Content holes? Seriously? Most people are complaining about outlevelling content before they finish out the story.
As it sits, if ALL you do are the world and class stories, don't bother with any bonus missions/objectives, no space combat, no PvP, no group content, you MIGHT fall behind. I run the standard content and space mission dailies, some multiplayer stuff here and there, and I'm 2-3 levels ahead on each planet.
True dat.
I'm not jumping on the 'It's a single-player pretending to be an MMO' bandwagon, but I suffer much more from outlevelling content on my play-mainly-teamed characters than I did with my play-mainly-solo character.
It seems if you do any group content at all, you will quickly outlevel content - the game needs a big xp nerf in my opinion; it's like the direct opposite of where Champions Online was at launch, where you had to do every single quest and grind a good chunk too to hit the level cap.
It's a hard call. I think people should be able to get to max solo with minimal grinding, but I also think people should at very least NOT BE DISCOURAGED from grouping. Maybe remove the bonus XP for grouping and offer something else. Or allow "grouped up xp" to be spent some other way than standard XP. So you still get big benefits from PvP and group content, but you don't have to start Tatooine at 30th level...
But when there are already other bonuses like social points and other kinds of tokens...
I'm hoping the legacy system will have a 'turn off the xp' option - I never felt the need to use that option in City of Heroes, but I'm getting a bit fed up of leaving planets early in SWTOR just so the next one isn't worthless!
After playing through beta and for the first month now I have little doubt this game was built to be free to play. It is my personal opinion that they are running the sub fees as long as they can but the model was designed to be profitable as free to play and the sub fees are just gravy for as long as they last.
There's just too many content holes for the amount of time and money they put into it. When you look at the finished product it just doesn't add up. There is more, they designed more, and they're just waiting until they have to use it. I'm not talking about free updates to keep people paying subs (RIFT) or even paid expansions (WOW), I'm talking about a cash store the likes of which the industry has never seen. I think its there, I think its ready, I think all they need to do is flip the switch.
These posts just keep getting better and better by the day.........yes BW spent a quarter of a million dollars making a game so they can go F2P all they need to do is "flip the switch", oh what was that an alien just popped out of my butt !
Less is better??? I think it WAS going to originally be B2P …. Until a large segment of the prelaunch community (who may or may not still be playing) raged about how games can't do well if they start out F2P or B2P, and all F2p games suck ect ect. EA got all giddy about reading that and BW did what they were told. Just because you pay14.99 per month does not mean it's ba better game then a B2P or F2p, or that the community will not be full of people you don't like.
They shot down ideas left and right that could have made this game more awesome, these are now issues that people are bitching about. Hell even optional chat bubbles, UI customizability….sandbox like features, dynamic events like in Rift. They shot them all down for some odd reason like they were purposely trying to suck the fun out of the game(look what we ended up with, a diorama that talks). Those same folks who shot down every valid idea that graced the forums have all vanished like farts in the wind.
It cracks me up when people say, I'm having fun...they most likely are, until their buddy who stops having fun leaves and others follow, then it becomes a solo journey through a shell of a game and people start shouting for server merges. I’ve seen it happen with EQ2, Aion, SWG, CoV/CoH, DDO, LoTRO, WAR, STO and every game I've played since WoW. Oh sure there are always whose who say this game won't fail it's great and I love it, but for some reason the failure always follows. Anyone else recognize the fail pattern yet? I do, and TOR is not immune. Been like this for years now, why the denial?
Since the game release, we got flooded with countless topic/blog/post, on the doomsday train, OR the fp2 train.
game is not gonna go f2p soon, they might switch? sure they can, theyre gonna switch soon? never.
i think a LOT of ppl actually really want the game to go f2p so they can finally play it without flooding the internet with crap topic like this.
Game director stated many times that they know there is a huge amount of ppl out there that WANT a sub based game.
The server pop as decreased only on the few populated less servers.
The free month have passed and still my server is full of ppl playing and ejoying the game, my guild is still there everyone actually resubbed and plan to resub for months to come.
Stop making this thread showing how much u dislike the game, hiding behind a possibility that's not gonna happen for at least years(f2p).
I dont think this game was built with F2P in mind.
That being said, I think it ends up that way sometime in 2013. Once the majority of players hit 50 and realize just how much of a disaster endgame is they are gonna quit.
January 2012= 1 million+ subs
April 2012= 300k+ subs
September 2012= 150k+ subs and stable but not profitable enough now.
January 2012= Bioware announces SWTOR is now F2P with optional subscription.
