dust, Incarna, World of darkness, all are getting more of ccp's money then the parts of eve players actually participate in. It took 3 years for them to create a single box you can walk around with your avatar in when since the begining players have been saying they don't want it.
Every expansion is still incomplete when the next one rolls out.
We're waiting on engine trails, cyno effects, a gallente cosmos arc, two unfinished pirate epic arcs, Faction warfare to be updated so it isn't based on grinding lp with a dram+ bomber, a response to the caldari FW side winning and having 100% of the territory(beyond the hotfix to just reset control), two classes of T3's that were planned for expansion release about two years ago. CCP rolled back a chunk of the changes in dominion because they were poorly implemented, PI has 0 interaction with other players on planet, no conflict or scarcity assosiated with it despite that being planned for release. Incursion was a decent expansion, just straight copy paste sleepers to known space and change their skin to a skin that's old. Oh yeah and incarna is a single player box.
I would have to agree that it take CCP FOREVER to produce updates etc.. Not going to argue with you there. Just sick of the anti company/profit cry babies. Now if CCP produces a bad product = less custermers = less profit.
if you take care of your community, it will take care of you. CCP was doing this for the most part, for the first couple of years. their desire to make profit has alienated all but the most naive of noobs. a couple of thousand new subs will not support this game. the MT fiasco has and will cost them a fortune.
The illusion of "the game company cares about it's subscribers" stems from the desire of players wanting to feel that they are IMPORTANT in the game, and by extension that their wishes for the game should be implemented.
Does Apple "care about you" because you carry around an iPhone or an iPad ? Hell, no.
Companies care about how many units they sell (or how many subs their game has). They develop new products and improve existing ones TO SELL MORE UNITS, not because they give a tinker's about how John Public "feels" about their product. The numbers speak for themselves.
The only people that companies REALLY care about are their shareholders and investors. Those are the people that have them by the balls, so they deserve special care. And what THOSE people want is to see decent (preferably increasing) dividends every year.
It seems that many players expect game developers to be hardcore communists, only labouring for the good of the many. But they are people like you and me. They also want pay rises, promotions, a nice place to live and great holidays in exotic destinations. And a Ferrari...
All things change over time, and MMO's are certainly no exception to that rule. The second appropriate cliche is that "nothing lasts forever". Any game company that tries to survive on a single hit game will have a very limited lifespan. Does anyone here seriously think that Blizzard aren't using masses of their WoW profits to fund the development of their next MMO ?
I think the biggest problem for CCP and Eve comes when you combine the RMT strategy highlighted in the newsletter, with the outrageous prices for the first set of available cosmetic items. Knowing they eventually intend to RMT almost everything, then looking at these initial RMT price points, would definitely scare players and potential players right out of the game.
If these items had been a few bucks a peice, Eve's heavily RMT driven future might not have seemed so bleak. CCP has destroyed any trust in the playerbase that future RMT pricing will be "reasonable".
These pricepoints and the ability to convert real cash into virtual cash also warn of hyperinflation in the Eve economy, as RMT expands. Another prospect that will drive many players right out of the game.
Done right, RMT can work in MMOs. Unfortunately, CCP seems to have stepped right off a cliff, while expecting players to follow right behind, then pay big bucks for a parachute.
The illusion of "the game company cares about it's subscribers" stems from the desire of players wanting to feel that they are IMPORTANT in the game, and by extension that their wishes for the game should be implemented.
Does Apple "care about you" because you carry around an iPhone or an iPad ? Hell, no.
Companies care about how many units they sell (or how many subs their game has). They develop new products and improve existing ones TO SELL MORE UNITS, not because they give a tinker's about how John Public "feels" about their product. The numbers speak for themselves.
The only people that companies REALLY care about are their shareholders and investors. Those are the people that have them by the balls, so they deserve special care. And what THOSE people want is to see decent (preferably increasing) dividends every year.
It seems that many players expect game developers to be hardcore communists, only labouring for the good of the many. But they are people like you and me. They also want pay rises, promotions, a nice place to live and great holidays in exotic destinations. And a Ferrari...
