Teala, that's a stretch. GW had a lobby that was instanced and when you went in the world it was your own instance of that world, right?
This is nothing like that. There is no "lobby" but sometimes the open world gets sharded. 100 is not the cap either, it's much higher.
At most in any zone there are 2 instances. I've never seen it hit 3 shards. As you level up it doesn't instance at all. Never seen one on tatooine for example. I'm pretty sure the larger worlds have much higher caps than the starter worlds.
The starter worlds are very small and get congested easily. The later worlds are huge.
The guild wars comparison is not really appropriate here. The differences inthe server architecture are much greater. 2 instances per zone compared to how many at a time in GW?
I do kind of see what you are saying, and can see how it would give that impression, but the reality is much different than that.
Yeah it is weird, but Ican see it from his perspective. I will say this, I still do not understand why people are ragging on this system. It aliviates so many issues you might encounter in other games. Even if your friend is on another shard, either have them move to yours or you move to theirs. Which ever has the least peeps in it. Problem solved. It is way less taxing on peoples systems with this in place and I can completely understand why Bioware did this. ::shrugs:: I understand some peoples concerns, but at the same time I understand that this is very benificial to the over all performance of the game.
People are ragging on this system because some of us actually enjoy seeing and interacting with other players in our "Massively Multiplayer" games. I'm on Anchorhad. It's a "full server" and had an 800+ (1 hour) queue to get in at prime time last night. When you do get in, you don't see hardly anyone. The world feels lifeless and dead enough, and then you don't really see many other players. The hubs and social areas such as cantinas are boring as well, because no one is around.
I understand some of you are perfectly fine having a massively singleplayer game, but many of us are not. I chose a high population server in the first place because I thought there would be more general action. Now I realize I should have just gone low population because the experience would have been exactly the same, but with no queue to get on.
A sure sign that you are in an old, dying paradigm/mindset, is when you are scared of new ideas and new technology. Don't feel bad. The world is moving on without you, and you are welcome to yell "Get Off My Lawn!" all you want while it happens. You cannot, however, stop an idea whose time has come.
People are ragging on this system because some of us actually enjoy seeing and interacting with other players in our "Massively Multiplayer" games. I'm on Anchorhad. It's a "full server" and had an 800+ (1 hour) queue to get in at prime time last night. When you do get in, you don't see hardly anyone. The world feels lifeless and dead enough, and then you don't really see many other players. The hubs and social areas such as cantinas are boring as well, because no one is around.
I understand some of you are perfectly fine having a massively singleplayer game, but many of us are not. I chose a high population server in the first place because I thought there would be more general action. Now I realize I should have just gone low population because the experience would have been exactly the same, but with no queue to get on.
I don't think sharding is in and of itself bad. However, I do think that it's just a band-aid to cover up much bigger problems.
The problems being all the issues that are caused by having "player-anchored" quests in a shared world. Or what others know as "traditional" questing. It essentially means that YOU the individual have to complete a quest and what goes on in the world does not contribute at all to your quest.
So YOU have to kill 10 flesh raiders. The problem is that 500 other players also have to kill 10 flesh raiders. Given that you all share the same world and there is a limited supply of flesh raiders, there is a problem. People will be waiting in line to kill flesh raiders. So this is why devs use sharding. They give a controlled group of players their own little "shard" to play around in so that there are enough flesh raider (or whatever) for everyone.
The PROBLEM with sharding when it is used like this is that it makes the game feel even more single player than the player anchored quests do. Now, not only do you personally have to kill the chief (even though he's been killed 2000 times already), but there are only two other people in a half a mile radius when you do it.
I wouldn't have an issue with sharding if it was used ONLY to control lag because that's basically a necessary limitation of technology. My problem with it is that it's used to "cover-up" the inherent flaw with player anchored quests.
