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Why this game won't go quietly
RelytDnegel
Member UncommonPosts: 261
Heatwave Interactive. They really are an amazing company and are doing an awesome job with this game, even though people may debate over whether Gods and Heroes was ready for release I'v seen games release a lot worse then this. Anyways read the full post and see how committed they are to this game.
Partial post from dev:
"As I have noted from way back in closed Beta, the economics of our game are different than those of most MMOs. We don't need 500k users to be successful. However, our current growth rate isn't good enough. The game deserves more people enjoying it and the three servers we have online aren't even sweating. I'm sure some of you are concerned about what that means for the future of the game, and so I'd like to assuage your concern. Heatwave and team are 100% committed to G&H. We believe in it and as you'll see in the list below, we are investing heavily in it and we will continue to do so.''
Full post here
Yes you can say that they have to talk about this and all but I haven't seen a company come out and be this honest for a long time (or ever?), which I find quite refeshing. Heatwave won't be giving up on this game in the near future and either will I. A free trial would go a long way for this game with the AAA pricing scaring a lot of people off with not being able to "try before you buy", which I believe to be in the works for sometime soon. Anyways good luck Heatwave and keep up the good work!
Safehouse Gaming up and running at: http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCnKd0Hk85CQ_N04Ae7v5zZg
Comments
Until they stop charging the ridiculous price for the game and then a sub rate, the game is gonna stay dead. Once they figure that one out, they may have a chance and certainly a better chance.
I was in the closed beta from August last year but it was always unstable on my PC. I'd usually login, play for ten minutes and then get a crash necessitating a reboot. So I'd leave it a month and then try again with the same result. I did eventually manage to get off the starter island but I started playing Rift earlier this year and lost track of G & H. I was quite surprised when I saw it was to be launched though as the last time I played earlier this year, it didn't seem anywhere close to being ready.
I agree the devs put a lot of effort into improving the game, lots of things did improve enormously in the time I was able to do my limited testing but it did seem as though the time had passed where this game would be able to compete with newer offerings from other publishers.
i think a major mistake was persisting with the P2P business model too. More and more games are now going to the F2P/P2P hybrid model following the success of D&D and LotRO. Only the very best games can command a premium monthly subscription nowadays. G & H is never going to be able to compete on a level playing field with games such as Rift or SWTOR and their multi million dollar budgets.
^ My thoughts exactly.
Despite my feelings on the game (which are generally negative) I actually do like the people working on it. They're a very interactive company and also very personable. They've also got a lot of talent, considering how much they've done to fix the game up. But that doesn't make the game better, just because I like the company, which is the worst part of it all to me. They're wasting their time and talents on a game that even in the most capable hands, and even F2P, is mediocre at best.
F2P would get some interest going, but I'm not convinced it would be enough to make the game salvageable. As a P2P it doesn't even have the polish of most F2Ps let alone P2Ps, and if it were to become F2P, it will have a LOT of competition that doesn't have half the stigma starting out that it does.
I understand development of a game takes far too much time and effort to simply scrap it and try something new if the result is less than stellar (Tabula doesn't count, NCsoft can spare that kind of money) but sticking to something that isn't working, based largely on principle, doesn't sound much better.
They can 'believe' in their game as much as they want, but if no one's playing it, that belief isn't going to get them very far.
"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."
Thats what I see out of this game. Its minion system needs minions that have a larger variety of skills and powers, so you can have tactical choices for them, like STO did. Although I enjoy the setting greatly and hope the game well I see its a 4-6month road to get remotely at a state for release.
Regardless your statement is QFT. Population is dwindling at an alarming rate. Unless something is done literally last week, whoever is funding the game is going to say screw it and cut their losses soon. This game needs I imagine between 10-15k players to sustain itself.(We know games have been run on less, but they've been usually void of anything but being online) Having maybe 500 unique users in my estimates who bought a box does not do that.
The problem with the game is pretty simple, you can't put out a trash game and slap monthly payments on it. P2P games HAVE to be polished nowadays to keep users interested or they all just go back to WoW. Sad but true. This game never stood a chance.
