Unfounded Hate against GW2 and its 'fanbois'

Eir_S · May 2012

Yeah, I too have to wonder what constitutes "blind" fanboyism and not legitimate praise anymore; apart from a few examples already given, there is a massive amount of people pleased with what they played now, so that excuse hardly flies.

ebonized · May 2012

Originally posted by Wickedjelly

Well, considering how some of those asshats went around messing with others forums not really surprising the favor is being returned. Gonna get a lot worse too. Would happen regardless but considering how annoying and awful some were can say I have no sympathy for it in this case.

what a petty, spiteful and downright poor excuse. don't even know what to say to this

xenpt · May 2012

This is not about videogames people are just douchebags by nature.

There will always be people that love one game and hate the competition one example is Call of Duty Modern Warfare 3 and Battlefield 3.

UtukuMoon · May 2012

@OP

Mate, this was always going to happen,i would not worry about it to be honest.The main bulk of the hate comes from a certain fanbase of another MMO that didn't live up to their expectations.Contructive criticism was to much for them to bare so they bottled it all up and waited for the right time to stike back.

Hurvart · May 2012

Originally posted by Nevulus
Yeah the cycle has to stop. It has gotten out of hand and prevents us from having actual productive discussions on the games we DO like.

The blind fanaticism of the defensive fanboy hurts their respective game more than they realize, which in turn agitates another user into attacking with a rebuttal from either sheer frustration or for the purpose of trolling. Which then causes the fanatic to reply in kind, and on and on and on. They are hurting the MMORPG genre as a whole without ever realizing it.

Unfortunately this is a biproduct of the new "Generation Me", where they want everything handed to them immediately. A generation where people are awarded for simply existing, and everything is about "me, me, me, now, now, now", never to actually work for anything, nor appreciate the journey while focused on a set goal.

I can agree with the first part. But why do you think its a biproduct of "Generation Me"? Typically fanatics are people that are very selfless. People that need some authority that they can follow blindly. And to be part of a community of followers like themselves. If the authority steals money from them or abuse them they will defend it and claim they like it. If you try to help them they attack you. But they are not really selfish or individualistic. People that are overly selfish and self centered can perhaps be mean in other ways. Sometimes its someone like that the fanatics are following.

People that are strong and independent never becomes fanatics. People that are critical and stand up for and defend their rights. People that can reognize a bad deal and not fall for hype. People that want facts and prefer to think first before deciding if something is good or bad.

Typically fanatics support sports teams. But sometimes also games, other products or companies.

Wickedjelly · May 2012

Originally posted by ebonized

Originally posted by Wickedjelly

Well, considering how some of those asshats went around messing with others forums not really surprising the favor is being returned. Gonna get a lot worse too. Would happen regardless but considering how annoying and awful some were can say I have no sympathy for it in this case.

what a petty, spiteful and downright poor excuse. don't even know what to say to this

Who would that be? The ones that started it or the ones that return the favor? I mean really...

Besides it's a forum. Petty and spiteful are pretty much par for the course.

RefMinor · May 2012

Poor things, they must be beside themselves

Shadin · May 2012

Didn't read the whole thread but.... Yes. It happens. It's the same as against SW:TOR and just about any MMO.

Whenever a game is to be released it gets bashed together with it's followers, as some people cannot comprehend that people have different tastes and that what's "good" is subjective. GW2 is no different in that respect, nor will whatever new, shiny, large game that comes after it be I'd wager.

To be blunt, and I'm sorry if I come across as rude, suck it up. It happens to just about every game. However sad that may be.

Eir_S · May 2012

Originally posted by RefMinor

Poor things, they must be beside themselves

Nah, knowing that most of this is a result of petty vengeance doesn't upset me. At least two people have been caught out lying about playing the game and the percentages of people who didn't enjoy the beta are extremely low even here on TROLLRPG.com. It doesn't give me any reason to think the game is going to do poorly or I won't enjoy it.

Kaocan · May 2012

Originally posted by impiro

Originally posted by MMOExposed

Hey OP you mind showing us some examples of what you are talking about?

