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Basing game interest upon any user review : a grain of salt to take

k-damagek-damage Member CommonPosts: 738
in Guild Wars 2

Hello,

I've seen a certain number of people (a minority yes, but still), saying the game is "not good" because there's "nothing special" in it. So for all the people who didn't have the chance to test it this week end, please let me bring a grain of salt in these reviews.

First, so you know I'm not just yadda-yaddaing from nothing, I'm a Thief (the class who dies the most), I'm lvl 9 (= 8 hours of playing), and I've covered only 2 zones (= 5% of the world).

Here's 3 game chat experiences I had with people with a negative opinion :

1) guy : "The first quest is a mess, I'm thrown against a boss but I don't even know how to use my character".

me : "Did you see that there are tons of lvl 1 neutral mobs next to the village to try your skills ?" guy : "No. they should have been more visible." (said mobs were indeed really visible, and lots of them, right next to the first quest point).

2) guy : "I can't stop dying, this is crazy." or even by seeing tons of "anyone to rez me ?" prove how much people die generally. 

me : "did you use your heal skill ? or did you try to weapon swap ? Some weapons are a real advantage in some situations"

guy : "No, what ? How can I heal ? How can I swap weapon ?". 

3) guy : "It's boring, there are only the same dynamic events."

me : "Did you try to lurk around the woods ? or behind the mountain ? Or did you try to talk to that long view icon NPC ? She can unveil all points of interest for you." guy : "No, how am I supposed to know that there are some stuff over here ?"

____________

 

So, all in all, there some people who are expecting a themepark, and to be held by hand like in other MMOs. Thing is, GW2 is holding by hand for a lot of things. But there is so much to do in only one zone, challenges, events, quests, gathering, lurking, hidden places to discover, etc ... that people who expect the game to tell them all what they are supposed to do are actually missing 50% of it. 

So yes, for the gamer who doesn't want to invest in lurking, discovering, trying, dying to trials and errors, then the game might not be anything special or revolutionary. And it's the same for combat skills : anyone who just mashes buttons (because in starting area, in 1 vs 1, it does work) will not see any difference between skills except with visuals.

But I can assure you that :

- combat is far more than mashing : from lvl 1 to 4, I discovered my class, Thief. And any time I wanted to take on more than 2 mobs, I just died in no time. But something happened at lvl 7-8, when I finally understood how combat work, and which skills / weapons were more efficient in certain situations. There, I found myself rushing through packs of 4 mobs, slay them, and (rarely) dying. And to even more justify my argument, I often did it next to packs of 3 players who didn't dare to engage packs, visibly afraid to die (still learning their skills I guess, nothing wrong with that).

- the world is freaking huge. There are tons, tons of things to do, it's impressive. To tell you, I spent nearly 1 hour this afternoon just attacking random packs of mobs, trying to push the boundaries of how many and how fast I could kill without dying (I was destroyed in seconds at times, don't worry thief is not OP). I also enjoyed completing a quest, having the choice to go east, west or north, and then only let my instinct/inspiration guide me where I should go. And it worked, never did I find repeating the same event too often, or the same activity. Also, concrete example : 8 hours spent, 2 huge zones where I didn't even fullfilled every quest point, and my map is saying right now : "World exploration : 2%".

- Activities are very varied. Example : I chained a quest where I had to protect a shaman in a parallel spirit world, with a quest where I had to aim & throw snowballs on children (the way they giggled when they hit me really made me smile, it was refreshing). Then suddenly the village I was playing in was attacked by litterally an army of bears, lol. Players were being destroyed one by one by furious grizzlies, until we started to pack & organize ourselves.

But enough wall of texts, you get the point :

_________________

TL;DR : GW2 is offering so much freedom that themepark players (or players who don't want to invest in exploration) will without a doubt feel lost, miss a lot of things, and therefore find nothing new here. So if you're looking for fair & objective reviews, search the elaborated ones, from people who took time to explore every aspect of the game. And the game is huge, so it won't be short ones.

This is absolutely not a themepark game (and thank you ANet for that). So if you're really interested in GW2, either play it (and EXPLORE), either search for reviews from people who don't like to rush things, people who are used to invest themselves in MMOs. You'll have to read walls of text I guess, like this one, as they're the invested type, but don't be afraid if you're looking for well thought critics.

