Vanguard will more likely be the game that ticks the final dagger in EQ2/EQ1... I think most WoW fans will be more along the lines of Vanguard what? It is inevitable though that the next generation of games will take a big chunk of WoW's current userbase, people want to try new things... you won't notice it though, as WoW will continue to get more and more new subscribers to do better than compensate.
Originally posted by jd269 Vanguard will more likely be the game that ticks the final dagger in EQ2/EQ1... I think most WoW fans will be more along the lines of Vanguard what? It is inevitable though that the next generation of games will take a big chunk of WoW's current userbase, people want to try new things... you won't notice it though, as WoW will continue to get more and more new subscribers to do better than compensate.
? EQ2's subscription base is starting to rise. EQ will proly not lose anymore subscribers. EQ2 still has way more funding behind it, and will not be shafted by some game that I have never heard of... This is bs.
The thread title is correct. Few of the upcoming games have the brand recognition which helped WoW a lot. Lord of the Rings and Star Trek online and Marvel online are best placed to challenge in the future.
A game has to be truly superlative to establish a new top brand. It remains to be seen whether Vanguard and Tabula Rasa can meet those heights. Personally I think the next great game, following in the line of Ultima Online, Everquest and WoW won't be seen until the next decade.
Originally posted by Adamska Originally posted by jd269 Vanguard will more likely be the game that ticks the final dagger in EQ2/EQ1... I think most WoW fans will be more along the lines of Vanguard what? It is inevitable though that the next generation of games will take a big chunk of WoW's current userbase, people want to try new things... you won't notice it though, as WoW will continue to get more and more new subscribers to do better than compensate.
? EQ2's subscription base is starting to rise. EQ will proly not lose anymore subscribers. EQ2 still has way more funding behind it, and will not be shafted by some game that I have never heard of... This is bs.
Game you've never heard of? Vanguard is headed by the head guy the original EQ... I played the original EQ, and I played EQ2.. and I know that many of the people in those games have a religious fanaticism with the original creaters of EQ. EQ2's subscription base is not hitting new highs, it may be rising after the dramatic fall, but it is not hitting new high's. As for EQ2 having more funding behind Vanguard, I would think you are a complete idiot if you believe that... Vanguard's publisher is a little known company called Microsoft.
Lets not forget that microsoft has a well documented history of droping mmorpg´s that dont stand up to the test. If vanguard by any chance fails to brake eq2´s measly numbers, then you can see the AC2 scenario all over again. Microsoft cleaned their hands from AC2 as soon as they saw that it was a sinking ship.
Vanguard might steal some subscribers from the SOE games: SWG, EQ, EQ2, but im not seeing the "camp mob for 7 hours" type of gameplay will have much apeal to the current WoW player base, also you have to keep in mind that the players in WoW very much enjoy the quest driven content, doing quests, explroing the world and enjoying the story, Vanguard will have a very very small ammount of quests compared to WoW, the Sigil devs have stated more than once that they would have a small ammount of quests and that quests were not their priority, so im not seeing vanguard having much apeal to WoW players.
Also would like to point the fact that vanguard is almost a year away from launch, wich will possibly coincide with the much vaunted WoW expansion... if that comes to pass, than expect that no wow player will even want to know what vanguard is.
I don't understand the whole line of thinking that an upcoming game will "kill" a currently established game. There's only been 2 high profile games that I'm aware of that have been shut down after launch - Earth and Beyond and AC2. UO is still out there, as are EQ, Meridian 59, AC, AO, SWG, SoR, DAoC, Shadowbane, Horizons, Planetside, etc. These games last a very long time. When the game is no longer fresh, however, the subscriber numbers eventually start waning.
Nobody really knows how long it takes for a successful online game to finally reach the point where it finally shut down. E&B and AC2 were shut down because they were never really successful. When will UO go? Or M59? They might be gone by the end of the year, or they might have another 10 years left in them.
So, will WoW "fail" when Vanguard releases? No. It's probably got another 9 years minimum left in it. Will it keep 4 million subscribers that entire time? Unlikely - the game still has huge buzz about it, is still launching in new markets, and is still new enough to be gaining subscribers. Eventually that will peak and start dropping - just like every other old game did. No one game is going to kill it. WoW and EQ2 didn't completely decimate every other game out there, as many people said they would. Sure, some lost a few subscribers, but moreso they opened up the genre to new players. I expect Vanguard, LOTR, DDO, D&L, etc. to have a similar effect.
