Not sure what you're arguing here. A lot of games release information before the release. What we're talking about is the method of deployment, how Arena.Net has chosen to spread the world of Guild Wars 2, how they are hitting a target audience, and how they are doing it differently than other games.
Not sure what you're arguing here. A lot of games release information before the release. What we're talking about is the method of deployment, how Arena.Net has chosen to spread the world of Guild Wars 2, how they are hitting a target audience, and how they are doing it differently than other games.
That was more or less a side debate in response to something said. AS to your OT ..sure.. They've passed on traditional marketing for what is essentially viral marketing. They've handed the marketing raines over to their fans, Fiontar said it pretty well a few times earlier. As he pointed out the problems that could case quite perfectly.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
You know what's also different from all those games and GW2? They're out, and we can now look back at the actual games themselves and see what they did wrong. We can't do that with GW2. Yet.
It's easy to sit back and say that enough information about Warhammer and Swtor (I never played FF, but when the boss apologizes for releasing a bad game, I guess enough's said) wasn't released, but it was. We had gameplay videos all over the place. But you can't really get a feel for the thing until you play it.
It's not really fair to compare the marketing departments of these games while using the state of those games to prove your point. Here's the thing. Marketing sold me on games like Warhammer and Auto Assault. Marketing has sold you on GW2. Because that's all it is. Good marketing. And it's JUST hype and marketing until the game hits the shelves.
Look, I had this same conversation with AmazingAvery when he knew that Age of Conan would be the best game ever. I get it. And I'll never convince you that you're affected by anything other than just what has to be the most awesome game ever. That's fine too. Just realize that it's all the same sales machine, and this one has your soul. Just like A Secret World has mine.
That's going to be the best game ever. I saw videos.
You might want to talk to someone who has played the game for more than a tiny bit at a con before giving it your soul... just sayin. All you have to do is look at the state of the game RIGHT NOW, compare GW2 with TSW. TSW is in no way ready to be release in June... three game companies combined couldn't make it so. *shakes head, sighs and moves on*
how do you know what state TSW is in? they haven't exactly releasd a slew of videos. you've been saying you played the beta, but that was months ago.
you aren't following your game of choice very well... its in beta right now. You can see that right now at the TSW forums.
i must not bother to visit the forums, cause im so interested in it. i just hate how people slander games, for no good reason.
so you ignore the useful information because you just can't take ppl not liking it >.< I would think you WANT the poor reviews so you know what to be careful of...
You know what's also different from all those games and GW2? They're out, and we can now look back at the actual games themselves and see what they did wrong. We can't do that with GW2. Yet.
It's easy to sit back and say that enough information about Warhammer and Swtor (I never played FF, but when the boss apologizes for releasing a bad game, I guess enough's said) wasn't released, but it was. We had gameplay videos all over the place. But you can't really get a feel for the thing until you play it.
It's not really fair to compare the marketing departments of these games while using the state of those games to prove your point. Here's the thing. Marketing sold me on games like Warhammer and Auto Assault. Marketing has sold you on GW2. Because that's all it is. Good marketing. And it's JUST hype and marketing until the game hits the shelves.
Look, I had this same conversation with AmazingAvery when he knew that Age of Conan would be the best game ever. I get it. And I'll never convince you that you're affected by anything other than just what has to be the most awesome game ever. That's fine too. Just realize that it's all the same sales machine, and this one has your soul. Just like A Secret World has mine.
That's going to be the best game ever. I saw videos.
You might want to talk to someone who has played the game for more than a tiny bit at a con before giving it your soul... just sayin. All you have to do is look at the state of the game RIGHT NOW, compare GW2 with TSW. TSW is in no way ready to be release in June... three game companies combined couldn't make it so. *shakes head, sighs and moves on*
how do you know what state TSW is in? they haven't exactly releasd a slew of videos. you've been saying you played the beta, but that was months ago.
you aren't following your game of choice very well... its in beta right now. You can see that right now at the TSW forums.
i must not bother to visit the forums, cause im so interested in it. i just hate how people slander games, for no good reason.
so you ignore the useful information because you just can't take ppl not liking it >.< I would think you WANT the poor reviews so you know what to be careful of...
i like to form my own opinion rather than soak up all the generalizations and speculation on forums.
I've said as much myself. Except, I want to say that NCSoft's willinglness not to rush this title is the reason they are able to market it so well. It's barely marketing. This game was probably finished overall a year ago. Around the time the marketing picked up. But instead of rushing it out, they gave people what they wanted, what they knew other game designers won't do. They told them that there was new functionarlity and showed that functionality at work. Visual evidence is what sold me. SWTOR was a big disappointment. Things began to disappear well before it was launched. By the time beta was launched the PR had changed.
