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Death from old age
Sintinel
Member Posts: 11
If your characters only had a certain amount of time to live before old age caught up to them and they died, how would you spend your time with those characters?
Take into consideration that I'm talking about a whole new style game, not just slapping old age death into WoW. This new game would have to have some sort of heir system. In other words, when your character dies, you make a new character (the heir) and this new character will start off with the money, gear, housing, and the most of the faction (they trust the family name for the most part) the old character obtained. Plus, the new character could start with increased skills to represent being trained by old character.
The world would have to be different too, with a lot of leveling paths so when someone makes a new character they can either go off on a brand new adventure or continue on the one the old character was on.
Think about it. Your first character in this new game, do you focus on PvP for his or her limited time? Passing on those rewards but not much of others. Do you become a craftsman and obtain a house, lab, or forge to pass on to your heir? Perhaps you'll travel around doing quest, making a good name for your family/clan so your heir will be met with open arms when he or she heads on out. Or maybe you'll focus entirely on leveling up (maybe there wouldn't even be a max) to become a super powerful character but leave little to pass on to an heir?
Imagine really rare hidden artifacts that could add time to your character's life. What if there was some super spell wizards could cast but it knocked years off their life? How about an evil lich who's magic is so powerful it could drain time away from your character, only the bravest would try to reach it's treasure.
Comments
It could be alright if there was a tight cycle to it so you never got too attached to one character. There was a pretty fun facebook puzzler (I think called Hero Generations?) which revolved around each generation of your characters needing to do a few heroic deeds and then find a mate and have a child before dying, with your upgrades to the terrain persisting between generations and some genetic traits carrying down to the child.
It would be a weaker grouping game, and awkward as an MMORPG where social interaction works best with a recognizable "face" (name, character looks, etc), but I could definitely see it pushing into interesting new territory.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
There could be a last name or clan name that people add to their friends list/guilds and things like that.
I guess it has always just bothered me in most MMOs it seems like everyone can do everything.
I am one of the few it seems that really believes in limiting us as characters in these game worlds. I'd love to see things like limited bag space where if you wanted to go out gathering a bunch of stuff to sell you better replace your cloak with a backpack, your magic belt with one that has pouches, and leave your superfast mount at home and take out the slow moving pack mule.
If each character has to start over on leveling and is constantly leveling until he dies, then such a game would severely punish people who want to do things for fun, rather than seeking the optimal path to level as quickly as possible.
I would play another game.
It might be interesting to start out as a child character and see physical age progression. So maybe when young you learn and level faster, middle game you start to level off and by endgame you're character is aged and slow. It would be an interesting mechanic to see put into place. But this is more of a virtual world type mechanic and we really aren't seeing that kind of gameplay in newer games.
And when you die, don't forget about the estate tax. The server should take 50% off the top of everything you own, lol.
That's exactly what I'd be concerned about. I wouldn't want to feel like I have to now grind time instead of gear.
However, I do see some possibilities. What if age is uaed as sort of a death penalty, long term. Every death causes you to age a year. At certain age ranges you get graying hair, facial wrinkles, that sort of thing. Up to a venerable age. And then to perma-death.
Add in quests to gain a spouse, requiring first a home (maybe another quest or not?). Spouse is also an NPC merchant, house vendor?
Then add in some way to get an offspring. Maybe enough "gifts" to add up to a point total, for your spouse.
Have spouses age along with the character.
Offspring age through cycles,
start out as a child for a week or two,
then as a teen for a week or two,
then a "student" with points to spend on training, based on the player's original character's current status,
then becomes adult and playable as a second charater.
When (and if) the first character dies, the offspring takes over.
Also add in the game some rare perma-death possibilities. Top end MOBs maybe being able to perma-death the character. And in that case, if that should happen, and if the character has no offspring, a cousin or something can be created as the new character at fewer points than the offspring had to build with.
Something like that?
Once upon a time....
If a system of heirs was implimented, then player must have control over training of current heir. You want to start next with high base - you need to spend more money and build-up good relations with guilds that would teach that heir. So you can live 1st generation as warrior and switch to a mage at 2nd generation.
Here's an idea when the child is old enough choose what class they want to be and take them to the trainers of whatever class you chose for them and take them out with you for there training. You could have them with you for the training or you can leave them home andf they can do chores and get experience that way. Could also put in different things like a wood cutters bench build a house near a forest and habve them learn wood cutting and various other things you do around a home.
I think you could justify having successvie generations leveling faster, up to a point at least, on the grounds that "It's in his blood," or somesuch.
Also, echoing what another suggested above about a guild training your children, perhaps you choose the role for the child, and when it's time for your current hero to retire, the child has gained N number of levels through his "training."
There would have to be other perks as well. Heirloom items are obvious. A factional reputation system would probably make sense for such a game, and the reputation of the parent would carry over to the child in some fashion.
I believe that success of the game would in part be determined by how such an ancestor/descendant system was integrated into the game experience. For example, upward social mobility for a starting character might be severely lmited, but through deeds and reputation, collectively the player's "House" could rise to become one of the "Inner Circle' of wizards or knights or thieves or whatever over several generations.
