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Item shop
Lord.Bachus
Member RarePosts: 9,686
Eric Flannum sent us a note to clarify a couple of things about their plans for Guild Wars 2 post-release content:“We haven’t decided on what exactly we are or aren’t going to offer for money post-release. We’re open to whatever our players seem most interested in. If, after release, you guys would like more story content, more dungeons, more events, more maps or whatever, it’s something that we have to consider because ultimately making you happy is what makes us successful. Whether we release that in DLC (like the bonus mission packs in GW1) or whether we do it through expansions (Like Eye of the North) is yet to be determined. As to whether or not there are going to be items like XP boosts available in the in game store, I can only reiterate what we’ve said before (and will continue to say,) that we’ll release details on it when they are available, and that our core philosophy of not requiring you to spend additional money to play the game and not making the game difficult or painful to play in order to encourage you to buy things from the store still stands.”
Nothing is announced yet, but since GW2 is released without a subscription plan then there is other ways needed to gain funds for paying their servers and employees. There will probably be expansions and DLC which would make them some money, but looking at the Monthly costs that Blizzard has for WoW i highly doubt that will be enough..
So they will probably have an itemshop with much more then just leveling potions... They say they will not encourage people to buy them, but i am affraid their buiseness model requires them to have them, because after all someone has to pay the bill..
What are your feelings towards this part of the game? What do you think Arenanet will do?
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Comments
Not a very good poll, because my answer is 'a little 2, a lot of 3, and a little 4 maybe'.
So how in the world can I vote?
I think any popular online game should have an item shop with cosmetic items only. It grows the community, and gives the developer more funds for additional content or support of the game or even for future games. I however do not agree with item shops (many f2ps do this) where you can buy EXP boosts, Potions that give all sorts of very benefitial buffs that can't be obtained, or they allow you to buy gear or even levels, all these I despise and will never support.
Agreed. Fail poll.
What kind of item shop will GW2 have? Answer : Probably the same type of shop they had in GW1.
- Some DLC (hidden dungeons, items, pets, etc.)
- Cosmetic Items (costumes, armor skins, weapon skins, etc.)
- Potions (exp boosts, dyes)
If they ever introduce companions / heroes / etc. They'll probably eventually have those in the shop as well.
There's really not much else to put in a cash shop for a game such as this. It's not a game that revolves heavily around loot.
That's quite a big step up from GW1 to be honest.
I just don't want that motherf*cking shopping cart icon anywhere on my screen.
my answer is cosmetic items and stuff like Transmutation stones. And they wont do any 2x exp stuff in my opinion which is more pointless in GW2 than in GW1 esp with sidekicking. Also mind you cool stuff like transmutation stones will NOT be item shop only, they will be available from Karma point vendors( Karma is spl currency awarded for participation in DEs)
Agree with Meowhead, there's no answer to the poll which accurately describes what I think it will have. DLCs/Expansions, extra stuff like extra character slots or bank tabs.
People need to separate two different types of costs. The first are operating costs like bandwidth, servers, rent, electricity, etc. ArenaNet has said several times they've developed technology to keep these costs low, but honestly there's no indication that they're all that high in the first place. Maybe back in the EQ days they required a $15 a month sub, they don't now. Look at my sig. P2P companies have absolutely no incentive to tell you that they don't actually need that subscription, or at least not all $15 of it to pay to keep things running.
Secondly, there's development costs. These are the big expense compared to operating costs. The thing is that development costs are paid for by the things they develop. You pay 100-200 developers like 50-100k per year for 5 years to develop the game in the first place, this is what box sales are paying off, the money that NCSoft or investors put up. After the game sells, you've still got all these developers that you don't want to have to fire, so you've got to put them to work on something else. If this was a non-MMO, you'd just have them making another game. If this was a P2P game, part of that $15 goes to paying for the "free" content upgrades you get every couple months, or they're making the $40 expansion you're buying every 1-1.5 years. With a B2P game, they're still making content. The only difference is that the purchases are voluntary. Whether it's a standalone game every 6 months, or a DLC every few months, or an expansion.