Actually sure! In one ongoing thread right now, titled something like "did it meet expectations?", someone just wrote a page long writeup claiming he played beta and that is was very underwhelming etc. A lot of the things he described where not at all how the game was in my experience. Then I read something most peculiar in his post, he claimed to have played engineer, and how it was kind of fun, being able to SWAP weapon-sets (rifle to pistol). This is not possible for an engineer to do in combat. Every class but elementalist and engineer can swap weapons during combat. conclusion: Lies about being beta and saying it was underwhelming.

Other than this specific example, i suggest reading through threads on gw2 a bit. Often when negativity towards the game is challenged, it not responded to by focusing on the reasoning and arguments, but by focusing on the post being a GW2 fanboy. I know you have problems with melee in GW2, and i can not discuss this with you since i didn't play any melee. However people claiming that the combat is a spamfest of abilities are simply lying or not understanding the combat system at all, as explained my multiple posts.

Umm your not exactly correct in your assessment there. Guardian can not swap weapons during combat either. Also, I read that post you're talking about on the weapon swapping, the poster never states specifically 'swapping weapon-sets during combat' only that he liked having the ability to easily swap weapon-sets. You are just assuming he meant during combat, and then using your assumption to base your assumption that he never played in the BWE.

Most of the time what one person sees as examples of some idea they have is nothing more than reading into someones post something which was not there. Most people on these forums 'think they know what you meant' and then base thier comments and opinions solely off what they 'believe' you posted, not what you actully did.

And lets make the declaration here for the record, since this thread is all about the facts. Over the past year on these forums, the GW2 fanbois have made massive amounts of enemies with thier game hate towards anything not GW2. A lot of those enemies are now out for revenge, not out to hate, but simply to pay back all the hate they recieved when they were looking forward to a different game over that time period. Getting all self-righteous now, acting like you shouldn't be treated in the manner you have treated others over the past year, may not go over very well.

That being said, I agree that people who post false information on these forums about a game should not be tollerated. It is our responsability as a community to give accurate information about the games we play in order to help others become better informed. The tricky slope on that statement is defining what is actually a fact and what is partially a fact with a large dose of spin involved. Be careful which one you pick up the torch and pitchfork on and go after on these forums, people here tend to be highly defensive when you question their percieved accuracy. And nobody, I mean nobody likes being called a liar, comments like the one you posted above in that quote will most times get you a report and a day off. And no, it doesn't matter if your for or against a game, its what you say and how you say it that counts.

Slampig · May 2012

Originally posted by impiro
With this thread I want to specifically address the amount of unfounded hate and negativity against GW2 and its fans, and how it derails any attempt at serious discussion about GW2. Especially after the BW, but even long before that, multiple people on these forums are constantly hating and whining on GW2 and its fans. Now this will be seen as a silly attempt of a GW2 fanboy to deny any form on negativity on GW2, but it is not.

By no means do I want to deny or debunk any negativity towards this game for the sake of it being negative about something I like, and I belief this goes for the majority of GW2's fans. The haters on the other hand do make out to be that this is the case, without giving any proper argumentation or reasoning, basing this accusation on nothing more than the fact that we like GW2.

Any attempt to discuss anything in a serious way will be kicked down and burned by the haters, because according to them, the fanbois of gw2 will rationalize anything about GW2 in a way that satisfies their positive view on the game. The funny thing is that the haters keep screaming and crying that this is the case, while very little actual occurrences of this will be seen on the forums. Often people with knowledge of the game will debunk negative attitudes toward it with valid reasoning and arguments, but regardless the haters will just pull the old strawman saying that gw2 fans will not hear anything negative about their game. This is a load of bull, as many GW2 fans, including me, do have multiple concerns and quirks with the game.

The thing is that a lot of the haters base their negativity on false premises and reasoning. It is ok for anybody to like or dislike something. If it is because of the thing at hand itself, it stands as opinion. However, if this opinion is based on some sort of premises or reasoning, then this could be the subject of discussion. Specifically, a lot of negativity comes from not understanding technical details about GW2, and therefore are unfounded. But no matter how hard the GW2 fans will try to explain, all there attempts to do so will be automatically be put down by the haters as fanboy attempts to defend their game.

