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An Epic Klingon History Thread
Cacaphony
Member Posts: 738
This thread is being made to showcase an awesome forum goer over in the STO forums by the name of Perrigrine_Falcon. I take no credit for the research done or anything in the OP in the link below or the thread for that matter.
I am simply re posting this thread here so we all may see the hard work done by one who cares enough about the Klingon faction in STO, to bring to light the history of the Kligon faction with Cryptic Studios. Its a long post guys... a long one. But if you have any interest in the goings on reguarding the Klingon faction and Cryptic.... Perrigrine did an epic job documenting this. Again, the following information is to the credit of Perrigrine_Falcon, on the STO forums. This is only a repost of his hard work, since his thread was closed in the STO forums.
Here is the link to the now locked thread.
http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=217322
Here is the OP, copied and pasted. Again, the following is NOT MY work. It is the work of Perrigrine_Falcon.
As the memory of launch day fades into history I've started to see more and more misinformation being posted about the Empire, its past, and things that were supposedly said. In an effort to set the record straight, and see that it remains that way, I present this timeline of the Klingon Empire during its time with Cryptic Studios.
Pre-Launch - The Mesospeculative Era
July 28th, 2008 - Cryptic officially announces Star Trek Online
August 10th, 2008 - At Gen Con Jack Emmert says: "Starfleet and Klingon. Yeah. So two factions, full PvE content."
Between that statement by Jack Emmert on August 10th, 2008, and his announcement on December 15th, 2009 that Klingons were a PvP oriented faction, there was nothing that led us to believe they weren't going to have "full PvE content."
August 25th, 2008 - ASK CRYPTIC: Zinc: "The universe of Star Trek Online is shaped and changed by the actions of the players. The Federation and the Klingon Empire will be competing for influence and resources throughout the galaxy and players can influence the results through PvP battles and a system we're calling Competitive PvE."
Still waiting for that competitive PvE by the way.
September 16th, 2008 - In an interview in Game Informer Magazine Craig Zinkievich said that no matter which faction you're in, you don't have to "go and get owned by somebody else", i.e. PvP.
While it's been quoted in several places, the text of this interview was never put online by Game Informer Magazine to my knowledge.
April 30th, 2009 - ASK CRYPTIC: "...for example if you’re Klingon and your friend is Federation and the Borg are attacking, you’re probably going to form an alliance against them. You’re going to see all kinds of weird alliances within the game."
Weird alliances huh? Yep. I'm really looking forward to that.
May 30th, 2009 - Craig Zinkievich (Zinc), STO's Executive Producer posts: "There will be PvP in STO. PvP will be consensual. If you don't want to do it, you will never have to."
Nothing to indicate that Klingons are PvP oriented.
June 23rd, 2009 - ASK CRYPTIC: "In general, there’s more PvP involvement on the Klingon side of the game."
Notice how he did not say - Klingons are PvP only. He said Klingons have "more PvP involvement." Implying that there's at least some PvE. This still doesn't invalidate Jack Emmert's "full PvE" comment.
July 21st, 2009 - ASK CRYPTIC: "No one ever said Klingons don’t have scientists or engineers; somebody built those ships. Klingons will probably have a few distinctions in skills and certain other areas, but the classes will be the same."
Still nothing to indicate that Klingons are PvP only.
In September of 2009, barely five months before game launch, we started getting some hints that Klingons would be 'PvP focused.' This was finally confirmed in this interview with Eurogamer.
October 9th, 2009 - Craig Zinkievich: "Yes! We plan on shipping with the ability to play as Federation and play on the Klingon side. The Klingon game play is going to be drastically different to the Federation game play. It's going to be a lot more focused on PvP; their advancement is a little bit different - it is not a full-on story-driven game like the Federation."
He then went on to assure us that; "It's a lot more than Monster Play." Later that same day, in response to a thread about that interview, is when we first found out that the KDF wouldn't have a tutorial at launch.