___

Personal conclusion : the game is absolutely good, and has a lot of potential. As I wrote  here : http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/4940859#4940859 , any type of player can enjoy this game. For example, as someone who doesn't have as much time as 6 years ago, I'll find myself perfectly pleased with having 2 hours per day to play. I'll just dive into the world, let the wind guide my steps. I did it for 8 hours this weekend and it worked very well.

Just explore, don't try to rush things, and learn your class. The game is too big to have a solid opinion before lvl 50.

***** Before hitting that reply button, please READ the WHOLE thread you're about to post in *****

«1

Comments

  • TwoThreeFourTwoThreeFour Member UncommonPosts: 2,155
    Great post, times like these I wish there was a "increase reputation" button in this forum. I specially like how you appear to have taken time to avoid exaggerating and generalizing, which I know can be tempting to do.
  • BaniscoBanisco Member Posts: 240
    I dont usually say this but good post, its good to read something diferent from the "i cant play im mad this is bad"
  • DrNo172000DrNo172000 Member Posts: 48
    Great review honestly, I think the problem that most people have is that because they are so use to the standard template the don't know what to do.  The first time I played Beta I keep missing my attacks because my brain was so wired to if I can use it I'm in range.  Missing my leap attack over and over with my warrior was a little frustrating but it was refreshing.  People just need to memory dump how things normally work and do some exploring.
  • k-damagek-damage Member CommonPosts: 738

    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour

    Great post, times like these I wish there was a "increase reputation" button in this forum. I specially like how you appear to have taken time to avoid exaggerating and generalizing, which I know can be tempting to do.

    Thanks TwoThreeFour :)

    I don't want to put the game on a pedestal yet, 9 levels is really not enough to judge. But I thought it at least deserves to be given a chance up to lvl 80. 

    Cheers

    ***** Before hitting that reply button, please READ the WHOLE thread you're about to post in *****

  • Atlan99Atlan99 Member UncommonPosts: 1,332

    Combat is easy against most melee, since you can pretty much kite indefinitely. Range mobs are the only thing that make the game challenging.

    Alot of times you are just spamming one skill until you run out intiative. Then you autoattack while kiting until you build up more.

    I was also dissapointed by the lack of world changing so far in dynamic events. This is key because Arenanet went on and on ad nausem about this. As far as I can tell so far I have yet to run into a dynamic event that changes anything.

    For the most part all quest activities fall into kill mobs and collect objects.

    Like I said before, the game isn't bad it's just not as good as people have been claiming.

  • LoekiiLoekii Member Posts: 430

    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour

    Great post, times like these I wish there was a "increase reputation" button in this forum. I specially like how you appear to have taken time to avoid exaggerating and generalizing, which I know can be tempting to do.

    Agreed.  Thanks for the post.

    image

  • grimfallgrimfall Member UncommonPosts: 1,153

    Originally posted by Banisco

    I dont usually say this but good post, its good to read something diferent from the "i cant play im mad this is bad"



    Not really a good post.  It's called a strawman argument.  Maybe these are real quotes from the game, maybe not, but the people who are taking time to post legitimate reviews and impressions aren't these people, so his argument basically has no value.

    It's like saying "I went to University Alabama and some idiot couldn't find his first class and was frustrated.  He's an idiot, therefore University of Alabama is a better school than Stanford and MIT."

    All it really proves (if the OP isn't fabricating things) is that some idiots are pre-purchasing GW2.

  • GroovyFlowerGroovyFlower Member Posts: 1,245

    Well said and i agree game is just great.

    Im agains holding hands and i invest alot in game and my character so np for me guildwars 2 is perfectly suited for my needs.

    If you want game that have waxmuseum and kill 10x quest and it hold your hand then GW2 is not for you.

    If you dont mind explore invest and die alot and dont wanne grind endless for gear but have exciting gameplay and fun then GW2 is for you:)

     

  • niceguy3978niceguy3978 Member UncommonPosts: 2,051

    Originally posted by k-damage

    Hello,

    I've seen a certain number of people (a minority yes, but still), saying the game is "not good" because there's "nothing special" in it. So for all the people who didn't have the chance to test it this week end, please let me bring a grain of salt in these reviews.

    First, so you know I'm not just yadda-yaddaing from nothing, I'm a Thief (the class who dies the most), I'm lvl 9 (= 8 hours of playing), and I've covered only 2 zones (= 5% of the world).