Vanguard just will not apeal to enough people to even effect WOWs playerbase. Theres just too many features Vangaurd has that just eliminate any fun the game might have. I really love the "making travel an adventure" part. How many random annoying events can happen on your way to where you want to go? I guess they're relying on the playerbase to just disrupt eachother constantly to create "content". If they don't plan on making many quests, where will this adventure come from? I guess their idea of adventure will be crossing giant empty areas over and over again. Sounds like a blast. We'll see.
look. people from other games need to quit bashing wow, sorry it's bigger than your game, get over it.
wow people, why bash other games? wow is huge, and it will eventually lose some player base. but it's not going anywhere for a long time, no reason to go out bashing other games that are on a similar level of gameplay but appeal to less people.
and the next time i hear "x is a kiddie mmorpg" im gonna go crazy. many people have looked into mmo's and seen how much of your life it can suck away. people see wow as an mmo they can play w/o sacrificing a social life or other quality game genres. how this makes them lesser than you i don't know but su.
vanguard looks to be a very quality game, and whoever said it iwll take a a small amount of the player base off all games hit it right. but no one game will kill another. if one mmorpg was truly superior in every way to another why would there be so many different games with large player bases?
Until a game comes along that makes some truly innovative changes in the genre (and succeeds at it), the most popular/profitable MMOs will always be the ones with the biggest name recognition.
For example, even though it is up in the air as to whether DDO and LOTRO will be good games or not, I suspect they will both have higher subscription numbers than Vanguard simply based on name recognition alone.
Vanguard will have an impact on all the current MMO for one simple reason its not coming out till what oct 2006 if not Christmas 2006, EQ2 will be dead by then, GW will be static for many of its users since unless they nickel and dime their customers for expansions, evolving the content will be expensive, and yes the mighty WoW will be old by then as well......
WoW was advertised even in TV commercials it was everywhere when it first came out but to that point word of mouth is what has continued WoWs subsciption base where as lack of content and poorly concieved revamps are dooming EQ2 so they are forced to continually advertise their game. Vanguard also has advantages of word of mouth and that is based on trust........
As many of you know or do not know the designer for EQ1 is the designer for Vanguard, He is taking what was successful from EQ1 and and infusing the things that Sony would not let him incorporate into his own product.......it will be a good mmo that i know for sure and with an expected beta of around a year it will not be rushed like EQ2 was due to WoW so Vanguard will enter the MMO arena with a polished product not a paid for beta project that are pushed out by many of WoWs current competitors, cant knock a giant off the hill with a halfling ( sorry no offense to halflings).
Vanguard isnt advertised now because those who know MMO know about it and those who are casual MMO gamers wont see the game coming out for another year so why advertise now, as a subscriber to WoW and EQ2 i know the day Vanguard comes out i will be cancelling my two current accounts and heading to Vanguard so i know there are many like me, just my 2 cents
When Blizzard released WOW, they turned into a Hurricane, which cannot be stopped. The company made huge revenue profits with WOW and will continue to do so after the expansion sales. This is just the beginning of WOW. Expect them to release WOW 2 in a few years which will suck in everyone once again, like they did with Diablo 2.There is way to much money to be made, and they already have 4 million zombies who will buy at will. Vangaurd, DNL, Middle earth, etc.. no chance. It's no different from a movie that makes millions at the box office. For example Spiderman 1 made tons of cash and they released number 2 cause it was money in the bank. All you people who say WOW is gonna die are not thinking clearly. It'll never die, it'll evolve and evolve till they close shop like Diablo 2 and then just when you thought u were out , bam! WOW 2! to inject some more crack into your computers.
Originally posted by mangeekhan When Blizzard released WOW, they turned into a Hurricane, which cannot be stopped. The company made huge revenue profits with WOW and will continue to do so after the expansion sales. This is just the beginning of WOW. Expect them to release WOW 2 in a few years which will suck in everyone once again, like they did with Diablo 2.There is way to much money to be made, and they already have 4 million zombies who will buy at will. Vangaurd, DNL, Middle earth, etc.. no chance. It's no different from a movie that makes millions at the box office. For example Spiderman 1 made tons of cash and they released number 2 cause it was money in the bank. All you people who say WOW is gonna die are not thinking clearly. It'll never die, it'll evolve and evolve till they close shop like Diablo 2 and then just when you thought u were out , bam! WOW 2! to inject some more crack into your computers.
Speaking of crack, I hear Diablo 3 is in the works......