All things change over time, and MMO's are certainly no exception to that rule. The second appropriate cliche is that "nothing lasts forever". Any game company that tries to survive on a single hit game will have a very limited lifespan. Does anyone here seriously think that Blizzard aren't using masses of their WoW profits to fund the development of their next MMO ?
Good companies realize that making some effort to show they care about their customers pays dividends, precisely because of the psychological factors you highlight. Making customers feel valued makes them better customers. Customer loyalty can make or break any company, no matter what they are selling.
Many U.S. companies have found this out the hard way in the last decade. How many have decided to "save money" by outsourcing customer service to India and other places with cheap labor, only to see their customer base and sales dwindle, because people resent what these moves say about how much the company cares about their customers?
Psychology drives all purchases. Even for goods that fulfill absolute needs, people chose which company to patronize often for reasons beyond pure price. Get into non-essentials, which include all forms of gaming and how the customer "feels" about a game and a game company becomes the major motivating factor.
RMT can work, as long as it is balanced. It should please many more people than it irks.
CCP seems to think that their players NEED the game so bad, that they will be able to charge them through the nose for anything and everything. (This is perception, based on a. ridiculously high prices on the first set of vanity items b. the developers expressed desire to eventually RMT almost everything the game has to offer).
I realize that there are many in the Eve player base who have a lot of time and effort invested in the game. CCP seems to think their players are so hooked on the game that their "addiction" can be tapped for large sums of money spent on virtual goods. For a certain percentage of the game's population, this may be true, but for most this will only create and foster resentment and may end up being the "wake up call" where customers ask "do I really want to spend so much of my life; time, effort, emotion; on this "@#&;%@# game"?
Yeah, reading a document like that is sort of a kick in the teeth, but seems logical in the face of the future. Biggest concern is the several references to a willingness to dabble in selling items of power....... that road leads to madness...
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
The CSM fucked up when they stopped CCP from just plain out sell skill points. If CCP could sell skill points for $ they really would not need any other revnue stream.
Just saying.
But oooooh, noooo. Buying skill point would be bad be course that would mean that the (imho equally unfair) advantage old chars have in the game over new ones, would be in jeopardy.
Idiots. CSM 5 that is...
Are you reallly that interested in the cashshop that you compare this to the fact that prices in the cashshop is expensive.
I can not understand the tears from people that can not afford a monocle and they are not the same as those tears that would be shed if we had skillpoints in the cashshop.
Oh no! CCP have to sell expensive monocles in the cashshop because they could not sell cheap skillpiints. Oh no! CCP blatently says the need to make a profit fron their games. At least they could humble about it, they hurt my feelings.
Oh well, what the hell......CSM 5 is not the one without a clue.
The problem with selling things that matter, like skill points, is that it gives a major advantage to the older vets that know how to play. For Example, need a few super cap pilots and you have people that know how to fly them in your alliance.....there you go!
Others, like you, get practically no benefit.
In fact, if players could really buy their way in, most of the ones without any experience would just lose the money, then realize how hard EVE really is, and quit. I would hurt the number of people that make it out of high sec. This would be really bad for the game.
It's not a question of what people want, it just wouldn't work in this game. However, it would give bitter old vets the ability to create clones all over eve.
"Oh well, what the hell......CSM 5 is not the one without a clue."
"Others, like you, get practically no benefit."?
Elighten me where I said that Where did I say that selling SP was anything good?
Did you just say that I was without a clue because I said that the tears over this crap items in the cash-shop would be nothing compared to the ones if you could buy skillpoints?
C'mon read the craptext I quoted first, that is why the quote is there.
Or could I just simply assume that as you said I was clueless you a pro buy skillpoints?
The problem is that ccp is very likely adding pay for advantage to eve and that the money isn't going back into eve but instead going into other games for development.
Dust, Incarna, World of darkness, all are getting more of ccp's money then the parts of eve players actually participate in. It took 3 years for them to create a single box you can walk around with your avatar in when since the begining players have been saying they don't want it.
Every expansion is still incomplete when the next one rolls out.