There is no way to win this argument with these people on these forums. 95% of them believe that MMORPG really is just MMO and screw the RPG side. They have little to no desire to play anything that is heavily built around the story and the role playing aspects. If its not innovative on the mechanics, if they cann't feel like they are hangin in the club with 2000 people they are not going to like it, no matter how good anything else in it is. And no amount of logic involving anything else is going to sink in one little bit to them. SW:TOR was built as an mmoRPG, with heavy overtones towards the RPG side of the spectrum when it comes to that MMORPG combination. They dont like that, so they are all kinds of mad as a result. It really is just that simple, they want 95% MMO and 5% RPG in thier games - SW:TOR gave them 30% MMO and 70% RPG. For me thats perfect, for them its not acceptable.
(DISCLAIMER - The use of the word YOU in the above post is not directed at any one person in particular, but towards those who fall into the category itself - there is no personal attack here, neither intentional nor implied.)
Where did I state that was not my opinion? OK ill spell it out to you, IMO GW1 was a crap HEAVILY INSTANCED garbage dung heap that I could plat little more than an hour before I uninstalled it.
I just botted my smite monk in GW PVE so i cant really comment on it.. but the PVP in GW was amazing.
- The game is so instanced that you have huge cities with no one in them.
- The game is just Guild Wars.
- Why am I waiting in a queue if it's all instanced.
- Still has annoying aging MMO quests.
- Brad wondering why he is playing the game after level three on a few characters because it is the same game that we've played before. (might not play for much longer).
- Jeff saying it's the best WoW like MMO since WoW.
- Didn't like the on Rails Space game.
- Ryan at around level 12, feels familiar but voice work is great and Jeff feels the same after Joining the Empire (hates Republic).
- Game is very easy.
- Having to choose all light side or all dark side for the gear, even though those are the decisions you don't want to make unless you want to grind repeatables after.
- Brad hates how everything about Star Wars has become these recreations of the original Trilogy. Saying Here is your Obi-Wan class, here is your Han Solo, Boba Fett and Stormtrooper etc. Wants to see new characters...
- Emo Hair designs.
- General chat made of 12 year olds.
- First Flashpoint experience wasn't anywhere near as epic as Vancleef lol.
- Well made MMO but hasn't fixed a lot of problems other MMOs have but the voiced stuff.
- Alien voice work seems weak (probably why we don't have Alien races).
- Jeff doesn't like Star Wars and wish'd they solved problems of the genre, likes companions doing the crafting.
- Brad thinks the new Blizzard MMO is the last hope of pushing the genre forward.
- Patrick hates these types of MMOs and has no interest in playing, thought it was going to be different but turned out it isn't.
- Brad seems to hate no Auto Attack because it makes it unclear when to hit the next attack.
- Jeff 30 hours played.
- Seem to like Saber Modifications but disappointed that you're locked into a saber type with your class.
- Don't get to learn about the Advance class you're picking.
- Good story, well made MMO but still about going to an area, clicking on all the guys with icons above their heads with objectives that all happen to take place in the same area. You do all them quests and then realise you missed one and have to go all the way back, Brad saying that is when he stopped.
Conclusion at the end.
Well made MMO, but it is pretty much a standard MMO and they're curious to see how it turns out. It doesn't seem like they're that impressed so far but they like the story and the voice acting so far.
rofl. A bunch of lemmings hoping on the fresh new MMO. Same shit different game lol
Hmmm PvP centric game vs story PvE centric MMO. No.
....
Did you ever actually play Guild Wars?
It's actually a pretty story centric game. It has cutscenes, missions, heck it even has "companions" like I mentioned in my previous post.
Do you know why people consider GW a PvP centric game? It's probably because it's seven years old, so everyone has already finished the story parts. PvP is a highly repeatable activitiy that gives the game longevity. Without it, no one would play Guild Wars. They would just finish the story, get their fill of the different classes, and quit.
And this is my worry with SWTOR. I don't think it offers anything really good outside of the story. Yes, it has what other MMORPGs have (raids, PvP, dungeons), but I don't think it does these things nearly as well. You can't even pull up the scoreboard in PvP for heaven's sake.
Gw1 was utter crap. This game has very few if any similarities to it at all.
Wow, what a great argument. I love how you used all those facts to back it up!
