ive been playing Rift since beta event 1 and every single update and major patch they put through changes the game for the worse. Every single one makes it even closer to WoW. I canceled my sub because of it. I dont wanna play WoW and I sure as hell don't wanna play a game that is devolving into WoW.
I think by "serious contender [to WoW]", Lars means "trying to copy WoW in every aspect".
And, yeah - in that respect he is right. Rift really is the only game that not only could be called WoW 2.0, but is inferior to the original in most aspects as well. I've played it for two months, and it seriously is the one MMO I can't see myself returning to at some point.
Have you even played Rift? WoW and Rift are totally different. Rift you can switch classes on the fly, WoW you're stuck with the class you chose permenantly. Rift has infinitely better graphics. If you have a decent graphics card, if not, then almost all games look alike since they will be using reduced shaders, detail, etc. If you have a good enough computer, set every setting to max, it looks like a freakin CGI movie. Then there's lore. Rift has much better lore than WoW. WoW just keeps creating the next bigger badder boss, while Rift has a reason why the boss is there in the first place. I'm tired of people saying "<game> just copied WoW." Most games aren't copies of WoW. If you sit there and say everything is a copy of WoW, then go play FPS or something. ALL MMOs are similar to each other, you go two paths, there's sandbox, and there's quest driven. So...every MMO is just a copy of Neverwinter Nights. Neverwinter Nights is a Visual copy of MUDs and RPGs. RPGs are copies....i think you can tell were this is going.
Edit: Oh, and customer support you can't even compare the two. Ive had tickets in WoW open for days. I've had 3 problems with rift, it took Trion about 30 minutes TOTAL to reply/help...Trion is the best MMO company right now
I thought so too. I read people being all excited about it and wonder if we played the same game. Confuses the hell outta me. I don't get it. For ME it was one of the most boring and mundane games I ever played. Granted, I never made it past level 23 or 27, don't remember which, but it was too boring for me to go on. The quests were AWFUL. But....to each their own. It was certainly not my cup of tea.
I still enjoy reading the news about ALL MMOs, so this is interesting, albeit strange. Rift is not "skeered".....and maybe they should be. Or....maybe not. Who can accurately foretell what gamers will do? We're a very diverse people group. Anything could happen.
Rift is a perfect example of how many people are not tired of the WoW type of game mechanics. I'm sure Rift will weather out the TOR storm just fine. Just as I am sure TOR will do well and turn a nice profit and WoW will still be the King of MMO's for some time to come. This type of game play will not change until something different turns the type of profit that investors want to see. The industry may be stagnant from an innovation point of view but these guys will still be rolling in the dollars and that is after all how success is measured.
Rift is a solid game with some potential growth at this point, but in reality the only reason half the people are playing is because they are waiting for SWTOR. It may still hold some subs a few months from now, but I would imagine we will see a cash shop and possibly even a hybrid f2p model in the future. The game's leveling just does not have enough depth. Considering that the majority of people playing MMOS are not max level, SWTOR and GW2 alike will both appeal to many more players.
If you have a good enough computer, set every setting to max, it looks like a freakin CGI movie. Then there's lore. Rift has much better lore than WoW.
I stopped reading right there. Rift has no lore. Period. WoW's lore, while not on the level of Lotro or SWG/TOR, is very well known and pretty deep.
It's one thing to be a fan of the game, but let's not go posting falsehoods, either.
I thought so too. I read people being all excited about it and wonder if we played the same game. Confuses the hell outta me. I don't get it. For ME it was one of the most boring and mundane games I ever played. Granted, I never made it past level 23 or 27, don't remember which, but it was too boring for me to go on. The quests were AWFUL. But....to each their own. It was certainly not my cup of tea.
I still enjoy reading the news about ALL MMOs, so this is interesting, albeit strange. Rift is not "skeered".....and maybe they should be. Or....maybe not. Who can accurately foretell what gamers will do? We're a very diverse people group. Anything could happen.
You can take my word for it---it doesn't get any better beyond level 27 either. The questing/levelling process is just terrible in this game. You spend the whole time thinking, "My God, I can't wait until I hit cap so I can stop with these inane quests." Only problem is, the end-game content is just as inane and boring as the levelling process.