October 9th 2009 - Rekhan: "We opted to create a single tutorial due to time constraints."
October 22nd, 2009 - CLOSED BETA officially announced, and some people were a bit worried because Klingons weren't in it. Towards the end there were quite a few threads demanding the devs release detailed info on the KDF, most ended up getting locked and/or deleted.
Nov 9th, 2009 - Klingon testing - The Grand Nagus: "Seeing as its now official the game will be launching in less than 3 months, maybe its time we start testing the Klingon faction?"
Nov 18th, 2009 - The devs still refused to say anything. IRC Chat: "More info on Klingons and PvP is coming very soon."
Nov 30th, 2009 - So, About Those Klingons - If only Trent Solace had known how right on the money his prediction was going to be.
December 1st, 2009 - It's confirmed that we were supposed to get Klingon info in December when StormShade posts; "You'll be hearing lots of Klingon info this month."
Decemeber 7th, 2009 - ASK CRYPTIC: "Even so, Episodes are just one of the ways to progress in the game. You can gain similar rewards by engaging in PvP or exploring Star Clusters."
A mere week before Jack Emmert broke the news to us and no mention of Klingons being 'PvP only' or 'PvP oriented' or 'PvP focused.'
December 15th, 2009 - Jack Emmert posted; "Believe it or not, December was supposed to "klingon" month. I have zero clue why it's Dec. 15th and still nothing, but I can tell you this WILL change (I just saw the threads yesterday)."
It wasn't until two days later that we finally got the Ask Cryptic that informed us that the KDF was going to launch with no PvE content.
December 15th, 2009 - Dstahl posts on the Closed Beta forums that the ability to test Klingon characters will be added on the December 17th patch
December 17th, 2009 - ASK CRYPTIC: "Your Klingon Captain can be a Science, Engineering or Tactical officer. However, they must advance through PvP, as they will not have access to the same amount of player-vs.-environment content as Federation players at launch."
That one page there comprised all of the info that we received during 'Klingon Month.'
December 17th, 2009 - Jack Emmert speaks to MMORPG.com about why Klingons are 'PvP-centric' at launch
January 11th, 2010 - CLOSED BETA ENDS
January 12th, 2010 - OPEN BETA - until January 26th, 2010
January 29th, 2010 - HEADSTART - until February 2nd, 2010
February 2nd, 2010 - GAME LAUNCH
The Klingon Empire has no storyline PvE missions - only some "Empire Defense" space PvE madlibs
No Joined Trill (that we paid extra for and were told would work KDF side)
No personal armor visuals
No kit visuals
No tricorders
No ship customization
No buff pets (like the Federation Tribbles)
No crafting
Incomplete TOS uniform, not that it mattered because we never got to see our bridge officers anyway
Half our bridge officer races are male only
Computer audio and transporter visuals are Starfleet ones, not KDF
I'm sure there's some more "no's" that I'm forgetting, but it's not monster play!
Comments
continued....
Post-Launch - The Golden Age
February 5th, 2010 - Romulan "Empire Defense" missions added
February 11th, 2010 - The Borg Return: "level 43+ Klingon players now have access to repeatable Borg related Klingon Defense missions."
February 13th, 2010 - Jack Emmert posts; "Yes, there are definitely things on the table for Klingons. I'm a die hard Klingon player and I wanted them in no matter what. Believe me, we'll get more in. Otherwise, I'm going postal."
March 4th, 2010 - Infected goes live and the KDF is now able to enter Gamma Orionis
March 25th, 2010 - SEASON 1 - The 45 day patch!
There was a lot of forum flamage after this patch went live, because players had gotten the impression that the "Mythical 45 Day Patch" was going to fix all of the KDF's problems. It's important to note that the developers never actually said that this patch would be adding anything to the Klingon Faction. During the height of the rage-fest, Jack Emmert made this post:K’Tanco Battle Cruiser added.
Some minor customization for some Birds of Prey & Raptors added.