Where did I state that was not my opinion? OK ill spell it out to you, IMO GW1 was a crap HEAVILY INSTANCED garbage dung heap that I could plat little more than an hour before I uninstalled it.
I also have always found similarities between SWTOR and GW1. It should've been a good thing for me, since I enjoy GW1 a lot. The funny thing is I find SWTOR to be a subpar game. At least GW1 never pretended to be something it's not (aka a MMORPG) in order to force you to pay a sub for it.
@Kreslin Actually that's not why people consider GW1 a PvP game. When it first came out Arenanet had in mind for it to be a PvP game, with PvP being the main end-game for Prophecies. There were only 2 Elite areas (well they added a third a few months later) in which you could enter based on whether your continent was winning in one of the PvP Arenas. As it turned out the game attracted a lot of people that prefered PvE, so the later games (Nightfall, Eye of the North) were entirely PvE focused.
You're also wrong about the storyline being everything there's to PvE. I have around 2500 hours spent in GW1, and like 85% of that time was spent playing PvE. And there's tons of things I've never done. After 3 stand-alone games and one expansion GW1 has loads of content. Just none of it is centered around leveling, gear grinding and no one points you in the direction of the "end-game", so you have to find the stuff you enjoy doing by yourself.
Well in terms of 'instanced' its less being that, and more of it being so damn linear it might as well be instanced. Everyones at different parts and theres very little in terms of traveling through areas you already have been to.
Anywho, not very suprised. If I get over my lightsaber fetish, I can quickly see the flaws and negative points of the game.
90% in this "review" is compleet bullshit, the rest is uninformed "noobs" talking.
there is neutral gear, that you cant wear if you have to much dark or lightside points .. so you have a choise what to light/neutral/dark.
no part of the world is instanced, the entire game is basicly like Campions online. its a huge huge maps that have diferent zones that are all seamless connected but each zone can have a copy of itself in case its to bussy there. you mostly only see this in the capital world and starter zone/world.
well who cares anyway..more forum troll attemps..happens to every mmo..
its not empty at all, and try and the heroic quests if you think questing is to easy. also the 1st flash point was more fun then any pve ive done in wow(vancleef lol)
and i know no auto attack?!?! wtf i need to be doing more constructive things while i play my mmo like watching tv.. or making a sandwhich..
Oh yeah the all light side all dark side for gear claim is completely false.
Diplomacy can make up points you
Missed as well as flashpoints. There are an unlimited amount of DS/LS points in this game.
Oh, and who the crap are these guys and why do they matter?
They are experienced, articulate, respected reviewers whom people come back to time and time again to hear about their opions and experiences of games.
Their opinions matter more than yours.
lol. Their "review" points didnt sound very articulate or experienced. Sounded like a bunch kids hopped up on Mountain Dew. "Can't wait for Blizzrads new MMo. It will save gaming" Really?
there is neutral gear, that you cant wear if you have to much dark or lightside points .. so you have a choise what to light/neutral/dark.
no part of the world is instanced, the entire game is basicly like Campions online. its a huge huge maps that have diferent zones that are all seamless connected but each zone can have a copy of itself in case its to bussy there. you mostly only see this in the capital world and starter zone/world.
Every time you run through a greenlit doorway, and it says "story area" that's an instance. It's cool that they did it so seamlessly, but it's still an instance.
Interesting to see that there's neutral-requirement gear though. I haven't seen any, in 24 levels, it it only higher than that?
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
How can people be waiting in queues and yet see nobody in the game? For some reason that just sounds fishy to me.
That is what everyone is wondering about. I am level 30 and i spent a lot of time on the planets doing quests and messing around.
I ~NEVER~ saw more than 5-6 people in an area, like a city or quest hub. The most i saw was on the Imperial fleet ship which kind of acts like a hub for flashpoints, gear, trainers and rewards. Even there the max i saw running around was at most 20.
There are usually at least 4 instances of every map available. This is NOT a MMO, it is a linear Mass effect type single player game with co-op features.
It is enjoyable the first time around, i do admit that. But even thinking about doing the hundreds of mind numbingly simple quests again on a new class just make me cry.
