is it too late

GTDHECATE · July 2005

Hi guyz i used to play Earth and Beyond and then they git RIP . I just reading the review of EVE ONLINE at gamespot.com and according to what i understood was its learning skill is baed on time . So is it too late for me to start a new account and new character and will i be ever able to compete players who been playing this since 2 years ?

Copeland · July 2005

You'll always be behind overall but if you specialize you can compete rather well.

Knightblast · July 2005

Originally posted by GTDHECATE
Hi guyz i used to play Earth and Beyond and then they git RIP . I just reading the review of EVE ONLINE at gamespot.com and according to what i understood was its learning skill is baed on time . So is it too late for me to start a new account and new character and will i be ever able to compete players who been playing this since 2 years ?

This seems to be a common cause of concern for people.

EVE trains skills in real time. So you will *never* catch up, in terms of total skill points, with someone who has been training nonstop for the past two years. Never, unless they stop training.

The key to understand, however, is that you don't need to catch up in terms of total skill points in order to compete with players who have many, many more total skill points than you do. The key is taking a more targeted and focused approach to your own skill training (focusing on one or two key areas) so that you can "catch up" in those areas and compete with the other players in those areas.

It's really not that big a deal ... it only becomes a big deal if you scatter your skillpoints around all the various areas ... if you do that, then you will fall behind a lot of people, even folks who start around the same time you do.

Naos · July 2005

No its never too late.. even a week old newbie can play a part in a fleet Op, more so now than ever.

What I would have given to have half of the content ingame now when I started out

foxhound16 · July 2005

What a lot of people fail to realize, is there isn't much difference between lvl 5 skills and lvl 4 skills. Only thing you will be short on is tech 2 modules, but the best named are almost as good and have lower fittings. The difference in the gunnery skills is between 3-5% for each category, so although they have an advantage, it isn't much. If you train your skills right you can easily take down a character with more sp. With 6 mill sp I killed a player with 15 mill sp...I know cuz I saw him selling his character afterwards ::::01:: . I hope being behind doesn't scare you away from Eve...it's a great game.

GTDHECATE · July 2005

thx for replies guyz, seems like not a big deal then, I love Space Sims, ANd ive played ever space sim out there. GUss ill run to Gamestop and buy one copy

Earth and Beyond was my favourite.

baroo · July 2005

Eve is a great game, and as stated in another post you will be a bit behind, but nothing worth mentioning. I have canceled my account, as all my friends, real life, have moved to WoW. I miss this game a lot and might re-instate my account.

GTDHECATE · July 2005

LOL i m moving from World of Warcraft to EVE ONLINE, I have palyed WOW a lot and i have lvl 60 mage and lvl 60 Druid. But me being a space sim fan ........WOW IS awesome game ull love it. GOod luck

Kem0sabe · July 2005

I think you will find it hard to keep focused when your skills start taking 20+ days in realtime to train, currently thats the biggest problem with eve, the lack of meaningfull progression for your character, you wont feel rewarded after waiting so many days to train a skill and thinking the next one will take that many also. Just my personal view of things.

Knightblast · July 2005

Originally posted by Kem0sabe
I think you will find it hard to keep focused when your skills start taking 20+ days in realtime to train, currently thats the biggest problem with eve, the lack of meaningfull progression for your character, you wont feel rewarded after waiting so many days to train a skill and thinking the next one will take that many also. Just my personal view of things.

Here's the thing about that: you shouldn't be so focused on the next skill to progress your character. If you have a really long skill training, you should be focused on other things like making money, raising standing, PvPing, roleplaying, testing loadouts, exploring, setting up instajump bookmarks, or what have you, during the time that your skill is training. The skill training time is only a big deal if you're really focused on skill training as a benchmark for your development and anxious to get to the "end game material" as soon as you can, which is really the wrong approach to take to EVE in general.

There are, in reality, very few skills that take 20 days or more to train. Mostly people get skill training times like that when they try to train to fly a battleship too early on without doing adequate attribute-raising learning skill training, and when they do finally get the battleship skill they want, they can't fly it very well becuse they don't have the gun skills for that size ship, or the other module-related skills to really make it an effective platform. It's a poor choice of training.

A good way to avoid that is to train the attribute-enhancing learning skills to level 5 during the first few months, and then train the advanced attribute-enhancing learning skills up as well so that your attributes are all 16+ and hopefully one or two around 20 without the use of implants. Then watch your skill training time be chopped down substantially --- and if you get implants, even more so. That's the best way to go about training because although it is not so glamorous to be training those skills, it pays substantial dividends after they are done in terms of overall training time saved.