So arenanet's appraoch to, this is what we got feels good. There need to have it all perfect works for me. I'd rather not have a release date for another year than hav them givre one because they feel they need to.
As a journalist, I can pick up on when previews are of a bad game. The wording is different. Like I can tell right now that Secret world did not impress a great impression. Guild wars feels as if there is ginuine love for this game and this is from a variety of different journalists. This is big. I like to think we are fairly unbiased. WE get paid not to be on the hype train.
so you ignore the useful information because you just can't take ppl not liking it >.< I would think you WANT the poor reviews so you know what to be careful of...
i like to form my own opinion rather than soak up all the generalizations and speculation on forums.
so what are you doing here? If you don't want to hear what others have to say go figure out another way to delelope your opinion.
I hate to break it to you OP, but I think SWTOR did pretty much exactly the same in its roll out: short closed beta weekends, press event, prelaunch + a late NDA drop, etc.
Also SWTOR showed a considerable amount of gameplay from press before preordering started and people were convinced that they made a very informed decision (I for one) when in fact it wasn't. We all know there is much more to these games than a few hours or even days of starter experience can cover.
Making betas and press events short (i.e. beta "weekends") and restricting them to a certain level range or area very much limits most of what we've seen to "first impressions". It's very much controlled and orchestrated and despite us catching a glimpse of pretty much every aspect, there's still plenty of questionmarks.
SWTOR didn't have long term testers speaking out until pretty late, and most of them just had multiple weekends under their belts: true, prolonged max level gameplay reports were very scarce (if any). At this moment we've yet to read the first report from people who played GW2 for a considerable while and past level 30 and the players in the first, limited closed beta have yet to speak out publically (NDA).
So yeah, the buy or not choice will be about as informed as SWTOR's was, (provided they follow up soon with an NDA drop).
Whether that's enough information is a personal decision for everyone, but saying that everyone knows everything they need to know isn't really true, I'm afraid.
Now the information is trickling down to the community itself, who weren’t the first ones to be catered to it at all. With an information overload, the community is still sifting through the mass media. If you haven’t looked at anything Guild Wars 2 related, you should. These aren't simple assumption articles. These are detailed descriptions of the actual mechanics of the game that will not see much alteration between now and the final release. Confident in their product, especially after a record breaking 50 hour beta sign up period, Arena.Net is offering full on pre-purchases of the final product. This too has been seldom done.
Not to be confused with a pre-order, a pre-purchase is a full commitment by the consumer to right out buy, at full price, the final product of the game as though it were on the shelf right now. That means refunds are highly unlikely, and that the consumer is showing a great deal of trust in the developer to provide what they’ve already put on display. While a picture may be worth a thousand words, videos are worth roughly 29,970 words per second. The Game-Press are the ones doing the leg work to really sell this game, offering their genuine excitement and experience in a fashion that can be wildly shared and seen with actual gameplay footage and natural player-like experience. Game-Press appeals far more to the consumer, as they are people, just like you – not a game developer preaching what you want to hear or a massive Review Website offering oddly to-good-to-be-true insights.
So far, I admit I’m impressed with the marketing strategy of Guild Wars, for as a consumer, I feel very confident in the investment I intend to make in the pre-purchase. I feel I have the knowledge and the foresight of what to expect, thanks to the hard and eager work of the Game-Press. While the developers over at Arena.Net seem to have a good game on their shoulders, it is the Game-Press who really have knocked this one out of the park with selling the product for the developer. Never before have I seen a company so nimbly dance around a publisher, almost laughing in the face of NCsoft – because Guild Wars 2 is actually selling itself right now in all the right ways.
Man, what differentiate your post from Barnett liturgy, even WAR was fun first 10-15 days of game play, everyone already know that you can't judge MMO for few days of game play. GW2 is not out yet, be careful. Rest of the post is very good, till you turn on marketing hype.
I hate to break it to you OP, but I think SWTOR did pretty much exactly the same in its roll out: short closed beta weekends, press event, prelaunch + a late NDA drop, etc.
Also SWTOR showed a considerable amount of gameplay from press before preordering started and people were convinced that they made a very informed decision (I for one) when in fact it wasn't. We all know there is much more to these games than a few hours or even days of starter experience can cover.
Making betas and press events short (i.e. beta "weekends") and restricting them to a certain level range or area very much limits most of what we've seen to "first impressions". It's very much controlled and orchestrated and despite us catching a glimpse of pretty much every aspect, there's still plenty of questionmarks.