Wow that's some pretty honest stuff. Saying they don't have the player base they hoped for. However I don't think they can drive thousands of folks to the game by simply changing their payment options.
Going to take a lot more than that.
They should have fired the CEO cos he is an idiot. If he cannot gauge how good or bad their own game is, he should not hold the post at all.
Pardon my English as it is not my 1st language
No amount of honesty or enthusiasm from the developer can make up for the current sorry state of the game.
But if it makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside and prevents you from canceling your subscription, it has probably done its job.
I've interacted with Heatwave once, during headstart, when my client was being all sorts of whacked out and I must say, they have some of the most helpful, friendly and dedicated staff I've ever dealt with.
The CS rep I got in touch with was speedy and the actual tech I e-mailed back and forth to actually listened to what I had to say and worked up a diagnosis instead of some dude with a "Top 10 Problems" script.
Sure, this can be attributed to a low pop, but it's nice to have real support.
The CEO thinks they have a solid game that people like. Their lies the problem, they are in denial about the quality of the game they are trying to sell to thousands of gamers.
Exaclty. Rift and I imagine GW2 and SWKOR are going to be highly polished games at released. The bar has now been raised.
I don't think he is in total denial following the thread he understands the timeline is weeks and not months to address issues. Regardless I do not see anyway that a lot of the issues can be addressed in that timeline. I honestly feel this game is either going B2P or F2P in the next month or going offline breaking APB's record. Infact it would honestly be best for them to at least pull a FFXIV until the game is fixed to a P2P state, though maybe time for a F2P by that time.
This game reminds me a lot of Alganon, but with actually good PR skills. It can survive, but it needs the time and I do not think it'll be anywhere near what it could of been had they waited to release until this fall or winter even against the big boys it was a niche that might of gotten a fairly decent following, the early release will most likely be its death.
The only belief that matters is that the money believes.
He who keeps his cool best wins.
i'd like to play the game , i really would. but there is no way im forking out full retail price on a game thats got F2P written all over it
If someone is talking in general chat in a language you dont understand, chances are they're not talking to you. So chill out and stop bitching about it!
Mu thoughts exactly THE OPPOSITE...
What success of Ddo and Lotro he's talking about? they went F2P cause they failed. Is he searching success into failure?
The very best games can coomand a monthly sub? And Rift and Swotr are the right examples? a wow copy and space kittens? Mount amd blade has better combat and was made by 2 ppl alone .Get serious pls
Besides you have no idea in what game G&H could eveolve too if the DEV team is indeed devoted to the player base.
Give those ppl a break. And after 5-6 months add the criticism if they proved to be exactly the opposite of what they claim they r trying to do.
I think the key here is POLISH.
This game IMO would be a AAA title and have every right to demand a monthly fee if it had lets say the same amount of polish Rift had at it's release. This is a fun and unique title to play when the ground isn't disappearing on you and your toon actually hits it's opponent on time without a delay, and the game isn't crashing on you.
It doesn't matter how good Heatwave is, if they don't polish this game, I doubt this title will last the upcoming winter.
LOTRO was in no way a failure, it commanded a large amount of subs, I don't think it ever dipped below 150k-200k. Turbine changed the market with their success of a transition from P2P to F2P. So they followed suit.
The fact that there are 100-300 k ppl that dont want to pay subs for game they play or are without jobs or kids that dont have the money to pay for better games that demand subs doesnt mean that these games are good and success. It just mean they are good as F2P. Turbine didnt changed the market of mmorpgs. Turbine just wasted 2 huge opportunities to deliver 2 top selling titles and instead they failed and went F2P.And that's not my opinion..that is a FACT. Instead of praise only thing Turbine deserves is blame.
If M&B is so amazing(which I think its decently good, just not enough hook to it for my taste) It would be totally full all the time with many servers, not just one or two full and a lot empty. Its is the best game for what it offers, but the market is so small.
