I would disagree with getting credit for "open" WvWvW.. If I understand it correctly, you have to que up for it. Through that necessity alone, it makes it instanced, not open. You can't just go out and join, you have to wait in line.
DAoC is the only game that had true open, non-istanced WvWvW (RvRvR), and technically when they clustered servers (Before the merged to Ywain, or whatever the super cluster is called) 3 or 4 at a time, they did it first.
GW2 WvWvW might be persistant, which in and of itself is good, but it's not truly open. Although if I am wrong about the necessity to que up, than I apologize.
It is persistant and it is a welcome change from the old open world pvp with the griefers issue. no one likes to be ganked by an end level character picking on the lower levels just because it is open world pvp. Arenanet is all about taking new aproaches to solve old mmo problems so I like this one a lot i can pve and not worry about gankers griefers and i can go pvp when i want on my terms.
Yeah, I don't if I saw much innovation in any of the OP's suggestions, seems like I've most of them before and each of these titles took the previous idea and extended it out further or refined it to a higher degree. Not saying these are bad things to do, but can't really call them innovative.
Cross server DF'er, much as I don't like it, was innovative. GW's World vs World is pretty innovative, but didn't Shadowbane have something like cross server PVP back in the day? (can't remember now)
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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Well, they're saying that they want to keep the game playable and that's why they are putting caps on the WvW zone populations. It is quite logical that these caps are per-faction because otherwise the system could be abused quite badly (say a midnight raid which fills up the player cap and thus prevents the opponents from joining in)
At the moment the cap is 500 players PER ZONE. There are 4 WvW zones which gives you 2000 players in WvW or 666 per side total (heh). The devs said that these numbers are temporary and that they'll very probably raise them as the game is optimized and they see how the game behaves in RL (hence the upcoming stress test beta). These are quite decent numbers and a far cry from "100 per side, so 300 people at most".
Actually I'm not sure if this 500/zone number translates directly into 500/3factions = 166 players/faction/zone. It is quite possible that this per faction cap is a bit softer so it could be 200players/faction/zone or even more. The solid info is "500 players/zone. Each zone has its separate cap and each facion has a cap as well." We'll see.
Imo the smart detail is that that each of the 4 zones has a separate population cap. Considering that players tend to flock towards the largest fight, this actually forces the population to spread around more and thus accomodate more players overall. If they had a single pop cap for all 4 zones, all players would eventually end up in one of the zones and thus crash the server.
Imo they could have said "no caps" at all and very probably they'd really like that, but when faced with very real possibilities of server meltdowns, especially at launch, imo they made a right choice.
And this is all very logical and sensible that they would do this for hardware reasons. Of that, we are in complete agreement.
It must be because the DAoC population never met the critcal mass that they never needed to force some kind queue to get into an RvR area. And you are right that they probably could have said "no caps" and possibly had gotten away with it - But they must be, in hurbris or no, anticipating that they will reach those thresholds that it will be required.
Although I do wonder - Do you get to chose what WvWvW zone you go to? Or do they fill them up in turn, or distribute them round robin per faction? If they control where you go, top to bottom (hardware concerns aside), then it's little more than persistant battle grounds. But if I can chose where I want to go until that threshold is met, then it's not that big a deal.
Still, I'd argue that DAoC did this first, even if GW2 implementation ends up being very similar.
3. DF: Aiming ( I am sure they are not the first) I liked that they made it more like a FPS in a sense that you had to click on the target you were attacking. (I probably would not like this with most other games but I did like this when I played Darkfall)
I too may be wrong in this but, I would have to say the first game to utilize Aim mechanic you speak of was SWG CU (as in SWG was better before the CU). The Combat Upgrade introduced two major changes to the game mechanics of SWG. First was replacing Tab Targeting (RPG) with Aim Targeting (FPS). Second was removal of Built In Bot Leveling. Every time you see a post about the CU NGE suck, these two changes are what they are complaining about. The NGE reduced the number of Combat Classes, to the same as found in SWTOR.