Where do all these idiots who always get completely hyped by unreleased games come from. These guys are just so incredibly naive but yet they still keep appearing year after year after year. EQ1 gonna be owned by DAOC!!!!, DAOC gonna be owned by WOW!!!!!11, WOW gonna be owned by Vanguard!!!!!!1.
Although i agree that the competition that vangaurd will bring will be good for the gaming community i do not think that it will put up alot of competition against WOW. Tdhe game might have alot of hype coming out about it it cant be anywhere near as much as EQ2 had and that game did nothing to the gamer population of WOW and if it did it wasnt really noticable. I think alot of good will come from this game suc has new ideas but i do not think that it will impact the population of WOW at all but thats just me
Vanguard looks like a great game, will it over take WoW, I highly doubt it WoW is an amazing success and at best Vanguard will have 500k users. And all those users will not come just from WoW.
And yes one day WoW will end, now that day is probally years away. But yes WoW will end. The question is will there be WoW 2?
DOAC is still the MMO I judge other games by, My first and still my favorite.
Comments
Vanguard will more likely be the game that ticks the final dagger in EQ2/EQ1... I think most WoW fans will be more along the lines of Vanguard what? It is inevitable though that the next generation of games will take a big chunk of WoW's current userbase, people want to try new things... you won't notice it though, as WoW will continue to get more and more new subscribers to do better than compensate.
? EQ2's subscription base is starting to rise. EQ will proly not lose anymore subscribers. EQ2 still has way more funding behind it, and will not be shafted by some game that I have never heard of... This is bs.
The thread title is correct. Few of the upcoming games have the brand recognition which helped WoW a lot. Lord of the Rings and Star Trek online and Marvel online are best placed to challenge in the future.
A game has to be truly superlative to establish a new top brand. It remains to be seen whether Vanguard and Tabula Rasa can meet those heights. Personally I think the next great game, following in the line of Ultima Online, Everquest and WoW won't be seen until the next decade.
Raymondo
? EQ2's subscription base is starting to rise. EQ will proly not lose anymore subscribers. EQ2 still has way more funding behind it, and will not be shafted by some game that I have never heard of... This is bs.
Game you've never heard of? Vanguard is headed by the head guy the original EQ... I played the original EQ, and I played EQ2.. and I know that many of the people in those games have a religious fanaticism with the original creaters of EQ. EQ2's subscription base is not hitting new highs, it may be rising after the dramatic fall, but it is not hitting new high's. As for EQ2 having more funding behind Vanguard, I would think you are a complete idiot if you believe that... Vanguard's publisher is a little known company called Microsoft.
Lets not forget that microsoft has a well documented history of droping mmorpg´s that dont stand up to the test. If vanguard by any chance fails to brake eq2´s measly numbers, then you can see the AC2 scenario all over again. Microsoft cleaned their hands from AC2 as soon as they saw that it was a sinking ship.
Vanguard might steal some subscribers from the SOE games: SWG, EQ, EQ2, but im not seeing the "camp mob for 7 hours" type of gameplay will have much apeal to the current WoW player base, also you have to keep in mind that the players in WoW very much enjoy the quest driven content, doing quests, explroing the world and enjoying the story, Vanguard will have a very very small ammount of quests compared to WoW, the Sigil devs have stated more than once that they would have a small ammount of quests and that quests were not their priority, so im not seeing vanguard having much apeal to WoW players.
Also would like to point the fact that vanguard is almost a year away from launch, wich will possibly coincide with the much vaunted WoW expansion... if that comes to pass, than expect that no wow player will even want to know what vanguard is.
All ur Mountain Dew is belong to me.
I don't understand the whole line of thinking that an upcoming game will "kill" a currently established game. There's only been 2 high profile games that I'm aware of that have been shut down after launch - Earth and Beyond and AC2. UO is still out there, as are EQ, Meridian 59, AC, AO, SWG, SoR, DAoC, Shadowbane, Horizons, Planetside, etc. These games last a very long time. When the game is no longer fresh, however, the subscriber numbers eventually start waning.
Nobody really knows how long it takes for a successful online game to finally reach the point where it finally shut down. E&B and AC2 were shut down because they were never really successful. When will UO go? Or M59? They might be gone by the end of the year, or they might have another 10 years left in them.
So, will WoW "fail" when Vanguard releases? No. It's probably got another 9 years minimum left in it. Will it keep 4 million subscribers that entire time? Unlikely - the game still has huge buzz about it, is still launching in new markets, and is still new enough to be gaining subscribers. Eventually that will peak and start dropping - just like every other old game did. No one game is going to kill it. WoW and EQ2 didn't completely decimate every other game out there, as many people said they would. Sure, some lost a few subscribers, but moreso they opened up the genre to new players. I expect Vanguard, LOTR, DDO, D&L, etc. to have a similar effect.