Trion is a good company, but they had the wrong vision for this game. And any of the Rift players who actually believe that Trion is going to be pumping out the same amount of content a year from now are delusional. They are pushing out content that was sorely lacking from launch to try and get caught up, knowing they are going to lose a ton of players in a few months. This is nothing more than filling in the cracks of a very dull game to begin with. Unfortunately, they aren't filling in those cracks with the right stuff. All they've added is more grind and more monotony.
debbie downers indeed. Why is everyone so critical of everything. If you dont like Rift and games like it why comment on it? makes you seem a little petty. Anyways I enjoy Rift. Good fun. Good Guild, great mates.
If no one commented then there would be a bunch of VERY short threads. Think about it. If people that didn't like WoW didn't comment....or if people that didn't like SoE didn't comment.....or etc., etc. This is a forum. People voice differing views and opinions on forums. It's kind of the point.....
If you have a good enough computer, set every setting to max, it looks like a freakin CGI movie. Then there's lore. Rift has much better lore than WoW.
I stopped reading right there. Rift has no lore. Period. WoW's lore, while not on the level of Lotro or SWG/TOR, is very well known and pretty deep.
It's one thing to be a fan of the game, but let's not go posting falsehoods, either.
WoW lore ? lol
What like spacegoats ? They make up lore as they go along, how many time has Onyxia and Ragnaros been resurected ?
Rift lasted all of 2 months on my machine. And only that because I didn't decide to cancel until 3 days after my 2nd month was charged. The dynamic content wasn't very dynamic and grew to be a chore long before I hit level cap. What made it worse is that it is a one trick pony. We got new content, that new content was to go forth and fight rifts. Which is what we did previously. Then more content. Oh, fighting rifts? Uhm, guys?
Can I speak to TOR? No. But he's already lost me as a subscriber long before TOR came along. I've Pro-ordered TOR, something I didn't do with Rift. Even if I end up not liking TOR (possible since the MMO I'm really waiting for is GW2) I'm still not going back to Rift. I know a few people who are dropping Rift in the next few months. Some for TOR, some for other reasons.
Has everyone already forgotten the EPIC security breach rift had at launch?? THOUSANDS of accounts hacked in the first week?
Anyhow, I beta'd SWTOR and Rift should feel comfortable. SWTOR will have record breaking box sales then be considered a failure after 2 months. It is a shallow, golden path game on rails. Rift isn't any better but SWTOR is sure to disappoint at least 3/4 of initial players.
Right now, with TOR being The Next Big MMO, people think it'll naturally blow away all other MMOs, at least in the WoW-park bracket. Thing is, when it turns out to be just another MMO, it'll go back to being all about preferences again, and when all is said and done, and TOR turns out to have its own sort of flaws and weaknesses, some people will prefer Rift. I'd even go so far as to say the same of GW2. I'm sure that won't be everyone's cup of tea, either.
It's just when these games are all hype crazy, people forget just how flawed they always turn out to be, each in their own ways.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
If you have a good enough computer, set every setting to max, it looks like a freakin CGI movie. Then there's lore. Rift has much better lore than WoW.
I stopped reading right there. Rift has no lore. Period. WoW's lore, while not on the level of Lotro or SWG/TOR, is very well known and pretty deep.
It's one thing to be a fan of the game, but let's not go posting falsehoods, either.
WoW lore ? lol
What like spacegoats ? They make up lore as they go along, how many time has Onyxia and Ragnaros been resurected ?
You do realize that the WoW universe is based on the Warcraft franchise correct? And you do realize they have a pretty extensive series of books detailing the history of the Warcraft universe, correct? I'm not saying they don't take liberties with that history, but they do have a much, much larger and deeper source of lore to pull from than Rift does. This isn't even up for debate.
If you have a good enough computer, set every setting to max, it looks like a freakin CGI movie. Then there's lore. Rift has much better lore than WoW.
I stopped reading right there. Rift has no lore. Period. WoW's lore, while not on the level of Lotro or SWG/TOR, is very well known and pretty deep.
It's one thing to be a fan of the game, but let's not go posting falsehoods, either.
WoW lore ? lol
What like spacegoats ? They make up lore as they go along, how many time has Onyxia and Ragnaros been resurected ?