We're waiting on engine trails, cyno effects, a gallente cosmos arc, two unfinished pirate epic arcs, Faction warfare to be updated so it isn't based on grinding lp with a dram+ bomber, a response to the caldari FW side winning and having 100% of the territory(beyond the hotfix to just reset control), two classes of T3's that were planned for expansion release about two years ago. CCP rolled back a chunk of the changes in dominion because they were poorly implemented, PI has 0 interaction with other players on planet, no conflict or scarcity assosiated with it despite that being planned for release. Incursion was a decent expansion, just straight copy paste sleepers to known space and change their skin to a skin that's old. Oh yeah and incarna is a single player box.
EVE is just there to fund other games.
And it couldn’t come at a better time. As EVE edges closer to being the
grand dame of gaming, turning 8 years old this month, and our other
game titles continue their prodigious growth (yes, World of Darkness too
– you got the t-shirt to prove it), our development road map is shaping up
stronger and better. However,
as a subscription based golden goose, EVE
needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further
revenue – revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you.
The model also supports the notion of creating a meaningful experience
and identity for the player (more in our main feature on page 4).
Comments
funny how it was perfectly acceptable for blizzard to charge $25 for a mount.
If anything, we can blame the Wow players for setting this precedent in the gaming industry... its gona get like this for all mmo's.
Are you reallly that interested in the cashshop that you compare this to the fact that prices in the cashshop is expensive.
I can not understand the tears from people that can not afford a monocle and they are not the same as those tears that would be shed if we had skillpoints in the cashshop.
Oh no! CCP have to sell expensive monocles in the cashshop because they could not sell cheap skillpiints. Oh no! CCP blatently says the need to make a profit fron their games.
At least they could humble about it, they hurt my feelings. 
I'm so broke. I can't even pay attention.
"You have the right not to be killed"
I left EVE because of how expensive decent ships were, and me not having the time for the in game day job it requires to play EVE.
These prices here are just pathetic.
Oh well, what the hell......CSM 5 is not the one without a clue.
The problem with selling things that matter, like skill points, is that it gives a major advantage to the older vets that know how to play. For Example, need a few super cap pilots and you have people that know how to fly them in your alliance.....there you go!
Others, like you, get practically no benefit.
In fact, if players could really buy their way in, most of the ones without any experience would just lose the money, then realize how hard EVE really is, and quit. I would hurt the number of people that make it out of high sec. This would be really bad for the game.
It's not a question of what people want, it just wouldn't work in this game. However, it would give bitter old vets the ability to create clones all over eve.
It really is amazing to me how many players actually hold to the ideal that for a game to be noble its developers must work for free. Well, ok, maybe free takes it too far - maybe they should allow themselves to make about $30k per year - but that's it. The rest goes back into the game!
Imo, if someone makes a game that 300k+ people like to play on a daily basis, that someone and their company deserves to make a very nice living. And if that someone has half a brain, he or she milk it for all it's worth. Do you think EVE will last forever? What's the half-life do you suppose? 10 more years? 15? Will that get the developers to retirement age? And at the end of those 10 years they're supposed to have done - what? Sunk every penny back into their game that will have become a sinking ship and have nothing to show for themselves, hoping beyond hope that they can develop another hit game? If they can turn a million dollar profit now into 2 million they should do it. 10 mil possible through multi-colored monocles? Do that then. It will keep them happy, their high paid workers happy, and their players happy when a lot of the profit gets reinvested into the game.
Or maybe you'll someday find your idealistic game. The one where people don't always strive for bigger and better. The one where they are content to sit on their $30k salary and are never motivated to do more because they're perfectly satisfied with their very low population of players that is keeping them alive and their ideal of "everything for my players" will never allow them further personal achievement anyway, so why bother? Of course, your game won't get very many updates and won't have a marketing budget to draw more players, but I'm sure it will be an idillic enough online society that you'll never feel the need to leave.
I was pleasantly surprised when I went from Apprentice to full 5 star Elite in under 2 months. I was pleasantly surprised again when I went from Elite to just barely Hardcore in 2 weeks. Apprentice, here I come!