However I think if SWTOR does in fact go F2P its going to be a hugely successful at it and by this time next year they will have fixed many of the design flaws and engine problems with the game. SWTOR has MASSIVE potential and will likely succeed in the end but its going to go through some bad first year growing pains.
Sorry OP, you are dead wrong. TOR isn't ever going free to play, they have a 10 year plan for story driven updates...the kind of updates that will bring back people that thought they left for good.
i gotta disagree with the op also. This game does lack content for those gamers that rushed thru everything or players that obviously have more time to spare then the average casual gamer. I know some players that hit 50 consider themselves casual but imo if you can spend more then 20 hours a week playing a game you're not casual with that being said I doubt we'll see this game going f2p anytime soon. I do see free trials in the near future once the game is polished and BW feels that it will be more appealing to old and new gamers.
On a seperate note i don't know why ppl want thiis game to go f2p. sure it might bring in more numbers but the community will suffer and if EA/BW get greed then instead of f2p it goes to pay to win like a bunch of other f2p game models. Oh well only time will tell if this game will be able to stand on its own 2 feet. I'm sure once this game is a success or a failure we'll see a bunch of "i told you so" posts
Wow, sounds just like the "analysts" we've been hearing from this week.
"I don't have any proof, but this is how I feel, and I'm sure I'm right."
Well, when you look at some of the cosmetic features, like matching chest color that was suddenly removed before end of beta without any notice!
I mean... it was working, people were extremely happy with it, no issues with it.... why suddenly remove it before release??
Unless ofcourse you want, down the road, launch a Cash Shop and start selling cosmetic gear and want people to pay for each piece, and force them to get the complete set to get a matching appearance.
In such case you don't want a feature, like Matching chest color, in the game, as it would hurt their Cash Shop sales.
It would be stupid to release a game in 2012 with such a huge budget and not think and prepare the possibility of going F2P. I'm sure they have it all thought out and prepared as the OP says, in case of need.
After playing through beta and for the first month now I have little doubt this game was built to be free to play. It is my personal opinion that they are running the sub fees as long as they can but the model was designed to be profitable as free to play and the sub fees are just gravy for as long as they last.
There's just too many content holes for the amount of time and money they put into it. When you look at the finished product it just doesn't add up. There is more, they designed more, and they're just waiting until they have to use it. I'm not talking about free updates to keep people paying subs (RIFT) or even paid expansions (WOW), I'm talking about a cash store the likes of which the industry has never seen. I think its there, I think its ready, I think all they need to do is flip the switch.
My feeling is that the game was planned to be B2P. Where you would buy the game initially, and than pay for additional content (planets,quests) as you go along.
But at some point EA decided to try and milk it just a bit more (with subs)
I think that at some point (probably a year from now) they will announce that the game will switch to this model.
But not before first payed expansion that will happen in summer (to coincide with GW2 release)
I could have sworn that i read something around the time this game was announced that led me to believe it was B2P.
F2P implies that there would not be an initial buy cost and I dont think it was ever designed to not have that. However this game feels very much designed to be B2P. For me anyway, I have spent the majority of my time soloing my class stories and space combat. Very rarely did I feel the urge to group, the group quests did not seem that interesting and the two or three flashpoints I did was kind of meh.
Another F2P thread? I guess we'll see sometime in the future. The only thing I've ever seen involving LucasArts that was free was the Clone Wars Adventures game and promo plastic toys with kiddie meals...that and a 'free' nap with every viewing of Episode 3.
I really think if they were cool with the notion of F2P for the adult market SWG would still be live and F2P, and the ca$h shop would be selling all those coveted items people used to have to buy the TCG to get their hands on.
No matter what the economic arguments for F2P increasing revenue are, you can be sure there'll be someone in a suit arguing about the perceived value of their IP dropping (like Episodes 1-3 didn't already do that...) and why that cannot be allowed.
I seriously doubt, even if BioWare/EA wanted to go that route, that Lucas would give it his blessing. I can see MTs on top of a sub, because I'm still looking out for the oft-quoted 'twist' in the pricing model, but F2P, nah.
Not that I care, they have my money now, and they'll keep getting it until I stop having fun, and after that I couldn't care less what their pricing model is because I'll have moved on.
I dont see EA spending 200+ million to produce a F2P.
No, but Subscription + Cash Shop no doubt about that!
I won't give it long before that bomb will be dropped onto the game, EA starting to show it's true colors (well... it already does with it's pispoor Customer Service and completely lack of GM's! ).