"Give players systems and tools instead of rails and rules"
90% in this "review" is compleet (complete) bullshit, the rest is uninformed "noobs" talking.
there is neutral gear (never seen any), that you cant (can't) wear if you have to much dark or lightside points .. so you have a choise (choice) what to light/neutral/dark.
no part of the world is instanced (not true), the entire game is basicly like Campions online. its a huge huge maps that have diferent zones that are all seamless connected but each zone can have a copy of itself in case its to bussy (busy) there. you mostly only see this in the capital world and starter zone/world.
well who cares anyway..more forum troll attemps (attempts)..happens to every mmo..
Please provide a screenshot of neutral gear if you may.
I have not seen one neutral gear yet. i am level 30. So pelase come back and post, "but it's only after your each 50", well we shall see about that, i doubt it and what good is it if its only at end game?
The whole world is instanced and there are at least 4 instances up at any time on ANY map plus all the green/red forcefield instances.
Funny how you call others uninformed noobs and trolls. I see only one troll here and that one can't even spell.
"Give players systems and tools instead of rails and rules"
How can people be waiting in queues and yet see nobody in the game? For some reason that just sounds fishy to me.
I almost never see more than one or two other players at a time. Dromund Kaas, Balmorra, and now Nar Shadaa - I don't know, maybe there are a hundred players somewhere, but I never see the sort of population in my immediate area, that I've seen in every other MMO.
What utter rubbish.
You must be playing a different game from every other person.
"one or two others players?" LMFAO - Get real - there are hordes of players everywhere I have been.
So much lies and deceit and SWTOR it amazing. Where do these noobs come from?
How can people be waiting in queues and yet see nobody in the game? For some reason that just sounds fishy to me.
I almost never see more than one or two other players at a time. Dromund Kaas, Balmorra, and now Nar Shadaa - I don't know, maybe there are a hundred players somewhere, but I never see the sort of population in my immediate area, that I've seen in every other MMO.
What utter rubbish.
You must be playing a different game from every other person.
"one or two others players?" LMFAO - Get real - there are hordes of players everywhere I have been.
So much lies and deceit and SWTOR it amazing. Where do these noobs come from?
That is true actually was doing the Revan lots of players running around in that area, Dark Temple also lots of players in that area even with the instances there were sometimes I coudl just run through the Heroic Area with lots of ppl killing there I had no aggro.
How can people be waiting in queues and yet see nobody in the game? For some reason that just sounds fishy to me.
I know, it sounds ridiculous but it's true... 900+ queue last night.. finally get into game and 43 people on Coruscant...
It is the most heavily instanced game I've ever seen... If I'm on a server, on a planet, I like to think that every who is on that server is also on that planet... hate shard/instanced versions of the same zone... totally ruins any immersion.
Every time you run through a greenlit doorway, and it says "story area" that's an instance. It's cool that they did it so seamlessly, but it's still an instance.
Wholeheartedly agree. Somehow loading screens for me takes something away from the immersion. I for one am also glad SWTOR does instancing the right way rather than how other MMOs do them.
How can people be waiting in queues and yet see nobody in the game? For some reason that just sounds fishy to me.
I know, it sounds ridiculous but it's true... 900+ queue last night.. finally get into game and 43 people on Coruscant...
It is the most heavily instanced game I've ever seen... If I'm on a server, on a planet, I like to think that every who is on that server is also on that planet... hate shard/instanced versions of the same zone... totally ruins any immersion.
You're not actually thinking this is logical are you? That EVERYONE playing on your server SHOULD be in the same place as you are?!?!?! Really??? In a game that has multiple planet, you really think this?? Are you..... nope not even going to go there....
(DISCLAIMER - The use of the word YOU in the above post is not directed at any one person in particular, but towards those who fall into the category itself - there is no personal attack here, neither intentional nor implied.)