Well, if this is legit and they have done the same in the past. then CCP needs to sell out to a real game company soon because mocking your customers isn't exactly good public relations. Jeez, even EA isn't that stupid, and that is saying something. You might think your customers are idiots. You might even joke about them with coworkers, but putting it into writing is beyond stupid.
All die, so die well.
You see this argument in most games and on most forums concerning this issue, the argument that "hey maaan, it's a business maaan, they are there to make money maaaaaaan". I'm surprised so many consumers have swallowed this corporate BS so easily. A company does not exist to make a profit, a company exists to create a good product or service. Being profitable is supposed to be an indicator of providing a good service or product. Part of the problem is that not only have a lot of business people forgotten this simple fact, but so too have the consumers. Today the focus is on the profit and putting in the least amount of effort to create a passable product or service that will get them there. It's all backwards mate and wallowing in mediocrity.
The issue that has caused so much furor among the playerbase is that they feel betrayed by CCP. I'm sure most players would laugh and forgive them for the stupidity of making comsetic items in-game as or more expensive than their counterparts in real life, but the thing that sticks in their throats is the mention of pay-to-win items and of monetizing every aspect of the game.
For many players in EvE, taking the game in this direction is not indicative of a good product. Moreover, in a genre that is becoming saturated with cash grabbing games the players feel even more let down. Honestly, I'm starting to think that the fact that none of the big companies took the risk to increase their monthly sub price in line with inflation has hurt us all in the long term.
But let us not get ahead of ourselves, the validity of the document is still in question and so is the purpose of it.
What the hell planet are you from?
The planet where a company does not exist to make a profit but exists by making a profit.
thats lala land, companies from the dawn of time have existed to make money so that the owner can make money and fee his family and provide a future for all off spring, they did not go will this is a damn good product but its to expensive for anyone to buy but I am going to keep making it go broke and starve becuase its for the betterment of mankind I die brining people this product and all my employees are going to agree with philosphy when I no longer pay them.
but on subject, CCP can offer a monocle for $1000 as far as I am concerened as long as thye dont allow pay to win, in the form of wepaons, blue prints, special ships etc.
As long as its vanity items charge what ever they want
I'm not saying companies shouldn't make a profit. What I am saying is that the profit shouldn't be their single primary concern. Acting in self-interest is not a bad thing, pursuing it ruthlessly is.
The problem is that ccp is very likely adding pay for advantage to eve and that the money isn't going back into eve but instead going into other games for development.
Dust, Incarna, World of darkness, all are getting more of ccp's money then the parts of eve players actually participate in. It took 3 years for them to create a single box you can walk around with your avatar in when since the begining players have been saying they don't want it.
Every expansion is still incomplete when the next one rolls out.
We're waiting on engine trails, cyno effects, a gallente cosmos arc, two unfinished pirate epic arcs, Faction warfare to be updated so it isn't based on grinding lp with a dram+ bomber, a response to the caldari FW side winning and having 100% of the territory(beyond the hotfix to just reset control), two classes of T3's that were planned for expansion release about two years ago. CCP rolled back a chunk of the changes in dominion because they were poorly implemented, PI has 0 interaction with other players on planet, no conflict or scarcity assosiated with it despite that being planned for release. Incursion was a decent expansion, just straight copy paste sleepers to known space and change their skin to a skin that's old. Oh yeah and incarna is a single player box.
Good to see we are in agreement then.
There's this customer happiness thing as well, it's kinda needed to make profit.
community > quick proft.
if you take care of your community, it will take care of you. CCP was doing this for the most part, for the first couple of years. their desire to make profit has alienated all but the most naive of noobs. a couple of thousand new subs will not support this game. the MT fiasco has and will cost them a fortune.
I sure am glad that EVE is free to play these days.
Give me liberty or give me lasers
The illusion of "the game company cares about it's subscribers" stems from the desire of players wanting to feel that they are IMPORTANT in the game, and by extension that their wishes for the game should be implemented.
Does Apple "care about you" because you carry around an iPhone or an iPad ? Hell, no.
Companies care about how many units they sell (or how many subs their game has). They develop new products and improve existing ones TO SELL MORE UNITS, not because they give a tinker's about how John Public "feels" about their product. The numbers speak for themselves.