People were wondering why sertain cosmetic features were suddenly removed from the game before launch! It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out why.
It's a fun multiplayer roleplaying game. It's not an MMORPG, far from it, it's an instanced match-making game.
But it's only worth the initial fee imo. It does not have a compelling and rewarding end-game. It's too shallow and outdated and easily rushed through.
Until next time BioWare! ME3 and DA3. Hope EA didnt suck all of your soul and made you cater to everyone destroying your magic.
I dont see EA spending 200+ million to produce a F2P.
No, but Subscription + Cash Shop no doubt about that!
I won't give it long before that bomb will be dropped onto the game, EA starting to show it's true colors (well... it already does with it's pispoor Customer Service and completely lack of GM's! ).
People were wondering why sertain cosmetic features were suddenly removed from the game before launch! It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out why.
I think the game was designed as subscription, but they underestimated what is required to keep people playing and paying.
There is an awful lot of content in the game, but so much of it you can't see unless you make other characters and play both factions, which isn't very common for most MMO gamers in the first few months.
Not that I agree with the OP but I strongly disagree with this. After getting a taste of the game I can't see there beeing a lot of content you cant see unless you play another character. The leveling after the starting planet (of which there is only 2 per side) is very linear. And as you travel this linear path you see closed out doors or sections of a zone reserved for a specific class. So thats a cubby hole that is reserved for class story and that's it. All classes not only level the same path, but see the exact same quests aside from the class story. Since your answers have 0 affect on your gameplay, even that is an illusion of choice and variety.
I am not saying that this is any different than the way other games have done it, but let's not kid ourselves and say this game has an abundant amount of content that can only be experienced through months of gameplay thus telling us it had to be a sub design. I don't know what the intention was, I know that it should have been a B2P since it is really KOTOR3 with multiplayer functions. Customer service is a joke and so far it seems they need to spend a lot of time fixing bugs and exploits because the game probably wasn't ready for launch. I know it has done well on box sells, but that still doesn't take away the complaints I read and see for myself. If the game were B2P, then I would have no problem playing the game nor would I have a problem supporting them through purchasing content they add. As it stands now it isn't worth a sub, to me, and I find myself bored more often than not.
Er... you missed a few words there... and play both factions...
You only get half the content if you play one faction. Though it actually has more content than any other subscription MMO had at launch, looking back, more than Rift, WAR, AoC, WoW, EQ2.
It just doesn't feel like a lot because you blast through it in a few weeks.
After playing through beta and for the first month now I have little doubt this game was built to be free to play. It is my personal opinion that they are running the sub fees as long as they can but the model was designed to be profitable as free to play and the sub fees are just gravy for as long as they last.
There's just too many content holes for the amount of time and money they put into it. When you look at the finished product it just doesn't add up. There is more, they designed more, and they're just waiting until they have to use it. I'm not talking about free updates to keep people paying subs (RIFT) or even paid expansions (WOW), I'm talking about a cash store the likes of which the industry has never seen. I think its there, I think its ready, I think all they need to do is flip the switch.
Can you be more specific?
The way it looks to me is that Bioware has been a bit lazy and they came up with the wrong design, that's why the game sucks.
I am sure that RMT is plan B for Bioware, but so is for every MMO, but I don't think Swotor has been specifically designed for RTM (although they will end up there like every failed MMO)
Blizzard is not even thinking about RMT because the game is already profitable as it is.
Monthly subscription is thye more profitable way to make money from a MMO.
Only when a game fail to substain a decent amount of subscribers then it's forced to the Free to Play concept
After playing through beta and for the first month now I have little doubt this game was built to be free to play. It is my personal opinion that they are running the sub fees as long as they can but the model was designed to be profitable as free to play and the sub fees are just gravy for as long as they last. There's just too many content holes for the amount of time and money they put into it. When you look at the finished product it just doesn't add up. There is more, they designed more, and they're just waiting until they have to use it. I'm not talking about free updates to keep people paying subs (RIFT) or even paid expansions (WOW), I'm talking about a cash store the likes of which the industry has never seen. I think its there, I think its ready, I think all they need to do is flip the switch.
200 million budget and you claim it was f2p? jesus, your logic left you bro.
"I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"
After playing through beta and for the first month now I have little doubt this game was built to be free to play. It is my personal opinion that they are running the sub fees as long as they can but the model was designed to be profitable as free to play and the sub fees are just gravy for as long as they last.