    Here's 3 game chat experiences I had with people with a negative opinion :

    1) guy : "The first quest is a mess, I'm thrown against a boss but I don't even know how to use my character".

    me : "Did you see that there are tons of lvl 1 neutral mobs next to the village to try your skills ?" guy : "No. they should have been more visible." (said mobs were indeed really visible, and lots of them, right next to the first quest point).

    2) guy : "I can't stop dying, this is crazy." or even by seeing tons of "anyone to rez me ?" prove how much people die generally. 

    me : "did you use your heal skill ? or did you try to weapon swap ? Some weapons are a real advantage in some situations"

    guy : "No, what ? How can I heal ? How can I swap weapon ?". 

    3) guy : "It's boring, there are only the same dynamic events."

    me : "Did you try to lurk around the woods ? or behind the mountain ? Or did you try to talk to that long view icon NPC ? She can unveil all points of interest for you." guy : "No, how am I supposed to know that there are some stuff over here ?"

    ____________

     

    So, all in all, there some people who are expecting a themepark, and to be held by hand like in other MMOs. Thing is, GW2 is holding by hand for a lot of things. But there is so much to do in only one zone, challenges, events, quests, gathering, lurking, hidden places to discover, etc ... that people who expect the game to tell them all what they are supposed to do are actually missing 50% of it. 

    So yes, for the gamer who doesn't want to invest in lurking, discovering, trying, dying to trials and errors, then the game might not be anything special or revolutionary. And it's the same for combat skills : anyone who just mashes buttons (because in starting area, in 1 vs 1, it does work) will not see any difference between skills except with visuals.

    But I can assure you that :

    - combat is far more than mashing : from lvl 1 to 4, I discovered my class, Thief. And any time I wanted to take on more than 2 mobs, I just died in no time. But something happened at lvl 7-8, when I finally understood how combat work, and which skills / weapons were more efficient in certain situations. There, I found myself rushing through packs of 4 mobs, slay them, and (rarely) dying. And to even more justify my argument, I often did it next to packs of 3 players who didn't dare to engage packs, visibly afraid to die.

    - the world is freaking huge. There are tons, tons of things to do, it's impressive. To tell you, I spent nearly 1 hour this afternoon just attacking random packs of mobs, trying to push the boundaries of how many and how fast I could kill without dying (I died at times, don't worry thief is not OP). I also enjoyed completing a quest, having the choice to go east, west or north, and then only let my instinct/inspiration guide me where I should go. And it worked, never did I find repeating the same event too often, or the same activity.

    - Activities are very varied. Example : I chained a quest where I had to protect a shaman in a parallel spirit world, with a quest where I had to aim & throw snowballs on children (the way they giggled when they hit me really made me smile, it was refreshing). Then suddenly the village I was playing in was attacked by litterally an army of bears, lol. Players were being destroyed one by one by furious grizzlies, until we started to pack & organize ourselves.

    But enough wall of texts, you get the point :

    _________________

    TL;DR : GW2 is offering so much freedom that themepark players (or players who don't want to invest in exploration) will without a doubt feel lost, and find nothing new here.

    This is absolutely not a themepark game (and thank you ANet for that). So if you're really interested in GW2, either play it (and EXPLORE), either search for reviews from people who don't like to rush things, people who are used to invest themselves in MMOs. You'll have to read walls of text I guess, like this one, as they're the invested type, but don't be afraid if you're looking for well thought critics.

    ___

    Personal conclusion : the game is absolutely good, and has a lot of potential. As I wrote  here : http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/4940859#4940859 , any type of player can enjoy this game. For example, as someone who doesn't have as much time as 6 years ago, I'll find myself perfectly pleased with having 2 hours per day to play. I'll just dive into the world, let the wind guide my steps. I did it for 8 hours this weekend and it worked very well.

    Just explore, don't try to rush things, and learn your class. The game is too big to have a solid opinion before lvl 50.

    Ok, when Rift, TOR, WAR, and others came out we were only suppose to listen to user reviews because we all seem to know that all of the review sites have been bought and paid for to do good reviews, now for GW2 we're not suppose to listen to player reviews?  Or only certain player reviews?  It is so confusing to know who to listen to these days, nobody seems to know.  I would love to "try it for myself" as people will claim others should do, but I'm not going to pay a non-refundable 60 for a game that I may or may not like.

  • k-damagek-damage Member CommonPosts: 738

    Originally posted by grimfall

    All it really proves (if the OP isn't fabricating things) is that some idiots are pre-purchasing GW2.