Pardon any spelling errors
Konfess your cyns and some maybe forgiven Boy: Why can't I talk to Him? Mom: We don't talk to Priests. As if it could exist, without being payed for. F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing. Even telemarketers wouldn't think that. It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
For all the criticism thrown at Cryptic and Bioware, some of it justified, I really hope their games succeed, if for no other reason than I dearly want to see more voiced content, more story content, more player character story choices, and more options for building player-created content in future MMOs. I applaud Bioware and Cryptic for their efforts on these fronts.
While Rift and WoW have a lot of polish and great features, they both bored me senseless by their lack of real STORY content or sense of character progression beyond ("ding!") going up another level.
Also, as a general rule, I VASTLY prefer the design(s) of low-level armors in these games. Appearance options, such as those afforded by LotRO, are greatly appreciated. Higher-level armors in virtually all of these games grow progressively more ridiculous and hideous, to say nothing of being impractical for combat. (Some of us actually try to RP in MMO*RP*Gs, ya know....)
I would disagree with getting credit for "open" WvWvW.. If I understand it correctly, you have to que up for it. Through that necessity alone, it makes it instanced, not open. You can't just go out and join, you have to wait in line.
DAoC is the only game that had true open, non-istanced WvWvW (RvRvR), and technically when they clustered servers (Before the merged to Ywain, or whatever the super cluster is called) 3 or 4 at a time, they did it first.
GW2 WvWvW might be persistant, which in and of itself is good, but it's not truly open. Although if I am wrong about the necessity to que up, than I apologize.
Well, they're saying that they want to keep the game playable and that's why they are putting caps on the WvW zone populations. It is quite logical that these caps are per-faction because otherwise the system could be abused quite badly (say a midnight raid which fills up the player cap and thus prevents the opponents from joining in)
At the moment the cap is 500 players PER ZONE. There are 4 WvW zones which gives you 2000 players in WvW or 666 per side total (heh). The devs said that these numbers are temporary and that they'll very probably raise them as the game is optimized and they see how the game behaves in RL (hence the upcoming stress test beta). These are quite decent numbers and a far cry from "100 per side, so 300 people at most".
Actually I'm not sure if this 500/zone number translates directly into 500/3factions = 166 players/faction/zone. It is quite possible that this per faction cap is a bit softer so it could be 200players/faction/zone or even more. The solid info is "500 players/zone. Each zone has its separate cap and each facion has a cap as well." We'll see.
Imo the smart detail is that that each of the 4 zones has a separate population cap. Considering that players tend to flock towards the largest fight, this actually forces the population to spread around more and thus accomodate more players overall. If they had a single pop cap for all 4 zones, all players would eventually end up in one of the zones and thus crash the server.
Imo they could have said "no caps" at all and very probably they'd really like that, but when faced with very real possibilities of server meltdowns, especially at launch, imo they made a right choice.
And this is all very logical and sensible that they would do this for hardware reasons. Of that, we are in complete agreement.
It must be because the DAoC population never met the critcal mass that they never needed to force some kind queue to get into an RvR area. And you are right that they probably could have said "no caps" and possibly had gotten away with it - But they must be, in hurbris or no, anticipating that they will reach those thresholds that it will be required.
Although I do wonder - Do you get to chose what WvWvW zone you go to? Or do they fill them up in turn, or distribute them round robin per faction? If they control where you go, top to bottom (hardware concerns aside), then it's little more than persistant battle grounds. But if I can chose where I want to go until that threshold is met, then it's not that big a deal.
Still, I'd argue that DAoC did this first, even if GW2 implementation ends up being very similar.
Yeah, ofc DAoC did it first and kudos to them, in fact ANet keeps citing DAoC as their #1 inspiration for WvW...