There's just too many content holes for the amount of time and money they put into it. When you look at the finished product it just doesn't add up. There is more, they designed more, and they're just waiting until they have to use it. I'm not talking about free updates to keep people paying subs (RIFT) or even paid expansions (WOW), I'm talking about a cash store the likes of which the industry has never seen. I think its there, I think its ready, I think all they need to do is flip the switch.
200 million budget and you claim it was f2p? jesus, your logic left you bro.
why does the budget decide if a game is f2p or not? think logic never got to you, bro. here's a dollar. call spock.
Comments
I'm hoping the legacy system will have a 'turn off the xp' option - I never felt the need to use that option in City of Heroes, but I'm getting a bit fed up of leaving planets early in SWTOR just so the next one isn't worthless!
These posts just keep getting better and better by the day.........yes BW spent a quarter of a million dollars making a game so they can go F2P all they need to do is "flip the switch", oh what was that an alien just popped out of my butt !
Less is better??? I think it WAS going to originally be B2P …. Until a large segment of the prelaunch community (who may or may not still be playing) raged about how games can't do well if they start out F2P or B2P, and all F2p games suck ect ect. EA got all giddy about reading that and BW did what they were told. Just because you pay14.99 per month does not mean it's ba better game then a B2P or F2p, or that the community will not be full of people you don't like.
They shot down ideas left and right that could have made this game more awesome, these are now issues that people are bitching about. Hell even optional chat bubbles, UI customizability….sandbox like features, dynamic events like in Rift. They shot them all down for some odd reason like they were purposely trying to suck the fun out of the game(look what we ended up with, a diorama that talks). Those same folks who shot down every valid idea that graced the forums have all vanished like farts in the wind.
It cracks me up when people say, I'm having fun...they most likely are, until their buddy who stops having fun leaves and others follow, then it becomes a solo journey through a shell of a game and people start shouting for server merges. I’ve seen it happen with EQ2, Aion, SWG, CoV/CoH, DDO, LoTRO, WAR, STO and every game I've played since WoW. Oh sure there are always whose who say this game won't fail it's great and I love it, but for some reason the failure always follows. Anyone else recognize the fail pattern yet? I do, and TOR is not immune. Been like this for years now, why the denial?
well, another fp2 post.
Since the game release, we got flooded with countless topic/blog/post, on the doomsday train, OR the fp2 train.
game is not gonna go f2p soon, they might switch? sure they can, theyre gonna switch soon? never.
i think a LOT of ppl actually really want the game to go f2p so they can finally play it without flooding the internet with crap topic like this.
Game director stated many times that they know there is a huge amount of ppl out there that WANT a sub based game.
The server pop as decreased only on the few populated less servers.
The free month have passed and still my server is full of ppl playing and ejoying the game, my guild is still there everyone actually resubbed and plan to resub for months to come.
Stop making this thread showing how much u dislike the game, hiding behind a possibility that's not gonna happen for at least years(f2p).
I dont think this game was built with F2P in mind.
That being said, I think it ends up that way sometime in 2013. Once the majority of players hit 50 and realize just how much of a disaster endgame is they are gonna quit.
January 2012= 1 million+ subs
April 2012= 300k+ subs
September 2012= 150k+ subs and stable but not profitable enough now.
January 2012= Bioware announces SWTOR is now F2P with optional subscription.
However I think if SWTOR does in fact go F2P its going to be a hugely successful at it and by this time next year they will have fixed many of the design flaws and engine problems with the game. SWTOR has MASSIVE potential and will likely succeed in the end but its going to go through some bad first year growing pains.
Sorry OP, you are dead wrong. TOR isn't ever going free to play, they have a 10 year plan for story driven updates...the kind of updates that will bring back people that thought they left for good.
Agreed.
I don't play Swtor ,(I played beta) but I admit that.
Sorry OP but you're very mistaken.
Another drunk fan in the nose-bleed seats thinking their opinions somehow find their way into the coaches playbook?
i gotta disagree with the op also. This game does lack content for those gamers that rushed thru everything or players that obviously have more time to spare then the average casual gamer. I know some players that hit 50 consider themselves casual but imo if you can spend more then 20 hours a week playing a game you're not casual
with that being said I doubt we'll see this game going f2p anytime soon. I do see free trials in the near future once the game is polished and BW feels that it will be more appealing to old and new gamers.
On a seperate note i don't know why ppl want thiis game to go f2p. sure it might bring in more numbers but the community will suffer and if EA/BW get greed then instead of f2p it goes to pay to win like a bunch of other f2p game models. Oh well only time will tell if this game will be able to stand on its own 2 feet. I'm sure once this game is a success or a failure we'll see a bunch of "i told you so" posts
Well, when you look at some of the cosmetic features, like matching chest color that was suddenly removed before end of beta without any notice!