    I can assure those were real quotes (not exact quotes of course, I didn't cut/paste, but this was the essence). First one they were a group of 2 (friends I guess), second one is basically all my 8 hours long experience, chat being flooded with "please rez me", and third was one guy in the Norn starting area.

    ***** Before hitting that reply button, please READ the WHOLE thread you're about to post in *****

  • LoekiiLoekii Member Posts: 430

    Originally posted by Atlan99

    Like I said before, the game isn't bad it's just not as good as people have been claiming.

     

    Imo, like most things in life, things are never a great as people make them sound.  People exaggerate, or simply value things differently.

     

    For me, I prefer to look at the middle of the road reviews, and just look for a good game -- with the understanding that no game is going to be with out problems and issues.      I am content if a game has simply taken what is the current standard and raised the bar a little --- basically moving from good MMORPG 2.0 to good MMORPG 2.5 or 3.0. 

     

    image

  • BadaboomBadaboom Member UncommonPosts: 2,380
    When I was playing yesterday there was just so much going on and so many people it was not fun.  Played a little bit this morning and it was a lot better. 
  • SlampigSlampig Member UncommonPosts: 2,342

    All I have to say is that this is only the second post I have seen that is positive. The negatives are outweighing the positives by a large margin.

     

    Just saying.

     

    Look to the login screen...haha...

    That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!

  • LoekiiLoekii Member Posts: 430

    Originally posted by k-damage

    Originally posted by grimfall

    All it really proves (if the OP isn't fabricating things) is that some idiots are pre-purchasing GW2.

    I swear to god those were real quotes (not exact quotes of course, I didn't cut/paste, but this was the essence).



    I think many of us have seen similar comments in other MMOs, so it is not that far fetched that you saw such in GW2 Beta.

     

    Most MMORPGer players can play games, but there are those few gamers that really do need to be hand held, are poor gamers, or simply are decent gamers that are simply over looking the obvious.   

     

    image

  • k-damagek-damage Member CommonPosts: 738

    Originally posted by niceguy3978

    Ok, when Rift, TOR, WAR, and others came out we were only suppose to listen to user reviews because we all seem to know that all of the review sites have been bought and paid for to do good reviews, now for GW2 we're not suppose to listen to player reviews?  Or only certain player reviews?  It is so confusing to know who to listen to these days, nobody seems to know.  I would love to "try it for myself" as people will claim others should do, but I'm not going to pay a non-refundable 60 for a game that I may or may not like.

    I understand, and was in the same boat. That's why I only give this thread as an advice (not the ultimate review, just an advice) to people who really want to have an objective opinion about the game's potential. It's not easy to find I admit, but search for reviews where people describe a lot things. Basically walls of text.

    ***** Before hitting that reply button, please READ the WHOLE thread you're about to post in *****

  • grimfallgrimfall Member UncommonPosts: 1,153

    Originally posted by Badaboom

    When I was playing yesterday there was just so much going on and so many people it was not fun.  Played a little bit this morning and it was a lot better. 



    Now you've done it.  You ended  MMORPG.com forums world record streak of posts about a game that provide no useful information to the readers.

    More posts like Badaboom's please.

  • jusomdudejusomdude Member RarePosts: 2,706

    Originally posted by niceguy3978

    Originally posted by k-damage

    *snip*

    Ok, when Rift, TOR, WAR, and others came out we were only suppose to listen to user reviews because we all seem to know that all of the review sites have been bought and paid for to do good reviews, now for GW2 we're not suppose to listen to player reviews?  Or only certain player reviews?  It is so confusing to know who to listen to these days, nobody seems to know.  I would love to "try it for myself" as people will claim others should do, but I'm not going to pay a non-refundable 60 for a game that I may or may not like.

    Exactly. I wasn't going to buy D3 before I played, now I can't wait for it to come out, but I'm not buying this until I can at least try it either.

    OP makes it sound like it's all sunshine and rainbows which I highly doubt.

  • k-damagek-damage Member CommonPosts: 738

    Originally posted by jusomdude

    OP makes it sound like it's all sunshine and rainbows which I highly doubt.

    You're really overexaggerating. Read all my post, and the other ones below it, you'll find words contradicting that.

    Plus this one : http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/post/4940859#4940859

    ***** Before hitting that reply button, please READ the WHOLE thread you're about to post in *****

  • AvatarBladeAvatarBlade Member UncommonPosts: 757

    Originally posted by grimfall

    Originally posted by Badaboom

    When I was playing yesterday there was just so much going on and so many people it was not fun.  Played a little bit this morning and it was a lot better. 