SWTOR didn't have long term testers speaking out until pretty late, and most of them just had multiple weekends under their belts: true, prolonged max level gameplay reports were very scarce (if any). At this moment we've yet to read the first report from people who played GW2 for a considerable while and past level 30 and the players in the first, limited closed beta have yet to speak out publically (NDA).
So yeah, the buy or not choice will be about as informed as SWTOR's was, (provided they follow up soon with an NDA drop).
Whether that's enough information is a personal decision for everyone, but saying that everyone knows everything they need to know isn't really true, I'm afraid.
Yet it is not as if much is being hidden. Like we pretty much know how the entirety of max level PvP will be like in GW2 (Structured PvP & WvW). Yet did we see any max level PvP in SW:TOR, with how gear disparity will effect the warzones and did we even see Ilum in action? The press beta experience of SW:TOR was much more constrained, with players being able to experience level 1-15 PvE content and the warzones.The only important things that haven't been shown off in GW2 is endgame PvE. We know what it will contain (3 Dungeons & Level 80 zone), yet we don't know the state of the content. The problem of revealing that is that there will be very little surprise come launch and whether it will be a good or bad surprise has yet to be seen.
I hate to break it to you OP, but I think SWTOR did pretty much exactly the same in its roll out: short closed beta weekends, press event, prelaunch + a late NDA drop, etc.
Also SWTOR showed a considerable amount of gameplay from press before preordering started and people were convinced that they made a very informed decision (I for one) when in fact it wasn't. We all know there is much more to these games than a few hours or even days of starter experience can cover.
Making betas and press events short (i.e. beta "weekends") and restricting them to a certain level range or area very much limits most of what we've seen to "first impressions". It's very much controlled and orchestrated and despite us catching a glimpse of pretty much every aspect, there's still plenty of questionmarks.
SWTOR didn't have long term testers speaking out until pretty late, and most of them just had multiple weekends under their belts: true, prolonged max level gameplay reports were very scarce (if any). At this moment we've yet to read the first report from people who played GW2 for a considerable while and past level 30 and the players in the first, limited closed beta have yet to speak out publically (NDA).
So yeah, the buy or not choice will be about as informed as SWTOR's was, (provided they follow up soon with an NDA drop).
Whether that's enough information is a personal decision for everyone, but saying that everyone knows everything they need to know isn't really true, I'm afraid.
Yet it is not as if much is being hidden. Like we pretty much know how the entirety of max level PvP will be like in GW2 (Structured PvP & WvW). Yet did we see any max level PvP in SW:TOR, with how gear disparity will effect the warzones and did we even see Ilum in action? The press beta experience of SW:TOR was much more constrained, with players being able to experience level 1-15 PvE content and the warzones.The only important things that haven't been shown off in GW2 is endgame PvE. We know what it will contain (3 Dungeons & Level 80 zone), yet we don't know the state of the content. The problem of revealing that is that there will be very little surprise come launch and whether it will be a good or bad surprise has yet to be seen.
True. But similar restrictions apply to GW2: 3 of 5 races available, sub level 30 content, CS as a topic being off limits for the press, players still under NDA, etc. And like I said: these short events aren't able to give an impression of long term gameplay.
Swtor and GW2 are very much on the same line in their roll-out and both are very different compared to a game like AA with 5 or so long open betas without NDA long before the game launches.
Don't take this personally, Pony. I assure I don't mean to offend you, but if you didn't know what you were getting into with TOR beforehand, you were not paying attention.
For all the critique Bioware got about TOR, one thing they got right was being absolutely transparent about the game. The gameplay videos released ahead of launch showed pretty much all you needed to know about it, their dev interviews confirmed the design route they chose, and the 2 beta weekends were more than enough for anyone still undecided to make up his mind.
Don't take this personally, Pony. I assure I don't mean to offend you, but if you didn't know what you were getting into with TOR beforehand, you were not paying attention.
For all the critique Bioware got about TOR, one thing they got right was being absolutely transparent about the game. The gameplay videos released ahead of launch showed pretty much all you needed to know about it, their dev interviews confirmed the design route they chose, and the 2 beta weekends were more than enough for anyone still undecided to make up his mind.
You mean like, showcasing the game with full high res textures, and then removing them before launch?
You are absolutely right, they went full open door policy there
True. But similar restrictions apply to GW2: 3 of 5 races available, sub level 30 content, CS as a topic being off limits for the press, players still under NDA, etc. And like I said: these short events aren't able to give an impression of long term gameplay.
Swtor and GW2 are very much on the same line in their roll-out and both are very different compared to a game like AA with 5 or so long open betas without NDA long before the game launches.