A nice example is the GW2 combat system that saw quite a bit of discussion since BW ended. A lot of people claim the combat is just a zergfest pressing skills as fast as possible when they are of cooldown and claim that dodging etc is not that important at all. Many people who have played the BW a bit longer than 2 hours disagree with these statements. I've seen posts twice as long as this one explaining in detail why the above sentiments are invalid. Yet, every time someone will take the time to explain the issue extensively, it is shot down as a fanboy attempt at defending the game against any form of negativity. Any underlying argumentation and reasoning behind the sentiments at hand are completely ignored by the haters.

tl;dr: Not every GW2 fan will defend GW2 blindly, and not every post GW2 fans make is an attempt to defend it against negativity. What matters is the reasoning and the argumentation of the post that validates the point it is making, nothing else. This is often disregarded by the haters, who will just blindly assume that any positivity is the result of blind fanboism, regardless of argumentation or reasoning. Even in cases where opinions, that rely completely on technical premises, get debunked by GW2 fans because those premises are simply not true, the haters will pull the strawman and claim that all of it is just the result of blind fanboism.

First, nice way to start off the post, calling people haters and whiners because they don't subscribe to the same process as you.

The majority of posts I have seen are attacks. When somoene posts something percieved as negative by the GW2 Army, they are attacked, told to go back to WoW, told how they obviously don't know how to game, etc... Your entire post about "haters" works both ways, obviously something that the "fanboys" do not understand.

Any attempt to discuss means actually discussing, and the "fanboys" do the same thing when something is posted that they do not like, don't act like your sides s**t don't stink...

And as for the combat, I have read many legit complaints about the combat only to see the "fanboys" swoop in and use your very argument, "Well, you didn't play long enough to make a valid point."

That's bulls**t. It didn't take me two hours or more to realize I can't stand Brussil sprouts, am I not qualified to make that statement because I didn't beat myself over the head with Brussil sprouts for 3 days straight?

To sit there and tell someone they are wrong because YOU have decided that they are not qualified enough knowing full well that the other person is capable of deciding what is and isn't to their liking, that reeks of "fanboyism" and, in my opinion, THAT is what people are tired of.

Rivalen · May 2012

[Mod Edit]

On topic, it's normal, every game will have haters and lovers, some more vocal then others.

In MMORPG there's ALOT of bored people that rather be spamming forums then watching / playing whatever game they think it's the best.

Nothing new.

JesseBFox · May 2012

Originally posted by Slampig

First, nice way to start off the post, calling people haters and whiners because they don't subscribe to the same process as you.

The majority of posts I have seen are attacks. When somoene posts something percieved as negative by the GW2 Army, they are attacked, told to go back to WoW, told how they obviously don't know how to game, etc... Your entire post about "haters" works both ways, obviously something that the "fanboys" do not understand.

JBF - please post links as examples. The OP was asked for links, please post links where you are attacked

Any attempt to discuss means actually discussing, and the "fanboys" do the same thing when something is posted that they do not like, don't act like your sides s**t don't stink...

JBF - please define "your side". There are people in the mmorpg.com forum who like to stir the pot. They say all kinds of crap they don't believe just to get your goat. They are commonly referred to as trolls. For example, someone going to the swtor forum as it is in beta and posting that TOR sucks and GW2 rocks for this reason or that. Many of those are clearly trolls and most likely don't care about GW2 at all. The vast majority of people in the GW2 forum are people interested or already like GW2. This is not the same 'side'

And as for the combat, I have read many legit complaints about the combat only to see the "fanboys" swoop in and use your very argument, "Well, you didn't play long enough to make a valid point."

That's bulls**t. It didn't take me two hours or more to realize I can't stand Brussil sprouts, am I not qualified to make that statement because I didn't beat myself over the head with Brussil sprouts for 3 days straight?