In that sense, 1-MAX of a standard MMO might actually correspond to several generations of this hypothetical MMO, but in addition to some content gated by level, other content at any given level will also be gated by your House's reputation, so a level 30 first character might be asked to put an end to the bandits terrorizing the kingdom while a level 30 fifth-generation character might be asked to escort the prince on a journey across the world to locate the Holy Grail.
It wouldn't be for everybody -- I don't really see myself interested in such a game -- but I think you could probably find a small loyal playerbase depending on the implementation of the system and the overall quality of the game.
Intresting idea, Your heir could "follow" you around much like a pet, and level off of you and/or your XP, And you could equip them,
So at "age 50" you get a kid, he/she follows you around and helps you fight, you can start customizing them with armor and diffrent stats (much like a pet) and when you get to age of "70" and you die, you transfer all of your equipment over to the heir..who is already leve 20.
..That would be kinda sweet.
And you could also use them for storage space?
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So, your character ages, dies and respawns as an "heir" with all the stuff the "ancestor" had, plus some?
I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil
Perhaps the point of the game wouldn't be to level as quickly as you can, unless of course you WANTED your current generation to be high level. Again, this system couldn't just be slapped into a current game like Rift or WoW. Taking into consideration this new limit on a character's life, there would have to be plenty of "fun" things to do for a character at any level.
Simply put, if designed right, the level of your current character wouldn't be anywhere near as important as the status of your family/clan. Maybe being high level would make you strong enough to go take on some super strong bosses, but if your clan's faction isn't high enough with certain nearby kingdoms, who would reward you for such a kill? If you don't have a house and land, where would you keep these rewards?
It would require a complete shift in the way we approach these games. I imagine some people not even leveling up too much with some characters, instead focusing on things like faction, trade, and money. Once your clan is well established then newer generations will train (level up) to become powerful wizards and warriors without having to worry as much about other things, they would have access to areas of the world only someone from a high ranking clan could have.
Maybe if you continue to make generation after generation of clerics (or whatever) they will level faster since they come from a long line of clerics. Or I like the idea of paying certain "schools" or "guilds" to train your heir if you want to change class.
What if there was even a way to include alts as part of your clan? Or even another player (suggested it be a real life friend)? This could be done through player housing. Get a bigger house and land, get more characters, get a huge place and another player can join your clan, with full access to everything.
My favorite MUD of all time, Avendar, had dying of old age and perma-dying if you got pk'ed too much. I liked the feature since it kept a new cycle of characters being created regularly. Roleplaying was mandatory so living out your character's life was usually dynamic 'content'.
In essence each 'generation' of your family would absolutly need to be similar to higher level tiers in other games. With the unlocking of new content. No one wants to die and repeatedly start out at 0 again.
I don't know, something like this would be different, the real key would be letting players feel progression after their character had died and they started on a new generation (or whatever you would call it).
Some really good ideas coming out of this.
I think the world would have to be huge with many factions to befriend and upset. Maybe even a slow transportation system so, for example, a barbarian clan may stay in the northern mountains, building up reputation and money, exploring all there is to see in that area. Then one day, a new heir will be born that will decide to expland the reach of the clan, he gathers what all he needs and moves south to set up a new home for the clan in the elvish woods, where he has a lot of work to do to gain favor with all those around.
There would have to be dungeons and raid bosses at all levels. And yeah quest would be offered to people based more off reputation instead of level. Access to the king's armory to those who come from clans of high rank, stuff like that.
Just like in the real world, someone born to a rich/famous family starts off a step above eveyone else (if that stuff matters to you) and they can continue to expand on the family's fortune and fame.
Basically, money and reputation would become more important to characters in this game than level. Though someone of high level would definitely be important, like they could be hired by a high ranking clan to help take on some dragon a king wants dealt with.
Well the idea of losing any progression at all is at the heart of what players dislike about permadeath, so why not avoid that entirely by having zero progression live on the character? So you don't level at all, but you do accumulate valuable things (houses, land, gear, etc) which are then inherited by the heir.
I guess you could go out of your way to ensure replaying that part of the game is fresh and fun each time, but it feels like something which could get old quick.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
I guess you're right, you really could get away from leveling all together as reputation, gear and riches could take it's place as far as progression goes.
But then we're left with questioning why even deal with the death to begin with? Because you could have that type of progression over leveling without introducing old age.
So perhaps we should simply discuss the pros and cons.
Pro:
- Gives your clan a history (imagine having statues made of your dead characters to put in your giant home you've built after many generations)
- Forces the player to really think about what they want to do with their character's life. Would people really go around griefing others if they knew they only had a limited time with that character?
- Achievements would mean more. People who want to sacrifice time to go hunt down rare items, even if it's just fluff, will get more of a sense of accomplishment out of it because less people will be doing it.
- If the world is big enough people might actually get out and explore with the time they have left. Why grind instance after instance hoping for a small upgrade to gear when you only have so much time left? Go explore, go find stuff to improve your clan.
- Assuming there is a leveling system, the world's population will be spread out so new players will find groups
- I could sit here forever and think of more, but let's discuss
Con:
- no one likes to lose progress
- all the hard work done to level up a character will be "lost"
- people get attached to their character
- lost time doing the high end stuff as you have to re-level your character
- same thing, there is more, but let's discuss, obviously there are counterpoints to these too