Pony really isnt wrong. Unless you activly search for under NDA information we really, really dont know much more than up to level 30 for 3 of the 5 races, one of the instances, and what level scaled pvp looks like. To assume we know what PvP is based off level scaled PvP is kind of silly. We know basic layout of it but we cant really know just how end game pvp will play out.
At least for me though what I have seen was enough to make me want to play GW2 and I didnt buy TOR for a few weeks after launch till I got bored with my current games and got it for the story. I saw enough in the TOR beta weekends and video's to know it was basic questing (people can argue with me all they want on this but its my opinion) and basic themepark combat. 2 things I'm burnt out on. GW2 has shown me that the dynamic even system looks like alot of fun and the combat is slightly diffrent which I wont know how I like it till I get my hands on it but again, looks more fun than stand still and press 112224335 over and over again. As for the Dynamic events TB REALLY sold me on thoes when he said "It just makes the world feel alive with all this stuff happening even if I'm not here.". Add to that a box fee and I never have to spend another dime if I dont like it and I was sold.
You mean like, showcasing the game with full high res textures, and then removing them before launch?
You are absolutely right, they went full open door policy there
Beta didn't have high-res textures, tradeshow demos didn't have high-res, press demos didn't have high-res. You either drew your own conclusions by then, or you didn't.
Very well written! I'm glad you've brought your "talents" to PainTrain! Hahahaha! I agree with the article completely. Now only to play GW2 and find out for ourselves how well put together the game truly is. I highly doubt GW2 will be a letdown like other titles, but to each his own. I'm sure people will complain and rant, but at the end of the day, GW2 will do what other MMO's failed to do. Take my money with me being completely happy with it!
you do realize that writing bullshit like this is quite hilarious, given that everyone can go to youtube, write in swtor gameplay and get plenty of videos, ranging from early alpha in 2010, to the last beta in 2011 and everything in betwen
hell just going to the official site, gives you a 20 min, pure gameplay video from 2009, a 16 min 2011 dungeon video, EV developer walkthrough etc
so realy you need to get out of your and on porpuse not search for any gameplay videos in order for this statement to be true
the cgi videos are just remembered more because they were really well done and still some of the best cgi trailers out there, but to say there were no gameplay videos is a blatant lie
Also SWTOR showed a considerable amount of gameplay from press before preordering started and people were convinced that they made a very informed decision (I for one) when in fact it wasn't. We all know there is much more to these games than a few hours or even days of starter experience can cover.
Indeed, and if you recall in my article I didn't give fine-tooth-comb specifics on SWTOR's overall approach to the release of the game and their method of feeding the public with certain elements of information. Actually, I left a large portion of that open ended to be filled out by those who were more versed in the subject that I; however, the statement I made though was no less accurate because of this. I still strongly feel that SWOTR was a fine example of seeing two very distinct patterns in gaming hype, merged into a pretty massive creature -- probably so big, not a lot of people knew where to look for quality information a lot of time.
I know that as the game neared release, I curiously began to read up a bit more on the game to see what all the fuss was about. I didn't religiously follow the title either, and I seldom do. I stopped being a follower of game times after Final Fantasy XI -- namely because being a hardcore follower of that title nearly got me killed. That isn't an overblown statement, certain events in 2002 nearly ended with the conclusion of my life because of a game. Ever since then, I realized that a game wasn't really worth that much, and shouldn't be so all consuming to me.
Also, previous games like Anarchy Online scarred me for life on how being excited about a games release can lead to six months of pure frustration and horrible gameplay -- often with the constant hope that a fix is just around the corner. But instead of a fix, the company just keeps making it work. Like a doctor who doesn't mend a bleeding cut, but instead starts to whip out the sharp objects and eventually starts to amputate the entire leg just because the patient got a deep flesh wound.
I've seen my share of let-downs in my time, and it didn't make me cynical -- it made me a realist. The ideal of expectations dissolved from me, and I realized I should only be excited about real solid facts; real things that I've personally seen play out and are not at all doctored or pre-rendered. I need to see it from a player's point of view, not a developer's. Often you are not given this point of view, and that is why I seldom buy a lot of games these days. When I started looked into Star Wars: The Old Republic, I took my prior experience and started to look for trends and signals.
I found that the game wasn't going to measure up to any form of hype, not even EAs. All of the material I read, watched, and sifted through was often pre-packaged by the developer. Just felt more like 'Same old, same old' to me. I did not go online an express this opinion, I just decided to stay the course and show the world I didn't want SWOTR, not because I wasn't a Star Wars fan, or I haven't been eager for a new MMO, or this, or that... But because I looked into it, researched very hard for roughly three or four weeks in the months leading up to release and found it to be just plane... bland.