As for the question, there are 4 zones in WvW of similar size. There is a central one and 3 "home" zones, one for each server. You can enter any zone from any other one. The central neutral zone contains a massive keep which gives most points to your realm while the "home" zone keeps hold orbs of power which can be stolen and taken to your own keep for bonuses (and probably extra points). So, imo the plan is that if and when the central zone fills up you can still go raiding other server's keeps... or you can do it anytime if you see that the defenders are busy elsewhere. And besides there are lesser objectives such as camps, towers etc strewn about all four zones. We'll see how it turns out in the end but imo they really did think this whole strategic meta wargame through...
Some of these aren't even innovative, much less "truely" innovative features.
#5 - While innovative in a sense of scale SW:TOR has done it, it's been done in other MMOs to certain extents, mainly AoC and EQ2.
#4 - Not innovative at all. This was done in City of Heroes and Champions Online. Most F2P games and many P2P games also have a costume or appearance tab.
#3 - This is a feature of many sandbox games. Some even go as far to let you design your own dungeons / campaigns. Second Life even lets you make entire alterations to areas of the world through scripting language.
#2 - Could be innovative in a sense, but LFG tools have been around since the EQ days. I don't remember if you could look for a raid with the EQ tool or not.
#1 - A feature of many PvP oriented sandbox games and DAoC.
I think we should at least give the innovators credit where it's due.
For me it would be the following ( I do not know what games originally came up with the ideas... but the game I list would be the 1 I played first with it)
1. EQ: AA's- The ability to still improve your characters stats, abilities, and skills, even after reaching maximum level. This for me was the greatest thing ever. Today, I get so bored with games because I get max level, top end gear and then its onto an alt or onto the next game.
2. WoW: Warzones. I really enjoyed the additions of warzones for Pvp... the only downside was the addition of pvp gear. I always wished they would have done similar to EQ AA's and made PvP warzone an xp bar to buy additional stats (meaning a well rounded player in PvE and PvP would ultimately have a better character)
3. DF: Aiming ( I am sure they are not the first) I liked that they made it more like a FPS in a sense that you had to click on the target you were attacking. (I probably would not like this with most other games but I did like this when I played Darkfall)
4. MO: Skill Caps (Not the first) I liked for this type of PvP sandbox game that the skills you could have had a cap. This prevented you from learning every weapon skill, every spell skill.
5. Dungeons: I hate and love the idea of dungeons or instances. It is good when the game is overcrowded and the are not enough raid targets to share... unfortunately I feel this also ruined games for me as it was done wrong. ( I personally hate games that you get gear easily and simple quests for xp and gear in general) I would say this feature is the only thing that really kept me able to play these themepark MMO's because it kept me grouping opposed to solo questing.
city of heroes and guild wars beat wow to instanced PVP
or if your on about Wintergrasp or whatever - thats just DAOC very very very lite.
Every quest might not be voiced out but I really like the way it is for DCUO instead of what I have heard about SWtOR. I enjoy most of what you listen to there can be done while on the move. You do have to go back at times to places but so often you are just wandering around. End game I have not experienced as I just take my time and have fun but I really like it.
Wow, pretty much only one thing on this list is a real innovation. [Mod Edit]
Innovations generally refer to new ideas, no?
First, voice acting. Simply taking an old idea that other MMOs have done (voice acting) and doing MORE of it, is not an innovation. It just means Bioware had a bigger budget. It's not a new idea, it's just a natural progression of tech.
Second, no armor snobbery... ever heard of City of Heroes? Same exact thing.
The Foundry, a true innovation, though other MMOs had the seeds of it. None to the extent of the Foundry though. Well...except for City of Heroes, though I'm not sure which did the feature first.
Instant raiding in Rift. This one is arguable. In older MMOs like DAoC you could drop into raids without needing to be invited or being a specific class. You'd get put into a group and have a random shot at the loot, just like it works in Rift. The only difference is there were no game mechanics that enforced this, it was just the way the game worked. Raids were open to everyone and everyone had an equal shot at the loot because there was no gear progression bs.
And finally.. WvW... seriously? How much is Bioware and Arenanet paying you guys? No, even Arenanet say this idea was lifted directly from Dark Age of Camelot, someone at MMORPG just must have fallen asleep at the wheel. It's not even open world either, it has a cap on how many people can join. And can we please stop calling it world vs world? It's RvR.