JBF - Having an opinion is great. Many people won't like GW2. Many more than most think if you ask me. However this analogy does not relate. Food and flavor is not a complex thing you must learn. You early like it or you do not. There is no learning curve and no getting better at tasting. A video game, like any other practiced skill is something you must learn and get better at. Many times, especially in a complex game like gw2 with poor tutorials/explainations, when you start out you miss some of the nuances. This is the same with most any game. Open yourself up to the possibility that you missed something and don't have such a thin skin. Also can you link me an example of this so we can see how you were horribly harrassed by people?

To sit there and tell someone they are wrong because YOU have decided that they are not qualified enough knowing full well that the other person is capable of deciding what is and isn't to their liking, that reeks of "fanboyism" and, in my opinion, THAT is what I am tired of.

JBF - In yellow I took the liberty to correct something. You seem to have a lot of angst in your post. Perhaps someone wronged you. Perhaps you should deal with that anger in a constructive way and not use it to deliver such a hostile attitude towards others you perceive to be in the same "group". This is not a war. There are not sides. We all have opinions and are entitled to them. Stop attacking the "other team"

komobo · May 2012

Originally posted by EduardoASG
Why are you worried about who hates or who likes gw2? If you like gw2, why are you worried someone else doesnt like? This world would be a sad place if we all liked the same things wouldnt it?

People with a lot fo experience in mmos, who saw several coming, going, failing or suceeding will probably have an opinion towards the 'nothing special' or 'just another game' type of opinions that might be considered as 'hate' type.

On the other hand, people new to the genre that might have a better opinion and might even defende gw2 as the new eureka of the mmo scene.. Some of them will even say gw2 loading screen is a proof that gw2 is revolutionary.. go figure why.

See.. many opinions, probably none 100% right.. but thats what they are.. opinions.

It is just a matter of not liking certain opinions, is it? Is that really what this is about? Come on, don't fool yourself.

Opinions are dirt cheap and everybody has one. Any one opinion is as valid as any other, positive or negative, as long as they are based on sound reasoning and honest facts. However, the prevailing trend of masking a false statement or blatant lie as an opinion-piece is what people get up in arms about. Making sweeping generalizations and turning to lies in an effort to strengthen ones argument (or rather, lack therefore) does not constitute an opinion but an agenda.

Don't come tell me, it is certain opinions people are upset about rather than the dishonesty passed on as opinions.

JesseBFox · May 2012

This forum does seem filled with an unfortunately large percentage of people who hate on each other and not much real discussion gets to happen. It is not in any way limited to GW2. Many people just like to troll and I have to say MMORPG.com seems to be located under the internet bridge. There is such an "us and them" mentality here it is kind of sad. We are all players who all want good games. We have different opinions and tastes so what a "good game" is changes with each person.

But in the end we all want quality games that we, as individuals, can like and appreciate. So WoW isn't for you? Great! Many people agree with you. However, that does not make WoW a bad game. Many people do like it. Many people like SW:TOR. Many people like Vanguard, and Darkfall, and Mortal Online, and Eve, etc etc etc. You may hate some of those games, but others like it. And you know what, that doesn't make you better than them and it doesn't make them wrong. It just makes you different than the people who like them.

Lumping anyone in a group then blasting that group is just crazy. It is a prejudicial way of dealing with things and never leads to anything constructive. "He is a Darkfall fan so he must be a griefer" as an example. Or "He said something good about GW2, so he must be a fanboi. Just like that person who came to the secret world thread and blasted my game. I must blast this guy back because GW2 fanbois are terrible!"

Really? I mean really? I truly feel sorry for people with this mindset.

This is not the appropriate place for pulling out a sandbox and standing on it, but seriously people. Look at yourself in the mirror. Yay you don't like brussil sprouts. John likes brussil sprouts. John was an arse to you. Bob likes brussil sprouts. He deserves revenge for what John did. Is this the logic you want to follow?

My suggestion to OP: Ignore the people who are trying to derail things. If a thread gets completely sidetracked, move on. It really isn't worth it. Find other forums where things will stay on track. I have found I have been spending way more time on the official GW2 forums and even some time on the gw2guru forums. They seem to have a lower percentage of flat out rude people who seem to exist just to cause strife and win the forum wars. Plenty of differing opinions as well there.

tl;dr: FFS people, do you have nothing better to do?

ktanner3 · May 2012

Originally posted by Shadin
Didn't read the whole thread but.... Yes. It happens. It's the same as against SW:TOR and just about any MMO.

