Which is my point exactly. You can still spec and gear towards a role, but there isn't enough skills by far to fit the role perfectly.
And I have played a elementalist. go double dagger, you have 2 healing skills, 1 aoe, 1 single target on urself. Staff has healing rain. You can't spam these, but you can be considered a healing class by using these skills, BUT that cannot be your only role.
Eh, by all accounts the healing is quite weak. So no, I don't think you could be considered a "healing class" anymore than everyone is already a healing class or a guy who can leap is a "leaping class." It's a relatively minor element. The condition removal is more significant, I'd say.
Its particularly hard to know that until we get to late game with full stats and full spec. But who knows...
Originally posted by Angier2758 Well.. a lot of people (me included) consider "tanking" any time you're getting hit. Now that being said you have funny tanking and real tanking in most games, but that's the quality of said tanking. The holy trinity is *not* gone from GW2 anyone who says that is getting caught up in catch phrases and hype. You don't need to even be ina beta to realize this... just look at a skill list. If you have heals, abilities/items allowing to absorb tank, and some doing some sort of damage... you have a HT. In GW2 the HT is just greatly diminished in importance. Maybe just one strat amongst many. I don't know if people see this as semantics or they honestly believe the HT is dead in GW2.
Oh! So like Halo then!
When I was writing it I was actually thinking "damn the HT is in Halo too"
heres a good video on the HT system not specific to GW2 it actually is about wow but shows the issues with the trinity system http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xGDL6QVL-8 and from watching this you can see how GW2 solves most the issues he goes over with the HT system
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
The devs say "Play how you want to play" but I want to play as a healer. Im not interested in doing dps.
If I spec to be a healer I will be gimping myself. Therefore you either have to be an all rounder or pure dps ?
I sugest you play a elementlis or a guardian and spec heavy into support. You will have tools to heal and also ways to stop damage happening to team mates. You can play a class heavy in support and people will love you for it. But you will be doing damage while you do this. You wil not be transfixed on peoples health bars. I love playing support and this is the most fun I have had playing a support role in any MMO. Watch the video below to get the idea. You can spec a lot of the classes to play support with many flavors of it but like I said Guardian and Elementlist have the strongest healing. Just dont expect to stand there spaming heal and watching health bars.
Originally posted by Aerowyn heres a good video on the HT system not specific to GW2 it actually is about wow but shows the issues with the trinity system http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xGDL6QVL-8 and from watching this you can see how GW2 solves most the issues he goes over with the HT system
If you dont get what a hard trinity/holly trinity is then watch this video. Also if you think getting hit equals tanking, then all the mages and rogues in my WoW guild tanked 5-10% of the time but always faceplanted for trying. I get the confusion. GW2 has changed the MMO market and new terms needed to be invented to label what they are doing. Terms like Soft Trinity are new to MMOs. If you dont get it, dont get fustrated. It makes more sense once you play and trust me its worth playing to get it.
Soft trinity means this: No one class has one single role. (tank/heal/dps) Every class fills more then one role in the team.
There are many advantages of going with a soft trinity and if you have MMOed for any amount of time its easy to figure out what. Couple of quick ones are. No more LF X class to tank or heal. No longer canceling an event because the guild tank or healer is sick or went to the movies to see Avengers. No more looking at just health bars, even your own. (you know when you are taking damage) IMO a soft trinity wins every time.
If every profession has the tools to "tank" and "heal" for any period of time, then there is no holy trinity as holy trinity = dedicated roles.
Just about every single ability any profession has that allows you to heal other players has a damage or other support component to it as well.
Damage avoidance/mitigation is done via block and dodge as well as things like blind and stun/knockdown/cripple which every profession has.
In other MMOs like WoW there were gimmick tanking scenarios, mage tanks in Gruul or Warlock pet tanks / hunter pet tanks Shaman tanks etc. etc. but the game was DESIGNED from the ground up to have the Holy Trinity in play.
GW2 is DESIGNED from the ground up to NOT have the Holy Trinity in play.
All classes CAN be damage, support, control and often all at the same time/within a split second of each other.
Having someone spec'd into Support especially for Healing means you the party member will probably have to use your own healing skills less often, but you still can't just stand there taking a beating and expect to not go down.
I present to you sir:
WoW's Paladin. Holy trinity represented as one class with the tools to do any one in any spec (with degrees of success).