Homelander · July 2005

On the same trend, I believe it is very rewarding that after waiting for over 30d to train all the skills I was needing to finaly be able to jump into a Heavy Assault Ship, I finaly got myself into one. Yeah, it required alot of skills to level 5, cruiser 5 was just under 20d by itself, but now that I've finaly got all of it done, I can fly an amazing ship that can be fitted to whoop just about anything.

Just training a skill to level 5 to get the 2-10% boost to whatever it is boosting is usualy not worth the while but, when your getting skills to level 5 to get yourself into some nice looking T2 ships, I personnaly believe that it makes it well worth the wait.

Same goes for all the people who are rush-training to get into dreadnaughts, with 20+ perception and willpower, your talking about 2 months of training to be able to use one efficiently and last I checked, there hasen't even be any produced yet. That might be due to the fact that it requires capital starship engineering (rank 15) to level 5 to put the final product together but still, people are willing to put 2, 3 or more months aside simply to train for this one ship that can only be used in large gangs and is primarily only good for shooting at stations. It's long, it's annoying but the end result is well worth the wait.

Phron · July 2005

I agree with all the replies here except two.

1st, I do believe training for a long time is rewarding, that's why you started the skill in the first place. You didn't just randomly pick a skill to train for no apparent reason, there was a goal, have it be a better module, ship, or whatever.

2nd, I believe training from Level 4 to Level 5 is worth it. Even if it is 2-5%. Every little bit helps, and it also open up for more advanced skills.

Great suggestion earlier, which is what I'm doing to a New ALT. But I did it a little different.

Train into something before learning first, something to make your character useful while he/she is training all the learning skills. Like for instance, train Industrial 1 to 3 levels. It's a cheap skill and the Industrial ships are relatively cheap. Then while you're training you can join a corporation that has a lot of mining ops and help them out by hauling the ores mined. Then you're making profits and it's all good from there.

hicks26 · July 2005

I started 2 months ago and loving it :P And there is always more people joining every day.

adoulou · July 2005

EVE is a very 'cerebral' game... skills are really important... but less than your strategic or coop abilities...

the learning curve is more based on your irl skills than in-game ones...

the game rewards you for your intellectual effort... not for your grindind lvling as many mmorpgs use to...

It's a mature game for mature players...

...so... not for everyone

Scaris · July 2005

Originally posted by GTDHECATE
Hi guyz i used to play Earth and Beyond and then they git RIP . I just reading the review of EVE ONLINE at gamespot.com and according to what i understood was its learning skill is baed on time . So is it too late for me to start a new account and new character and will i be ever able to compete players who been playing this since 2 years ?

No, the only thing that somewhat prevents this from being a bigger issue is that fact that many people do stop playing a game after a few years. But there is no way to compete with someone that alot more time in then you on skills.

MrPopov · July 2005

Originally posted by GTDHECATE
thx for replies guyz, seems like not a big deal then, I love Space Sims, ANd ive played ever space sim out there. GUss ill run to Gamestop and buy one copy

Earth and Beyond was my favourite.

I think you will have trouble finding a copy at gamespot. CCP only sells it as an online download as far as I know.

hicks26 · July 2005

Instead of running to a shop, send one of us your email addy and we will send you a buddy key for the 14 day trial which you can activate after the trial expires anyway

Scaris · July 2005

Originally posted by MrPopov
Originally posted by GTDHECATE
thx for replies guyz, seems like not a big deal then, I love Space Sims, ANd ive played ever space sim out there. GUss ill run to Gamestop and buy one copy

Earth and Beyond was my favourite.

I think you will have trouble finding a copy at gamespot. CCP only sells it as an online download as far as I know.

MWahaha, I have the original box. Its a nice box too! And yes I think you can only get it online now.

Kraptor · July 2005

EVE is a very good game, but it is a very slow paced and so far this was the only game where I felt that I need to create an alt for just mining, btw mining is the most boring thing in the world. Also this is the only mmo game where actually when u die you can use quite a lot of possesion:)

Barrow · July 2005

I have two characters in EVE, one has 17 msp the other 22msp.

the 22msp one has 5 million points in Gunnery and other 5 mill in spaceship command.

Thats 10 million skillpoints and I only use ~2 million of those skillpoints 70% of the time (I fly a interceptor frigate). I also have 1.5msp in the drone category wich I dont use at all when flying my chosen ship.

Thats about 9.5 million skill points I dont use at all when I do the pvp things I love to do. I could probably count more things into this as I dont use many of the skills I have trained in the past.