I mean... it was working, people were extremely happy with it, no issues with it.... why suddenly remove it before release??
Unless ofcourse you want, down the road, launch a Cash Shop and start selling cosmetic gear and want people to pay for each piece, and force them to get the complete set to get a matching appearance.
In such case you don't want a feature, like Matching chest color, in the game, as it would hurt their Cash Shop sales.
SWTOR will not go f2p...not in the forseeable future.
I predict that they'll introduce an item shop on top of the subscription instead. There are several items that I'd probably buy if it were offered...
It would be stupid to release a game in 2012 with such a huge budget and not think and prepare the possibility of going F2P. I'm sure they have it all thought out and prepared as the OP says, in case of need.
An honest review of SW:TOR 6/10 (Danny Wojcicki)
I could have sworn that i read something around the time this game was announced that led me to believe it was B2P.
F2P implies that there would not be an initial buy cost and I dont think it was ever designed to not have that. However this game feels very much designed to be B2P. For me anyway, I have spent the majority of my time soloing my class stories and space combat. Very rarely did I feel the urge to group, the group quests did not seem that interesting and the two or three flashpoints I did was kind of meh.
My gaming blog
Another F2P thread? I guess we'll see sometime in the future. The only thing I've ever seen involving LucasArts that was free was the Clone Wars Adventures game and promo plastic toys with kiddie meals...that and a 'free' nap with every viewing of Episode 3.
I really think if they were cool with the notion of F2P for the adult market SWG would still be live and F2P, and the ca$h shop would be selling all those coveted items people used to have to buy the TCG to get their hands on.
No matter what the economic arguments for F2P increasing revenue are, you can be sure there'll be someone in a suit arguing about the perceived value of their IP dropping (like Episodes 1-3 didn't already do that...) and why that cannot be allowed.
I seriously doubt, even if BioWare/EA wanted to go that route, that Lucas would give it his blessing. I can see MTs on top of a sub, because I'm still looking out for the oft-quoted 'twist' in the pricing model, but F2P, nah.
Not that I care, they have my money now, and they'll keep getting it until I stop having fun, and after that I couldn't care less what their pricing model is because I'll have moved on.
I dont see EA spending 200+ million to produce a F2P.
F2P money inst in the same ballpark as P2P money if you have alot of people willing to pay to play it.
No, but Subscription + Cash Shop no doubt about that!
I won't give it long before that bomb will be dropped onto the game, EA starting to show it's true colors (well... it already does with it's pispoor Customer Service and completely lack of GM's! ).
People were wondering why sertain cosmetic features were suddenly removed from the game before launch! It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out why.
It's a fun multiplayer roleplaying game. It's not an MMORPG, far from it, it's an instanced match-making game.
But it's only worth the initial fee imo. It does not have a compelling and rewarding end-game. It's too shallow and outdated and easily rushed through.
Until next time BioWare! ME3 and DA3. Hope EA didnt suck all of your soul and made you cater to everyone destroying your magic.
yeah absolutely, especially when the pop dips.
Er... you missed a few words there... and play both factions...
You only get half the content if you play one faction. Though it actually has more content than any other subscription MMO had at launch, looking back, more than Rift, WAR, AoC, WoW, EQ2.
It just doesn't feel like a lot because you blast through it in a few weeks.
Can you be more specific?
The way it looks to me is that Bioware has been a bit lazy and they came up with the wrong design, that's why the game sucks.
I am sure that RMT is plan B for Bioware, but so is for every MMO, but I don't think Swotor has been specifically designed for RTM (although they will end up there like every failed MMO)
Blizzard is not even thinking about RMT because the game is already profitable as it is.
Monthly subscription is thye more profitable way to make money from a MMO.
Only when a game fail to substain a decent amount of subscribers then it's forced to the Free to Play concept
I am 100% sure that the OP is the market 'analyst' that caused EA's stock to go down last week on thursday.
Please continue your analysis as it has made me a fair bit of money. /Sarcasm
Yes, EA stock went back up on Friday cause there were no factual numbers to justify the drop!
Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
given the amount of time it takes them to pop up a weenie little patch like 1.1.0b (6 hours), i think they should be paying me to play.
200 million budget and you claim it was f2p? jesus, your logic left you bro.
"I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"
why does the budget decide if a game is f2p or not? think logic never got to you, bro. here's a dollar. call spock.