You do realize that the WoW universe is based on the Warcraft franchise correct? And you do realize they have a pretty extensive series of books detailing the history of the Warcraft universe, correct? I'm not saying they don't take liberties with that history, but they do have a much, much larger and deeper source of lore to pull from than Rift does. This isn't even up for debate.
Have you even played Rift? WoW and Rift are totally different. [..]
Edit: Oh, and customer support you can't even compare the two. Ive had tickets in WoW open for days. I've had 3 problems with rift, it took Trion about 30 minutes TOTAL to reply/help...Trion is the best MMO company right now
Yes, I have played. I've played it in Beta, and (at the urging of some friends who liked it) I played it for two months at release.
To me, it feels like a carbon copy of WoW. Quests are presented in exactly the same way as in WoW (and, yes, there are games that do it differently). The GUI is very similar. The talent point system is similar.
And most importantly, the game's philosophy is similar. You get funneled through the open world until you hit max level, at which point the entire open world becomes useless for progression. The only road to character progression is gearing up (though I read somewhere they want to implement some sort of AA). At max level, you do the very same things you do in WoW: Grind Daily quests, grind reputation, and grind dungeons/raids. The difference to WoW? It takes ages to get anywhere.
And, as others already pointed out, people are just burned out of those mechanics. Rift offers nothing that hasn't been done to death.
The fact that you can choose your own selection of talent trees within limits isn't all that it's touted to be, either. There are trees that work well together. Others don't. If you choose some that don't, you're gimping yourself.
Other than that, this system discourages alts. One character from each calling, and you're set. Which is just as well, since the road to max level can not be deviated from (other than in WoW, where you often have different zones for a level range).
And, yes, the CS in WoW is abysmal atm. But that doesn't say anything about the quality of the game per se. As I said: It's not that Rift is a bad game. I did enjoy it until I hit max level. After one week of grinding I couldn't be bothered to log in any more. Even the titular rifts quickly lose their appeal.
Quick reply to your other points: I, for one, find the game's graphics to be bland and boring, for example. And i played on max. Maybe I'm just too old to be blinded by sparkly shaders. And WoW's bosses usually have reason for being there, too. To be honest, I'm an avid fan of well-done lore. WoW doesn't have it (any more). Rift, I'm sad to say, never had it. I really tried to get into it, but it just was so cookie-cutter stereotypical fantasy I really cba after a while.
Yeah we know. WoW clone, repetitive, nothing new here etc....
Trion isn't all concerned about us MMO and -most importantly- WoW vets. And thats what most of you subscribers on this site are. Your summary views from your WoW/MMO perspective are just a small part of the potential MMO subscriber pie. Believe it nor not many people could be starting their first MMO or at least their first "WoW-like" MMO. If you were a new player today without a WoW perspective (that most of you here are coming from) which would you choose, WoW or Rift? I know what my choice would be.
So please, just because you're the uber/ultra/ludacris/elite MMORPG.com fourm god of the era don't presume your point of view magically speaks for the majority of the MMO enthusiast base.
Comments
ive been playing Rift since beta event 1 and every single update and major patch they put through changes the game for the worse. Every single one makes it even closer to WoW. I canceled my sub because of it. I dont wanna play WoW and I sure as hell don't wanna play a game that is devolving into WoW.
Tell me after TOR, GW2, TSW. Tell me where Rift stands when these 3+ many more titles are out.
We'll see if he's able to say "We still feel strong about our game." I hope so because many jobs ride on that title.
Guild Wars 2's 50 minutes game play video:
http://n4g.com/news/592585/guild-wars-2-50-minutes-of-pure-gameplay
Everything We Know about GW2:
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/287180/page/1
@Topic
I believe they really are not afraid. However, 1.6 delay was something predictable in my opinion ^^.
@SWTOR
for what ive seen will be an epic fail.
They should be scared - Rift is boring
FROM A VETERAN MMORPG PLAYER...RIFT IS FRIKKING AWESOME!!!!!!! HAVENT HAD THIS MUCH FUN IN AN MMO IN A LONG DAMN TIME!!!!!!!!!
playing eq2 and two worlds
Trion Worlds is the best new MMO company even if his comments may be overly optimistic.