Oh come on, quest voice overs have been in the genre for years! Absolute nothing innovative about that feature except that SWTOR went a bit overboard on it
As to foundaries, old UO did it one better they had player reps that ran live events. And STO is flat out a bad MMO.
As to the other so called innovations, I don't see anyone that is something I would play a game for.
You don't queue ever in GW2, if a server/instance is full it creates a new mirror of the instance for you to experience until the original has space for you. Though even so, the first WvW wasn't GW2, GW2 has tonnes of new innovations, but they hit one that really isn't original.
You don't queue ever in GW2, if a server/instance is full it creates a new mirror of the instance for you to experience until the original has space for you. Though even so, the first WvW wasn't GW2, GW2 has tonnes of new innovations, but they hit one that really isn't original.
...How does that work in an RvR scenario, running around in a mirror world with mirror keeps? So you could just get a bunch of people to fill everything up then take out all the keeps in your mirror world without anyone there? No. I doubt they do that.
#5: Story = Not my story. The story in SWTOR became so long-winded and boring that I had to resort to creating an elaborate leveling macro because I couldn't take it anymore. There is nothing innovative about sitting through 5 minutes of speech just to collect bantha paws.
#1. Guild Wars' WvW does seem like a cool idea. However, it's ultimately still scripted pvp. In MMO games, I yearn for unpredictability. We need an elaborate World PvP setting with meaning and proper sanctions.
#2. SWG's deep crafting and resource gathering. Lol..."deep"...try Eve Online's system. Stomps SWG's into the dirt.
#3. WAR's deep achievement journal and public raiding.
#4. EQ2's "Aesthetic Slot" system. This let players have two slots of equipement: one for stats and the other for how your character will look to others. I'm not sure if EQ2 developed this idea, but it's a must in every MMO. That feature is so old it's not even worth mentioning.
#6. STO's ability to create your very own race via Character Customization.
#7. CoH's extremely deep Character Customization system.
#8. SWG's player cities and world housing. Eve Online's sovereignty system in Nullsec and POS's wherever you want them beat this.
#9. SWG's "social classes", e.g.., entertainer, musician, dancer, image designer, politician, merchant. I've met players who have played for years and have never fired a shot.
#10. WoW's flying mounts. I'm not sure if they are first to do this, but the feature is fantastic. Definitely not the first at this. Flyff had flying "mounts" (i.e. hoverboards and brooms) long before WoW did.
#1. Guild Wars' WvW does seem like a cool idea. However, it's ultimately still scripted pvp. In MMO games, I yearn for unpredictability. We need an elaborate World PvP setting with meaning and proper sanctions. That and DAoC did this bigger and better already. With 1/20th of the budget.
#2. SWG's deep crafting and resource gathering. Lol..."deep"...try Eve Online's system. Stomps SWG's into the dirt
#3. WAR's deep achievement journal and public raiding. The journal, kind of. LotRO's and CoH had similar systems, though perhaps not as robust. But public raiding is as old as the MMO genre.
#4. EQ2's "Aesthetic Slot" system. This let players have two slots of equipement: one for stats and the other for how your character will look to others. I'm not sure if EQ2 developed this idea, but it's a must in every MMO. That feature is so old it's not even worth mentioning.
#5. EQ2's huge variety of playable races. DAoC has, what, 32 races? 40? But as we established with the voice acting, more of a pre existing thing is not an innovation.
#6. STO's ability to create your very own race via Character Customization.
#7. CoH's extremely deep Character Customization system
#8. SWG's player cities and world housing. Eve Online's sovereignty system in Nullsec and POS's wherever you want them beat this. Also Ultima Online had this, though SWG built on it. Both systems were kind of broken in the fact that soon there was urban creep and overpopulation.
#9. SWG's "social classes", e.g.., entertainer, musician, dancer, image designer, politician, merchant. I've met players who have played for years and have never fired a shot.