Comments
Most GB visitors know that GB are huge star trek nerds... haha. Not surprised by their review.
eqnext.wikia.com
People are ragging on this system because some of us actually enjoy seeing and interacting with other players in our "Massively Multiplayer" games. I'm on Anchorhad. It's a "full server" and had an 800+ (1 hour) queue to get in at prime time last night. When you do get in, you don't see hardly anyone. The world feels lifeless and dead enough, and then you don't really see many other players. The hubs and social areas such as cantinas are boring as well, because no one is around.
I understand some of you are perfectly fine having a massively singleplayer game, but many of us are not. I chose a high population server in the first place because I thought there would be more general action. Now I realize I should have just gone low population because the experience would have been exactly the same, but with no queue to get on.
A sure sign that you are in an old, dying paradigm/mindset, is when you are scared of new ideas and new technology. Don't feel bad. The world is moving on without you, and you are welcome to yell "Get Off My Lawn!" all you want while it happens. You cannot, however, stop an idea whose time has come.
I don't think sharding is in and of itself bad. However, I do think that it's just a band-aid to cover up much bigger problems.
The problems being all the issues that are caused by having "player-anchored" quests in a shared world. Or what others know as "traditional" questing. It essentially means that YOU the individual have to complete a quest and what goes on in the world does not contribute at all to your quest.
So YOU have to kill 10 flesh raiders. The problem is that 500 other players also have to kill 10 flesh raiders. Given that you all share the same world and there is a limited supply of flesh raiders, there is a problem. People will be waiting in line to kill flesh raiders. So this is why devs use sharding. They give a controlled group of players their own little "shard" to play around in so that there are enough flesh raider (or whatever) for everyone.
The PROBLEM with sharding when it is used like this is that it makes the game feel even more single player than the player anchored quests do. Now, not only do you personally have to kill the chief (even though he's been killed 2000 times already), but there are only two other people in a half a mile radius when you do it.
I wouldn't have an issue with sharding if it was used ONLY to control lag because that's basically a necessary limitation of technology. My problem with it is that it's used to "cover-up" the inherent flaw with player anchored quests.
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
There is no way to win this argument with these people on these forums. 95% of them believe that MMORPG really is just MMO and screw the RPG side. They have little to no desire to play anything that is heavily built around the story and the role playing aspects. If its not innovative on the mechanics, if they cann't feel like they are hangin in the club with 2000 people they are not going to like it, no matter how good anything else in it is. And no amount of logic involving anything else is going to sink in one little bit to them. SW:TOR was built as an mmoRPG, with heavy overtones towards the RPG side of the spectrum when it comes to that MMORPG combination. They dont like that, so they are all kinds of mad as a result. It really is just that simple, they want 95% MMO and 5% RPG in thier games - SW:TOR gave them 30% MMO and 70% RPG. For me thats perfect, for them its not acceptable.
(DISCLAIMER - The use of the word YOU in the above post is not directed at any one person in particular, but towards those who fall into the category itself - there is no personal attack here, neither intentional nor implied.)
I just botted my smite monk in GW PVE so i cant really comment on it.. but the PVP in GW was amazing.
rofl. A bunch of lemmings hoping on the fresh new MMO. Same shit different game lol
"I play Tera for the gameplay"
I also have always found similarities between SWTOR and GW1. It should've been a good thing for me, since I enjoy GW1 a lot. The funny thing is I find SWTOR to be a subpar game. At least GW1 never pretended to be something it's not (aka a MMORPG) in order to force you to pay a sub for it.
@Kreslin Actually that's not why people consider GW1 a PvP game. When it first came out Arenanet had in mind for it to be a PvP game, with PvP being the main end-game for Prophecies. There were only 2 Elite areas (well they added a third a few months later) in which you could enter based on whether your continent was winning in one of the PvP Arenas. As it turned out the game attracted a lot of people that prefered PvE, so the later games (Nightfall, Eye of the North) were entirely PvE focused.
You're also wrong about the storyline being everything there's to PvE. I have around 2500 hours spent in GW1, and like 85% of that time was spent playing PvE. And there's tons of things I've never done. After 3 stand-alone games and one expansion GW1 has loads of content. Just none of it is centered around leveling, gear grinding and no one points you in the direction of the "end-game", so you have to find the stuff you enjoy doing by yourself.