Perhaps you may have read the same stuff, I don’t know. But Mythbusters have proven that Beer Goggles do exist, maybe there is something much the same when it comes to games -- and those desperate to play them.
you do realize that writing bullshit like this is quite hilarious, given that everyone can go to youtube, write in swtor gameplay and get plenty of videos, ranging from early alpha in 2010, to the last beta in 2011 and everything in betwen
hell just going to the official site, gives you a 20 min, pure gameplay video from 2009, a 16 min 2011 dungeon video, EV developer walkthrough etc
so realy you need to get out of your and on porpuse not search for any gameplay videos in order for this statement to be true
the cgi videos are just remembered more because they were really well done and still some of the best cgi trailers out there, but to say there were no gameplay videos is a blatant lie
Did you read the paragraphs following that one? I assume you just stopped reading at that point, and didn't take notice to the additional links I gave to SWOTR gameplay videos dating as early as 2009.
Originally posted by garretth Gamestop is giving a delivery date of 6/26/2012 for the CE. Not sure if that is meaningful to you.
Meaningful to me - just happens to be the date of my 50th birthday! That would be a bonus for sure
Great post OP
The info started heavily hitting in 2010, lots of convention footage and hands on experience with the slow build of class releases and blog posts on mechanics. There was enough for me to get my ' Evrything we know about GW2 up by October 2010.
Meaningful to me - just happens to be the date of my 50th birthday! That would be a bonus for sure
Great post OP
The info started heavily hitting in 2010, lots of convention footage and hands on experience with the slow build of class releases and blog posts on mechanics. There was enough for me to get my ' Evrything we know about GW2 up by October 2010.
Thanks. I just wanna point out something about your Everything we know about GW2 thread. Even though the information started coming out in late 2010, people need to understand a simple thing -- it wasn't a lot -- especially as MMORPGs go. The information we know now, breaks the scale in comparison to what was availlable back then and what trickled down since 2010 until until Feburary 2012.
You point to a single player running around a zone as your key evidence as to what makes this game different? Somehow you leave out the fact that ArenaNET has said GW2 will bring grouping back to mmorpg's, but have yet to provide any actual examples of this massive gameplay they are hyping.
My prediction is WvW will be a massive lag fest. Sorry, but there is not magic bullet for technology that simply does not exist. If you think all these flashy spells will not cause performance issues, then you have have mental performance issues and are fighting reality,
This dev has little to zero actual experience in a mmorpg model of running a game and B2P up to this point has not worked. Sorry the content is slow and out dated. Nothing about Guild Wars impressed me. This will be labeled a pvp game with pve barely sprinkled in while leveling and zero pve at end game that is even worth the attention of a serious guild.
You point to a single player running around a zone as your key evidence as to what makes this game different? Somehow you leave out the fact that ArenaNET has said GW2 will bring grouping back to mmorpg's, but have yet to provide any actual examples of this massive gameplay they are hyping.
My prediction is WvW will be a massive lag fest. Sorry, but there is not magic bullet for technology that simply does not exist. If you think all these flashy spells will not cause performance issues, then you have have mental performance issues and are fighting reality,
This dev has little to zero actual experience in a mmorpg model of running a game and B2P up to this point has not worked. Sorry the content is slow and out dated. Nothing about Guild Wars impressed me. This will be labeled a pvp game with pve barely sprinkled in while leveling and zero pve at end game that is even worth the attention of a serious guild.
I will be proven right in the long run.
I agree with you. This game, like its predecessor, will end up primarily catering to the e-sport PvP arena players.
The RPG players are going to quickly discover, as they hit max level a few days after launch, that this game really isn't quite as different as ANet has been trying to make it sound.
I agree with you. This game, like its predecessor, will end up primarily catering to the e-sport PvP arena players.
The RPG players are going to quickly discover, as they hit max level a few days after launch, that this game really isn't quite as different as ANet has been trying to make it sound.
I see nothing from this dev that makes me believe they can keep up with the sheer demand or request that they will be getting. First and foremost GW2 have made the cardinal mistake of hyping this game to the WoW crowd. So we all know what they want and need in a mmorpg and their is a snow balls chance in hell ArenaNET will cater to these people.
You point to a single player running around a zone as your key evidence as to what makes this game different? Somehow you leave out the fact that ArenaNET has said GW2 will bring grouping back to mmorpg's, but have yet to provide any actual examples of this massive gameplay they are hyping.
My prediction is WvW will be a massive lag fest. Sorry, but there is not magic bullet for technology that simply does not exist. If you think all these flashy spells will not cause performance issues, then you have have mental performance issues and are fighting reality,
This dev has little to zero actual experience in a mmorpg model of running a game and B2P up to this point has not worked. Sorry the content is slow and out dated. Nothing about Guild Wars impressed me. This will be labeled a pvp game with pve barely sprinkled in while leveling and zero pve at end game that is even worth the attention of a serious guild.