Whatever it is, whatever the method of payment, development pays for developers (and hopefully also turns a profit)
An equivalent B2P game will always sell better than a P2P, so not everybody needs to buy everything. They can have more players buying less and still turn a profit.
The item shop in GW1 wasn't even in the game for the first year, and it's entirely possible to play the game without even knowing the item shop even exists. The way I see it, not having one is just leaving money on the table. As long as it's vanity and the game itself doesn't hold you back, I've got no problem with them trying to make a little extra. GW1 earned vastly more income than the P2P City of Heroes over the same time period, probably largely because it probably had 10x as many players as it would have had as if it were P2P.
TLDR To me the idea that it's inevitable that the cash shop is going to go P2W because they need to pay the bills is unfounded.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." -Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
Actually, because it IS so pointless, I actually wouldn't mind if they sold 2x exp stones or something, especially if it's after a year or so when people are mostly working on alts.
Levels just aren't a big deal in GW2. They're almost fake. Sidekicking up, sidekicking down... automatic full levels in competitive PvP...
You can tell Arenanet wanted to do a game without levels, but just didn't think they'd be able to sell it to the mass audience. So they made 80 levels worth of mostly fake levels.
If somebody is THAT determined that spending 100 hours or so to level up a character is way too long, then... oh well. More power to them, I guess. They're not really buying power. Sure, they're rushing ahead a bit, but I'm getting to experience more awesome gameplay.
I used to kill myself in CoH nonstop for massive xp penalties, just so I could finish some story arcs without outlevelling them, and the story in that game was pretty abyssmal. :P GW2 is looking to be better.
If it's like GW1 you could only access the shop from the login screen.
Also, take a look at GW1's shop, that's pretty much how GW2 shop will be.
If they add DLC, I hope it's not the kind that adds dungeons. Anything that segregates the community is a bad idea in my opinion.
The only playable part released in gw shop was the "bonus mission pack". 4 short solo missions with full arsenal as rewards (4 different unique weapon skins). You can repeat em to obtain as many weapons as you wish. Really nothing you can live without
Have none of you guys played Guild Wars at all? Jesus. It's just cosmetic goods, they don't have weapons and shit for sale in the item shop and if they did they'd still be obtainable in game.
yep but i know people who have money will buy the stones to have it quick....my friend played guild wars 1 he spend alot of money on cash shop tends to spend alot in this one >.<
.....
There is more than just cosmetic goods in the GW1 item shop.
Hopefully just cosmetic and DLC,
Backpacks, char slots things like that.. Although i would pay to change the appearance of an item like make 1 sword look like another (within the game) ..a characters appearance would like a lot more unique. I would even go as far as a small xp boost on extra char slots bought.
Why would anyone want something like XP boosters with the way they have described the game and the focus of the game.
Transmutation Stones can be obtained in game (certain karma merchants) and through the store. These will allow you to 'fuse' two items so that you can retain the look you like without sacrificing anything stat-wise. Extra character slots have not been confirmed but will almost certainly be a big feature in the store.
I expect there to be seasonal costumes, makeover packs, name changes, extra character slots and extra item storage for sure. I wouldn't be surprised to see some small content like the Bonus Mission Pack, with cosmetic rewards, either. Perhaps there'll be EXP orbs too, since we know those items currently exist in the game and are fairly easy to get (daily feats), so it wouldn't take much out of the game, but would allow impatient players to spam their way up. -shrugs-
"Those who stand at the top determine what's wrong and what's right. This very place is neutral ground! Justice will prevail, you say? But of course it will! Whoever wins this war becomes justice!"
So, what exactly are those monthly costs? I just did an admittedly quick search on that and couldn't find anything (not recent anyway - they claimed a total of $200 million in 2008, so about $50 million per year). Considering that GW1 has been running for over 5 years and still seems to remain profitable kind of shows me that their non sub business model works just fine. In fact, it seems to expose the fallacy that Blizzard "has" to charge a monthly fee to be profitable.
GW1's cash shop has mostly cosmetic items, the pet unlock pack, the elite skills unlock pack (you still have to go find the skills in PvE), and the bonus mission packs. With the exception of some of the new cosmetic items, most of those things have been in the cash shop for years so I'm sure they aren't relying on that as a base revenue. I don't know for sure but I can't imagine that people bought that stuff on a large scale even a year after they came out. I could be wrong though, I haven't seen Anet's books.