KDF can now play Crystalline Entity, Big Dig, Breaking the Planet and The Cure
KDF exploration missions added.
Bat'leths made available to Federation characters at Battle group Omega.
Shanty Town ground PvP map added
Fed vs. Fed PvP (Wargames) was added, which reduced available PvP matches for Klingon characters.
March 30th, 2010 - Jack Emmert posts: "Trust me, we'll continue to add PvE. I'm a die hard Klingon player and I'm constantly on the EP to add more."
April 13th, 2010 - Khitomer Accord goes live
April 29th, 2010 - SEASON 1.1 - Death Penalty!
Joined Trill (that we paid extra for) finally join the Klingon Faction
Klingon ship replicators work now (Feds always had them)
Klingons get ground auto-fire (Feds worked earlier)
May 13th, 2010 - Terradome goes live
June 3rd, 2010 - SEASON 1.2 - Accolades & Squad Support!
Major space powers revamp and a ton of bugs added to the game.
July 1st, 2010 - Executive Producer Craig Zinkievich (Zinc) leaves Cryptic Studios. Producer Daniel Stahl (dstahl) is promoted to Executive Producer.
July 27th, 2010 - SEASON 2 - Level cap increased to 51
Kar’Fi Battle Carrier added
Feds get Tactical Escort Retrofit, so now they have a cloaking device.
Federation Diplomatic Corps added - so Feds can now get Orion Slavegirls.
200 Day Veteran Rewards include a Fed only jacket, nothing for KDF.
8 New Klingon-only missions are available!
Some uniform customization options added and bugs fixed
Females now allowed to wear the MALE TOS Klingon shirt
"Congratulations, Captain!" audio finally added to Klingon side
Klingon game UI finally has the remaining Starfleet icons and symbols removed
August 1st, 2010 - KDF players are now able to get Efficient Impulse Engines - not listed in any of the patch notes
Federation players have been able to get this special reward since launch.
August 5th, 2010 - Several Orion and Klingon costume pieces added
August 17th, 2010 - Cryptic announces that Bill Roper has left the building
August 26th, 2010 - Dstahl posts about where he sees the KDF in 5 months
August 28th, 2010 - First "Weekly Episodes" later renamed to "Featured Episodes" - Cold Call goes live
September 7th, 2010 - Dstahl posts no Kzinti for the KDF
September 15th, 2010 - State of the Game - dstahl discusses the state of the KDF
October 15th, 2010 - KDF ship wings now move and Starfleet gets the Nebula class, which has a Universal Bridge Officer Slot.
The Federation now has access to all of the formerly unique Empire items, except for carriers. The Empire no longer has anything unique to offer to players.
October 22nd, 2010 - The Empire gets a Tier 5 Vor’cha
November 12th, 2010 - The Empire receives three new ships - the Varanus Fleet Support Vessel (Gorn), the Maurauder Patrol Cruiser (Orion), and the B'rel Bird-of-Prey Retrofit (Klingon)
Multiple threads explaining how the Varanus doesn't work as a science ship because of the low turn speed are ignored by Cryptic.
November 17th, 2010 - Dstahl posts about the KDF 200 Veteran reward that; "gets better over time."
Except that it doesn't.
November 17th, 2010 - Dstahl posts; "We are instead looking into other Feline species that might be allied with the KDF."
Because there couldn't possibly be any Caitians in the Empire?
December 9th, 2010 - SEASON 3 - Sector Space Fixed! (finally) and Episode Replay
Klingons get stolen Federation tricorders which actually work now
The KDF can now get anomalys
Klingons can now craft, still no buff bets though
Sortie missions in Pi Canis added - buggy and broken
The KDF finally gets the 200 Day Veteran Reward shoulder pads
December 23rd, 2010 - The Guramba Siege Destroyer hits the C-Store
continued...