I will be proven right in the long run.
I agree with you. This game, like its predecessor, will end up primarily catering to the e-sport PvP arena players.
The RPG players are going to quickly discover, as they hit max level a few days after launch, that this game really isn't quite as different as ANet has been trying to make it sound.
Oh? Because I'm in a pretty large guild in GW1 and not a single one of them has ever touched the PvP. I'm the only one with experience in it, and my experience is extremely limited. I like how people keep going by information incredibly dated. GW1 catered to the e-sport pvp crowd in Prophecies, it went more story oriented with Factions and by Nightfall it was more about the PvE than the PvP. If you ask anyone that actually plays GW1, the PvP was long ago outshined by the PvE.
"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."
You can sum it up with what I've been trying to say in all of these "hype" threads -
Hype is developer created, carefully crafted and presented information or pure marketing material.
Dev blogs, interviews, CGI videos, etc.
What Anet has done, release the game to the media and give them full permission to show us uncut footage and raw impressions etc. is something I haver never seen a MMO company do before release.
It shows a LOT of confidence in their product.
No hype, no spin, just raw access to the game.
The only "hype" present may be the spin the press put on things themselves, but with hours and hours and pages and pages availabel, you really can look for yourself and make your own decision.
This is why I think the idea of a full pre-purchase works for GW2.
Comments
Not sure what you're arguing here. A lot of games release information before the release. What we're talking about is the method of deployment, how Arena.Net has chosen to spread the world of Guild Wars 2, how they are hitting a target audience, and how they are doing it differently than other games.
That was more or less a side debate in response to something said. AS to your OT ..sure.. They've passed on traditional marketing for what is essentially viral marketing. They've handed the marketing raines over to their fans, Fiontar said it pretty well a few times earlier. As he pointed out the problems that could case quite perfectly.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
so you ignore the useful information because you just can't take ppl not liking it >.< I would think you WANT the poor reviews so you know what to be careful of...
i like to form my own opinion rather than soak up all the generalizations and speculation on forums.
I've got the straight edge.
Great summary.
I've said as much myself. Except, I want to say that NCSoft's willinglness not to rush this title is the reason they are able to market it so well. It's barely marketing. This game was probably finished overall a year ago. Around the time the marketing picked up. But instead of rushing it out, they gave people what they wanted, what they knew other game designers won't do. They told them that there was new functionarlity and showed that functionality at work. Visual evidence is what sold me. SWTOR was a big disappointment. Things began to disappear well before it was launched. By the time beta was launched the PR had changed.
So arenanet's appraoch to, this is what we got feels good. There need to have it all perfect works for me. I'd rather not have a release date for another year than hav them givre one because they feel they need to.
As a journalist, I can pick up on when previews are of a bad game. The wording is different. Like I can tell right now that Secret world did not impress a great impression. Guild wars feels as if there is ginuine love for this game and this is from a variety of different journalists. This is big. I like to think we are fairly unbiased. WE get paid not to be on the hype train.
so what are you doing here? If you don't want to hear what others have to say go figure out another way to delelope your opinion.
I hate to break it to you OP, but I think SWTOR did pretty much exactly the same in its roll out: short closed beta weekends, press event, prelaunch + a late NDA drop, etc.
Also SWTOR showed a considerable amount of gameplay from press before preordering started and people were convinced that they made a very informed decision (I for one) when in fact it wasn't. We all know there is much more to these games than a few hours or even days of starter experience can cover.
Making betas and press events short (i.e. beta "weekends") and restricting them to a certain level range or area very much limits most of what we've seen to "first impressions". It's very much controlled and orchestrated and despite us catching a glimpse of pretty much every aspect, there's still plenty of questionmarks.
SWTOR didn't have long term testers speaking out until pretty late, and most of them just had multiple weekends under their belts: true, prolonged max level gameplay reports were very scarce (if any). At this moment we've yet to read the first report from people who played GW2 for a considerable while and past level 30 and the players in the first, limited closed beta have yet to speak out publically (NDA).
So yeah, the buy or not choice will be about as informed as SWTOR's was, (provided they follow up soon with an NDA drop).
Whether that's enough information is a personal decision for everyone, but saying that everyone knows everything they need to know isn't really true, I'm afraid.
My brand new bloggity blog.
Man, what differentiate your post from Barnett liturgy, even WAR was fun first 10-15 days of game play, everyone already know that you can't judge MMO for few days of game play. GW2 is not out yet, be careful. Rest of the post is very good, till you turn on marketing hype.