Whenever a game is to be released it gets bashed together with it's followers, as some people cannot comprehend that people have different tastes and that what's "good" is subjective. GW2 is no different in that respect, nor will whatever new, shiny, large game that comes after it be I'd wager.

To be blunt, and I'm sorry if I come across as rude, suck it up. It happens to just about every game. However sad that may be.

This.

@OP- Any game that gets massive hype is going to get massive attention.You're going to get people that enjoy it, but also people who don't for various reasons. And those people who don't enjoy it tend to be the most vocal on forums. Fans of every other hyped MMO had to deal with it, so don't expect the rules to change just because your MMO is now getting its turn.

Zylaxx · May 2012

Originally posted by impiro
With this thread I want to specifically address the amount of unfounded hate and negativity against GW2 and its fans, and how it derails any attempt at serious discussion about GW2. Especially after the BW, but even long before that, multiple people on these forums are constantly hating and whining on GW2 and its fans. Now this will be seen as a silly attempt of a GW2 fanboy to deny any form on negativity on GW2, but it is not.

By no means do I want to deny or debunk any negativity towards this game for the sake of it being negative about something I like, and I belief this goes for the majority of GW2's fans. The haters on the other hand do make out to be that this is the case, without giving any proper argumentation or reasoning, basing this accusation on nothing more than the fact that we like GW2.

Any attempt to discuss anything in a serious way will be kicked down and burned by the haters, because according to them, the fanbois of gw2 will rationalize anything about GW2 in a way that satisfies their positive view on the game. The funny thing is that the haters keep screaming and crying that this is the case, while very little actual occurrences of this will be seen on the forums. Often people with knowledge of the game will debunk negative attitudes toward it with valid reasoning and arguments, but regardless the haters will just pull the old strawman saying that gw2 fans will not hear anything negative about their game. This is a load of bull, as many GW2 fans, including me, do have multiple concerns and quirks with the game.

The thing is that a lot of the haters base their negativity on false premises and reasoning. It is ok for anybody to like or dislike something. If it is because of the thing at hand itself, it stands as opinion. However, if this opinion is based on some sort of premises or reasoning, then this could be the subject of discussion. Specifically, a lot of negativity comes from not understanding technical details about GW2, and therefore are unfounded. But no matter how hard the GW2 fans will try to explain, all there attempts to do so will be automatically be put down by the haters as fanboy attempts to defend their game.

A nice example is the GW2 combat system that saw quite a bit of discussion since BW ended. A lot of people claim the combat is just a zergfest pressing skills as fast as possible when they are of cooldown and claim that dodging etc is not that important at all. Many people who have played the BW a bit longer than 2 hours disagree with these statements. I've seen posts twice as long as this one explaining in detail why the above sentiments are invalid. Yet, every time someone will take the time to explain the issue extensively, it is shot down as a fanboy attempt at defending the game against any form of negativity. Any underlying argumentation and reasoning behind the sentiments at hand are completely ignored by the haters.

tl;dr: Not every GW2 fan will defend GW2 blindly, and not every post GW2 fans make is an attempt to defend it against negativity. What matters is the reasoning and the argumentation of the post that validates the point it is making, nothing else. This is often disregarded by the haters, who will just blindly assume that any positivity is the result of blind fanboism, regardless of argumentation or reasoning. Even in cases where opinions, that rely completely on technical premises, get debunked by GW2 fans because those premises are simply not true, the haters will pull the strawman and claim that all of it is just the result of blind fanboism.

Just report and block everyone who trolls, derails, or flames the game. Its the only recourse we have to us. Other then that try not to feed the trolls and fight the haters and flamers with facts and love, it really annoys them.

RefMinor · May 2012

Hater: I don't like this aspect of GW2

Hivemind member: You are misinforminated, educate yourself.

The_Korrigan · May 2012

I personally think a good fan site should have specific forum bans, and the moderators be able to give them more easily.