#10. WoW's flying mounts. I'm not sure if they are first to do this, but the feature is fantastic. Definitely not the first at this. Flyff had flying "mounts" (i.e. hoverboards and brooms) long before WoW did. As did CoH
I attacked the other list, must as well attack this one too. In Green.
TSW--and I'm a fan of this game, can't wait to try it--is essentially implementing an appearance tab from day 1. This "innovation" is no doubt just for their cash shop. We might just be the game where the best player in the game, unwilling to pay real money, is walking around in what looks like a bathrobe.
I'm truly shocked TERA isn't on this list for its combat.
Better than #4, I'd've even liked to have seen FFXIV (Yes, the one that flopped) on the list for making a 180 and really really trying to revamp the game in its entirety. Most developers would have either A) made it f2p with a cash shop or shut it down.
Spec'ing properly is a gateway drug. 12 Million People have been meter spammed in heroics.
You don't queue ever in GW2, if a server/instance is full it creates a new mirror of the instance for you to experience until the original has space for you. Though even so, the first WvW wasn't GW2, GW2 has tonnes of new innovations, but they hit one that really isn't original.
...How does that work in an RvR scenario, running around in a mirror world with mirror keeps? So you could just get a bunch of people to fill everything up then take out all the keeps in your mirror world without anyone there? No. I doubt they do that.
WvW you do queue other than that you won't have to see a queue screen in GW 2.
Umm any way, why was this list created, innovative is subjective I'm guessing, I mean hell it doesn't mean something that is "new" but more so improved and works better in a sense.
Funny enough going by this you miswell say GW 2 as a whole game is innovative not individual features because people will argue and say such in such had this feature first. Well I'd like to challenge someone...
Name me one MMO that has done all of what GW 2 has in one game, thanks.
I still don't get the list purpose since people will only argue about it being new rather than upgraded to get a much better result lol.
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You don't queue ever in GW2, if a server/instance is full it creates a new mirror of the instance for you to experience until the original has space for you. Though even so, the first WvW wasn't GW2, GW2 has tonnes of new innovations, but they hit one that really isn't original.
...How does that work in an RvR scenario, running around in a mirror world with mirror keeps? So you could just get a bunch of people to fill everything up then take out all the keeps in your mirror world without anyone there? No. I doubt they do that.
WvW you do queue other than that you won't have to see a queue screen in GW 2.
Umm any way, why was this list created, innovative is subjective I'm guessing, I mean hell it doesn't mean something that is "new" but more so improved and works better in a sense.
Funny enough going by this you miswell say GW 2 as a whole game is innovative not individual features because people will argue and say such in such had this feature first. Well I'd like to challenge someone...
Name me one MMO that has done all of what GW 2 has in one game,
That's the same argument that people used to try to use to argue that WoW was innovative. Which it isn't.
That kind of logic holds no water.
Obviously there's no MMO that is identical to GW2. As for its individual features, there are many games that did very similar things, but even more extensive than GW2, in one game. Like Dark Age of Camelot.
I didn't think SWTOR's fully-voiced over system was innovative as much as annoying. Before the first week was out, I was already spacing through to get to the quest objectives.
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Yeah, I don't if I saw much innovation in any of the OP's suggestions, seems like I've most of them before and each of these titles took the previous idea and extended it out further or refined it to a higher degree. Not saying these are bad things to do, but can't really call them innovative.
Cross server DF'er, much as I don't like it, was innovative. GW's World vs World is pretty innovative, but didn't Shadowbane have something like cross server PVP back in the day? (can't remember now)
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
And this is all very logical and sensible that they would do this for hardware reasons. Of that, we are in complete agreement.
It must be because the DAoC population never met the critcal mass that they never needed to force some kind queue to get into an RvR area. And you are right that they probably could have said "no caps" and possibly had gotten away with it - But they must be, in hurbris or no, anticipating that they will reach those thresholds that it will be required.