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"I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that."
Yet it is not as if much is being hidden. Like we pretty much know how the entirety of max level PvP will be like in GW2 (Structured PvP & WvW). Yet did we see any max level PvP in SW:TOR, with how gear disparity will effect the warzones and did we even see Ilum in action? The press beta experience of SW:TOR was much more constrained, with players being able to experience level 1-15 PvE content and the warzones.The only important things that haven't been shown off in GW2 is endgame PvE. We know what it will contain (3 Dungeons & Level 80 zone), yet we don't know the state of the content. The problem of revealing that is that there will be very little surprise come launch and whether it will be a good or bad surprise has yet to be seen.
True. But similar restrictions apply to GW2: 3 of 5 races available, sub level 30 content, CS as a topic being off limits for the press, players still under NDA, etc. And like I said: these short events aren't able to give an impression of long term gameplay.
Swtor and GW2 are very much on the same line in their roll-out and both are very different compared to a game like AA with 5 or so long open betas without NDA long before the game launches.
My brand new bloggity blog.
Don't take this personally, Pony. I assure I don't mean to offend you, but if you didn't know what you were getting into with TOR beforehand, you were not paying attention.
For all the critique Bioware got about TOR, one thing they got right was being absolutely transparent about the game. The gameplay videos released ahead of launch showed pretty much all you needed to know about it, their dev interviews confirmed the design route they chose, and the 2 beta weekends were more than enough for anyone still undecided to make up his mind.
You mean like, showcasing the game with full high res textures, and then removing them before launch?
You are absolutely right, they went full open door policy there
"I am not a robot. I am a unicorn."
Pony really isnt wrong. Unless you activly search for under NDA information we really, really dont know much more than up to level 30 for 3 of the 5 races, one of the instances, and what level scaled pvp looks like. To assume we know what PvP is based off level scaled PvP is kind of silly. We know basic layout of it but we cant really know just how end game pvp will play out.
At least for me though what I have seen was enough to make me want to play GW2 and I didnt buy TOR for a few weeks after launch till I got bored with my current games and got it for the story. I saw enough in the TOR beta weekends and video's to know it was basic questing (people can argue with me all they want on this but its my opinion) and basic themepark combat. 2 things I'm burnt out on. GW2 has shown me that the dynamic even system looks like alot of fun and the combat is slightly diffrent which I wont know how I like it till I get my hands on it but again, looks more fun than stand still and press 112224335 over and over again. As for the Dynamic events TB REALLY sold me on thoes when he said "It just makes the world feel alive with all this stuff happening even if I'm not here.". Add to that a box fee and I never have to spend another dime if I dont like it and I was sold.
Beta didn't have high-res textures, tradeshow demos didn't have high-res, press demos didn't have high-res. You either drew your own conclusions by then, or you didn't.
Very well written! I'm glad you've brought your "talents" to PainTrain! Hahahaha! I agree with the article completely. Now only to play GW2 and find out for ourselves how well put together the game truly is. I highly doubt GW2 will be a letdown like other titles, but to each his own. I'm sure people will complain and rant, but at the end of the day, GW2 will do what other MMO's failed to do. Take my money with me being completely happy with it!
you do realize that writing bullshit like this is quite hilarious, given that everyone can go to youtube, write in swtor gameplay and get plenty of videos, ranging from early alpha in 2010, to the last beta in 2011 and everything in betwen
hell just going to the official site, gives you a 20 min, pure gameplay video from 2009, a 16 min 2011 dungeon video, EV developer walkthrough etc
so realy you need to get out of your and on porpuse not search for any gameplay videos in order for this statement to be true
the cgi videos are just remembered more because they were really well done and still some of the best cgi trailers out there, but to say there were no gameplay videos is a blatant lie
Indeed, and if you recall in my article I didn't give fine-tooth-comb specifics on SWTOR's overall approach to the release of the game and their method of feeding the public with certain elements of information. Actually, I left a large portion of that open ended to be filled out by those who were more versed in the subject that I; however, the statement I made though was no less accurate because of this. I still strongly feel that SWOTR was a fine example of seeing two very distinct patterns in gaming hype, merged into a pretty massive creature -- probably so big, not a lot of people knew where to look for quality information a lot of time.
I know that as the game neared release, I curiously began to read up a bit more on the game to see what all the fuss was about. I didn't religiously follow the title either, and I seldom do. I stopped being a follower of game times after Final Fantasy XI -- namely because being a hardcore follower of that title nearly got me killed. That isn't an overblown statement, certain events in 2002 nearly ended with the conclusion of my life because of a game. Ever since then, I realized that a game wasn't really worth that much, and shouldn't be so all consuming to me.