Anniversary - The Silver Age
January 7th, 2011 - Dstahl is getting tired of the all the KDF complaints and posts; "If you don't like the speed at which the car is moving - your options are to jump out or watch the DVD in the back seat and eat some cheerios." AND: "Overnight armchair quarterbacks aside, the dev team is constantly improving the KDF for the 12% of our player base who play them."
January 27th, 2011 - Cryptic_Gozer posts; "The community ASSUMED that meant that both factions would have full PVE content."
He's immediately corrected, and never again mentions his attempt to rewrite history.
January 28th, 2011 - To be fair though, dstahl did discuss Gozer's comments
January 28th, 2011 - Vulcan D'Kyr Science Vessel, an exact copy of the Gorn Varanus in all but looks (the ship's shipyard data entry even says Varanus instead of D'Kyr), is released to Tribble for testing.
January 29th, 2011 - Cryptic has ignored issues KDF players have with the Varanus for over 3 months. But when Federation players request an increase in the turn rate for the Vulcan D'Kyr, for the exact same reasons that Klingon players wanted an increase in the Varanus' turn rate, a developer responds with 24 hours of it hitting the test server saying they'll increase the turn rate of the D'Kyr.
January 30th, 2011 - In an interview with Computer Ed, Dan Stahl says; "The Klingon faction ... first it was going to be PvE then it became PvP..."
This PROVES that it was originally their intent to make the Empire a full PvE faction just like the Federation. From the mouth of the executive producer himself.
February 2nd, 2011 - One Year Anniversary! Earth Space Dock has received an overhaul to its interior. We're told that Qo'noS will get an update too, sometime in the future.
February 3rd, 2011 - Four Foundry missions are ported from Tribble (test server) to Holodeck (live server). Despite multiple KDF missions being suggested in StormShade's official thread, and in other threads, they decide to port 3 Starfleet and only 1 KDF mission to Holodeck.
February 24th, 2011 - Dstahl posts; "As far as Kerrat and KDF content in general, the big update is coming with the launch of Season 4."
So the belief that Season 4 will be big for the Empire isn't something that just came from rumors and rampant speculation.
March 25th, 2011 - Starfleet captains can now craft their own Delta Flyers! The KDF doesn't get anything to craft of course.
March 25th, 2011 - Dstahl posts: "More than half of the team is working on Klingon content for Season 4 at the moment, so I can assure that I remain committed to improving the KDF faction and have done so with every release."
Once again the executive producer saying that Season 4 will be big for the Empire.
March 28th, 2011 - The Foundry goes live on Holodeck
April 8th, 2011 - Dan Stahl posts: "The team continues to release Klingon improvements with every major update, and Season 4 will be no different. KDF costume customization options, new Gorn, new KDF tutorial, Start as a KDF with your first toon, KDF Duty Officer Assignments, releveleved KDF PVE content, opening up more KDF sectors - its all in the works.
As I've said in numerous interviews - don't take me at my word - just look at my track record for making the improvements that I said we would with the KDF and judge by that."
That sounds pretty concrete to me.
May 13th, 2011 - S_Wall posts: KDF tutorial - postponed, Klingon Academy - postponed, Updated Qo'noS - in Season 4, Qo'noS side missions - postponed
Wow. That's a sudden change from dstahl's posts on April 8th, March 25th, and February 24th.
May 14th, 2011 - Captain_Geko states in an interview on STOked, that Qo'noS "is not likely to go into Season 4 at this time."
May 16th, 2011 - Dstahl posts that Gorn Customization and a reworked Qo'noS will be in Season 4
So those two things are in, but after reading that engineering report it's looking less and less likely that Season 4 will be big for the Empire.
May 21st, 2011 - Salami_Inferno announces that, as part of the remastered missions, Starfleet will get a special mission reward that lets them summon a bank in sector space. Only after KDF players start asking about it does he announce that the Empire will get one as well, but it won't be in game until Season 4. However, it turns out that they were able to get it done and in game at the same time Starfleet gets the Azura Com after all.