Although I do wonder - Do you get to chose what WvWvW zone you go to? Or do they fill them up in turn, or distribute them round robin per faction? If they control where you go, top to bottom (hardware concerns aside), then it's little more than persistant battle grounds. But if I can chose where I want to go until that threshold is met, then it's not that big a deal.
Still, I'd argue that DAoC did this first, even if GW2 implementation ends up being very similar.
I too may be wrong in this but, I would have to say the first game to utilize Aim mechanic you speak of was SWG CU (as in SWG was better before the CU). The Combat Upgrade introduced two major changes to the game mechanics of SWG. First was replacing Tab Targeting (RPG) with Aim Targeting (FPS). Second was removal of Built In Bot Leveling. Every time you see a post about the CU NGE suck, these two changes are what they are complaining about. The NGE reduced the number of Combat Classes, to the same as found in SWTOR.
Boy: Why can't I talk to Him?
Mom: We don't talk to Priests.
As if it could exist, without being payed for.
F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing.
Even telemarketers wouldn't think that.
It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
For all the criticism thrown at Cryptic and Bioware, some of it justified, I really hope their games succeed, if for no other reason than I dearly want to see more voiced content, more story content, more player character story choices, and more options for building player-created content in future MMOs. I applaud Bioware and Cryptic for their efforts on these fronts.
While Rift and WoW have a lot of polish and great features, they both bored me senseless by their lack of real STORY content or sense of character progression beyond ("ding!") going up another level.
Also, as a general rule, I VASTLY prefer the design(s) of low-level armors in these games. Appearance options, such as those afforded by LotRO, are greatly appreciated. Higher-level armors in virtually all of these games grow progressively more ridiculous and hideous, to say nothing of being impractical for combat. (Some of us actually try to RP in MMO*RP*Gs, ya know....)
you forget planetside
well...
1 GW2 WvW while looking good is not inovative, its a scaled back DAOC or planetside imo
2 takes it stage further, but its not that different to open warbands in WAR
4 TSW clothing - again done before COH/COV
5 voice - done before age of conan
im not sure on the forge thing in STO though that may be new.
Yeah, ofc DAoC did it first and kudos to them, in fact ANet keeps citing DAoC as their #1 inspiration for WvW...
As for the question, there are 4 zones in WvW of similar size. There is a central one and 3 "home" zones, one for each server. You can enter any zone from any other one. The central neutral zone contains a massive keep which gives most points to your realm while the "home" zone keeps hold orbs of power which can be stolen and taken to your own keep for bonuses (and probably extra points). So, imo the plan is that if and when the central zone fills up you can still go raiding other server's keeps... or you can do it anytime if you see that the defenders are busy elsewhere. And besides there are lesser objectives such as camps, towers etc strewn about all four zones. We'll see how it turns out in the end but imo they really did think this whole strategic meta wargame through...
Here's the WvW map from the last press beta. http://huntersinsight.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/wvworldmap.jpg Note that all three home zones are the same here but according to ANet, these are just placeholders and they'll be different maps come release.
Some of these aren't even innovative, much less "truely" innovative features.
#5 - While innovative in a sense of scale SW:TOR has done it, it's been done in other MMOs to certain extents, mainly AoC and EQ2.
#4 - Not innovative at all. This was done in City of Heroes and Champions Online. Most F2P games and many P2P games also have a costume or appearance tab.
#3 - This is a feature of many sandbox games. Some even go as far to let you design your own dungeons / campaigns. Second Life even lets you make entire alterations to areas of the world through scripting language.
#2 - Could be innovative in a sense, but LFG tools have been around since the EQ days. I don't remember if you could look for a raid with the EQ tool or not.
#1 - A feature of many PvP oriented sandbox games and DAoC.
I think we should at least give the innovators credit where it's due.
city of heroes and guild wars beat wow to instanced PVP
or if your on about Wintergrasp or whatever - thats just DAOC very very very lite.
Every quest might not be voiced out but I really like the way it is for DCUO instead of what I have heard about SWtOR. I enjoy most of what you listen to there can be done while on the move. You do have to go back at times to places but so often you are just wandering around. End game I have not experienced as I just take my time and have fun but I really like it.