Either way, Anet seems to have been able to make a profitable game that they have proven to be able to maintain as well as WoW, but without the sub fee. I wouldn't be too surprised if they did it again.
You want me to pay to play a game I already paid for???
Be afraid.....The dragons are HERE!
Guildwars servers can't be compared to typical MMO servers... lets say server costs are $50.000.000 a year for $5.000.000 players, thats about $10/year... add to that the continuous costs of the development team, then its obvious that they need atleast an income of $30 /playing customer /year to break even... so they need atleast 2 expansions a year at $30 each if they sell boxes through retail... to make a tiny bit of money...
So there is no other way for them to have an itemshop where the average Joe spends atleast $5 a month on virtuall items to make a tiny bit of profit....
Now you can argue with my math, but the general idea is there.... they need to sell stuff to make up for the server upcosts, and the development teams sallary and on top of that keep investors happy in these harsh times...
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Could you please explain why you think GW servers can't be compared to typical MMO servers? I don't see how they would be much different. You still have to have the ability to log many thousands of people on and give them content both in the cities (persistent areas) and in the instances. You also have to do this simultaneously, just like in other MMOs. I don't really think the differences in gameplay make that much of a difference in the cost of maintaining the servers, etc. If that were the case, Anet would not be attempting to run GW2 as a persistent world with dynamic events constantly running (not to mention all the mini games, etc.) as well as 3 tiered explorable dungeons without a subscription fee. Yet that is exactly what they are doing and I don't think they would try it if they didn't have full confidence that it will work.
I pulled this from Cali59's signature (thanks!) and have seen it around before and read Jeff's article about it:
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true – you know it, and they know it." -Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
I personally think that "server costs", etc. are just an MMO develpers' excuse to suck more money out of our pockets. I've said on other posts and will say here that maybe 10 years ago (or even 7 when WoW first came out) subscriptions were needed to offset server/bandwidth costs, but that isn't really true any more. Server and bandwidth costs have decreased dramatically over those years and so are now fairly miniscule money considerations. Also, if server/bandwidth issues did require subscriptions to maintain, why would games like LotRO go to its hybrid system? At the moment they MAY be staying afloat due to people continuing their subscriptions, but I don't see that lasting much longer. I'm sure Turbine thought of that before they started implementing their F2P policies.
I agree with Jeff, I know it's not true and I know that many of these companies know it, too.
*edit: Font size (weird!)
You want me to pay to play a game I already paid for???
Be afraid.....The dragons are HERE!
Please ArenaNet. stick with the basic only.
-Name/gender/apperance change is fine
-Transmutation stone is fine (can be purchased ingame with Karma too)
-Costumes/mask and weapon/armor skin is fine
-character slot is fine
-storage slot is fine
-mini pets is fine
Don't ever touch this
-Xp boost is pointless because of sidekicking
-Dlc with new dungeon and armor/weapon? please no... just no
-speed boost? no
-mount? no
-unique special pet for ranger? no
everything ta give a + over other player is a no. Please ArenaNet ... Don't do something that stupid
They have already stated they will be selling Dungeons .
I am affraid this is going to happen.... tough i don't know if the weapons and armor will be better, but they will be just different...
Its the perfect system, you pay for what you get, nothing wrong with a system like this, if prices are lower or on par with subscriptions when you buy all new DLC...
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
I personally have no qualms with vanity items and such purchasable in the cash shop. I probably won't buy them myself since I like the cosmetic stuff you have to put the effort into to obtain. I take a small sence of pride in working for what I have. My wife however is a hoarder and loves these type of things. If I can help Anet out by buying a cosmetic item out of the shop while at the same time possibly buying my way out of the after argument couch visit then I love this.
As long as they don't steer the game towards forcing you to buy things just to either enjoy the game or stay on par with others then by all means. If people want to support the devs by purchasing optional stuff from the CS then it's a win win.
RIP Jimmy "The Rev" Sullivan and Paul Gray.
You want me to pay to play a game I already paid for???
Be afraid.....The dragons are HERE!