May 23rd, 2011 - Mhighison posts that the devs aren't even planning on making the Swordmaster Greatcoat available to players
May 26th, 2011 - Mhighison posts; "The skirts and badges I've mentioned here are indeed Fed only, because they are Fed Uniform parts. Getting a Klingon faction skirt is on my list of extras I want to squeeze in before for Season 4."
Starfleet, which already has a wide selection of comm badges and skirt options, is getting a bunch more. The KDF, which has none, might get some squeezed in for Season 4.
May 27th, 2011 - The Remastered Doomsday Machine episode goes to Holodeck - Starfleet players are able to wear the KDF Swordmaster Greatcoat and get a KDF Harg'Peng torpedo. KDF players do not get either of these things.
July 7th, 2011 - SEASON 4 - Season of the Empire (supposedly)
The Federation has far more content and options (as well as far less bugs) than the Empire does. red_shirt_ started a great thread that has some numbers that show just how great the disparity is.
At launch the KDF had several things that Starfleet did not: Bat'leths, Cloaking Devices, Universal Bridge Officer Slots, Orion Slave Chicks, and later Carriers. Starfleet has acquired all of these things, except for Carriers, but they did get other space pets in the form of separated saucers and MVAM.
This has removed everything unique about the Empire and means that the Klingon Faction has nothing to offer a player that they can't get far more of (and with less bugs) Federation side.
Apart from carriers obviously, which is basically a fourth shipclass. You want to fly a carrier you have to play klingon. Only reason to roll klingon besides lore i guess.
Just to add an item to the timeline:
On December 13, 2009 DStahl did a podcast interview where he let it be known the direction that the Klingon Faction would then be taking (I believe the words he used were "pretty much PvP only," or something to that effect). This caused a major uproar in the forums, and two days later on December 15, 2009 Jack Emmert made his post that is cited above. It is also what he wads referring to when he said, "Seems like good ole Dan kicked off Klingon month in STYLE!"
The two day delay between DStahl's interview and Jack's reply to the forum uproar was keeping in line with how Cryptic has done things since CoH was in development; they drop a comment that causes an uproar on Friday, and then it takes them days before someone gets around to correcting or clarifying things.
"Oh my, how horrible, someone is criticizing a MMO. Oh yeah, that is what a forum is about, looking at both sides. You rather have to be critical of anything in this genre as of late because the track record of these major studios has just been appalling." -Ozmodan
Considering how many Klingon only things have wound up being available to the Federation players, I wouldn't be a bit surprised to see Federation carriers one day. Heck, it even has some precedent: we've seen Federation fighters in the shows, they have the Federation Peregine fighter available now, and as I understand it the Akira was originally designed to be a Federation carrier for the shows.
"Oh my, how horrible, someone is criticizing a MMO. Oh yeah, that is what a forum is about, looking at both sides. You rather have to be critical of anything in this genre as of late because the track record of these major studios has just been appalling." -Ozmodan
Your right, i would actually be surprised if feds wouldn't get carriers one day. Wether that be before klingons get enough content to stand on their own legs though i don't dare to predict.
Though in all honesty i do understand cryptic here a bit. We all know klingons will never attract as many players as federation/humans, people want to play the chars/ships they have seen in the series and films.
I disagree with that assumption.. lot of people would play Klingon if there was enough content to make it worth playing. Of course KDF doesn't attract anyone right now, who wants to play an incomplete, boring, repetitive, pvp faction in a game clearly made for solo/casual pve gamers? Bet if the KDF had the same amount of content as Feds their population would be just as solid. Plenty of gamers who like the idea of playing the part of the bad guys in games. Cryptic trying to assume only a few people will want to play as Klingon is just making excuses for their broken promises and not living up to their own hype.
The sub-title to this thread should be: All the stuff Cryptic ever promised for Klingons, and lied about.
And people wonder why "haters" have nothing but contempt for Cryptic.