I know i typed fast yesterday misstyping some words but it appears u have a reading problem. I didnt said it's better as game. I just said that M&B was made by 2 ppl and has better combat system than rift and swotr.
They have yet to show me a vision. They have lots of ideas, but nothing put down with how to do implement things. Truth is if they are that devoted they have about 1 month before everyones sub runs out to show people something, because everyone will be cap and if there is nothing but a couple dungeons that are going to be replaced by the 30-40 stuff you'll see the current crap population become even less. Population+Money coming in currently=Offline shortly. I'm sorry but this is by far the worst launch of any Box MMO to date. Adding 3 servers was first and foremost the worst Idea they did, and should of never launched Apollo by any means after seeing their current other servers population so low. Not to mention Bacchus should of never came online since it was bugged and Mars should be the only server. They do not have the means to server transfer so the minimal population is spread even thinner. Heck I'd be better to have 1 server with 200 on than 3 with 50-80 during peak hours. Instead we get servers with 25-50 on during nearly all hours.
M: 40, B: 27, A: 18 @9pm EST on a Sunday, peek hours for a slew of gamers. Where do you see this game going anytime soon? I see the doors shutting in the next month.
If you follow the story of G&H Romerising the game was abandoned and these guys here with some limited funds took the rights had to fast complete it sell it and further improve its state in the future. I just say let them show in the next few months if they are capable to indeed take some steps in front the game ,improve it and make it worthwhile of money. Aparently for financial reasons they had to charge subs. Is it worth it right now? maybe not. We ll see though what will happen in some months. Besides none forces ppl to buy their subs meanwhile right?
I believe what he meant was that LoTRO had that number of subs before going F2P.
LoTRO ran quite happily with steady subs for 4 years before going F2P, so it can in no way be called a failure. That's my opinion and also a FACT.
If that's your definition of a game being a failure, I'd love to see what you think is a success. It must be some kind of super MMO that doesn't exist yet...
...let me know when that releases won't you
.
DDO was more successful after going F2P than it ever was beforehand. In fact, Turbine was overwhelmed by the success of DDO after it went F2P. So much so that they followed suit with LoTRO, which was far from a "failure". Turbine's switch to F2P was so succeessful for them, that it's encouraging most other AAA MMOs to go F2P, or at least offer an F2P option.
That being said, I hate the F2P business model, and won't touch any F2P games.
Ofc it was more succesfull after going F2P .That's my opinion as well. Since it didnt delivered ppl refuse to pay subs and it went down to F2P.
As for Lotro far from failure? sure. I know 12 rl friends ppl that playing mmorpgs , 8 of them are on wow or were in wow,2 of them were burned on L2 ,1 on AOC and 1 is a rift fun. Sure LOTRO is a huge success all players playing it.
If LOTRO wasnt a failure why it went free to play? care to exxplain? :]
My opinion on this matter is... Lotro of all current f2p hybrids did not have to do so as it does and always would of had a populous. Although since it's dive into the f2p market it has found a way of making larger profits... Although everything is speculation other than them making more profits I feel they did it because DDO was getting really popular due to it's f2p model and they wanted to get in on that particular group of fantasy game players.
Concerning this game though... I would of played it if it were a f2p hybrid with a sub option... when they tried to launch it like a AAA title I lost all interest. their loss as I would of subbed and played until christmas when the others begin to launch. This game is in no way worth a 50$ box fee + monthly sub. AoC actually has me resubbed because I didn't have to buy anything.
"Sometimes people say stuff they don''t mean, but more often then that they don''t say things they do mean"
I'm in this camp. Make an organic massively-multiplayer online game with at least as mediocre-level content as most other mmorpg's, or substantially adjust their $ business model for the rudimentary lobby-system single-player rpg that they do have.
Until then, the players will probably remain off the playing-field.
I agree completely. I met their community manager at PAXEast and she was super friendly and very passionate about her game. While I don't think the game is worth a box fee, I wish them the best of luck. There's just soooo much mediocrity in this genre...
Joined 2004 - I can't believe I've been a MMORPG.com member for 20 years! Get off my lawn!