It can only do one of them at a time, since you'd have to equip completely different gear and change your spec to do another role. To say nothing of how hard roles are in a Holy Trinity game, whereas everyone is inherently a hybrid in GW2 and it uses a different set of elements than the Holy Trinity, has other elements, etc, etc. So what exactly is your point?
If every profession has the tools to "tank" and "heal" for any period of time, then there is no holy trinity as holy trinity = dedicated roles.
Just about every single ability any profession has that allows you to heal other players has a damage or other support component to it as well.
Damage avoidance/mitigation is done via block and dodge as well as things like blind and stun/knockdown/cripple which every profession has.
In other MMOs like WoW there were gimmick tanking scenarios, mage tanks in Gruul or Warlock pet tanks / hunter pet tanks Shaman tanks etc. etc. but the game was DESIGNED from the ground up to have the Holy Trinity in play.
GW2 is DESIGNED from the ground up to NOT have the Holy Trinity in play.
All classes CAN be damage, support, control and often all at the same time/within a split second of each other.
Having someone spec'd into Support especially for Healing means you the party member will probably have to use your own healing skills less often, but you still can't just stand there taking a beating and expect to not go down.
I present to you sir:
WoW's Paladin. Holy trinity represented as one class with the tools to do any one in any spec (with degrees of success).
It can only do one of them at a time, since you'd have to equip completely different gear and change your spec to do another role. To say nothing of how hard roles are in a Holy Trinity game, whereas everyone is inherently a hybrid in GW2 and it uses a different set of elements than the Holy Trinity, has other elements, etc, etc. So what exactly is your point?
I played a pally as my main in WoW and had a blast doing so. When WoW first launched pallies were able to switch roles on the fly and tank, be main healer for a short time in a pinch and switch back to dps on the same build. Just how all classes in GW2 work now. As more and more expansions in WoW came out this was changed. Now pallies are in one fixed role at a time. Trust me in a raid as a tank I could not put enough healing to keep anyone alive and I would not have the mana to do so. But I am glad to see you get it. All GW2 classes are like pallies from vanilla WoW.
You could have a team with 1 'tank' specced guardian and 4 'healer' specced guardians/elementalists, and they still won't be able to keep the tank alive for more than 15 seconds. Also, you guys would be dealing crap damage.
A good level 80 Guardian should be able to generate 2000 healing per second on himself without the use of his healing skill. Throw in the extra water blasts from the Ele using arcane wave, and you should have no problem tanking with 3500 armor.
If you really need, you can even use the 20% damage reduction pots that an Artificer can make. Though you can easily get the medium version of these potions in the dungeons themselves.
If you still can't tank as a Guardian you should probably just reroll an Ele.
Sure thing, mate.
When you make a video of that and upload it to youtube, make sure you link it to me, maybe then I'll take your word for it.
Maybe I watched a different video, but the warrior and the elementalist took most of the damage in almost every situation. The Guardian just bummed around and did shitty damage in melee.
Comments
Its particularly hard to know that until we get to late game with full stats and full spec. But who knows...
When I was writing it I was actually thinking "damn the HT is in Halo too"
kudos to you sir.
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
That is a cool vid. Being a support player myself I have to say I am very excited about how support works in GW2. Thanks for sharing.
If you dont get what a hard trinity/holly trinity is then watch this video. Also if you think getting hit equals tanking, then all the mages and rogues in my WoW guild tanked 5-10% of the time but always faceplanted for trying. I get the confusion. GW2 has changed the MMO market and new terms needed to be invented to label what they are doing. Terms like Soft Trinity are new to MMOs. If you dont get it, dont get fustrated. It makes more sense once you play and trust me its worth playing to get it.
Soft trinity means this: No one class has one single role. (tank/heal/dps) Every class fills more then one role in the team.
There are many advantages of going with a soft trinity and if you have MMOed for any amount of time its easy to figure out what. Couple of quick ones are. No more LF X class to tank or heal. No longer canceling an event because the guild tank or healer is sick or went to the movies to see Avengers. No more looking at just health bars, even your own. (you know when you are taking damage) IMO a soft trinity wins every time.
It can only do one of them at a time, since you'd have to equip completely different gear and change your spec to do another role. To say nothing of how hard roles are in a Holy Trinity game, whereas everyone is inherently a hybrid in GW2 and it uses a different set of elements than the Holy Trinity, has other elements, etc, etc. So what exactly is your point?
He didn't catch the part in red.
Sure thing, mate.
When you make a video of that and upload it to youtube, make sure you link it to me, maybe then I'll take your word for it.