If a reported person is seen by the moderator, from his post history, to be a blind hater of the game in every of his posts and also a regular poster on another game's forum, he should simply be locked out of the game's forum for a specific time. This would stop the trolls coming from other games to pollute the forums of games they don't play and don't ever plan to play.

BigHatLogan · May 2012

Originally posted by Mephster

It is fear they fear. The fear of their game being an abandoned wasteland when Gw2 launches. They have every right to fear that for it will come to a reality come launch. Let them wallow in their own fear I say.

Either that or they work for EA...

BarCrow · May 2012

Originally posted by niceguy3978

Originally posted by Wickedjelly

Well, considering how some of those asshats went around messing with others forums not really surprising the favor is being returned. Gonna get a lot worse too. Would happen regardless but considering how annoying and awful some were can say I have no sympathy for it in this case.

Pretty much this.

I have to agree. Especially the bile they've spewn at SWTOR alone. Yeah..it came frrom others as well but true hate seethed from GW2 "enthusiasts".

Hell..I'm looking forward to GW2 and still play other games including SWTOR. Don't have time to hate a game but as far the focus on GW2 being and "unfounded hate"...I think you'd need to read too many of the last years posts to find out that is just not true.

Johnie-Marz · May 2012

I have trouble taking this subject seriously.

I have been curious about the game because GW2 does seem so promising, so I have been reading the forums. One thing I noticed is, if anybody says anything remotely negitive about GW2 they are attacked for being a "Hater."

There was a thread where a guy had been in beta, he basicaly said that he felt that GW2 was the best game he had ever played but he felt the Warrior animations were clunky and needed work before the game was released.

He was, of course, labeled a "Hater" and told to go back to WoW.

How can I take a thread complaining about GW2 Haters seriously when fanbois of the game are so quick to label anyone who doesn't have a glowing awe of the game a Hater.

I have seen more complaints about "Haters" than actual haters saying bad things about GW2.

GW2 looks like it is going to be a great game that is going to deliver what was promised, Just enjoy it.

kakasaki · May 2012

Originally posted by The_Korrigan
I personally think a good fan site should have specific forum bans, and the moderators be able to give them more easily.

If a reported person is seen by the moderator, from his post history, to be a blind hater of the game in every of his posts and also a regular poster on another game's forum, he should simply be locked out of the game's forum for a specific time. This would stop the trolls coming from other games to pollute the forums of games they don't play and don't ever plan to play.

Slippery slope my friend. Who is to say when someone has crossed the line? Your interpretation of troll behavior may be different from mine...

Also, I don't get the people that want forums restricted to just positive posts. I mean, what is the fun of a fanboi circlej*** in which everyone is praising each other's love of a game???

karmath · May 2012

Fanboi's drink enough marketing koolaid to fill the 7 seven seas and begin foaming at the mouth. This has happened before, and will happen again.

Zylaxx · May 2012

Originally posted by Johnie-Marz
I have trouble taking this subject seriously.

I have been curious about the game because GW2 does seem so promising, so I have been reading the forums. One thing I noticed is, if anybody says anything remotely negitive about GW2 they are attacked for being a "Hater."

There was a thread where a guy had been in beta, he basicaly said that he felt that GW2 was the best game he had ever played but he felt the Warrior animations were clunky and needed work before the game was released.

He was, of course, labeled a "Hater" and told to go back to WoW.

How can I take a thread complaining about GW2 Haters seriously when fanbois of the game are so quick to label anyone who doesn't have a glowing awe of the game a Hater.

I have seen more complaints about "Haters" than actual haters saying bad things about GW2.

GW2 looks like it is going to be a great game that is going to deliver what was promised, Just enjoy it.

Cause of blantantly false accusations. If Combat in GW2 is clunky then so is WoW. Now this isnt to say that there wasnt lag and animation delay caused by some high ping last weekend but for those times when lag wasnt a problem then there was absolutely no clunkyness to is so making stuff up will get hammered by truth and making false accusations will derail the subject.

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Unfounded Hate against GW2 and its 'fanbois'

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Unfounded Hate against GW2 and its 'fanbois'

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