Have you even played Rift? WoW and Rift are totally different. Rift you can switch classes on the fly, WoW you're stuck with the class you chose permenantly. Rift has infinitely better graphics. If you have a decent graphics card, if not, then almost all games look alike since they will be using reduced shaders, detail, etc. If you have a good enough computer, set every setting to max, it looks like a freakin CGI movie. Then there's lore. Rift has much better lore than WoW. WoW just keeps creating the next bigger badder boss, while Rift has a reason why the boss is there in the first place. I'm tired of people saying "<game> just copied WoW." Most games aren't copies of WoW. If you sit there and say everything is a copy of WoW, then go play FPS or something. ALL MMOs are similar to each other, you go two paths, there's sandbox, and there's quest driven. So...every MMO is just a copy of Neverwinter Nights. Neverwinter Nights is a Visual copy of MUDs and RPGs. RPGs are copies....i think you can tell were this is going.
Edit: Oh, and customer support you can't even compare the two. Ive had tickets in WoW open for days. I've had 3 problems with rift, it took Trion about 30 minutes TOTAL to reply/help...Trion is the best MMO company right now
I thought so too. I read people being all excited about it and wonder if we played the same game. Confuses the hell outta me. I don't get it. For ME it was one of the most boring and mundane games I ever played. Granted, I never made it past level 23 or 27, don't remember which, but it was too boring for me to go on. The quests were AWFUL. But....to each their own. It was certainly not my cup of tea.
I still enjoy reading the news about ALL MMOs, so this is interesting, albeit strange. Rift is not "skeered".....and maybe they should be. Or....maybe not. Who can accurately foretell what gamers will do? We're a very diverse people group. Anything could happen.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
Rift is a perfect example of how many people are not tired of the WoW type of game mechanics. I'm sure Rift will weather out the TOR storm just fine. Just as I am sure TOR will do well and turn a nice profit and WoW will still be the King of MMO's for some time to come. This type of game play will not change until something different turns the type of profit that investors want to see. The industry may be stagnant from an innovation point of view but these guys will still be rolling in the dollars and that is after all how success is measured.
Yes marketing rules, kill that WoW sized godzilla!!! The rest of the world might move on but who cares?! As long as Trion guys win!!!!!!!
I'm going to out WoW WoW, support me I'm cool, honest!!!
This looks like a job for....The Riviera Kid!
Rift is a solid game with some potential growth at this point, but in reality the only reason half the people are playing is because they are waiting for SWTOR. It may still hold some subs a few months from now, but I would imagine we will see a cash shop and possibly even a hybrid f2p model in the future. The game's leveling just does not have enough depth. Considering that the majority of people playing MMOS are not max level, SWTOR and GW2 alike will both appeal to many more players.
I stopped reading right there. Rift has no lore. Period. WoW's lore, while not on the level of Lotro or SWG/TOR, is very well known and pretty deep.
It's one thing to be a fan of the game, but let's not go posting falsehoods, either.
You can take my word for it---it doesn't get any better beyond level 27 either. The questing/levelling process is just terrible in this game. You spend the whole time thinking, "My God, I can't wait until I hit cap so I can stop with these inane quests." Only problem is, the end-game content is just as inane and boring as the levelling process.
Trion is a good company, but they had the wrong vision for this game. And any of the Rift players who actually believe that Trion is going to be pumping out the same amount of content a year from now are delusional. They are pushing out content that was sorely lacking from launch to try and get caught up, knowing they are going to lose a ton of players in a few months. This is nothing more than filling in the cracks of a very dull game to begin with. Unfortunately, they aren't filling in those cracks with the right stuff. All they've added is more grind and more monotony.
If no one commented then there would be a bunch of VERY short threads. Think about it. If people that didn't like WoW didn't comment....or if people that didn't like SoE didn't comment.....or etc., etc. This is a forum. People voice differing views and opinions on forums. It's kind of the point.....
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
WoW lore ? lol
What like spacegoats ? They make up lore as they go along, how many time has Onyxia and Ragnaros been resurected ?