    Now you've done it.  You ended  MMORPG.com forums world record streak of posts about a game that provide no useful information to the readers.

    More posts like Badaboom's please.

    Thanks for the laughs grim.

  • hikaru77hikaru77 Member UncommonPosts: 1,123
    OP, thats only your point of view. Im also a MMO veteran and so far the only good think about gw2 is the WvWvW, and still it have a lot of problems. if you have played Rift or Warhammer the PvE is exactly like that, and in some point feels like a cheap version of them. And the combat or gameplay is just too easy, it really looks like a console game or if it was a game made for kids, well is rated for 12 years old kids right?. but i mean, all you need to do is press 1, (auto atk), and then running around ur target waiting for countdowns, same as a melee but is even worse bc under certain situations, you have only 2 usefulls skills in ur skill bar. The instanced PvP looks like a deathmatch, you dont even need an strategic there, just get points and kill people and is even worse bc everyone is dps. And like i said before, something is just not right with the animations. GW2 is a good game, fun, but thats all, if you was waiting for a game who gonna change everything, you´ll be disappointed. ¨yes but the WvWvW is awesome¨, if you have played warhammer you´ll find that gw2 have the same system, or even Daoc, but is more simple, still fun, but at the end most of the people will play the game just for the WvWvW and it some point without updates people will get bored pretty fast.
  • IstavaanIstavaan Member Posts: 1,350
    The game is great takes awhile to get used to though. there is just so much going on around you that it can get overwhelming at times. im enjoying it so far and the client  is very stable no crashes yet and decent fps even in pvp.
  • k-damagek-damage Member CommonPosts: 738

    Originally posted by hikaru77

    OP, thats only your point of view. 

    Of course.

     


    Originally posted by hikaru77

     but i mean, all you need to do is press 1, (auto atk), and then running around ur target waiting for countdowns, same as a melee but is even worse bc under certain situations, you have only 2 usefulls skills in ur skill bar. 

    All I have to say is : we'll see who dies the most at lvl 80 then :)

    cheers

    ***** Before hitting that reply button, please READ the WHOLE thread you're about to post in *****

  • LexinLexin Member UncommonPosts: 701
    I never go by user reviews or the fake reviews givin by websites. Only opinion I will take in the matter of buying games is my own.

    image

  • LoekiiLoekii Member Posts: 430

    Originally posted by jusomdude

    Exactly. I wasn't going to buy D3 before I played, now I can't wait for it to come out, but I'm not buying this until I can at least try it either.

    OP makes it sound like it's all sunshine and rainbows which I highly doubt.

     

    Defnately support 'Try-before-you-buy'.   I would have prefered to see the MMORPG market do 'free trials' at release -- like a taster sample to hook you in.   Might have improved the overall quality of games, if Developers could not just sell boxes 'behind the curtain'.

     

    I disagree with the comment about the OP.   I do not see it remotely close to 'Pie in the sky', like we saw with TOR fans.   Rather I see it as just offering up some personal experience, like Baddaboom, to just toss into the pile of information about the Beta.

     

     

    image

  • redcap036redcap036 Member UncommonPosts: 1,230

    Very well put mate, I to play a Char thief as well and had pretty much the same experience as you, I found this game to be a little bit confusing at first, but just like you around level 7-8 I started to find my feet with my class, personally I still can't get over how big this game world is.

    I've also tried making a few different characters, another Char warrior and a Norn guardian which I've only played to level 3 so far, both had different starting stories, the Char warrior compared to my Char thief althou starting off in the same city, both went off on different paths, the warrior had to go and find some infiltrators in a tavern in the city,( which is where I left him so far) the other had to find some weapon blue prints and then build the weapon, get it tested, then decide which way it would be used by the char forces, this so far has taken my thief from level 3 to level 6, I found the next stage of this story to be a little too high level for my thief so I had to go off and just explore and find some lower level quests to do in a bid to level him up a bit more first before I continue the story.

    The Norn Guardian started off in a completely different city, but again I haven’t taken him to far yet as I’ve concentrated on my Char thief for the most part, I’m still planning on making a ranger of some kind yet aswell.

    For me so far this game compared to the mmorpg’s I’ve played, let’s me and makes me think about where I want to go next and not just look around for where I have to go next.

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