Vanguard just will not apeal to enough people to even effect WOWs playerbase. Theres just too many features Vangaurd has that just eliminate any fun the game might have. I really love the "making travel an adventure" part. How many random annoying events can happen on your way to where you want to go? I guess they're relying on the playerbase to just disrupt eachother constantly to create "content". If they don't plan on making many quests, where will this adventure come from? I guess their idea of adventure will be crossing giant empty areas over and over again. Sounds like a blast. We'll see.
who caaaaares.
look. people from other games need to quit bashing wow, sorry it's bigger than your game, get over it.
wow people, why bash other games? wow is huge, and it will eventually lose some player base. but it's not going anywhere for a long time, no reason to go out bashing other games that are on a similar level of gameplay but appeal to less people.
and the next time i hear "x is a kiddie mmorpg" im gonna go crazy. many people have looked into mmo's and seen how much of your life it can suck away. people see wow as an mmo they can play w/o sacrificing a social life or other quality game genres. how this makes them lesser than you i don't know but su.
vanguard looks to be a very quality game, and whoever said it iwll take a a small amount of the player base off all games hit it right. but no one game will kill another. if one mmorpg was truly superior in every way to another why would there be so many different games with large player bases?
Until a game comes along that makes some truly innovative changes in the genre (and succeeds at it), the most popular/profitable MMOs will always be the ones with the biggest name recognition.
For example, even though it is up in the air as to whether DDO and LOTRO will be good games or not, I suspect they will both have higher subscription numbers than Vanguard simply based on name recognition alone.
Vanguard will have an impact on all the current MMO for one simple reason its not coming out till what oct 2006 if not Christmas 2006, EQ2 will be dead by then, GW will be static for many of its users since unless they nickel and dime their customers for expansions, evolving the content will be expensive, and yes the mighty WoW will be old by then as well......
WoW was advertised even in TV commercials it was everywhere when it first came out but to that point word of mouth is what has continued WoWs subsciption base where as lack of content and poorly concieved revamps are dooming EQ2 so they are forced to continually advertise their game. Vanguard also has advantages of word of mouth and that is based on trust........
As many of you know or do not know the designer for EQ1 is the designer for Vanguard, He is taking what was successful from EQ1 and and infusing the things that Sony would not let him incorporate into his own product.......it will be a good mmo that i know for sure and with an expected beta of around a year it will not be rushed like EQ2 was due to WoW so Vanguard will enter the MMO arena with a polished product not a paid for beta project that are pushed out by many of WoWs current competitors, cant knock a giant off the hill with a halfling ( sorry no offense to halflings).
Vanguard isnt advertised now because those who know MMO know about it and those who are casual MMO gamers wont see the game coming out for another year so why advertise now, as a subscriber to WoW and EQ2 i know the day Vanguard comes out i will be cancelling my two current accounts and heading to Vanguard so i know there are many like me, just my 2 cents
When Blizzard released WOW, they turned into a Hurricane, which cannot be stopped. The company made huge revenue profits with WOW and will continue to do so after the expansion sales. This is just the beginning of WOW. Expect them to release WOW 2 in a few years which will suck in everyone once again, like they did with Diablo 2.There is way to much money to be made, and they already have 4 million zombies who will buy at will. Vangaurd, DNL, Middle earth, etc.. no chance. It's no different from a movie that makes millions at the box office. For example Spiderman 1 made tons of cash and they released number 2 cause it was money in the bank. All you people who say WOW is gonna die are not thinking clearly. It'll never die, it'll evolve and evolve till they close shop like Diablo 2 and then just when you thought u were out , bam! WOW 2! to inject some more crack into your computers.
Speaking of crack, I hear Diablo 3 is in the works......
Where do all these idiots who always get completely hyped by unreleased games come from. These guys are just so incredibly naive but yet they still keep appearing year after year after year. EQ1 gonna be owned by DAOC!!!!, DAOC gonna be owned by WOW!!!!!11, WOW gonna be owned by Vanguard!!!!!!1.
Play today.
Die tomorrow.
DT
Couldnt we let this 6 month old post die.............please!
*cries*
And yes one day WoW will end, now that day is probally years away. But yes WoW will end. The question is will there be WoW 2?