Also, previous games like Anarchy Online scarred me for life on how being excited about a games release can lead to six months of pure frustration and horrible gameplay -- often with the constant hope that a fix is just around the corner. But instead of a fix, the company just keeps making it work. Like a doctor who doesn't mend a bleeding cut, but instead starts to whip out the sharp objects and eventually starts to amputate the entire leg just because the patient got a deep flesh wound.
I've seen my share of let-downs in my time, and it didn't make me cynical -- it made me a realist. The ideal of expectations dissolved from me, and I realized I should only be excited about real solid facts; real things that I've personally seen play out and are not at all doctored or pre-rendered. I need to see it from a player's point of view, not a developer's. Often you are not given this point of view, and that is why I seldom buy a lot of games these days. When I started looked into Star Wars: The Old Republic, I took my prior experience and started to look for trends and signals.
I found that the game wasn't going to measure up to any form of hype, not even EAs. All of the material I read, watched, and sifted through was often pre-packaged by the developer. Just felt more like 'Same old, same old' to me. I did not go online an express this opinion, I just decided to stay the course and show the world I didn't want SWOTR, not because I wasn't a Star Wars fan, or I haven't been eager for a new MMO, or this, or that... But because I looked into it, researched very hard for roughly three or four weeks in the months leading up to release and found it to be just plane... bland.
Perhaps you may have read the same stuff, I don’t know. But Mythbusters have proven that Beer Goggles do exist, maybe there is something much the same when it comes to games -- and those desperate to play them.
Did you read the paragraphs following that one? I assume you just stopped reading at that point, and didn't take notice to the additional links I gave to SWOTR gameplay videos dating as early as 2009.
Meaningful to me - just happens to be the date of my 50th birthday! That would be a bonus for sure
Great post OP
The info started heavily hitting in 2010, lots of convention footage and hands on experience with the slow build of class releases and blog posts on mechanics. There was enough for me to get my ' Evrything we know about GW2 up by October 2010.
Thanks. I just wanna point out something about your Everything we know about GW2 thread. Even though the information started coming out in late 2010, people need to understand a simple thing -- it wasn't a lot -- especially as MMORPGs go. The information we know now, breaks the scale in comparison to what was availlable back then and what trickled down since 2010 until until Feburary 2012.
You point to a single player running around a zone as your key evidence as to what makes this game different? Somehow you leave out the fact that ArenaNET has said GW2 will bring grouping back to mmorpg's, but have yet to provide any actual examples of this massive gameplay they are hyping.
My prediction is WvW will be a massive lag fest. Sorry, but there is not magic bullet for technology that simply does not exist. If you think all these flashy spells will not cause performance issues, then you have have mental performance issues and are fighting reality,
This dev has little to zero actual experience in a mmorpg model of running a game and B2P up to this point has not worked. Sorry the content is slow and out dated. Nothing about Guild Wars impressed me. This will be labeled a pvp game with pve barely sprinkled in while leveling and zero pve at end game that is even worth the attention of a serious guild.
I will be proven right in the long run.
I agree with you. This game, like its predecessor, will end up primarily catering to the e-sport PvP arena players.
The RPG players are going to quickly discover, as they hit max level a few days after launch, that this game really isn't quite as different as ANet has been trying to make it sound.
Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.
I see nothing from this dev that makes me believe they can keep up with the sheer demand or request that they will be getting. First and foremost GW2 have made the cardinal mistake of hyping this game to the WoW crowd. So we all know what they want and need in a mmorpg and their is a snow balls chance in hell ArenaNET will cater to these people.
Oh? Because I'm in a pretty large guild in GW1 and not a single one of them has ever touched the PvP. I'm the only one with experience in it, and my experience is extremely limited. I like how people keep going by information incredibly dated. GW1 catered to the e-sport pvp crowd in Prophecies, it went more story oriented with Factions and by Nightfall it was more about the PvE than the PvP. If you ask anyone that actually plays GW1, the PvP was long ago outshined by the PvE.
"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."
Great post OP.
You can sum it up with what I've been trying to say in all of these "hype" threads -
Hype is developer created, carefully crafted and presented information or pure marketing material.
Dev blogs, interviews, CGI videos, etc.
What Anet has done, release the game to the media and give them full permission to show us uncut footage and raw impressions etc. is something I haver never seen a MMO company do before release.
It shows a LOT of confidence in their product.
No hype, no spin, just raw access to the game.
The only "hype" present may be the spin the press put on things themselves, but with hours and hours and pages and pages availabel, you really can look for yourself and make your own decision.
This is why I think the idea of a full pre-purchase works for GW2.