Rift lasted all of 2 months on my machine. And only that because I didn't decide to cancel until 3 days after my 2nd month was charged. The dynamic content wasn't very dynamic and grew to be a chore long before I hit level cap. What made it worse is that it is a one trick pony. We got new content, that new content was to go forth and fight rifts. Which is what we did previously. Then more content. Oh, fighting rifts? Uhm, guys?
Can I speak to TOR? No. But he's already lost me as a subscriber long before TOR came along. I've Pro-ordered TOR, something I didn't do with Rift. Even if I end up not liking TOR (possible since the MMO I'm really waiting for is GW2) I'm still not going back to Rift. I know a few people who are dropping Rift in the next few months. Some for TOR, some for other reasons.
Not just another pretty color.
Right now, with TOR being The Next Big MMO, people think it'll naturally blow away all other MMOs, at least in the WoW-park bracket. Thing is, when it turns out to be just another MMO, it'll go back to being all about preferences again, and when all is said and done, and TOR turns out to have its own sort of flaws and weaknesses, some people will prefer Rift. I'd even go so far as to say the same of GW2. I'm sure that won't be everyone's cup of tea, either.
It's just when these games are all hype crazy, people forget just how flawed they always turn out to be, each in their own ways.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
You do realize that the WoW universe is based on the Warcraft franchise correct? And you do realize they have a pretty extensive series of books detailing the history of the Warcraft universe, correct? I'm not saying they don't take liberties with that history, but they do have a much, much larger and deeper source of lore to pull from than Rift does. This isn't even up for debate.
거북이는 목을 내밀 때 안 움직입니다
Yep, pretty serious stuff, isnt it ? ...
Yes, I have played. I've played it in Beta, and (at the urging of some friends who liked it) I played it for two months at release.
To me, it feels like a carbon copy of WoW. Quests are presented in exactly the same way as in WoW (and, yes, there are games that do it differently). The GUI is very similar. The talent point system is similar.
And most importantly, the game's philosophy is similar. You get funneled through the open world until you hit max level, at which point the entire open world becomes useless for progression. The only road to character progression is gearing up (though I read somewhere they want to implement some sort of AA). At max level, you do the very same things you do in WoW: Grind Daily quests, grind reputation, and grind dungeons/raids. The difference to WoW? It takes ages to get anywhere.
And, as others already pointed out, people are just burned out of those mechanics. Rift offers nothing that hasn't been done to death.
The fact that you can choose your own selection of talent trees within limits isn't all that it's touted to be, either. There are trees that work well together. Others don't. If you choose some that don't, you're gimping yourself.
Other than that, this system discourages alts. One character from each calling, and you're set. Which is just as well, since the road to max level can not be deviated from (other than in WoW, where you often have different zones for a level range).
And, yes, the CS in WoW is abysmal atm. But that doesn't say anything about the quality of the game per se. As I said: It's not that Rift is a bad game. I did enjoy it until I hit max level. After one week of grinding I couldn't be bothered to log in any more. Even the titular rifts quickly lose their appeal.
Quick reply to your other points: I, for one, find the game's graphics to be bland and boring, for example. And i played on max. Maybe I'm just too old to be blinded by sparkly shaders. And WoW's bosses usually have reason for being there, too. To be honest, I'm an avid fan of well-done lore. WoW doesn't have it (any more). Rift, I'm sad to say, never had it. I really tried to get into it, but it just was so cookie-cutter stereotypical fantasy I really cba after a while.
Biggus99 makes some good points, too.
Yeah we know. WoW clone, repetitive, nothing new here etc....
Trion isn't all concerned about us MMO and -most importantly- WoW vets. And thats what most of you subscribers on this site are. Your summary views from your WoW/MMO perspective are just a small part of the potential MMO subscriber pie. Believe it nor not many people could be starting their first MMO or at least their first "WoW-like" MMO. If you were a new player today without a WoW perspective (that most of you here are coming from) which would you choose, WoW or Rift? I know what my choice would be.
So please, just because you're the uber/ultra/ludacris/elite MMORPG.com fourm god of the era don't presume your point of view magically speaks for the majority of the MMO enthusiast base.
I love how he tries to say that 5 years ago there was only WoW, when EQ2 and LOTRO sub numbers really werent *that* far off what hes got now.
didnt know paul giamatti worked for trion