Pretty good chronological history of Cryptic BS, right there.,... and all from the the Horse's .... errr.... mouth.
Personally I think the Klingon faction population would be at least double (and perhaps more than that) what Cryptic says it is (12%), if the Klingon faction approached the Federation in terms of (non-Cstore) content. To be fair though, Cryptic isn't the only company to underestimate how popular a faction will be. A good example of this would be Mythic's and GW's belief that few would play the Chaos faction in WAR.
If STO's Klingon faction had nearly the amount of Klingon unique PvE content that the Federation has of Federation specific content, it's a safe bet that most of STO's players would have at least one Klingon that they levelled all the way up, if only for a change of pace from doing the same missions again and again.
"Oh my, how horrible, someone is criticizing a MMO. Oh yeah, that is what a forum is about, looking at both sides. You rather have to be critical of anything in this genre as of late because the track record of these major studios has just been appalling." -Ozmodan
Great post! I have thought about doing something like this with all the "Ask Cryptics" they had before launch with all the lies and half-truths that came out of Zinc and Jacks pie-hole but then I decided this game is not worth the effort. Its bad enough that they got sold off to a Chinese F2P company, I think for me that is punishment enough.
I found the link to the DStahl podcast interview the guys at STOked did, that I mentioned in my first post in this thread (post #5):
Podcast
They have it dated December 14, 2009, but I could have sworn they posted a link to it on the STO forums late on December 13, 2009. Then again, that could have been posted after midnight, and I didn't notice the date change.
"Oh my, how horrible, someone is criticizing a MMO. Oh yeah, that is what a forum is about, looking at both sides. You rather have to be critical of anything in this genre as of late because the track record of these major studios has just been appalling." -Ozmodan
I could have sworn someone on the STO forums did that sometime last year, although I doubt the thread still exists.
"Oh my, how horrible, someone is criticizing a MMO. Oh yeah, that is what a forum is about, looking at both sides. You rather have to be critical of anything in this genre as of late because the track record of these major studios has just been appalling." -Ozmodan
Ah yes, I remember the good old days of telling everyone Klingons were little more than LotRO monster play to the angst of fanboys, and linking the video of Emmert saying both factions would have full content to shut up the ones saying Klingons were always supposed to be primarily a PvP faction.
Why am I not surprised the that thread was first buried in a little read section, and later closed? I'm surprised PF wasn't banned for the lengthy, public de-pantsing of Cryptic. EVE reskinned with Star Trek races and ships would have been 100x better than the garbage Cryptic made.
He was briefly banned and then the mods thought better of it, because 100% of it was all things that Cryptic people had said themselves.
Only thing they could have done to make themselves look worse, tbh....
That's my guess: Someone saw the thread, got mad, locked it and banned PF. Someone else with a bit more common sense reversed the banning, before Cryptic looked even worse.
"Oh my, how horrible, someone is criticizing a MMO. Oh yeah, that is what a forum is about, looking at both sides. You rather have to be critical of anything in this genre as of late because the track record of these major studios has just been appalling." -Ozmodan
The Underlined part sounds like it'd be an amazing game lol.
An epic bit of spin in which my old pal PF attempts to obfuscate the fact that Cryptic said Klingons were a primarily PvP experience 4 months before lifetime subs went on sale. People were logging into the IRC channel by the hundreds (occasionally topping 1,000) and discussing this exact issue, with PF in the channel, months in advance of LTS sales, yet he claims nobody knew.
WTF!!!
Really glad I quit when I did, as an exclusively KDF player this move, and a few of the others listed, would have pushed me over the edge.
Cryptic is a such a joke.
This goes to point out the North Korean attitude when they have ugly information on their hands...
They LOCKED THE THREAD...
Not not only are they lairs, they are spineless as well.
The torpedo rewards is correct but the Swordmaster part is only for the latter part of the mission and your character just gets turned into Klingon npc so honestly not that big of a deal as its not like a item of cloathing was made.