Of course I have had two years to train what I want and to experiment with ships and other stuff, but you as a new player will have the experience of older players to help you focus your training so you will not have as many skill points you are not using.

And besides that new players have much better access to implants and learning skills than the older players had when they started so the playing field has been leveled some as well.

sycokillah · August 2005

many new players overlook the great advantage of training learning skills in the beginning, they look at other people in great big ships in awe, thinking to themselves, "i want one a ship like that asap". this sometimes ruins there eve experience thinking that training time takes to long, if they had trained the skills earlier they would have saved more time than if they started before the learning skills.

eve isnt very fast paced, it requires alot of patience which many new players do not understand. i even know a few senior members who havent started on there advanced skills after all those years. it isnt impossible to catch up with some of them, it will just take a very long time.

Kem0sabe · August 2005

Dont really care about catching up to anyone, eve is a game that caters to my style of play, i can do alot of interesting things with my time while the skills train.

Scaris · August 2005

Originally posted by sycokillah
many new players overlook the great advantage of training learning skills in the beginning, they look at other people in great big ships in awe, thinking to themselves, "i want one a ship like that asap". this sometimes ruins there eve experience thinking that training time takes to long, if they had trained the skills earlier they would have saved more time than if they started before the learning skills.
eve isnt very fast paced, it requires alot of patience which many new players do not understand. i even know a few senior members who havent started on there advanced skills after all those years. it isnt impossible to catch up with some of them, it will just take a very long time.

I started as a gimp and I won't remake my character because his birthdate is the same day the game was released. I didn't start training him til 1 month ago however when I started back up in the game. His attritutes are pretty nasty for learning alot of things but I don't care. I don't compare with anyone, I just know how long its gonan take to get to my goals. I have spent some time working on learning skills, but I am far from done with them. I am already in a BC and have fair skill in it, have no desire to work on BS yet, I enjoy the hell out of my little destroyer as well! And currently i am about 20 days off from a medium mining barge.

sycokillah · August 2005

Originally posted by Kem0sabe
Dont really care about catching up to anyone, eve is a game that caters to my style of play, i can do alot of interesting things with my time while the skills train.

i feel the same way as you, i was just trying to give an example of how important learning is, im sure that there isnt a right or wrong way in training skills in eve.

Knightblast · August 2005

Originally posted by sycokillah
Originally posted by Kem0sabe
Dont really care about catching up to anyone, eve is a game that caters to my style of play, i can do alot of interesting things with my time while the skills train.

i feel the same way as you, i was just trying to give an example of how important learning is, im sure that there isnt a right or wrong way in training skills in eve.

Yup, yup. As I tell people, try to balance between training "fun" skills and "learning" skills, with the goal of getting all of your attribute-related learning skills to lvl 5, and then getting advanced attribute-enhancing learning skills up several levels as well, interspersing that effort with other skill training -- that way you'ee increase your base attributes by between 5 and 10 points PERMANENTLY. Once you have that done, you can train other advanced skills much, much more quickly, and you won't even have to rely on your implants that much for training times to be decent, even if you are gimped in terms of your starting base attributes. The addition of the advanced learning skills meant that getting attributes up to pretty good levels without having to have millions and millions of isk implanted in your head is possible for every player. It's boring for a bit, but once you see it start paying dividends in terms of training time for other skills, it gets much less boring watching your learning skills advance, believe me.

And, of course, there's nothing stoping you from having fun in the game when you're training learning skills. Once you have a base level of skills for flying a moderate tech I frigate with webbing and jamming skills, you can start getting involved in PvP operations with the right corp: sure you don't have many skill points, but the advantage is that your clone is cheap, you have no implants and you'll be flying a ship (probably supplied by the corp) that is also a throwaway ship, and the reward for you is that you get a lot of combat experience, which is key. People often say that because EVE doesn't feature twitch-based interface, it isn't skill-based, but in reality to run successful PvP operations consistently requires a great deal of skill and, mostly, calom nerves under pressure ... and that comes from actual combat experience, not skill points. So design a skill training plan that makes rational sense, follow it, and then don't think about it, and go about the rest of the game doing what you like.

Kem0sabe · August 2005

I do agree tho that the learning skills are worthwhile to learn to level 4 right at the start, it makes training those nasty multiday skillsa alot easier to bare.

Im currently using my moa, its set up for long range combat and its shapig up nicely as a combat rig, but i was thinking of training my new character to fly barges, its a nice way to support your combat character if you have a nice minning oriented character behind him. Its a pain you cant train more than one skill at a time per account ::::16::

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