The only people that companies REALLY care about are their shareholders and investors. Those are the people that have them by the balls, so they deserve special care. And what THOSE people want is to see decent (preferably increasing) dividends every year.
It seems that many players expect game developers to be hardcore communists, only labouring for the good of the many. But they are people like you and me. They also want pay rises, promotions, a nice place to live and great holidays in exotic destinations. And a Ferrari...
All things change over time, and MMO's are certainly no exception to that rule. The second appropriate cliche is that "nothing lasts forever". Any game company that tries to survive on a single hit game will have a very limited lifespan. Does anyone here seriously think that Blizzard aren't using masses of their WoW profits to fund the development of their next MMO ?
I think the biggest problem for CCP and Eve comes when you combine the RMT strategy highlighted in the newsletter, with the outrageous prices for the first set of available cosmetic items. Knowing they eventually intend to RMT almost everything, then looking at these initial RMT price points, would definitely scare players and potential players right out of the game.
If these items had been a few bucks a peice, Eve's heavily RMT driven future might not have seemed so bleak. CCP has destroyed any trust in the playerbase that future RMT pricing will be "reasonable".
These pricepoints and the ability to convert real cash into virtual cash also warn of hyperinflation in the Eve economy, as RMT expands. Another prospect that will drive many players right out of the game.
Done right, RMT can work in MMOs. Unfortunately, CCP seems to have stepped right off a cliff, while expecting players to follow right behind, then pay big bucks for a parachute.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
Good companies realize that making some effort to show they care about their customers pays dividends, precisely because of the psychological factors you highlight. Making customers feel valued makes them better customers. Customer loyalty can make or break any company, no matter what they are selling.
Many U.S. companies have found this out the hard way in the last decade. How many have decided to "save money" by outsourcing customer service to India and other places with cheap labor, only to see their customer base and sales dwindle, because people resent what these moves say about how much the company cares about their customers?
Psychology drives all purchases. Even for goods that fulfill absolute needs, people chose which company to patronize often for reasons beyond pure price. Get into non-essentials, which include all forms of gaming and how the customer "feels" about a game and a game company becomes the major motivating factor.
RMT can work, as long as it is balanced. It should please many more people than it irks.
CCP seems to think that their players NEED the game so bad, that they will be able to charge them through the nose for anything and everything. (This is perception, based on a. ridiculously high prices on the first set of vanity items b. the developers expressed desire to eventually RMT almost everything the game has to offer).
I realize that there are many in the Eve player base who have a lot of time and effort invested in the game. CCP seems to think their players are so hooked on the game that their "addiction" can be tapped for large sums of money spent on virtual goods. For a certain percentage of the game's population, this may be true, but for most this will only create and foster resentment and may end up being the "wake up call" where customers ask "do I really want to spend so much of my life; time, effort, emotion; on this "@#&;%@# game"?
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
I feel really dirty after reading that..
Yeah, reading a document like that is sort of a kick in the teeth, but seems logical in the face of the future. Biggest concern is the several references to a willingness to dabble in selling items of power....... that road leads to madness...
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
"Oh well, what the hell......CSM 5 is not the one without a clue."
"Others, like you, get practically no benefit."?
Elighten me where I said that Where did I say that selling SP was anything good?
Did you just say that I was without a clue because I said that the tears over this crap items in the cash-shop would be nothing compared to the ones if you could buy skillpoints?
C'mon read the craptext I quoted first, that is why the quote is there.
Or could I just simply assume that as you said I was clueless you a pro buy skillpoints?
I'm so broke. I can't even pay attention.
"You have the right not to be killed"
EVE is just there to fund other games.
And it couldn’t come at a better time. As EVE edges closer to being the
grand dame of gaming, turning 8 years old this month, and our other
game titles continue their prodigious growth (yes, World of Darkness too
– you got the t-shirt to prove it), our development road map is shaping up
stronger and better. However,
as a subscription based golden goose, EVE
needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further
revenue – revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you.
The model also supports the notion of creating a meaningful experience
and identity for the player (more in our main feature on page 4).