Well in terms of 'instanced' its less being that, and more of it being so damn linear it might as well be instanced. Everyones at different parts and theres very little in terms of traveling through areas you already have been to.
Anywho, not very suprised. If I get over my lightsaber fetish, I can quickly see the flaws and negative points of the game.
Basically a review of SW:TOR from people who really don't like MMORPGs.
90% in this "review" is compleet bullshit, the rest is uninformed "noobs" talking.
there is neutral gear, that you cant wear if you have to much dark or lightside points .. so you have a choise what to light/neutral/dark.
no part of the world is instanced, the entire game is basicly like Campions online. its a huge huge maps that have diferent zones that are all seamless connected but each zone can have a copy of itself in case its to bussy there. you mostly only see this in the capital world and starter zone/world.
well who cares anyway..more forum troll attemps..happens to every mmo..
its not empty at all, and try and the heroic quests if you think questing is to easy. also the 1st flash point was more fun then any pve ive done in wow(vancleef lol)
and i know no auto attack?!?! wtf i need to be doing more constructive things while i play my mmo like watching tv.. or making a sandwhich..
lol. Their "review" points didnt sound very articulate or experienced. Sounded like a bunch kids hopped up on Mountain Dew. "Can't wait for Blizzrads new MMo. It will save gaming" Really?
Every time you run through a greenlit doorway, and it says "story area" that's an instance. It's cool that they did it so seamlessly, but it's still an instance.
Interesting to see that there's neutral-requirement gear though. I haven't seen any, in 24 levels, it it only higher than that?
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
That is what everyone is wondering about. I am level 30 and i spent a lot of time on the planets doing quests and messing around.
I ~NEVER~ saw more than 5-6 people in an area, like a city or quest hub. The most i saw was on the Imperial fleet ship which kind of acts like a hub for flashpoints, gear, trainers and rewards. Even there the max i saw running around was at most 20.
There are usually at least 4 instances of every map available. This is NOT a MMO, it is a linear Mass effect type single player game with co-op features.
It is enjoyable the first time around, i do admit that. But even thinking about doing the hundreds of mind numbingly simple quests again on a new class just make me cry.
Lies. the developers even explain the instancing in this interview http://www.giantbomb.com/old-republic-new-interview/17-5441/ (around 7min in)
Please provide a screenshot of neutral gear if you may.
I have not seen one neutral gear yet. i am level 30. So pelase come back and post, "but it's only after your each 50", well we shall see about that, i doubt it and what good is it if its only at end game?
The whole world is instanced and there are at least 4 instances up at any time on ANY map plus all the green/red forcefield instances.
Funny how you call others uninformed noobs and trolls. I see only one troll here and that one can't even spell.
What utter rubbish.
You must be playing a different game from every other person.
"one or two others players?" LMFAO - Get real - there are hordes of players everywhere I have been.
So much lies and deceit and SWTOR it amazing. Where do these noobs come from?
Take the Magic: The Gathering 'What Color Are You?' Quiz.
That is true actually was doing the Revan lots of players running around in that area, Dark Temple also lots of players in that area even with the instances there were sometimes I coudl just run through the Heroic Area with lots of ppl killing there I had no aggro.
I know, it sounds ridiculous but it's true... 900+ queue last night.. finally get into game and 43 people on Coruscant...
It is the most heavily instanced game I've ever seen... If I'm on a server, on a planet, I like to think that every who is on that server is also on that planet... hate shard/instanced versions of the same zone... totally ruins any immersion.
Wholeheartedly agree. Somehow loading screens for me takes something away from the immersion. I for one am also glad SWTOR does instancing the right way rather than how other MMOs do them.
You're not actually thinking this is logical are you? That EVERYONE playing on your server SHOULD be in the same place as you are?!?!?! Really??? In a game that has multiple planet, you really think this?? Are you..... nope not even going to go there....
(DISCLAIMER - The use of the word YOU in the above post is not directed at any one person in particular, but towards those who fall into the category itself - there is no personal attack here, neither intentional nor implied.)