Wow, pretty much only one thing on this list is a real innovation. [Mod Edit]
Innovations generally refer to new ideas, no?
First, voice acting. Simply taking an old idea that other MMOs have done (voice acting) and doing MORE of it, is not an innovation. It just means Bioware had a bigger budget. It's not a new idea, it's just a natural progression of tech.
Second, no armor snobbery... ever heard of City of Heroes? Same exact thing.
The Foundry, a true innovation, though other MMOs had the seeds of it. None to the extent of the Foundry though. Well...except for City of Heroes, though I'm not sure which did the feature first.
Instant raiding in Rift. This one is arguable. In older MMOs like DAoC you could drop into raids without needing to be invited or being a specific class. You'd get put into a group and have a random shot at the loot, just like it works in Rift. The only difference is there were no game mechanics that enforced this, it was just the way the game worked. Raids were open to everyone and everyone had an equal shot at the loot because there was no gear progression bs.
And finally.. WvW... seriously? How much is Bioware and Arenanet paying you guys? No, even Arenanet say this idea was lifted directly from Dark Age of Camelot, someone at MMORPG just must have fallen asleep at the wheel. It's not even open world either, it has a cap on how many people can join. And can we please stop calling it world vs world? It's RvR.
Oh come on, quest voice overs have been in the genre for years! Absolute nothing innovative about that feature except that SWTOR went a bit overboard on it
As to foundaries, old UO did it one better they had player reps that ran live events. And STO is flat out a bad MMO.
As to the other so called innovations, I don't see anyone that is something I would play a game for.
You don't queue ever in GW2, if a server/instance is full it creates a new mirror of the instance for you to experience until the original has space for you. Though even so, the first WvW wasn't GW2, GW2 has tonnes of new innovations, but they hit one that really isn't original.
...How does that work in an RvR scenario, running around in a mirror world with mirror keeps? So you could just get a bunch of people to fill everything up then take out all the keeps in your mirror world without anyone there? No. I doubt they do that.
Suzie Ford gives the #1 spot to GW2, wow, total suprise there...
It's almost like they fire all their unbiased employees..oh wait, that's what they do :P
Where's the any key?
I attacked the other list, must as well attack this one too. In Green.
TSW--and I'm a fan of this game, can't wait to try it--is essentially implementing an appearance tab from day 1. This "innovation" is no doubt just for their cash shop. We might just be the game where the best player in the game, unwilling to pay real money, is walking around in what looks like a bathrobe.
I'm truly shocked TERA isn't on this list for its combat.
Better than #4, I'd've even liked to have seen FFXIV (Yes, the one that flopped) on the list for making a 180 and really really trying to revamp the game in its entirety. Most developers would have either A) made it f2p with a cash shop or
shut it down.
Spec'ing properly is a gateway drug.
12 Million People have been meter spammed in heroics.
WvW you do queue other than that you won't have to see a queue screen in GW 2.
Umm any way, why was this list created, innovative is subjective I'm guessing, I mean hell it doesn't mean something that is "new" but more so improved and works better in a sense.
Funny enough going by this you miswell say GW 2 as a whole game is innovative not individual features because people will argue and say such in such had this feature first. Well I'd like to challenge someone...
Name me one MMO that has done all of what GW 2 has in one game, thanks.
I still don't get the list purpose since people will only argue about it being new rather than upgraded to get a much better result lol.
I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.
I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.
P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)
Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.
That's the same argument that people used to try to use to argue that WoW was innovative. Which it isn't.
That kind of logic holds no water.
Obviously there's no MMO that is identical to GW2. As for its individual features, there are many games that did very similar things, but even more extensive than GW2, in one game. Like Dark Age of Camelot.
Just came to say that City of heroes Launched their Mission Architech in april 2009 about 10 months before Star trek Online's launch
I didn't think SWTOR's fully-voiced over system was innovative as much as annoying. Before the first week was out, I was already spacing through to get to the quest objectives.
Stay on topic please.